1 person call me pussy cause I declined a duel and another person follow me around for 15 minutes, killing every mob I attacked. I actually logged out for about an hour and when I came back he somehow found me and the whole process started again. So, after 7 hours of playing I realized why I quit this games years ago. I have now cancelled my sub and this will be my last look at WoW ever again.
So the guy who was following you and killing mobs you tagged was actually helping you? Since you cant kill steal in WoW
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
If he kills mobs that u attacked (like u said), you gain full exp for every mob and quest objectives finished. If he just made all the job for you, why complain?
I didnt say I never had ANY issues with wow. I actually named some issues earlier. It just didn't bother me much since I was in good guild and was focus on other things, then reading global and seeking for help
Worst: The majority of MMOs since '04, or '05. When I left SWG due to the NGE debacle and toyed around with more MMORPGs, I was actually disturbed by how frequently less grouping occured, and when they DO occur, they abruptly get disbanded or members leave without so much as a "Later dudes!" MMORPG player communities are at a point where as soon as the quest is done and your back in a relatively safe area, the members disberse with out even a "Bye." Quite oftenly, people don't say s**t the entire time. That doesn't build a good community, IMO.
Best: Easily, hands down Pre-NGE SWG. The playerbase was good in Pre-WoW standards and respectable numbers even in contrast for today (best it had I think was 200k I think). The community in the differing servers in general were spectacular, partly because of the people and partly because of the game mechanics....
QFT
You've echoed my experience with ye olde SWG. Easily the best community in any game I have ever played.
Best: Pre-NGE SWG - no contest. Ryzom had a nice community. LOTRO is a mix bag as is EQ2, but on the whole they are more mature than most.
Worst: WoW is pretty bad. There are good people there but they're drowning in a sea of turds. Aion's community leaves a lot to be desired too. I also have to mention the FFXIV Beta community. Very hostile, rude and unfriendly. I really hope it's not a glimps into the community's future.
PreNGE SWG was not only the first MMO but the first computer game I ever played. Since then I have gone on to many others, but none has compared to that first experience. Without a doubt, the poster said exactly what I would have.
The community in SWG's Golden Age has never been equaled in any game I have played (WoW, Ryzom, EQ2, FF, Vanguard, Dark & Light, Aion, Guild Wars, LOTRO, etc, etc). People actually socialized and helped each other in a way I have never seen before. The cantinas made it natural for total strangers to meet and hang out with each other, and the xp incentive system encouraged everyone to help each other. I have never, ever encountered a community like that one before, where people were actually EAGER to help me, a total newby. Later in my experience, I have never had so many friends in a game--nor have I ever felt so comfortable in any game just picking up a group. By the end of the group, we would have made new friends, not scattered to the four winds without even speaking.
I truly hope one day a game developer smartens up and decides to make something like SWG again--something where community develops naturally, because there is just more to DO than fight.
WORST: WoW, hands down. It would seem the general age is about 11, and nobody's mama has taught any of them any manners. The jerk factor is about +15 on a scale of 1 - 10. Unfortunately, it seems a lot of those kiddies also are playing Aion and FFX!V. Manners, children, remember your manners, PLEASE!
Originally posted by Warmaker
Worst: The majority of MMOs since '04, or '05. When I left SWG due to the NGE debacle and toyed around with more MMORPGs, I was actually disturbed by how frequently less grouping occured, and when they DO occur, they abruptly get disbanded or members leave without so much as a "Later dudes!" MMORPG player communities are at a point where as soon as the quest is done and your back in a relatively safe area, the members disberse with out even a "Bye." Quite oftenly, people don't say s**t the entire time. That doesn't build a good community, IMO.
Best: Easily, hands down Pre-NGE SWG. The playerbase was good in Pre-WoW standards and respectable numbers even in contrast for today (best it had I think was 200k I think). The community in the differing servers in general were spectacular, partly because of the people and partly because of the game mechanics.
...
My friends list in that game was huge and you'd always say what's up when one of your buddies log in. My list in there was easily the largest compared to every MMORPG I have played. Once SOE destroyed the community and I left the game, I have never found another MMORPG that had the same level or better community experience as I had with old school SWG. Even LOTRO, with its community having a good and mature reputation, did not come close to half that experience.
Worst: The majority of MMOs since '04, or '05. When I left SWG due to the NGE debacle and toyed around with more MMORPGs, I was actually disturbed by how frequently less grouping occured, and when they DO occur, they abruptly get disbanded or members leave without so much as a "Later dudes!" MMORPG player communities are at a point where as soon as the quest is done and your back in a relatively safe area, the members disberse with out even a "Bye." Quite oftenly, people don't say s**t the entire time. That doesn't build a good community, IMO.
Best: Easily, hands down Pre-NGE SWG. The playerbase was good in Pre-WoW standards and respectable numbers even in contrast for today (best it had I think was 200k I think). The community in the differing servers in general were spectacular, partly because of the people and partly because of the game mechanics. My justifications:
Pre-NGE SWG's community was the best I ever saw. Due to how the gameplay mechanics were and the people that were there. My friends list in that game was huge and you'd always say what's up when one of your buddies log in. My list in there was easily the largest compared to every MMORPG I have played. Once SOE destroyed the community and I left the game, I have never found another MMORPG that had the same level or better community experience as I had with old school SWG. Even LOTRO, with its community having a good and mature reputation, did not come close to half that experience.
Man... you really make me jealous of the people who experienced this... Although I do think some of it is influenced by nostalgia, it still sounds awesome.
Best: any p2p with a decent niche group that you can hang out with... It's really a hit or miss on this one, considering you have to find a group of people amongst a HUGE puddle of mess. I personally found my first amongst WoW players, mostly during vanilla and BC, most left, I stayed.
Worst: any f2p, while I was a f2p lover at one time, after being spoiled by the community of people I found in other MMOs... I just became afraid of anyone I encountered in f2p... and what's a game without a community to rely on?
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
That really sucks! Sorry to hear that you had that experience. I must be one of the luckiest (ex) WoW players. I never had issues like these. I've had issues with groups from time to time, like the random ninja looter or healer/tank who leaves group right when you get in the dungeon door, but nothing on the order of harassment like this, and nothing I haven't encountered in any game to be honest.
Maybe I was just lucky on the EU server I rolled, the community was very nice and pretty helpful. There weren't even that many Chuck Norris jokes in Barrens chat!
I would wager that the reason your experience wasn't as bad IS indeed because Europeans are generally not such utter asshats as many American children and young adults these days. I'm guessing here, but I'm betting that has something to do with it. Rudeness...has become an American trademark, sadly.
On North American servers you are forced to share servers with a cornucopia of children and young adults that have had no active parenting in their lives, for one, and have grown up with the internet anonymity blanket to protect them from their own vile behavior having any real consequences. Theyve been raised with "freedom of speech" being preached to them more than common decency and compassion, and have been taught that you put yourself FIRST....always. Many of them know nothing of sharing, being helpful and considerate, or putting aside one's own desires to benefit another human being....not even for a few seconds. When you're raised with that sort of narcissistic mentality being rewarded as being "bold and honest" (honest...what a joke) then you tend to turn into a real shithead of an adult. We are right NOW seeing the repercussions of not disciplining children and allowing them to just do whatever they like, regardless of the impact on others or even themselves.
1 person call me pussy cause I declined a duel and another person follow me around for 15 minutes, killing every mob I attacked. I actually logged out for about an hour and when I came back he somehow found me and the whole process started again. So, after 7 hours of playing I realized why I quit this games years ago. I have now cancelled my sub and this will be my last look at WoW ever again.
So the guy who was following you and killing mobs you tagged was actually helping you? Since you cant kill steal in WoW
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
If he kills mobs that u attacked (like u said), you gain full exp for every mob and quest objectives finished. If he just made all the job for you, why complain?
