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Anyone NOT want assassin?
Draanimrev
Member Posts: 13
Stealth classes are garbage. Especially in a game that strives to have competitive PvP. Yes GW implemented it better than most, but nonetheless, the ability to become invisible and pop up unseen somewhere else is still a crappy mechanic.
Its odd for me to even say this. I have always liked the shady shadowy rogue type characters. But sadly the MMO implementation has always been horrible. They have been unable to figure out a way to implement sneakiness effectively so they just take the easy way out and let them become completely invisible.
Assassin is pretty much a forgone conclusion to be in the game. So hoping they arent is a moot point. But lets just hope that in a game that strives to innovate, they find a way to preseve the stealthy rogue like nature of the assassin without resorting to the old cheap stand by of invisibility.
Comments
Did you like shadow stepping? Because that might still be in the game.
This is not a game.
i would rather have a more thief like class then a straight up assassin, but its not really up to me.
but in the end as long as balance happens I do not care if assassin is in GW2
I personally don't want the assassin to be in the game.
The only problem I have with it, is that everyone will play it. These types of classes are always the most populated, especially in pvp.
If it's more of a thief class that isn't fully lethal, mainly supports the group through CCs and sneak attacks with shadow stepping, then I'd like it.
God I hope gw1 assassin's aren't in gw2. Balance wise they were terrible although not as bad as the usual stealth mechanic still pretty bad for matches like ab. It took next to no skill to play and the entire mechanic was basically gank and run away. It's going to be so freaking annoying for WvW if they are implemented.
I think there will be something similar, but I don't think the exact same things is going to be in GW2. If you look at the games style, they're isn't really anything sneaky in the Tyrian continent's lore. There will probably be a rougelike class but not really like the assasin, if that makes sense.
Stealth classes are okay as long as other classes have a defense against them....
I allways loved how stealth classes trie to solo my necromancer in DAoC ... guaranteed win.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Assassins in guild wars 1 didnt have stealth, but used a 'teleport' mechanic. They werent that much of a 'gank' class but more of 'strategic melee hitters'.
Some combos obliterated them, out of my head, hammer specced rangers, war/monks, necros, my boon/prot monk also wasnt very much afraid them and could survive alot till one of the aforementioned classes came around. A well played mesmer on the other hand ... yikes.
Assassin in GW didn't had stealth. GW is probably the only multiplayer game that made Assassins right. And yes, I don't like stealth either. It makes many complicated tasks way too simple.
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Assassins will be in GW2, no facts, I just kow it...it just incomprehensible without that profession.
About stealth, bleh, I hate that mechanic, I'm sure ArenaNet does too that's why the assassin profession has shadowstep instead.
If you read the novel "Ghosts of Ascalon", you get a sneak peak at what profession might be in the game.
Ready for GW2!!!
If it's balanced I suppose it isn't a big deal.
I will say that stealth classes are easily the lamest. That's right even lamer than Templars/Paladins with plate armor, dps, and self heals.
Generally the kind of person that gravitates towards stealth is usually why people don't like stealth classes.
Stealth mechanic is like flying mechanic, ppl would go crazy at the notion of an ability like that, thinking it only to be for themselves of course ; ) But I agree, balancing comes first and if it can be implemented in that respect, then no problem, otherwise much like flying it could deteriate everything else.
Personally it would be nice if ArenaNet stepped up to this challenge as well and were able to give it a "twist":
EG: Camouflage (invisible when still) but fluid when moving (aka predator cloak) or even Impersonate, touch a character and be able to take their skin for a time.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
Invisibility without timers is terrible, there i've said it.
Camouflage, hide in shadows, smoke bombs, whatever, it's fine...but not invisibilty.
Other then that, assassin, duelist, whatever seems fine.
There's was a discussion on GW2G similar to this. Only it was about how to balance the stealth mechanic. The proposal was that stealth only made the dot on the mini-map disappear. The idea is that the assassin, rogue, thief, or other similar professions should rely on tactic rather than invisibility. Basically create realistic dummies, traps, etc. The closest we got to stealth was possibly camoflague while standing still. However, anyone that got close was able to see you, but not so close that you were instantly able to attack them.
Could have an AoC type stealth, where you have a light meter.
^
THIS
Anybody who knows me, knows that I am crazy about stealthy, assassin-like classes. They are always my first avatars, and forever my main in just about every RPG and MMORPG I've played. And anybody who just makes a blind assumption that I'm automatically some kind of prick simply because I prefer those types of classes, you're just saying more about yourself than you are about me. Nuff said there.
However, even I can admit that the invisibility mechanic can be pretty cheap sometimes. Getting a taste of your own medicine (or poison?) can teach you that there may need to be some changes in this class. Stealth does not equal invisibility. Being an assassin SHOULD BE about strategy and seeking to gain the tactical advantage in a battle, leading to efficient killing while sustaining the least amount of damage. IMHO, there should be more of a heavier reliance upon tools and careful planning rather than on some magical power to render myself invisible by doing nothing more than turning it on and off like a switch. It seems too arcane if you ask me.
