This was a well written article. Balanced views and a majority of the points brought up are also concerns of mine, though I find I have a different view on them.
I am shaky at best about the companion pet additions, though for different reasons than the author's. As said in the first article, "5 reasons to be stoked", It's bioware! They may have no experience in the MMO market, but they do have experience in the "not being retarded" market as seen by their constant successes. They understand what they're doing. The conceptuality of MMO gaming is not foreign to anyone, even those who have never played MMOs. Anyone to date can explain, to a degree, the necessities of an MMO game. Bioware will not make these companion pets any more than a single-player flourish. They've made it perfectly clear is several interviews that multiplayer gameplay will be an important focus. So I wouldn't take the same concerns as the author on this issue. I do, however, completely agree that there is some concern to be had with the direction they take these companions.
regarding the "WoW Clone" concern,
During my many years of MMO experience, one of the most annoying arguments that has ALWAYS been around is "this game is just like [older game]". This argument has so rarely been accurate historically, and it's really annoying to hear when individuals are trying to enjoy something new. This dates back as far as Asheron's Call being called Everquest or Everquest being called UO. And it hasn't stopped, and won't stop, as seen with very recent releases like Aion being called WoW.
How many features does it take to make a game distinguishably different from WoW? At what point will people stop chiming in that the game is the same.
WoW is WASD to move, auto-attack, and Activatable Abilities. How many countless MMOs have used this formula? I'm not trashing it, I love it, and I loved WoW for the 4 years that I played it. That formula works, and is by far my favorite to date. But what exactly does it take to separate a game from WoW? Because even games that go beyond the superficial orcs/goblins/dwarves skins, deeper, and actually CHANGE COMBAT are still called WoW clones.
I don't ever see people putting this argument to rest. MMO devs are practically sleeping in their PR departments thinking of ways to answer the inevitable question that everyone always asks: How is this different from WoW? The truth of the matter is, even in game, people will be chanting this. WoW is a legend and I can assure you not an MMO in history is untouched by its presence. You will find discussions, harsh feelings, and arguments in any MMO when WoW comes up.
SW:TOR needs to be what it is. It needs to play well, it needs to be sure that the features it designs don't turn out to detract from the experience (thank god for voiced skipping, I personally love it but I'm sure plenty who don't would cry endlessly if spacebar weren't around). If the game's combat feels and performs like WoW, it'll be called "a WoW clone" but people are going to say that anyway, even if it doesn't. Why? Because they always do and they always will. FFS, people called Global Agenda a WoW clone! It's a tactic to incite, and people will do it until the end of time. We, as a community, need to be prepared for that. The best way to do that is to stop feeding the trolls. The game is an MMO. It will be LIKE other MMOs in one way or another. That should be as far as the discussion goes.
Someday we'll all look back on the age of computers - and lol.
bla bla bla the OP is giving for granted some wow-tards thinkings abaout VO, companions and little more, wich in the case of bioware they are 1 step further than blizzard child.
the only real objective they have to achive is end content, if they succed in that item then will be a the first mmo 2.0 of XXI century.
Number 1 is definetely my biggest concern, or rather expectation really. Almost every major game since WoWs success has tried to ape WoW. And this usually means:
everything you just mentioned are the things that people love about MMO's and the reason why games like WoW are successfull and why games like SWG/Fallen Earth/Eve are not. Ultima ONline? yea, 12 years ago.
Old MMORPG style is still old.
Uh where do you get your information? SWG was hugely successful, Eve is hugely successful. WoW is nothing but an easy to pick up game for kids, and chinese people to make money off lazy / stupid americans
everything you just mentioned are the things that people love about MMO's and the reason why games like WoW are successfull and why games like SWG/Fallen Earth/Eve are not. Ultima ONline? yea, 12 years ago.
Old MMORPG style is still old.
Uh where do you get your information? SWG was hugely successful, Eve is hugely successful. WoW is nothing but an easy to pick up game for kids, and chinese people to make money off lazy / stupid americans
Way to go to generalise to the point of being completely inaccurate.
Well Bioware has a reputation for creating good solo RPGs altough ME 2 was more like a shooter with some RPG elements. They don't have any experience with creating a MMO and currently it shows. They are trying to copy too much solo RPG features and transform it into an MMO which won't work.
Its still early judging from what we've seen right now its looking more like a solo RPG with co op modus. Also they have to with LA and EA two studios known for their failed MMOs.
4. Star Wars Serious Business
Only for fans Lucas is as greedy as it gets, just look at the craptastic episodes 1 - 3. He doesn't care about Star Wars any longer all he's seeing is $$$. Do you really believe this guy what give a rats butt about a not so Star Wars like change if he can make one more dime out of it? I highly doubt it.
