There doesn't seem to be any real plan or end game to this, such as raiding or ranked pvp or battlegrounds. There isnt even a dungeon.
It's statements such as this that cause the "go back to WoW" response we see so much. Before the theme park games became prevelant this is how it was, you played in a virtual world and used your imagination to live out your fantasy online. Today with the WoW generation they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo.
Also this is a beta test so you need to get a grip.
This.
Not saying its perfect or even really that good, but you have to realise that there is not meant to be any of that stuff, it is a virtual world, not a theme park.
Unfortunately OP is correct and for how much the fan boys continue to defend the game it doesn't change the fact that this game is extremely unfinished.
IF (big if) they manage to survive long enough to actually finish it then it might be a decent niche game, much like DF but with better graphics and absolutely no pve. the sad part is that most players will not want to live in a virtual world were there is nothing to do after you'v gathered some mats, made some armor, bough some skil books. stealing and killing other players for absolutely no reward besides their gear will not hold many player's interest for long.
i am almost hoping SV sells the game to a bigger company and they fix it and stream line it a bit more. change the stealing system, make towns save zone, put a compas, but more then anything implement some sort of pve or pvp objectives. i'd be fine even with only pvp objectives but still you need to have something to do.
Unfortunately OP is correct and for how much the fan boys continue to defend the game it doesn't change the fact that this game is extremely unfinished.
IF (big if) they manage to survive long enough to actually finish it then it might be a decent niche game, much like DF but with better graphics and absolutely no pve. the sad part is that most players will not want to live in a virtual world were there is nothing to do after you'v gathered some mats, made some armor, bough some skil books. stealing and killing other players for absolutely no reward besides their gear will not hold many player's interest for long.
i am almost hoping SV sells the game to a bigger company and they fix it and stream line it a bit more. change the stealing system, make towns save zone, put a compas, but more then anything implement some sort of pve or pvp objectives. i'd be fine even with only pvp objectives but still you need to have something to do.
I have noticed a large drop in forum posting... not just on here but also on the official forums. In game population has dropped a ton as well. At least that is my observation from entering the game twice in the last week. Maybe half (or lower) of the players that were there the last time I loaded it up.
If they don't launch soon, attrition will make the release a moot point.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
No its the beta, but supposedly the games gonna be released soon.
you are aware that teh beta experience is not necessarily indictive of the game that actually launches?
you are also aware the game is designed to have no maps, compasses can be made and you make your own map?
also the map we are playing on now is NOT the entire gameworld? they have unlocked a section of the world for us to test in?
I got into the Beta in Block B and dip into the game every so often, I like what I see, as do lots of other players, oh yes it has its bad points which people tell the devs about, after all thats what BETA is for.
so how about amending you title to state 'My beta Opinion' rather than Review since you are reviewing an unlaunched game.
1) I have been in over 30 closed betas and a handful of alphas. Not one of the alphas were in as bad shape as this game is in beta. I know there is not all of the content, but this game lacks anything substantial enough to indicate that there is even a game to be played.
2) Maps and compass are in games so you don't walk around wondering where the hell you are. It's a simple courtesy by the game maker so you can get on PLAYING THE GAME. I can see some fun in making explorable maps that you have to reveal.
3) The map included is fine. As a matter of fact, it doesn't need to be any bigger. The problem is that all over the giant landscape there is nothing worth finding.
As far as amending the title of my post, it seems we are all quite aware this game is in beta.
Furthermore, in all the games that i have beta tested almost ALL of them were exactly what we played in beta. I have found out time and time again that if a game is just plain bad in beta, it's bad when it releases. Hoping against hope that the devs are going to pull it through to something enjoyable is about as fruitless as the landscape in Mortal Online. This game isn't just 'a little bad'. This game isn't one that leaves me with a sense that a 'little something' is missing. The whole damn game is missing.
They're not done with the game yet, dummy. I'd wait a good 6 months before actually reviewing it.
