Having the ability to experience the majority of an AAA MMORPG title with no credit card or payment of any kind is the single greatest thing to happen to the industry in the last few years. The people who are complaining about having to someday pay for something - or grind for an obscene amount of time to obtain enough Turbine points to do the same - are missing the point completely.
This is not a demo. It is not a crippled experience (a la EQ2 Extended). This is an experience where you can play the epic storyline through to level 50. If you can't appreciate what is being offered, you're too jaded with the industry to matter anyhow.
I agree. I am not sure what happen to everyone but MMO communities just seem to be all about whine these days. Either they complain about game mechanics, balancing issues, pay models or just because they feel like complaining.
I downloaded Lord of the Rings, I have a lvl 13 Dwarf Champion so far and I am enjoying the game - I am seriously considering paying, why? because I am having "fun". That is what matters when I look for a game. If I am having fun or not.
If you don't want to "pay' then go some were else, all the complaining in the world will not change the fact that you can play for free - it may not be the same experience as paying to play, but you are still can play for "free" not one cent do I need to pay to play.
(Free to play, doesn't mean they have to offer all the content)
The difference between Turbine "F2P" and typical F2P is that Turbine sells contents in shop for fair prices and the overpriced items are purely optional, while the rest releases dungeons for free but the so-called "convenience" items are pretty much mandatory. Some people will cry foul and nothing will please them but it is not like the GW model is so confusing or controversial or even new.
If I am upset about anything it is unlocking trait slots for cash and some convenience items like potions way over the top and dangerously close to what is mandatory purchases in other games. I do not suspect Turbine to do it intentionally but they are not famous for their flawlessly balanced game mechanics and it may just happen.
Also, cash shop is what F2P betas are for, if they did not adjust shop what were you beta-testing? Years old game?
or you could actually up to level 20 , mess around with the free stuff and subscribe to the game for 15 a month or whatever the rate is now if you like it...what a concept!
If people wanted to pay a sub to play lotro they would have done so in the last three years. Those coming to lotro now expect something for nothing which they will not find.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
or you could actually up to level 20 , mess around with the free stuff and subscribe to the game for 15 a month or whatever the rate is now if you like it...what a concept!
If people wanted to pay a sub to play lotro they would have done so in the last three years. Those coming to lotro now expect something for nothing which they will not find.
well seems as if going by the servers the last few days a lot of new people are checking the game out, time will tell ghow many subscribe. It seemed to work out well for DDO, so we will see I guess.
First of all, they went f2p to increase their game revenue. Apparently the industry believes that brings them more money than a group of dedicated gamers paying a sub every month.
Second of all; they are increasing prices already. I believe you can be TOO greedy and make your playerbase realize you don't care about game content or quality. Obvious greed like that will make them leave. I know I wouldn't stay in a game where I knew all they wanted was my hard earned cash.
I'm telling you this: You get an interesting game, loaded with features, skip eye candy, good game mechanics, frequent updates on content, and you will gain a DEDICATED bunch of players.
I know I used to come home from work and sit on WoW for at least 4 hours a day. That was my entertainment.
I used to play SWG at least 4 hours a day. They still have a VERY DEDICATED playerbase in spite of the NGE.
Myself; as soon as I hear cash shop or microtransactions and I don't even look past that. Just the way I am. I want a game I can invest my time in. To know that if I want epic things, I need to invest time; not pay money. I'm sure you all wont' agree and that's fine. That's what makes us different.
To sum it all up: Don't rape the playerbase for hard earned cash. Unless you give them immersion, and content; your cash shop playerbase will take off for the next trend game.
~~~The point is........how loyal is the gamer in wanting and to some extend trusting the developer.............using money to polish the game in the way the customer is looking for it.~~~
I'd pay 50 euros a month for a game like LOTRO without lag on highest graphics, without bugs, more polished characters, mounts, instant bans on excessive trollers, bullies, and all these things that makes mmorpg's so much fun. But do we all realize what we want? If developers would do an investigation, of the available money from its customers, and offsetting that against the time they spend in mmorpg's. I think they'll find a big group that will pay that 50 euros a month. Imagine this, if the average player plays 2 hours per day, that's 60 hours a month, which is 50/60 less then 1 euro per hour. That's (forgive my French) fucking cheap for an entertainment service!
I'd pay 50 euros a month for a game like LOTRO without lag on highest graphics, without bugs, more polished characters, mounts, instant bans on excessive trollers, bullies, and all these things that makes mmorpg's so much fun. But do we all realize what we want? If developers would do an investigation, of the available money from its customers, and offsetting that against the time they spend in mmorpg's. I think they'll find a big group that will pay that 50 euros a month. Imagine this, if the average player plays 2 hours per day, that's 60 hours a month, which is 50/60 less then 1 euro per hour. That's (forgive my French) fucking cheap for an entertainment service!
