Originally posted by xplororor Originally posted by _Jord_ I do feel that hardcore MMO'ers wll feel a bit threatened though. I mean if you're like me and have spent 75+ DAYS of playtime to reach cap, it's hard to imagine dropping it and joining a game in which cap can be reached in 10 days of playtime. Please name me all the MMORPGs in which you can reach the cap aka the highest level in 10 days playing time? How many hours each day is your example playing? Some people play 1 hour a day so in 10 days will play 10 hours. Some play 10 hours a day, so in 10 days will play 100 hours.
In response to the question 'WoW, why play anything else?'
WoW is just too shallow for my liking.
WoW tells you how to play, you WILL kill lots of NPC monsters or perform lots of quests, you don't have the choice to do anything else (that is if you want to advance in the game).
You are not unique, you will often find players that have the exact same skills/abilities that you have, simply because they chose the same class.
It is unimmersive/unrealistic, with instant messaging across the world, names floating above heads and no way to attack another player that annoys you, among many other things, the game just feels unrealistic to me.
These are just some of the reasons why I will play something else.
I don't care that WoW is your perfect game, I hope you have lots of fun with it. But it just doesn't work for me, I'm waiting for Darkfall or Trials of Ascension. These games in my opinion are FAR superior to WoW.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Originally posted by geld In response to the question 'WoW, why play anything else?' WoW is just too shallow for my liking. WoW tells you how to play, you WILL kill lots of NPC monsters or perform lots of quests, you don't have the choice to do anything else (that is if you want to advance in the game). You are not unique, you will often find players that have the exact same skills/abilities that you have, simply because they chose the same class. It is unimmersive/unrealistic, with instant messaging across the world, names floating above heads and no way to attack another player that annoys you, among many other things, the game just feels unrealistic to me. These are just some of the reasons why I will play something else. I don't care that WoW is your perfect game, I hope you have lots of fun with it. But it just doesn't work for me, I'm waiting for Darkfall or Trials of Ascension. These games in my opinion are FAR superior to WoW.
Talents allow you to spec your character so he's different from another character of the same race and class, but you obviously didn't know that so I'll let you off.
You don't like the names above peoples heads? Turn them off. There ya go.
Your criticism of the game "forcing" you to play a certain way is slightly justified (you can't be a pure crafter for example), but since it's Warcraft and the game will end up being focussed around the combat element, I feel this is more than justified. You don't like fighting? Go play A Tale in the Desert.
I especially liked the bit where you said that two games that haven't even been released are better than one that has. A lot of people on this forum claim to have an ability to see into the future, but I have a feeling the laws of physics aren't gonna be working with you on this one.
Originally posted by geld 1. you WILL kill lots of NPC monsters or perform lots of quests, you don't have the choice to do anything else (that is if you want to advance in the game). 2. You are not unique, you will often find players that have the exact same skills/abilities that you have, simply because they chose the same class. 3. It is unimmersive/unrealistic, with instant messaging across the world, names floating above heads and no way to attack another player that annoys you, among many other things, the game just feels unrealistic to me. 4. These are just some of the reasons why I will play something else. 5. I don't care that WoW is your perfect game, I hope you have lots of fun with it. But it just doesn't work for me, I'm waiting for Darkfall or Trials of Ascension. These games in my opinion are FAR superior to WoW.
1. you can mine, fish, blacksmith etc. What else could there be?
2. You are mad because other players have the same abilities you do? name 1 mmorpg that has so many abilities that nearly no 2 players have the same skills.
3. Once again, most (if not all) other mmorpgs have messagin accross the world and names above the heads. Would you rather not be able to whisper messages to friends? If this still bothers you turn the names above the heads off (have fun figuring out whos talking to you) and mute the chat channels you don't want. Theres no way to attack someone who annoys you because that would cause chaos, think about it. Someone annoys you so you kill them, you get no penalty for doing so, so their are groups dedicated to running around killing random people. the entire game turns into trying to find the best hiding spot so you don't get instantly killed.
4. Ya, I guess theres always........nothing? Theres no mmorpg out there that has the features you want.
5. What do these games offer that WoW doesn't? (seriously I want to know, I'm not some closed minded WoW fanboy)
Originally posted by seabass20011 you're a hardcore fanboy if you think WoW has class variety and customisation o.o
Why's that?
Are you able to actually explain why, or are you just gonna hide behind the meaningless word "fanboy" like everyone else on this forum who can't back up their opinions with facts?
Ok I guess noone will let me get away with a less than adequately detailed explanation of why I don't like WoW. So I will try to explain in more detail.
The whole class/level based system is obsolete in my opinion, once you have picked a class thats it, you are stuck with that choice throughout the game, this limits your choices, and defines your role. Basically if you choose warrior, regardless of the talents you specified your role in a party remains the same, the tank, to take damage and deal it out. Same with a mage, you have certain mezzes, stuns, holds, but mostly your job is do deal a lot of damage at a range and stay away from the enemies because you will die quickly. Yes talents allow you to specialise in certain areas, making you different from other players who play the same class, but not significantly different. Some may specialise in strength and weapon skills, while others may specialise in stamina and defensive talents. Also you are able to choose a profession on top of that to further customize yourself. WoW is definately the best class/level based game I have ever seen, but it still doesn't even compare to a pure skill based game in my opinion. In a skill based system there are no limits to what you can do, you want to be good at magic? Fine, you also want to be good at swordsmanship, also fine, the choice is completely yours, and that makes the difference. Each skill will be trained independantly of each other, meaning you could be the best blacksmith in the world and yet not have a clue how to actually fight with a sword. Which is that way it should be I reckon. Darkfall has 500 skills planned, so IF they deliver on all of their promises then I believe it will be a much better game than WoW just for this reason.
Now I mentioned that WoW forces you to play a certain way, now that isn't 100% accurate you CAN do other things. You can be a fisherman, miner, herbalist, skinner, alchemist, blacksmith, cook, engineer, leatherworker, tailor, enchanter and medic. But you are only allowed to learn 2 of these, thats it. So again, you are stuck, like if you want to be a blacksmith you really need to get mining as well in order to be able to smith, or else you will be relying on other players to provide you with ore. Now you CAN'T go fishing, since you have learnt all the professions you are allowed. If you want to be a crafter, then WoW really isn't a good game for you. Unless you are happy being able to do only 2 things. This is not enough for me, I need to know that if I want I can take my fishing rod and just relax at the docks catching fish, then go plant some crops and start a farm, or build a house or a ship, whatever I want to do. This is why I prefer Darkfalls features over WoWs, because I am free to do what I want.
WoW is definately focused on the grind, if you want to get anywhere you have no choice but to grind (kill monsters repeatedly or do quests). I don't see why you should EVER have to kill monsters, why would that make you stronger anyway? It's just unrealistic. Thats why a skill based game is better, you can practice your skills in many different ways, whether sparring your friends, attacking a sparring dummy, or hunting monsters in the forest, all of these make you stronger. In WoW you only get stronger from killing the enemy (or doing a quest) you never get stronger from STRIKING an enemy, which is how it should be, whether the enemy dies should be irrelevant. This is one reason why skill based games are better whether combat, or non combat skills, they should go up simply by using the skill. Again Darkfalls features are ahead in this department.
