That game wont succeed in the west for sure. These asian models are way too much on usual asian stereotype.
huge 5 foot long weapons, half naked equipment for woman, annoying noise everytime they strike(specially on female part) So on model part, its a loss for the western. I really dont like these animation and the graphix is too bright, too much color.
On the gameplay, usual asian grind is what i expect so its a no. Combat itself really sux and these knock down are super annoying while pvp. The dodge system is not genious at all.
I have yet to meet a person that plays or does not play a game because of immersion. Entertainment yes, Immersion not so much.
Many people play to be immersed in the game world - it's why they make a themed game world in the first place. However, immersion is bound to be broken at some point. As soon as you look at your abilities to see which attack would do more damage in what situation, as soon as you bring up your in game chat box, an ui menu, etc - so that allow isn't necessarily a strong reason to stop playing any particular game.
Yea reading a book or paper & pen games give good immersion and maybe throw in a well made SP game. But mmo's tend to break very early in the game. Back ground stories and quest lines just don't cut it.
Only one's that may get immersion out of a mmo is the RP crowd.
Not true. You never played darkfall. A game where you can lose your stuff on death add a lot of immersion since you will do anything to stay alive, looking around you while traveling. DF got no instance and its a huge world. This is immersion.
That game wont succeed in the west for sure. These asian models are way too much on usual asian stereotype.
huge 5 foot long weapons, half naked equipment for woman, annoying noise everytime they strike(specially on female part) So on model part, its a loss for the western. I really dont like these animation and the graphix is too bright, too much color.
On the gameplay, usual asian grind is what i expect so its a no. Combat itself really sux and these knock down are super annoying while pvp. The dodge system is not genious at all.
Again not true at all. People jumped all over Aion knowing what it looked liked when it come out and it had everything you mentioned. I have yet to see a review of Aion where they said the Graphics or Art Style was bad. The only way this game will not succeed if its a typical Korean grindfest. If this game is full of content and keeps people having fun while playing it will be a success. Just because you dont like something dont say that everybody in the west wont like it because of that reason.
I have yet to meet a person that plays or does not play a game because of immersion. Entertainment yes, Immersion not so much.
Many people play to be immersed in the game world - it's why they make a themed game world in the first place. However, immersion is bound to be broken at some point. As soon as you look at your abilities to see which attack would do more damage in what situation, as soon as you bring up your in game chat box, an ui menu, etc - so that allow isn't necessarily a strong reason to stop playing any particular game.
Yea reading a book or paper & pen games give good immersion and maybe throw in a well made SP game. But mmo's tend to break very early in the game. Back ground stories and quest lines just don't cut it.
Only one's that may get immersion out of a mmo is the RP crowd.
Not true. You never played darkfall. A game where you can lose your stuff on death add a lot of immersion since you will do anything to stay alive, looking around you while traveling. DF got no instance and its a huge world. This is immersion.
Your confusing immersion with awareness, big difference.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
That game wont succeed in the west for sure. These asian models are way too much on usual asian stereotype.
huge 5 foot long weapons, half naked equipment for woman, annoying noise everytime they strike(specially on female part) So on model part, its a loss for the western. I really dont like these animation and the graphix is too bright, too much color.
On the gameplay, usual asian grind is what i expect so its a no. Combat itself really sux and these knock down are super annoying while pvp. The dodge system is not genious at all.
You know they said WoW would not succeed in the east because it did not have those things you listed, and guess what happen.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
@ realbigdeal sounds like some major QQ to me if you think the mechanics are too harsh having to dodge and deal with CC. rather crunch some numbers and depend on the color of your gear to win eh? Sigh*
Art wont succeed? Lol just like final fantasy doesnt succeed in the west? Its nearly the same art style as well as aion. I can't wait for this game and have literally played just about every mmo to date. This one holds more promise than any of the past, and any listed as coming out in the near future aside from guild wars 2.
if realism is important for your fantasy world then go play AoC. that game is beautifull and perfectly realistic. the best in low fantasy, high skill mmos. i think that as long as the combat is fun and the game is not too grindy Tera will do fine. sure the art style is tipical Asian anime but that is just fine with me.