Just my 2 cents
I Euro each hour isn't really that cheap. It is not as expensive as to go to the cinema but it is still pretty expensive.
If the quality is high enough it is surely worth it but any current MMO just isn't.
If someone makes a truly great game I would pay that sum to play and I think many people would but I expect no timesink for that kind of money and little grind, that means a lot of more content than current games have.
or you could actually up to level 20 , mess around with the free stuff and subscribe to the game for 15 a month or whatever the rate is now if you like it...what a concept!
If people wanted to pay a sub to play lotro they would have done so in the last three years. Those coming to lotro now expect something for nothing which they will not find.
Not true, this is far too simplistic. Some people come back and, upon seeing that the population is healthy and the game is evolving, they resubbed (happened already to three in my kins).
I like Turbine's move as it gave the motivations some players need to play again. I wish only they would have been a bit more generous with old players, giving them for instance a few more TP or 2/3 regions for free, instead of having to buy SOA regions.
Actually Turbine goes F2P because it actually increases their subscriptions. You CANT play the game without spending money. You are so gimped that nobody would want you in their group if you don't have a sub.
uh yes you can play. Go F2P do the starter area quests. grind mobs and do the Epic quest lines for money and gear , take money for mob ginding and buy crafted gear. Is it painfull and slow? yeah sure, can it be done also yes. Or you can pay the subscription for 15USD a month.
Double facepalm here also ....A company gives you a chance to really see everything in thier game up to the level 50 content for free and people bitch
No one cares if its free if its really boring. Grinding mobs in LotRO is just not an option. The rate of xp gain is so slow it feels worse than the original EQ. Quests are the ONLY way to advance. Grinding mobs might be tolerable if anyone grouped in that game, but they don't, they all just do the solo quests.
So we can torture ourselves playing a terrible game, or we can pay extra money for how the game is actually supposed to work? How do they expect anyone to want to play this.
Obviously no F2P game in the market is actually really after the "too cheap to pay anything" crowd. They all advertise with Free play and they all deliver(some sort of) free play. Its just like free beer though, its hardly ever as good as beer you have to pay for. No, what Turbine is after is the casual crowd. The kind of people that would never enter their CC info on "some website" with a recurring payment, the kids that jump on anything that is free, get sucked up and then corner their parents into buying them giftcards for that game to their birthdays(having to buy upgrades to frickin carddecks like Yugio or whats it spelled has already numbed parents down, they won't question this). You can't reach the hardcore MMO gamer crowd with a F2P option, though you might get some of them if you have a much healthier population, provide content faster or simply have more media coverage, all of which can be helped by F2P.
Remember the refocusing that Blizzard did with their raids and stuff? We see MMOs coming out of the woodworks and becoming more mainstream, and that means casuals with some candy on top for the not so casual crowd. What turbine accomplishes with their Hybrid model is to make all kinds of people comfortable. I know people who would never play a MMO simply because it has a monthly subscription, they don't have a problem buying 3 cheap games for their PS 3, but subscribing to some game like if it was a Cable TV or something? No chance. They simply don't think like that, don't even understand the concept.
There simply is a big crowd of people that want the illusion of getting and keeping what they pay for. These people are comfortable with paying 5$ for a "new part" of their game or buying an expansion or DLC pack, they understand that if they want something "new" they need to pay something. But they expect to keep the stuff, like you would keep the expansion of a single player game that you bought and not having to pay rent for a game or needing to keep track of subscriptions(an aquiantance of mine paid over a year a subscription to a game he stopped playing because he didn't know how to cancel, and was afraid they would delete his chars and he never could come back, and yeah he forgot his accountname/password too). LotRO currently is seeing people start playing that never before touched a MMO, simply because they recognize the IP and its free. People like him.
Because honestly, we have been ripped off for years. My neighbor plays WoW from launch till today(unlike me, i only played it on and off), he got every expansion when it came out, lets look what he paid:
Original Game: 50€
Burning Crusade: 40€
Wraht of the Lichking: 40€
5 Years x 12 Months x 15€ : 900€
He payed 1130€ for it up to now. Do i have to run comparsions to Guildwars or even the old LotRO lifetime thingy? Would he have bought the game if i had gone with him into the store in 2005 and told him "you know you are going to spend over 1000€ on that thing?" Sure he got alot of content for that, but did he really get good value for his money? Did he get 20x Guildwars worth of money? Guildwars has imho shown the large populace what a scam even the fastest content throughput subscriptions based MMOs are. This doesn't even get into how you pay the same subscription price for a MMO in maintenance mode as for one getting regular updates which just makes no sense. Money spent should be tied to content delivered, not just to some fixture industry standard regardless of what you get.
