Jumping is a part of the illusion for me, the onscreen avatar being glued to the ground and having to walk around small objects impacts on that. I can look past it eventually if a game is half decent though.
Since SE has said they are considering adding jumping this thread is already void but reading peoples posts i think its ridiculous. So far throughout the entire thread I've read of two games with a justified use of jumping, Aion and Darkfall, and even then it seems to be just for platforming. I myself enjoy jumping, I understand how its fun but I also see how it can get on peoples nerves. I played WoW for a few months and to say that no one 'bunny hops' is stupid, I would see it all the time. As a note when i would watch my friend to instances, I don't think I saw anyone jump around once during it, probably because its pointless. I'd rather have no jumping than jumping without purpose. If SE can come up with an amazing combat tactic involving jumping then go for it, but in general other than dodging, which can be just an animation in response to dodging an attack, I'd think jumping during combat would be a hindrance. End of the day tho jumping seems like a novelty more than anything else. I recall reading a comment about getting rid of strafing running etc... i know it was sarcasm but people complain about jumping because they are useless, you may need to strafe to position yourself around your enemy, and running duh, jumping not so much. My only grief with ffxi not jumping was not being able to go around objects but it's definitely not a deal breaker
It appears I wasn't the only one who didn't know about the lack of a jumping option as a standard for FFXI or FFXIV or that the developers have made public statements about considering it. I would call the discussion from this thread exactly the opposite of void. Additionally, instead of people flaming people for differing in opinions people should realize part of the community that is interested in this game enjoys the jump feature for immersion, enjoyment, whatever reason.
Anyways, I have learned a lot from the discussion here, and I'm hopeful perhaps someone will bring it up in closed beta. If I was invited, I definitely would. It may be a novelty to you, but it's a staple game feature for a lot of others. As I mentioned briefly earlier, two other games that started out as no-jump (GW and TERA) now have that feature in due to popular demand. I would wager it's popular not because people think jumping will help them exploit or bunny-hop annoy people, but because it provides them with a feeling of more dynamic connectedness in the game. That's my feeling on it, anyways.
I hope others got as much out of this issue as I have.
Maybe the FFX-2 thing with prompts to get over things is about as far as I'd want to go. In FFXI, there is jumping, it's called Dragoon. All it sounds like is that people want to get over things that they should, a button press to do that should be fine. You don't have to jump, you can step onto or leap over the object. No actual jumping is needed.
To be the best, you must help each other become the best. FFXI Character: Satimasu FFXI Server: Valefor FFXIV Character: Tamorae Fonteil
Since SE has said they are considering adding jumping this thread is already void but reading peoples posts i think its ridiculous. So far throughout the entire thread I've read of two games with a justified use of jumping, Aion and Darkfall, and even then it seems to be just for platforming. I myself enjoy jumping, I understand how its fun but I also see how it can get on peoples nerves. I played WoW for a few months and to say that no one 'bunny hops' is stupid, I would see it all the time. As a note when i would watch my friend to instances, I don't think I saw anyone jump around once during it, probably because its pointless. I'd rather have no jumping than jumping without purpose. If SE can come up with an amazing combat tactic involving jumping then go for it, but in general other than dodging, which can be just an animation in response to dodging an attack, I'd think jumping during combat would be a hindrance. End of the day tho jumping seems like a novelty more than anything else. I recall reading a comment about getting rid of strafing running etc... i know it was sarcasm but people complain about jumping because they are useless, you may need to strafe to position yourself around your enemy, and running duh, jumping not so much. My only grief with ffxi not jumping was not being able to go around objects but it's definitely not a deal breaker
SE is not going to give you free jumping ability, it will be things like ffxi in the zone dangruf wadi where you stand on the gyser and it shoots you up the cliff. FFXIV may have certian spots where an icon will show you when you can jump. But thinking there going to give free jumping is a fools hope.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Since SE has said they are considering adding jumping this thread is already void but reading peoples posts i think its ridiculous. So far throughout the entire thread I've read of two games with a justified use of jumping, Aion and Darkfall, and even then it seems to be just for platforming. I myself enjoy jumping, I understand how its fun but I also see how it can get on peoples nerves. I played WoW for a few months and to say that no one 'bunny hops' is stupid, I would see it all the time. As a note when i would watch my friend to instances, I don't think I saw anyone jump around once during it, probably because its pointless. I'd rather have no jumping than jumping without purpose. If SE can come up with an amazing combat tactic involving jumping then go for it, but in general other than dodging, which can be just an animation in response to dodging an attack, I'd think jumping during combat would be a hindrance. End of the day tho jumping seems like a novelty more than anything else. I recall reading a comment about getting rid of strafing running etc... i know it was sarcasm but people complain about jumping because they are useless, you may need to strafe to position yourself around your enemy, and running duh, jumping not so much. My only grief with ffxi not jumping was not being able to go around objects but it's definitely not a deal breaker
It appears I wasn't the only one who didn't know about the lack of a jumping option as a standard for FFXI or FFXIV or that the developers have made public statements about considering it. I would call the discussion from this thread exactly the opposite of void. Additionally, instead of people flaming people for differing in opinions people should realize part of the community that is interested in this game enjoys the jump feature for immersion, enjoyment, whatever reason.