Now I mentioned realism, thats another big thing for me. I like the game to just feel realistic. OK names above heads is one thing, yes I CAN turn that off. But then everyone else will see my name and I won't see theirs so that would just be a stupid thing to do. No class based game cares about realism much, so I'm sure I can find many other examples of unrealisitc features once I start playing the game. Some unrealistic features that level based games have (all of which I think are stupid ideas): (I'm not sure if any of these are in WoW so please let me know).
NPCs that never move they just stand still so you can recieve quests/items/whatever from them.
Weapons/armour that cannot be used until a certain level.
Weapons that cannot be used by certain classes/races.
Instant messaging worldwide without any attempt to explain how.
When an NPC explains how to do something in game that should be explained out of game only (like in EQ1 an NPC explained to me the colour coded conning system, if their name appears blue they are just below your level, etc...)
There are other examples but I think I have provided enough for now.
There is also a matter of PVP, I feel PVP is very important for keeping the game entertaining. But PVP in WoW seems pointless and not fun. You can only PVP in the battlegrounds areas, and only at higher levels (or you will get slaughtered). All you really do is fight again and again, like counterstrike except with swords and spells. Don't you think this sort of PVP will get boring? I do. Open PVP is much better in my opinion. You will always be in different situations, fighting for different reasons. Maybe a large scale siege on a player run town, or maybe a small one on one battle with a criminal you just caught killing and looting someone. Since the PVP opportunites in open PVP are virtually endless, so is the level of fun.
So basically, I think that sums up a lot of the reasons why I can't play WoW. I will hold out until Darkfall or another good skill based, open PVP game comes out.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Originally posted by geld Now I mentioned that WoW forces you to play a certain way, now that isn't 100% accurate you CAN do other things. You can be a fisherman, miner, herbalist, skinner, alchemist, blacksmith, cook, engineer, leatherworker, tailor, enchanter and medic. But you are only allowed to learn 2 of these, thats it. So again, you are stuck, like if you want to be a blacksmith you really need to get mining as well in order to be able to smith, or else you will be relying on other players to provide you with ore. Now you CAN'T go fishing, since you have learnt all the professions you are allowed. If you want to be a crafter, then WoW really isn't a good game for you. Unless you are happy being able to do only 2 things. This is not enough for me, I need to know that if I want I can take my fishing rod and just relax at the docks catching fish, then go plant some crops and start a farm, or build a house or a ship, whatever I want to do. This is why I prefer Darkfalls features over WoWs, because I am free to do what I want.
Wrong.
You can choose two primary professions, and you can also take on one or more secondary professions. It's all laid out in plain English HERE. So if you want to be a Miner/Blacksmith, or an Alchemist/Herbalist, or a Skinner/Enchanter, or a Skinner/Leatherworker (etc) you can also do one or all of the following: First Aid, Fishing, and Cooking.
Do a little research in future and you might be a little less uninformed.
I stopped reading your post at that point. You're obviously hung up on Darkfall and have taken the typically treacherous gamers gamble of deciding a game is great before you've even played it, so I'll just wish you the very best of luck.
Originally posted by geld Now I mentioned that WoW forces you to play a certain way, now that isn't 100% accurate you CAN do other things. You can be a fisherman, miner, herbalist, skinner, alchemist, blacksmith, cook, engineer, leatherworker, tailor, enchanter and medic. But you are only allowed to learn 2 of these, thats it. So again, you are stuck, like if you want to be a blacksmith you really need to get mining as well in order to be able to smith, or else you will be relying on other players to provide you with ore. Now you CAN'T go fishing, since you have learnt all the professions you are allowed. If you want to be a crafter, then WoW really isn't a good game for you. Unless you are happy being able to do only 2 things. This is not enough for me, I need to know that if I want I can take my fishing rod and just relax at the docks catching fish, then go plant some crops and start a farm, or build a house or a ship, whatever I want to do. This is why I prefer Darkfalls features over WoWs, because I am free to do what I want.
Wrong.
You can choose two primary professions, and you can also take on one or more secondary professions. It's all laid out in plain English HERE. So if you want to be a Miner/Blacksmith, or an Alchemist/Herbalist, or a Skinner/Enchanter, or a Skinner/Leatherworker (etc) you can also do one or all of the following: First Aid, Fishing, and Cooking.
Do a little research in future and you might be a little less uninformed.
I stopped reading your post at that point. You're obviously hung up on Darkfall and have taken the typically treacherous gamers gamble of deciding a game is great before you've even played it, so I'll just wish you the very best of luck.
Sorry as I said I haven't played the game, I didn't realise you get 4 proffessions, not 2. Yet my point still stands. So you can choose 4 professions, thats still nothing compared to the game I'm looking forward to. If you want to be a crafter you need to be able to learn a lot more professions than 4, otherwise you will have a very boring, shallow game to look forward to. It's obvious the whole crafting system is added in as an afterthough in WoW and is not going to provide much long term enjoyment on it's own.
So I made 1 simple mistake (a mistake that doesn't make much of an impact on my overall argument) and all you do is point out the one mistake, and use that to try to discredit everything I said. Thats no way to argue, why don't you read the rest of my post and then tell me why I would like WoW? That would really help your argument.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Originally posted by geld Originally posted by firemagicOriginally posted by geldNow I mentioned that WoW forces you to play a certain way, now that isn't 100% accurate you CAN do other things. You can be a fisherman, miner, herbalist, skinner, alchemist, blacksmith, cook, engineer, leatherworker, tailor, enchanter and medic. But you are only allowed to learn 2 of these, thats it. So again, you are stuck, like if you want to be a blacksmith you really need to get mining as well in order to be able to smith, or else you will be relying on other players to provide you with ore. Now you CAN'T go fishing, since you have learnt all the professions you are allowed. If you want to be a crafter, then WoW really isn't a good game for you. Unless you are happy being able to do only 2 things. This is not enough for me, I need to know that if I want I can take my fishing rod and just relax at the docks catching fish, then go plant some crops and start a farm, or build a house or a ship, whatever I want to do. This is why I prefer Darkfalls features over WoWs, because I am free to do what I want.Wrong. You can choose two primary professions, and you can also take on one or more secondary professions. It's all laid out in plain English HERE. So if you want to be a Miner/Blacksmith, or an Alchemist/Herbalist, or a Skinner/Enchanter, or a Skinner/Leatherworker (etc) you can also do one or all of the following: First Aid, Fishing, and Cooking. Do a little research in future and you might be a little less uninformed. I stopped reading your post at that point. You're obviously hung up on Darkfall and have taken the typically treacherous gamers gamble of deciding a game is great before you've even played it, so I'll just wish you the very best of luck.Sorry as I said I haven't played the game, I didn't realise you get 4 proffessions, not 2. Yet my point still stands. So you can choose 4 professions, thats still nothing compared to the game I'm looking forward to. If you want to be a crafter you need to be able to learn a lot more professions than 4, otherwise you will have a very boring, shallow game to look forward to. It's obvious the whole crafting system is added in as an afterthough in WoW and is not going to provide much long term enjoyment on it's own. So I made 1 simple mistake (a mistake that doesn't make much of an impact on my overall argument) and all you do is point out the one mistake, and use that to try to discredit everything I said. Thats no way to argue, why don't you read the rest of my post and then tell me why I would like WoW? That would really help your argument.
