Evidently they are just implementing the latest build of Atlas. Suprise?
Migrating from one engine to another takes a LONG time, and apparently they are going to upgrade both their network solution, as well as their unreal engine version.
My guess is that you may as well write off MO entirely now, because if you thought that each patch produced more bugs... just wait until this hits. It's going to be epic.
Original release update by Henrik implies that they are fixing the desync by improving their network structure and that they are going to rebuild the way their network structure works.
By what that thread says they are just getting the new build of Atlas, not at all touching their own code, and hoping that works.
Not to mention that they aren't even sending people to the right place. Epic Games in the United States doesn't work with Atlas, that's Epic Games China's issue.
Overall they are being intentionally misleading in order to make people think they are fixing things like desync when they aren't doing shit.
Wtf are you going on about. wow some people. what they are doing is to fix the dysync. they did say they are delayign to fix the dysync. hence updating to the latest atlas and ue will FIx the dysync along with some other stuff
>>Latest build of something is typically considered an upgrade and an improvement.
What were you expecting?
Getting the latest build of something doesn't fix your code. In this case it won't fix the desync issue because the desync issue is related to SV, not Atlas.
>>How are they lying when they are going to send devs to EPIC to fix the issues? EPIC did develop their network solution.
Epic Games China develops Atlas which is the network solution. If they have a problem with their network solution they need to fly to Shanghai.
They aren't flying to the U.S for any reason that has to do with networking or desync.
Are you dense or just trolling?
Engine: Unreal Engine 3 (US)
Network Solution: Atlas Technology (China)
There is a problem in their network solution that cause the desync and apprently it will be fixed by updating Atlas to the latest version. But to do so, they need to update their game engine (UE3) as well, and that is something that can be troublesome and time consuming. Hence they are sending a few programmers to the US to make the merge as smooth as possible.
And what's up with the lying part? Henrik said that they are delaying the game a month to fix desync, and that is exactly what the whole programming team is working on atm.
Did post this already on one thread, but here it goes, directly from Epic Games China's Atlas overview page: "Full Support – We offer full support and work hard to make sure our licensees succeed, and offer multi-site support in Shanghai and Seattle." Will it offer any improvements is a totally different matter, but debating whether this is/was the right address can stop.
Wtf are you going on about. wow some people. what they are doing is to fix the dysync. they did say they are delayign to fix the dysync. hence updating to the latest atlas and ue will FIx the dysync along with some other stuff
Correction,... They are hoping it will fix the sync issues.
There is no way the Atlas technology is perfect and free of problems,i have been around since the beginning of Epic games and i can tel lyou,they have struggled with networking code badly.The first 5-6 patches/updates all continually addressed networking and eventually they made it worse.I knwo they made it worse because from version 420 onwards i went from very stable connections to all sorts of problems with instability.
There has also been one lawsuit against Epic claiming the support was not as promised.I can se the problem right away as their support is done online through tickets lmao,we all knwo how well that system works...not !.
So i believe that rather than go through that horrible process,they may very well be sending some pople straight to Epic to get better communication for support.
Personally i could not possibly see how anyone could do a written back and forth support,it would be 50 pages long and still could be misinterpreted.
As to why the USA,they have a support team based in Seattle called Titan Studios,who houses some very talented people.Weather or not SV is actually sending people and weather or not Titan wil lactually do hands on support is anyone's guess,however it makes sense to me,i would blow a gasket if i had to deal with support for something this important through a support ticket system.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
In the release update Henrik goes on for a paragraph about how they are going to improve the server networking. All of this was just a long wind version of "we're going to update Atlas" with the intent of spinning it so that you think they are doing a bunch of work on their own server to fix the desync.
It is rather apparent at this point, that all the updates they said "We put in a fix for desync, how does it work now?" was really "we tried something, we have no idea if it will work!"
And that's what it boils down to. They have NO IDEA what is wrong. So now instead of actually trying to figure out the problem (which I'd bet money is DESIGN related), they are going to upgrade to the latest version of Unreal Engine and Atlas. As said above, and I'll paraphrase -- it's like taking a HTML4 page (the one you see now) that is not even loading, trying to convert it to HTML5 and thinking that will be the fix. It's stupid thinking, and is indicative of the whole project being an abject failure.
And oddly enough, all the things I've mentioned in the past have miraculously come true about SV and MO. And I think that going forward, I'll still be right. I thought that it may have a slow death over time, but I think at this point with Henrik's dad selling his shares to get some further funding (possibly), they are going to have some severe problems with the health of this game.
