Regardless of his "job", he did an awful job. The forum is filled with launcher/patcher issues, that's not normal and StarVault didn't fix anything yet? I'd have fired that guy long ago and fixed the damn launcher myself if I was an employee at SV.
orly? Why other companies use his launcher(s) successfully? I do not think it requires much thinking to figure out who is doing awfull job here...
Check MO forums to get actual clue of how the launcher was developed, how the thing actualy works and what the issue with launcher is.
Only if it works and has few bugs, which is not what MO is known for.
Was UO totally bugfree at the release ?
Origin had so many other graphical MMOs to learn from and could easliy buy pre-made game engines and scenery generators.
From what I hear premade engines are just as hard if not harder to code. Basically its easier to start from scratch.
You heard wrong. Otherwise there would be no market for gaming engines, at all.
Imagine the amount of math it takes to calculate shadows, draw distance, details, animations, physics -- easier to start from scratch? LOL . I call troll on this post, just because it's their first post and they are here defending MO. LOL.
You can troll on this post? What exactly does that mean? I am here as an observer nothing more. I am just joining in on the debate. Yet you calling me a troll?
For some on these forums... Actually... for many on these forms... merely disagreeing with them is "trolling", because you're questioning their "Ultimate And Infallible Opinion" on something.... and why would anyone do that? Because they disagree? Pfft. No way. You *must* be trolling.
That said, people create their own engines over purchasing them because they feel the pre-made engines don't necessarily fit what they're looking to do with it, or it would cost so much in man-hours to take a ready-made engine and make all the required changes, that they would be better off creating their own, with their own custom tools, etc.
Sometimes licensing cost comes into play, etc. etc.
As far as the math involved to render shadows and all that... all that information is out there and anyone who's hired on to do that kind of work is very likely going to have knowledge/experience in doing it already. Unless one wants to believe that the typical developer interviews new programmers as such:
Interviewer: "Do you have graphics programming experience?"
Programmer: "Not a lick"
Interviewer: "Do you know how to render shadows in a game?"
Programmer: "lolwut?"
Interviewer: "Perfect! You don't know a thing! You're hired!"
(no... it doesn't work that way)
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Originally posted by WSIMike As far as the math involved to render shadows and all that... all that information is out there and anyone who's hired on to do that kind of work is very likely going to have knowledge/experience in doing it already.
There are good programmers and the poor ones, you know... And you won't find out whether the programmer is bad if your are not better or you are yourself as poor.
The fact is, SV staff has almost non-existant professional experience which is fine alone but you should not be surprised when you see the PR such as SV got and the game being in a state as it is 2 weeks from release.
As far as the math involved to render shadows and all that... all that information is out there and anyone who's hired on to do that kind of work is very likely going to have knowledge/experience in doing it already.
There are good programmers and the poor ones, you know... And you won't find out whether the programmer is bad if your are not better or you are yourself as poor.
The fact is, SV staff has almost non-existant professional experience which is fine alone but you should not be surprised when you see the PR such as SV got and the game being in a state as it is 2 weeks from release.
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse, every company has someone in charge of HR, those people will be the first line of recruitment ANYWHERE within the games company, most of the time they have no experience whatsoever in programming or technical issues they can however tick boxes very well and from overview of what the person says or his portfolio says identify areas and skills that may be needed within the company.
That being said HR does not work in favor of the programmer 90% of the time, as a matter of fact it works against them, I know people who were overqualified and had amazing work being turned down at the first phase of recruitment and never got to talk to someone that has the technical ability.
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
This sort of knowledge can be demonstrated with demos and pre-screening tests even before you get to talk to anyone that is minimally technically skilled.
Originally posted by rav3n2 That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2 Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
You hit the nail on the head, ignorance is a bliss. It is infinitely frustrating to take over someones work on some piece of crap like that and that is the reason you can see so much pig code in the industry :-/
The knowledge of commands and methods is not what makes you a good programmer, it is the complex analysis, precise thinking and experience - things you won't find in books.
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
I am not trying to impress anyone, nor do I have to I simply answered to the OP when he said he wish people spent one minute IRL, he was the one that assumed not me, hell I even agree that SV is being unprofessional, I just think people should do some research or at least know about the subject, trying to backup your views with made up and unfounded arguments is not the way to go in ANY discussion.