You still got it wrong. You can have up to five professions, and maybe that isn't as many as Darkfall promises to have, and Darkfall may yet prove to be a much more enjoyable game than WoW (in which case, I'll be playing Darkfall). The fact is though, comparing a game you haven't played that is released to a game you haven't played that isn't released just isn't a particularly intelligent thing to do.
I have no "argument" as to why you might like WoW. In fact I'm almost 100% certain you wouldn't like it as you're one of these incredibly clever people who's decided they don't like it before they've even tried it, and preconceived opinions don't usually change. I was simply correcting your mistake, and have zero concern for whether you want to play WoW or not.
The fact that you can make such a bold statement as "It's obvious the whole crafting system is added in as an afterthough [sic] in WoW and is not going to provide much long term enjoyment on it's own." without actually having experienced the tradeskills, or even any one single element of the game at all is just hilarious.
Originally posted by Worf Why should I play WOW?Don't see anything that catches MY interests.Don't get me wrong it looks like a nice game but it isn't a game that I'd want to play.I'm currently playing a variety of games and game styles.Including: Half Life 2, Star Wars Battlefront, ... as well as some newer and older games, some offline and others online.Hope you are enjoying it.Another reason that I'm not playing WOW is the Pay to Play stuff.Couldn't afford it if I wanted to at this point in time.Why should I waste ALL my gaming budget for a year in ONLY 1 game that I wouldn't be able to play after that timeframe?I'd rather take that same money and buy 3 or 4 really good games that can be played both Online and Offline for FREE!none
What the freaking hell are you doing on MMORPG.COM then? Oh you're just here for the free crappy MMORPGs... I see. Sheesh.
Well, your loss buddy. You just have to become addicted to 1 MMORPG to become a MMORPG addict.
That's what happens when you are simple minded. I used to be like you, I found it stupid to pay for a game per month. Thing is... it's cheaper playing MMORPGs than playing normal games! Normal games last what... 10 hours for a normal game and 40-50 hours for a big RPG? You pay 20-80$ per game. That's a lot of money per month to play multiple games! Just the fact that you will buy 1 new game per month, you are paying more than a MMORPG. So your logic is complete BS.
Play a MMORPG, pay only 20$ a month, it'll last you thousands and thousands of hours if the game is good.
Reason people don't see this is cause they play MMORPGs, pay 20$ per month, but STILL BUY GAMES! STop buying games... MMORPGs are so time consumming, you won't have time to play anything else. Heck I bought Half-Life 2, got halfway into the game, but WoW is so much more fun than HL2 and I never find the time to play HL2 anymore cause of that.
Originally posted by geld Ok I guess noone will let me get away with a less than adequately detailed explanation of why I don't like WoW. So I will try to explain in more detail. The whole class/level based system is obsolete in my opinion, once you have picked a class thats it, you are stuck with that choice throughout the game, this limits your choices, and defines your role. Basically if you choose warrior, regardless of the talents you specified your role in a party remains the same, the tank, to take damage and deal it out. Same with a mage, you have certain mezzes, stuns, holds, but mostly your job is do deal a lot of damage at a range and stay away from the enemies because you will die quickly. Yes talents allow you to specialise in certain areas, making you different from other players who play the same class, but not significantly different. Some may specialise in strength and weapon skills, while others may specialise in stamina and defensive talents. Also you are able to choose a profession on top of that to further customize yourself. WoW is definately the best class/level based game I have ever seen, but it still doesn't even compare to a pure skill based game in my opinion. In a skill based system there are no limits to what you can do, you want to be good at magic? Fine, you also want to be good at swordsmanship, also fine, the choice is completely yours, and that makes the difference. Each skill will be trained independantly of each other, meaning you could be the best blacksmith in the world and yet not have a clue how to actually fight with a sword. Which is that way it should be I reckon. Darkfall has 500 skills planned, so IF they deliver on all of their promises then I believe it will be a much better game than WoW just for this reason. Now I mentioned that WoW forces you to play a certain way, now that isn't 100% accurate you CAN do other things. You can be a fisherman, miner, herbalist, skinner, alchemist, blacksmith, cook, engineer, leatherworker, tailor, enchanter and medic. But you are only allowed to learn 2 of these, thats it. So again, you are stuck, like if you want to be a blacksmith you really need to get mining as well in order to be able to smith, or else you will be relying on other players to provide you with ore. Now you CAN'T go fishing, since you have learnt all the professions you are allowed. If you want to be a crafter, then WoW really isn't a good game for you. Unless you are happy being able to do only 2 things. This is not enough for me, I need to know that if I want I can take my fishing rod and just relax at the docks catching fish, then go plant some crops and start a farm, or build a house or a ship, whatever I want to do. This is why I prefer Darkfalls features over WoWs, because I am free to do what I want. WoW is definately focused on the grind, if you want to get anywhere you have no choice but to grind (kill monsters repeatedly or do quests). I don't see why you should EVER have to kill monsters, why would that make you stronger anyway? It's just unrealistic. Thats why a skill based game is better, you can practice your skills in many different ways, whether sparring your friends, attacking a sparring dummy, or hunting monsters in the forest, all of these make you stronger. In WoW you only get stronger from killing the enemy (or doing a quest) you never get stronger from STRIKING an enemy, which is how it should be, whether the enemy dies should be irrelevant. This is one reason why skill based games are better whether combat, or non combat skills, they should go up simply by using the skill. Again Darkfalls features are ahead in this department. Now I mentioned realism, thats another big thing for me. I like the game to just feel realistic. OK names above heads is one thing, yes I CAN turn that off. But then everyone else will see my name and I won't see theirs so that would just be a stupid thing to do. No class based game cares about realism much, so I'm sure I can find many other examples of unrealisitc features once I start playing the game. Some unrealistic features that level based games have (all of which I think are stupid ideas): (I'm not sure if any of these are in WoW so please let me know).
NPCs that never move they just stand still so you can recieve quests/items/whatever from them. Weapons/armour that cannot be used until a certain level. Weapons that cannot be used by certain classes/races. Instant messaging worldwide without any attempt to explain how. When an NPC explains how to do something in game that should be explained out of game only (like in EQ1 an NPC explained to me the colour coded conning system, if their name appears blue they are just below your level, etc...) There are other examples but I think I have provided enough for now. There is also a matter of PVP, I feel PVP is very important for keeping the game entertaining. But PVP in WoW seems pointless and not fun. You can only PVP in the battlegrounds areas, and only at higher levels (or you will get slaughtered). All you really do is fight again and again, like counterstrike except with swords and spells. Don't you think this sort of PVP will get boring? I do. Open PVP is much better in my opinion. You will always be in different situations, fighting for different reasons. Maybe a large scale siege on a player run town, or maybe a small one on one battle with a criminal you just caught killing and looting someone. Since the PVP opportunites in open PVP are virtually endless, so is the level of fun. So basically, I think that sums up a lot of the reasons why I can't play WoW. I will hold out until Darkfall or another good skill based, open PVP game comes out.
First off, and i ask sorry for this in advance, it seems you are not very updated on your "WoW Lore" skill. But that is okay, you do not like this genre of games, so of course you do not keep you update on it. (Example: PvP: you can pvp in much more areas that just the battlefields, that are not even in the game yet, you can fight in open fields or assault an enemy town and so on).
