I say to a degree it does. Most of it for me is centered around it just being a game and having fun and helping each other out. One of my pet peaves in mmos is player run economies. The only game that has come close to being tolerable has been eve. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
When I create a character I think a bit of the personality and values of that character. The character will then grow as I play him.
I don't model characters on myself, some of them are evil others good, some are patient while others impatient and so on.
I really don't think you should mix reality and fantasy, I have a feeling it might be a bad thing, I seen people who after a while have hard to tell what is real and what isn't because of it.
On the other hand is trying to see things from a different perspective important if you ever plan to understand other people so roleplaying can be good for people.
I have to admit that it was kinda hard the first times to play someone really evil or extreme in another way but it is just a game.
I don't really enjoy playing myself, in a MMO or P&P game (particularly "Cthuly now" where you actually play yourself, it rarely ends good), after all do I play myself the rest of the time amd the great possibility with roleplaying is that you can be almost anyone.
Same thing with religion, mixing that together with fantasy might not be the best idea.
I seperate my real and fantsy life so I voted no. My characters are all from goodie 2 shoes to villians.
. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
Err, ingame religions have little to do with christian belief.
Yes Paladin and Cleric are inspired by reallife examples, but thats really all.
But of course my ingame characters are influenced by my whole personality, and that includes my belief.
There is however not such a stupid direct influence, a la "I'm christian, therefore I play Paladin". Paladins are usually a very boring class to play.
Yeah, it's not 1:1 copy. But the general idea. Say you are Christian and belief in forgivance and leading a "pure" life, and you play Pally to somehow reflect that. Or you are a Pagan and play Shaman or Druid to relfect that. Just roughly of course.
Well, keep in mind I think people can play "evil" characters in these games and still be ethical. I don't really recall any game that has a true "good/evil" except EQ 2 perhaps. Did EQ have a good evil split? That be another.
I think someone can be "evil" and play it "evil" but not be an ass or verbally abusive, etc. unless it was in character. And I mean "in character". not some smart ass being an idiot in a game and then saying "well - I"m evil!".
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
One of my core beliefs is in balance, (as strange as that sounds) and my playstyle reflects that. I try and balance my characters when I play no matter what I do, and it allows me to also play classes fairly balanced. Its rare for me to min/max a character, because they only excel at one thing, while I prefer to be a balanced player and be able to do some of everything to support a group.
This also goes with factions, for example, in DCUO if heroes had more players I would have rolled villain, but on the server I chose it was villain heavy, so I ran hero. Likewise in SWTOR, I see a number of people already deciding on Empire, so to balance, I will go republic. (Yes, just me going republic is enough to balance the servers.) I also plan on going smuggler, or consular, one that can easily multiclass and take on different roles.
I just believe everything is better with balance and moderation, and it shows in my online characters.
I find that I always play from a morally grey perspective. I tend to react in a certain way in a given situation and pretty much always react in that same way when presented with a similar choice. The reason of course, is that my RL morals are presenting themselves in the game. I can overcome this predisposition if necessary, but it always makes me feel somehow compromised or sullied. And it's not just when I'm doing "the wrong thing" (according to what I would expect would be the societal consensus) but also when I do what would usually be considered "the right thing". It bothers me when I violate my personal ethics, even in a fictitious environment like a game.
I'm guessing we all paint our games with our own personal moral brushes. I probably just hold that brush a little tighter than others might.
. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
That sounds pretty realistic to me...
And there in is the problem. We are playing a game, not real life. So why bring all that greed into it and ruin the fun?
Here's some of the ways my morals have an impact on gameplay:
1) The Animal Kingdom - I have a great respect for animals. I believe strongly that animals suffer because of humanity. Neglect, ignorance, sport, and torture, animals suffer. This makes it difficult for me to kill animals in video games, I realize they're only pixels, but it's the idea that bothers me. Because of this, I sometimes avoid quests which require me to kill wolves or other wild animals. I often times find myself playing a character (such as the Hunter in WoW) which has an animal companion.
2) Drugs and Alcohol - I had enough of drugs and alcohol. Now with a damaged liver and multiple strikes on my record, I try to avoid drugs and alcohol no matter what. When I'm playing a video game, I want to forget about all that nonsense. But, there's a lot of people who like to brag about being drunk or high while playing a video game. Honestly, I think it's damn depressing when someone is drinking alone and playing a video game. At least go to the bar and hang out with friends, pick up some chicks, do something fun. And don't brag about being drunk or high. It's not an accomplishment worth bragging about. If you want to brag, brag about being sober and resisting the bottle. It's very easy to pick up a drink.