I didnt say I never had ANY issues with wow. I actually named some issues earlier. It just didn't bother me much since I was in good guild and was focus on other things, then reading global and seeking for help
That only works if he actually tapped the mobs before the higher level kill them. Even then, he would only get a fraction on the experience based on the damage he did to the mob, to prevent exploting. He would still get quest credit, but still quite a bit less than if he were to just kill the mobs on his own. Besides, some people actually prefer to be challenged by gameplay rather than be lead around and powerleveled with minimal effort. Shocking, I know.
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
That really sucks! Sorry to hear that you had that experience. I must be one of the luckiest (ex) WoW players. I never had issues like these. I've had issues with groups from time to time, like the random ninja looter or healer/tank who leaves group right when you get in the dungeon door, but nothing on the order of harassment like this, and nothing I haven't encountered in any game to be honest.
Maybe I was just lucky on the EU server I rolled, the community was very nice and pretty helpful. There weren't even that many Chuck Norris jokes in Barrens chat!
I would wager that the reason your experience wasn't as bad IS indeed because Europeans are generally not such utter asshats as many American children and young adults these days. I'm guessing here, but I'm betting that has something to do with it. Rudeness...has become an American trademark, sadly.
On North American servers you are forced to share servers with a cornucopia of children and young adults that have had no active parenting in their lives, for one, and have grown up with the internet anonymity blanket to protect them from their own vile behavior having any real consequences. Theyve been raised with "freedom of speech" being preached to them more than common decency and compassion, and have been taught that you put yourself FIRST....always. Many of them know nothing of sharing, being helpful and considerate, or putting aside one's own desires to benefit another human being....not even for a few seconds. When you're raised with that sort of narcissistic mentality being rewarded as being "bold and honest" (honest...what a joke) then you tend to turn into a real shithead of an adult. We are right NOW seeing the repercussions of not disciplining children and allowing them to just do whatever they like, regardless of the impact on others or even themselves.
Your very mistaken there are countrys here that are way more worse then americans i wont say witch countrys most know who they are, but there realy realy bad, and problem is many of those realy bad behaving players hide behind there language and just refuse to speak english.
I rather play on US server then on some servers here in europe and not only for english but most;y for behavior.
Darkfall have some realy bad european players way worse then the US server thats what ive heared so far from some US friends i meet on mirc about behavior on theres.
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009..... In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
Seems like this thread pops up on this site every so often....I guess I'll play again...
Best: LotRO - Simply a helpful and friendly community. I have really enjoyed my time in Middle Earth thanks in part to the community who share my adventures.
Best Runner-Up: CoH/V - In a team centric game, it really helps if the community is mature. With CoH, you get a helpful, fun, and mature community that makes teaming a blast.
Worst: WoW - With a larger community you apparently get bigger arses. The main reason I left the game was because the community was so bad. Coming from a game like CoH, to a game like WoW was a shock. I went from a game with one of the best communities, to one with the worst.
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
That really sucks! Sorry to hear that you had that experience. I must be one of the luckiest (ex) WoW players. I never had issues like these. I've had issues with groups from time to time, like the random ninja looter or healer/tank who leaves group right when you get in the dungeon door, but nothing on the order of harassment like this, and nothing I haven't encountered in any game to be honest.
Maybe I was just lucky on the EU server I rolled, the community was very nice and pretty helpful. There weren't even that many Chuck Norris jokes in Barrens chat!
I would wager that the reason your experience wasn't as bad IS indeed because Europeans are generally not such utter asshats as many American children and young adults these days. I'm guessing here, but I'm betting that has something to do with it. Rudeness...has become an American trademark, sadly.
On North American servers you are forced to share servers with a cornucopia of children and young adults that have had no active parenting in their lives, for one, and have grown up with the internet anonymity blanket to protect them from their own vile behavior having any real consequences. Theyve been raised with "freedom of speech" being preached to them more than common decency and compassion, and have been taught that you put yourself FIRST....always. Many of them know nothing of sharing, being helpful and considerate, or putting aside one's own desires to benefit another human being....not even for a few seconds. When you're raised with that sort of narcissistic mentality being rewarded as being "bold and honest" (honest...what a joke) then you tend to turn into a real shithead of an adult. We are right NOW seeing the repercussions of not disciplining children and allowing them to just do whatever they like, regardless of the impact on others or even themselves.
Right-on, I agree with all this, which is why when I am walking through the mall, and see those snot nosed little shitheads roaming around at 12yrs old in groups of 5, cursing up a storm and trying to look all hard, I walk right up to the group, look the meanest one in the eye and ask...
"What did the 5 fingers say to the face?"
SLAP!!!
Little basterds. I absolutely hate american youth.
To those very VERY small percent of american youth who are actually kind and polite. I apologize and would like to shake your parents hands.
To the rest, yes they deserve to die, and I hope they burn in hell!
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
That really sucks! Sorry to hear that you had that experience. I must be one of the luckiest (ex) WoW players. I never had issues like these. I've had issues with groups from time to time, like the random ninja looter or healer/tank who leaves group right when you get in the dungeon door, but nothing on the order of harassment like this, and nothing I haven't encountered in any game to be honest.
Maybe I was just lucky on the EU server I rolled, the community was very nice and pretty helpful. There weren't even that many Chuck Norris jokes in Barrens chat!
I would wager that the reason your experience wasn't as bad IS indeed because Europeans are generally not such utter asshats as many American children and young adults these days. I'm guessing here, but I'm betting that has something to do with it. Rudeness...has become an American trademark, sadly.
On North American servers you are forced to share servers with a cornucopia of children and young adults that have had no active parenting in their lives, for one, and have grown up with the internet anonymity blanket to protect them from their own vile behavior having any real consequences. Theyve been raised with "freedom of speech" being preached to them more than common decency and compassion, and have been taught that you put yourself FIRST....always. Many of them know nothing of sharing, being helpful and considerate, or putting aside one's own desires to benefit another human being....not even for a few seconds. When you're raised with that sort of narcissistic mentality being rewarded as being "bold and honest" (honest...what a joke) then you tend to turn into a real shithead of an adult. We are right NOW seeing the repercussions of not disciplining children and allowing them to just do whatever they like, regardless of the impact on others or even themselves.
Your very mistaken there are countrys here that are way more worse then americans i wont say witch countrys most know who they are, but there realy realy bad, and problem is many of those realy bad behaving players hide behind there language and just refuse to speak english.
I rather play on US server then on some servers here in europe and not only for english but most;y for behavior.
Darkfall have some realy bad european players way worse then the US server thats what ive heared so far from some US friends i meet on mirc about behavior on theres.
Actually...it's oddly comforting that at least someone doesn't think Americans hold the corner on the market for being grossly rude, crude, and socially inept. Thank you. Sadly, I'm a little encouraged by that.
Your very mistaken there are countrys here that are way more worse then americans i wont say witch countrys most know who they are, but there realy realy bad, and problem is many of those realy bad behaving players hide behind there language and just refuse to speak english.
I rather play on US server then on some servers here in europe and not only for english but most;y for behavior.
If you don't play on servers because some people don't use English, it might be polite to learn English yourself.
BEST: Lotro (Too bad the game and combat didnt interest me), RYZOM (see the comment I made regarding LOTRO) and beleive it or not...WOW. I have a fine time in that game with my guild. Whenever I need a crafter I just ask in trade. Dungeon runs are very polite and decent. I dont know wtf everyone complains about in the WOW community, its full of decent, working individuals for the most part. Sure there are kids, and ignore works just fine. Whenever I have needed advice someone sends a kind whisper with all the info I need. WOW gets a bad rap IMHO.
