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Console games cost $60 up from $50, so are we now taking MMORPG development for granted?
knighthonor
Member Posts: 96
Console games cost $60 up from $50, so are we now taking MMORPG development for granted?
The cost of games has gone up due to the development and increased graphic engine effects.
Well for MMORPG games, that same effect is happening here on our games. We put too much pressure on developers to make a pretty game rather than a AWESOME game!
And with so much development time spent on making the game’s graphics all pretty and such, well basically the developers are left to release a crappy game.
If they would spend more of the time developing the gameplay over graphics, then maybe we would have more great games.
But problem is the MMORPG community, like the Console Gaming Community, bash down games that aren’t graphically top notch.
Take notice to the console games out now days. We had better games on the PS2 genre for crying out loud. But if the games aren’t graphically top notch, the pubic bashes it.
Which is why we don’t see many of the good, less graphically games from the ps2 era making come backs on the PS3,
Because they know, the community would never accept gameplay over graphics.
The same thing is happening here with MMORGs.
Developers know the player base would never accept gameplay over graphics
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You Sandbox mmorpg fans for example,
If you would stop your mad dash for graphically top notch games as the requirement, then maybe you would have more cool Sandbox mmos to choose at your disposal. Most Sandbox MMORPG are made by indies, so if they didn’t have to go out their way to bump up the graphics, then maybe, just maybe, you all would have your UO2010x Sandbox king killer mmorpg.
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Sooner or later, this graphics lust is going to cost many of us down the road.
Do be surprised once the average monthly subscription fee jumps up again, just like PS3/360 games jumped up in fee.
Comments
That's just how people are, unfortunately. Look at it this way, if a publisher had a commercial for, say, Ultima Online, and immediately following that was a commercial for Everquest II, or something like that, do you think the people at home would go buy UO or EQII? People are attracted to pretty things. Mentally they associated pretty with "GOOD", thinking the game that has the spectacular water effects will clearly blow their socks off, which, as you stated, OP, isn't always true.
As far as I know, sandbox gamers are last to be blamed for this, usually much older crowd who have been playing for long time and actually prefer gritty graphics. The younger generation of gamers, who have started gaming at about 2000-2005 are used to much better graphics and it's kind of understandable for them to hope for better graphics, but frankly it's makes my blood boil a bit when I see a LFG post saying "LFG game with awsum graphics, awsum big mobs and must be F2P!".
Waiting on Xsyon & betaing stuff
Agreed.
Spoiled brats.
What does any of that do with price? The cost of console games is in no way related to developments costs, if this were the case then you'd see a much more varied difference in price for individual releases. The reason the are 50 or 60 bucks? Because they can. It's that simple.Console owners and parents are there to be milked, not to provide "top notch" graphics.
How you made the jump from console games being expensive to developers giving graphics on MMO's over gameplay i can't quite fathom as the links in the post are weak to say the least. Sandboxes are crap and are crap almost every single time they get released, it's something that is just damn hard to do and has absolutely nothing to do with time spent on graphics, do you really think that development teams are made of a bunch of people who are jack of all trades?
Besides all that, graphics on the whole for MMO's are absolute rubbish compared to what they could be if developers were really going for that alone.
Eh, what's yer beef with current console games?
I've played a few awesome console games lately. Assassin's Creed 2, Uncharted 2, Heavy Rain .. I'm spending more time playing Need for Speed:Shift online with work buddies than I am playing MMOs these days. Sure, there's some tripe .. but that's par for the course.
PS3 games still need keyboard/mouse support as standard though!
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
Because once the trend continues, more and more developers will put more focus on graphics over gameplay.
All to the point were subs will go up for graphics alone just like the console games did.
Now they can sell us Shit with a pretty bowtie on top and get away with it (AT A HIGHER SUB FEE AT THAT)
You're simply scaremongering, if the big companies could get away with raising their subs beyond the industry standard they would have done so already. If you think that they care anything beyond how much money you can give them then you're severely mistaken.
