Hardware compatibility ?s

wheelman_73

Im in the mist of selecting parts for a new PC build and am running into some confusion.  Ive been told here recently that if i select a MB that is DDR3 my GPU has to be a DDR3.  Im wanting to use a GTX 400 series card which is DDR5.  Now this doenst make sense to to me b/c in all my parts searching, 99% of the time newegg, i can not find a DDR5 MB.  Can I get some clarification here please.....

Thanks in advance...

Quizzical

There is no such thing as DDR5 yet.  For that matter, DDR4 is a couple of years away from being used commercially.  Most newer mid range and high end video cards use GDDR5 memory, which is different.

A modern motherboard will use DDR3 as system memory, but can be paired with a video card that uses whatever type of memory it likes, whether DDR3 or otherwise.  The main reason why any video cards use DDR3 memory at all is that it is cheap because it is mass produced for use as system memory.  For video card compatibility, what you want is a motherboard with a PCI Express x16 2.0 slot, which nearly all modern motherboards have.

thecrap

you do not need a ddr3 mobo for a ddr3 GPU I think what he means by ddr3 is the GPU since GPU ram is different 

Mehve

Originally posted by wheelman_73

Im in the mist of selecting parts for a new PC build and am running into some confusion.  Ive been told here recently that if i select a MB that is DDR3 my GPU has to be a DDR3.  Im wanting to use a GTX 400 series card which is DDR5.  Now this doenst make sense to to me b/c in all my parts searching, 99% of the time newegg, i can not find a DDR5 MB.  Can I get some clarification here please.....

Thanks in advance...

Pretty much what's already been said. Whoever told you that was either lying or simply confused. There are two different kinds of memory at issue here - the system memory that your motherboard uses, and the graphics memory that's on your video card. But they're independant of each other, so no worries about compatibility between them. Often you'll see the video card memory called GDDR, since it's actually a completely different standard than system memory.

These days, unless you're looking at an older motherboard, it will almost certainly use DDR3 memory, so pick your modules accordingly. But the GPU uses its own memory, included on the card itself, and the only matching issue is to make sure that the interface (these days, virtually guaranteed to be a PCI-E x16 slot) is the same on both the motherboard and GPU. And of course, to make sure the power supply has the necessary number/type of PCI-E power plugs to power your card properly.

wheelman73

Hey thanks for all the input so far!  I guess posting the hardware Im looking at using will better help make sure Im on the right track...

 

 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136284 - HD

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130568 - GPU

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145260 - RAM

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188051 - MB

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115067 - CPU

 

My only other concern is  a PSU.  The GPU reqs a min. 450W 24amp on the 12V rail.  Should I consider any other system specs for my PSU.  Again thanks for any info posted...

 

 

Quizzical

The obvious, glaring problem is that the motherboard has a LGA 1366 socket, while the CPU needs an LGA 1156 socket.  It's probably better to switch the motherboard than the CPU.  Get a motherboard with an LGA 1156 socket and a P55 chipset and you should be set.

You'd still need an optical drive, case, power supply, and OS license.  For a power supply, try this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151094

If you want a GeForce GTX 460 with 1 GB of memory, you can get basically the same thing for $30 cheaper:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125333

Or if willing to spend a little more than that, then you might as well at least get a nicer card like a Radeon HD 5850:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127500

Alternatively, if you picked the video card for EVGA's warranty service, XFX seems to be regarded as comparable:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150494

If it's for EVGA's step-up program, then don't.  Nvidia doesn't have anything meaningfully new coming for a year or so.

wheelman73

Thanks for catching that socket issue.  Im liking that PSU especially for the price, seems to provide more than enouogh power.  As for still needing optic drive and case, Im wanting to get the major components set before I start looking into those, gotta make sure of what case to get so they'll fit.  I want to stay w/ an EVGA GPU b/c the one I have now is EVGA and has given me nothing short of its best.  Gonna do some looking tonight for another MB and maybe a case to link in next post.

Thanks again for taking the time to help a noob...

thecrap

No problemo just get a good case and your all set I recommend a lian li or a cooler master 

wheelman73

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128425

New MB option...hope its a good option.