Bioware on the other hand is walking a very thin line here. The Star Wars crowd has been pissed off by LA and Soe's NGE so they are even more skeptical right now and rightfully so. Voice acting alone for sure isn't gonna get it if the story isn't Star Wars like I'm sure it will end up like so much others games.
3. Voice Acting = Too much
Its a time and money killer and thats my number 1 concern with it. Its a blast for the first time but after that it can become annoying very fast (ig. Aoc and Tortage) at some point you just want to get the damn task and skip the dialogue.
I'm very sure they've already wasted a huge part of their budget and time into this thing. You know they are only 1 year away from shipping and haven't yet talked about endgame nor shown any real plans for it. Time is running out Bioware.
2. Companion Characters
Best example for too much solo RPG style in an MMO. Its working well in solo games cause well ... they are meant to be played solo. MMO on the other side are about working together as a team, raid and not having stupid NPCs called companions taking your job as a healer, dd or tank. Companions could very well lead to more solofication of the game.
It also kills the diversity of pet classes.
Why do they have to be part of my story? How about writting my own story and customize the part companions will or will not have in it? Its starting to look like a linear part of story and some loyal tasks (known from ME).
1. WoW With Lightsabers
- gay graphics check
- solo till max level check
- no death penalty check
- few classes avaiable check
So judging from the videos, hands on reports shown right now its looking like WoW with Lightsabers, yes. Only difference its fully voiced and more focused on a storyline.
conclusion: Bioware has yet to release some information about the endgame, group game right now they've only shown one "big" fight which wasn't very epic at all. Gonna keep following the infos but right now its just looking like another carebear game hope I'm wrong though.
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play." "Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
Good article, better than the list you gave for reasons to be stoked for ToR. Do I still sense a bit of bias against this game by this reviewer? Not that it's a bad thing.
Companions are the big one for me, since we don't know the details about how they will work in all situations. I hope they're not like the ones in GW in some ways. Yes it was nice to have customisable henchies, but their abilities and power levels were so very different from one player to the other, and it always threw off the immersion when you grouped up with someone else's henchies that overwrote your own. These guys could either be incredible for immersion or for immersion-breaking depending on how they are implemented in ToR.
The other points are not as big of a deal in my view. It has been shown that MMO companies can start out of non-MMO companies in the past, Blizzard isn't the only example.
Voice overs are a little of a double-edged sword. I'm one of those who does care about immersion in this style of game and I'm one of those weirdos who did read through WoW's quests, for example. Voice overs and more dynamic story-telling could be quite good though it might be a pain in the butt in group play. Again I think of GW where players would always skip through cutscenes in group instances. They would get really annoyed if there was one person (which there almost always was) who wanted to watch the cutscene. I think this could be a source of contention for groups: people will squabble over those who want to listen to the story and those who just want to get on with it.
5.) All companies started somewhere. This is a non issue. (Don't forget they are putting more money into this game than anyone has in a mmo before.)
4.) Another non issue here. Why even stay this? I'm not worried about what they are doing with the IP and you shouldn't either. They might as well be the successors to Lucas.
3.) Okay on to a real matter. You ask if the VO is too much. Instead ask yourself is it going to be enough? I hate having to read all the text in mmos and I feel it’s a real drag and I'm tired of it. It’s a breath of fresh air to finally have a "MMORPG" and not a fancy semi-MUD. The fact it’s taken this long to get a fully VO game is ridiculous. This game is for RPGers. If you’re not interested in the story then why are interested in playing the game? Seriously think about that a moment.
2.) Companion Characters. I'm still trying to decide which is better, full VO or Companions? Well Companion characters certainly ranks up there with things going in the right direction. People for some reason are worried that there won’t be a need for grouping? Really?! I wonder if you’re the kind of person who gets nervous when the weather starts to change. I feel like I can safely call you an alarmist. Or maybe you have too much time on your hands.
If you group and the group has 4 players and each player brings along a CC then the group just became 8. Surely there is someone here besides me who can see the benefit of that. I personally think that CC's will make the game easier for non MMORPGers to get into the game and make that transition. (This could be a very shrewd move on Biowares part to get more people into their mmorpg)
1.) You have to ask yourself what makes a game different than WoW.
They are both Massively Multiplayer (SWTOR = MMORPG, WoW = MMOG)
They are two separate genres (SWTOR = Sci-Fi, WoW = Fantasy)
WoW came out in 2004 and SWTOR comes out in 2011 (About 8 years apart)
SWTOR has better graphical quality then WoW.