3) Religion - I claim no religion, but I keep an open mind. I consider it a possibility that there is some great creature which is all knowing and all powerful. But I don't dedicate my life to any of it. I respect and even follow many of the excellent moral lessons taught from various religions. The teachings within Taoism are some of my favorite. Basing my in-game experience from morals, I generally find myself playing a support class of some type, being that I like to help people IRL.
In summary - a lot of this is just sentimental. What's important to me may not be important to someone else. To each their own.
Well, keep in mind I think people can play "evil" characters in these games and still be ethical. I don't really recall any game that has a true "good/evil" except EQ 2 perhaps. Did EQ have a good evil split? That be another.
I think someone can be "evil" and play it "evil" but not be an ass or verbally abusive, etc. unless it was in character. And I mean "in character". not some smart ass being an idiot in a game and then saying "well - I"m evil!".
Yeah, there is a difference between being evil and an asshat.
I usually when I play evil tend to be the manical megalomaniac that laughs while the world suffer but that doesn't mean I spend my time griefing noobs or being rude just for being rude.
Real villians (at least the type I prefer) are evil with style.
. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
That sounds pretty realistic to me...
And there in is the problem. We are playing a game, not real life. So why bring all that greed into it and ruin the fun?
I know and I get your point but I just couldn't help myself.
There are a lot more faults to MMO economies than that and even Eve could be a lot better, it is one of the things that nneds a big improvement in the next few years.
Err, ingame religions have little to do with christian belief.
Yes Paladin and Cleric are inspired by reallife examples, but thats really all.
But of course my ingame characters are influenced by my whole personality, and that includes my belief.
There is however not such a stupid direct influence, a la "I'm christian, therefore I play Paladin". Paladins are usually a very boring class to play.
Yeah, it's not 1:1 copy. But the general idea. Say you are Christian and belief in forgivance and leading a "pure" life, and you play Pally to somehow reflect that. Or you are a Pagan and play Shaman or Druid to relfect that. Just roughly of course.
Well, keep in mind I think people can play "evil" characters in these games and still be ethical. I don't really recall any game that has a true "good/evil" except EQ 2 perhaps. Did EQ have a good evil split? That be another.
I think someone can be "evil" and play it "evil" but not be an ass or verbally abusive, etc. unless it was in character. And I mean "in character". not some smart ass being an idiot in a game and then saying "well - I"m evil!".
Heh, well yes, but keep in mind in EQ2, being and evil Freeport person did have no consequence whatsoever. You still helped people the same way via quests as any guy from Qeynos. And so with some of the older MMOs. Or MMos fixated on good like LOTRO. But people still can adapt via their own role or choice of class & race. Or you can have quests to make you ponder. Like my strong reaction to the "Jedi betray lovers" idea, where I just come to greatly disagree with a light-side & dark-side judgement of the developer. Or the Deathknight of WOW, where I just REALLY was put into stress doing all the evil stuff.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
That sounds pretty realistic to me...
And there in is the problem. We are playing a game, not real life. So why bring all that greed into it and ruin the fun?
My thoughts exactly. I remember the first time I ran into this greed in-game and found it hard to understand. These are virtual items, and yet people still get greedy about them? And even worse, try to justify that greed in all sorts of strange and wonderful ways.
. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
That sounds pretty realistic to me...
And there in is the problem. We are playing a game, not real life. So why bring all that greed into it and ruin the fun?
My thoughts exactly. I remember the first time I ran into this greed in-game and found it hard to understand. These are virtual items, and yet people still get greedy about them? And even worse, try to justify that greed in all sorts of strange and wonderful ways.
I wish people wouldn't summarily dismiss "virtual items" as being "nothing". True, they have no bearing on your real life, but people get greedy over these "virtual" items because they provide benefit in context of the game.
If you are in a game and you need to buy a virtual thing and it costs 25 gold then having 25 gold means you get that thing. Not having that 25 gold means you don't. Virtual gold buys virtual things in virtual games.
If an item will give a player greater benefit, whether in pvp, raiding, being able to store more virtual doodads then that item has value within the context of that game.
Try playing these games with no virtual gear at all and no virtual currency. Do you think you can rise through the ranks, explore the world, be successful in pvp/pve, etc?