What your problem seems to be with WoW is that you are searching for a Virtual World Simulator, not a Online game. You want realism and a game that emulates a realistic world, only not our world but some fantasy/sci-fi ones. That is quite nice, i like that kind of games too, sadly they do not seems to be very popular these days.
Anyhow, if Virtual Worlds is what you seek, there are 2 already out. Ultima Online and SWG. Granted i do not know if UO is still a virtual world with all the modifications done to it since i stopped playing it, but i suppose you still can craft almost any item you see around and things like those. they are also both Skill-based system with no levels at all.
Realize, though, that balance is important and most of this games, be them Virtual Worlds or Online Games (or Online Theme Parks if you prefer), WILL limit what you can become.
This is simply to avoid making Gods of the character. What would happen if a character could learn it all or be it all at the same time?
1) no alts. As you can do all with one main character there is no need to make an alt, as a result new players coming to the game will be severely hindered as there is nobody doing the training they need to do.
2) a 6 months character has no chance to compete with a 5 years+ character as the latter is not only a super warrior, but also a mage, alchemist, necromancer etc etc. that is, there IS a maxed up level, but is so long to achieve it that is practically non-existant. Levels are made so that no matter how long you play, there is a cap you cannot go over. so that, eventually, everybody can reach the cap and be on same level of power as everybody else.
I know what you could say "skill based games are different, a novice can kill a veteran and you do not need to be master something to be effective", true and false. While it is true that usually skill based games lowers a lot the difference between newbie and veteran, it still boils down to who has the highest skill in sword/blaster. i have more skill in it, i win.
What the skill based game obtain is that 5 newbie characters CAN threaten a veteran player while in a level based game, 5,10,50 level 20 characters cannot do much to a level 60. At least usually, dunno how that works in WoW.
Anyhow, i understand why you would not like WoW if you only wants to play Virtual Worlds
I hope Darkfall then really mantain its promises because, to nowaday, no Virtual World simulator managed to achieve a great success. For these reasons i think:
1) Computers are logical entities, they do not emulate really well artistic or inventive endeavors. As such, they cannot grant you the ability to be creative in a game. They can just add more variety, but in the end, you, as a player, can not add anything really inventive in the game. You cannot invent a new sword, for example, or design a new piece of furniture, just make what the computer database already includes.
2)Virtual Worlds simulator, as a result, are waaaaaay harder to implement and do than Online Games, plus people seems to understand easier a Online Game than a Virtual World.
Sorry for the rambling. Have a nice day.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
I think those are some great comments about the formula behind the game, but people also get this over developed idea about other players and the gaming environment itself. Its not always the system of character creation or leveling thats the problem, some are expecting people to treat the worlds in a fantasy novel style, they want political intrigue, they want huge wars, they want to create an atmosphere of something they normally don't experience in games. The problem with this is they don't understand that other people have different ideas of what they want out of the games they play.
When my character was about lvl 30 in WoW, some other people and myself agreed to help two people along in lvls, both seemed okay until we started the quests to help them. What normally takes a little time to finish a quest became an uncomfortable 30 minutes of pure chat as one of the characters couldn't make a move without launching into prologue about this or that. When someone asked her to shorten the speeches a little she replied that the server was rp and she could act in that way if she wished. Fair enough answer, last time I logged in she moved from lvl 24 to an astounding lvl 26.
There is nothing wrong with roleplaying,(If when Wish comes out it can manage to keep its atmosphere rp I say more power to them) but does it ever seem like some people can't keep a proper balance between rping and the other mechanics of the game to make it fun?
Real MMORPG hardcores dont even deserve to live. They prefer to have "sup4 l33t h4x0r wand of gayness" than having a girlfriend or even gather with family or friends on December 31.
1. Level/class based system, forces you into a certain playstyle that you cannot change (much) throughout the game, and ensures the one thing you will be doing almost all of the time will be trying to find XP. Something that no game yet has managed to make challenging and fun for a player like myself.
2. The devs don't care for realism much at all. NPCs stand in one spot forever. You automatically know everyones name just by looking at the sign above their head (yes you can turn this off but it would be a stupid thing to do because then everyone else can see your name and you can't see theirs). Also I should mention how unrealistic the whole levelling system is, like if you use only a sword, but put points on bow, you are suddenly good at using a bow, even if you have never actually used one.
3. The game is not challenging at all. Absolutely ANYONE can make it to the highest level if they spend enough time on it. I could train a monkey to level for me .
4. Grind, I hate grind, I can't play another grind again, the quest system doesn't seem like it helps that much, some of the quests sound like they are more tedious than the grind. Like "go talk to Gakin the Darkbinder in Stormwind, then go talk to Strahan Farsan in Ratchet, then go talk to Krom Stoutarm in Ironforge then go find a scroll in a chest, then kill some Dragonmaw casters and loot their channeling rods, then go back to Strahad Farsan in Ratchet and get your exp".
5. No Open PVP, I need open PVP not because of griefing, I never grief, but simply because it's more realistic and makes the game more challenging/fun.
6. Only 12 Crafting professions in the WHOLE GAME. UO has way more and it's almost 7 years old now.
7. Not much freedom, if you want to access the high end content you HAVE to kill LOTS of monsters or do LOTS of quests. Whether solo or in a group. You don't have the choice to do what you want, you have to grind, or you will not get anywhere. One reason why a skill based system is better.
8. They have items that require a certain level to use eg "Shortsword of Vengeance -Requires level 51" and items that certain classes can/cannot use. I hate this idea, if I am lucky enough to find a magical sword lying on the ground why in the world would I not be able to hold it in my hand and swing it at enemies? That is ridiculous.
9. You can only get your skills in your chosen profession up to a certain amount before you have to level again, to improve them further. Just like EQ1, this is a terrible idea, it means you don't have the option to be a pure crafter.
10. There are better games IMO coming out very soon. No point in wasting my money on WoW when I could just save it and spend it on a much better game when it comes out.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Originally posted by geld 10 Reasons why I won't be playing WoW. 1. Level/class based system, forces you into a certain playstyle that you cannot change (much) throughout the game, and ensures the one thing you will be doing almost all of the time will be trying to find XP. Something that no game yet has managed to make challenging and fun for a player like myself. 2. The devs don't care for realism much at all. NPCs stand in one spot forever. You automatically know everyones name just by looking at the sign above their head (yes you can turn this off but it would be a stupid thing to do because then everyone else can see your name and you can't see theirs). Also I should mention how unrealistic the whole levelling system is, like if you use only a sword, but put points on bow, you are suddenly good at using a bow, even if you have never actually used one. 3. The game is not challenging at all. Absolutely ANYONE can make it to the highest level if they spend enough time on it. I could train a monkey to level for me . 4. Grind, I hate grind, I can't play another grind again, the quest system doesn't seem like it helps that much, some of the quests sound like they are more tedious than the grind. Like "go talk to Gakin the Darkbinder in Stormwind, then go talk to Strahan Farsan in Ratchet, then go talk to Krom Stoutarm in Ironforge then go find a scroll in a chest, then kill some Dragonmaw casters and loot their channeling rods, then go back to Strahad Farsan in Ratchet and get your exp". 5. No Open PVP, I need open PVP not because of griefing, I never grief, but simply because it's more realistic and makes the game more challenging/fun. 6. Only 12 Crafting professions in the WHOLE GAME. UO has way more and it's almost 7 years old now. 7. Not much freedom, if you want to access the high end content you HAVE to kill LOTS of monsters or do LOTS of quests. Whether solo or in a group. You don't have the choice to do what you want, you have to grind, or you will not get anywhere. One reason why a skill based system is better. 8. They have items that require a certain level to use eg "Shortsword of Vengeance -Requires level 51" and items that certain classes can/cannot use. I hate this idea, if I am lucky enough to find a magical sword lying on the ground why in the world would I not be able to hold it in my hand and swing it at enemies? That is ridiculous. 9. You can only get your skills in your chosen profession up to a certain amount before you have to level again, to improve them further. Just like EQ1, this is a terrible idea, it means you don't have the option to be a pure crafter. 10. There are better games IMO coming out very soon. No point in wasting my money on WoW when I could just save it and spend it on a much better game when it comes out.
