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Are our expectations too high?
Rockgod99
Member Posts: 4,640
Do we expect too much from these developers? I recently posted a thread asking how many clients players purchased where they decided to quit either before or just after the free month. The numbers were surprising. From three to as high as ten! So let me ask are our expectations just too high? Will we ever be satisfied?
Comments
Depends a lot on first impressions. If you buy the "next, most amazing WoW-killing game EVAH!" and get a bug-laden piece of barely functioning guano, then people won't be satisfied and will leave. If you gut a game promising this innovation and that innovation and wind up with the same old turn with a touch of polish on it, people will leave.
If they give what they promise (meet expectations) and do so in a well-polished functioning game they'll do great. Don't release on a hard deadline to make the investors happy, release it when it's ready.
Oderint, dum metuant.
I don't think we're asking too much. Sure, it's a lot of work to create an MMO, but if the developers put the time and effort in then they can keep raking in cash afterwards for more than 10 years. See EverQuest for details. The thing with the current batch of developers are they don't want to innovate, they just create the same thing that 'the other developer' has done because it made them a few dollars. You can pretty much take every fantasy MMO released since WoW, reskin them, and have the exact same game. There are a few exceptions, sure, but very few.
In all honesty the easy answer to me is yes, there are some people who whether they admit it or not prefer a particular gaming style, for a decent example I think we can look at a game like FFXIV (or whichever freaking roman numeral they are on). The consensus I get is that if you like slow paced gaming folks are much more willing to overlook the glaring problems being reported in that game while it seems a vast majority of the folks who bought the game hate it and to play devils advocate for second I'm going to side with FF fans, why in the hell if you prefered the game pace of WOW even try out this game?
SE showed their ideas are not in line with mainstream gamers with the first FF mmo they released but folks bought this one and complained anyway regardless of all indications that this would be as niche a game as the last FF mmo.
I had one game on my list and even that game I kind of knew going in I would burn myself, I did and I promptly came to the boards and whined about Cryptic to no end (which I still do) even though I knew the game would be crap for me. Far too often we are willing to think little enough of our fifty bucks plus sub fee to give it to anyone but when we are dissapointed we whine about it.
In general I just wish more gamers were more picky about what they picked up and chose to pay for then we wouldn't have to spend so much time complaining about games. Having said all that I still don't think of it as too big of an issue if we never try to take a chance the genre doesn't grow.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
My expectations aren't that high its just that noone will make a true MMO that has other content than just fighting, raiding, or pvping, what about naval battles?, world politics?, non combat professions?, minigames? exploration? , achievements? , collections?, a real crafting system not a afterthought like all MMOs today have? world terrorities and pvp zones not arenas not battlegrounds but terrorities (ex, EVE low sec, 0.0)
If someone can make a hybrid sandbox and themepark MMORPG give a little bit of a story but not the whole focus of the game, throw in what I wanted above with a freeform character builder with non-instanced housing I would be satsified
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
I don't think they are too high at all. Not when the product we expect comes with a price tag. Every other industry has to meet our expectations, it only stands to reason that the game industry, which is growing like wildfire and is now a multi billion dollar industry and not something people smirk about anymore, follow suit and provide QUALITY games.
It's no different now than the movie industry. They also have quite the gamut of low quality to high quality films being made every year. The ones that bring in the bucks and are successful are usually the high quality ones that everyone expects.
Personally, I think we need more writers of high quality being hired for games as it seems where they lack is in story and "world" building or world "immersion". SO many games out there are all about game mechanics and graphics, yet the true pull of MMORPGs, in my opinion, is the chance to explore someone's "world" idea.
Just look at FTPs as an example of what I mean. Ever wonder why they feel so shallow? Because they aren't built around a "world" but around game mechanics. Throw in a top notch story with the world fleshing out the background and showing a history and you very well could break the current FTP mold and sometimes AAA mold that does the same thing.
Anyway, if I had the bucks, I would own an MMORPG company and would be trying to bang a game like this out if not more than one. Much like Curt Schilling is doing. Now if only I had a World Series Baseball career to fund my dream.
/sigh
I think either
a)developers have become more lazy
b)Publishers have become more impatient
c)a mix of both
When it comes down to games and their subscriptions, It's almost as if our buck's worth has lessened with each passing year.
I think that most people's expectations are simply unrealistic. These games have to make money and many people want things that are simply not financially viable. They want things that are exactly the way they want them, no compromises. If they don't get exactly what they want, they complain that the genre is failing. No, it's their expectations that are out of whack.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Not only are people's expectations too high, but they are nearly impossible. People expect new games to release with the same amount of content / features as games that have been out for 6 or even 10 years. People expect games to cater to exactly their playstyle, when they are only 1 out of hundreds of thousands of potential subscribers.
People don't buy MMOs with realistic expectations anymore. They buy them thinking that they should all fit their description of a perfect, finished game, and provide the same experience that games with many years of updates and expansions provide. It is simply not possible.
UNfortunately, there will always be some shortcoming in every game. For some players, it is not a big deal. For others it is blasphemy.
IN the end, the minority of vocal detractors will appear to be a majority.
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
from 3-10?
I know some people wrote numbers lower than 3. I am sure there are a lot of people who would answer that question as a 0. Using any data collected from the thread for anthing is a waste of time.
Also not sure how you can expect to get a consensus, you used the word "we" when the only constant on this site is disagreement.
--John Ruskin
well then, why switch to a new game if the old one's better?
I never bought a product irl that's worst than its counterparts because it can get better over time.
other than antiques, i don't know of anything that makes sense to invest in now and collect your money's worth later.
