Pay to win is not simply for PVP. Pay to win is when someone with money has an in game advantage over those who do not spend cash.
Ok, I'm a newbie to the game, I don't know anything about these tomes. Please help me out with some answers here:
What kind of advantage are we talking about here? When I hit 65 (or 50 or whatever) and start looking for raids to join, how often am I going to get "must have tomes to join" ?
How much less effective in combat will I be compared to having tomes given same skill and equipment? Am i going to be doing like 20% less dps or 2%?
Also, given LoTRO's system, it's not exactly true that you have pay cash for these, you have to pay Turbine Points, which can and are earned in-game.
How many points does it cost to buy a tome? And is it really harder to grind up that many TPs or to grind up a Tome drop or grind-up the gold for the tome?
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
Well Turbine (TimeWarner) ruined a great game... Now you have to spend $50 on "Tombs" to max your players stats out... Thanks for ruining a great game... 2 less subscribes Turbine!
You are right, that sucks. Those books should at least be possible to get in the game even if it is hard.
Well Turbine (TimeWarner) ruined a great game... Now you have to spend $50 on "Tombs" to max your players stats out... Thanks for ruining a great game... 2 less subscribes Turbine!
You are right, that sucks. Those books should at least be possible to get in the game even if it is hard.
They are.
IlgauskasLineage II CorrespondentMemberUncommonPosts: 58
I don't see what this fuss is all about. Seriously:
1. LOTRO is a PVE game where you could perform well without the boosts from those tomes. Have in mind, that there are stat caps.
Don't worry, pay your monthly subscription and in 1 year you will get this along with everything else people use the argument "but you can buy it with your monthly 500 TP" yet you're paying a subscription to live with a fully functional cash shop and they make you think you're getting extra stuff... heh, Turbine has done an awesome work here with this trap.
You don't NEED to buy anything from the shop as VIP - you also don't NEED to buy tomEs to succeed. In fact, they're a waste of money. Your main stats will be capped, or very nearly through gear anyways, and since this game is primarily PvE - it's really a non-issue.
^ This. It is tomEs with an E. Bloody grammar fails.
Indeed, LoTRO is not a PvP game (not for F2P anyway) so the capped stats = better to kill mobs yourself. What's wrong with paying abit to do that?
In fact, F2Pers complaining that you can buy perm stat boosts is like someone who is eating free food at their parent's house getting mad at their friend who goes to Pizza Hut and gets whatever they want. Guess what? People who are paying get more perks than those who don't. If your Mom makes meatloaf, and you don't like it but don't want to or don't have the money for Pizza Hut, don't complain when your friend wolfs down a medium deep pan pepperoni.
F2P is a milking scheme so I don't see what the problem is Anyone who starts to play a F2P game should know that to get everything you have to fork out huge amount of money. There is always an option not to pay for extras that are needed to max out your character but the truth is F2P games are designed for wealthier segment of players
I totally disagree. Many non-"wealthy" players don't want to sub. That's cool, that's fine. The benefit of the cash shop is that you can grind a bit, and maybe spend $7 a month for some extra points, and get a few extras the average froob doesn't. There are people who totally can afford a sub (like me) but don't want to pay $15 a month because then I will feel compelled to play it more. The F2P + cash shop gives me the option to buy a perk here and again, but I can play whenever and don't feel bad about NOT playing and wasting money. Or just sub a 3-month package and get a few points to spend in the months following after you downgrade back to F2P.
the fact that a player can get the whole game (including tombs! well tomes anyway...) without ever paying a penny is already a risk to turbine. it's a calculated risk given that very few players will ever do what it takes to play absolutely free.
yes, turbine is after your money. holy crap. a business designed to make money, it's downright anti-communist! let's start a revolution!
anyhow, i'd really appreciate answer to some of the tome-related questions i posed on the last page. i think it's hard to have this discussion with us newbies without us knowing all the details of these tomes and what they mean.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
the fact that a player can get the whole game (including tombs! well tomes anyway...) without ever paying a penny is already a risk to turbine. it's a calculated risk given that very few players will ever do what it takes to play absolutely free.
yes, turbine is after your money. holy crap. a business designed to make money, it's downright anti-communist! let's start a revolution!
anyhow, i'd really appreciate answer to some of the tome-related questions i posed on the last page. i think it's hard to have this discussion with us newbies without us knowing all the details of these tomes and what they mean.
Yeah damn that turbine for wanting to make money!
Tomes really don't mean shit in terms of making you competetive for a spot in a fellowship or raid, it's not that kind of game. They provide some advantage but anyone telling you that they are taking someone else over you because they have a tome and you don't is someone not really worth fellowing with anyway.
Pay to win is not simply for PVP. Pay to win is when someone with money has an in game advantage over those who do not spend cash.
Ok, I'm a newbie to the game, I don't know anything about these tomes. Please help me out with some answers here:
1. What kind of advantage are we talking about here? When I hit 65 (or 50 or whatever) and start looking for raids to join, how often am I going to get "must have tomes to join" ?
2. How much less effective in combat will I be compared to having tomes given same skill and equipment? Am i going to be doing like 20% less dps or 2%?
3. Also, given LoTRO's system, it's not exactly true that you have pay cash for these, you have to pay Turbine Points, which can and are earned in-game.