Again not true at all. People jumped all over Aion knowing what it looked liked when it come out and it had everything you mentioned. I have yet to see a review of Aion where they said the Graphics or Art Style was bad. The only way this game will not succeed if its a typical Korean grindfest. If this game is full of content and keeps people having fun while playing it will be a success. Just because you dont like something dont say that everybody in the west wont like it because of that reason.
I agree with that, it is my main concern for the game so far.
I remember before Aion launched, some people were wondering about that too. The fanboys were always quick to defend the game, they always said "Don't worry, the game will be westernized, it wont be a problem!". We all know how that went... Aion launched as a korean grindfest.
And its easy to understand why. Its a korean game, made for the korean market. We have to realize that "our" market is very small compared to korea. You know, Aion has more subs (and makes more profits) in korea alone than EU + US added together. Thats why it didnt make sense for NCsoft (from a business standpoint) to spend large amount of money to "westernize" Aion. The western market is just not worth it. It was much better for them to just release and hope to make money from those that like that type of game. In other words, NCsoft doesnt give a fuck about us.
Now, thats what happned with Aion, and I really, really hope that Tera can be different.
Another problem with aion (IMO) is that US aion is so closely related to K-Aion. If a patch gets added on the K version, you can be sure it will come to the US version a month or two later. At the same time, there is no US dev team that can make patches and changes for us. The us team is mostly translation, PR and support. This is very frustrating because the playerbase cannot give any feedback on the game. All the changes come from Korea and you are stuck with them.
Now, I have no idea how its gonna be between En masse and Bluehole. I'd have to read more about it. I just hope en masse will have more "power" to affect the game than NCsoft west did.
I think it might have similar issues that Aion did. I don't think an MMORPG designed in Asia has ever done well in the West. Aion was just terrible. I do like that Tera will have PvP, but the graphics already seem dated and the WoW'ish cartoon style is so rediculously over-done. The largest problem for me is the silly art style. You see a melee character with a sword on his back. He equips the sword in his hands, and now the sword is 20 feet long and three times the size of the character. The Asian art style of a 70 pound tiny little warrior girl swinging around a 20-foot long 300 pound sword is completely retarded. I mean sure this is fantasy and you can exagerate some, but there has to be a limit somewhere before things become stupid.
I think what you aren't understanding is that there are people who like the asian art style.
There are plenty of crowded anime festivals here in the states.
If you even look at Aion sales, they did extremely well. Aion failed to capture a huge audience because the game play wasn't as easy as other offerings. I think a great amount of wow players thought they were going to get a wow leveling experience and were sadly dissapointed.
As far as "wow'ish" I don't see anything wow'ish in Tera's art design.
Also, the example you gave of a 70 pound girl swinging a 300 pound sword might seem out of place for you but for other's that can appreciate it, there is a sort of irony at work that some find amusing. I know I do.
There seems to be a sort of philosophy behind Asian art style (in these games) where items become far more than what they represent.
A sword becomes giant because it is the focal point of the warrior wielding it and represents far more than a piece of metal. The size of the characters doesn't matter because they are more than their physical selves and they can transcend the bounds of mundane physicality in order to achieve great heroic deeds.
There is a certain acknowledgement of concepts used in fable where the physical realm is only part of the equation and even animals can be more than what they seem.
I'm sure I'm getting into this debate very late (I've only read the first page), but this was an amazing argument. I absolutely agree that the characters aesthetic representation has little-to-no link to the physical prowess within each character. I personally like to make my characters as short as possible, I absolutely love watching little creatures running around with axes twice the size of their body. It has nothing to do with realism.