Mainly boils down to sometimes the success or the state of the product is not because of the programmers, it doesnt mean that the programmers are unskilled or cant produce decent code, management most of the time are the ones cocking up the development process, badly managed and prioritized tasks, rushed features, the list goes on, the programmer has absolutely no say on what goes live or what doesnt go live, if you as a gamer can see that something is wrong so can a project manager, and he is the one that is going to give the green light for something to be released or put on a release build regardless of the state.
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
FYI, none of them ran a UO shard either. Henrik was FRIENDS with a guy who ran a UO shard.
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
I am not trying to impress anyone, nor do I have to I simply answered to the OP when he said he wish people spent one minute IRL, he was the one that assumed not me, hell I even agree that SV is being unprofessional, I just think people should do some research or at least know about the subject, trying to backup your views with made up and unfounded arguments is not the way to go in ANY discussion.
Mainly boils down to sometimes the success or the state of the product is not because of the programmers, it doesnt mean that the programmers are unskilled or cant produce decent code, management most of the time are the ones cocking up the development process, badly managed and prioritized tasks, rushed features, the list goes on, the programmer has absolutely no say on what goes live or what doesnt go live, if you as a gamer can see that something is wrong so can a project manager, and he is the one that is going to give the green light for something to be released or put on a release build regardless of the state.
You are given SV too much credit if you assume they have a management, as in an experienced management with a realistic development plan.
If my memory serves me, I think many of them are graphic designers with some programming skills. Thus the mess we have today, a beautiful world without the basic functionality working.
That night video is awesome no doubt. It shows what the engine can do, but you can have the best graphics engine ever for a game, if the game sucks, if the content is non existent, if it's full of bugs, what's the point ?
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Originally posted by rav3n2
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
I am not trying to impress anyone, nor do I have to I simply answered to the OP when he said he wish people spent one minute IRL, he was the one that assumed not me, hell I even agree that SV is being unprofessional, I just think people should do some research or at least know about the subject, trying to backup your views with made up and unfounded arguments is not the way to go in ANY discussion.
Mainly boils down to sometimes the success or the state of the product is not because of the programmers, it doesnt mean that the programmers are unskilled or cant produce decent code, management most of the time are the ones cocking up the development process, badly managed and prioritized tasks, rushed features, the list goes on, the programmer has absolutely no say on what goes live or what doesnt go live, if you as a gamer can see that something is wrong so can a project manager, and he is the one that is going to give the green light for something to be released or put on a release build regardless of the state.
Ahhhh my bad and my apologies- As I said, I didnt read the thread (and should of before I commented)- I see the RL card was played again and again lol.
its so good to see others posting nice things about mortal online, and yes mortal online is sooo awesome and i never liked mmos that much and well mortal online has kept me playing for months now and it can only get better.
its so good to see others posting nice things about mortal online, and yes mortal online is sooo awesome and i never liked mmos that much and well mortal online has kept me playing for months now and it can only get better.
its so good to see others posting nice things about mortal online, and yes mortal online is sooo awesome and i never liked mmos that much and well mortal online has kept me playing for months now and it can only get better.
its so good to see others posting nice things about mortal online, and yes mortal online is sooo awesome and i never liked mmos that much and well mortal online has kept me playing for months now and it can only get better.
These on the rise PVP games are so hardcore. To hardcore even for it's dense, other MMO reject player base!
So hardcore that it is unplayable
its more playable then other games like for example xyson, i got bored of it after 1 hour, theres nothing to play in that game unlike mortal online and darkfall with so much features in them.
Comments
You should rather check his professional background and re-consider who is lacking the ability here...
orly? Why other companies use his launcher(s) successfully? I do not think it requires much thinking to figure out who is doing awfull job here...
Check MO forums to get actual clue of how the launcher was developed, how the thing actualy works and what the issue with launcher is.
Was UO totally bugfree at the release ?
Origin had so many other graphical MMOs to learn from and could easliy buy pre-made game engines and scenery generators.
From what I hear premade engines are just as hard if not harder to code. Basically its easier to start from scratch.
You heard wrong. Otherwise there would be no market for gaming engines, at all.
Imagine the amount of math it takes to calculate shadows, draw distance, details, animations, physics -- easier to start from scratch? LOL . I call troll on this post, just because it's their first post and they are here defending MO. LOL.
You can troll on this post? What exactly does that mean? I am here as an observer nothing more. I am just joining in on the debate. Yet you calling me a troll?
For some on these forums... Actually... for many on these forms... merely disagreeing with them is "trolling", because you're questioning their "Ultimate And Infallible Opinion" on something.... and why would anyone do that? Because they disagree? Pfft. No way. You *must* be trolling.