Html4 and html5 are actually backwards compatible, it's just that html5 brings out new features that are actually just fluff (video tags so you dont have to use flash?) and have no affect on things like style sheets etc
also, Atlas = networking, Atlas is the thing that allows them to create such a huge world. SV is also first mmorpg company to use Atlas thats why theres tons of problems because SV basically desided to license an system that has only been proven to work on patent application.
and asking why they are going to USA for training when Atlas is being made in China is like asking why would you go to local volkswagen dealer to get your car fixed when Volkswagens are made in Germany?
>>and asking why they are going to USA for training when Atlas is being made in China is like asking why would you go to local volkswagen dealer to get your car fixed when Volkswagens are made in Germany?
Heres the reason why they are going to the U.S.
Hands-on Training
We provide on-site training for first time licensees – at your location for content creation training, and our location for engineering. We come to you to show your content team how to best work with our tools and content pipeline, and we invite your engineering staff to visit our Cary, NC offices to meet with our entire engineering staff to answer questions and provide overviews of current subsystems and the future technology roadmap. Depending on availability, our doors are open for visits throughout the development life of your project.
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
Evidently they are just implementing the latest build of Atlas. Suprise?
>>You say you are getting a new Atlas build, but Henrik said you are "upgrading our network solution" and "improving the overall network structure". Are these one and the same because it sounds very misleading.
Atlas is the network solution or at least a large part of it.
Epic Games China provides Asian technology support and professional training services in Mandarin and English, and North American support through wholly owned Titan Studios in Seattle, Washington. http://www.epicgames.com/press_releases/atlas.html
Starvault's developers speak Swedish with some fluency in English. Epic games (Cary, NC) or Titan studios employees speak English as their native language. Epic games China employees speak Mandarin with some fluency in English. Which combination would have the least communication problems?
I know liquidwolf already pointed it out, but it bears repeating...
The programmers go to where they are most efficient. In this case thats the US.
As Henrik already explained, we are merging our current build with both a new Atlas build AND a new UE build.
I hope that answers the question though I'm slightly irritated as to why this question arose in the first place. If people need to go to China, they are sent to China - if they need to go to the US, the are sent there. Pretty simple really :P
In the release update Henrik goes on for a paragraph about how they are going to improve the server networking. All of this was just a long wind version of "we're going to update Atlas" with the intent of spinning it so that you think they are doing a bunch of work on their own server to fix the desync.
It is rather apparent at this point, that all the updates they said "We put in a fix for desync, how does it work now?" was really "we tried something, we have no idea if it will work!"
And that's what it boils down to. They have NO IDEA what is wrong. So now instead of actually trying to figure out the problem (which I'd bet money is DESIGN related), they are going to upgrade to the latest version of Unreal Engine and Atlas. As said above, and I'll paraphrase -- it's like taking a HTML4 page (the one you see now) that is not even loading, trying to convert it to HTML5 and thinking that will be the fix. It's stupid thinking, and is indicative of the whole project being an abject failure.
And oddly enough, all the things I've mentioned in the past have miraculously come true about SV and MO. And I think that going forward, I'll still be right. I thought that it may have a slow death over time, but I think at this point with Henrik's dad selling his shares to get some further funding (possibly), they are going to have some severe problems with the health of this game.
Html4 and html5 are actually backwards compatible, it's just that html5 brings out new features that are actually just fluff (video tags so you dont have to use flash?) and have no affect on things like style sheets etc
also, Atlas = networking, Atlas is the thing that allows them to create such a huge world. SV is also first mmorpg company to use Atlas thats why theres tons of problems because SV basically desided to license an system that has only been proven to work on patent application.
and asking why they are going to USA for training when Atlas is being made in China is like asking why would you go to local volkswagen dealer to get your car fixed when Volkswagens are made in Germany?
Yes, HTML5 is backwards compatible to 4 -- but converting a broken HTML4 page into HTML5 won't fix any of the underlying problems. That's the point I was making.
That said, Atlas has been used in other MMOs -- Global Agenda (which is already released), and other upcoming MMOs like Blade and Soul, APB, etc.
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
Because people want to buy products made from people who know what the hell they are doing, not selling products and playing the "learn as you go".
I know nothing about medicine. How about I start a medicine company and sell you some medicine I made so I can go get some training on how to make medicine.
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
Not a problem but they should have done that a long time ago.
Evidently they are just implementing the latest build of Atlas. Suprise?
>>You say you are getting a new Atlas build, but Henrik said you are "upgrading our network solution" and "improving the overall network structure". Are these one and the same because it sounds very misleading.
>>It's not misleading at all really.