WORST: EQ2 - the absolute worst community I have ever experienced. Sexist, Racist, spiteful and dramatic. It got so bad it even has a flame website where those cretins can truly express the aforementioned views. And pity the hapless girl that sends pictures to any of the males in that game, if they are compromising they will get posted (especially if his little heart gets broken). Nasty group of conservative racists populate that game.
EVE - too much "I'm too sexy for my ship" leetness. They really need to get over themselves.
1 person call me pussy cause I declined a duel and another person follow me around for 15 minutes, killing every mob I attacked. I actually logged out for about an hour and when I came back he somehow found me and the whole process started again. So, after 7 hours of playing I realized why I quit this games years ago. I have now cancelled my sub and this will be my last look at WoW ever again.
So the guy who was following you and killing mobs you tagged was actually helping you? Since you cant kill steal in WoW
Yes, the level 80 1 shoting every quest mob in the level 10 area around me was be really helpful to me.....hmm........ But even if they were the same level as me and it wasn't kill stealing it still rude as hell. If you want to group you need to ask not just run in and start killing someone's mob. I don't care how you want to word it, it's just plain asshatery. Which is what World of Warcraft is built around.
I guess I just don't get where your coming from. Back in Jan. you said WoW had one of the worst communities http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3331248#3331248 . Now your saying you never had any issues with the game and can't complain. Your also trying to denfend the game or at the very least it's player base.
I don't know I'm confused.........
If he kills mobs that u attacked (like u said), you gain full exp for every mob and quest objectives finished. If he just made all the job for you, why complain?
I didnt say I never had ANY issues with wow. I actually named some issues earlier. It just didn't bother me much since I was in good guild and was focus on other things, then reading global and seeking for help
It's all in the red above. Why would I complain? There's one really simple reason. I don't play an mmo to have someone else play it for me. I'd rather die 15 times trying to complete a quest then have someone come in and complete it from. I think the question should be why wouldn't you get a little upset. Do you prefer the I WIN button? Cause that's what it sounds like to me.
This is exactly what you said:
Cant say bad about WoW. Warsong US server in early vanilla days was great, have alot of great memories. I also found alot of friends on russian Thermoplugg server. Of course there is alot of trashtalk in general chat and nobody willing to help, like in VG or Ryzom. But for WoW veteran it doesnt matter much.
So you can't say anything bad about wow? What about six months ago? Six months ago you said it had one of the worst communities. Look at the hyperlink in my above post if you can't remember. So, my question to you is what changed your prospective in the last six months?
Also, I originally started playing WoW in late 05' until early 08' and was in a good guild focused on raiding and all the crap still shined through. So, saying it doesn't bother veterans is untrue. If you're one of the many it doesn't bother then great! Enjoy your stay. You'll just enjoy it with one else adult player. But don't worry I'm sure there will be plenty of 10 -16 year olds to take my place.
BEST: Lotro (Too bad the game and combat didnt interest me), RYZOM (see the comment I made regarding LOTRO) and beleive it or not...WOW. I have a fine time in that game with my guild. Whenever I need a crafter I just ask in trade. Dungeon runs are very polite and decent. I dont know wtf everyone complains about in the WOW community, its full of decent, working individuals for the most part. Sure there are kids, and ignore works just fine. Whenever I have needed advice someone sends a kind whisper with all the info I need. WOW gets a bad rap IMHO.
WORST: EQ2 - the absolute worst community I have ever experienced. Sexist, Racist, spiteful and dramatic. It got so bad it even has a flame website where those cretins can truly express the aforementioned views. And pity the hapless girl that sends pictures to any of the males in that game, if they are compromising they will get posted (especially if his little heart gets broken). Nasty group of conservative racists populate that game.
EVE - too much "I'm too sexy for my ship" leetness. They really need to get over themselves.
Probly all Tea Party members that voted for Bush.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
BEST: Lotro (Too bad the game and combat didnt interest me), RYZOM (see the comment I made regarding LOTRO) and beleive it or not...WOW. I have a fine time in that game with my guild. Whenever I need a crafter I just ask in trade. Dungeon runs are very polite and decent. I dont know wtf everyone complains about in the WOW community, its full of decent, working individuals for the most part. Sure there are kids, and ignore works just fine. Whenever I have needed advice someone sends a kind whisper with all the info I need. WOW gets a bad rap IMHO.
WORST: EQ2 - the absolute worst community I have ever experienced. Sexist, Racist, spiteful and dramatic. It got so bad it even has a flame website where those cretins can truly express the aforementioned views. And pity the hapless girl that sends pictures to any of the males in that game, if they are compromising they will get posted (especially if his little heart gets broken). Nasty group of conservative racists populate that game.
EVE - too much "I'm too sexy for my ship" leetness. They really need to get over themselves.
Wow I would love to know what EQ2 server you were on. My experience with EQ2 has been the absolute polar opposite. Of course....this is the only game forum I spend any time on and this place can be bad enough. I never go to EQ2 Flames, it's not an official forum for the game, and I've heard it's where the entire asshat portion of the population hangs out, so....why go there??
But your "nasty group of conservative racists, sexists, spiteful, dramatic" comments....just don't describe Everfrost AT ALL. I've played on that same server since Feb. 2005 and it's nothing like that. So...I would be interested to know what server you're talking about, just so I never EVER make the mistake of going there for any reason.
Incidentally...I agree with your assessment of both LotRO and EVE as well. My experiences in those games, for the brief few months I toyed with them both....was similar to what you described.
Worst: The majority of MMOs since '04, or '05. When I left SWG due to the NGE debacle and toyed around with more MMORPGs, I was actually disturbed by how frequently less grouping occured, and when they DO occur, they abruptly get disbanded or members leave without so much as a "Later dudes!" MMORPG player communities are at a point where as soon as the quest is done and your back in a relatively safe area, the members disberse with out even a "Bye." Quite oftenly, people don't say s**t the entire time. That doesn't build a good community, IMO.
Best: Easily, hands down Pre-NGE SWG. The playerbase was good in Pre-WoW standards and respectable numbers even in contrast for today (best it had I think was 200k I think). The community in the differing servers in general were spectacular, partly because of the people and partly because of the game mechanics. My justifications:
* You get a bonus in XP's if adventuring together. In contrast to alot of games these days where you are penalized in XPs because you are in a group.
* Group sizes in Pre-NGE SWG used to allow alot of members. I think it used to allow 10? It's been a while, but you could have alot of names to the left of the screen. Shame SOE nerfed the group sizes.
* There was no tired, old Class + Level System. The Skillpoint / Template system allowed freedom of character builds and skills, but even finalized, you could not retain mastery in everything. That being said, regardless of how specialized or generalized you tried to be, you needed other players for something. Someone else will have a skillset that you lack and would be quite nice to have.
* Pre-NGE SWG used to offer enticing gameplay that WASN'T solely focused on combat. Believe it or not, there were quite a number of people who loved these aspects of the game and did not or barely got into combat at all. A number didn't even put any skillpoints to the most basic combat abilities. Onto the next 2 points:
* Pre-NGE SWG has been the only MMORPG that I have ever come across where there were professions absolutely and totally being Social in nature. Entertainers for example being one. Some can alter the appearance of your character. Some can be Dancers or Musicians, and if you watch / listen to them while they perform, combat players slowly remove "Fatigue" and "Mind Wounds" that they accrued from constrant combat. Cantinas (bars / clubs) in a number of the towns used to be packed with players. There were Entertainers doing their thing, and the Cantina would be filled with visitors hanging out, talking. If you can imagine the most packed Night Club you've visited IRL, that's how it was in a few of these Cantinas. The ones at Coronet, Theed, Bestine, and Mos Eisley were great examples, but Coronet back in the day was by far the most packed on most occasions.