My guess is no. In which case those virtual items have a very real effect on a player's game play.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Great idea for a discussion, Elikal. I've really enjoyed reading through all the replies so far, and thinking about my own stance.
In a nutshell, yes my ethics definitely do influence my gameply. I find it hard to kill animals and really enjoy those quests which rescue them from something or other (eg WoW's cure the deer of poison, and free the mammoths from the traps). I also really, really hate killing defenceless npc's such as the villagers at the start of Warhammer if you roll Chaos, or same in the starting area for Dark Knight in WOTLK. Makes me squirm, really. My behaviour in games, whether towards the pixels or other players, is the same as in the rest of life, ie I enjoy helping people, I love to chat and I don't want to attack defenceless animals/npc's/players. (Not that I attack any of those irl, of course).
The posts which were about playing a role different to real life intrigue me. I would love to do that, play around more with different aspects of my self, but somehow I always gravitate back to being "me" only in an mmo. Don't know what that says about me, but I do know I have loved reading all the different ways we approach our gaming.
I gotta say, in terms of playing the game itself, my RL ethics do not really influence how I play. I look at video games as a release. It's my window into a different world, but it's just that... a window. I'm not stepping through a door and becomming part of that world.
My character in game might go around and kill 20 boars, then go kill some thieves, and that it doesn't make me squeamish, but the thought of doing that IRL is apalling. I ran over a squirrel once driving up to a ski resort and it ruined my day.
It's a different world, different rules. Even in PvP... no qualms about getting the jump on an opponent who's not paying attention (I don't gank lowbies though... not cuz of ethics but because it's not fun).
My RL ethics mainly influence the way I talk with other people playing the game with me. I tend to speak with people in-game as I would if we were speaking face-to-face... if I wouldn't say it to the person's face, I won't say it in a chat window.
Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.
. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
That sounds pretty realistic to me...
And there in is the problem. We are playing a game, not real life. So why bring all that greed into it and ruin the fun?
My thoughts exactly. I remember the first time I ran into this greed in-game and found it hard to understand. These are virtual items, and yet people still get greedy about them? And even worse, try to justify that greed in all sorts of strange and wonderful ways.
I wish people wouldn't summarily dismiss "virtual items" as being "nothing". True, they have no bearing on your real life, but people get greedy over these "virtual" items because they provide benefit in context of the game.
If you are in a game and you need to buy a virtual thing and it costs 25 gold then having 25 gold means you get that thing. Not having that 25 gold means you don't. Virtual gold buys virtual things in virtual games.
If an item will give a player greater benefit, whether in pvp, raiding, being able to store more virtual doodads then that item has value within the context of that game.
Try playing these games with no virtual gear at all and no virtual currency. Do you think you can rise through the ranks, explore the world, be successful in pvp/pve, etc?
My guess is no. In which case those virtual items have a very real effect on a player's game play.
This is a very good point and it makes me realise I didn't elaborate enough on what I meant in my post. See, the thing is, we are talking about behaviour in games. So greed in a game (which is played, hopefully, primarily for enjoyment) still doesn't make much sense to me. Well, greed irl doesn't, either, so I guess it follows I won't like it in games either.
It is possible to play a game, surely, and get full enjoyment without indulging in behaviours like re-selling (my absolute pet hate). I take your point that some people will want certain items in order to progress more quickly through the game, but most games (I think) provide what you need to progress to end-game, it just might take longer to get the things you need. Also, there are different ways to get the desired goodies; running an instance over and over to get the drops for a particular armour set, or farming lots of mats to sell to raise the gold to buy it, or even collecting mats to make it for yourself, or asking another to make it, or questing to raise gold, are some examples.
Or you can decide that you will get your armour set or whatever by spending time at the auction house buying items and reselling them for a higher price which pushes prices up and also takes advantage of the generous person who posted the item at a reasonable/low price to begin with. To me that is greedy and not necessary in a game, but I know there are lots of people who will argue the opposite.