As to the argument regarding the actions characters take with their weapons (bizarre as they may be in TERA) I would equate to that of the fight choreography seen in many martial arts movies. Some, of course, keep it quite realistic, just as some MMOs attempt to make their characters' actions appear realistic, but many more MMOs chose to choreograph fight scenes to reflect a desire by their target audiences. This often drives developers to design movements that are over-the-top because it looks exciting and cool, just as blockbuster-Martial Arts movies traditionally feature ridiculous fighting moves that are very visually stimulating, but perhaps not quite practical. Furthermore, various martial arts movies chose to choreograph fights that are unrealistic but representative of an art form. Understanding of human proprioception meets Fantasy and that is the very argument I contend. I postulate that the art style of weapons and combat actions are quite definitive of the developers' desired outcome. More shallow games that put lots of stock and capitol into having a good looking exterior may throw some "super sick" moves in a combat sequence with some "bad ass" looking gear. Others, and this will fall under a subjectively-Asian art form, prefer slender, sleek movements that quite often acrobatic in nature, but decidedly controlled with flowing and sweeping motions. I think the art style reflects the desired setting of the game and TERA has an art style that is quite intriguing to me. Additional side note: not sure if the tone changed much after the first page but there was a surprisingly high level of maturity in these discussions, don't see that often in the other game-forums I read through every now-and-then.
Someday we'll all look back on the age of computers - and lol.
As to the argument regarding the actions characters take with their weapons (bizarre as they may be in TERA) I would equate to that of the fight choreography seen in many martial arts movies. Some, of course, keep it quite realistic, just as some MMOs attempt to make their characters' actions appear realistic, but many more MMOs chose to choreograph fight scenes to reflect a desire by their target audiences. This often drives developers to design movements that are over-the-top because it looks exciting and cool, just as blockbuster-Martial Arts movies traditionally feature ridiculous fighting moves that are very visually stimulating, but perhaps not quite practical. Furthermore, various martial arts movies chose to choreograph fights that are unrealistic but representative of an art form. Understanding of human proprioception meets Fantasy and that is the very argument I contend. I postulate that the art style of weapons and combat actions are quite definitive of the developers' desired outcome. More shallow games that put lots of stock and capitol into having a good looking exterior may throw some "super sick" moves in a combat sequence with some "bad ass" looking gear. Others, and this will fall under a subjectively-Asian art form, prefer slender, sleek movements that quite often acrobatic in nature, but decidedly controlled with flowing and sweeping motions. I think the art style reflects the desired setting of the game and TERA has an art style that is quite intriguing to me. Additional side note: not sure if the tone changed much after the first page but there was a surprisingly high level of maturity in these discussions, don't see that often in the other game-forums I read through every now-and-then.
(posted not for quality of the game but for the art style direction the Dev's took)
Just one look at the video you can tell were the game was made and the direction the devs wanted to take with this game (heavly influenced by matrial arts movies). Not saying the game is good or bad, just that local culture plays a part in art direction in most games.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Comments
That game wont succeed in the west for sure. These asian models are way too much on usual asian stereotype.
huge 5 foot long weapons, half naked equipment for woman, annoying noise everytime they strike(specially on female part) So on model part, its a loss for the western. I really dont like these animation and the graphix is too bright, too much color.
On the gameplay, usual asian grind is what i expect so its a no. Combat itself really sux and these knock down are super annoying while pvp. The dodge system is not genious at all.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
Not true. You never played darkfall. A game where you can lose your stuff on death add a lot of immersion since you will do anything to stay alive, looking around you while traveling. DF got no instance and its a huge world. This is immersion.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
Again not true at all. People jumped all over Aion knowing what it looked liked when it come out and it had everything you mentioned. I have yet to see a review of Aion where they said the Graphics or Art Style was bad. The only way this game will not succeed if its a typical Korean grindfest. If this game is full of content and keeps people having fun while playing it will be a success. Just because you dont like something dont say that everybody in the west wont like it because of that reason.