* Crafting in SWG used to be as deep in gameplay as combat, because a certain item will have different stats depending on the crafter's resources, resource quality, tools, character skills, and knowing the in's and out's of the system. There were many players in SWG that were, just like Entertainers, absolutely and totally dedicated to Crafting and being a Merchant. Sometimes, to gather resources at a far flung harvester at a dangerous location, they'd hire combat players to act as escorts.
* Pre-NGE SWG also had a player based economy, not the loot-based travesty it later became due to the NGE. Simply because everything you could possibly need was player crafteable, and there were no loot rewards to speak of. Items also "Decayed" in their condition, and once an item got to zero, it was useless. Stats went down with lower condition. What does this mean as far as community goes? It meant that Crafters were absolutely as essential as anyone in the game. THEY provided for your needs. You visit their shops. In those days you can regularly talk to them and do some wheeling and dealing, even as a combat oriented character. Lots of merchants were around and competition was fierce. This meant fair and competitive pricing. And us combat oriented players got favorite crafters that we eventually came back to for new, replacement gear.
* I also need to stress again how social SWG used to be. Not only were groups the norm (the gameplay didn't FORCE you to group, but we just naturally fell into groups), but they easily last for a long game session. Members TALKED with each other. After achieving a goal / mission, the group didn't disperse into the 4 winds. Quite frequently we stayed together and figured something to do. Usually somebody had something tough or long to do, and we helped each other out. I still recall after years the big hunting groups on the deathworld of Dathomir. Filled with dangerous, big creatures. You'd fly into one of the very few spaceports on the planet, see a bunch of people LFG'ing. "Enraged Rancor grp forming. PST if interested!" You'd go out with that group, lay waste to an area. After a while, you need to rest a bit (bio, listen / watch an entertainer in a group), and a member would build a camp to rest in. The funny part was that sometimes the "rest" can take forever because the group would be sitting there talking to each other for quite possibly a long time, until someone remembers again what you came out for! And BTW, these are PUGs I'm talking about in the old days of SWG.
* Also, the game was, in those days, very newbie friendly. Pre-CU/NGE SWG had quite a bit of a learning curve. The manual was utterly useless, despite it actually being pretty thick (I had the Collector's Ed). I recall having a really tough start, getting incapped / killed frequently as a newbie out in Doerba Goefel, Corellia. When I was out in a nice valley NW of the small town, having a tough time fighting the critters there, a passing by player on a swoop bike saved me from another demise. Afterwards, he talked to me a bit and gave me a few pointers as to how to fight. I also wanted to join the Empire, so he told me Corellia isn't the place for it. Go to Naboo or better yet, Bestine, Tatooine. After much advice, he gave me a nice DL44 pistol and wished me luck... Later when I got better, I'd also in turn help out newbies at Mos Eisley. Other veterans would go out of their way to help them out. Once I got further into the Empire, I used to don my Stormtrooper Armor and go out to Mos Eisley and help out the newbies. New players got a real kick out of seeing a Stormtrooper hep them out. For one, it gave them a hand in learning the game. Secondly, seeing a Stormtrooper screams as much Star Wars as a Lightsaber does.
* RP'ers helped bring some "Star Wars" into the game. I was never a RPer. The game did have hardcore RP servers, but RP guilds were scattered about in regular servers also. A great example on what kind of an experience they brought into the game were some of the more faction oriented RP guilds. There were some Imperial Trooper guilds where while adventuring / "On duty" they can only use Imperial armor or uniforms. Very uniform in appearance, and it was great when these guys rolled into town totally decked out in Stormtrooper Armor. They'd do patrols in Mos Eisley or manning checkpoints. There'd be an event with some of the Rebel RP guilds too.
Pre-NGE SWG's community was the best I ever saw. Due to how the gameplay mechanics were and the people that were there. My friends list in that game was huge and you'd always say what's up when one of your buddies log in. My list in there was easily the largest compared to every MMORPG I have played. Once SOE destroyed the community and I left the game, I have never found another MMORPG that had the same level or better community experience as I had with old school SWG. Even LOTRO, with its community having a good and mature reputation, did not come close to half that experience.
Absolutely agree. SWG-preNGE was just awesome. Seriously...this games community was by far the best I ever encountered next to Planetsides community.
Worst: Tie - World of Warcraft and EVE online.
Yeah...WoW definitely has to many bad people playing it, and so does EVE with their elite and veteran players with their attitudes constantly making the EVE forums and game a very unfriendly place for new players. If you think WoW's official forums are full of arses - then you haven't been to the EVE forums.
BEST: Lotro (Too bad the game and combat didnt interest me), RYZOM (see the comment I made regarding LOTRO) and beleive it or not...WOW. I have a fine time in that game with my guild. Whenever I need a crafter I just ask in trade. Dungeon runs are very polite and decent. I dont know wtf everyone complains about in the WOW community, its full of decent, working individuals for the most part. Sure there are kids, and ignore works just fine. Whenever I have needed advice someone sends a kind whisper with all the info I need. WOW gets a bad rap IMHO.
WORST: EQ2 - the absolute worst community I have ever experienced. Sexist, Racist, spiteful and dramatic. It got so bad it even has a flame website where those cretins can truly express the aforementioned views. And pity the hapless girl that sends pictures to any of the males in that game, if they are compromising they will get posted (especially if his little heart gets broken). Nasty group of conservative racists populate that game.
EVE - too much "I'm too sexy for my ship" leetness. They really need to get over themselves.
Wow I would love to know what EQ2 server you were on. My experience with EQ2 has been the absolute polar opposite. Of course....this is the only game forum I spend any time on and this place can be bad enough. I never go to EQ2 Flames, it's not an official forum for the game, and I've heard it's where the entire asshat portion of the population hangs out, so....why go there??
But your "nasty group of conservative racists, sexists, spiteful, dramatic" comments....just don't describe Everfrost AT ALL. I've played on that same server since Feb. 2005 and it's nothing like that. So...I would be interested to know what server you're talking about, just so I never EVER make the mistake of going there for any reason.
Incidentally...I agree with your assessment of both LotRO and EVE as well. My experiences in those games, for the brief few months I toyed with them both....was similar to what you described.
I started at launch on Befallen then went over to Blackburrow to join a friends guild. We will have to agree to disagree on the community of EQ2. I can tell you so many stories or drama and nonsense that took place on those servers it would easily take of 10 pages in this thread. As far as Flames, its simply the no-holds-barred version of the mud-spewing that goes on in the official server forums and in game. One example: I log on one night to raid and check guild chat only to see the "N" word flying across my screen. I mention that some of us take offense to this kind of thing yet people continue (they are making a joke of it). So I leave the guild explaining to the guild master that I dont like what Im seeing. I leave very respectfully, quietly and just want to move on past these hateful people. Several members of said guild then go through the official forums and try to get me blackballed from other guilds by slandering me. And I was not the only one, so dont just think it was me. This particular guild in question did this to ANYONE that decided to leave their ranks. Bad mouthing, backstabbing, racist rhetoric (in guild chat AND vent) were behaviours I saw in most of the guilds in EQ2. Also because the population has become so low and the game is so top heavy, vying for players makes them even more vicious in their attacks and slander. I resubbed briefly a few months ago to see the expansion and tool with my Defiler for a bit only to be barraged with offers to join guilds. I'd rather push thumbtacs under my nail beds then ever join a guild in that game again.
I could go on, but I won't. Take a look at the flame site and count up the drama. Sure its mostly the cretins and asshats that post regularly on flames, however it does reflect the truth about the hate that goes on in EQ2. Its a mirror to the community altho an extreme one. There are also a large number of unemployed persons that play that game. In contrast my WOW guild has Doctors, IT Managers, ect. Not sure what thats about.