4. How many points does it cost to buy a tome? And is it really harder to grind up that many TPs or to grind up a Tome drop or grind-up the gold for the tome?
You asked for answers to these let me provide them:
1. There is no way for a raidleader to check your stats or see wether you have tomes or not, i do not believe that its possbile to notice a effect on your efficency. Latency, skill, gear and trait choices are much much bigger concerns here.
2. If you gear your char right you will not be doing any less DPS or HPS. Thats because every class only has 2 stats(major and minor) that affect their damage, and those are easily capped already. What people are talking about is extra will or fate on a champion or something(i.e. 3rd place and lower stats), and fate already is on diminishing returns anyway.
3. Turbine points or gold yes.
4. I don't know the AH prices, but my guess is that its easier to farm them ingame or buy with gold than to farm the TP points. Exception maybe the upper tiers, which drop in raids, which are on a timer, limiting their farming potential.
One dropped last night as a matter of fact, the +10 agility one. Dropped for my group in a low level 20ish instance.
So I am not sure wtf people are complaining about. You don't HAVE to buy anything with cash. And as for the item shop the only things I have seen available in the shop that you cant get in game are cosmetic items.
Comments
Ok, I'm a newbie to the game, I don't know anything about these tomes. Please help me out with some answers here:
What kind of advantage are we talking about here? When I hit 65 (or 50 or whatever) and start looking for raids to join, how often am I going to get "must have tomes to join" ?
How much less effective in combat will I be compared to having tomes given same skill and equipment? Am i going to be doing like 20% less dps or 2%?
Also, given LoTRO's system, it's not exactly true that you have pay cash for these, you have to pay Turbine Points, which can and are earned in-game.
How many points does it cost to buy a tome? And is it really harder to grind up that many TPs or to grind up a Tome drop or grind-up the gold for the tome?
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
You are right, that sucks. Those books should at least be possible to get in the game even if it is hard.
They are.
I don't see what this fuss is all about. Seriously:
1. LOTRO is a PVE game where you could perform well without the boosts from those tomes. Have in mind, that there are stat caps.
2. They can be obtained in game.
What's the problem?
Don't worry, pay your monthly subscription and in 1 year you will get this along with everything else people use the argument "but you can buy it with your monthly 500 TP" yet you're paying a subscription to live with a fully functional cash shop and they make you think you're getting extra stuff... heh, Turbine has done an awesome work here with this trap.
^ This. It is tomEs with an E. Bloody grammar fails.
Indeed, LoTRO is not a PvP game (not for F2P anyway) so the capped stats = better to kill mobs yourself. What's wrong with paying abit to do that?
In fact, F2Pers complaining that you can buy perm stat boosts is like someone who is eating free food at their parent's house getting mad at their friend who goes to Pizza Hut and gets whatever they want. Guess what? People who are paying get more perks than those who don't. If your Mom makes meatloaf, and you don't like it but don't want to or don't have the money for Pizza Hut, don't complain when your friend wolfs down a medium deep pan pepperoni.
insanex
I totally disagree. Many non-"wealthy" players don't want to sub. That's cool, that's fine. The benefit of the cash shop is that you can grind a bit, and maybe spend $7 a month for some extra points, and get a few extras the average froob doesn't. There are people who totally can afford a sub (like me) but don't want to pay $15 a month because then I will feel compelled to play it more. The F2P + cash shop gives me the option to buy a perk here and again, but I can play whenever and don't feel bad about NOT playing and wasting money. Or just sub a 3-month package and get a few points to spend in the months following after you downgrade back to F2P.
insanex
the fact that a player can get the whole game (including tombs! well tomes anyway...) without ever paying a penny is already a risk to turbine. it's a calculated risk given that very few players will ever do what it takes to play absolutely free.
yes, turbine is after your money. holy crap. a business designed to make money, it's downright anti-communist! let's start a revolution!
anyhow, i'd really appreciate answer to some of the tome-related questions i posed on the last page. i think it's hard to have this discussion with us newbies without us knowing all the details of these tomes and what they mean.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
Yeah damn that turbine for wanting to make money!
Tomes really don't mean shit in terms of making you competetive for a spot in a fellowship or raid, it's not that kind of game. They provide some advantage but anyone telling you that they are taking someone else over you because they have a tome and you don't is someone not really worth fellowing with anyway.
You asked for answers to these let me provide them:
1. There is no way for a raidleader to check your stats or see wether you have tomes or not, i do not believe that its possbile to notice a effect on your efficency. Latency, skill, gear and trait choices are much much bigger concerns here.
2. If you gear your char right you will not be doing any less DPS or HPS. Thats because every class only has 2 stats(major and minor) that affect their damage, and those are easily capped already. What people are talking about is extra will or fate on a champion or something(i.e. 3rd place and lower stats), and fate already is on diminishing returns anyway.
3. Turbine points or gold yes.
4. I don't know the AH prices, but my guess is that its easier to farm them ingame or buy with gold than to farm the TP points. Exception maybe the upper tiers, which drop in raids, which are on a timer, limiting their farming potential.
These books ARE AVAILABLE IN GAME.
One dropped last night as a matter of fact, the +10 agility one. Dropped for my group in a low level 20ish instance.
So I am not sure wtf people are complaining about. You don't HAVE to buy anything with cash. And as for the item shop the only things I have seen available in the shop that you cant get in game are cosmetic items.
There may be more but I have not run across them.