If they can sell the game, we can review it.
Oh sure. You can review the game at any time. It's not like they have some weird anti-review field on the game client (also know as an NDA) or anything. I'm just saying it won't be finished until then, and then a review wouldn't be terribly valid. I don't plan on playing it beore then anyway, so I wouldn't look at it anyway.
There doesn't seem to be any real plan or end game to this, such as raiding or ranked pvp or battlegrounds. There isnt even a dungeon.
It's statements such as this that cause the "go back to WoW" response we see so much. Before the theme park games became prevelant this is how it was, you played in a virtual world and used your imagination to live out your fantasy online. Today with the WoW generation they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo.
Also this is a beta test so you need to get a grip.
Yeah... many MMOs have become far too compartmentalized... "PvP over here", "PvE over here..."
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
There doesn't seem to be any real plan or end game to this, such as raiding or ranked pvp or battlegrounds. There isnt even a dungeon.
It's statements such as this that cause the "go back to WoW" response we see so much. Before the theme park games became prevelant this is how it was, you played in a virtual world and used your imagination to live out your fantasy online. Today with the WoW generation they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo.
Also this is a beta test so you need to get a grip.
I have stated my feelings about maps and a compass, the essential tools to navigate yourself through a virtual world, in a previous post. It is not 'hardcore' to me to have to take the time to craft shit that should already be there. Mortal Online HAS a map and compass...but you have to craft it right? So it's no more hardcore in that respect than WoW or any other game besides the fact that you have to craft it first. This is stupid to me. It's psuedo-hardcore.
As far as theme parks go, thats not what im asking for at all. As a matter of fact it is the reason i took the time to check this game out in the first place. What i meant by the quoted quote above is that this game HAS NO PLAN. There is no direction or even an indication of what the hell we are going to do if the desynch ever did get fixed.
People are saying that the crafting system is 'elaborate'. OK. A good crafting system is nice in a game, but usually it is only a secondary part of an ACTUAL GAME. The crafting system is all this game has. So we will grind materials and craft shit..then go kill people trying to get materials? BAH...
And also, as you are speaking to me condescendingly as if I'm a young kid, lets examine the last things you said..
"Today with the WoW generation"....guess this is refering to me although i guarantee I am older and way more experienced gamer than you.. "they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box" ....wtf? Mortal Online has both of these....."experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV" ya we covered this... MO has it too "to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo"
By this last part, I'll ease up a bit and suggest that you mean the game has to be easy. I guess i just don't understand what you feel is so hardcore about this game. Having to overcome badly implemented elements and bad programming is not hardcore my friend. It's a chore. A chore I felt I should let people know about...hence my original post.
Dident know they released it, thought it was still in Beta
To bad the game is so bad pollished in retail. i could expect that in a beta , but not in a finnished version.
Don't worry it will be closed beta one night and release the next with no patch difference. They are just trying to find a point at which they feel they can start charging people for the game they have splooged out everywhere. The game is several development cycles away from being able to get released, and they continue to push it back. It probly shouldn't release till 2011 but SV doesn't have the money backing to deal with that kind of burden for that long.
People need to stop trying to pull the "It's Beta" when some of the biggest game breaking issues are not even being addressed by the development teams as issues.
First the excuse for a game being without content was because it was a " sandbox " and now it has moved to being a " virtual world ".
Neither fly people.
As for the " WoW " comment earlier.. UO ( you know the game that people measure other " sandbox " games against ) had many of those same elements you are bashing.
First the excuse for a game being without content was because it was a " sandbox " and now it has moved to being a " virtual world ".
Neither fly people.
As for the " WoW " comment earlier.. UO ( you know the game that people measure other " sandbox " games against ) had many of those same elements you are bashing.
Sandbox and virtual world are closely related so there hasn't real been a change in the argument. Sandbox is more "world" theme park is more "game" .
This game doesn't look bad graphically but o wow are there some things wrong with it. ..