SWTOR is fully voiced, Wow is not
Both Have PVP
Both have player housing (Wow added later, SWTOR has at launch)
SWTOR has companions who have their own storyline and purpose. They will fight beside you and help you or turn and try and kill you. Once their gone, their gone. WoW has a generic pet system.
That list could go on and on. Yes they are both games and so yes they are similar. Wow is not the first MMO. I don’t play WoW I tried to play it but it sucked so bad that I deleted it after a day. I want something that’s interesting and not a clone like WoW is. I’ve closely followed SWTOR and from what I can tell so far it’s not a clone like all the other mmo’s out there. It will stand on its own soon enough just you wait and see.
5.) All companies started somewhere. This is a non issue. (Don't forget they are putting more money into this game than anyone has in a mmo before.)
4.) Another non issue here. Why even stay this? I'm not worried about what they are doing with the IP and you shouldn't either. They might as well be the successors to Lucas.
3.) Okay on to a real matter. You ask if the VO is too much. Instead ask yourself is it going to be enough? I hate having to read all the text in mmos and I feel it’s a real drag and I'm tired of it. It’s a breath of fresh air to finally have a "MMORPG" and not a fancy semi-MUD. The fact it’s taken this long to get a fully VO game is ridiculous. This game is for RPGers. If you’re not interested in the story then why are interested in playing the game? Seriously think about that a moment.
2.) Companion Characters. I'm still trying to decide which is better, full VO or Companions? Well Companion characters certainly ranks up there with things going in the right direction. People for some reason are worried that there won’t be a need for grouping? Really?! I wonder if you’re the kind of person who gets nervous when the weather starts to change. I feel like I can safely call you an alarmist. Or maybe you have too much time on your hands.
If you group and the group has 4 players and each player brings along a CC then the group just became 8. Surely there is someone here besides me who can see the benefit of that. I personally think that CC's will make the game easier for non MMORPGers to get into the game and make that transition. (This could be a very shrewd move on Biowares part to get more people into their mmorpg)
1.) You have to ask yourself what makes a game different than WoW.
They are both Massively Multiplayer (SWTOR = MMORPG, WoW = MMOG)
They are two separate genres (SWTOR = Sci-Fi, WoW = Fantasy)
WoW came out in 2004 and SWTOR comes out in 2011 (About 8 years apart)
SWTOR has better graphical quality then WoW.
SWTOR is fully voiced, Wow is not
Both Have PVP
Both have player housing (Wow added later, SWTOR has at launch)
SWTOR has companions who have their own storyline and purpose. They will fight beside you and help you or turn and try and kill you. Once their gone, their gone. WoW has a generic pet system.
That list could go on and on. Yes they are both games and so yes they are similar. Wow is not the first MMO. I don’t play WoW I tried to play it but it sucked so bad that I deleted it after a day. I want something that’s interesting and not a clone like WoW is. I’ve closely followed SWTOR and from what I can tell so far it’s not a clone like all the other mmo’s out there. It will stand on its own soon enough just you wait and see.
While I agree fully with your post, I have one question... WoW has player housing? Did I miss something somewhere?
Lol voice overs? heh bioware has some really good quality voice actors in their pockets they have years of games too prove it.WoW with lightsabers o well if it works why the hell not.not a wow clone because its bein created on a completely diffrent game engine. ALL mmos are made with the same damn concept and as developers of this site should already be burned into ya brains.
Most people appear worried by the companions and rightly so because if done badly they will ruin the entire game, however; companion NPC's worked pretty well in guild wars and people still grouped when needed. My greatest fear is point number 5, will it be WoW with lightsabres? Not entirely to be sure but devs and publishers forcing themselves not to try for the heights of Blizzard mountain must be damned hard when you consider the possible income involved.
Interesting the link they have made between blizzard and bioware.
I can understand comparing one mmo to another, but comparing the "our first mmo" aspect seems to make some presume the game will therfore be similar, which is a bit far-fetched imo
Well considering Bioware's piss poor support for Dragon Age, failing to fix a single player game for over 6 months I have concerns about this being a success,
Good article, I enjoyed it, mainly because you're not afraid to voice your concern.
I have to admit, back in the day when I heard rumors of BW doing a SW MMO I want crazy about it, I thought, damn BW will make the best MMO evar!
But as the 1st screenshots came out and the more info we get now, I do feel as if this is not going to be my cup of tea. I was honestly looking for something like SWG with updated graphics engine, game mechanics, and overall improvement of that formula, but all I see when I look at SWTOR is mass appeal mass appeal and more mass appeal, with a healthy sprinkle of World of Warcraft.
I think a companion character would be sweet if it was like r2d2 or some kind of droid or alien that helped in some quirky way ala "r2d2 as a locksmith/hacker" but just like repaired your ship and stuff while you were doing more important things.