1. Play style is very varied, you obviously havent played it much or to any decent level.
2. So moving around in a set route is any more real than standing in one point. Btw not all npcs stand still in WoW, many move about.
3. Game can be very challenging if you hunt above your level or elites.
4. Erm ALL MMORPS have grind, its how they make the grind FUN that matters.
5. Try a PvP server, jesus!
6. I found the crafting professions very well done, quality not quantity.
7. MMORPs are all about Grind. If you dont like grind, dont play MMORPs.
8. Pretty much standard these days across all MMORPs. Have you played any? Obviously not.
9. I agree no pure crafter.
10. Glad your not playing, in fact I question what the hell are you doing on this forum.
Now playing: VG (after a long break from MMORPGS) Played for more than a month: Darkfall online, Vanguard SOH, Everquest, Horizons, WoW, SWG, Everquest II, Eve
Originally posted by geld 10 Reasons why I won't be playing WoW. 1. Level/class based system, forces you into a certain playstyle that you cannot change (much) throughout the game, and ensures the one thing you will be doing almost all of the time will be trying to find XP. Something that no game yet has managed to make challenging and fun for a player like myself.
You're allowed up to 50 characters. If that doesn't give you freedom to do whatever you like I don't know what does. If you could do it all with just one character then the game would arrive at a point where everyone could do everything with one character, and that would suck ass.
Originally posted by geld 2. The devs don't care for realism much at all. NPCs stand in one spot forever. You automatically know everyones name just by looking at the sign above their head (yes you can turn this off but it would be a stupid thing to do because then everyone else can see your name and you can't see theirs). Also I should mention how unrealistic the whole levelling system is, like if you use only a sword, but put points on bow, you are suddenly good at using a bow, even if you have never actually used one.
How can say a levelling system system is unrealistic??? This has to be the funniest thing I've ever read! There is no real levelling system, so there can be no such thing as an unrealistic levelling system. Give me an example of a "realistic" levelling system... Please.
And you obviously have no clue about improving abilities in weapons. If you train in bows, you have to use the bow a lot to become efficient with it.
Originally posted by geld 3. The game is not challenging at all. Absolutely ANYONE can make it to the highest level if they spend enough time on it. I could train a monkey to level for me .
You just described every MMORPG ever. So what's your point?
Originally posted by geld 4. Grind, I hate grind, I can't play another grind again, the quest system doesn't seem like it helps that much, some of the quests sound like they are more tedious than the grind. Like "go talk to Gakin the Darkbinder in Stormwind, then go talk to Strahan Farsan in Ratchet, then go talk to Krom Stoutarm in Ironforge then go find a scroll in a chest, then kill some Dragonmaw casters and loot their channeling rods, then go back to Strahad Farsan in Ratchet and get your exp".
I haven't felt even one vague spot of grind since I started playing. If I stop enjoying one particular thing I'm doing, I do something else. No grind in this game unless you actually make yourself grind, which would be a little stupid to say the least.
Originally posted by geld 5. No Open PVP, I need open PVP not because of griefing, I never grief, but simply because it's more realistic and makes the game more challenging/fun.
Are you saying you want to be able to kill your allies? I really can't think of anything to say to such a ridiculous statement.
Originally posted by geld 6. Only 12 Crafting professions in the WHOLE GAME. UO has way more and it's almost 7 years old now.
So why aren't you playing UO? Oh yeah - because it's an archaic relic of an MMORPG that everyone wants to relive in a new game but no-one actually likes any more. Maybe Wish will give you what you want. Fingers crossed.
Originally posted by geld 7. Not much freedom, if you want to access the high end content you HAVE to kill LOTS of monsters or do LOTS of quests. Whether solo or in a group. You don't have the choice to do what you want, you have to grind, or you will not get anywhere. One reason why a skill based system is better.
So why aren't you playing UO? Oh... wait a sec...
Originally posted by geld 8. They have items that require a certain level to use eg "Shortsword of Vengeance -Requires level 51" and items that certain classes can/cannot use. I hate this idea, if I am lucky enough to find a magical sword lying on the ground why in the world would I not be able to hold it in my hand and swing it at enemies? That is ridiculous.
Have you actually expended a few brain cells on working out why they might have done it this way? I'll leave it to you to figure out. You obviously know plenty about the mechanics of MMOs so I'm sure the penny will drop for you sometime soon.
Originally posted by geld 9. You can only get your skills in your chosen profession up to a certain amount before you have to level again, to improve them further. Just like EQ1, this is a terrible idea, it means you don't have the option to be a pure crafter.
So why aren't you playing UO? Oh forget it.
Originally posted by geld 10. There are better games IMO coming out very soon. No point in wasting my money on WoW when I could just save it and spend it on a much better game when it comes out.
Wow... Another guy who claims to be able to see into the future. I'll neglect to point out the inherent flaw in your logic, and wish you good luck with finding whatever it is you're looking for.
1. Play style is very varied, you obviously havent played it much or to any decent level.
It's not very varied, compared to a skill based game like UO. You can't learn any skill you want from a huge list, you are set to only pick the ones that your class is entitled too. This is too limiting for me.
2. So moving around in a set route is any more real than standing in one point. Btw not all npcs stand still in WoW, many move about.
Yes, it is a lot more realistic, especially if they happen to be standing outside, it's ridiculous for them to stand outside all night and day and never move. They should always wander around a set route during the day, and sleep at night. Also perform actions like bake bread, or go fishing, or work at the forge, whatever. It's not that hard to do, a game called Ultima 7 part 2, serpent Isle had this back in the early 90s.
3. Game can be very challenging if you hunt above your level or elites.
Obvious and pointless.
4. Erm ALL MMORPS have grind, its how they make the grind FUN that matters.
Wrong.
5. Try a PvP server, jesus!
But do they have full loot? If not then theres no point.
6. I found the crafting professions very well done, quality not quantity.
Good for you.
7. MMORPs are all about Grind. If you dont like grind, dont play MMORPs.
Wrong.
8. Pretty much standard these days across all MMORPs. Have you played any? Obviously not.
I have, and it is pretty much standard for most of them, is that a good thing? I think not.
9. I agree no pure crafter.
10. Glad your not playing, in fact I question what the hell are you doing on this forum.
Because the original poster wanted to know why people play other mmorpgs, hence the question 'why play anything else?'
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Originally posted by geld You can't learn any skill you want from a huge list, you are set to only pick the ones that your class is entitled too.