Its world is big enough, i can give it that...but if you dare venture away from town you wont have a damn clue where you are..there is no map function at all...not even a compass. They could have made this world one town and a small patch of woods to explore and it would be the same thing. Theres nothing anywhere.
The AI is terrible and pigs fall out of trees, warp all over when you try to kill things, and the combat in this game reminds me of early console games like Kings Field. The sad part is that King's Fields combat was alot more solid and the mobs didnt warp all over the place. This seems to be a theme thoughout this game too..like they were maybe trying to capture a nostalgia of early rpg games. The way you raise your skills in this game is by buying books that teach you said skill. This is also a pretty old way to go about skilling up.
SO.....
Thats all there really is to this game. You appear in a city...find a way to grind money...buy books with skills....and then.....man i dunno what your supposed to do then. Its supposedly a pvp type from what i gather...but the only pvp is ..you'll be sittin there mining to try to make money and someone ganks you and takes everything that you had. There doesn't seem to be any real plan or end game to this, such as raiding or ranked pvp or battlegrounds. There isnt even a dungeon.
I have read alot on these and other forums about this game. It seems that people are trying to defend this game by saying it has a 'steep learning curve'......buying books with the name of the skill as its title doesn't make you a genious, hitting a tree to get wood doesnt either...In my opinion the only learning curve in this game is trying to overcome all the poorly implemented elements that ultimately lead to frustration .....
Don't bother playing this game imo
What about the combat system? is it oblivion style? The swords animations/moves are smooth like oblivion? Is it equal in quality better or worst and why?
Combat is a-z for a game like Mo and tell us pls how u find it
They're not done with the game yet, dummy. I'd wait a good 6 months before actually reviewing it.
If they can sell the game, we can review it.
You can also get your money back for the game if you have made the mistake of buying this. I did, and also got a refund through my credit card company. I just saved my e mails to Starvault requesting a refund for a product not delivered(that they denied), then called my card company and requested a chargeback under the consumer protections act, and recieved my money back. That easy.
wow sure is a crapload of crying from whiners in here.
at the end of the day, not every game appeals to every player, some of us old UO players have been after a sandbox game like this , create am avatar then run free, not 'radar' or 'UI map to tell us where to go, learning to explore the game world our selves.
Other want the game to hold there hand every step of the way, if thats the game you want then this game isnt for you. Most of the people (like me) who actually paid up for the game in the hope and belief the game will be what we are looking for.
the money I paid for this game is a fraction of what I spend on a night out on the beer, instead I get 30 days of fun to play and explore the game, if its what I want they got my sub, if its not then least I got 30 days of play outta the game before the discs become target practice for my rifle.
I don't think it's a matter of Sandbox vs. Theme-park. People prefer certain games, we know that. There's no use arguing opinion. I think there is a difference between a good game and a bad game though. I played UO. I loved it. But, whether you like it or not.. the market and players within it have changed in the last 13 years since it's launch. This cannot be debated.
I enjoy the open-endedness of a virtual world. I like players having to govern themselves. I enjoy being able to pick up and do whatever I want to do, whenever I want to do it. I like having my own personal space in games, such as houses and boats. I love raising skill by practicing it, rather than kill enough goblins to become stronger. I enjoy not having a number above my head associated with how strong I am. I love the player economy in a game with full loot and item decay. I could go on and on, I'm sure we all could.
However, I am not ignorant. I'm not going to sit here and say that everything about UO was the best ever created. The lack of information for new players made people leave instantly. These people never got the chance to play a truly good video game because of poor design choices. Lack of intuitive UI that made the game easier for players who didn't cheat or use macro's to do everything. The complete absence of a complex guild system that made it easier to make friends and form alliances against people who wanted to do you harm. And, a quest system that was non-existent. Am I suggesting 1,000 quests be added to a game where you are supposed to use your imagination? No. I'm suggesting starter quests. Quests that teach you the basics of the game. Like crafting. Sending you to areas to learn to fight relatively worry free of being slaughtered by a Vet. Something to get the new player started before pushing them out into a dangerous world. While everyone may not agree, it's my personal belief that spamming 'guards' is a useless mechanic. Guards should either kill theives instantly after they fail, or theivery should not be permitted in town all together. I'd be more inclined to go with the first choice. People need to understand that it is a game. Even some of the most hardcore don't have the time to sit there every second of the day. Nature calls occasionally. And not everyone will own a house.