Good article, I enjoyed it, mainly because you're not afraid to voice your concern.
I have to admit, back in the day when I heard rumors of BW doing a SW MMO I want crazy about it, I thought, damn BW will make the best MMO evar!
But as the 1st screenshots came out and the more info we get now, I do feel as if this is not going to be my cup of tea. I was honestly looking for something like SWG with updated graphics engine, game mechanics, and overall improvement of that formula, but all I see when I look at SWTOR is mass appeal mass appeal and more mass appeal, with a healthy sprinkle of World of Warcraft.
Wouldn't they have to be completely retarded to spend more than $100million and NOT go for mass appeal?
Well considering Bioware's piss poor support for Dragon Age, failing to fix a single player game for over 6 months I have concerns about this being a success,
I never had a single problem with DA:O, what exactly did they not fix?
Well Bioware has a reputation for creating good solo RPGs altough ME 2 was more like a shooter with some RPG elements. They don't have any experience with creating a MMO and currently it shows. They are trying to copy too much solo RPG features and transform it into an MMO which won't work.
Its still early judging from what we've seen right now its looking more like a solo RPG with co op modus. Also they have to with LA and EA two studios known for their failed MMOs.
4. Star Wars Serious Business
Only for fans Lucas is as greedy as it gets, just look at the craptastic episodes 1 - 3. He doesn't care about Star Wars any longer all he's seeing is $$$. Do you really believe this guy what give a rats butt about a not so Star Wars like change if he can make one more dime out of it? I highly doubt it.
Bioware on the other hand is walking a very thin line here. The Star Wars crowd has been pissed off by LA and Soe's NGE so they are even more skeptical right now and rightfully so. Voice acting alone for sure isn't gonna get it if the story isn't Star Wars like I'm sure it will end up like so much others games.
3. Voice Acting = Too much
Its a time and money killer and thats my number 1 concern with it. Its a blast for the first time but after that it can become annoying very fast (ig. Aoc and Tortage) at some point you just want to get the damn task and skip the dialogue.
I'm very sure they've already wasted a huge part of their budget and time into this thing. You know they are only 1 year away from shipping and haven't yet talked about endgame nor shown any real plans for it. Time is running out Bioware.
2. Companion Characters
Best example for too much solo RPG style in an MMO. Its working well in solo games cause well ... they are meant to be played solo. MMO on the other side are about working together as a team, raid and not having stupid NPCs called companions taking your job as a healer, dd or tank. Companions could very well lead to more solofication of the game.
It also kills the diversity of pet classes.
Why do they have to be part of my story? How about writting my own story and customize the part companions will or will not have in it? Its starting to look like a linear part of story and some loyal tasks (known from ME).
1. WoW With Lightsabers
- gay graphics check
- solo till max level check
- no death penalty check
- few classes avaiable check
So judging from the videos, hands on reports shown right now its looking like WoW with Lightsabers, yes. Only difference its fully voiced and more focused on a storyline.
conclusion: Bioware has yet to release some information about the endgame, group game right now they've only shown one "big" fight which wasn't very epic at all. Gonna keep following the infos but right now its just looking like another carebear game hope I'm wrong though.
With the exception that I disaprove the usage of "gay" as synonyme for "bad", I couldn't have said it better myself.
Bioware has a strong tendency for conservative gameplay. The stories and characters were always great. But tbh... nothing else in any Bioware game ever really was great or anything but standard fare outside of story. Neither the combat nor the world design nor anything. And EA and Lucasarts aren't quite hotspots of innovation and creativity either.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
People who are interested in grouping, do so. People who are not interested, do not. People who do want to group stop playing when they hit manditory group content. Games that force group content do not force players to group. They make players who don't want to group do something else instead. Like play another game.
Why would anyone want to group with people who didn't want to? If some person is doing their own thing, happy as can be without you, why do you care in the slightest that they are happy but not in a group? How exactly are you going to force them to group with you and have the resulting group function effectively?
Companions sound like a massive boon to solo players. There are a lot of solo players, for many reasons. If the game caters to them, they will come and play it. This is good for the game, the solo players, and the player community as a whole. Where is the negative in having more players? In supporting multiple playstyles?
Crafting is another way to attract more players. Not everyone likes to kill things. Some players like to be social while accomplishing goals and quests. How many people play facebook games with simple nonviolent goals? A lot. Is getting them to play on an MMO bad for anyone? I think not. More players is, at the very least, a bigger community. More money into the game, which leads to more game development. Which is great for everyone.