That said, people create their own engines over purchasing them because they feel the pre-made engines don't necessarily fit what they're looking to do with it, or it would cost so much in man-hours to take a ready-made engine and make all the required changes, that they would be better off creating their own, with their own custom tools, etc.
Sometimes licensing cost comes into play, etc. etc.
As far as the math involved to render shadows and all that... all that information is out there and anyone who's hired on to do that kind of work is very likely going to have knowledge/experience in doing it already. Unless one wants to believe that the typical developer interviews new programmers as such:
Interviewer: "Do you have graphics programming experience?"
Programmer: "Not a lick"
Interviewer: "Do you know how to render shadows in a game?"
Programmer: "lolwut?"
Interviewer: "Perfect! You don't know a thing! You're hired!"
(no... it doesn't work that way)
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
There are good programmers and the poor ones, you know... And you won't find out whether the programmer is bad if your are not better or you are yourself as poor.
The fact is, SV staff has almost non-existant professional experience which is fine alone but you should not be surprised when you see the PR such as SV got and the game being in a state as it is 2 weeks from release.
There are good programmers and the poor ones, you know... And you won't find out whether the programmer is bad if your are not better or you are yourself as poor.
The fact is, SV staff has almost non-existant professional experience which is fine alone but you should not be surprised when you see the PR such as SV got and the game being in a state as it is 2 weeks from release.
That is so not true, I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in Wikipedia before coming here to talk out of their arse, every company has someone in charge of HR, those people will be the first line of recruitment ANYWHERE within the games company, most of the time they have no experience whatsoever in programming or technical issues they can however tick boxes very well and from overview of what the person says or his portfolio says identify areas and skills that may be needed within the company.
That being said HR does not work in favor of the programmer 90% of the time, as a matter of fact it works against them, I know people who were overqualified and had amazing work being turned down at the first phase of recruitment and never got to talk to someone that has the technical ability.
Like WSIMike said its not just a matter of ask if he knows shadows as a matter of fact you could not know anything about shadows and still develop the best shadow system for an engine within a company, if you know memory management and optimization and you are ace at 3D Maths, all you need is to pickup a book for an hour and you got an amazing and efficient shadow system in.
This sort of knowledge can be demonstrated with demos and pre-screening tests even before you get to talk to anyone that is minimally technically skilled.
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
You hit the nail on the head, ignorance is a bliss.
It is infinitely frustrating to take over someones work on some piece of crap like that and that is the reason you can see so much pig code in the industry :-/
The knowledge of commands and methods is not what makes you a good programmer, it is the complex analysis, precise thinking and experience - things you won't find in books.
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
I am not trying to impress anyone, nor do I have to I simply answered to the OP when he said he wish people spent one minute IRL, he was the one that assumed not me, hell I even agree that SV is being unprofessional, I just think people should do some research or at least know about the subject, trying to backup your views with made up and unfounded arguments is not the way to go in ANY discussion.
Mainly boils down to sometimes the success or the state of the product is not because of the programmers, it doesnt mean that the programmers are unskilled or cant produce decent code, management most of the time are the ones cocking up the development process, badly managed and prioritized tasks, rushed features, the list goes on, the programmer has absolutely no say on what goes live or what doesnt go live, if you as a gamer can see that something is wrong so can a project manager, and he is the one that is going to give the green light for something to be released or put on a release build regardless of the state.
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
FYI, none of them ran a UO shard either. Henrik was FRIENDS with a guy who ran a UO shard.
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
I am not trying to impress anyone, nor do I have to I simply answered to the OP when he said he wish people spent one minute IRL, he was the one that assumed not me, hell I even agree that SV is being unprofessional, I just think people should do some research or at least know about the subject, trying to backup your views with made up and unfounded arguments is not the way to go in ANY discussion.
Mainly boils down to sometimes the success or the state of the product is not because of the programmers, it doesnt mean that the programmers are unskilled or cant produce decent code, management most of the time are the ones cocking up the development process, badly managed and prioritized tasks, rushed features, the list goes on, the programmer has absolutely no say on what goes live or what doesnt go live, if you as a gamer can see that something is wrong so can a project manager, and he is the one that is going to give the green light for something to be released or put on a release build regardless of the state.
You are given SV too much credit if you assume they have a management, as in an experienced management with a realistic development plan.