You also have to remember that you can trade in console games for credit towards another console game. Depending on how old the game is you can receive a credit from $10-20$.I agree, we have has better console games than mmos because mmos these days are nothing more than slot machines with their item malls. I wish mmo devs would keep requirements to a minimum and actually worry about gameplay more.
All I have to say they keep on rising price because of silly excuses like graphics and so but yet they keep on making games shorter then ever.
Miss Psx games length...
Thats basically my point.
Developers are putting to much excuses on the graphics, and basically we the community ask for that shit.
And in the end, the games get worst, or are just plain lame.
Dont be suprised when the sup fee jumps up again, but with more shitty MMORPGs
You may think that rising development cost are triggering the rise in console games but that fact is only partially true. The other factor in that equation is frequency in purchasing console games. For instance:
If I buy on average a few games out of the year say three, then you have three different companies getting some return on their product. And as a consumer you have stimulated potential development into three different companies as well.
On the other hand if I decide to buy a MMO and I like it, I have paid my 50-80 dollars for the initial cost to one company and not only that, if I decide to stay for a year I'm effectively repurchasing a game every 4 months. But now I'm giving only one company enough return to continue to improve on work that has already been released. Well that and future expansion development if it occurs.
So to recap, you have console gamers that invest their money into up to 3 different companies at 60 dollars a pop, that is 180 dollars a year. Now compare that to MMO players that pay 1 company 50 dollars for a game and a additional cost of 15 (1 month) to 165 (11 months) dollars to only 1 company, for a grand total of about 215 bucks for that first year. And if you decide to stay longer count it as 180 dollars a year there after.
Also you have to take in account that console gamers are not only supporting more companies than their MMO counterparts but also more genres. RPGs, sports, adventure, RTSs, you name it. While different MMOs are all part of the same genre with only different skins. So naturally there is a tougher struggle for control of your dollar. Where a fighting game's appeal will be less likely to a issue for someone developing shooters, most MMO players can only afford 1 sub at a time.
So you tell me who deserves to raise prices more: Console developers that may get 1 purchase a year with no way to retain that income after that purchase or a MMO developer who gets that 1 time purchase and also has the chance to retain your business for many more months to come after it? An upward of 50 different companies covering a dozen genres vs. a dozen companies covering 1 genre. You decide.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
I blame the used game market!
/flee
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
If anyone has been taking anything for granted it is a lot of these companies running mmos lately such as Funcom, NCSoft, Mythic, and Cryptic.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
take away gamestop used game buy back crap for one that's one idea. That will make the game prices go down.
IN THE FACE!
Console games prices went up because system prices went up. Sony and Microsoft charge company's x amount to release game to make console cheaper. Now Nintendo games.. err toys prices is just them being greedy.
Also most company like to charge 50$ because it's the average amount people spend on entertainment per month.
--
"Any free people have the right to choose how it wants to be govern thats the essence of democracy. It's sad when America has chosen for the stability and consistency of a dictatorship and doing it democratically" -utnow
If you did that then you wouldn't have any stores to buy your games from. Places like Gamestop and Gameexchange make there profits via used games. They may make $5-$10 on a retail sale. But on used games thats more along the lines of $15-$25 per game.
Very few companys could survive off $5 game sells alone. That would require them to sale atleast 2-4 games a hour every hour the store is open just to cover the costs of having two employees at the store. Now that doesnt even cover the cost of keeping the rent payed on the building, any other expenses that are also occured. That isn't going to happen 90% of the time.
It's not the used games market that is the problem here. The reasion costs have gone up is simple inflation. If you look at the cost of gas in the early 90s and then look at the cost of gas now you will see a huge change in price. Thats just basic inflation and demand. Take a look at just about any item that you can buy. Compare the prices from the early 90s to now and you see that everything has increased somewhat. Some more then others.
This.
Games get so much shorter but it seems that some don't realize it, as long as they get their pretty graphics they are satisfied, these people are not real players, players are people that pay and play a game for the content.
Would you pay $60 for a great looking 8oz salmon that you consume in an hour or less, or pay $60 for an entire salmon that you can prepare and enjoy for 2 weeks?