It depends mmo aren't all the same so if one offers a different experience even if it isn't as good as my last mmo I wouldn't be unhappy with that purchase. As an example when I took a break from eve I decided to start up Ryzom. Ryzom certainly isn't a better game overal but be ause it offered something different I was happy to pay my 10 bucks a month for the 6 to 8 months I played.Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
They make millions if they make a good game so our expectations should be high.
Those are probably the highest expectations i have ever read.
All of what you described seems hell to implement and keep logic, even non instanced housing is a problem and really hard to balance.
To the OP, yes, people demand what they would love to play, the problem is that EVERYONE wants to play a different game, it's impossible to meet anyone's expectations in this day and age.
Ok you have some precious free time to play a game. Do you:
A) Take whatever is thrown at you and live with it even if you don't like it, or
It sucks to have to do the trial and error thing, this is why trial persiods can be helpful in deciding. Why anyone would "settle" for just putting up with a game you aren't thrilled about is beyond me. The problem i think is a lot of the developers either just don't get what is fun and exciting, or they did develop something exciting but management said, no that is too much, scale it back and give them shit, but charge extra. We need to make 35% more profit this quarter, my bonus is on the line!
Archlinux ftw
After playing EvE my expectations are so high that its not likely that a upcomming MMO will interest me.
Another great example of Moore's Law. Give people access to that much space (developers and users alike) and they'll find uses for it that you can never imagine. "640K ought to be enough for anybody" - Bill Gates 1981
That is true however. Compare the content and general feel of polish between a launch day MMO and a single player game and it’s easy to see that MMO developers have gotten a bit lazy when it comes to making finished games. Single player games rarely have big launch day patches (especially console games), they have all the content needed to play from start to finish (if you think it’s enough content is a different matter), the controls generally work without any huge bugs, etc.
I don’t know if it’s because MMO companies have fallen into the “we can always fix that in a patch later” mentality or that the budgets to complete that last 5% of the game are really difficult to plan for but either way it leads to a real jarring user experience.
My expectations are neither too high nor too low. They're perfect. I will play (and pay for) any MMO that I enjoy. When and if I no longer enjoy it, I will cease playing (and paying for) it.
If I have a choice between two or more MMOs that I enjoy, I will play (and pay for) the one I enjoy the most.
Those with more disposable income than I have will often choose to pay for more than one, and this is perfectly fine. (But Guild Wars 2 might become my second MMO when it releases, if I enjoy it, since there is no monthly sub.)
Do I understand that my dream game is probably impossible to achieve anytime in the near future and that, if it ever does exist, it might only appeal to a few people and therefore it would be silly of anyone to throw money into making it? Yep. So I play the free trial of whatever is out there that seems closest to my ideal, and if I enjoy the game, I stay (and pay).
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
In my opinion developers need to reel in their marketing department and not hype the living shit out of newer releases. What you expekt is usually what you see or hear and when you finally play it and see the system is broken/not implemented you get pissed.
Stop making promises and stick to reality, that would give the games a much better retention rate.
All statements I make is from my point of view unless stated otherwise.
No developers dont give s**** about crap game. They hype make developement cost back at box sales, also geting profit + profit from 2-3 month subs. And then they change company name make another crap make profit with box sales and do it over and over again. Becouse people are stupid and preorder.
Terminator, the movie. When it first came out the special effects were amazing, the story was great, and people watched it again and again. It's a great movie. However, years later, when you watch it again, you realise with modern advances the special effects are looking really dated, the music sounds old, and you know the story inside out. Now, it might be a great movie, but if you have the choice of watching that AGAIN or watching something new with amazing special effects, it's highly likely you'll watch something new.
Same principle. The older games were great, but time has aged them and though they're still fun, you'd really prefer to be playing something more modern.
So should we just give up and be happy what we have? Hell no!
I don't expect a new game to have the same amount of content as one with multiple expansions under its belt. I don't want pretty grapchis in the expense of gameplay. I don't expect advanced physics or sharp controls in an MMO. Put many players in the same area and you have to cut some features. Otherwise it's a nightmare on the server-side and no one is happy.
All I want is some common sense and proficiency from the developer. Do what you can with what you have and make sure the package works as it is and is entertaining. Don't promise something you can't deliver. Too many MMOs are, put plainly, bad games. Chatrooms with graphics. Served and sold by their marketing department with big promises on the side.
Is it too much to ask? -To just have good games?
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
I have the same expectations I did when diablo came out originally. The game should work when I install it. Sadly, today's games can't even get that right.
Back in the day you got ONE shot at getting a game right, because most people would never update a game via internet. Now they use the internet as an excuse to release something in a beta format and say "we'll get to it later"
No my expectations are not too high, EA and friends just want more money then anyone imaginable.
The Terminator script is still cited by How-To Write a Screenplay classes and books as one of the best examples of pacing in the industry. The analogy isn't exact, but I can take away something from your example for developers that goes something like: "Find the core element(s) that made any older MMO great and apply it to whatever MMO you're making now."
Then all you have to worry about are losing the people that try your MMO and expect it to be something other than another MMO, which is as silly as going to the movies and expecting to see something other than a movie.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
Why shouldnt we expect more from games, im not talking about the hype surrounding games these days, which tbh, you need to view with a healthy bit of scepticism. Even so how many games are made by the various companies just for the $$ they might make out of them, rather than because they really believe in the game itself, theres only one company i can look at and say with any degree of confidence, are designing/developing a game because they are really into it.. and thats CCP and Eve online.. and i do think that their trying to fullfil the players expectations, but are our expectations too high.. i'd say no.. unless we expect more out of the games we play, then we won't get it.. so keep on having high expectations, we'll never get exactly what we want.. but.. chances are, as things improve.. we'll at least be having fun playing the games that try to fullfil them.