Wrong again. No class or race is limited to a certain range of professions.
That was as far as I read. I never get very far in your posts before I find a blatant misinformed error. Do you just make this stuff up? You're obviously poster #5287293423 who just has a deep-seated emotional grudge against the game, but when you post completely incorrect statements you just come across as a simpleton.
Here's a plan for you to try so you might not appear so stupid in future. Follow it step by step, and don't miss out any of the steps:
1. Learn about a game. 2. Actually play it. 3. Form an opinion on it.
I hope this helps, because you seem to have things a little ass-backwards right now.
Originally posted by diegofrgc Originally posted by Copeland hah and you turn 12 when?and WoW still sucks.
oh c´mon MMORPGs are not supposed to replace life. I was hardcore player too, ´til i "got the life" Do you think EQ is better than life? lets hope not
Depends on what you like. Most people come home sit on the couch and watch tv. I come home sit at my desk and play EQ. It's what gives me pleasure. To judge someone for playing a game for pleasure is silly. Some people like bars, some people like cars, some people like women and some people like games. I dont like bars. I could care less about cars unless mines broken. Women are fun but they're even more fun if they play eq with me. So yeah i find a blanket judgement on the mentallity of hardcore gamers to be immature.
Comments
he means in-game played time o.O
In response to the question 'WoW, why play anything else?'
WoW is just too shallow for my liking.
WoW tells you how to play, you WILL kill lots of NPC monsters or perform lots of quests, you don't have the choice to do anything else (that is if you want to advance in the game).
You are not unique, you will often find players that have the exact same skills/abilities that you have, simply because they chose the same class.
It is unimmersive/unrealistic, with instant messaging across the world, names floating above heads and no way to attack another player that annoys you, among many other things, the game just feels unrealistic to me.
These are just some of the reasons why I will play something else.
I don't care that WoW is your perfect game, I hope you have lots of fun with it. But it just doesn't work for me, I'm waiting for Darkfall or Trials of Ascension. These games in my opinion are FAR superior to WoW.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Talents allow you to spec your character so he's different from another character of the same race and class, but you obviously didn't know that so I'll let you off.
You don't like the names above peoples heads? Turn them off. There ya go.
Your criticism of the game "forcing" you to play a certain way is slightly justified (you can't be a pure crafter for example), but since it's Warcraft and the game will end up being focussed around the combat element, I feel this is more than justified. You don't like fighting? Go play A Tale in the Desert.
I especially liked the bit where you said that two games that haven't even been released are better than one that has. A lot of people on this forum claim to have an ability to see into the future, but I have a feeling the laws of physics aren't gonna be working with you on this one.
2. You are mad because other players have the same abilities you do? name 1 mmorpg that has so many abilities that nearly no 2 players have the same skills.
3. Once again, most (if not all) other mmorpgs have messagin accross the world and names above the heads. Would you rather not be able to whisper messages to friends? If this still bothers you turn the names above the heads off (have fun figuring out whos talking to you) and mute the chat channels you don't want. Theres no way to attack someone who annoys you because that would cause chaos, think about it. Someone annoys you so you kill them, you get no penalty for doing so, so their are groups dedicated to running around killing random people. the entire game turns into trying to find the best hiding spot so you don't get instantly killed.
4. Ya, I guess theres always........nothing? Theres no mmorpg out there that has the features you want.
5. What do these games offer that WoW doesn't? (seriously I want to know, I'm not some closed minded WoW fanboy)
you're a hardcore fanboy if you think WoW has class variety and customisation o.o
Why's that?
Are you able to actually explain why, or are you just gonna hide behind the meaningless word "fanboy" like everyone else on this forum who can't back up their opinions with facts?
Ok I guess noone will let me get away with a less than adequately detailed explanation of why I don't like WoW. So I will try to explain in more detail.
The whole class/level based system is obsolete in my opinion, once you have picked a class thats it, you are stuck with that choice throughout the game, this limits your choices, and defines your role. Basically if you choose warrior, regardless of the talents you specified your role in a party remains the same, the tank, to take damage and deal it out. Same with a mage, you have certain mezzes, stuns, holds, but mostly your job is do deal a lot of damage at a range and stay away from the enemies because you will die quickly. Yes talents allow you to specialise in certain areas, making you different from other players who play the same class, but not significantly different. Some may specialise in strength and weapon skills, while others may specialise in stamina and defensive talents. Also you are able to choose a profession on top of that to further customize yourself. WoW is definately the best class/level based game I have ever seen, but it still doesn't even compare to a pure skill based game in my opinion. In a skill based system there are no limits to what you can do, you want to be good at magic? Fine, you also want to be good at swordsmanship, also fine, the choice is completely yours, and that makes the difference. Each skill will be trained independantly of each other, meaning you could be the best blacksmith in the world and yet not have a clue how to actually fight with a sword. Which is that way it should be I reckon. Darkfall has 500 skills planned, so IF they deliver on all of their promises then I believe it will be a much better game than WoW just for this reason.
Now I mentioned that WoW forces you to play a certain way, now that isn't 100% accurate you CAN do other things. You can be a fisherman, miner, herbalist, skinner, alchemist, blacksmith, cook, engineer, leatherworker, tailor, enchanter and medic. But you are only allowed to learn 2 of these, thats it. So again, you are stuck, like if you want to be a blacksmith you really need to get mining as well in order to be able to smith, or else you will be relying on other players to provide you with ore. Now you CAN'T go fishing, since you have learnt all the professions you are allowed. If you want to be a crafter, then WoW really isn't a good game for you. Unless you are happy being able to do only 2 things. This is not enough for me, I need to know that if I want I can take my fishing rod and just relax at the docks catching fish, then go plant some crops and start a farm, or build a house or a ship, whatever I want to do. This is why I prefer Darkfalls features over WoWs, because I am free to do what I want.
WoW is definately focused on the grind, if you want to get anywhere you have no choice but to grind (kill monsters repeatedly or do quests). I don't see why you should EVER have to kill monsters, why would that make you stronger anyway? It's just unrealistic. Thats why a skill based game is better, you can practice your skills in many different ways, whether sparring your friends, attacking a sparring dummy, or hunting monsters in the forest, all of these make you stronger. In WoW you only get stronger from killing the enemy (or doing a quest) you never get stronger from STRIKING an enemy, which is how it should be, whether the enemy dies should be irrelevant. This is one reason why skill based games are better whether combat, or non combat skills, they should go up simply by using the skill. Again Darkfalls features are ahead in this department.
Now I mentioned realism, thats another big thing for me. I like the game to just feel realistic. OK names above heads is one thing, yes I CAN turn that off. But then everyone else will see my name and I won't see theirs so that would just be a stupid thing to do. No class based game cares about realism much, so I'm sure I can find many other examples of unrealisitc features once I start playing the game. Some unrealistic features that level based games have (all of which I think are stupid ideas): (I'm not sure if any of these are in WoW so please let me know).
There are other examples but I think I have provided enough for now.
There is also a matter of PVP, I feel PVP is very important for keeping the game entertaining. But PVP in WoW seems pointless and not fun. You can only PVP in the battlegrounds areas, and only at higher levels (or you will get slaughtered). All you really do is fight again and again, like counterstrike except with swords and spells. Don't you think this sort of PVP will get boring? I do. Open PVP is much better in my opinion. You will always be in different situations, fighting for different reasons. Maybe a large scale siege on a player run town, or maybe a small one on one battle with a criminal you just caught killing and looting someone. Since the PVP opportunites in open PVP are virtually endless, so is the level of fun.
