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Why did other ratings drop when EQ2 came up?
Catastrofik
Member Posts: 43
in Everquest II
I'm just wondering. For weeks I have been watching EVE, AO, DAoC, CoH and others bounce up and down at the tops rating spot on the home page pushing an average rating right around 8.2. Cool, no problem.
Now EQ2 is at the top with a very respectable 8.7. That's cool too. I am just wondering how this pushed all the other ratings down into the 7.5/7.6 range all of a sudden. It seems kind of strange, I mean if users were rating all these games at 8.2 forever, they overnight all changed their ratings and dropped these games all the same amount? Kind of makes you wonder. 
Comments
Thinking back...don't have screen shots or anything but I am pretty sure that is where they were all sitting. Maybe I am loosing my mind.
Gawd, I hope not. Someone else gonna tell me I am nuts or confirm my dreams?
And, nope, even though I don't play EQ2, I don't begrudge it being a "better" game on any level. Not my type of game. I don't, personally go for the pointy ear, camp the MOB, wait for spawn, walk around miladying and milording. So as far as the plug for it being "more fun", that depends on the person, as with any MMO
The ratings were around 8.2 for the top games about a week ago. And I´ve been asking myself the same question why they dropped.
Or it could be bcause youre an idiot. EVE, DAoC, AO, and a few others were all around 8.2, and now they are 7.6 like others have already pointed out. EQ2 sucks.
Yea, they definitely were at 8.2. I noticed that too and was wondering.
Maybe its a conscpiracy...
maybe its odd but i'm not sure i disagree with it. Imo the standard in which mmorpg's are measured since the release of EQ2 is higher now.
Not to be a fanboy, or maybe i am
But i have a new look on mmorpg's ever since playing EQ2, one reason being voice speech. And for how trivial it might sound, i think i'm going to think alot less of the ones that dont have it(which is most i think). It just brings so much more of a sense of realism if you use game audio. I know some people listen to music while they play, and thats what i was doing for other mmorpg's, well, along with ventrilo for SB. But i realized the other day when i was focusing on the TV and half-playing on my PC(so i didnt have headphones on and no game audio), just how much more detached from the game i felt.
I know EQ1 and its style game isnt for everyone, but EQ2 honestly did alot of things that improve on the genre while knocking the rest down some.
I didn't think I was nuts!
Now...on to the why? Conspiracy? Probably, considering how much the other scores all dumped overnight, I would say something just isn't on the up and up here. That would suck to find out that a site I come to for impartial discussion and reference (other than banners and advertising....because the fine people who run this site do need operating costs, at least and profit at best).
Could it be that someone, as "advertising", paid to have the numbers skewed for the launch of EQ2 in order to boost the perception of popularity? Again, that would suck because these are supposed to be the users ratings.
Just my random thoughts, some clarification by the staff would be most welcome.
Im glad im not the only one that noticed this... obviously mmorpg.com is taking payoffs from SOE. Its why they close all the wow vs eq2 threads (they know eq2 will lose).
Orcc i love yer sig man.
----ITS A TRAP!!!----
----ITS A TRAP!!!----
The last thing I am trying to do or find out is "who thinks this or that game is the best and why?" It's old and beaten to death in every discussion group.
What I am questioning is how the users ratings for all the other games dropped on the day EQ2 appeared at the top of the list? If EQ2 is sitting at the top with a perfect 8.7, then OK...as long as that is the users ratings. But how did the other games go from being 8.2s or so to 7.6 and 7.5?
Hehe, thanks, took me all of 10 minutes
It would be interesting to see a moderator's response. It would be in their best interest to do so. To not do so would suggest that there is "foul play" involved.
Personally, it is obvious to me that they skewed the ratings. This site grows less and less worth visiting every day. Now if only there were a site that discussed all MMOGs, with a respectable level of morality as to how they run the site. It would be worth visiting, if there were one.
All that said... to skew them in the way that they did is completely idiotic. How could people not notice? Do they not realize that they need respectability to be worth their salt?
The payoff must have been large.