If my memory serves me, I think many of them are graphic designers with some programming skills. Thus the mess we have today, a beautiful world without the basic functionality working.
That night video is awesome no doubt. It shows what the engine can do, but you can have the best graphics engine ever for a game, if the game sucks, if the content is non existent, if it's full of bugs, what's the point ?
I wish people had a bit of sense or at least spent a minute in real world
HR is out of question since it has nothing to do with what I am saying nor it makes it less true.
Also, do you really think StarVault got HR department? :-D
Yeah, you are right. Programming is like cooking by a book, isn't it?
It is very easy to think how simple the thing is when you do not know how it works...
Actually you bring a good analogy Programming is exactly like cooking from a book, when you know how and understand the basic functions and concepts the bigger problems are just really all of those concepts and knowledge applied to a wider scale, put it this way if you dont know how to turn the hob on and put some butter on that frying pan doesnt matter how many times a book tell you, you need a frying pan to flip those eggs so they are cooked on both sides you are not going to get it right.
The same is with programming, the bigger problems are a collection of small concepts and knowledge like design patterns and 3D Math, a perpendicular vector to a surface is a very simple concept yet if you dont understand this you will never be able to produce a bump mapping architecture for your game, on the other hand if you understand bump mapping but you understand vector maths, OOP and can read english you will be able to by reading it GPU Gems or any other similar type of books implement this system.
You shouldn't be so quick to judge people, specially because the argument that you sarcastically presented thinking it would make you look smart actually turns out its a perfect fit and makes you look a bit stupid and shows you have absolutely no knowledge of any type of software development let alone qualified to discuss how a person should be hired or not.
I would keep what you think to yourself or do a bit of reasearch about it before posting. To answer your first comment as well, I have spent many minutes and hours in the real world you however have none and I highly doubt you will ever have, so stick to playing games.
And yes you are right they probably do not have an HR department but your guess on how skilled they are is as good as anyone else and can hardly be taken as fact or with any weighting on this discussion.
Actually they have a history running a private UO shard and modding- So its not too difficult figuring out their skills based on the work they have done which is/was publicly available. Its also relative to consider the work they have done in MO and the constant patching which breaks more than it fixes (alon with a totally amature patch system)-
I have not read this thread (oly your comment) so perhaps I am missing something BUT if the argument is regarding how much skill (or lack thereof) SV has as a collective team- Its not a pretty picture.
That being said, I am sure they are decent on small scale projects but they have taken on far too much and made far too many amature mistakes. Its evident they had no real concrete plan and far underestimated the projects manhours...Plus their professionalism is VERY far from acceptable in terms of basic communication and CS.
BTW, playing the "real world" card makes YOU look like an ass. You dont know how much time anyone posting here spends in the real world and its easy to lie and say "I spend lots of time in the real world" whilst living in Moms basement...You prove nothing by trying to impress us with how much "real world" experience you have.
I am not trying to impress anyone, nor do I have to I simply answered to the OP when he said he wish people spent one minute IRL, he was the one that assumed not me, hell I even agree that SV is being unprofessional, I just think people should do some research or at least know about the subject, trying to backup your views with made up and unfounded arguments is not the way to go in ANY discussion.
Mainly boils down to sometimes the success or the state of the product is not because of the programmers, it doesnt mean that the programmers are unskilled or cant produce decent code, management most of the time are the ones cocking up the development process, badly managed and prioritized tasks, rushed features, the list goes on, the programmer has absolutely no say on what goes live or what doesnt go live, if you as a gamer can see that something is wrong so can a project manager, and he is the one that is going to give the green light for something to be released or put on a release build regardless of the state.
Ahhhh my bad and my apologies- As I said, I didnt read the thread (and should of before I commented)- I see the RL card was played again and again lol.
I stand corrected as you are right.
I swear that night scene sountrack the OP posted is from a conan movie or something similuar. Think it was a screwing scene.
its so good to see others posting nice things about mortal online, and yes mortal online is sooo awesome and i never liked mmos that much and well mortal online has kept me playing for months now and it can only get better.
Are you using sarcasm?
are you trolling or are you also being sarcastic?
I do not troll
These on the rise PVP games are so hardcore. To hardcore even for it's dense, other MMO reject player base!
When did you start playing "old school" MMO's. World Of Warcraft?
So hardcore that it is unplayable
its more playable then other games like for example xyson, i got bored of it after 1 hour, theres nothing to play in that game unlike mortal online and darkfall with so much features in them.