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Sandbox-ThemePark-Hybrid. Could it work?
Buttermilch
Member Posts: 208
Hey guys!
I was just thinking (as I have a concept for such a hybrid-game) if it really could work and be appealing for the masses to have a hybrid game of theme park and sandbox. Features it would have:
- Complex, but easy-to-use crafting system, that is not boring by just watching progress-bars to reach their maximum
- Policy-system
- Players can really change the world through server-wide events and such
- Very cool fractions PvP in which you can conquer towns and outposts, thus getting advantages and shifting the borders of your faction
- No private instanced zones. You won't have a dungeon just for yourself or your group. Anyone can join.
- Scalable world that is smaller with few people online and larger with a lot of people online, thereby ensuring that you will regularly meet other players while exploring and preventing overcrowded zones
- dynamic quest generation that makes fun quests that sometimes mix up with PvP elements
- some "Lore"-quests, which are prescripted quests you just do like in common MMOs.
- classless, levelless. You have skills that raise when you use them (having a hard-cap)
- Semiharsh penalty upon death. There is a chance to drop one item you have currently equipped, which can be looted + some gold
- Item decay to ensure player-run economy
- revolutionary magics-system
- innovative combat system that really feels like playing an RPG, but needs you to react fast and think tactically
- a plotline that is updated regularly via patches
I know this sounds a bit like the next AAA MMORPG title. ;-p But I just wondered if such a game could work. For all these features I named above I have a fully working concept. But still, there is no company that would do such a game with me. Sad. :-(
/discuss
Comments
Could a hybrid work? Of course.
some of your freatures I don't like however.
Classless leveless? Not necessary. Classes work fine. Could you also develop a fun skill system? Yes, but IMO, only if it works similar to classes.
meaning you can't build a tank mage. You can EITHER be an awesome specialist, or an ok generalist.
For example, if you take only healing skills, you get bonus heal skill points ot spend, and you get the highest heal skills in the game. However, if you take heal skills and Tank skills, you won't get the highest heal skills, or the highest tank skills in the game.
That gives you flexibility, but every character isn't the exact same min maxed tank mage. So as you can see, you're pretty close to classes, and either one works.
Dynamic quest generation? IMO, no. These are generic and boring.
Harsh death penalty for PvP? Absolutely not. You are discouraging people from PvP, and if you do that then why have PvP in the first place? Do like Eq2. YOu get rewarded for wins, the other person doesn't get a penalty, besides a trip back to the bind stone.
"Innovative combat system"? I hope you don't mean yet ANOTHER thread asking for FPS combat. If that's the case, just go play a FPS game. When I play an RPG, I want to play an RPG. If I want to play an FPS I will go play an FPS.
Updated plotlines? Not interested, but probably doesn't hurt anything if you ad them.
I think a quick glance at the active threads on this very forum reveal that that is hardly a universal opinion.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
I think a quick glance at the active threads on this very forum reveal that that is hardly a universal opinion.
I make no claim that it is universal. I believe the OP was trying to list features to a game that would be popular, and not a small niche.
Yeah, right. You cannot be good as a tank AND a mage. But there is still a difference between a strict class-system and a skill-based system. Because the skill-based system allows more freedom. Just look at what Ultima Online has done. In addition, you don't have to reroll the whole character if you just want to do small changes like exchange your archery skill with the first aid skill for example.
"Dynamic quest generation? IMO, no. These are generic and boring."
Dynamic quests are at least as good as the common "Kill 10 of these, find 5 of that"-quests. But the system I want would be better as it combines questing with PvP-elements in some situations. Keep in mind that combat-related quests can be fun as long as combat is well done in general.
"Harsh death penalty for PvP? Absolutely not. You are discouraging people from PvP, and if you do that then why have PvP in the first place?"
It's not that harsh if there is just the chance to loose one single item. Please assume that there won't be uber-epic-items like in WoW where you would cry for days when loosing them.
""Innovative combat system"? I hope you don't mean yet ANOTHER thread asking for FPS combat. If that's the case, just go play a FPS game. When I play an RPG, I want to play an RPG. If I want to play an FPS I will go play an FPS. "
Nope. Just like I said: It feels like being a real RPG, still adding elements that make it fun and innovative. ;-) So no FPS-styled combat.