So basically, I think that sums up a lot of the reasons why I can't play WoW. I will hold out until Darkfall or another good skill based, open PVP game comes out.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Wrong.
You can choose two primary professions, and you can also take on one or more secondary professions. It's all laid out in plain English HERE. So if you want to be a Miner/Blacksmith, or an Alchemist/Herbalist, or a Skinner/Enchanter, or a Skinner/Leatherworker (etc) you can also do one or all of the following: First Aid, Fishing, and Cooking.
Do a little research in future and you might be a little less uninformed.
I stopped reading your post at that point. You're obviously hung up on Darkfall and have taken the typically treacherous gamers gamble of deciding a game is great before you've even played it, so I'll just wish you the very best of luck.
Wrong.
You can choose two primary professions, and you can also take on one or more secondary professions. It's all laid out in plain English HERE. So if you want to be a Miner/Blacksmith, or an Alchemist/Herbalist, or a Skinner/Enchanter, or a Skinner/Leatherworker (etc) you can also do one or all of the following: First Aid, Fishing, and Cooking.
Do a little research in future and you might be a little less uninformed.
I stopped reading your post at that point. You're obviously hung up on Darkfall and have taken the typically treacherous gamers gamble of deciding a game is great before you've even played it, so I'll just wish you the very best of luck.
Sorry as I said I haven't played the game, I didn't realise you get 4 proffessions, not 2. Yet my point still stands. So you can choose 4 professions, thats still nothing compared to the game I'm looking forward to. If you want to be a crafter you need to be able to learn a lot more professions than 4, otherwise you will have a very boring, shallow game to look forward to. It's obvious the whole crafting system is added in as an afterthough in WoW and is not going to provide much long term enjoyment on it's own.
So I made 1 simple mistake (a mistake that doesn't make much of an impact on my overall argument) and all you do is point out the one mistake, and use that to try to discredit everything I said. Thats no way to argue, why don't you read the rest of my post and then tell me why I would like WoW? That would really help your argument.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
WoW sucks.
Make a difference!
You still got it wrong. You can have up to five professions, and maybe that isn't as many as Darkfall promises to have, and Darkfall may yet prove to be a much more enjoyable game than WoW (in which case, I'll be playing Darkfall). The fact is though, comparing a game you haven't played that is released to a game you haven't played that isn't released just isn't a particularly intelligent thing to do.
I have no "argument" as to why you might like WoW. In fact I'm almost 100% certain you wouldn't like it as you're one of these incredibly clever people who's decided they don't like it before they've even tried it, and preconceived opinions don't usually change. I was simply correcting your mistake, and have zero concern for whether you want to play WoW or not.
The fact that you can make such a bold statement as "It's obvious the whole crafting system is added in as an afterthough [sic] in WoW and is not going to provide much long term enjoyment on it's own." without actually having experienced the tradeskills, or even any one single element of the game at all is just hilarious.
What the freaking hell are you doing on MMORPG.COM then? Oh you're just here for the free crappy MMORPGs... I see. Sheesh.
Well, your loss buddy. You just have to become addicted to 1 MMORPG to become a MMORPG addict.
That's what happens when you are simple minded. I used to be like you, I found it stupid to pay for a game per month. Thing is... it's cheaper playing MMORPGs than playing normal games! Normal games last what... 10 hours for a normal game and 40-50 hours for a big RPG? You pay 20-80$ per game. That's a lot of money per month to play multiple games! Just the fact that you will buy 1 new game per month, you are paying more than a MMORPG. So your logic is complete BS.
Play a MMORPG, pay only 20$ a month, it'll last you thousands and thousands of hours if the game is good.
Reason people don't see this is cause they play MMORPGs, pay 20$ per month, but STILL BUY GAMES! STop buying games... MMORPGs are so time consumming, you won't have time to play anything else. Heck I bought Half-Life 2, got halfway into the game, but WoW is so much more fun than HL2 and I never find the time to play HL2 anymore cause of that.
___________ ___ __ _ _ _
Stealth - Ambush - Hemorrhage - Sinister Strike x2 - Cold Blood - Eviscerate - Vanish - Preparation - Cold Blood - Ambush - ... you're dead! :P
First off, and i ask sorry for this in advance, it seems you are not very updated on your "WoW Lore" skill. But that is okay, you do not like this genre of games, so of course you do not keep you update on it. (Example: PvP: you can pvp in much more areas that just the battlefields, that are not even in the game yet, you can fight in open fields or assault an enemy town and so on).
What your problem seems to be with WoW is that you are searching for a Virtual World Simulator, not a Online game. You want realism and a game that emulates a realistic world, only not our world but some fantasy/sci-fi ones. That is quite nice, i like that kind of games too, sadly they do not seems to be very popular these days.
Anyhow, if Virtual Worlds is what you seek, there are 2 already out. Ultima Online and SWG. Granted i do not know if UO is still a virtual world with all the modifications done to it since i stopped playing it, but i suppose you still can craft almost any item you see around and things like those. they are also both Skill-based system with no levels at all.
Realize, though, that balance is important and most of this games, be them Virtual Worlds or Online Games (or Online Theme Parks if you prefer), WILL limit what you can become.
This is simply to avoid making Gods of the character. What would happen if a character could learn it all or be it all at the same time?
1) no alts. As you can do all with one main character there is no need to make an alt, as a result new players coming to the game will be severely hindered as there is nobody doing the training they need to do.
2) a 6 months character has no chance to compete with a 5 years+ character as the latter is not only a super warrior, but also a mage, alchemist, necromancer etc etc. that is, there IS a maxed up level, but is so long to achieve it that is practically non-existant. Levels are made so that no matter how long you play, there is a cap you cannot go over. so that, eventually, everybody can reach the cap and be on same level of power as everybody else.
I know what you could say "skill based games are different, a novice can kill a veteran and you do not need to be master something to be effective", true and false. While it is true that usually skill based games lowers a lot the difference between newbie and veteran, it still boils down to who has the highest skill in sword/blaster. i have more skill in it, i win.
What the skill based game obtain is that 5 newbie characters CAN threaten a veteran player while in a level based game, 5,10,50 level 20 characters cannot do much to a level 60. At least usually, dunno how that works in WoW.
Anyhow, i understand why you would not like WoW if you only wants to play Virtual Worlds
I hope Darkfall then really mantain its promises because, to nowaday, no Virtual World simulator managed to achieve a great success. For these reasons i think:
1) Computers are logical entities, they do not emulate really well artistic or inventive endeavors. As such, they cannot grant you the ability to be creative in a game. They can just add more variety, but in the end, you, as a player, can not add anything really inventive in the game. You cannot invent a new sword, for example, or design a new piece of furniture, just make what the computer database already includes.
2)Virtual Worlds simulator, as a result, are waaaaaay harder to implement and do than Online Games, plus people seems to understand easier a Online Game than a Virtual World.
Sorry for the rambling. Have a nice day.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
I think those are some great comments about the formula behind the game, but people also get this over developed idea about other players and the gaming environment itself. Its not always the system of character creation or leveling thats the problem, some are expecting people to treat the worlds in a fantasy novel style, they want political intrigue, they want huge wars, they want to create an atmosphere of something they normally don't experience in games. The problem with this is they don't understand that other people have different ideas of what they want out of the games they play.