If you like to form groups with other players and pvp, chances are you're only going to be facing other players who like the same thing. Players who aren't interested in this kind of play aren't going to. The game can't make them. Having a game only support this playstyle means only those players will play it. Which, no matter how you look at it, is only a tiny fraction of the player community.
If companions have problems with gameplay, or play balance, that's a serious issue and will have to be addressed. Just like player class balance, player gear balance, yadda yadda yadda. I'm sure such issues are being taken into account. I can't imagine that they're being ignored. Like the designers are suddenly: OMG! The companion is involved with combat too? We never thought of that! Six years and millions of dollars to waste. Oh well.
So far the only serious companion concern I've seen printed was the post about if they'll make pvp more predictable because it the companions will always be targeted first. But if companions are all classes, and players get to choose their companions, it seems like companions could be fine tuned just like your gear loadout. Just like you have sever pvp gear and hotbar loadouts you would have companion setups to go along with them. And whil you might always target a healer, what if the player loads a dps, buffer or tank?
I'm really looking forward to companions and to seeing what players do with them.
I serieusly doub it will become as popular as WoW, its just to many similaritys that make swtor a themepark for mass identical to WoW.
Voice over will not work in mmo maybe only first month you play after that it becomes annoying, companions seems biggest couse of failor for swtor.
But if you go blindly and im sure most do for this swtor and you want familiar themeprk gameplay as we saw in last decade well this game prolly for you.
But my gues is most will be bored after couple of months becouse they find out its nothing new its all the same boring crap.
Bioware should stick to solo games is my advice.
Btw release is not that far away but world is still very empty and dull looking, result maybe not much to do but same old crap like kill 10x rats ill bet yah this will be ingame and we want that RIGHT :P
Goodluck with another eq-wow themepark copy:)
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009..... In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
Actually they have already stated there will be some tough end-game content and raids for hardcore players. They have also stated the world is 95% open and 5% instanced. Do some research before you come bashing the game.
You should play a varaition of either class, but at heart all players should be either Jedi or Sith. I make that statement because that is what StarWars is about. The story isnt about troopers, pilots, or even any of the local populace, they merly provide fill and fodder to the Jedi/Sith conflict.
I feel this way because, as stated in the article, Star Wars is the biggest intelectual property in Nerdville...Hence..to open the playable class structure BioWare has raped the lore...see Jedi facing a viable threat in 1 trooper....really?..really?...These are Jedi..a small group of them are able to repel a battaion of troopers...I think this will be an argument that will atleast hinder TORs placement umungest MMOs greatest titles.
In the StarWars universe there is a vast and untapped pile of RPG resourse. But it seems to me BioWare has chosen to stay in a farmula of 'stick with what works and what is safe'..great Blizzard wins another with teh WOW formula....ToR will sell previously unseen pre-release numbers...then..without an inovative..and I suspect 'slow to play" do to the voice over, it will falter.
Comments
This was a well written article. Balanced views and a majority of the points brought up are also concerns of mine, though I find I have a different view on them.
I am shaky at best about the companion pet additions, though for different reasons than the author's. As said in the first article, "5 reasons to be stoked", It's bioware! They may have no experience in the MMO market, but they do have experience in the "not being retarded" market as seen by their constant successes. They understand what they're doing. The conceptuality of MMO gaming is not foreign to anyone, even those who have never played MMOs. Anyone to date can explain, to a degree, the necessities of an MMO game. Bioware will not make these companion pets any more than a single-player flourish. They've made it perfectly clear is several interviews that multiplayer gameplay will be an important focus. So I wouldn't take the same concerns as the author on this issue. I do, however, completely agree that there is some concern to be had with the direction they take these companions.
regarding the "WoW Clone" concern,
During my many years of MMO experience, one of the most annoying arguments that has ALWAYS been around is "this game is just like [older game]". This argument has so rarely been accurate historically, and it's really annoying to hear when individuals are trying to enjoy something new. This dates back as far as Asheron's Call being called Everquest or Everquest being called UO. And it hasn't stopped, and won't stop, as seen with very recent releases like Aion being called WoW.
How many features does it take to make a game distinguishably different from WoW? At what point will people stop chiming in that the game is the same.
WoW is WASD to move, auto-attack, and Activatable Abilities. How many countless MMOs have used this formula? I'm not trashing it, I love it, and I loved WoW for the 4 years that I played it. That formula works, and is by far my favorite to date. But what exactly does it take to separate a game from WoW? Because even games that go beyond the superficial orcs/goblins/dwarves skins, deeper, and actually CHANGE COMBAT are still called WoW clones.