BEST: Lotro (Too bad the game and combat didnt interest me), RYZOM (see the comment I made regarding LOTRO) and beleive it or not...WOW. I have a fine time in that game with my guild. Whenever I need a crafter I just ask in trade. Dungeon runs are very polite and decent. I dont know wtf everyone complains about in the WOW community, its full of decent, working individuals for the most part. Sure there are kids, and ignore works just fine. Whenever I have needed advice someone sends a kind whisper with all the info I need. WOW gets a bad rap IMHO.
WORST: EQ2 - the absolute worst community I have ever experienced. Sexist, Racist, spiteful and dramatic. It got so bad it even has a flame website where those cretins can truly express the aforementioned views. And pity the hapless girl that sends pictures to any of the males in that game, if they are compromising they will get posted (especially if his little heart gets broken). Nasty group of conservative racists populate that game.
EVE - too much "I'm too sexy for my ship" leetness. They really need to get over themselves.
Wow I would love to know what EQ2 server you were on. My experience with EQ2 has been the absolute polar opposite. Of course....this is the only game forum I spend any time on and this place can be bad enough. I never go to EQ2 Flames, it's not an official forum for the game, and I've heard it's where the entire asshat portion of the population hangs out, so....why go there??
But your "nasty group of conservative racists, sexists, spiteful, dramatic" comments....just don't describe Everfrost AT ALL. I've played on that same server since Feb. 2005 and it's nothing like that. So...I would be interested to know what server you're talking about, just so I never EVER make the mistake of going there for any reason.
Incidentally...I agree with your assessment of both LotRO and EVE as well. My experiences in those games, for the brief few months I toyed with them both....was similar to what you described.
I started at launch on Befallen then went over to Blackburrow to join a friends guild. We will have to agree to disagree on the community of EQ2. I can tell you so many stories or drama and nonsense that took place on those servers it would easily take of 10 pages in this thread. As far as Flames, its simply the no-holds-barred version of the mud-spewing that goes on in the official server forums and in game. One example: I log on one night to raid and check guild chat only to see the "N" word flying across my screen. I mention that some of us take offense to this kind of thing yet people continue (they are making a joke of it). So I leave the guild explaining to the guild master that I dont like what Im seeing. I leave very respectfully, quietly and just want to move on past these hateful people. Several members of said guild then go through the official forums and try to get me blackballed from other guilds by slandering me. And I was not the only one, so dont just think it was me. This particular guild in question did this to ANYONE that decided to leave their ranks. Bad mouthing, backstabbing, racist rhetoric (in guild chat AND vent) were behaviours I saw in most of the guilds in EQ2. Also because the population has become so low and the game is so top heavy, vying for players makes them even more vicious in their attacks and slander. I resubbed briefly a few months ago to see the expansion and tool with my Defiler for a bit only to be barraged with offers to join guilds. I'd rather push thumbtacs under my nail beds then ever join a guild in that game again.
I could go on, but I won't. Take a look at the flame site and count up the drama. Sure its mostly the cretins and asshats that post regularly on flames, however it does reflect the truth about the hate that goes on in EQ2. Its a mirror to the community altho an extreme one. There are also a large number of unemployed persons that play that game. In contrast my WOW guild has Doctors, IT Managers, ect. Not sure what thats about.
From what you say...I think I'll pass on the forums.
Sounds to me like you had some terrible experiences on a couple of servers. I don't know....maybe you just have terrible luck? That IS possible, because that truly doesn't reflect what I see on my server at all. I will say that I generally don't leave 1-9 chat checked, and if EQ2 is like most games...those public lower level channels are the worst. So maybe because of that...I don't see the things you're talking about, particularly if they're happening in 1-9 channel.
I don't think you can ever judge the entirety of a game's community (including WoW's, for that matter) by just the absolute worst of the worst. I would have done the SAME THING you did, however, had my experience been the same as yours. I really do think that after a certain amount of time....servers develop sort of individual personalitites based on the people that have made those servers their gaming "home," so to speak.
Another difference in our experiences is that almost everyone in my WoW guild was on disability or unemployed and living with Mom and Dad, even a few in their late 20s and early 30s. There were some college students though. I'm figuring that had to be a fluke. One of the guys was even living with another guild member who had lost ALL patience with him not being able to hold down a job. And it caused some drama in the guild, being that the unemployed roommate was one of the main raid tanks. Not good. I also saw a couple of marriages dissolve over the course of the years, something that, thankfully, hasn't happened to any of my EQ2 guildmates. in part, perhaps, because the couples in our guild...play together.
Like your WoW experience, my guild in EQ2 has several professional people in it, a nurse, a graphic artist, assorted other professions, and a wide variety of relationships represented, including 2 gay couples that have been together a long time, several married heterosexual couples, some college students, although most in the guild are over 30....they all have their own homes, most have children (including one of the gay couples), and several different races are represented. Everyone gets along fantastically, no one seems to get harassed in public chat, and ....well.....there's really just nothing in the community to complain about other than a very few people that are willing to admit that they came over from WoW and seem to have a hard time not talking about WoW, which is generally met with some annoyance in 1-9 general chat, and probably a lot of /ignore. (The WoW banter...is why I no longer read 1-9 chat, actually.) Other than that...I've never had any issues at all. To be fair...our guild has been playing together for years now, so...the fact that members know each other pretty well after all this time, and are careful to invite people that seem fairly well-adjusted...MIGHT be the reason we don't have drama and trauma.
It saddens me a bit that some people can be such downright hateful, despicable beings. I'm really sorry your time in EQ2 sucked so bad, but I can't deny that I am extremely grateful that mine hasn't. If mine had gone like yours....I probably wouldn't even be playing an MMO any more from the post traumatic stress that would have set in from listening to that kind of crap all the time. That's just ridiculous. Does it really take that much maturity just to have some common courtesy and decency? I'm not sure I'll ever understand that. Anyhow....
I hope you'll be able to find SOME game to play that doesn't feel like that for you. That's really awful.
Worst: The majority of MMOs since '04, or '05. When I left SWG due to the NGE debacle and toyed around with more MMORPGs, I was actually disturbed by how frequently less grouping occured, and when they DO occur, they abruptly get disbanded or members leave without so much as a "Later dudes!" MMORPG player communities are at a point where as soon as the quest is done and your back in a relatively safe area, the members disberse with out even a "Bye." Quite oftenly, people don't say s**t the entire time. That doesn't build a good community, IMO.
Best: Easily, hands down Pre-NGE SWG. The playerbase was good in Pre-WoW standards and respectable numbers even in contrast for today (best it had I think was 200k I think). The community in the differing servers in general were spectacular, partly because of the people and partly because of the game mechanics. My justifications:
* You get a bonus in XP's if adventuring together. In contrast to alot of games these days where you are penalized in XPs because you are in a group.
* Group sizes in Pre-NGE SWG used to allow alot of members. I think it used to allow 10? It's been a while, but you could have alot of names to the left of the screen. Shame SOE nerfed the group sizes.
* There was no tired, old Class + Level System. The Skillpoint / Template system allowed freedom of character builds and skills, but even finalized, you could not retain mastery in everything. That being said, regardless of how specialized or generalized you tried to be, you needed other players for something. Someone else will have a skillset that you lack and would be quite nice to have.