Very much so! As a compassionate person irl I have trouble killing players that are low lvl for example, because I know how it feels ;op So I never do it. As a horde I used to help alliance lowbies sometimes if they were about to die from a mob..lol ( i know..silly lol). Although I could kill other players my lvl with no problem ;op I believe who you are in real life reflects in the game 100% no doubt. If you're greedy irl you will be greedy in game, if you're rude irl you will be rude in game..etc;
I say there's a feedback loop between an MMO and myself. I say this as I think of my first experiences playing EQ ten years ago. As a total MMO newbie, I played according to my morals, and yet I was influenced in the game by other players. Generally for the better, as I was in a family type guild, and we were all very close. Not location wise, but friendship wise. That happens when you spend 20 hours with the same people every week for 3 years. It was very, highschool like too with girls getting crushes on guild mates etc. My brother and I have both had this happen to us.
Oh I'm rambbling.
Back to the feedback. Because there was such a tight, and generally positive community at the time in EQ, I was influenced to be a teacher type gamer when it comes to MMOs. I found it fun to teach newbies how to play, different strategies, etc. I'd do it every now and then in wow too. Just pick a random stranger that's having problems, and teach them. Though sometimes it backfires, as the person thinks they're the second coming. So I let those n00bs die.
One quest sticks out in WoW which I refused and was almost disgusted with the objective. It was one of the Kirin Tor quests in Borean Tundra which involved torturing a captured mage hunter from the blue dragonflight. What bothered me especially was the questgivers line which was something along the lines of "the Kirin Tor forbids this practice, so you do it for me".
When I was roleplaying I played very different characters, but their core beliefs are always my own. Don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal, help others when I can.
As a roleplayer I found I can play anyting except chaotic Evil characters.
Male, female, christian,muslim,budist,slave,slaveowner,lie,be honest, be good, be bad , light and dark..you name it I can play it whitout being affected rl at all. but slaying torturing evil dude/gal for no reason other then doing it i cant play, all gameplay actions must have a good reason.
as a non-roleplayer I am ingame who I am in RL whit a few behavior changes that I would not get away whit In RL :P
No it does not .The only thing that influences me is the story. If the NPC touches me in some way I might not be able to kill them . I tend to really like characters in the games I play. They make my mind up for me. Never actual beliefs because being a Hindu I should dislike Christians who in real life have often tried to tell me I was going to hell. I can never get over my friends who were perfectly cool before who have become 'born again ' Christians who have never failed to try and save me. I am always sad I have to constantly avoid them after. I play Christian like characters those zealots in games without any difficulty so no real life beliefs or ethics do not affect me. However if a character pisses me off I can kill them easily in a story.
My RL beliefs influence to an extent. As a Christian I definitely would not do anything malicious in a game like ninja looting. When I'm in a guild I am loyal and try to do things that benefit the guild and try not to cause drama. I do like playing pvp servers even though I rarely pvp, primarily because I like the added danger that comes with adventuring out in a pvp environment - which means I am not opposed to the occasional pking, although I will never camp a body unless I've been badly provoked. I'm not sure that any of the above really has anything to do with role playing exactly, but these are examples where my character and beliefs will not let me off the hook just because it is a game.
As for role playing, I find my beliefs usually do not impact much. For example, I could play a rogue and if picking pockets were part of the mechanics and greater story of the game I'd pick away. I could play an assassin without problems. I liken it to writing. A good author, regardless of his beliefs, should be able to write all kinds of characters well. I really see it as no different since I am "writing" my character as I go. I will say, though, that for games that include alignments I can't recall having ever played anything with an evil alignment - except for a short stint on the dark side in Fable.
The only time I have aversions to certain characters or classes or games in general is when they speak directly to my faith. For instance, I have a level 20 Warlock in WoW. I think a warlock is a great class to play. It's easy in that it has a pet but the mechanics of the class make it far more challenging than playing a hunter, which made warlock a very attractive option for me. That said - I put my warlock down probably 2 years ago and haven't looked back. I was unable to reconcile the fact that I, a Christian, was playing a class that has demons as its constant companions.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
Comments
I say to a degree it does. Most of it for me is centered around it just being a game and having fun and helping each other out. One of my pet peaves in mmos is player run economies. The only game that has come close to being tolerable has been eve. Everything else, people just want to be greedy bastards and gouge every nickle and dime out of the other players they can. Oh sure, there are some honest folks out there that dont do that, but they are usually swallowed up by the greedy and then resold at much higher prices. It really is the one thing that truely drives me crazy about mmos.
When I create a character I think a bit of the personality and values of that character. The character will then grow as I play him.
I don't model characters on myself, some of them are evil others good, some are patient while others impatient and so on.
I really don't think you should mix reality and fantasy, I have a feeling it might be a bad thing, I seen people who after a while have hard to tell what is real and what isn't because of it.