Anyways, I have learned a lot from the discussion here, and I'm hopeful perhaps someone will bring it up in closed beta. If I was invited, I definitely would. It may be a novelty to you, but it's a staple game feature for a lot of others. As I mentioned briefly earlier, two other games that started out as no-jump (GW and TERA) now have that feature in due to popular demand. I would wager it's popular not because people think jumping will help them exploit or bunny-hop annoy people, but because it provides them with a feeling of more dynamic connectedness in the game. That's my feeling on it, anyways.
I hope others got as much out of this issue as I have.
Sorry for the double post, Since you seem new to SE and SE games I think I should inform you now that, they dont listen to their NA player base, any SE fan can tell you this. I am personally glad they dont because otherwise we would end up with an anime WoW 2.0. It would be an outcry from the japanese players that would get jumping in ffxiv.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Since SE has said they are considering adding jumping this thread is already void but reading peoples posts i think its ridiculous. So far throughout the entire thread I've read of two games with a justified use of jumping, Aion and Darkfall, and even then it seems to be just for platforming. I myself enjoy jumping, I understand how its fun but I also see how it can get on peoples nerves. I played WoW for a few months and to say that no one 'bunny hops' is stupid, I would see it all the time. As a note when i would watch my friend to instances, I don't think I saw anyone jump around once during it, probably because its pointless. I'd rather have no jumping than jumping without purpose. If SE can come up with an amazing combat tactic involving jumping then go for it, but in general other than dodging, which can be just an animation in response to dodging an attack, I'd think jumping during combat would be a hindrance. End of the day tho jumping seems like a novelty more than anything else. I recall reading a comment about getting rid of strafing running etc... i know it was sarcasm but people complain about jumping because they are useless, you may need to strafe to position yourself around your enemy, and running duh, jumping not so much. My only grief with ffxi not jumping was not being able to go around objects but it's definitely not a deal breaker
SE is not going to give you free jumping ability, it will be things like ffxi in the zone dangruf wadi where you stand on the gyser and it shoots you up the cliff. FFXIV may have certian spots where an icon will show you when you can jump. But thinking there going to give free jumping is a fools hope.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
Since SE has said they are considering adding jumping this thread is already void but reading peoples posts i think its ridiculous. So far throughout the entire thread I've read of two games with a justified use of jumping, Aion and Darkfall, and even then it seems to be just for platforming. I myself enjoy jumping, I understand how its fun but I also see how it can get on peoples nerves. I played WoW for a few months and to say that no one 'bunny hops' is stupid, I would see it all the time. As a note when i would watch my friend to instances, I don't think I saw anyone jump around once during it, probably because its pointless. I'd rather have no jumping than jumping without purpose. If SE can come up with an amazing combat tactic involving jumping then go for it, but in general other than dodging, which can be just an animation in response to dodging an attack, I'd think jumping during combat would be a hindrance. End of the day tho jumping seems like a novelty more than anything else. I recall reading a comment about getting rid of strafing running etc... i know it was sarcasm but people complain about jumping because they are useless, you may need to strafe to position yourself around your enemy, and running duh, jumping not so much. My only grief with ffxi not jumping was not being able to go around objects but it's definitely not a deal breaker
It appears I wasn't the only one who didn't know about the lack of a jumping option as a standard for FFXI or FFXIV or that the developers have made public statements about considering it. I would call the discussion from this thread exactly the opposite of void. Additionally, instead of people flaming people for differing in opinions people should realize part of the community that is interested in this game enjoys the jump feature for immersion, enjoyment, whatever reason.