You can easily subsumize certain core components of the UE as well as Atals with this term.
I'm sorry if you were irritated by that but since you are the only one that seems to have been I will close this thread and thus the redundant discussion.
Benthon, you sound a lot like the poster SHOE that is constantly trying to cause problems in the MO forums. You related?
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
Because people want to buy products made from people who know what the hell they are doing, not selling products and playing the "learn as you go".
I know nothing about medicine. How about I start a medicine company and sell you some medicine I made so I can go get some training on how to make medicine.
Yea, makes you really want to buy my crap.
Umm last time i checked people buy products from SALESMEN people that will,lie to your face to make a sale.Peopel aslo buy those million dollar homes for middle men that have nothing to do with products,so peopel are basically tossing money out the window,paying 1000 bucks for a TV that would sell from the manufacturer for about 150 bucks.So no we don't buy fom peopel that know anything other than how to rip us off.When's the last time anyone walked int oa store and the salesmen said ,don't buy anything here it is all crap lol.
I also need to remind people here that EPIC failed badly out of the gate on their networking structure for Unreal/UT the yhad to make steady updates for several months to get pings from horrible standards to playable.
One further point,NOBODY is expected to know the game engine,this is why SUPPORT is part of the licensing agreeement.This is a famous lawsuit that Silicon Knights took agaisnt Epic and the UE3 engine.
Those buyers you describe Wiz are known as morons, children, fools, whatever, but not intelligent consumers. BTW a 75K lawsuit?? ROFLMAO boy that will sure hurt Epic LOL. Sounds like more SV script kiddies and modders. BTW what was the result of the suit? Do you have any citations or just some rumor mill crap from some other gamer site?
Glad to see this game is still wheezing along while I have been away. Fired it up a short while ago and still the same old de-sync crap, hyper warp critters, and empty void that they are calling a game world. LOL even DnL had more to offer.
Oh BTW, nice to see so many of the die hard DFO defenders showing up on here with the same old songs they used for DFO's aborted launch. I guess some people make a career of hyping failed games on this site because if the one that they previously hyped was so good then why are they here and not playing it???
>>One further point,NOBODY is expected to know the game engine,this is why SUPPORT is part of the licensing agreeement.This is a famous lawsuit that Silicon Knights took agaisnt Epic and the UE3 engine.
Nobody is expected to know the Engine right off the bat.
However, Mortal Online is over 3 years into development, sold preorders, is "nearing" release, and you're telling me they need hands on training directly from Epic on how to work the engine they've been developing with all along?
What the hell.
>>Benthon, you sound a lot like the poster SHOE that is constantly trying to cause problems in the MO forums. You related?
You think he's the only person to see through all SV's BS?
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
Because people want to buy products made from people who know what the hell they are doing, not selling products and playing the "learn as you go".
I know nothing about medicine. How about I start a medicine company and sell you some medicine I made so I can go get some training on how to make medicine.
Yea, makes you really want to buy my crap.
Medicine. Funny you should mention that. You realize that when you see the doctor some portion of that payment go towards paying for Continuing Medical Education. Your doctor may know medicine fairly well but doesn't know everything. Same goes for the Star Vault Devs and the Unreal Engine (and Atlas)
I'm sorry if you were irritated by that but since you are the only one that seems to have been I will close this thread and thus the redundant discussion.
Perhaps the US is just the first stop in SVs world tour. We all know they need all the help they can get.
Stop 1 US : Get schooled on Unreal
Stop 2 CN : Get schooled on Atlas
Stop 3 Home : Hope it works
it's far more likely 1. Go to US as there is no language barrier and the dev team are familiar enough with atlas to get the job done. Ops a drama queen seeking attention by whoring the forums for his inane rants.
My Colour Is Vomit green, I puke on the tards with stupid colour sigs. My symbol is ,,!, O ,!,, My enemies are any prat with a colour sig, a meaningless personality test, or a pointless list of games and classes.
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
Because people want to buy products made from people who know what the hell they are doing, not selling products and playing the "learn as you go".
I know nothing about medicine. How about I start a medicine company and sell you some medicine I made so I can go get some training on how to make medicine.
Yea, makes you really want to buy my crap.
Medicine. Funny you should mention that. You realize that when you see the doctor some portion of that payment go towards paying for Continuing Medical Education. Your doctor may know medicine fairly well but doesn't know everything. Same goes for the Star Vault Devs and the Unreal Engine (and Atlas)
Doctor's practice their professions. They still need a medical license for proof that they have SOME idea what they are doing.
SV selling preorders for a game so they can go get training on how to make the game is bullshit.