On the other hand is trying to see things from a different perspective important if you ever plan to understand other people so roleplaying can be good for people.
I have to admit that it was kinda hard the first times to play someone really evil or extreme in another way but it is just a game.
I don't really enjoy playing myself, in a MMO or P&P game (particularly "Cthuly now" where you actually play yourself, it rarely ends good), after all do I play myself the rest of the time amd the great possibility with roleplaying is that you can be almost anyone.
Same thing with religion, mixing that together with fantasy might not be the best idea.
I seperate my real and fantsy life so I voted no. My characters are all from goodie 2 shoes to villians.
That sounds pretty realistic to me...
Well, keep in mind I think people can play "evil" characters in these games and still be ethical. I don't really recall any game that has a true "good/evil" except EQ 2 perhaps. Did EQ have a good evil split? That be another.
I think someone can be "evil" and play it "evil" but not be an ass or verbally abusive, etc. unless it was in character. And I mean "in character". not some smart ass being an idiot in a game and then saying "well - I"m evil!".
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
One of my core beliefs is in balance, (as strange as that sounds) and my playstyle reflects that. I try and balance my characters when I play no matter what I do, and it allows me to also play classes fairly balanced. Its rare for me to min/max a character, because they only excel at one thing, while I prefer to be a balanced player and be able to do some of everything to support a group.
This also goes with factions, for example, in DCUO if heroes had more players I would have rolled villain, but on the server I chose it was villain heavy, so I ran hero. Likewise in SWTOR, I see a number of people already deciding on Empire, so to balance, I will go republic. (Yes, just me going republic is enough to balance the servers.) I also plan on going smuggler, or consular, one that can easily multiclass and take on different roles.
I just believe everything is better with balance and moderation, and it shows in my online characters.
I find that I always play from a morally grey perspective. I tend to react in a certain way in a given situation and pretty much always react in that same way when presented with a similar choice. The reason of course, is that my RL morals are presenting themselves in the game. I can overcome this predisposition if necessary, but it always makes me feel somehow compromised or sullied. And it's not just when I'm doing "the wrong thing" (according to what I would expect would be the societal consensus) but also when I do what would usually be considered "the right thing". It bothers me when I violate my personal ethics, even in a fictitious environment like a game.
I'm guessing we all paint our games with our own personal moral brushes. I probably just hold that brush a little tighter than others might.
And there in is the problem. We are playing a game, not real life. So why bring all that greed into it and ruin the fun?
Here's some of the ways my morals have an impact on gameplay:
1) The Animal Kingdom - I have a great respect for animals. I believe strongly that animals suffer because of humanity. Neglect, ignorance, sport, and torture, animals suffer. This makes it difficult for me to kill animals in video games, I realize they're only pixels, but it's the idea that bothers me. Because of this, I sometimes avoid quests which require me to kill wolves or other wild animals. I often times find myself playing a character (such as the Hunter in WoW) which has an animal companion.
2) Drugs and Alcohol - I had enough of drugs and alcohol. Now with a damaged liver and multiple strikes on my record, I try to avoid drugs and alcohol no matter what. When I'm playing a video game, I want to forget about all that nonsense. But, there's a lot of people who like to brag about being drunk or high while playing a video game. Honestly, I think it's damn depressing when someone is drinking alone and playing a video game. At least go to the bar and hang out with friends, pick up some chicks, do something fun. And don't brag about being drunk or high. It's not an accomplishment worth bragging about. If you want to brag, brag about being sober and resisting the bottle. It's very easy to pick up a drink.
3) Religion - I claim no religion, but I keep an open mind. I consider it a possibility that there is some great creature which is all knowing and all powerful. But I don't dedicate my life to any of it. I respect and even follow many of the excellent moral lessons taught from various religions. The teachings within Taoism are some of my favorite. Basing my in-game experience from morals, I generally find myself playing a support class of some type, being that I like to help people IRL.
In summary - a lot of this is just sentimental. What's important to me may not be important to someone else. To each their own.
Yeah, there is a difference between being evil and an asshat.
I usually when I play evil tend to be the manical megalomaniac that laughs while the world suffer but that doesn't mean I spend my time griefing noobs or being rude just for being rude.
Real villians (at least the type I prefer) are evil with style.
My favorite villian actor is Tim curry.