Anyways, I have learned a lot from the discussion here, and I'm hopeful perhaps someone will bring it up in closed beta. If I was invited, I definitely would. It may be a novelty to you, but it's a staple game feature for a lot of others. As I mentioned briefly earlier, two other games that started out as no-jump (GW and TERA) now have that feature in due to popular demand. I would wager it's popular not because people think jumping will help them exploit or bunny-hop annoy people, but because it provides them with a feeling of more dynamic connectedness in the game. That's my feeling on it, anyways.
I hope others got as much out of this issue as I have.
Sorry for the double post, Since you seem new to SE and SE games I think I should inform you now that, they dont listen to their NA player base, any SE fan can tell you this. I am personally glad they dont because otherwise we would end up with an anime WoW 2.0. It would be an outcry from the japanese players that would get jumping in ffxiv.
I don't play WoW. Jumping has nothing to do with WoW (except for the fact it's one of the many MMOs that feature jump mobility).
Also this isn't a thread to communicate with developers - it was for a discussion and to learn.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
For me jump in mmos excluding the ones that have real time battles (Darkfall and such) are just like an emote to have fun or look silly with nothing more.
Now if developers created some mmos (B&S) were jumping will be needed to proceed then yes I'll be all for it.
jump has never really been in any of the ff games, just feels normal that way.
I can understand that I guess. I just think a next-gen MMO should really be developed outside of the "well this is how we've always done it" box.
I think action/pace and mobility are things new MMO developers should be considering, looking at the games expected in 2011 (TERA Online, Guild Wars 2, SWTOR) and the newer MMOs of Korea (Continent of the Ninth, TERA Online, Aion, Berkanix).
I never played FFXI, but I played the previous 10 games (seriously) which were all classic RPG's. Jumping was not needed and would have made the games a pain in the ass. I didn't like that there was no jumping in Guild Wars, but I felt the UI needed jumping and it felt unnatural. If the game's UI doesn't create the feeling of needing to jump, then it should be fine.
I'm going to borrow a term that I only know of from Magic: the Gathering. Design space. When a game allows you to perform an action, and the designers come up with interesting ways that you can put that action to strategic use, they are designing in that particular design space. For example, some new cards do something special when you put a land onto the battlefield. Once per turn, if it's your turn, you can put in one land from your hand. But there are other ways to put out multiple lands on your turn, or maybe even when it isn't your turn. The designers could have played it safe and said that only playing a land the normal way triggers the cool ability, and then they wouldn't have to worry about how powerful the cards potentially get when you bring in 5 lands at once. But they decided that bringing in multiple lands at once or even putting a land in during the opponent's turn made for good design space, so they worded those abilities to work no matter how you get that land to the battlefield.
Jumping to position yourself is not what I would consider a good design space for an MMO. It takes much less than a second for your character to jump up and come back down. Under moderately laggy conditions (say 200ms ping, which developers MUST assume a significant percentage of their playerbase will experience), by the time the server knows you want to jump, your monitor may already be showing you on your way down. Designing combat so that you benefit from strategic jumping means either flipping off all the people with slow connections and reducing their combat effectiveness, or making the server place a lot of trust in the client when it says "I jumped at the right time." I should not need to explain the perils of the latter option.
If we're not talking about jumping at a strategic time, then we're probably concerned with jumping to a strategic place — e.g. onto a ledge where a monster cannot reach without taking a very long route to get there, if at all. While choosing a good vantage point for ranged attacks is a staple of single-player action games, it's been unacceptable in most MMOs for a long time.
