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Overall Impression So Far
bookworm438
Member Posts: 647
Title says it all. This has only been day one of gamescom, day one of the videos. What has been your impression so far? Did you like it? Hate it? Give us your honest opinion about it. Just make sure you back it up with proof, otherwise you'll be seen as a troll.
For a list of all GW2 gamescom related info:
http://www.guildwars2guru.com/forum/this-gamescom-compilation-information-streaming-t6651.html
As for me, I look forward to GW2. I think it still needs a lot of work, but considering this is an impressive quality game for not even being in beta, all the problems are understandable. I feel that Anet actually delivered on all their promises, maybe not to the point where the players hyped it up, but they did deliver. I think the player disappointment is due to their own fault, for blowing what Anet said way out of proportion. So overall, I give this a thumbs up.
Criticisms:
~ The UI. I disliked it, but that's just me. I hope they give us more options in customizing the UI. I prefer a cleaner UI. though the brush streak for the warm-up bar was interesting. Obviously this will still change a lot between now and release.
~ Event alert. I hope that goes before launch, or at least give us an option to turn it off. I think part of the fun will be actually discovering the events for ourselves.
~ Combat seems a little slow from the videos. However, this could just be because they are videos.
Again, I give this a thumbs up and looking forward to buying this on release.
So what about you guys?
EDIT: Let's keep the flame wars out of this thread. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. This thread is just for stating your overall opinion about the game so far...what you liked, disliked. Little corrections on misinformed statements is good...just let's not call someone a moron for saying it.
Comments
"~ Combat seems a little slow from the videos. However, this could just be because they are videos."
IMO it has to do with the fact that these people had no clue of the game^^
im pretty sure i saw one video with a guy who actually kept moving, dodging stuff with rolling and so on instead of standing and spamming 1
oh and i hate the fact that there are consumables, but have enough confidence in anet to beleive they can pull it off
For nearly two centuries the Trolloc Wars had ravaged the length and breadth of the world, and wherever battles raged, the Red Eagle banner of Manetheren was in the forefront. The men of Manetheren were a thorn to the Dark One's foot and a bramble to his hand. Sing of Mantheren, that would never bend knee to the Shadow. Sing of Manetheren, the sword that could not be broken.
I haven't weeded through every bit of info/every video, but judging by this, they might just meet my expectations!
I'll vote when Gamescon is over ^^
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkY3y0A8xac
watch this video. As someone said in the comments: Finally,? someone? who actually looks like he knows how to play the game.
Combat feels much faster here.
The game definately met my expectations. A bit of final polish here and there and its a must buy.
Yeah I didn't see that when I posted this :P. Perhaps, they have taken the needing skill part a bit further. I'm also sure the combat will be a lot faster in PvP.
I agree about the consumables, not so sure about them. However, Anet may be able to actually pull them off. They pulled everything else off so far. http://www.guildwars2guru.com/forum/showpost.php?p=274477&postcount=1003
A post from someone who was there. He'll be giving more of a review tomorrow i guess.
Just a quickie: Games rarely undergo any huge transformation during beta anymore. Beta is used for stress test, final bug fixing and small tweaks. So don't expect a game to change or fix larger gameplay issues just because "it's not even beta yet".
So far, it looks like it should give wow a run for its money, as do 5+ other MMOs slated for 2011.
Played it today at their booth and in short: I liked it overall. Since RIFT and TERA where just next to GW2, I'll draw some comparisons.
Setup
You did not play the entire game, but they sat up a scene/zone/scenario where you had to defend a village in danger (humans and the now known classes). And another one, meant for higher level where you play a Charr where you start in a sort of keep near a desert. The character customistion was disabled, but you could pick other options. Humans had origin, background story and a sort of "characterisation" plus a sort of patron god/ess -- always three choices, except the gods (five or so). The charr had essentially the same stuff, but instead of background story they had the legions, different gods etc.
The presentation looked good to me. The style is pretty much like the one of the website and trailers, very consistent, earthy colored brush-stroke style with 3D art combined, painted-looking icons and so forth.