Your confusing immersion with awareness, big difference.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
You know they said WoW would not succeed in the east because it did not have those things you listed, and guess what happen.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
@ realbigdeal sounds like some major QQ to me if you think the mechanics are too harsh having to dodge and deal with CC. rather crunch some numbers and depend on the color of your gear to win eh? Sigh*
Art wont succeed? Lol just like final fantasy doesnt succeed in the west? Its nearly the same art style as well as aion. I can't wait for this game and have literally played just about every mmo to date. This one holds more promise than any of the past, and any listed as coming out in the near future aside from guild wars 2.
if realism is important for your fantasy world then go play AoC. that game is beautifull and perfectly realistic. the best in low fantasy, high skill mmos. i think that as long as the combat is fun and the game is not too grindy Tera will do fine. sure the art style is tipical Asian anime but that is just fine with me.
I agree with that, it is my main concern for the game so far.
I remember before Aion launched, some people were wondering about that too. The fanboys were always quick to defend the game, they always said "Don't worry, the game will be westernized, it wont be a problem!". We all know how that went... Aion launched as a korean grindfest.
And its easy to understand why. Its a korean game, made for the korean market. We have to realize that "our" market is very small compared to korea. You know, Aion has more subs (and makes more profits) in korea alone than EU + US added together. Thats why it didnt make sense for NCsoft (from a business standpoint) to spend large amount of money to "westernize" Aion. The western market is just not worth it. It was much better for them to just release and hope to make money from those that like that type of game. In other words, NCsoft doesnt give a fuck about us.
Now, thats what happned with Aion, and I really, really hope that Tera can be different.
Another problem with aion (IMO) is that US aion is so closely related to K-Aion. If a patch gets added on the K version, you can be sure it will come to the US version a month or two later. At the same time, there is no US dev team that can make patches and changes for us. The us team is mostly translation, PR and support. This is very frustrating because the playerbase cannot give any feedback on the game. All the changes come from Korea and you are stuck with them.
Now, I have no idea how its gonna be between En masse and Bluehole. I'd have to read more about it. I just hope en masse will have more "power" to affect the game than NCsoft west did.
Thats why I am so happy that En Masse has been given total control to make the western version of Tera the way they want it to be.
Thats nice. Any idea if the US version of the game will have its own patches or will they still come from korea?
Now thats a good question. I have no idea but will try to find out.
I'm sure I'm getting into this debate very late (I've only read the first page), but this was an amazing argument. I absolutely agree that the characters aesthetic representation has little-to-no link to the physical prowess within each character. I personally like to make my characters as short as possible, I absolutely love watching little creatures running around with axes twice the size of their body. It has nothing to do with realism.
As to the argument regarding the actions characters take with their weapons (bizarre as they may be in TERA) I would equate to that of the fight choreography seen in many martial arts movies. Some, of course, keep it quite realistic, just as some MMOs attempt to make their characters' actions appear realistic, but many more MMOs chose to choreograph fight scenes to reflect a desire by their target audiences. This often drives developers to design movements that are over-the-top because it looks exciting and cool, just as blockbuster-Martial Arts movies traditionally feature ridiculous fighting moves that are very visually stimulating, but perhaps not quite practical. Furthermore, various martial arts movies chose to choreograph fights that are unrealistic but representative of an art form. Understanding of human proprioception meets Fantasy and that is the very argument I contend. I postulate that the art style of weapons and combat actions are quite definitive of the developers' desired outcome. More shallow games that put lots of stock and capitol into having a good looking exterior may throw some "super sick" moves in a combat sequence with some "bad ass" looking gear. Others, and this will fall under a subjectively-Asian art form, prefer slender, sleek movements that quite often acrobatic in nature, but decidedly controlled with flowing and sweeping motions. I think the art style reflects the desired setting of the game and TERA has an art style that is quite intriguing to me. Additional side note: not sure if the tone changed much after the first page but there was a surprisingly high level of maturity in these discussions, don't see that often in the other game-forums I read through every now-and-then.
Someday we'll all look back on the age of computers - and lol.
Exactly, I think you nailed it spot on.
Take this video of butterfly sword online for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eK04S2OqTMo
(posted not for quality of the game but for the art style direction the Dev's took)
Just one look at the video you can tell were the game was made and the direction the devs wanted to take with this game (heavly influenced by matrial arts movies). Not saying the game is good or bad, just that local culture plays a part in art direction in most games.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...