As far as barriers to exploration are concerned... all MMOs need barriers. There needs to be a point where the developers say "we didn't make anything further in this direction, so you can't go there." Be it a visible wall, and invisible wall, or instant spiky death, it has to exist to keep you from going to where there is no world, and that is true whether you can jump or not. People who cry that it pains them to see areas that they think they should be able to get to but cannot... they get a great big "meh" from me. They could have put a featureless 50-foot brick wall there, instead they put a cliff edge so that you can get a nice view of the (inaccessible) beach and occasionally a pretty sunset. Be happy. Just because it exists doesn't mean you have a right to put your character there.
So that's my stance on strategic jumping and exploratory jumping. Join us next week when we watch a YouTube video of someone jumping over a waist high fence without a running start, while wearing a full suit of plate mail and wielding a two-handed sword. ("Immersion", HA!)
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
1. Tera online isn't released yet
2. From this discussion i see a lot of people who don't care either way or would prefer not to have any form of jumping at all. Again is it really competitive to implement a jumping system that doesn't go beyond hoping up and down. And your already insisting that they add it by encouraging beta testers to suggest it.
3. Jumping IS a small part of gameplay. Peroid. Can you fight a boss without jumping? Yes. Can you complete quests without jumping? Yes. Can you get form point a to point b without jumping? Yes! Mobility is the state of being in motion, i'd consider running and walking an essential part of gameplay, jumping not so much
No jumping is actually why I really liked FFXI. When we get the ability to jump it's either animated terribly, or the overuse of it makes everyone look like bunny rabbits running around. Hence the term bunnyhopping in video games. I wouldn't mind jumping in FF if the implemented it to where it was heavily taxing so you could only do it so often.
I would hardly say this is game breaking news, but really it is an easy to program mechanic that as depth to character animations. I do not really see a good reason to not have jumping in a game. More is better.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
1. Tera online isn't released yet
2. From this discussion i see a lot of people who don't care either way or would prefer not to have any form of jumping at all. Again is it really competitive to implement a jumping system that doesn't go beyond hoping up and down. And your already insisting that they add it by encouraging beta testers to suggest it.
3. Jumping IS a small part of gameplay. Peroid. Can you fight a boss without jumping? Yes. Can you complete quests without jumping? Yes. Can you get form point a to point b without jumping? Yes! Mobility is the state of being in motion, i'd consider running and walking an essential part of gameplay, jumping not so much
Now put the word Running in there , hmm you can still do all this well, and to be true we do walk most of the time. Running all the time seems to break the true rpg of an mmo. jumping is like by many as is running.
An army of 40 men ban together to slay an evil dragon. little did they know the cave was heavily guarded by a 3 foot high picket fence...if only our hero's could jump...
welll BTW i dont even know why you making a threat about this, i mean JUMPINg into a mmo is completely useless, and it require a loot more energie and time for the developpement team, in many ways.
Jump in wow ??? I never used this only when i was waiting on other teamate into a dungeon waiting ....
a lot of mmo f2p dont use jump...
and jump in each game arent well used by the game i mean it can be cool to jump but much game arent using this opportunity to made the game more special... its only a function for fun and to made shut up those asking jump.
And i wont be use to jump into a FFx "x" game.... lol ... this making me taugh how better would be FF7 with jump ( sarcastic)
And here I thought only Dragoons in FFs could have jump?
These threads to always give me a giggle, really at the end of the day if "jumping" is your deal sealer on playing or not playing - good riddens. Both sides are valid, yes its easy to implement but its hard to balance - developers hate the Z axis and rightfully so, the dev time can be invested in substance (expanded content & bug fixes, among other things). And if you think they would actually dev things that you couldnt reach "unless you could jump"...your brain must be a lonely place for cells.
Jumping can be fun, it can be exploited - and whatever they decide, as long as THE REST IS GOOD that is what matters.
PS. To the one a few above, you want to argue running doesnt matter for quests or fights? wow, just wow. ever hear of kiting, or travel time or running out of aoe? I mean there are countless times running helps - now lets count jumps, oh wait - gotta remember those pesky cliffs, hills, logs & rocks to jump over...what would I do without it! oh thats right, walk or run around - but then again, I don't want to get too "immersed" now do I...