* Pre-NGE SWG used to offer enticing gameplay that WASN'T solely focused on combat. Believe it or not, there were quite a number of people who loved these aspects of the game and did not or barely got into combat at all. A number didn't even put any skillpoints to the most basic combat abilities. Onto the next 2 points:
* Pre-NGE SWG has been the only MMORPG that I have ever come across where there were professions absolutely and totally being Social in nature. Entertainers for example being one. Some can alter the appearance of your character. Some can be Dancers or Musicians, and if you watch / listen to them while they perform, combat players slowly remove "Fatigue" and "Mind Wounds" that they accrued from constrant combat. Cantinas (bars / clubs) in a number of the towns used to be packed with players. There were Entertainers doing their thing, and the Cantina would be filled with visitors hanging out, talking. If you can imagine the most packed Night Club you've visited IRL, that's how it was in a few of these Cantinas. The ones at Coronet, Theed, Bestine, and Mos Eisley were great examples, but Coronet back in the day was by far the most packed on most occasions.
* Crafting in SWG used to be as deep in gameplay as combat, because a certain item will have different stats depending on the crafter's resources, resource quality, tools, character skills, and knowing the in's and out's of the system. There were many players in SWG that were, just like Entertainers, absolutely and totally dedicated to Crafting and being a Merchant. Sometimes, to gather resources at a far flung harvester at a dangerous location, they'd hire combat players to act as escorts.
* Pre-NGE SWG also had a player based economy, not the loot-based travesty it later became due to the NGE. Simply because everything you could possibly need was player crafteable, and there were no loot rewards to speak of. Items also "Decayed" in their condition, and once an item got to zero, it was useless. Stats went down with lower condition. What does this mean as far as community goes? It meant that Crafters were absolutely as essential as anyone in the game. THEY provided for your needs. You visit their shops. In those days you can regularly talk to them and do some wheeling and dealing, even as a combat oriented character. Lots of merchants were around and competition was fierce. This meant fair and competitive pricing. And us combat oriented players got favorite crafters that we eventually came back to for new, replacement gear.
* I also need to stress again how social SWG used to be. Not only were groups the norm (the gameplay didn't FORCE you to group, but we just naturally fell into groups), but they easily last for a long game session. Members TALKED with each other. After achieving a goal / mission, the group didn't disperse into the 4 winds. Quite frequently we stayed together and figured something to do. Usually somebody had something tough or long to do, and we helped each other out. I still recall after years the big hunting groups on the deathworld of Dathomir. Filled with dangerous, big creatures. You'd fly into one of the very few spaceports on the planet, see a bunch of people LFG'ing. "Enraged Rancor grp forming. PST if interested!" You'd go out with that group, lay waste to an area. After a while, you need to rest a bit (bio, listen / watch an entertainer in a group), and a member would build a camp to rest in. The funny part was that sometimes the "rest" can take forever because the group would be sitting there talking to each other for quite possibly a long time, until someone remembers again what you came out for! And BTW, these are PUGs I'm talking about in the old days of SWG.
* Also, the game was, in those days, very newbie friendly. Pre-CU/NGE SWG had quite a bit of a learning curve. The manual was utterly useless, despite it actually being pretty thick (I had the Collector's Ed). I recall having a really tough start, getting incapped / killed frequently as a newbie out in Doerba Goefel, Corellia. When I was out in a nice valley NW of the small town, having a tough time fighting the critters there, a passing by player on a swoop bike saved me from another demise. Afterwards, he talked to me a bit and gave me a few pointers as to how to fight. I also wanted to join the Empire, so he told me Corellia isn't the place for it. Go to Naboo or better yet, Bestine, Tatooine. After much advice, he gave me a nice DL44 pistol and wished me luck... Later when I got better, I'd also in turn help out newbies at Mos Eisley. Other veterans would go out of their way to help them out. Once I got further into the Empire, I used to don my Stormtrooper Armor and go out to Mos Eisley and help out the newbies. New players got a real kick out of seeing a Stormtrooper hep them out. For one, it gave them a hand in learning the game. Secondly, seeing a Stormtrooper screams as much Star Wars as a Lightsaber does.
* RP'ers helped bring some "Star Wars" into the game. I was never a RPer. The game did have hardcore RP servers, but RP guilds were scattered about in regular servers also. A great example on what kind of an experience they brought into the game were some of the more faction oriented RP guilds. There were some Imperial Trooper guilds where while adventuring / "On duty" they can only use Imperial armor or uniforms. Very uniform in appearance, and it was great when these guys rolled into town totally decked out in Stormtrooper Armor. They'd do patrols in Mos Eisley or manning checkpoints. There'd be an event with some of the Rebel RP guilds too.
Pre-NGE SWG's community was the best I ever saw. Due to how the gameplay mechanics were and the people that were there. My friends list in that game was huge and you'd always say what's up when one of your buddies log in. My list in there was easily the largest compared to every MMORPG I have played. Once SOE destroyed the community and I left the game, I have never found another MMORPG that had the same level or better community experience as I had with old school SWG. Even LOTRO, with its community having a good and mature reputation, did not come close to half that experience.
The topic was: best and worst community, not why do you like SWG per whatever patch
Have to agree with most of the people here WoW has the worst community by far. I played for about 7 hours this week. In those 7 hours I had 1 person call me pussy cause I declined a duel and another person follow me around for 15 minutes, killing every mob I attacked. I actually logged out for about an hour and when I came back he somehow found me and the whole process started again. So, after 7 hours of playing I realized why I quit this games years ago. I have now cancelled my sub and this will be my last look at WoW ever again.
I dont know what you have done before the guy start following you but you did something, i cant beleive he would just follow you because you refused a duel. And after 15 min why havent you just duel the guy ? i mean he was a kid... let the kid win and he would have left you alone.
Just for you to remember we are speaking about COMMUNITIES not single person that folowed you, he doesnt represent the community at all. Good for you if you are happy hating WOW, but if everyone left a game because something bugs em off atfer 15 min noone would play mmos.
Best: Eve in corp like situations. Wow in guild like situations, Shadowbane RP server.
Worst: MO, Eve in gankfest situation, Wow in general/trade chat.
Im not sure tho that we can figure out the complete community of a game and make a realistic decision about it. Some games have multy server other have a very wide world but somehow we cant see all of it before it has changed. In every game there are some places you can enjoy and how fast you find them may be how you judge the community of the game.
This is a hard one for me [hence why it took so long to post here as i had to think about it].
Best for me is between 2 games my first one was Final Fantasy. There were loads of helpfull people who were happy to groupe with me and help. And there were many who were happy to answer my questions. And i had no need to block many people for spam as it was largly limited to market areas. Dont play it now tho as my second best EvE i like more [not for community reasons].
In EvE Its community was very helpfull [this was before a tutorial existed] And not only answered my questions but also donated cash and ships for me to use!!!!!!
Right now tho things have changed. For a newbie to get a posotive welcome to eve like i did you need to do the tutorial which will teach you the basics reason being is that the questions it answeres annoy a lot of those who like to help noobies. And there are many who do want to help but not doing the tutorial just gives a perception of a impatient or lazy gamer. This can be unfare tho as most newcommers are used to a Themepark mmo like wow where everything is easy. In EDvE its basicaly about thinking outside the box. anyway if you did the tutorial things get better it is then you join a player run corperation which is where you begine to move foward with your corpmates helping you teaching you and giving you free stuff.
Communit wise Final fantasy is good because its easy and full of good people. EvE is good because the corp system creates very strong ties between players and between the many mini communities in the game.....it is hardr to begine with tho.
The worst for me is also split between 2 games the best of the worst was wow. It is easier to get into but its full of unhelpfull people who like to insult you for being a Noob!!!! Also lots of spamming. Also grouping outside a guild is hard. And many guilds are not very forgiving. My second choice is Neocron....its just bad.
I almost posted Guildwars but then i remembered its not a MMO.
Another great example of Moore's Law. Give people access to that much space (developers and users alike) and they'll find uses for it that you can never imagine. "640K ought to be enough for anybody" - Bill Gates 1981
WoW has and will always have (at least until WoW 2 gets released) the worst community of the pay to play MMORPGs.