There is no such thing as sandbox-themepark hybrid.
The list of features can be the same for both game types, what is actualy different is how those features interact with each other and the player. That can be done in a way or another but not both ways.
Far as I'm concerned Fallen Earth is a hybrid game combining elements fom both types of mmos and seems to be doing okay so definitely could work.
I would love more games to try to combine features from both types myself.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Sandbox-Themepark hybrids can exist. I see a game like FFXI being close but not quite there.
I agree with this, FFXI definately had elements of both but was still more theme-park styled. Will be interesting to see how FFXIV goes then since the actual vision behind the game seems to be much the same, they've just updated and reinvented a lot of features.
In reply to the OP, I actually imagine that an Elder Scrolls MMO could be exactly what you are describing if the likes of Oblivion was translated into the MMO genre successfully.
I was thinking FE as well. It falls short on more than a few of your requirements but the ones it hits it does very well. They are constantly updating the game and a more robust PVP experience is said to be in the works. Might not be everything you're looking for right now but it's one to keep an eye on as it appears the developer's vision for the game it quite similar to what you've got outlined.
I also wouldn't call FFXI sandbox at all, but XIV seems to introduce many sandboxish elements on top of the already stable themepark model. Crafting and item gathering are classes just like melee and magic classes are, but we are yet to see how big of a difference this makes. One would assume that crafting has a bigger role in that game and it won't be "just a minigame" like usually in themeparks.
That doesn't quite make it sandbox, but it definitely is an element only available in sandbox games afaik. I wonder if there'll be something else as well.
I mean, out of everything listed above, many of them might make it in the game:
- Complex, but easy-to-use crafting system, that is not boring by just watching progress-bars to reach their maximum
- No private instanced zones. You won't have a dungeon just for yourself or your group. Anyone can join.
- dynamic quest generation that makes fun quests that sometimes mix up with PvP elements
- some "Lore"-quests, which are prescripted quests you just do like in common MMOs.
- classless, levelless. You have skills that raise when you use them (having a hard-cap)
^ The class system hints at something like this, but not in the traditional way. A mix of the two, probably.
- Item decay to ensure player-run economy
- revolutionary magics-system
- innovative combat system that really feels like playing an RPG, but needs you to react fast and think tactically
- a plotline that is updated regularly via patches
All of those will probably be included, although it is for players to decide if the magic system is revolutionary or the combat system innovative. So far looks like it.
This is the way I think a hybrid should work.
It is WoW. You can play the game, doing quests, collecting gear, going up in levels or skills (makes no real difference IMO), just like you are playing WoW, LotRO, Aion, or any other themepark game.
However, on TOP of this game is a sandbox where players can change the gameworld and control territory.
Doing a quest may affect the gameworld, but you don't even know it.
You can participate in teh sandbox by organizing players to change the game world by doing certain actions, or you can ignore the sandbox and just play the game like you would any other themepark, oblivious to the fact that others are playing a sandbox game.
I played it upon release. There were a lot of things I didn't like about it and that didn't feel very sandbox-like.
1) There was no item-decay (don't know what it is like nowadays)
2) Crafting was boring, though it was cool you had to scavenge all the crap you need to craft things
3) Combat system was mediocre
4) PvP seemed to be without penalty... I don't know why you should even do PvP in FE
5) It didn't feel very "open". I started in a town doing low-level quests. After I did these, I was redirected to the next town doing a bit harder quests and so on. In a real sandbox game you can at least try to do end-game encounters. In Ultima Online, I can kill a dragon after 2-3 hours of playtime if I just do it right (though it would be hard to do). In FE I couldn't just go into a tier3 zone and kill whatever I engage. It wouldn't even be worth trying.
I played it for several days, yes... BUT:
If the game (or at least some of you guys) claim this game to be at least a bit of sandbox and I didn't feel any sandbox elements within like 20 hours of gameplay, then the game did something severely wrong. Just because there are no instances doesn't make it a sandbox game (though there are some). I would call myself an UO vet and I played several other sandbox games. So I know when I'm playing one. FE is 10% sandbox at best. ;-)