Questing
There were quests and events. The events were announced in the upper right corner with some steps what to do or where to go, similar to a quest tracker. The event was about centaurs attacking a village with nearby castle. You see them coming all over the place and so you can just jump right in and fend them off. This looked a bit more dynamic than in usual MMORPGs where mobs tend be static or fake move around in small paths. The centaurs moved around and attacked anyone. All players naturally joined in. The idea that players work together panned out really well (in that demo at least, since everyone was either playing this zone or the charr one). Additionally, there were quest givers marked with a green icon above their heads. They give you a short briefing what do that matched the event. In this case the soldier dude wanted me to rescue villagers, which was exactly like MMORPG quests -- you find them, you click on them, you get the point and they run off. You have to do this with 3 of them. So the quest did complement the event so there was no big reading involved. I saw that some quests were presented in full screen dialogue mode, looking similar in style as the GW2 trailers (a montage with a letterbox made from wide brush strokes and characters in 3D saying something).
After some more time of centaur killing, the event was updated and I had to go into the castle. The gate closed right before my nose (literally), so I was left outside and killed a few centurs coming my direction. The gate then opened again and I could get in, proceeding with centaur killing. They drop dead really quickly after a few attacks. Then it was announced that a boss would appear (again same upper right corner and I guess as sys-msg in the center screen). The boss didn't look dramatically different, if at all. He was quickly defeated, where he would run off and summon a large earth elemental on the field -- this was actually shown, debris and dust coming out of the ground. This combat scene though was pretty much exactly like regular MMORPGs. I basically stood next to the elementals toe and button-mashed number keys until it collapsed. Then the demo ended.
The approach with the events worked very well. I think this is an old mmo concept finally come true. It bascially switched through a chain of events like you would have with your regular MMORPG quest, but then implemented in public quest style (i.e. the setting is in the world and not locked away in an instance or phased in for you personally only, and everyone is notified all the time). It lacked a bit a sense of progress or accomplishment. Both TERA and RIFTS use typical quest systems, but RIFTS also has dynamic content with the rifts appearing in the world. In a nutshell, it spawns an environment (like lava underground and burnt vegetation and some monsters around a sparkly rift). But the whole setting then was exactly like it would be if you'd go to a lava location, i.e. monsters hanging out, sometimes moving in small circles around, not doing anything else). If there are only 6 or so rift settings and they are all --essentially-- the same thing, but with different monsters and textures, it could become quite boring quickly. TERAs quests seem to be tutorial quests (nicely done) and kill/grind quest. While I found them reasonable fun, because of the combat system, it would be very lame if that's all.
Combat
It seems there is the basic MMORPG combat running under the hood, with a couple of tweaks and changes so the experience is different — but not really that different (I am not saying this is bad or good). You can tab and select targets, like in regular MMOs and show the opponents health and info you expect (name, de/buffs etc.). If you hit any attack button, the character will perform the attack "into the air" towards the direction of the selected target so you have to make sure you are in range. Since attacks go "into the air" you can use skills at any point, liking swining the sword or just swinging it into the general direciton of opponents to hit someone. In this case, the target will switch to the one you've hit. So it's kind of target-soft-lock system.
In essence, GW2 uses a combat system similar to that of some recent action MMOs, but stays rather conservative and rather static as we are used to in MMORPGs. However, there are some elements where you move around quickly (getting knocked back or using some skills). There were some nice touches in the skills, like quickly doing a kind of backward movement with the Elementarist leaving a trail of flame. It feels a lot more fresh than RIFTs (which seems to be standard MMO combat), but does't go as far towards action as TERA (collsion detection, real blocking, real dodging etc.). It wasn't entirely clear to me how it worked, but it seems that the left side of the skill-bar (5 slots) are dependent of weapon/class and you can switch them around with another set, provided the class / character has one. Above that, there as an Adrenaline (?) meter and supposedly when it's filled, you could hit F1 to unleash a special attack and consume some adrenaline. The ranger had pet controls sitting there. The demo had more skills at the disposal than the other two games. RIFT seems to demo low level with like 3 skills and in TERA I had whopping 2 skills at my displosal, but there seem to be combos or something in place that show up when you also move and attack or hit the attack button several times.