I don't ever see people putting this argument to rest. MMO devs are practically sleeping in their PR departments thinking of ways to answer the inevitable question that everyone always asks: How is this different from WoW? The truth of the matter is, even in game, people will be chanting this. WoW is a legend and I can assure you not an MMO in history is untouched by its presence. You will find discussions, harsh feelings, and arguments in any MMO when WoW comes up.
SW:TOR needs to be what it is. It needs to play well, it needs to be sure that the features it designs don't turn out to detract from the experience (thank god for voiced skipping, I personally love it but I'm sure plenty who don't would cry endlessly if spacebar weren't around). If the game's combat feels and performs like WoW, it'll be called "a WoW clone" but people are going to say that anyway, even if it doesn't. Why? Because they always do and they always will. FFS, people called Global Agenda a WoW clone! It's a tactic to incite, and people will do it until the end of time. We, as a community, need to be prepared for that. The best way to do that is to stop feeding the trolls. The game is an MMO. It will be LIKE other MMOs in one way or another. That should be as far as the discussion goes.
Someday we'll all look back on the age of computers - and lol.
bla bla bla the OP is giving for granted some wow-tards thinkings abaout VO, companions and little more, wich in the case of bioware they are 1 step further than blizzard child.
the only real objective they have to achive is end content, if they succed in that item then will be a the first mmo 2.0 of XXI century.
Number 1 is definetely my biggest concern, or rather expectation really. Almost every major game since WoWs success has tried to ape WoW. And this usually means:
Themepark
Linear
Casual
Heavily restricted PvP
Instanced
Doubt SW:Old Republic will be much different.
My gaming blog
Way to go to generalise to the point of being completely inaccurate.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
5. Biowares first MMO
Well Bioware has a reputation for creating good solo RPGs altough ME 2 was more like a shooter with some RPG elements. They don't have any experience with creating a MMO and currently it shows. They are trying to copy too much solo RPG features and transform it into an MMO which won't work.
Its still early judging from what we've seen right now its looking more like a solo RPG with co op modus. Also they have to with LA and EA two studios known for their failed MMOs.
4. Star Wars Serious Business
Only for fans Lucas is as greedy as it gets, just look at the craptastic episodes 1 - 3. He doesn't care about Star Wars any longer all he's seeing is $$$. Do you really believe this guy what give a rats butt about a not so Star Wars like change if he can make one more dime out of it? I highly doubt it.
Bioware on the other hand is walking a very thin line here. The Star Wars crowd has been pissed off by LA and Soe's NGE so they are even more skeptical right now and rightfully so. Voice acting alone for sure isn't gonna get it if the story isn't Star Wars like I'm sure it will end up like so much others games.
3. Voice Acting = Too much
Its a time and money killer and thats my number 1 concern with it. Its a blast for the first time but after that it can become annoying very fast (ig. Aoc and Tortage) at some point you just want to get the damn task and skip the dialogue.
I'm very sure they've already wasted a huge part of their budget and time into this thing. You know they are only 1 year away from shipping and haven't yet talked about endgame nor shown any real plans for it. Time is running out Bioware.
2. Companion Characters
Best example for too much solo RPG style in an MMO. Its working well in solo games cause well ... they are meant to be played solo. MMO on the other side are about working together as a team, raid and not having stupid NPCs called companions taking your job as a healer, dd or tank. Companions could very well lead to more solofication of the game.
It also kills the diversity of pet classes.
Why do they have to be part of my story? How about writting my own story and customize the part companions will or will not have in it? Its starting to look like a linear part of story and some loyal tasks (known from ME).
1. WoW With Lightsabers
- gay graphics check
- solo till max level check
- no death penalty check
- few classes avaiable check
So judging from the videos, hands on reports shown right now its looking like WoW with Lightsabers, yes. Only difference its fully voiced and more focused on a storyline.
conclusion: Bioware has yet to release some information about the endgame, group game right now they've only shown one "big" fight which wasn't very epic at all. Gonna keep following the infos but right now its just looking like another carebear game hope I'm wrong though.
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play."
"Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
Good article, better than the list you gave for reasons to be stoked for ToR. Do I still sense a bit of bias against this game by this reviewer? Not that it's a bad thing.
Companions are the big one for me, since we don't know the details about how they will work in all situations. I hope they're not like the ones in GW in some ways. Yes it was nice to have customisable henchies, but their abilities and power levels were so very different from one player to the other, and it always threw off the immersion when you grouped up with someone else's henchies that overwrote your own. These guys could either be incredible for immersion or for immersion-breaking depending on how they are implemented in ToR.
The other points are not as big of a deal in my view. It has been shown that MMO companies can start out of non-MMO companies in the past, Blizzard isn't the only example.