When my character was about lvl 30 in WoW, some other people and myself agreed to help two people along in lvls, both seemed okay until we started the quests to help them. What normally takes a little time to finish a quest became an uncomfortable 30 minutes of pure chat as one of the characters couldn't make a move without launching into prologue about this or that. When someone asked her to shorten the speeches a little she replied that the server was rp and she could act in that way if she wished. Fair enough answer, last time I logged in she moved from lvl 24 to an astounding lvl 26.
There is nothing wrong with roleplaying,(If when Wish comes out it can manage to keep its atmosphere rp I say more power to them) but does it ever seem like some people can't keep a proper balance between rping and the other mechanics of the game to make it fun?
I will tell you why.
Becuase i was suspended. Then my name (which is in the dictionary) was changed.
That is the answer to your post, your question has been answered.
BYE MOTHEFUCKERS.
Real MMORPG hardcores dont even deserve to live. They prefer to have "sup4 l33t h4x0r wand of gayness" than having a girlfriend or even gather with family or friends on December 31.
hah and you turn 12 when?
and WoW still sucks.
Make a difference!
oh c´mon MMORPGs are not supposed to replace life. I was hardcore player too, ´til i "got the life"
Do you think EQ is better than life? lets hope not
10 Reasons why I won't be playing WoW.
1. Level/class based system, forces you into a certain playstyle that you cannot change (much) throughout the game, and ensures the one thing you will be doing almost all of the time will be trying to find XP. Something that no game yet has managed to make challenging and fun for a player like myself.
2. The devs don't care for realism much at all. NPCs stand in one spot forever. You automatically know everyones name just by looking at the sign above their head (yes you can turn this off but it would be a stupid thing to do because then everyone else can see your name and you can't see theirs). Also I should mention how unrealistic the whole levelling system is, like if you use only a sword, but put points on bow, you are suddenly good at using a bow, even if you have never actually used one.
3. The game is not challenging at all. Absolutely ANYONE can make it to the highest level if they spend enough time on it. I could train a monkey to level for me
.
4. Grind, I hate grind, I can't play another grind again, the quest system doesn't seem like it helps that much, some of the quests sound like they are more tedious than the grind. Like "go talk to Gakin the Darkbinder in Stormwind, then go talk to Strahan Farsan in Ratchet, then go talk to Krom Stoutarm in Ironforge then go find a scroll in a chest, then kill some Dragonmaw casters and loot their channeling rods, then go back to Strahad Farsan in Ratchet and get your exp".
5. No Open PVP, I need open PVP not because of griefing, I never grief, but simply because it's more realistic and makes the game more challenging/fun.
6. Only 12 Crafting professions in the WHOLE GAME. UO has way more and it's almost 7 years old now.
7. Not much freedom, if you want to access the high end content you HAVE to kill LOTS of monsters or do LOTS of quests. Whether solo or in a group. You don't have the choice to do what you want, you have to grind, or you will not get anywhere. One reason why a skill based system is better.
8. They have items that require a certain level to use eg "Shortsword of Vengeance -Requires level 51" and items that certain classes can/cannot use. I hate this idea, if I am lucky enough to find a magical sword lying on the ground why in the world would I not be able to hold it in my hand and swing it at enemies? That is ridiculous.
9. You can only get your skills in your chosen profession up to a certain amount before you have to level again, to improve them further. Just like EQ1, this is a terrible idea, it means you don't have the option to be a pure crafter.
10. There are better games IMO coming out very soon. No point in wasting my money on WoW when I could just save it and spend it on a much better game when it comes out.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
So, geld, what MMORPG are you playing? Im sure I can tell you 10 flaws bout it
1. Play style is very varied, you obviously havent played it much or to any decent level.
2. So moving around in a set route is any more real than standing in one point. Btw not all npcs stand still in WoW, many move about.
3. Game can be very challenging if you hunt above your level or elites.
4. Erm ALL MMORPS have grind, its how they make the grind FUN that matters.
5. Try a PvP server, jesus!
6. I found the crafting professions very well done, quality not quantity.
7. MMORPs are all about Grind. If you dont like grind, dont play MMORPs.
8. Pretty much standard these days across all MMORPs. Have you played any? Obviously not.
9. I agree no pure crafter.
10. Glad your not playing, in fact I question what the hell are you doing on this forum.
Now playing: VG (after a long break from MMORPGS)
Played for more than a month: Darkfall online, Vanguard SOH, Everquest, Horizons, WoW, SWG, Everquest II, Eve
You're allowed up to 50 characters. If that doesn't give you freedom to do whatever you like I don't know what does. If you could do it all with just one character then the game would arrive at a point where everyone could do everything with one character, and that would suck ass.
How can say a levelling system system is unrealistic??? This has to be the funniest thing I've ever read! There is no real levelling system, so there can be no such thing as an unrealistic levelling system. Give me an example of a "realistic" levelling system... Please.
And you obviously have no clue about improving abilities in weapons. If you train in bows, you have to use the bow a lot to become efficient with it.
You just described every MMORPG ever. So what's your point?
I haven't felt even one vague spot of grind since I started playing. If I stop enjoying one particular thing I'm doing, I do something else. No grind in this game unless you actually make yourself grind, which would be a little stupid to say the least.
Are you saying you want to be able to kill your allies? I really can't think of anything to say to such a ridiculous statement.
So why aren't you playing UO? Oh yeah - because it's an archaic relic of an MMORPG that everyone wants to relive in a new game but no-one actually likes any more. Maybe Wish will give you what you want. Fingers crossed.
So why aren't you playing UO? Oh... wait a sec...
Have you actually expended a few brain cells on working out why they might have done it this way? I'll leave it to you to figure out. You obviously know plenty about the mechanics of MMOs so I'm sure the penny will drop for you sometime soon.
So why aren't you playing UO? Oh forget it.
Wow... Another guy who claims to be able to see into the future. I'll neglect to point out the inherent flaw in your logic, and wish you good luck with finding whatever it is you're looking for.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Wrong again. No class or race is limited to a certain range of professions.
That was as far as I read. I never get very far in your posts before I find a blatant misinformed error. Do you just make this stuff up? You're obviously poster #5287293423 who just has a deep-seated emotional grudge against the game, but when you post completely incorrect statements you just come across as a simpleton.
Here's a plan for you to try so you might not appear so stupid in future. Follow it step by step, and don't miss out any of the steps:
1. Learn about a game.
2. Actually play it.
3. Form an opinion on it.
I hope this helps, because you seem to have things a little ass-backwards right now.
oh c´mon MMORPGs are not supposed to replace life. I was hardcore player too, ´til i "got the life"
Do you think EQ is better than life? lets hope not
Depends on what you like. Most people come home sit on the couch and watch tv. I come home sit at my desk and play EQ. It's what gives me pleasure. To judge someone for playing a game for pleasure is silly.
Some people like bars, some people like cars, some people like women and some people like games. I dont like bars. I could care less about cars unless mines broken. Women are fun but they're even more fun if they play eq with me. So yeah i find a blanket judgement on the mentallity of hardcore gamers to be immature.
Make a difference!