Graphics
I liked the overall graphics and atmosphere but I wouldn't write home about it. If one would compare it to older MMOs the difference would be very clear, but when you see it on the spot, it "felt like as good as when EverQuest 2 was new". This means, it certainly looks a lot better than EQ2 does, but relatively speaking, you will get the feeling that currently it looks about average-well-done. Environments and world looked better than that of RIFTS, too, even though overall the RIFTS interface felt more finished (though I personally liked the painterly style of the GW2 GUI), giving RIFTS a little bit more "shiny" appearance. RIFTS overall it has a more old school MMO feel to it. TERA on the other hand had this asian AION style -- they apparently like turquoise with purple -- however I must say that TERA looked more impressive and detailled overall, I also liked the monsters better. Guild Wars 2 could make this up with nice vistas and cool locations, as seen in the concept arts.
So, thats my view on it. pretty much.
Nice write up Stormwatch, thanks for sharing.
That review was much appreciated and honest, and I especially value the comparisons with TERA and Rift. Thanks!
Thank you for that stormwatch. Glad we have someone here who actually played it.
So those quests that you got complemented the event? In other words, if the event was not active then those quests would not be available?
Overall how do you feel about the game? Did it at least meet your expectations, come close to it? I understand that it needs work, considering we are at least a year from launch, but how polished do you think it was compared to say RIFT or TERA? Do you think it could be a lot better in a year come launch time?
EDIT: Sorry, for bombarding you with questions. I am just curious.
The fact that I don't know what happens with the quest is a good thing, I guess. It managed well to push me forward to the next chain of events. These quests would only make sense in the context of the situation, so when the event is done (and it will even if you don't do anything at all) the quest very likely go away as well. When I did finish the 3 villager rescue mission and talked to the NPC in a larger house (tavern?), the described dialogue scene in letterbox style appeared and explained a bit of the background. This setup managed well to basically tell the story where centaurs attack, I am helping to rescue villagers, we go to the tavern, the main NPCs have some kind of pep talk and we go out agian to drive the centaurs off who were still running around and attack anyone, then the castle scene as described. Nice little story all told in public quest style. If I had left out the quest, then I would be just killing centaurs straight through. In a sense, the quest adds a little episode into the narrative.
The very most NPCs in the area where basically victims and for providing flavor-text. It wasn't like other MMOs where the place was littered with questing green icons above all NPCs. In some places they would also shout in speech bubbles to point to the action, as a reminder what you should be doing.
They demoed the two zones/scenarios and I saw someone else playing a personal story, which seemed(!) to be entirely instanced. I guess they took inspirations of Age of Conan's nightly adventures; among some other things. The map opens with a similar zoom out effect, if I am not mistaken, the letterbox dialogues appeared in AOC earlier as well. But since they showed these areas only, I have no clue how large the game is, or how far they are progessed. That content looked quite polished, the earth elemental was very large (I meant toe as I wrote it).
I found that the game-world was not as interactive as I personally thought it would be. For instance, it wasn't possible to smash the large, delicious melons on the field in the village, even the level designers invited to try this out (maybe they add that for fun, but I have no idea). I also couldn't jump over the fences, they were too high (you can jump, to be clear). So I had to pass through openings and gates.
In terms of content: if they manage to provide enough of these events for the game world (basically, so many that it keeps the game going), then it makes it a lot more interesting than the other two games. Or older MMORPGS, because this is a kind of dialectic synthesis of the two extreme other ideologies from before (procedular content and extreme directed content). Now that these things are technically possible online and graphically, which i guess, was an issue, developers can catch up and do the stuff they wanted to do for at least 10+ years (because all these neat ideas already existed back then in text form, and even more sophisitacted). This is clear win.
I still wouldn't totally write off other MMOs or games in general either, because we are now seeing the formation of sub-genres and crossovers / fusion genres. That's what happens in any genre that has reached a matured state. GW2 is a good example for this, because they are almost bridging the gap between the MMORPG world and the Downloadable-Content (DLC) world that is reality already. They sell the game once and will sell DLC, just like Dragon Age Origin does. Other games will add MM elements. TERA is focussed on combat more and they said something about political systems and sandbox elements that tie to that. SW:TOR decided to do stories really well, so they play the combat safe. RIFTs will attract the EQ/Vangaurd, maybe sandbox, audience and they can do more with prodecural stuff (they can change their entire world with chaning terraion etc, it seems, whereas GW2 seems to be about playing different events in a preset world (that can change at defined places).
I feel that GW2 is in a line of great games that all did some cool stuff and brought some evolution to the genre. GW2 picks up the torch of public quests of Warhammer-Online who could only do quests that way because other games back to EQ and DAOC and WOW more recently added crucial elements to it etc.