Voice overs are a little of a double-edged sword. I'm one of those who does care about immersion in this style of game and I'm one of those weirdos who did read through WoW's quests, for example. Voice overs and more dynamic story-telling could be quite good though it might be a pain in the butt in group play. Again I think of GW where players would always skip through cutscenes in group instances. They would get really annoyed if there was one person (which there almost always was) who wanted to watch the cutscene. I think this could be a source of contention for groups: people will squabble over those who want to listen to the story and those who just want to get on with it.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
5.) All companies started somewhere. This is a non issue. (Don't forget they are putting more money into this game than anyone has in a mmo before.)
4.) Another non issue here. Why even stay this? I'm not worried about what they are doing with the IP and you shouldn't either. They might as well be the successors to Lucas.
3.) Okay on to a real matter. You ask if the VO is too much. Instead ask yourself is it going to be enough? I hate having to read all the text in mmos and I feel it’s a real drag and I'm tired of it. It’s a breath of fresh air to finally have a "MMORPG" and not a fancy semi-MUD. The fact it’s taken this long to get a fully VO game is ridiculous. This game is for RPGers. If you’re not interested in the story then why are interested in playing the game? Seriously think about that a moment.
2.) Companion Characters. I'm still trying to decide which is better, full VO or Companions? Well Companion characters certainly ranks up there with things going in the right direction. People for some reason are worried that there won’t be a need for grouping? Really?! I wonder if you’re the kind of person who gets nervous when the weather starts to change. I feel like I can safely call you an alarmist. Or maybe you have too much time on your hands.
If you group and the group has 4 players and each player brings along a CC then the group just became 8. Surely there is someone here besides me who can see the benefit of that. I personally think that CC's will make the game easier for non MMORPGers to get into the game and make that transition. (This could be a very shrewd move on Biowares part to get more people into their mmorpg)
1.) You have to ask yourself what makes a game different than WoW.
They are both Massively Multiplayer (SWTOR = MMORPG, WoW = MMOG)
They are two separate genres (SWTOR = Sci-Fi, WoW = Fantasy)
WoW came out in 2004 and SWTOR comes out in 2011 (About 8 years apart)
SWTOR has better graphical quality then WoW.
SWTOR is fully voiced, Wow is not
Both Have PVP
Both have player housing (Wow added later, SWTOR has at launch)
SWTOR has companions who have their own storyline and purpose. They will fight beside you and help you or turn and try and kill you. Once their gone, their gone. WoW has a generic pet system.
That list could go on and on. Yes they are both games and so yes they are similar. Wow is not the first MMO. I don’t play WoW I tried to play it but it sucked so bad that I deleted it after a day. I want something that’s interesting and not a clone like WoW is. I’ve closely followed SWTOR and from what I can tell so far it’s not a clone like all the other mmo’s out there. It will stand on its own soon enough just you wait and see.
While I agree fully with your post, I have one question... WoW has player housing? Did I miss something somewhere?
I was under the impression it was added in at some point.. A wow wiki had a lot of details on it.
Lol voice overs? heh bioware has some really good quality voice actors in their pockets they have years of games too prove it.WoW with lightsabers o well if it works why the hell not.not a wow clone because its bein created on a completely diffrent game engine. ALL mmos are made with the same damn concept and as developers of this site should already be burned into ya brains.
Companion Characters?
This is going to be a mmorpg!!!!!!!
or is it?
Most people appear worried by the companions and rightly so because if done badly they will ruin the entire game, however; companion NPC's worked pretty well in guild wars and people still grouped when needed. My greatest fear is point number 5, will it be WoW with lightsabres? Not entirely to be sure but devs and publishers forcing themselves not to try for the heights of Blizzard mountain must be damned hard when you consider the possible income involved.
Interesting the link they have made between blizzard and bioware.
I can understand comparing one mmo to another, but comparing the "our first mmo" aspect seems to make some presume the game will therfore be similar, which is a bit far-fetched imo
Well considering Bioware's piss poor support for Dragon Age, failing to fix a single player game for over 6 months I have concerns about this being a success,
Good article, I enjoyed it, mainly because you're not afraid to voice your concern.
I have to admit, back in the day when I heard rumors of BW doing a SW MMO I want crazy about it, I thought, damn BW will make the best MMO evar!
But as the 1st screenshots came out and the more info we get now, I do feel as if this is not going to be my cup of tea. I was honestly looking for something like SWG with updated graphics engine, game mechanics, and overall improvement of that formula, but all I see when I look at SWTOR is mass appeal mass appeal and more mass appeal, with a healthy sprinkle of World of Warcraft.
I think a companion character would be sweet if it was like r2d2 or some kind of droid or alien that helped in some quirky way ala "r2d2 as a locksmith/hacker" but just like repaired your ship and stuff while you were doing more important things.