I am a strong beleiver in live and let live, so I'm stuck at level 1.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
I know and I get your point but I just couldn't help myself.
There are a lot more faults to MMO economies than that and even Eve could be a lot better, it is one of the things that nneds a big improvement in the next few years.
Heh, well yes, but keep in mind in EQ2, being and evil Freeport person did have no consequence whatsoever. You still helped people the same way via quests as any guy from Qeynos. And so with some of the older MMOs. Or MMos fixated on good like LOTRO. But people still can adapt via their own role or choice of class & race. Or you can have quests to make you ponder. Like my strong reaction to the "Jedi betray lovers" idea, where I just come to greatly disagree with a light-side & dark-side judgement of the developer. Or the Deathknight of WOW, where I just REALLY was put into stress doing all the evil stuff.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
My thoughts exactly. I remember the first time I ran into this greed in-game and found it hard to understand. These are virtual items, and yet people still get greedy about them? And even worse, try to justify that greed in all sorts of strange and wonderful ways.
I wish people wouldn't summarily dismiss "virtual items" as being "nothing". True, they have no bearing on your real life, but people get greedy over these "virtual" items because they provide benefit in context of the game.
If you are in a game and you need to buy a virtual thing and it costs 25 gold then having 25 gold means you get that thing. Not having that 25 gold means you don't. Virtual gold buys virtual things in virtual games.
If an item will give a player greater benefit, whether in pvp, raiding, being able to store more virtual doodads then that item has value within the context of that game.
Try playing these games with no virtual gear at all and no virtual currency. Do you think you can rise through the ranks, explore the world, be successful in pvp/pve, etc?
My guess is no. In which case those virtual items have a very real effect on a player's game play.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Great idea for a discussion, Elikal. I've really enjoyed reading through all the replies so far, and thinking about my own stance.
In a nutshell, yes my ethics definitely do influence my gameply. I find it hard to kill animals and really enjoy those quests which rescue them from something or other (eg WoW's cure the deer of poison, and free the mammoths from the traps). I also really, really hate killing defenceless npc's such as the villagers at the start of Warhammer if you roll Chaos, or same in the starting area for Dark Knight in WOTLK. Makes me squirm, really. My behaviour in games, whether towards the pixels or other players, is the same as in the rest of life, ie I enjoy helping people, I love to chat and I don't want to attack defenceless animals/npc's/players. (Not that I attack any of those irl, of course).
The posts which were about playing a role different to real life intrigue me. I would love to do that, play around more with different aspects of my self, but somehow I always gravitate back to being "me" only in an mmo. Don't know what that says about me, but I do know I have loved reading all the different ways we approach our gaming.
Great thread!
I gotta say, in terms of playing the game itself, my RL ethics do not really influence how I play. I look at video games as a release. It's my window into a different world, but it's just that... a window. I'm not stepping through a door and becomming part of that world.
My character in game might go around and kill 20 boars, then go kill some thieves, and that it doesn't make me squeamish, but the thought of doing that IRL is apalling. I ran over a squirrel once driving up to a ski resort and it ruined my day.
It's a different world, different rules. Even in PvP... no qualms about getting the jump on an opponent who's not paying attention (I don't gank lowbies though... not cuz of ethics but because it's not fun).
My RL ethics mainly influence the way I talk with other people playing the game with me. I tend to speak with people in-game as I would if we were speaking face-to-face... if I wouldn't say it to the person's face, I won't say it in a chat window.
Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.
This is a very good point and it makes me realise I didn't elaborate enough on what I meant in my post. See, the thing is, we are talking about behaviour in games. So greed in a game (which is played, hopefully, primarily for enjoyment) still doesn't make much sense to me. Well, greed irl doesn't, either, so I guess it follows I won't like it in games either.
It is possible to play a game, surely, and get full enjoyment without indulging in behaviours like re-selling (my absolute pet hate). I take your point that some people will want certain items in order to progress more quickly through the game, but most games (I think) provide what you need to progress to end-game, it just might take longer to get the things you need. Also, there are different ways to get the desired goodies; running an instance over and over to get the drops for a particular armour set, or farming lots of mats to sell to raise the gold to buy it, or even collecting mats to make it for yourself, or asking another to make it, or questing to raise gold, are some examples.
Or you can decide that you will get your armour set or whatever by spending time at the auction house buying items and reselling them for a higher price which pushes prices up and also takes advantage of the generous person who posted the item at a reasonable/low price to begin with. To me that is greedy and not necessary in a game, but I know there are lots of people who will argue the opposite.