Also the funny thing is, if he stopped paying his subscription he would get abolutely nothing for his 1130€ spent but a few pretty boxes on his shelf. Some people say LotROs F2P model or pricing is a scam, i say what we have dealt with in the past was the real scam. Atleast the money spent on this F2P persists with your account aslong as the game runs.
No one cares if its free if its really boring. Grinding mobs in LotRO is just not an option. The rate of xp gain is so slow it feels worse than the original EQ. Quests are the ONLY way to advance. Grinding mobs might be tolerable if anyone grouped in that game, but they don't, they all just do the solo quests.
So we can torture ourselves playing a terrible game, or we can pay extra money for how the game is actually supposed to work? How do they expect anyone to want to play this.
It's a option, just one that most will not care for. That is why they have the ala carte plan and the subscription plan. For someone on a very limited budget the pain of grinding might be their only choice. Maybe you are burned out on the game and want to play EvE or Aion for a couple of months, yet still want to stay in touch with your guildies in chat. F2P would be perfect for that.
Another option for someone on a budget is as someone pointed out on another thread. You could do up to the level 20 stuff, sub for 2 months and buy MoM and Mirkwood, level that toon through the 65 content, create a alt rinse and repeat except you already have the MoM and SoM packs.
Or if you are in military for example and on a hectic schedule buy ala carte a zone at atime as your schedule permits.
All Turbine has done is give people lots of choices on how they pay or not pay as case may be, yet a few whiny kids still complain. Take your pick , play for free with a lot of grind, buy a sub, or go ala carte . No one is forcing you into doing it one way or the otehr, it's your choice. Like I said earlier I pronounce this thread epic fail, or rather epic whine.
Comments
I agree. I am not sure what happen to everyone but MMO communities just seem to be all about whine these days. Either they complain about game mechanics, balancing issues, pay models or just because they feel like complaining.
I downloaded Lord of the Rings, I have a lvl 13 Dwarf Champion so far and I am enjoying the game - I am seriously considering paying, why? because I am having "fun". That is what matters when I look for a game. If I am having fun or not.
If you don't want to "pay' then go some were else, all the complaining in the world will not change the fact that you can play for free - it may not be the same experience as paying to play, but you are still can play for "free" not one cent do I need to pay to play.
(Free to play, doesn't mean they have to offer all the content)
The difference between Turbine "F2P" and typical F2P is that Turbine sells contents in shop for fair prices and the overpriced items are purely optional, while the rest releases dungeons for free but the so-called "convenience" items are pretty much mandatory. Some people will cry foul and nothing will please them but it is not like the GW model is so confusing or controversial or even new.
If I am upset about anything it is unlocking trait slots for cash and some convenience items like potions way over the top and dangerously close to what is mandatory purchases in other games. I do not suspect Turbine to do it intentionally but they are not famous for their flawlessly balanced game mechanics and it may just happen.
Also, cash shop is what F2P betas are for, if they did not adjust shop what were you beta-testing? Years old game?
If people wanted to pay a sub to play lotro they would have done so in the last three years. Those coming to lotro now expect something for nothing which they will not find.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
well seems as if going by the servers the last few days a lot of new people are checking the game out, time will tell ghow many subscribe. It seemed to work out well for DDO, so we will see I guess.
I miss DAoC
~~~The point is........how loyal is the gamer in wanting and to some extend trusting the developer.............using money to polish the game in the way the customer is looking for it.~~~
I'd pay 50 euros a month for a game like LOTRO without lag on highest graphics, without bugs, more polished characters, mounts, instant bans on excessive trollers, bullies, and all these things that makes mmorpg's so much fun. But do we all realize what we want? If developers would do an investigation, of the available money from its customers, and offsetting that against the time they spend in mmorpg's. I think they'll find a big group that will pay that 50 euros a month. Imagine this, if the average player plays 2 hours per day, that's 60 hours a month, which is 50/60 less then 1 euro per hour. That's (forgive my French) fucking cheap for an entertainment service!
Just my 2 cents
I Euro each hour isn't really that cheap. It is not as expensive as to go to the cinema but it is still pretty expensive.
If the quality is high enough it is surely worth it but any current MMO just isn't.
If someone makes a truly great game I would pay that sum to play and I think many people would but I expect no timesink for that kind of money and little grind, that means a lot of more content than current games have.
Not true, this is far too simplistic. Some people come back and, upon seeing that the population is healthy and the game is evolving, they resubbed (happened already to three in my kins).