In fact, it would make much more sense to me for a mage or wizard to be able to go invisible than a rogue-like class, whether through using their innate powers, or by drinking some kind of magical potion. However, imagine a game having a very expensive potion in the game which allows players (of any class) to go invisible for a very short period of time. Ok now, let's say this is the only manner by which one could become invisible. While assassins, with their high opening melee damage would be able to take serious advantage of such an item, it still would not be limited to only one particular class. Any thoughts on this, guys?
One other thing to add is that DDO's stealth seemed to be pretty interesting, because it required that you actually use the shadows, and your chance of detection would increase while you were moving (even while moving within the shadows). While DDO wasn't my favorite MMO, I must admit that I did at least appreciate DDO's take on stealth.
Look, all I'm saying is that there are many creative ways to produce a stealthy class without resorting to the same ole cookie cutter invisibility mechanic that so many other MMO's keep regurgitating. Don't just go and throw out the baby with the bath water on this one, friends.
"Everyone dies. It is how one lives that matters."
Artemis Entreri (R.A. Salvatore)
"P.S. MAKE NO DEALS WITH THE WOLF." -Durzo Blint-
"But, there is one they fear.
In their tongue, he is Dovahkiin -- Dragonborn!" -Game of the Century-
I agree with the conclusion of the dot on the mini-map disappear, but i think they should implement the camouflage (in the sense of beeing really invisible while standing still) too. IMO, the camouflage should be always active while standing still, but when the player moves or is attacked he loses the camouflage and it takes a lot of resources (Mp) to have camouflage again, leaving that skill to be a big risk to use more than once while fighting. The Shadow Step should be in GW2 too.
BUT Having this 3 stealth mechanics needs some kind of balance with other players. I think the balance should take the example of the game Alien VS Predator, or the anime Naruto, in other words and referring to GW2, there should be a way that other professions or all races have different habilities to sense they are in danger or beeing watched. More in detail:
Professions
Warrior - "spider-man" sense, knowing they are in danger or beeing watch but dont know where that comes from, and it has a limited range.
Elementalist - needs to use a skill to search for life force around him, but it has the disadvantage of beeing standing still and it needs Mp to work (not much though... but the longer they use, the more Mp they lose)
Ranger - His pets sense they are beeing watched or are in danger and know if the danger comes from East/West/North/South, having a limited rage too. But without the pets he is much vulnerable.
(there are classes missing, so I don't know the rest of them).
OR
Races
Human - Dont know what they can have, so I think this is the only race that can have the "professions anti-stealth" mechanics i talked earlier. In other words, they rely too much on their classes. (PS: maybe a bad idea though -.-")
Norn - They have the "spider-sense" i told earlier that warrior has. But when they change into an animal, their sense gets stronger, knowing exactly the way the enemy is coming from. Disadvantages: limited range, having to change in order to know where the enemy is coming from.
Charr - They have the "spider-sense" too, but with a much longer range (zoom out in mini-map) and their sense gets them to know if the danger comes from East/West/North/South (but don't know where the enemy exactly is).
Asura - They have a special item used only by their races that let them know if there are enemies in front of them (with colours, like the predator with his vision in AVP), of course changing to that vision really implies the overall vision to be really bad, so its bad for combat.
Sylvari - The same as the elementalist. OR (another idea) they can have warnings from the nature itself (voices from trees), giving them the knowledge of where the enemy is coming from. Disadvantages: In a desert and under-water their senses are limited.
Anyone has any thoughs and better solutions for my thoughs??? What do you think of them???
This idea implies having more balance between players and need more strategies because of the kind of players we have (considering their races). And a player should be able to chose (in the beguining or while lvling) whether they want to have their "danger sense" be more stronger or not.
Anything that is innately better on a particular race (i.e. charr can detect stealth better) is a big no no, you pick a race because you like them, or their story, not because you have to to stop yourself being ganked by some stealth noob (incidentally, this is the approach anet are taking). Basically i don't think the assassin will have any form of invisibility, and the 'not appear on mini map' skill would be useless in pve. Arenanet are very against deadwood skills this time around
Although i like my thoughts (of course lol), I think you really do have a point there! -.-"
But what i wanted to do is just give different ways of detecting stealth, danger or enemies in order to give the feeling that there's no "better" choice when they chose their race, just different sensing abillities with the same end. I mean, the heroes in movies, animes, etc., can always feel they are beeing watched or in danger. Who doesnt want that? That's a hell of an epic feature!
Everyone knows that get invisible is what a lot of players most like in games, so I was looking for a choice where they can still become invisible (with a lot of restrictions of course) and the classes/races have different epic abilities (but balanced between them) in order to have balance between this 2 features.
But I guess youre right, this is too much of a work to do when maybe nothing of this can contribute much for PVE. But with the Dynamic Even System (groups of bandits, rogues and sentries appearing from nowhere) they can have some utility too, not that much compared with PVP though.