Cases Im shopping.  I dont need anything flashy to show off, something basic to fit everything is my only concern.  PSU will prob go w/ the on forementioned.

So, so far it will be all other mentioned hardware w/ this MB replacement...

Thoughts? TY in advance again...

Quizzical

Linking to the shopping cart rather than a particular item doesn't work very well.

If you still need a case, you could try one of these and add fans:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119233

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042

Or you can get a version of the latter with more fans:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129066

Note that all of those have an available combo deal with the OS for $10 off if you're not already doing combo deals.

Quizzical

I see that you've fixed the motherboard link.  That motherboard should work fine.  Make sure that you don't use the USB 3.0 ports unless you have a device that can make use of the extra speed of USB 3.0, as otherwise, it steals PCI Express lanes from your video card.  Also, make sure that you put the video card in the PCI Express x16 slot closer to the processor socket, as the other one is only wired for x4 bandwidth.

wheelman73

Im going to have to get new keyboard and mouse anyway so might well upgrade things to 3.0 USB now.  Still need and optic drive which i hardly ever use so not looking to break the bank w/ that purchase.  Right now im just shy of $1k which was exactly where i wanted to be w/ this build.

Now just need someone to help me put it all together and make it work...lol!

Quizzical

Mice and keyboards can't make use of the extra speed of USB 3.0, or even USB 2.0.  It doesn't matter if the bandwidth available is 1000 times what you need or 10000 times what you need.  USB 3.0 is mainly for external hard drives and SSDs.

wheelman73

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128405

 

New MB.  Still keeps me in my $ amount.

wheelman73

Quick question here...

What is the differance between a SATA and a SSD?  What are specific application uses for each? 

Thanks all...

Mehve

Originally posted by wheelman73

Quick question here...

What is the differance between a SATA and a SSD?  What are specific application uses for each? 

Thanks all...

Actually, it's not an either/or question:

SATA is an interface standard - it basically refers to the cable and connection that joins the hard disk to the motherboard, and determines the maximum possible data speeds you could (theoretically) see. It's seen several speed upgrades, to SATA 3.0 and more recently to SATA 6.0, but the standard is backwards compatible, so there isn't any real issues with having to match them up. Pretty much all HDD's and optical drives use it these days, although you still see some using an older interface generally refered to as PATA or IDE.

SSD refers to Solid State Disk, and it refers to a subset of hard drives that don't use mechanical parts (i.e. spinning data platters), but instead use flash memory for storage. They're very fast, and certain applications benefit hugely from them, but their cost/storage is much, much higher. They're also fairly new to the market (only a few years in mainstream availability), so we're still learning things about them and discovering little quirks that they have. But that aside, from a user perspective, they install and operate just regular hard disks. (And incidentally, use a SATA connection to hook up to the computer's motherboard)

A popular approach for people looking for performance is to put the operating system and frequently accessed programs (i.e. favourite games) onto an SSD, and use a standard mechanical drive for storing large files where bleeding edge performance isn't a concern (i.e. music/video/backup files).

wheelman73

How much of a denifite is it to store your i.e. fav game on a SSD?  Ive looked into these and prices are through the roof for them.  Is it really worth the $$$ for the performance gain?

TheHatter

edit nvm

Quizzical

Some games have "hitching" problems where the game stops rendering frames for a fraction of a second while waiting for data to arrive from the hard drive.  A solid state drive can avoid that particular problem, though it's not the only cause of unstable frame rates.

A solid state drive makes it so that games load much faster.  If you're annoyed at loading screens when you zone, it takes far less time to zone on an SSD.  In some games, loading a zone and getting in and able to move around and do stuff sooner can be an advantage, albeit usually only a small advantage.

The question of whether that is worth the cost depends on your budget and your priorities.  One could just as well ask, is it worth paying $300 for a video card, when a $70 card will run the games you play very smoothly on minimum graphical settings?  Again, it's a matter of budget and priorities.