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
1. Tera online isn't released yet
2. From this discussion i see a lot of people who don't care either way or would prefer not to have any form of jumping at all. Again is it really competitive to implement a jumping system that doesn't go beyond hoping up and down. And your already insisting that they add it by encouraging beta testers to suggest it.
3. Jumping IS a small part of gameplay. Peroid. Can you fight a boss without jumping? Yes. Can you complete quests without jumping? Yes. Can you get form point a to point b without jumping? Yes! Mobility is the state of being in motion, i'd consider running and walking an essential part of gameplay, jumping not so much
1. It's had 3 closed betas and a NA FGT - I can still comment on it as we have evidence of gameplay. Also saying it isn't released yet is totally irrelevant - I pointed to an example as in your original post you said "I can't recall...etc. etc."
2. Yeah - but I have made my argument that jump is a choice - if people don't want it, they don't have to use it. You seem to be ignoring this. People who don't want it as a feature are NOT directly hurt if it ever made it into game. You're just arguing for the sake of arguing - you haven't provided any response refuting the fact that a jump feature would be optional and would not be forced on people who do not want to use it.
3. As I said, no, it's not a fact. Your whole segue into boss fighting etc. is irrelevant and off topic - it's a core game feature that many people think is INTEGRAL to enjoying a game.
Listen you're entitled to your opinion, but you're ignoring crucial things I've mentioned, intentionally or unintentionally. I'm making very specific statements, and it seems you're just arguing against them with tangents.
Comments
Jumping is a part of the illusion for me, the onscreen avatar being glued to the ground and having to walk around small objects impacts on that. I can look past it eventually if a game is half decent though.
It appears I wasn't the only one who didn't know about the lack of a jumping option as a standard for FFXI or FFXIV or that the developers have made public statements about considering it. I would call the discussion from this thread exactly the opposite of void. Additionally, instead of people flaming people for differing in opinions people should realize part of the community that is interested in this game enjoys the jump feature for immersion, enjoyment, whatever reason.
Anyways, I have learned a lot from the discussion here, and I'm hopeful perhaps someone will bring it up in closed beta. If I was invited, I definitely would. It may be a novelty to you, but it's a staple game feature for a lot of others. As I mentioned briefly earlier, two other games that started out as no-jump (GW and TERA) now have that feature in due to popular demand. I would wager it's popular not because people think jumping will help them exploit or bunny-hop annoy people, but because it provides them with a feeling of more dynamic connectedness in the game. That's my feeling on it, anyways.
I hope others got as much out of this issue as I have.
Maybe the FFX-2 thing with prompts to get over things is about as far as I'd want to go. In FFXI, there is jumping, it's called Dragoon. All it sounds like is that people want to get over things that they should, a button press to do that should be fine. You don't have to jump, you can step onto or leap over the object. No actual jumping is needed.
To be the best, you must help each other become the best.
FFXI Character: Satimasu
FFXI Server: Valefor
FFXIV Character: Tamorae Fonteil
SE is not going to give you free jumping ability, it will be things like ffxi in the zone dangruf wadi where you stand on the gyser and it shoots you up the cliff. FFXIV may have certian spots where an icon will show you when you can jump. But thinking there going to give free jumping is a fools hope.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
It appears I wasn't the only one who didn't know about the lack of a jumping option as a standard for FFXI or FFXIV or that the developers have made public statements about considering it. I would call the discussion from this thread exactly the opposite of void. Additionally, instead of people flaming people for differing in opinions people should realize part of the community that is interested in this game enjoys the jump feature for immersion, enjoyment, whatever reason.
Anyways, I have learned a lot from the discussion here, and I'm hopeful perhaps someone will bring it up in closed beta. If I was invited, I definitely would. It may be a novelty to you, but it's a staple game feature for a lot of others. As I mentioned briefly earlier, two other games that started out as no-jump (GW and TERA) now have that feature in due to popular demand. I would wager it's popular not because people think jumping will help them exploit or bunny-hop annoy people, but because it provides them with a feeling of more dynamic connectedness in the game. That's my feeling on it, anyways.
I hope others got as much out of this issue as I have.