Comments
Wtf are you going on about. wow some people. what they are doing is to fix the dysync. they did say they are delayign to fix the dysync. hence updating to the latest atlas and ue will FIx the dysync along with some other stuff
no it isnt
yep at least they didnt release
except they money thay all made went into dev of the game : /
this. op got confused. /end thread
Did post this already on one thread, but here it goes, directly from Epic Games China's Atlas overview page: "Full Support – We offer full support and work hard to make sure our licensees succeed, and offer multi-site support in Shanghai and Seattle." Will it offer any improvements is a totally different matter, but debating whether this is/was the right address can stop.
Correction,... They are hoping it will fix the sync issues.
I win!!! LOL@U
There is no way the Atlas technology is perfect and free of problems,i have been around since the beginning of Epic games and i can tel lyou,they have struggled with networking code badly.The first 5-6 patches/updates all continually addressed networking and eventually they made it worse.I knwo they made it worse because from version 420 onwards i went from very stable connections to all sorts of problems with instability.
There has also been one lawsuit against Epic claiming the support was not as promised.I can se the problem right away as their support is done online through tickets lmao,we all knwo how well that system works...not !.
So i believe that rather than go through that horrible process,they may very well be sending some pople straight to Epic to get better communication for support.
Personally i could not possibly see how anyone could do a written back and forth support,it would be 50 pages long and still could be misinterpreted.
As to why the USA,they have a support team based in Seattle called Titan Studios,who houses some very talented people.Weather or not SV is actually sending people and weather or not Titan wil lactually do hands on support is anyone's guess,however it makes sense to me,i would blow a gasket if i had to deal with support for something this important through a support ticket system.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Html4 and html5 are actually backwards compatible, it's just that html5 brings out new features that are actually just fluff (video tags so you dont have to use flash?) and have no affect on things like style sheets etc
also, Atlas = networking, Atlas is the thing that allows them to create such a huge world. SV is also first mmorpg company to use Atlas thats why theres tons of problems because SV basically desided to license an system that has only been proven to work on patent application.
and asking why they are going to USA for training when Atlas is being made in China is like asking why would you go to local volkswagen dealer to get your car fixed when Volkswagens are made in Germany?
>>and asking why they are going to USA for training when Atlas is being made in China is like asking why would you go to local volkswagen dealer to get your car fixed when Volkswagens are made in Germany?
Heres the reason why they are going to the U.S.
Hands-on Training
We provide on-site training for first time licensees – at your location for content creation training, and our location for engineering. We come to you to show your content team how to best work with our tools and content pipeline, and we invite your engineering staff to visit our Cary, NC offices to meet with our entire engineering staff to answer questions and provide overviews of current subsystems and the future technology roadmap. Depending on availability, our doors are open for visits throughout the development life of your project.
http://www.unrealtechnology.com/licensing.php?ref=support
Right from Epic's website. So basically you people are paying for them to get training. Fun fun
He who keeps his cool best wins.
And the problem with that would be..... ?
They have designed the game in the Unreal Engine with Atlas but have not been able to fine tune the synchronization. Paying Epic to teach them how to fine tune is totally reasonable. It's not as if they are starting from scratch.
im still trying to find out where the lie is lol???
i went though 4 pages of trolling to find out nothing lol.
Atlas is the network solution or at least a large part of it.
Powerful MMO Server Architecture – Atlas provides robust and scalable server architecture. http://www.epicgameschina.com/tech/tech-atlas_overview.html
Cluster Server
master server per cluster
manages information about player's global location
manages interest lists, and node ownership.
http://www.epicgameschina.com/tech/tech-atlas_features.html
Why go to the U.S. instead of China?
Epic Games China provides Asian technology support and professional training services in Mandarin and English, and North American support through wholly owned Titan Studios in Seattle, Washington. http://www.epicgames.com/press_releases/atlas.html
Starvault's developers speak Swedish with some fluency in English. Epic games (Cary, NC) or Titan studios employees speak English as their native language. Epic games China employees speak Mandarin with some fluency in English. Which combination would have the least communication problems?
I know liquidwolf already pointed it out, but it bears repeating...
#40 (permalink)
Maerlyn
Community Manager
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Germany
Age: 29
Rep Power: 13
The programmers go to where they are most efficient. In this case thats the US.
As Henrik already explained, we are merging our current build with both a new Atlas build AND a new UE build.
I hope that answers the question though I'm slightly irritated as to why this question arose in the first place. If people need to go to China, they are sent to China - if they need to go to the US, the are sent there. Pretty simple really :P
@ange10 ; that would be because there is no lie
Yes, HTML5 is backwards compatible to 4 -- but converting a broken HTML4 page into HTML5 won't fix any of the underlying problems. That's the point I was making.
That said, Atlas has been used in other MMOs -- Global Agenda (which is already released), and other upcoming MMOs like Blade and Soul, APB, etc.
Because people want to buy products made from people who know what the hell they are doing, not selling products and playing the "learn as you go".
I know nothing about medicine. How about I start a medicine company and sell you some medicine I made so I can go get some training on how to make medicine.
Yea, makes you really want to buy my crap.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
Probably going to the US to try and learn how to use the darn engine more effectively.
Not a problem but they should have done that a long time ago.
Benthon, you sound a lot like the poster SHOE that is constantly trying to cause problems in the MO forums. You related?
Umm last time i checked people buy products from SALESMEN people that will,lie to your face to make a sale.Peopel aslo buy those million dollar homes for middle men that have nothing to do with products,so peopel are basically tossing money out the window,paying 1000 bucks for a TV that would sell from the manufacturer for about 150 bucks.So no we don't buy fom peopel that know anything other than how to rip us off.When's the last time anyone walked int oa store and the salesmen said ,don't buy anything here it is all crap lol.
I also need to remind people here that EPIC failed badly out of the gate on their networking structure for Unreal/UT the yhad to make steady updates for several months to get pings from horrible standards to playable.
One further point,NOBODY is expected to know the game engine,this is why SUPPORT is part of the licensing agreeement.This is a famous lawsuit that Silicon Knights took agaisnt Epic and the UE3 engine.
http://kotaku.com/280491/silicon-knights-epic-sabotaged-us
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Those buyers you describe Wiz are known as morons, children, fools, whatever, but not intelligent consumers. BTW a 75K lawsuit?? ROFLMAO boy that will sure hurt Epic LOL. Sounds like more SV script kiddies and modders. BTW what was the result of the suit? Do you have any citations or just some rumor mill crap from some other gamer site?
Glad to see this game is still wheezing along while I have been away. Fired it up a short while ago and still the same old de-sync crap, hyper warp critters, and empty void that they are calling a game world. LOL even DnL had more to offer.
Oh BTW, nice to see so many of the die hard DFO defenders showing up on here with the same old songs they used for DFO's aborted launch. I guess some people make a career of hyping failed games on this site because if the one that they previously hyped was so good then why are they here and not playing it???
>>One further point,NOBODY is expected to know the game engine,this is why SUPPORT is part of the licensing agreeement.This is a famous lawsuit that Silicon Knights took agaisnt Epic and the UE3 engine.
Nobody is expected to know the Engine right off the bat.
However, Mortal Online is over 3 years into development, sold preorders, is "nearing" release, and you're telling me they need hands on training directly from Epic on how to work the engine they've been developing with all along?
What the hell.
>>Benthon, you sound a lot like the poster SHOE that is constantly trying to cause problems in the MO forums. You related?
You think he's the only person to see through all SV's BS?
He who keeps his cool best wins.
Medicine. Funny you should mention that. You realize that when you see the doctor some portion of that payment go towards paying for Continuing Medical Education. Your doctor may know medicine fairly well but doesn't know everything. Same goes for the Star Vault Devs and the Unreal Engine (and Atlas)
Well it's bound to seem that way when he is basically just reposting a thread that SHOE was posting on the Mortal Online official forums.
Curiously enough,....
Here's Maerlyn closing that thread
Maerlyn 30th March 2010, 14:07 http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/39634-why-they-flying-us-2.html
I'm sorry if you were irritated by that but since you are the only one that seems to have been I will close this thread and thus the redundant discussion.
and here is the beginning of this thread
Benthon 3/30/10 2:25:34 PM http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3472231#3472231
Evidently they are just implementing the latest build of Atlas. Suprise?
18 minutes from the close of that thread to the start of this one. Certainly looks like Benthon wanted to continue that particular line of argument.
it's far more likely 1. Go to US as there is no language barrier and the dev team are familiar enough with atlas to get the job done. Ops a drama queen seeking attention by whoring the forums for his inane rants.
My Colour Is Vomit green, I puke on the tards with stupid colour sigs. My symbol is ,,!, O ,!,, My enemies are any prat with a colour sig, a meaningless personality test, or a pointless list of games and classes.
Regards Hexcaliber
Doctor's practice their professions. They still need a medical license for proof that they have SOME idea what they are doing.
SV selling preorders for a game so they can go get training on how to make the game is bullshit.
He who keeps his cool best wins.