I don't think of solid state drives as mainly for gaming.  They're also very nice with web browsers, as you don't have to sit and wait as long when it tries to grab something out of cache.  It's nice to have most programs simply open up ready to use as fast as you are after clicking to run the program, rather than having to sit and wait.  In a laptop, it's nice to have the laptop still work after you drop it (an SSD has no moving parts, and hence no moving parts that can break, while hard drives are very fragile), though most people don't drop desktops while they are running.

Mehve

Originally posted by wheelman73

How much of a denifite is it to store your i.e. fav game on a SSD?  Ive looked into these and prices are through the roof for them.  Is it really worth the $$$ for the performance gain?

At current prices probably not, to be honest. They won't do anything to improve your frames-per-second performance, and not all programs can benefit from them. But if you've got the money, and already have a strong rig, mechanical hard disks become more and more of a bottleneck for processing and loading things. An SSD can make your computer feel more responsive, especially when heavily multi-tasking, and games and in-game instances can load quicker.

But they're not a magic bullet - sometimes the improvements are nice, other times they're virtually non-existant. If you do nothing but word processing and email, these aren't for you. If you don't care about zoning into an instance a few seconds later, these aren't for you. It'll be a few more years at least before prices approach anything reasonable. From a gaming perspective, as a rule of thumb, I submit that you probably shouldn't be spending more on an SSD than on your video card(s).

wheelman73

Ok I see how that maybe an advantage.  Since this build Im working on will mainly be for gaming I may not see the reason for throwing down $300 for a SSD at the moment.  Maybe in a year or so when prices level off.  Thanks for the info, I keep learning...lol

Quizzical

Who says you'd have to spend $300 to get an SSD?  Prices have fallen greatly already.

$53 after rebate for 30 GB:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227510

$95 after rebate for 60 GB:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227394

60 GB is enough space for whatever programs you use the most, if you also have a hard drive for data.

Quizzical

Originally posted by wheelman73

Since this build Im working on will mainly be for gaming

Mainly for gaming is a long way from solely for gaming.  For example, I see that you're browsing the Internet right now.  ("Now" meaning as you read this, not as I type it.)

thecrap

I think ill start using SSD when they are in a more reasonable price and atleast above 200gb 

Quizzical

I'd expect that solid state drives aren't so much going to get cheaper as that you'll be able to get more capacity for the same price.  Much of the reason why an SSD is so much faster than a simple USB flash drive is that the controllers get speed benefits from being able to write to many NAND flash memory chips in parallel.  That doesn't work so well if you don't have many NAND flash chips to write to.  Building NAND flash isn't going to become cheaper, but they will be able to make larger capacity chips for the same price.

Today, $100 gets you about 60 GB.  A couple of years from now, $100 will probably get you about 120 GB.  Four years from now, maybe $100 will get you 240 GB.  But you're not likely to see SSDs for $30 apart from possibly some crippled little things that would be considered slow (for an SSD) even today.

It's kind of like how today, you can get memory modules that are less than 1 GB, but you don't save much by doing so.  New Egg has 128 MB and 256 MB memory modules, but the cheapest memory module of any capacity is more than 2/3 of the price of the cheapest 1 GB module.  The Moore's Law-type scaling doesn't mean that you can build memory chips for half the price; it means you can build them with double the capacity for the same price as before.  I'd expect NAND flash chips to scale in the same way.

Loke666

Originally posted by thecrap

I think ill start using SSD when they are in a more reasonable price and atleast above 200gb 

There are a few ones that are that large already but they cost a bit too much (like a normal gaming computer just for the drive).

But I am not so sure they ever will come that large and cheap since they are just a temporary solution.

A new and a lot faster drive will come in a few years and then we are talking about a drive that can replace both hard drive and ram. It is 3-4 years away, or maybe even less.

As for size and SSDs most people just use a small for the OS and important installed games, and then have a regular drive for all the other stuff. It is pretty effective. You don't have to keep stuff like music and movies on a SSD anyways, it is just a waste of money.

I myself have 4 raided X-25  SSDs of 80GB each and then something like 6 GBs in regular drives.