Ultimately, I think that sandboxes need to evolve with the rest of the industry. Just because UO did it, doesn't mean UO was right in everything they did. Companies in any industry make changes over time to enhance their product to get more people interested in buying it. Why should the MMO sandbox genre be immune to this? It's suicide. And lets be honest here. As much as some of the fanboys will deny wanting casual whiners, we need them if we decide to go on a killing spree. The more people, the better. Not only are there more people to kill, a better economy, but the game has more subscriptions. Which means that the game will probably have a better chance at improving and lasting more than a year or two. Again, I loved UO. And I want this game to be great. I just don't think it will be everything it could be unless certain things are changed. Why does it have to be a 'niche' audience who plays this game? There are several changes that could be made that makes it more popular without altering core features that would make old schoolers hate it.
There doesn't seem to be any real plan or end game to this, such as raiding or ranked pvp or battlegrounds. There isnt even a dungeon.
It's statements such as this that cause the "go back to WoW" response we see so much. Before the theme park games became prevelant this is how it was, you played in a virtual world and used your imagination to live out your fantasy online. Today with the WoW generation they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo.
Also this is a beta test so you need to get a grip.
I have stated my feelings about maps and a compass, the essential tools to navigate yourself through a virtual world, in a previous post. It is not 'hardcore' to me to have to take the time to craft shit that should already be there. Mortal Online HAS a map and compass...but you have to craft it right? So it's no more hardcore in that respect than WoW or any other game besides the fact that you have to craft it first. This is stupid to me. It's psuedo-hardcore.
As far as theme parks go, thats not what im asking for at all. As a matter of fact it is the reason i took the time to check this game out in the first place. What i meant by the quoted quote above is that this game HAS NO PLAN. There is no direction or even an indication of what the hell we are going to do if the desynch ever did get fixed.
People are saying that the crafting system is 'elaborate'. OK. A good crafting system is nice in a game, but usually it is only a secondary part of an ACTUAL GAME. The crafting system is all this game has. So we will grind materials and craft shit..then go kill people trying to get materials? BAH...
And also, as you are speaking to me condescendingly as if I'm a young kid, lets examine the last things you said..
"Today with the WoW generation"....guess this is refering to me although i guarantee I am older and way more experienced gamer than you.. "they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box" ....wtf? Mortal Online has both of these....."experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV" ya we covered this... MO has it too "to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo"
By this last part, I'll ease up a bit and suggest that you mean the game has to be easy. I guess i just don't understand what you feel is so hardcore about this game. Having to overcome badly implemented elements and bad programming is not hardcore my friend. It's a chore. A chore I felt I should let people know about...hence my original post.
I agree on mostly what you said. I'm going to elaborate one thing for you though.
The end game for a 'sandbox' is the game itself. You make the endgame. Ultimately it becomes how powerful can you become and how rich can you become. You want to craft today? Go craft. You want to fight mosters? Do it. You want to go sailing? Decorate your home? Tame some animals? Roleplay with some friends? Have a horse race? Explore? See my point?
A sandbox is open-ended. It's meant to give the player the power to do what they want rather than push them in a straight line. You make the quests. That's what it is supposed to be. That's how it's designed for you.
Also, in a sandbox game, player economy is a huge factor. It's not like theme-parks, crafting is usually an afterthought in those games. This game has a true player economy. Players craft everything in the world(well, almost). It makes the game what it is. PvE should be the main focus of the developers. PvP should be last. I'm not saying combat shouldn't be looked at. It should be very polished. But encouraging conflict should not be the primary focus in a virtual world with full loot and item decay. Those conflicts will happen on their own. They don't need any help.