Wouldn't they have to be completely retarded to spend more than $100million and NOT go for mass appeal?
I never had a single problem with DA:O, what exactly did they not fix?
With the exception that I disaprove the usage of "gay" as synonyme for "bad", I couldn't have said it better myself.
Bioware has a strong tendency for conservative gameplay. The stories and characters were always great. But tbh... nothing else in any Bioware game ever really was great or anything but standard fare outside of story. Neither the combat nor the world design nor anything. And EA and Lucasarts aren't quite hotspots of innovation and creativity either.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Companions - how will this affect grouping?
People who are interested in grouping, do so. People who are not interested, do not. People who do want to group stop playing when they hit manditory group content. Games that force group content do not force players to group. They make players who don't want to group do something else instead. Like play another game.
Why would anyone want to group with people who didn't want to? If some person is doing their own thing, happy as can be without you, why do you care in the slightest that they are happy but not in a group? How exactly are you going to force them to group with you and have the resulting group function effectively?
Companions sound like a massive boon to solo players. There are a lot of solo players, for many reasons. If the game caters to them, they will come and play it. This is good for the game, the solo players, and the player community as a whole. Where is the negative in having more players? In supporting multiple playstyles?
Crafting is another way to attract more players. Not everyone likes to kill things. Some players like to be social while accomplishing goals and quests. How many people play facebook games with simple nonviolent goals? A lot. Is getting them to play on an MMO bad for anyone? I think not. More players is, at the very least, a bigger community. More money into the game, which leads to more game development. Which is great for everyone.
If you like to form groups with other players and pvp, chances are you're only going to be facing other players who like the same thing. Players who aren't interested in this kind of play aren't going to. The game can't make them. Having a game only support this playstyle means only those players will play it. Which, no matter how you look at it, is only a tiny fraction of the player community.
If companions have problems with gameplay, or play balance, that's a serious issue and will have to be addressed. Just like player class balance, player gear balance, yadda yadda yadda. I'm sure such issues are being taken into account. I can't imagine that they're being ignored. Like the designers are suddenly: OMG! The companion is involved with combat too? We never thought of that! Six years and millions of dollars to waste. Oh well.
So far the only serious companion concern I've seen printed was the post about if they'll make pvp more predictable because it the companions will always be targeted first. But if companions are all classes, and players get to choose their companions, it seems like companions could be fine tuned just like your gear loadout. Just like you have sever pvp gear and hotbar loadouts you would have companion setups to go along with them. And whil you might always target a healer, what if the player loads a dps, buffer or tank?
I'm really looking forward to companions and to seeing what players do with them.
I serieusly doub it will become as popular as WoW, its just to many similaritys that make swtor a themepark for mass identical to WoW.
Voice over will not work in mmo maybe only first month you play after that it becomes annoying, companions seems biggest couse of failor for swtor.
But if you go blindly and im sure most do for this swtor and you want familiar themeprk gameplay as we saw in last decade well this game prolly for you.
But my gues is most will be bored after couple of months becouse they find out its nothing new its all the same boring crap.
Bioware should stick to solo games is my advice.
Btw release is not that far away but world is still very empty and dull looking, result maybe not much to do but same old crap like kill 10x rats ill bet yah this will be ingame and we want that RIGHT :P
Goodluck with another eq-wow themepark copy:)
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
~Xiara D'Aarmon
Actually they have already stated there will be some tough end-game content and raids for hardcore players. They have also stated the world is 95% open and 5% instanced. Do some research before you come bashing the game.
~Xiara D'Aarmon
My thoughts on a StarWars MMO:
It should be RvR...Sith vs Jedi
You should play a varaition of either class, but at heart all players should be either Jedi or Sith. I make that statement because that is what StarWars is about. The story isnt about troopers, pilots, or even any of the local populace, they merly provide fill and fodder to the Jedi/Sith conflict.
I feel this way because, as stated in the article, Star Wars is the biggest intelectual property in Nerdville...Hence..to open the playable class structure BioWare has raped the lore...see Jedi facing a viable threat in 1 trooper....really?..really?...These are Jedi..a small group of them are able to repel a battaion of troopers...I think this will be an argument that will atleast hinder TORs placement umungest MMOs greatest titles.
In the StarWars universe there is a vast and untapped pile of RPG resourse. But it seems to me BioWare has chosen to stay in a farmula of 'stick with what works and what is safe'..great Blizzard wins another with teh WOW formula....ToR will sell previously unseen pre-release numbers...then..without an inovative..and I suspect 'slow to play" do to the voice over, it will falter.