Same applies (strangely) to games, do you pay for something that looks great but only lasts 2-3 days and it's over? or some something that will last 2 or so weeks? If you are all money earning workers you know that $60 a month is a huge investment for something that won't even last a week, $60 is your monthly cell phone bill or food budget, or car insurance, etc. All of those evolve around a month's worth of those $60. If they plan on selling games for $60 then they better make sure it has enough content to last that long, given they can't make a game with 720h of content, and we can't really play all day as we have obligations, but the 30-40h of content is not enough for our money.
Why should i be unable to sell something i regularly purchased and i don't need/like/use anymore?
Bullsh*t.
Premise of this topic is that you have to choose between great graphics or great gameplay.Thought we have to accept sh*tty graphics makes no sense,I mean their is free version of the Unreal engine.The exisitance of middleware and Unreal engine Gamebyro,Hero engine,CryEngine2 and other engines means we should not see crappy looking games.
If you want me to invest my time in game,Go out of the way invest money in gaming engine if your company is incapable of creating a game with one.It is not all about graphics but you can have both graphics and gameplay.I refuse accept both options A good looking should not have bad gameplay,No company in this day should create a game that looks like fallen earth or darkfall.
You don't have to choose you can have both.Players who accept medicore graphics for good gameplay are just as bad as players who play great looking games with medicore gameplay.
You really can't be mad for console game prices going up. The truth is, it does cost more to develop a game these days. And with that said, the standard price remained at $50 for how many years? yeah, that's right. a loooong time. At least since the SNES days.
Look at how many times other industries have raised their prices since then. Especially considering games have always been in high demand
DId you know that Xbox and playstation consoles are sold at a loss by Sony and mcsoft? They make their profit on game sold. Each console game u buy has X% going to sony. I don't have the exact figures, but its not a small amount..
And no matter how much the dev costs go down, it will never going to make games cost less. The people out there are in to make money out of it, it they can make a game cheaper(with low gfx) that people will buy anyway, they will just inflate their profit margin and keep the price unchanged.
This.
Games get so much shorter but it seems that some don't realize it, as long as they get their pretty graphics they are satisfied, these people are not real players, players are people that pay and play a game for the content.
Would you pay $60 for a great looking 8oz salmon that you consume in an hour or less, or pay $60 for an entire salmon that you can prepare and enjoy for 2 weeks?
Same applies (strangely) to games, do you pay for something that looks great but only lasts 2-3 days and it's over? or some something that will last 2 or so weeks? If you are all money earning workers you know that $60 a month is a huge investment for something that won't even last a week, $60 is your monthly cell phone bill or food budget, or car insurance, etc. All of those evolve around a month's worth of those $60. If they plan on selling games for $60 then they better make sure it has enough content to last that long, given they can't make a game with 720h of content, and we can't really play all day as we have obligations, but the 30-40h of content is not enough for our money.
Your complaining about games that have 30-40 hours of content at the price of $60. Thats actually dirt cheap and a great investment.
Lets take a look at see how much 30 hours of watching a movie at a movie theater costs. Lets see 30 hours worth of movies comes to watching 15 different 2 hour movies. 15 movies at $7.50 (we will assume you don't buy any drinks or food.. but come on who doesn't buy anything to drink or eat at a movie theater.) That comes to $112.50 (We will just assume the movie is 2 hours long as most of the time it doesn't even come to being 2 hours.)
So $112.50 or $60 for 30 hours of time.. Hmm.. I think the game companies are getting ripped off at that price per time investment.
So no 30 hours of gameplay is actually fairly long for $60 by comparison to watching movies.
What the hell is it with gamers beating analogies to death and so prone to using them over and over again?
I swear more than any other group gamers use them to a nauseating degree.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I disagree with the OP as far as thinking players are able to have that kind of effect on devs.
The pressure, and the results are due to the demands of the investors, not the whining of the players.
I stopped taking anything for granted when 300 F2P games showed up out of nowhere.
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