I have never experienced any really good community in any of the MMORPGs that I have played but that was probably because I was getting in too late when all the good people were long gone (Anarchy Online and EverQuest II) so I am hopeful that one day I will meet some nice people on the internet.
Edit: spelling
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.
Comments
If he kills mobs that u attacked (like u said), you gain full exp for every mob and quest objectives finished. If he just made all the job for you, why complain?
I didnt say I never had ANY issues with wow. I actually named some issues earlier. It just didn't bother me much since I was in good guild and was focus on other things, then reading global and seeking for help
QFT
You've echoed my experience with ye olde SWG. Easily the best community in any game I have ever played.
Best: Pre-NGE SWG - no contest. Ryzom had a nice community. LOTRO is a mix bag as is EQ2, but on the whole they are more mature than most.
Worst: WoW is pretty bad. There are good people there but they're drowning in a sea of turds. Aion's community leaves a lot to be desired too. I also have to mention the FFXIV Beta community. Very hostile, rude and unfriendly. I really hope it's not a glimps into the community's future.
Man... you really make me jealous of the people who experienced this... Although I do think some of it is influenced by nostalgia, it still sounds awesome.
Best: any p2p with a decent niche group that you can hang out with... It's really a hit or miss on this one, considering you have to find a group of people amongst a HUGE puddle of mess. I personally found my first amongst WoW players, mostly during vanilla and BC, most left, I stayed.
Worst: any f2p, while I was a f2p lover at one time, after being spoiled by the community of people I found in other MMOs... I just became afraid of anyone I encountered in f2p... and what's a game without a community to rely on?
Best: Pre-NGE SWG and EQ1
Worst: WoW and Eve
I would wager that the reason your experience wasn't as bad IS indeed because Europeans are generally not such utter asshats as many American children and young adults these days. I'm guessing here, but I'm betting that has something to do with it. Rudeness...has become an American trademark, sadly.
On North American servers you are forced to share servers with a cornucopia of children and young adults that have had no active parenting in their lives, for one, and have grown up with the internet anonymity blanket to protect them from their own vile behavior having any real consequences. Theyve been raised with "freedom of speech" being preached to them more than common decency and compassion, and have been taught that you put yourself FIRST....always. Many of them know nothing of sharing, being helpful and considerate, or putting aside one's own desires to benefit another human being....not even for a few seconds. When you're raised with that sort of narcissistic mentality being rewarded as being "bold and honest" (honest...what a joke) then you tend to turn into a real shithead of an adult. We are right NOW seeing the repercussions of not disciplining children and allowing them to just do whatever they like, regardless of the impact on others or even themselves.
That only works if he actually tapped the mobs before the higher level kill them. Even then, he would only get a fraction on the experience based on the damage he did to the mob, to prevent exploting. He would still get quest credit, but still quite a bit less than if he were to just kill the mobs on his own. Besides, some people actually prefer to be challenged by gameplay rather than be lead around and powerleveled with minimal effort. Shocking, I know.
Your very mistaken there are countrys here that are way more worse then americans i wont say witch countrys most know who they are, but there realy realy bad, and problem is many of those realy bad behaving players hide behind there language and just refuse to speak english.
I rather play on US server then on some servers here in europe and not only for english but most;y for behavior.
Darkfall have some realy bad european players way worse then the US server thats what ive heared so far from some US friends i meet on mirc about behavior on theres.
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
Seems like this thread pops up on this site every so often....I guess I'll play again...
Best: LotRO - Simply a helpful and friendly community. I have really enjoyed my time in Middle Earth thanks in part to the community who share my adventures.
Best Runner-Up: CoH/V - In a team centric game, it really helps if the community is mature. With CoH, you get a helpful, fun, and mature community that makes teaming a blast.
Worst: WoW - With a larger community you apparently get bigger arses. The main reason I left the game was because the community was so bad. Coming from a game like CoH, to a game like WoW was a shock. I went from a game with one of the best communities, to one with the worst.
Right-on, I agree with all this, which is why when I am walking through the mall, and see those snot nosed little shitheads roaming around at 12yrs old in groups of 5, cursing up a storm and trying to look all hard, I walk right up to the group, look the meanest one in the eye and ask...
"What did the 5 fingers say to the face?"
SLAP!!!
Little basterds. I absolutely hate american youth.
To those very VERY small percent of american youth who are actually kind and polite. I apologize and would like to shake your parents hands.
To the rest, yes they deserve to die, and I hope they burn in hell!
Actually...it's oddly comforting that at least someone doesn't think Americans hold the corner on the market for being grossly rude, crude, and socially inept. Thank you. Sadly, I'm a little encouraged by that.
Best: LotRO
Worst: Mortal Online, or maybe DarkFall
If you don't play on servers because some people don't use English, it might be polite to learn English yourself.
BEST: Lotro (Too bad the game and combat didnt interest me), RYZOM (see the comment I made regarding LOTRO) and beleive it or not...WOW. I have a fine time in that game with my guild. Whenever I need a crafter I just ask in trade. Dungeon runs are very polite and decent. I dont know wtf everyone complains about in the WOW community, its full of decent, working individuals for the most part. Sure there are kids, and ignore works just fine. Whenever I have needed advice someone sends a kind whisper with all the info I need. WOW gets a bad rap IMHO.
WORST: EQ2 - the absolute worst community I have ever experienced. Sexist, Racist, spiteful and dramatic. It got so bad it even has a flame website where those cretins can truly express the aforementioned views. And pity the hapless girl that sends pictures to any of the males in that game, if they are compromising they will get posted (especially if his little heart gets broken). Nasty group of conservative racists populate that game.
EVE - too much "I'm too sexy for my ship" leetness. They really need to get over themselves.
Current Games: WOW, EVE Online
It's all in the red above. Why would I complain? There's one really simple reason. I don't play an mmo to have someone else play it for me. I'd rather die 15 times trying to complete a quest then have someone come in and complete it from. I think the question should be why wouldn't you get a little upset. Do you prefer the I WIN button? Cause that's what it sounds like to me.
This is exactly what you said:
Cant say bad about WoW. Warsong US server in early vanilla days was great, have alot of great memories. I also found alot of friends on russian Thermoplugg server. Of course there is alot of trashtalk in general chat and nobody willing to help, like in VG or Ryzom. But for WoW veteran it doesnt matter much.
So you can't say anything bad about wow? What about six months ago? Six months ago you said it had one of the worst communities. Look at the hyperlink in my above post if you can't remember. So, my question to you is what changed your prospective in the last six months?
Also, I originally started playing WoW in late 05' until early 08' and was in a good guild focused on raiding and all the crap still shined through. So, saying it doesn't bother veterans is untrue. If you're one of the many it doesn't bother then great! Enjoy your stay. You'll just enjoy it with one else adult player. But don't worry I'm sure there will be plenty of 10 -16 year olds to take my place.
Probly all Tea Party members that voted for Bush.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Wow I would love to know what EQ2 server you were on. My experience with EQ2 has been the absolute polar opposite. Of course....this is the only game forum I spend any time on and this place can be bad enough. I never go to EQ2 Flames, it's not an official forum for the game, and I've heard it's where the entire asshat portion of the population hangs out, so....why go there??
But your "nasty group of conservative racists, sexists, spiteful, dramatic" comments....just don't describe Everfrost AT ALL. I've played on that same server since Feb. 2005 and it's nothing like that. So...I would be interested to know what server you're talking about, just so I never EVER make the mistake of going there for any reason.
Incidentally...I agree with your assessment of both LotRO and EVE as well. My experiences in those games, for the brief few months I toyed with them both....was similar to what you described.