At the moment, I'd consider playing it
Shortly pros and cons
+ I loved the graphics
+ I loved Charr running on all four
+ I loved the combat
+ I loved Necros effects so much
+ Events shown in real, the thing is working just like I expected and thats awesome
+ I freaking LOVED the green/red aura around your target!! Lol the thing look so different but I understand a lot of you dont like it, but for me..well I loved Fallout 3 for VATS system, this is just the little thing I so love hehe:D
- I kinda dont like the UI (especially the diablo health bar) but well, its in Alpha, it is most likely to change
- I was kinda scared by the "lolwut a normal quest thing??!" ... but since it was a dress rehearsal for demo, it could be anything from dev coding to part of storyline to collector 2.0 so Im not THAT worried...
Overall: This game is fullfilling my dreams;)
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
There are allready over 1600 of these dynamic events programmed. (in the current testing version available)
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Pretty objective and honest review, it's unfortunate that their event system is really just a quest system in a slightly different box though.Nevertheless I am glad you thoroughly went through that so fanatics could stop arguing "omg vid quality was so bad all the mediocre stuff you could see was an illusion made from the cam"
It's more correct to say that it is like the Public Quests from WAR and CO in a different box, a progression or evolution of the Public Quests on a worldscale.
@Stormwatch: thanks for the insightful report of your impressions of your playtime
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
It's more correct to say that it is like the Public Quests from WAR and CO in a different box, a progression or evolution of the Public Quests on a worldscale.
@Stormwatch: thanks for the insightful report of your impressions of your playtime
No you could say it is just like normal quests in a slightly different box as a lot of the quests can be directed towards individual play and not all of them are themed after having many people around.I didnt know what to expect.....i played GW (the very first one) for about a week and never got back to it.
Not that the game was bad or anything but it didnt met my playstyle.
GW2: realy dont know what to expect of this too but its tempting to try this one out too.....i'll prolly watch it a bit closer when it gets to release date
I think so too. Even while MMO mechanics largely have stayed the same, technology has in the meantime progressed far enough to allow mechanics and visual options that weren't possible before.
What GW2 is doing, it's one of the new ways we'll see being done in other MMO's in the time to come; maybe not on the scale that GW2 is using them, but in essence they're enhanced Public Quests, and that's something that could be done for several areas in a MMO, especially now other developers see how it gels and can be implemented.
It could even be done in other current MMO's like WAR, WoW, LotrO and such.
I'm hoping that Rift will take that step further too, and not make those rifts static with merely a different spawned mob set for a little area, but also sending them forth, influencing the environment.
Other new or different mechanics I can see become common if they're successful is the enhanced story mode questing of a SW:TOR or the action oriented combat of a TERA.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Apparently you have never participated in Public Quests or haven't played MMO's a lot. No matter, I can see how difficult a mechanic it is to grasp if you haven't played it yet, everything new or different is
But as Stormwatch elaborated:
I agree with that last conclusion, the Dynamic Events is the next, better step of Public Quests, better implemented by it being on a world scale and having lasting impact. Stormwatch' description and what I've seen so far from the videos is basically what I expected the Events to be, it sounds exciting.
I'm glad that with the new batch of MMO's the genre finally feels like it's progressing again and not just rehashing the same-old same-old that it largely has been doing for years now. Good times!
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Getting some more definitive info on Dynamic Quests from Storm(y) and Cyphers. Thanks.
I agree, mass effect of how many DE's there are in the gameworld, is the key to these working ; ) and how many branches each chain allows or leads to.
GOOD QUALITY VIDEOS of PROFESSIONS (good music also):
These two vids show a lot more of the skills and the combat is faster also, much clearer:
Necromancer profession
then, both the
Elementalist Profession & Ranger profession (& Warrior)
So impression imo:
Professions are looking very distinct and each one looks to be as highly impressive as the next one. So that's my most positive take-home from the current demos.
I'd like to hear more reports and word-of-mouth from ppl who have played it (as above).
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
Thanks for the impressions.
And thanks for the good videos.
RobertDinh,
First of all, you say the word unfortunate. How is it unfortunate for you exactly? Can you please lay down here how you would prefer to see a quest based system that is revolutionary, to OUR times that is not "in a slighty different box"?