Very much so! As a compassionate person irl I have trouble killing players that are low lvl for example, because I know how it feels ;op So I never do it. As a horde I used to help alliance lowbies sometimes if they were about to die from a mob..lol ( i know..silly lol). Although I could kill other players my lvl with no problem ;op I believe who you are in real life reflects in the game 100% no doubt. If you're greedy irl you will be greedy in game, if you're rude irl you will be rude in game..etc;
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
I say there's a feedback loop between an MMO and myself. I say this as I think of my first experiences playing EQ ten years ago. As a total MMO newbie, I played according to my morals, and yet I was influenced in the game by other players. Generally for the better, as I was in a family type guild, and we were all very close. Not location wise, but friendship wise. That happens when you spend 20 hours with the same people every week for 3 years. It was very, highschool like too with girls getting crushes on guild mates etc. My brother and I have both had this happen to us.
Oh I'm rambbling.
Back to the feedback. Because there was such a tight, and generally positive community at the time in EQ, I was influenced to be a teacher type gamer when it comes to MMOs. I found it fun to teach newbies how to play, different strategies, etc. I'd do it every now and then in wow too. Just pick a random stranger that's having problems, and teach them. Though sometimes it backfires, as the person thinks they're the second coming. So I let those n00bs die.
I think you will find you see people in MMO's for what they really are. When the doors are closed and no one is watching.
As for "religious Christian" should never be playing. Anything to do with magic and such is made very clear as a NO NO!
One quest sticks out in WoW which I refused and was almost disgusted with the objective. It was one of the Kirin Tor quests in Borean Tundra which involved torturing a captured mage hunter from the blue dragonflight. What bothered me especially was the questgivers line which was something along the lines of "the Kirin Tor forbids this practice, so you do it for me".
When I was roleplaying I played very different characters, but their core beliefs are always my own. Don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal, help others when I can.
As a roleplayer I found I can play anyting except chaotic Evil characters.
Male, female, christian,muslim,budist,slave,slaveowner,lie,be honest, be good, be bad , light and dark..you name it I can play it whitout being affected rl at all. but slaying torturing evil dude/gal for no reason other then doing it i cant play, all gameplay actions must have a good reason.
as a non-roleplayer I am ingame who I am in RL whit a few behavior changes that I would not get away whit In RL :P
No it does not .The only thing that influences me is the story. If the NPC touches me in some way I might not be able to kill them . I tend to really like characters in the games I play. They make my mind up for me. Never actual beliefs because being a Hindu I should dislike Christians who in real life have often tried to tell me I was going to hell. I can never get over my friends who were perfectly cool before who have become 'born again ' Christians who have never failed to try and save me. I am always sad I have to constantly avoid them after. I play Christian like characters those zealots in games without any difficulty so no real life beliefs or ethics do not affect me. However if a character pisses me off I can kill them easily in a story.
My RL beliefs influence to an extent. As a Christian I definitely would not do anything malicious in a game like ninja looting. When I'm in a guild I am loyal and try to do things that benefit the guild and try not to cause drama. I do like playing pvp servers even though I rarely pvp, primarily because I like the added danger that comes with adventuring out in a pvp environment - which means I am not opposed to the occasional pking, although I will never camp a body unless I've been badly provoked. I'm not sure that any of the above really has anything to do with role playing exactly, but these are examples where my character and beliefs will not let me off the hook just because it is a game.
As for role playing, I find my beliefs usually do not impact much. For example, I could play a rogue and if picking pockets were part of the mechanics and greater story of the game I'd pick away. I could play an assassin without problems. I liken it to writing. A good author, regardless of his beliefs, should be able to write all kinds of characters well. I really see it as no different since I am "writing" my character as I go. I will say, though, that for games that include alignments I can't recall having ever played anything with an evil alignment - except for a short stint on the dark side in Fable.
The only time I have aversions to certain characters or classes or games in general is when they speak directly to my faith. For instance, I have a level 20 Warlock in WoW. I think a warlock is a great class to play. It's easy in that it has a pet but the mechanics of the class make it far more challenging than playing a hunter, which made warlock a very attractive option for me. That said - I put my warlock down probably 2 years ago and haven't looked back. I was unable to reconcile the fact that I, a Christian, was playing a class that has demons as its constant companions.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!