Who is the official owner of this site, anyway? All we hear from are the mods? Who is the owner?
_______________________________________________________________________
Waiting for WoW, will play until something with new gameplay arrives
"The philosophy of a corporate entity umbrellas all activities. Obviously, SOE has a flawed way of doing business."
-Crabby, MMORPG Boards
_______________________________________________________________________
Looking forward (cautiously) to: Age of Conan, Dark Solstice, Armada Online.
Will soon try: Guild Wars
Overall: Amazed and bewhildered at the current sad state of the artform of gaming.
Perhaps someone was
BREAKING THE LAW!!! BREAKING THE LAW!!!!
[12:38am] <+steve> don't speak of tampons in a channel like this
[12:38am] <+steve> don't speak of tampons in a channel like this
The fact that SOE gave away free betas through this site specifically right before the end of the beta (like 3 days before to about 150 people), combined with the skewing of the ratings, further suggests that their relationship has $$$'s involved in it somewhere, and a large amount, no doubt.
_______________________________________________________________________
Waiting for WoW, will play until something with new gameplay arrives
"The philosophy of a corporate entity umbrellas all activities. Obviously, SOE has a flawed way of doing business."
-Crabby, MMORPG Boards
_______________________________________________________________________
Looking forward (cautiously) to: Age of Conan, Dark Solstice, Armada Online.
Will soon try: Guild Wars
Overall: Amazed and bewhildered at the current sad state of the artform of gaming.
What you are seeing is the "curve" that we have. If you look back this same thing happened when CoH went live. Let me explain the math behind our curve. First let me highlight some points:
1) The curve only ADDS to a games real score.
2) Before the curve all games fell in the 3-6 range - it was really boring!
3) All this curve does is "zoom in" on the scores in the positive direction
4) What caused the recent surge is that EQII is getting a "natural" score far higher than other games (as is common during a release).
5) All the games that you say "went down" actually are still showing a score higher than the actual score determined by the average of the votes.
6) We only curve the released games, not the hypes as they don't seem to need this to see a good range.
Now for the math:
1) The system looks at all the games natural scores and finds the very highest score. Let's assume these are the natural scores for the top 5 games (Example only):
1. EverQuest II = 7.0
2. DAoC = 6.6
3. Anarchy Online = 6.4
4. EVE Online = 6.3
5. City of Heroes = 6.2
In this list, EQII would be the highest score with a 7.0.
2) It now takes that high score and finds the number that lies between it and a perfect 10. This is 7+((10-7)/2) = which is 8.5.
3) Now it determines what you would have to multiply 7 by to reach 8.5. This is found by 8.5/7 = which is roughly 1.2142. THIS IS THE CURVE.
4) Now the system multiplies all scores on the list by this value. Note that this will ALWAYS be a positive result for the game. The updated list would look like this:
1. EverQuest II = 7.0 = CURVED:8.5
2. DAoC = 6.6 = CURVED:8.0
3. Anarchy Online = 6.4 = CURVED: 7.7
4. EVE Online = 6.3 = CURVED: 7.6
5. City of Heroes = 6.2 = CURVED: 7.5
If you look this over you will see the impact if you have a list of natural scores in the top 10 going from 6.0 to 6.2 (which is about what they were) - then a game comes along that earns a natural score of 7.2 (like EQII). Then the curve dissolves...but in truth what you are seeing is closer to the real scores users made for these games...
Please post any questions...
We would NEVER fudge the scores at the site. In fact, if a respectable company would like to audit our scores and system I would welcome it. We added this curve because about 1.5 years ago the members found it boring that all the scores ranged from 3 to 6...the natural solution was to just "zoom" in on this to magnify the slight differences between the scores. If we removed the curve right now you would have even a bigger gap between EQII and the next game down.
Also, my money says that you will see this happen when WoW releases and you will see the EQII score settle down as players play the game longer...this happens with all of our major listings after a release.
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
The dead know only one thing: it is better to be alive.
Thank you admin. That clears alot up.
And I was wondering how EQ2 would possible get a 8.6 with all the WoW fanbois giving it 1s.