-Am I reading this right....you are saying mediocre things? What mediocre things are you referring to since I have read your disappointment into the hype of this game and it's revolutionary quest based system of content driven strategy.
-I find it a little puzzling why you seem to be the guy that is the "glass is half empty" if this is a good way of putting it...if you look into it this way, my question simply: What positive things do you so far enjoy about how this game is shaping up and why do you have quite a defensive view on people's hype about this game??
RobertDinh,
Nearly all your posts on www.mmorpg.com is on Guild Wars 2. You started off ok, where you warned people to be cautious which is great and to wary of hype. Then from there.....it has escalated into now a state where you almost believe that, and to the point of obsession that this hype (alot to do with the event system) is unfounded and that you believe this game that has only a small portion of exposure is worthy of such criticism. Why?
You must know the saying: If you believe in something so true, you start to believe it so. In other words, it seems to me now that you believe so much that Guild Wars 2 has disappointed you that you continue to despise the game even more.
I am not a fan-boy. I see a game on it's own merits. This is on ONE thing alone; if it is enjoyable to play. Maybe it's time you take a step back from the GW2 bashing and let people enjoy the hype, let people hope...their enjoyable type of game may not be yours. Your rationale is VERY unfounded on such limited knowledge of this game and HOW it actually plays at this stage.
You are old enough to realise people don't take criticism well, even if it may be of some factual and relevant substance....how can you percieve yourself to be qualified enough on the topic of MMORPGs and people's enjoyment? Why bother?
I simply do not see enough extended ideas on how you would like to see Guild Wars 2 to be an enjoyable game in your eyes, this may be why people are defensive.
Maybe, you could be so kind to explain to me now?
Im actually happy they included little old-fashioned quests within the events. It not only gives you more to do during the event, but it'll also give you and idea of what is going on. I like the idea that they give you a little bit of a background of the event as well. Id rather not jump into the middle of the event with no idea what is going on.
Can we keep the flaming out of this thread please?
Vids have not revealed that much and potions were the biggest dent in my expectations, but this piece seems to address that issue (in theory) so back to being very optimistic about the combat (especially seeing ALL those professions in PvP!):
http://www.guildwars2guru.com/forum/showpost.php?p=278026&postcount=879
Energy in Guild Wars 2 is a long term resource. It lasts over multiple fights. Every skill uses energy. It is a way for players to gauge how difficult a fight was and how cautious to play. This makes encounters a lot more diverse and in our more solo friendly environment, it allows players to push into higher level and more difficult areas and get into more challenging fights without killing them outright.
Guild Wars 1 did not have a long term resource. Energy regenerated immediately outside of combat. This created a number of problems for us. The greatest of which was there was no good way to balance encounters. Encounters were very binary – you either won or lost and there was nothing available to tip the scales of the fight in your favor. The only way you could tell if a fight was difficult was if players died. Most of the time this was either because they made a series of mistakes that they couldn’t recover from once they realized it.
A long term resource allows players to learn from their mistakes, makes the game more approachable, and together these things make the game more fun. You don’t just win or lose – you have time to react and time to recover from errors instead of being punished by death for not playing perfectly.
Energy regenerates slowly on its own, however, all players have a potion button attached to their energy bar. Drinking a potion returns energy and puts this button into recharge. Out of combat, this recharge is short. During combat, the potions recharge slower, allowing us to reward skilled play and balance difficult encounters against a finite resource pool, so that challenging bosses can’t simply be defeated by bringing more defensive and healing skills. Energy potions are the only kind of consumable that is usable in combat.
Since I know it is the first follow up question, we aren’t talking about PvP yet, but there will be interesting energy dynamics in PvP, but we will not force players to buy and pound potions to be competitive. Potions are not very expensive, they refill a significant portion of your energy pool and they will also drop off of mobs.
Also the second question, what about energy management and energy denial skills? Energy as a long term resource does mean that energy management is no longer a direct mechanic in the game. However, we recognize the strategy implications of this decision and there are other mechanics in the game that replace these elements and play style in a way that makes sense for the new game we are making.
Hopefully this addresses some of people’s concerns with potions in the game. Remember, Guild Wars 1 and Guild Wars 2 share a lot of philosophical similarities. but this is a new game and…instead of trying to explain it I’ll just quote one of you since I think this was as well as I could have said it…
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem