Another Sob Story to Add to the Bunch

SelfDestructPro

So I know you've probably seen about a hundred of these before, but you haven't quite seen mine I'm sure.  See I, like the idiot I must be, preordered the game to get into Beta.  I ended up being in Beta Block B.  I thought the game was interesting, but it lacked quite a bit in the quality.  Whenever I complained about the game, I would always get the same old "It's Beta" response.  But, the game never got better and I tried to get back my money for this game that I was convinced was worthless.  Months passed and no response about my refund.  Games started getting delivered and I never got mine.  I contacted support again, telling them that I still had not gotten my game and so I demanded my refund.  Someone contacted me back quite fast considering the dead silence that I received for my first refund request.  They said they sent another copy of the game and it would arrive soon.  It actually did.  I already had the client so there was really no point in having it anyway.

Meanwhile in the Mortal Online world, the game was still not getting any better.  I gave up and uninstalled the game.

More recently, a few days ago as a matter of fact, I was reading about this epic patch and how it was fixing pretty much everything that I was sure was wrong with the game back in the day.  I went out on a limb and subscribed to the game.

Big mistake.  I immediately regretted it.  First off, I tried installing the client using the DVD that I had originally bought.  That didn't work.  The game wouldn't patch, like at all.  So I downloaded the client off the site.  Well after 3 days it was finished patching.  I started up the game on my day off and tried creating a character.  That was a no go.  As soon as I made a character, and was a the select a starting location, I could go no further.  It was impossible to enter the world.  I tried recreating a character multiple times and it wouldn't work.

So I was getting pretty fed up at that point.  I tried again a few hours later and that time it was claiming that I was already logged in.  This error message displayed every login attempt for the next day.  Seriously.  I contacted support using the old e-mail address that they show on the refund policy PDF and got an automatic response saying that they no longer checked that and that I had to create a support ticket.  I thought, wow through this load of crap that they put people through they actually do SOMETHING intelligent.  So I send in a ticket asking for a refund on my subscription because I'm done with them, like forever.  I got a response back, a copy and paste response I might add, about how I should check and make sure that I meet the system requirements, that I've tried reinstalling the game, blah blah blah.  Everything on that response was basically blaming my problems on me and not their inability to properly patch, keep a stable server, yadda yadda.

At that point I just thought the whole thing was comical.  I responded back asking if they even read my ticket and to please just for the love of God, refund my money.  They responded back saying the following:

Hello Customer,





When you bought MortalOnline, you also actively agreed to our "terms and conditions" and "refund policy".

https://account.mortalonline.com/



You have the option if you login to your account to choose "do not renew". If you do so, no further withdrawals will be made from your account.



Refunds may be offered with respect to sales of the product on?line or through the Service only if

each of the following conditions is met:

1. The product has NOT been downloaded;

2. The product has NOT been used;

3. Your request for a refund is made within 48 hours from the time you purchase the product; and

4. Star Vault AB finds your request to be reasonable due to special circumstances.



NO REFUNDS OR CREDITS WILL BE OFFERED IF THE CLIENT HAS BEEN DOWNLOADED OR BEEN USED. ALL

SUCH SALES ARE FINAL.





Kind regards,



Mortal Online Support

 

Needless to say I have of course cancelled my subscription, but of course I'll never see any of that money ever again.  Anyway, in conclusion I advise everyone to steer clear of this game.  Seriously, there is nothing special about it, and it will just be a huge disappointment.  If you don't believe me, check out videos on Youtube.  You'll see that creatures still float.  Players still float.  Combat is the same as it was.  And you're still going to be dealing with the same launcher bullcrap that you had to in the beginning.  So there you have it.  My sob story.  Enjoy.

seraphis79

Just call your bank or credit card company and get a charge back.  I went down to my bank office and told them about the purchase and I got my money back instantly from the bank.

SelfDestructPro

You know, I think I will do that.  I didn't do it when I first preordered, but I wanted to.  I think I will this time though.

Slapshot1188

Your main argument at this point is that they have failed to deliver the actual working DVD to you.  Since you bought the "Boxed copy" you were promised the following:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

---

Boxed Version

EUR 43.95

(incl. VAT EUR 0.00)

• 
  Summer Offer - 20% discount
• 
  Embossed Metal Box
• 
  All pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD
• 
  Digital Download
• 
  Free future digital updates and expansions
• 
  Includes one month's game time
• 
  Includes shipping fee

---

 

Note that you never received "All pre-launch updated freely shipped on DVD"

 

Also, you may want to reference this post from Merlyn:

 

26th January 2010, 07:10

#161 (permalink)

Maerlyn vbmenu_register("postmenu_683696", true); Community Manager     Join Date: Mar 2009

Addressing the lack of a "manual" and the outdated client. A manual of the game does not make that much sense at this point really and it would have only suffered the fate of the client on the DVD - meaning it would almost certainly be outdated by the time it was delivered. We made it clear numerous times that a) the client on the DVD would be outdated by the time the boxes arrive and b) everybody who wants a version of the release client delivered again will get the option to do so once we release the game. We are currently working on something like a "manual", basically a very nice and thorough pdf explaining the basic systems of the game, the world and other things. We will make this available on the website as soon as it's done and of course keep this up to date. __________________ ~ Counselor Program ~ Teh law ~ Moderator Program ~ ~ Nothing screams "owned" like the chilly autumn breeze on your buttocks at the priest stone... -Milarepa

They promised to send updated and working DVDs at release but they have not done so and have ignored all requests for info about this for the last 6 months or so.

 

So I am not sure if you can get a refund at this point, but I think your best bet is to focus on the fact that they did not fulfill their contractual obligations to send "all pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD" and have seemingly reneged on their promise to ship functional and updated DVDs at launch (given it's now nearly launch +5 months...).

 

Good Luck.

 

 

 

 

PS: Also note that the Refund Policy and Terms of Service were different at the time you purchased the game than the ones they linked to you.   You may want to point that out to them.

cirsyndic

I had a similar experience with refund requests, particularly the complete black-out silence. In the end I phoned my CC and it was solved extremely promptly. The very nice lady also told me SV has been flagged in their database because of the refund requests, I wasn't really suprised other people took the same route. In hindsight, they never delivered the product they sold.

maharet

I would like to charge back both copies of the game I bought.  I have never done a charge back before.  What does your bank ask you for as proof to get a charge back??  And can you do a charge back if you used a debit card?

ImNewb

Originally posted by maharet

I would like to charge back both copies of the game I bought.  I have never done a charge back before.  What does your bank ask you for as proof to get a charge back??  And can you do a charge back if you used a debit card?

I just called my bank, explained that i had never recieved the product (box set and the DVD was also pre release game content) the game was not as advertised and i had contacted the company multiple times for a refund which they had refused, and i had the ticket and email proof should they require it. They asked me when i brought the game and what proof i had that it had never been as advertised - i just gave them the web forums address and told them there was adiquate proof right there. I had emalils from support, but they never asked for copies of those.

2 days later i had a email from SV asking for my address to send the box set too which i just ignored as the product would not be as it should be.

1 week later the refund was in my bank

cirsyndic

Originally posted by maharet

I would like to charge back both copies of the game I bought.  I have never done a charge back before.  What does your bank ask you for as proof to get a charge back??  And can you do a charge back if you used a debit card?

 

Call your bank and explain to them based on which copy you bought:

a) Box version

Simple, you've been waiting for 4-5 months now and you haven't received the product you paid for (release up-to-date DVD).

b) Download version

You've been waiting for 4-5 months now and you haven't received the product they advertised (False Advertising, serious lawsuit for companies in some countries), they changed the refund policy overnight, refund policy only applies to EU countries, refund policy is against the law; nobody is answering to refund mails etc.

If you really want a refund just pile it all in and do some research. Ultimately be a customer and demand you either get what you paid for, or get your money back. Works everywhere else in the world, MMO's aren't an exception in any court of law.

tvalentine

Failing to research a game before buying/subscribing, then bitching about not getting a refund. It's a shame the banks are giving these charge backs for irresponsible spending (yup keep blaming SV guys). They even said the game was going to be buggy and unfinished; posts here and reviews even reinforce the fact that the game is still in an incomplete state. Maybe if the banks didnt give charge backs more people would learn not to spend their money stupidly, it might reduce the amount of time it will take the economy to recover, but we'll never know with idiots still not learning how to spend their cash.

farginwar

Mortal Online. A tax on hope.

mmo22

Despite my convictions regarding SV i'm inclined to agree with the above poster.  You are at fault here, you purchased a subscription and used their product, why should a company pay the price for your fickleness.  Credit Institutions are too forgiving of uneducated spenders.  Needless to say, your account will be banned should you issue a charge back.

 

Do your research and think a moment before pressing that "Pay Now" button.

ImNewb

Originally posted by tvalentine

Failing to research a game before buying/subscribing, then bitching about not getting a refund. It's a shame the banks are giving these charge backs for irresponsible spending (yup keep blaming SV guys). They even said the game was going to be buggy and unfinished; posts here and reviews even reinforce the fact that the game is still in an incomplete state. Maybe if the banks didnt give charge backs more people would learn not to spend their money stupidly, it might reduce the amount of time it will take the economy to recover, but we'll never know with idiots still not learning how to spend their cash.

Actually i brought the game back in closed beta so to say that i didint do research is bull. If i had known that the box set was advertised wrong and that i would recieve a non-embossed box and closed beta old patcher DVD then i would of gone for the digital download.

I gave this game plenty of time to deliver at least something they advertised. They proved me wrong. You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/what-are-my-statutory-rights/

My account isnt banned with Mortal at all so thats a load of codswollop.

Slapshot1188

Originally posted by ImNewb

 You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

 DING DING DING!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!

 

The posters above you have it wrong.  The people who are spending "their money stupidly" are the ones that continue to accept unfinished and non-working garbage and never fight back.  When people stop letting these companies lower the bar WAY beyond what we would accept in any other industry we might actually start to see improvements instead of the steady downward spiral of quality that todays MMOs seem to think is fine and dandy.

 

When a company cannot even deliver functional discs to it's customers... promises "all pre launch updates freely delivered on DVD" (and doesn't deliver)... and promises updated "working" discs at release.... and hasn't delivered those nearly 5 months post launch... I am sorry but folks have EVERY right to a refund.

 

LeFantome

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by ImNewb

 You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

 DING DING DING!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!

 

The posters above you have it wrong.  The people who are spending "their money stupidly" are the ones that continue to accept unfinished and non-working garbage and never fight back.  When people stop letting these companies lower the bar WAY beyond what we would accept in any other industry we might actually start to see improvements instead of the steady downward spiral of quality that todays MMOs seem to think is fine and dandy.

 

When a company cannot even deliver functional discs to it's customers... promises "all pre launch updates freely delivered on DVD" (and doesn't deliver)... and promises updated "working" discs at release.... and hasn't delivered those nearly 5 months post launch... I am sorry but folks have EVERY right to a refund.

 

 He's right....

tvalentine

Originally posted by ImNewb

Originally posted by tvalentine

Failing to research a game before buying/subscribing, then bitching about not getting a refund. It's a shame the banks are giving these charge backs for irresponsible spending (yup keep blaming SV guys). They even said the game was going to be buggy and unfinished; posts here and reviews even reinforce the fact that the game is still in an incomplete state. Maybe if the banks didnt give charge backs more people would learn not to spend their money stupidly, it might reduce the amount of time it will take the economy to recover, but we'll never know with idiots still not learning how to spend their cash.

Actually i brought the game back in closed beta so to say that i didint do research is bull. If i had known that the box set was advertised wrong and that i would recieve a non-embossed box and closed beta old patcher DVD then i would of gone for the digital download.

I gave this game plenty of time to deliver at least something they advertised. They proved me wrong. You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/what-are-my-statutory-rights/

My account isnt banned with Mortal at all so thats a load of codswollop.

so what exactly are you not satisfied with? The fact the DVD doesnt work anymore, or that the game wasnt what you expected? And to answer your question, yes you still could have researched. You said you bought the game to get into the closed beta, while they were saying they would release an unifinished game. BTW i have a Lineage 2 CD from when it came out, and it doesnt work anymore. I didnt bitch, i just went online and downloaded it, like what you did. You still got the game, you played it and you paid for it. This self entitlment BS is old.

tvalentine

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by ImNewb

 You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

 DING DING DING!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!

 

The posters above you have it wrong.  The people who are spending "their money stupidly" are the ones that continue to accept unfinished and non-working garbage and never fight back. 

no, these are the people in the thread asking for charge backs.

When people stop letting these companies lower the bar WAY beyond what we would accept in any other industry we might actually start to see improvements instead of the steady downward spiral of quality that todays MMOs seem to think is fine and dandy.

With this knowledge in mind, why would you pre-order or buy a MMO at launch? ESPECIALLY one that is considered incomplete/unfinished by the developer behind it.