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"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
-- Ken Olson, chairman of Digital Equipment Corp, 1977
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"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
-- Ken Olson, chairman of Digital Equipment Corp, 1977
I would also like to add Thinman that your accusations are appauling. I would never partake in such deals, nor have I EVER been offered such a deal...I highly doubt that any game company would even risk offering such a thing.
I suppose you believe that the moon landings were all a hoax too?
But seriously, this rating thing is not new at all. It happened when City of Heroes released, it happened on a smaller scale when Saga of Ryzom released and it will happen when World of Warcraft releases. It is just the energy of a released game...and it willl settle.
If you would like I can easily generate a database report that will show you the true average scores for all the games on our list...I could even run one that shows every single vote record...then you can sum them up yourself.
If you don't think I am an honest person, ask youself why you don't see pop-up ads, flash "over page" ads, spyware offers, spam mailings, etc. etc. I HAVE been offered large sums of money for these activities and told them all to buzz off. I respect this community and I care about my members. Almost every feature in this site, including the game rating curve is an idea sparked from the community.
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
The dead know only one thing: it is better to be alive.
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
The dead know only one thing: it is better to be alive.
Cool!
Thank you for the explanation, it is exactly the kind of answer I was looking for. My faith is restored and if I apologize if I "threw stones", that was not my intention. I tried to keep everything on track to get to this explanation.
Thanks again!
coz everyone can see now
how wow suxx with teh nice open beta
and how eq2 roxx with release
daoc ao etc mmorpgs for freacs who hates something new
No problem, I can see where the accusations came from...I am just sad that some of our long time members did not pipe up to remind everyone that this always happens.
Again, I blame myself as this should be explained in the FAQ.
On a side note. Our new programmer Ben (aka "Meddle") is on our team now and he will be working on this site like a madman (you might have already noticed the major improvements around here with page loading, search speeds, reliability, less crashes, etc). One of our major tasks is to improve this rating system, we would like to add a "vote spectrum" that shows you the cross section of the votes - so you can see how many people voted perfect 10's or perfect 1's. Players might find it usefull to set these aside and analyze the middle votes.
We might also have a feature that lets each member select their "top 3 favorite MMORPG's" - we will then use these to make up part of the score for a game. Because you only get to pick your favorites...there won't be the bashing (this was a members idea!)
As always, thanks for your feedback...
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
The dead know only one thing: it is better to be alive.
Thanks for the clear up Admin.
Responces from the people who run this site make me glad i started reading and posting here some..
Wow I'm a bastard... I apologize profusely, though I know that I've made an ass of myself. I don't know what else to say. Thank you for the clear explanation.. though I don't even know if I have the right to say that now. WTH is my problem?
Anway, thank you, and I'll just quietly slink away now.
Edit: I just read this and it seems like it could seem like I was being sarcastic. I was not. Now, I'll go hide for awhile.
_______________________________________________________________________
Waiting for WoW, will play until something with new gameplay arrives
"The philosophy of a corporate entity umbrellas all activities. Obviously, SOE has a flawed way of doing business."
-Crabby, MMORPG Boards
_______________________________________________________________________
Looking forward (cautiously) to: Age of Conan, Dark Solstice, Armada Online.
Will soon try: Guild Wars
Overall: Amazed and bewhildered at the current sad state of the artform of gaming.
NICE job by the Admin.
I want to add that the original maker of this thread was asking for the Admin/Mod/Owners of this site for a response, not any long time members.
And I know a HUGE lurker army was watching this thread! LOL!
The fact that the Admin not only responded, BUT also responded by page 2 shows they are an ACTIVE administration. Which not only answers the original question in this thread, but answers other indirect questions too - like showing proof by action how much the Admin really care about this site, and this community.
(aka ...... Customer ..... Service! Aha! 
GOOD customer service! Keeping the lines of communication open!) (Quality baby! Quality!)
This makes everyone in the lurker army recommend this site even more, and helps MMORPG.com with hardcore WOMA. (Word Of Mouth Advertising).
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