I like Turbine's move as it gave the motivations some players need to play again. I wish only they would have been a bit more generous with old players, giving them for instance a few more TP or 2/3 regions for free, instead of having to buy SOA regions.
No one cares if its free if its really boring. Grinding mobs in LotRO is just not an option. The rate of xp gain is so slow it feels worse than the original EQ. Quests are the ONLY way to advance. Grinding mobs might be tolerable if anyone grouped in that game, but they don't, they all just do the solo quests.
So we can torture ourselves playing a terrible game, or we can pay extra money for how the game is actually supposed to work? How do they expect anyone to want to play this.
Obviously no F2P game in the market is actually really after the "too cheap to pay anything" crowd. They all advertise with Free play and they all deliver(some sort of) free play. Its just like free beer though, its hardly ever as good as beer you have to pay for. No, what Turbine is after is the casual crowd. The kind of people that would never enter their CC info on "some website" with a recurring payment, the kids that jump on anything that is free, get sucked up and then corner their parents into buying them giftcards for that game to their birthdays(having to buy upgrades to frickin carddecks like Yugio or whats it spelled has already numbed parents down, they won't question this). You can't reach the hardcore MMO gamer crowd with a F2P option, though you might get some of them if you have a much healthier population, provide content faster or simply have more media coverage, all of which can be helped by F2P.
Remember the refocusing that Blizzard did with their raids and stuff? We see MMOs coming out of the woodworks and becoming more mainstream, and that means casuals with some candy on top for the not so casual crowd. What turbine accomplishes with their Hybrid model is to make all kinds of people comfortable. I know people who would never play a MMO simply because it has a monthly subscription, they don't have a problem buying 3 cheap games for their PS 3, but subscribing to some game like if it was a Cable TV or something? No chance. They simply don't think like that, don't even understand the concept.
There simply is a big crowd of people that want the illusion of getting and keeping what they pay for. These people are comfortable with paying 5$ for a "new part" of their game or buying an expansion or DLC pack, they understand that if they want something "new" they need to pay something. But they expect to keep the stuff, like you would keep the expansion of a single player game that you bought and not having to pay rent for a game or needing to keep track of subscriptions(an aquiantance of mine paid over a year a subscription to a game he stopped playing because he didn't know how to cancel, and was afraid they would delete his chars and he never could come back, and yeah he forgot his accountname/password too). LotRO currently is seeing people start playing that never before touched a MMO, simply because they recognize the IP and its free. People like him.
Because honestly, we have been ripped off for years. My neighbor plays WoW from launch till today(unlike me, i only played it on and off), he got every expansion when it came out, lets look what he paid:
Original Game: 50€
Burning Crusade: 40€
Wraht of the Lichking: 40€
5 Years x 12 Months x 15€ : 900€
He payed 1130€ for it up to now. Do i have to run comparsions to Guildwars or even the old LotRO lifetime thingy? Would he have bought the game if i had gone with him into the store in 2005 and told him "you know you are going to spend over 1000€ on that thing?" Sure he got alot of content for that, but did he really get good value for his money? Did he get 20x Guildwars worth of money? Guildwars has imho shown the large populace what a scam even the fastest content throughput subscriptions based MMOs are. This doesn't even get into how you pay the same subscription price for a MMO in maintenance mode as for one getting regular updates which just makes no sense. Money spent should be tied to content delivered, not just to some fixture industry standard regardless of what you get.
Also the funny thing is, if he stopped paying his subscription he would get abolutely nothing for his 1130€ spent but a few pretty boxes on his shelf. Some people say LotROs F2P model or pricing is a scam, i say what we have dealt with in the past was the real scam. Atleast the money spent on this F2P persists with your account aslong as the game runs.
It's a option, just one that most will not care for. That is why they have the ala carte plan and the subscription plan. For someone on a very limited budget the pain of grinding might be their only choice. Maybe you are burned out on the game and want to play EvE or Aion for a couple of months, yet still want to stay in touch with your guildies in chat. F2P would be perfect for that.
Another option for someone on a budget is as someone pointed out on another thread. You could do up to the level 20 stuff, sub for 2 months and buy MoM and Mirkwood, level that toon through the 65 content, create a alt rinse and repeat except you already have the MoM and SoM packs.
Or if you are in military for example and on a hectic schedule buy ala carte a zone at atime as your schedule permits.
All Turbine has done is give people lots of choices on how they pay or not pay as case may be, yet a few whiny kids still complain. Take your pick , play for free with a lot of grind, buy a sub, or go ala carte . No one is forcing you into doing it one way or the otehr, it's your choice. Like I said earlier I pronounce this thread epic fail, or rather epic whine.
I miss DAoC