Again, I agree with everything else, I just figured I'd try and shed some light on some things you may not be aware of when it comes to sandboxes.
This game doesn't look bad graphically but o wow are there some things wrong with it. ..
Its world is big enough, i can give it that...but if you dare venture away from town you wont have a damn clue where you are..there is no map function at all...not even a compass. They could have made this world one town and a small patch of woods to explore and it would be the same thing. Theres nothing anywhere.
The AI is terrible and pigs fall out of trees, warp all over when you try to kill things, and the combat in this game reminds me of early console games like Kings Field. The sad part is that King's Fields combat was alot more solid and the mobs didnt warp all over the place. This seems to be a theme thoughout this game too..like they were maybe trying to capture a nostalgia of early rpg games. The way you raise your skills in this game is by buying books that teach you said skill. This is also a pretty old way to go about skilling up.
SO.....
Thats all there really is to this game. You appear in a city...find a way to grind money...buy books with skills....and then.....man i dunno what your supposed to do then. Its supposedly a pvp type from what i gather...but the only pvp is ..you'll be sittin there mining to try to make money and someone ganks you and takes everything that you had. There doesn't seem to be any real plan or end game to this, such as raiding or ranked pvp or battlegrounds. There isnt even a dungeon.
I have read alot on these and other forums about this game. It seems that people are trying to defend this game by saying it has a 'steep learning curve'......buying books with the name of the skill as its title doesn't make you a genious, hitting a tree to get wood doesnt either...In my opinion the only learning curve in this game is trying to overcome all the poorly implemented elements that ultimately lead to frustration .....
Don't bother playing this game imo
Oh boy would my review be SO much worse than yours at this point . ... LOL
But I feel that I have to get through the 'steep learning curve' before I give a review. Afterall, I do not work for EUROGAMER.NET
: P
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Comments
This.
Not saying its perfect or even really that good, but you have to realise that there is not meant to be any of that stuff, it is a virtual world, not a theme park.
Unfortunately OP is correct and for how much the fan boys continue to defend the game it doesn't change the fact that this game is extremely unfinished.
IF (big if) they manage to survive long enough to actually finish it then it might be a decent niche game, much like DF but with better graphics and absolutely no pve. the sad part is that most players will not want to live in a virtual world were there is nothing to do after you'v gathered some mats, made some armor, bough some skil books. stealing and killing other players for absolutely no reward besides their gear will not hold many player's interest for long.
i am almost hoping SV sells the game to a bigger company and they fix it and stream line it a bit more. change the stealing system, make towns save zone, put a compas, but more then anything implement some sort of pve or pvp objectives. i'd be fine even with only pvp objectives but still you need to have something to do.
I have noticed a large drop in forum posting... not just on here but also on the official forums. In game population has dropped a ton as well. At least that is my observation from entering the game twice in the last week. Maybe half (or lower) of the players that were there the last time I loaded it up.
If they don't launch soon, attrition will make the release a moot point.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
1) I have been in over 30 closed betas and a handful of alphas. Not one of the alphas were in as bad shape as this game is in beta. I know there is not all of the content, but this game lacks anything substantial enough to indicate that there is even a game to be played.
2) Maps and compass are in games so you don't walk around wondering where the hell you are. It's a simple courtesy by the game maker so you can get on PLAYING THE GAME. I can see some fun in making explorable maps that you have to reveal.
3) The map included is fine. As a matter of fact, it doesn't need to be any bigger. The problem is that all over the giant landscape there is nothing worth finding.
As far as amending the title of my post, it seems we are all quite aware this game is in beta.