 

When a company cannot even deliver functional discs to it's customers... promises "all pre launch updates freely delivered on DVD" (and doesn't deliver)... and promises updated "working" discs at release.... and hasn't delivered those nearly 5 months post launch... I am sorry but folks have EVERY right to a refund.

if you want a dvd i can find an empty one and send it to you. There is a reason why there are digital downloads as well as DVD installs. You still got the game on your computer and played it, what are you missing?

 

keep trying to point fingers at everyone but yourself there buddy.

Slapshot1188

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by ImNewb

 You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

 DING DING DING!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!

 

The posters above you have it wrong.  The people who are spending "their money stupidly" are the ones that continue to accept unfinished and non-working garbage and never fight back. 

no, these are the people in the thread asking for charge backs.

When people stop letting these companies lower the bar WAY beyond what we would accept in any other industry we might actually start to see improvements instead of the steady downward spiral of quality that todays MMOs seem to think is fine and dandy.

With this knowledge in mind, why would you pre-order or buy a MMO at launch?

 

When a company cannot even deliver functional discs to it's customers... promises "all pre launch updates freely delivered on DVD" (and doesn't deliver)... and promises updated "working" discs at release.... and hasn't delivered those nearly 5 months post launch... I am sorry but folks have EVERY right to a refund.

if you want a dvd i can find an empty one and send it to you. There is a reason why there are digital downloads as well as DVD installs. You still got the game on your computer and played it

 

keep trying to point fingers at everyone but yourself there buddy.

 Please re-read what I posted and what you replied.   The company sent out DVDs that did not work.. on day one...  put it in the drive and nothing.  They later "fixed" it so that putting in the DVD would allow you to download the whole client from scratch.  This is not what they sold us.   The sold us not onlt a working DVD, but "ALL PRE-LAUNCH UPDATES FREELY SHIPPED ON DVD"... which they ALSO didn't deliver (go to the order page now.. still says the same stuff).  But wait, thats not all!   They ALSO promised to send working DVDs out at release to everyone. Didn;t do it 5 months post release.   Thats 3 strikes..  THEY"RE OUT.

 

So yeah... these folks have EVERY RIGHT to demand a refund.

tvalentine

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by ImNewb

 You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

 DING DING DING!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!

 

The posters above you have it wrong.  The people who are spending "their money stupidly" are the ones that continue to accept unfinished and non-working garbage and never fight back. 

no, these are the people in the thread asking for charge backs.

When people stop letting these companies lower the bar WAY beyond what we would accept in any other industry we might actually start to see improvements instead of the steady downward spiral of quality that todays MMOs seem to think is fine and dandy.

With this knowledge in mind, why would you pre-order or buy a MMO at launch?

 

When a company cannot even deliver functional discs to it's customers... promises "all pre launch updates freely delivered on DVD" (and doesn't deliver)... and promises updated "working" discs at release.... and hasn't delivered those nearly 5 months post launch... I am sorry but folks have EVERY right to a refund.

if you want a dvd i can find an empty one and send it to you. There is a reason why there are digital downloads as well as DVD installs. You still got the game on your computer and played it

 

keep trying to point fingers at everyone but yourself there buddy.

 

So yeah... these folks have EVERY RIGHT to demand a refund.

i might agree if they couldnt/didnt install the game. Otherwise they got their product, even if it wasnt on the dvd, they still got it and played it. They got their software. You're grasping at straws and excuses.

maharet

I did my research I have played since closed beta.  I understood and was told the game would be buggy and not finished.  But buggy and unfinished is not the same as buggy and unplayable.

 

Many times I could not play the game to game breaking bugs, or weeks (up to a month on my slagger) that I could not do anything because my skills were gone.  

 

And now with the EPIC patch that brought the EPIC bugs.  The game is much harder to play with the new broken mass of crap we have now.

 

Graphics look good but that is it.   

 

They have been developing this game for what 5 years??  What do they really truely have to show for it???  Not really anything.

 

And with the hype and bullshit that Henrik chooses to spew out of his mouth I feel I have been lied to about the game on many occasions on what I am playing and getting.

ImNewb

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by ImNewb

Originally posted by tvalentine

Failing to research a game before buying/subscribing, then bitching about not getting a refund. It's a shame the banks are giving these charge backs for irresponsible spending (yup keep blaming SV guys). They even said the game was going to be buggy and unfinished; posts here and reviews even reinforce the fact that the game is still in an incomplete state. Maybe if the banks didnt give charge backs more people would learn not to spend their money stupidly, it might reduce the amount of time it will take the economy to recover, but we'll never know with idiots still not learning how to spend their cash.