Sorry for the double post, Since you seem new to SE and SE games I think I should inform you now that, they dont listen to their NA player base, any SE fan can tell you this. I am personally glad they dont because otherwise we would end up with an anime WoW 2.0. It would be an outcry from the japanese players that would get jumping in ffxiv.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
SE is not going to give you free jumping ability, it will be things like ffxi in the zone dangruf wadi where you stand on the gyser and it shoots you up the cliff. FFXIV may have certian spots where an icon will show you when you can jump. But thinking there going to give free jumping is a fools hope.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
It appears I wasn't the only one who didn't know about the lack of a jumping option as a standard for FFXI or FFXIV or that the developers have made public statements about considering it. I would call the discussion from this thread exactly the opposite of void. Additionally, instead of people flaming people for differing in opinions people should realize part of the community that is interested in this game enjoys the jump feature for immersion, enjoyment, whatever reason.
Anyways, I have learned a lot from the discussion here, and I'm hopeful perhaps someone will bring it up in closed beta. If I was invited, I definitely would. It may be a novelty to you, but it's a staple game feature for a lot of others. As I mentioned briefly earlier, two other games that started out as no-jump (GW and TERA) now have that feature in due to popular demand. I would wager it's popular not because people think jumping will help them exploit or bunny-hop annoy people, but because it provides them with a feeling of more dynamic connectedness in the game. That's my feeling on it, anyways.
I hope others got as much out of this issue as I have.
Sorry for the double post, Since you seem new to SE and SE games I think I should inform you now that, they dont listen to their NA player base, any SE fan can tell you this. I am personally glad they dont because otherwise we would end up with an anime WoW 2.0. It would be an outcry from the japanese players that would get jumping in ffxiv.
I don't play WoW. Jumping has nothing to do with WoW (except for the fact it's one of the many MMOs that feature jump mobility).
Also this isn't a thread to communicate with developers - it was for a discussion and to learn.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
For me jump in mmos excluding the ones that have real time battles (Darkfall and such) are just like an emote to have fun or look silly with nothing more.
Now if developers created some mmos (B&S) were jumping will be needed to proceed then yes I'll be all for it.
I can understand that I guess. I just think a next-gen MMO should really be developed outside of the "well this is how we've always done it" box.
I think action/pace and mobility are things new MMO developers should be considering, looking at the games expected in 2011 (TERA Online, Guild Wars 2, SWTOR) and the newer MMOs of Korea (Continent of the Ninth, TERA Online, Aion, Berkanix).
I never played FFXI, but I played the previous 10 games (seriously) which were all classic RPG's. Jumping was not needed and would have made the games a pain in the ass. I didn't like that there was no jumping in Guild Wars, but I felt the UI needed jumping and it felt unnatural. If the game's UI doesn't create the feeling of needing to jump, then it should be fine.
A witty saying proves nothing.
-Voltaire
I'm going to borrow a term that I only know of from Magic: the Gathering. Design space. When a game allows you to perform an action, and the designers come up with interesting ways that you can put that action to strategic use, they are designing in that particular design space. For example, some new cards do something special when you put a land onto the battlefield. Once per turn, if it's your turn, you can put in one land from your hand. But there are other ways to put out multiple lands on your turn, or maybe even when it isn't your turn. The designers could have played it safe and said that only playing a land the normal way triggers the cool ability, and then they wouldn't have to worry about how powerful the cards potentially get when you bring in 5 lands at once. But they decided that bringing in multiple lands at once or even putting a land in during the opponent's turn made for good design space, so they worded those abilities to work no matter how you get that land to the battlefield.
Jumping to position yourself is not what I would consider a good design space for an MMO. It takes much less than a second for your character to jump up and come back down. Under moderately laggy conditions (say 200ms ping, which developers MUST assume a significant percentage of their playerbase will experience), by the time the server knows you want to jump, your monitor may already be showing you on your way down. Designing combat so that you benefit from strategic jumping means either flipping off all the people with slow connections and reducing their combat effectiveness, or making the server place a lot of trust in the client when it says "I jumped at the right time." I should not need to explain the perils of the latter option.
If we're not talking about jumping at a strategic time, then we're probably concerned with jumping to a strategic place — e.g. onto a ledge where a monster cannot reach without taking a very long route to get there, if at all. While choosing a good vantage point for ranged attacks is a staple of single-player action games, it's been unacceptable in most MMOs for a long time.