Furthermore, in all the games that i have beta tested almost ALL of them were exactly what we played in beta. I have found out time and time again that if a game is just plain bad in beta, it's bad when it releases. Hoping against hope that the devs are going to pull it through to something enjoyable is about as fruitless as the landscape in Mortal Online. This game isn't just 'a little bad'. This game isn't one that leaves me with a sense that a 'little something' is missing. The whole damn game is missing.
They're not done with the game yet, dummy. :P I'd wait a good 6 months before actually reviewing it.
If they can sell the game, we can review it.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
Oh sure. You can review the game at any time. It's not like they have some weird anti-review field on the game client (also know as an NDA) or anything. I'm just saying it won't be finished until then, and then a review wouldn't be terribly valid. I don't plan on playing it beore then anyway, so I wouldn't look at it anyway.
Yeah... many MMOs have become far too compartmentalized... "PvP over here", "PvE over here..."
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I have stated my feelings about maps and a compass, the essential tools to navigate yourself through a virtual world, in a previous post. It is not 'hardcore' to me to have to take the time to craft shit that should already be there. Mortal Online HAS a map and compass...but you have to craft it right? So it's no more hardcore in that respect than WoW or any other game besides the fact that you have to craft it first. This is stupid to me. It's psuedo-hardcore.
As far as theme parks go, thats not what im asking for at all. As a matter of fact it is the reason i took the time to check this game out in the first place. What i meant by the quoted quote above is that this game HAS NO PLAN. There is no direction or even an indication of what the hell we are going to do if the desynch ever did get fixed.
People are saying that the crafting system is 'elaborate'. OK. A good crafting system is nice in a game, but usually it is only a secondary part of an ACTUAL GAME. The crafting system is all this game has. So we will grind materials and craft shit..then go kill people trying to get materials? BAH...
And also, as you are speaking to me condescendingly as if I'm a young kid, lets examine the last things you said..
"Today with the WoW generation"....guess this is refering to me although i guarantee I am older and way more experienced gamer than you.. "they're lost unless they have the single player with a chat box" ....wtf? Mortal Online has both of these....."experience a GPS and a built in SAT NAV" ya we covered this... MO has it too "to hold you by the hand as you power grind to max level solo"
By this last part, I'll ease up a bit and suggest that you mean the game has to be easy. I guess i just don't understand what you feel is so hardcore about this game. Having to overcome badly implemented elements and bad programming is not hardcore my friend. It's a chore. A chore I felt I should let people know about...hence my original post.
Don't worry it will be closed beta one night and release the next with no patch difference. They are just trying to find a point at which they feel they can start charging people for the game they have splooged out everywhere. The game is several development cycles away from being able to get released, and they continue to push it back. It probly shouldn't release till 2011 but SV doesn't have the money backing to deal with that kind of burden for that long.
People need to stop trying to pull the "It's Beta" when some of the biggest game breaking issues are not even being addressed by the development teams as issues.
First the excuse for a game being without content was because it was a " sandbox " and now it has moved to being a " virtual world ".
Neither fly people.
As for the " WoW " comment earlier.. UO ( you know the game that people measure other " sandbox " games against ) had many of those same elements you are bashing.
Sandbox and virtual world are closely related so there hasn't real been a change in the argument. Sandbox is more "world" theme park is more "game" .
http://www.raphkoster.com/gaming/gamevworld.shtml
As to the elements that are being "bashed" but are in UO, which ones specifically are you talking about?
What about the combat system? is it oblivion style? The swords animations/moves are smooth like oblivion? Is it equal in quality better or worst and why?
Combat is a-z for a game like Mo and tell us pls how u find it
You can also get your money back for the game if you have made the mistake of buying this. I did, and also got a refund through my credit card company. I just saved my e mails to Starvault requesting a refund for a product not delivered(that they denied), then called my card company and requested a chargeback under the consumer protections act, and recieved my money back. That easy.
http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/consumer/credit/cre16.shtm
http://www.busrep.co.za/index.php?from=rss_Business%20Report&fArticleId=5438805
(and the 10 day thing is bull, I got my money back after 60 days)
I don't think it's a matter of Sandbox vs. Theme-park. People prefer certain games, we know that. There's no use arguing opinion. I think there is a difference between a good game and a bad game though. I played UO. I loved it. But, whether you like it or not.. the market and players within it have changed in the last 13 years since it's launch. This cannot be debated.