Actually i brought the game back in closed beta so to say that i didint do research is bull. If i had known that the box set was advertised wrong and that i would recieve a non-embossed box and closed beta old patcher DVD then i would of gone for the digital download.

I gave this game plenty of time to deliver at least something they advertised. They proved me wrong. You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/what-are-my-statutory-rights/

My account isnt banned with Mortal at all so thats a load of codswollop.

so what exactly are you not satisfied with? The fact the DVD doesnt work anymore, or that the game wasnt what you expected? And to answer your question, yes you still could have researched. You said you bought the game to get into the closed beta, while they were saying they would release an unifinished game. BTW i have a Lineage 2 CD from when it came out, and it doesnt work anymore. I didnt bitch, i just went online and downloaded it, like what you did. You still got the game, you played it and you paid for it. This self entitlment BS is old.

Thats your opinion, i have mine. I wanted a refund and i got it. End of story 

As for what im not satisfied with - list is far too long for posting

tvalentine

Originally posted by ImNewb

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by ImNewb

Originally posted by tvalentine

Failing to research a game before buying/subscribing, then bitching about not getting a refund. It's a shame the banks are giving these charge backs for irresponsible spending (yup keep blaming SV guys). They even said the game was going to be buggy and unfinished; posts here and reviews even reinforce the fact that the game is still in an incomplete state. Maybe if the banks didnt give charge backs more people would learn not to spend their money stupidly, it might reduce the amount of time it will take the economy to recover, but we'll never know with idiots still not learning how to spend their cash.

Actually i brought the game back in closed beta so to say that i didint do research is bull. If i had known that the box set was advertised wrong and that i would recieve a non-embossed box and closed beta old patcher DVD then i would of gone for the digital download.

I gave this game plenty of time to deliver at least something they advertised. They proved me wrong. You still have consumer rights when you purchase a MMO as you do with any other product you buy.

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/what-are-my-statutory-rights/

My account isnt banned with Mortal at all so thats a load of codswollop.

so what exactly are you not satisfied with? The fact the DVD doesnt work anymore, or that the game wasnt what you expected? And to answer your question, yes you still could have researched. You said you bought the game to get into the closed beta, while they were saying they would release an unifinished game. BTW i have a Lineage 2 CD from when it came out, and it doesnt work anymore. I didnt bitch, i just went online and downloaded it, like what you did. You still got the game, you played it and you paid for it. This self entitlment BS is old.

Thats your opinion, i have mine. I wanted a refund and i got it. End of story 

As for what im not satisfied with - list is far too long for posting

^ point proven

Slapshot1188

Originally posted by tvalentine

 i might agree if they couldnt/didnt install the game. Otherwise they got their product, even if it wasnt on the dvd, they still got it and played it. They got their software. You're grasping at straws and excuses.

 No.. you are 100% wrong.  People PAID for the disc AND the pre-launch updates.  They received NEIGHTER.  They also were promised the working DVD at launch.. which they DID NOT RECEIVE.   Many of these people simply asked SV to refund the difference between the digital and boxed versions.  There are multiple threads asking this.   Not a single one was answered by the company.  They did NOT get what they paid for.. the company not only screwed them but then ignored them.  They have EVERY RIGHT to a refund.  

 

People need to STOP defending shovelware companies and start to demand that companies do what they promise AND ship functioning and complete games.  By accepting shovelware, you encourage the next company to shovel even more incomplete/buggy stuff... a slippery slope which has lead us to Starvault and the current situation.   The people that need to wise up are not the ones demanding and obtaining refunds but rather those who are served "fill in your own word here" and just shrug it off.  Sorry, but when the company can't even send you a working DVD that you PAID FOR (and then ignore you when you ask for updates).. nor the "pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD" that you PAID FOR... nor the disc that was to be sent "at launch", they don't deserve your cash.  That's not the customer's fault for actually believing what a company says.  That is the conpany's fault for not delivering the product they sold.  This is why I and many.. MANY other people successfully received a chargeback (plus interest) for their purchase.  The company has no defense when it is clear they did not deliver what they sold.. AND IT'S IN PRINT ON THEIR OWN WEBPAGE.