Absolutely agree. SWG-preNGE was just awesome. Seriously...this games community was by far the best I ever encountered next to Planetsides community.
Worst: Tie - World of Warcraft and EVE online.
Yeah...WoW definitely has to many bad people playing it, and so does EVE with their elite and veteran players with their attitudes constantly making the EVE forums and game a very unfriendly place for new players. If you think WoW's official forums are full of arses - then you haven't been to the EVE forums.
I started at launch on Befallen then went over to Blackburrow to join a friends guild. We will have to agree to disagree on the community of EQ2. I can tell you so many stories or drama and nonsense that took place on those servers it would easily take of 10 pages in this thread. As far as Flames, its simply the no-holds-barred version of the mud-spewing that goes on in the official server forums and in game. One example: I log on one night to raid and check guild chat only to see the "N" word flying across my screen. I mention that some of us take offense to this kind of thing yet people continue (they are making a joke of it). So I leave the guild explaining to the guild master that I dont like what Im seeing. I leave very respectfully, quietly and just want to move on past these hateful people. Several members of said guild then go through the official forums and try to get me blackballed from other guilds by slandering me. And I was not the only one, so dont just think it was me. This particular guild in question did this to ANYONE that decided to leave their ranks. Bad mouthing, backstabbing, racist rhetoric (in guild chat AND vent) were behaviours I saw in most of the guilds in EQ2. Also because the population has become so low and the game is so top heavy, vying for players makes them even more vicious in their attacks and slander. I resubbed briefly a few months ago to see the expansion and tool with my Defiler for a bit only to be barraged with offers to join guilds. I'd rather push thumbtacs under my nail beds then ever join a guild in that game again.
I could go on, but I won't. Take a look at the flame site and count up the drama. Sure its mostly the cretins and asshats that post regularly on flames, however it does reflect the truth about the hate that goes on in EQ2. Its a mirror to the community altho an extreme one. There are also a large number of unemployed persons that play that game. In contrast my WOW guild has Doctors, IT Managers, ect. Not sure what thats about.
Current Games: WOW, EVE Online
From what you say...I think I'll pass on the forums.
Sounds to me like you had some terrible experiences on a couple of servers. I don't know....maybe you just have terrible luck? That IS possible, because that truly doesn't reflect what I see on my server at all. I will say that I generally don't leave 1-9 chat checked, and if EQ2 is like most games...those public lower level channels are the worst. So maybe because of that...I don't see the things you're talking about, particularly if they're happening in 1-9 channel.
I don't think you can ever judge the entirety of a game's community (including WoW's, for that matter) by just the absolute worst of the worst. I would have done the SAME THING you did, however, had my experience been the same as yours. I really do think that after a certain amount of time....servers develop sort of individual personalitites based on the people that have made those servers their gaming "home," so to speak.
Another difference in our experiences is that almost everyone in my WoW guild was on disability or unemployed and living with Mom and Dad, even a few in their late 20s and early 30s. There were some college students though. I'm figuring that had to be a fluke. One of the guys was even living with another guild member who had lost ALL patience with him not being able to hold down a job. And it caused some drama in the guild, being that the unemployed roommate was one of the main raid tanks. Not good. I also saw a couple of marriages dissolve over the course of the years, something that, thankfully, hasn't happened to any of my EQ2 guildmates. in part, perhaps, because the couples in our guild...play together.
Like your WoW experience, my guild in EQ2 has several professional people in it, a nurse, a graphic artist, assorted other professions, and a wide variety of relationships represented, including 2 gay couples that have been together a long time, several married heterosexual couples, some college students, although most in the guild are over 30....they all have their own homes, most have children (including one of the gay couples), and several different races are represented. Everyone gets along fantastically, no one seems to get harassed in public chat, and ....well.....there's really just nothing in the community to complain about other than a very few people that are willing to admit that they came over from WoW and seem to have a hard time not talking about WoW, which is generally met with some annoyance in 1-9 general chat, and probably a lot of /ignore. (The WoW banter...is why I no longer read 1-9 chat, actually.) Other than that...I've never had any issues at all. To be fair...our guild has been playing together for years now, so...the fact that members know each other pretty well after all this time, and are careful to invite people that seem fairly well-adjusted...MIGHT be the reason we don't have drama and trauma.
It saddens me a bit that some people can be such downright hateful, despicable beings. I'm really sorry your time in EQ2 sucked so bad, but I can't deny that I am extremely grateful that mine hasn't. If mine had gone like yours....I probably wouldn't even be playing an MMO any more from the post traumatic stress that would have set in from listening to that kind of crap all the time. That's just ridiculous. Does it really take that much maturity just to have some common courtesy and decency? I'm not sure I'll ever understand that. Anyhow....
I hope you'll be able to find SOME game to play that doesn't feel like that for you. That's really awful.
The topic was: best and worst community, not why do you like SWG per whatever patch
I dont know what you have done before the guy start following you but you did something, i cant beleive he would just follow you because you refused a duel. And after 15 min why havent you just duel the guy ? i mean he was a kid... let the kid win and he would have left you alone.
Just for you to remember we are speaking about COMMUNITIES not single person that folowed you, he doesnt represent the community at all. Good for you if you are happy hating WOW, but if everyone left a game because something bugs em off atfer 15 min noone would play mmos.
Best: Eve in corp like situations. Wow in guild like situations, Shadowbane RP server.
Worst: MO, Eve in gankfest situation, Wow in general/trade chat.
Im not sure tho that we can figure out the complete community of a game and make a realistic decision about it. Some games have multy server other have a very wide world but somehow we cant see all of it before it has changed. In every game there are some places you can enjoy and how fast you find them may be how you judge the community of the game.
This is a hard one for me [hence why it took so long to post here as i had to think about it].
Best for me is between 2 games my first one was Final Fantasy. There were loads of helpfull people who were happy to groupe with me and help. And there were many who were happy to answer my questions. And i had no need to block many people for spam as it was largly limited to market areas. Dont play it now tho as my second best EvE i like more [not for community reasons].
In EvE Its community was very helpfull [this was before a tutorial existed] And not only answered my questions but also donated cash and ships for me to use!!!!!!
Right now tho things have changed. For a newbie to get a posotive welcome to eve like i did you need to do the tutorial which will teach you the basics reason being is that the questions it answeres annoy a lot of those who like to help noobies. And there are many who do want to help but not doing the tutorial just gives a perception of a impatient or lazy gamer. This can be unfare tho as most newcommers are used to a Themepark mmo like wow where everything is easy. In EDvE its basicaly about thinking outside the box. anyway if you did the tutorial things get better it is then you join a player run corperation which is where you begine to move foward with your corpmates helping you teaching you and giving you free stuff.
Communit wise Final fantasy is good because its easy and full of good people. EvE is good because the corp system creates very strong ties between players and between the many mini communities in the game.....it is hardr to begine with tho.
The worst for me is also split between 2 games the best of the worst was wow. It is easier to get into but its full of unhelpfull people who like to insult you for being a Noob!!!! Also lots of spamming. Also grouping outside a guild is hard. And many guilds are not very forgiving. My second choice is Neocron....its just bad.
I almost posted Guildwars but then i remembered its not a MMO.
Another great example of Moore's Law. Give people access to that much space (developers and users alike) and they'll find uses for it that you can never imagine. "640K ought to be enough for anybody" - Bill Gates 1981
WoW has and will always have (at least until WoW 2 gets released) the worst community of the pay to play MMORPGs.
I have never experienced any really good community in any of the MMORPGs that I have played but that was probably because I was getting in too late when all the good people were long gone (Anarchy Online and EverQuest II) so I am hopeful that one day I will meet some nice people on the internet.
Edit: spelling
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.