I enjoy the open-endedness of a virtual world. I like players having to govern themselves. I enjoy being able to pick up and do whatever I want to do, whenever I want to do it. I like having my own personal space in games, such as houses and boats. I love raising skill by practicing it, rather than kill enough goblins to become stronger. I enjoy not having a number above my head associated with how strong I am. I love the player economy in a game with full loot and item decay. I could go on and on, I'm sure we all could.
However, I am not ignorant. I'm not going to sit here and say that everything about UO was the best ever created. The lack of information for new players made people leave instantly. These people never got the chance to play a truly good video game because of poor design choices. Lack of intuitive UI that made the game easier for players who didn't cheat or use macro's to do everything. The complete absence of a complex guild system that made it easier to make friends and form alliances against people who wanted to do you harm. And, a quest system that was non-existent. Am I suggesting 1,000 quests be added to a game where you are supposed to use your imagination? No. I'm suggesting starter quests. Quests that teach you the basics of the game. Like crafting. Sending you to areas to learn to fight relatively worry free of being slaughtered by a Vet. Something to get the new player started before pushing them out into a dangerous world. While everyone may not agree, it's my personal belief that spamming 'guards' is a useless mechanic. Guards should either kill theives instantly after they fail, or theivery should not be permitted in town all together. I'd be more inclined to go with the first choice. People need to understand that it is a game. Even some of the most hardcore don't have the time to sit there every second of the day. Nature calls occasionally. And not everyone will own a house.
Ultimately, I think that sandboxes need to evolve with the rest of the industry. Just because UO did it, doesn't mean UO was right in everything they did. Companies in any industry make changes over time to enhance their product to get more people interested in buying it. Why should the MMO sandbox genre be immune to this? It's suicide. And lets be honest here. As much as some of the fanboys will deny wanting casual whiners, we need them if we decide to go on a killing spree. The more people, the better. Not only are there more people to kill, a better economy, but the game has more subscriptions. Which means that the game will probably have a better chance at improving and lasting more than a year or two. Again, I loved UO. And I want this game to be great. I just don't think it will be everything it could be unless certain things are changed. Why does it have to be a 'niche' audience who plays this game? There are several changes that could be made that makes it more popular without altering core features that would make old schoolers hate it.
Just my opinion.
I agree on mostly what you said. I'm going to elaborate one thing for you though.
The end game for a 'sandbox' is the game itself. You make the endgame. Ultimately it becomes how powerful can you become and how rich can you become. You want to craft today? Go craft. You want to fight mosters? Do it. You want to go sailing? Decorate your home? Tame some animals? Roleplay with some friends? Have a horse race? Explore? See my point?
A sandbox is open-ended. It's meant to give the player the power to do what they want rather than push them in a straight line. You make the quests. That's what it is supposed to be. That's how it's designed for you.
Also, in a sandbox game, player economy is a huge factor. It's not like theme-parks, crafting is usually an afterthought in those games. This game has a true player economy. Players craft everything in the world(well, almost). It makes the game what it is. PvE should be the main focus of the developers. PvP should be last. I'm not saying combat shouldn't be looked at. It should be very polished. But encouraging conflict should not be the primary focus in a virtual world with full loot and item decay. Those conflicts will happen on their own. They don't need any help.
Again, I agree with everything else, I just figured I'd try and shed some light on some things you may not be aware of when it comes to sandboxes.
Oh boy would my review be SO much worse than yours at this point . ... LOL
But I feel that I have to get through the 'steep learning curve' before I give a review. Afterall, I do not work for EUROGAMER.NET
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