As far as barriers to exploration are concerned... all MMOs need barriers. There needs to be a point where the developers say "we didn't make anything further in this direction, so you can't go there." Be it a visible wall, and invisible wall, or instant spiky death, it has to exist to keep you from going to where there is no world, and that is true whether you can jump or not. People who cry that it pains them to see areas that they think they should be able to get to but cannot... they get a great big "meh" from me. They could have put a featureless 50-foot brick wall there, instead they put a cliff edge so that you can get a nice view of the (inaccessible) beach and occasionally a pretty sunset. Be happy. Just because it exists doesn't mean you have a right to put your character there.
So that's my stance on strategic jumping and exploratory jumping. Join us next week when we watch a YouTube video of someone jumping over a waist high fence without a running start, while wearing a full suit of plate mail and wielding a two-handed sword. ("Immersion", HA!)
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
1. Tera online isn't released yet
2. From this discussion i see a lot of people who don't care either way or would prefer not to have any form of jumping at all. Again is it really competitive to implement a jumping system that doesn't go beyond hoping up and down. And your already insisting that they add it by encouraging beta testers to suggest it.
3. Jumping IS a small part of gameplay. Peroid. Can you fight a boss without jumping? Yes. Can you complete quests without jumping? Yes. Can you get form point a to point b without jumping? Yes! Mobility is the state of being in motion, i'd consider running and walking an essential part of gameplay, jumping not so much
No jumping is actually why I really liked FFXI. When we get the ability to jump it's either animated terribly, or the overuse of it makes everyone look like bunny rabbits running around. Hence the term bunnyhopping in video games. I wouldn't mind jumping in FF if the implemented it to where it was heavily taxing so you could only do it so often.
I would hardly say this is game breaking news, but really it is an easy to program mechanic that as depth to character animations. I do not really see a good reason to not have jumping in a game. More is better.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
1. Tera online isn't released yet
2. From this discussion i see a lot of people who don't care either way or would prefer not to have any form of jumping at all. Again is it really competitive to implement a jumping system that doesn't go beyond hoping up and down. And your already insisting that they add it by encouraging beta testers to suggest it.
3. Jumping IS a small part of gameplay. Peroid. Can you fight a boss without jumping? Yes. Can you complete quests without jumping? Yes. Can you get form point a to point b without jumping? Yes! Mobility is the state of being in motion, i'd consider running and walking an essential part of gameplay, jumping not so much
Now put the word Running in there , hmm you can still do all this well, and to be true we do walk most of the time. Running all the time seems to break the true rpg of an mmo. jumping is like by many as is running.
[Mod Edit]
An army of 40 men ban together to slay an evil dragon. little did they know the cave was heavily guarded by a 3 foot high picket fence...if only our hero's could jump...
welll BTW i dont even know why you making a threat about this, i mean JUMPINg into a mmo is completely useless, and it require a loot more energie and time for the developpement team, in many ways.
Jump in wow ??? I never used this only when i was waiting on other teamate into a dungeon waiting ....
a lot of mmo f2p dont use jump...
and jump in each game arent well used by the game i mean it can be cool to jump but much game arent using this opportunity to made the game more special... its only a function for fun and to made shut up those asking jump.
And i wont be use to jump into a FFx "x" game.... lol ... this making me taugh how better would be FF7 with jump ( sarcastic)
well this sucks
Just my 2 cents, I didn't miss jumping in FFXi and I wouldn't miss it in FFXIV.
(forgot to add, My DRG jumped just fine)
And here I thought only Dragoons in FFs could have jump?
These threads to always give me a giggle, really at the end of the day if "jumping" is your deal sealer on playing or not playing - good riddens. Both sides are valid, yes its easy to implement but its hard to balance - developers hate the Z axis and rightfully so, the dev time can be invested in substance (expanded content & bug fixes, among other things). And if you think they would actually dev things that you couldnt reach "unless you could jump"...your brain must be a lonely place for cells.
Jumping can be fun, it can be exploited - and whatever they decide, as long as THE REST IS GOOD that is what matters.
PS. To the one a few above, you want to argue running doesnt matter for quests or fights? wow, just wow. ever hear of kiting, or travel time or running out of aoe? I mean there are countless times running helps - now lets count jumps, oh wait - gotta remember those pesky cliffs, hills, logs & rocks to jump over...what would I do without it! oh thats right, walk or run around - but then again, I don't want to get too "immersed" now do I...
Go play Counter Strike if you like jumping so much, at least there it has a use for an exploit.
I didn't think or say anything about SE giving players "free jumping" at all - so your whole comment about those hoping for it are foolish is really irrelevant and misplaced. If you would have read my original post I asked WHY they didn't include jump (I assumed there was some specific reason - either gameplay mechanics or combat mechanics) and then provided my opinion on gameplay being more immersive WITH jump.
And people have mentioned in this thread developers at SE have actually commented that the decision not to have jump is not final - so it's actually not foolish for anyone to discuss the possibility or their preference for jumping.
So whats the big issue then? People i am addressing is the people who want to hit space bar to jump anywhere anytime (free jump). I absolutly have no problem with controlled jumping, example walk up ta a cliff and a little icon pops up to show you that your at a jumping/climbing spot. Like I said previously ffxi had that sort of jumping style like that with the gysers. I think its probably safe to say there might be stuff like that, in ffxiv. When people argue for jumping they are arguing for free jump, I dont think youll find any anti-jump argument from any of the ffxiv fans on this site about controlled jumps (certian spots only).
I think the best compromise would be a dodge or dash maneuver skills that allows you to jump or maneuver that uses endurance or mana or whatever - so people won't be spamming it endlessly for no reason- I would take that over a "you can only jump right here "mechanic. But the issue is, as I've always stated, player freedom. I think it's unnecessarily (key word there) restrictive.
Your asking for a jump that actually does something yet I don't recall many MMOs that have a jump function the works beyond the purpose of jumping up and down. Its frustrating that you insist that ffxiv must have some form of jumping or its a crappy game when jumping is such a small part of the game play, granted the ability to use a dodge or dash skill to avoid an attack and making combat more skill based would be awesome, however that isn't jumping, they have their own adjectives for a reason.
1. TERA Online does
2. I never once insisted FFXIV must have a jump. I think ALL MMOs should promote some basic personal freedoms, jump being one. If the developers don't ultimately include it, I won't parade around insisting they add it - that is ultimately their choice (and I think as evident by this discussion - a bad choice considering people do want it, and it doesn't directly effect people who don't want it if it was in game). I think if they were smart and competitive, they would add it.
3. Jumping a small part of gameplay? That my friend, is a personal opinion and not a fact. For a lot of people mobility (including jump) is a HUGE part of gamplay.
1. Tera online isn't released yet
2. From this discussion i see a lot of people who don't care either way or would prefer not to have any form of jumping at all. Again is it really competitive to implement a jumping system that doesn't go beyond hoping up and down. And your already insisting that they add it by encouraging beta testers to suggest it.
3. Jumping IS a small part of gameplay. Peroid. Can you fight a boss without jumping? Yes. Can you complete quests without jumping? Yes. Can you get form point a to point b without jumping? Yes! Mobility is the state of being in motion, i'd consider running and walking an essential part of gameplay, jumping not so much
1. It's had 3 closed betas and a NA FGT - I can still comment on it as we have evidence of gameplay. Also saying it isn't released yet is totally irrelevant - I pointed to an example as in your original post you said "I can't recall...etc. etc."
2. Yeah - but I have made my argument that jump is a choice - if people don't want it, they don't have to use it. You seem to be ignoring this. People who don't want it as a feature are NOT directly hurt if it ever made it into game. You're just arguing for the sake of arguing - you haven't provided any response refuting the fact that a jump feature would be optional and would not be forced on people who do not want to use it.
3. As I said, no, it's not a fact. Your whole segue into boss fighting etc. is irrelevant and off topic - it's a core game feature that many people think is INTEGRAL to enjoying a game.
Listen you're entitled to your opinion, but you're ignoring crucial things I've mentioned, intentionally or unintentionally. I'm making very specific statements, and it seems you're just arguing against them with tangents.