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Nostalgia/Nerd Revolution?
Zebrion
Member Posts: 12
Howdy and welcome to this little corner of my brain!
So in my endless browsing of the forums here, I've come to notice that there are a few like-minded individuals with whom this message may resonate. Anyhow, let's get right to it.
I remember a day some years ago when MMORPGs were about imagination. Not the kind of imagination that causes you to necessarily go on a creative binge and start writing Tolkien-esque novels, but the kind of imagination that caused you to get LOST in the game. I'm sure each of us has at least a few of those memories where you picked up a game, and you literally forgot about everything around you. Instead of being the perceived inadequate person in your real life, you BECAME that avatar in the game. You weren't pushing papers behind a desk; you were swinging your sword at a mortal foe, trying to forge your name in a world.
I think MMORPGs lately have lost this feel, and I think I understand why. In the push to bring more people (and thus more money) into the genre, companies have become increasingly reliant on instant gratification mechanics. Simply put, the games are just too damned fast paced. We have queues to take us instantly anywhere we want, teleporters to send you all over the world without having to run more than 30 seconds between. The world has lost its... grandeur.
While the case can be made that it's good for the companies, good for community, etc, I think that this catering to the "instant action" crowd has caused the entire genre to lose its feel. The games of today simply don't conjure up the spirit of sitting in a basement rolling dice and PRAYING for the d20 to hit. There's no excitement, or immersion, or challenge. I don't feel heroic, or that I've earned that massively long title or that glowing super-sword.
I want it back. I propose a revolution - a nerd revolution. We need to get these games back to being what they were meant to be - an escape from reality! I don't care whether you can fit 100 trillion polygons in a square inch and the game looks like real life. I want a believable world that I can go to in order to get away from the real world. I say we all start writing to/calling these companies, the big ones even, and let them know what we want. Be passionate about your views, and tell them that you don't want to grind numbers. Tell them you want to be absorbed into another world.
So who's with me?
Comments
All the focus on WoW's Looking for Dungeon Tool, LFD.
Before the LFD, I remember sitting for an hour or two spamming 'Scarlet Monastery, LFM, need healer and CC'
Every time I get frustrated with a random group, I remember those times. And I look for a good guild to join where I'll never need to use the LFD tool.
A good guild is the key to solving most MMO problems really.
Don't like /trade or /general chat? Join a guild. Do like immature types? Join a guild. Don't like using the LFD tool? Join a guild.
So I guess I'm not with you.
/plea for developers who make games for immersion/art/loveofogames not money thread
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I'm with you!
http://www.questhard.com
I'm not disagreeing with you on the fact that guilds make things better. My point is more to the system being built to make everything convient rather than immersive. It's extremely hard to get "lost" in a world that makes you able to instantly teleport to anything of interest without even having to first meet the people you're going there with. It diminishes the sense of community and of an alternate reality - which in essence is our entire reason for playing RPGs. I think that the influence from the "Call of duty-like" lobby-based gameplay is harming the genre as a whole. Yes, it makes things quicker for casual players to just jump in, but is quicker what we really want? If we're trying to be immersed in another world, why are we all rushing to get everything done now?
I'm with yah but I think your money will speak louder than words. ArcheAge looks like it might do something good.
My theme song.
I don't think that's completely true. Yes, it's good to vote with your wallets, but realistically people will play the best of what's out there, even if the best isn't good. So while we may not necessarily love a game, we'll play it just because it's better than its competitors. Companies see this and think "WOW! This model of game must be what the market really wants, look how well it sells!" and begin to make expansions and copies of the game. Of course, people will continue playing the mediocre games just because mediocre is the best that is currently available, and continue to buy expansions because they've already invested so much time into the game.
So while I do think that not buying terrible games is a step in the right direction, we should also be vocal about exactly what we want. Make sure the developers, and more importantly the people producing the funds for it, realize that what they've been doing isn't necessarily what we want in the games. Direct communication is key to making sure the industry has a clear picture of what we as gamers actually want, and that they shouldn't just follow market models. The big earners will be the games that innovate and immerse.
Zeb, I can't help but agree with you. I've been playing MMORPG's since Everquest. And I mean back in 1999-2000. And I agree that you could seriously get lost in that world. And the world around you just didn't exist. I've been looking HARD at the Everquest Progression server and really debating if I want to go back to it. I would be happy if they would stop at the Scars of Velious. But anyways, getting off track here. I miss that immersion. The feel of late night, being in Kurn's Tower and the littlest sound scaring the crap out of me because I was so lost in the world. I'm with ya, Zeb. I'm with ya, brother.
I'm with you Zeb, have ijn fact created several threads recently with a similar theme to yours. I'm not looking so much for innovation from MMORPG's, but rather a return to some of the mechanics that made the older games fun for me, but perhaps not so much fun for the more casual (or non-nerd) gamer.
I enjoyed longer travel times, slower combat passing, down time between fights and heavens, encouraged grouping.
Was everything perfect back then. No, of course not, and there have been some good ideas introduced in more modern games, however in adopting the new, they tossed out some really good concepts that I think could be re-used to create a fun, modern MMORPG.
Would it be anywhere near as popular as WOW. Of course not. Could it draw a respectable number of subs? Yes, I think 250-500 subs is quite obtainable.
Unfortunately most companies, particularly those willing to invest 50M+ to create a game are focused on "swinging for the fence" and trying to hit a home run with every game. Sadly, they mostly strike out (OK, no more baseball analogies) but they still keep trying.
So while there are like minded folks Zeb, we're few and far between it seems and our only hope lies in a lucky break by an indie dev or some really forward thinking larger firm who's struck out a few times with the standard formula and finally decides to try something different. (Funcom might be one such company btw)
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Why aren't you playing Everquest's timelocked progression servers? It has only been 2 weeks since they launched, you'll get a lot of what you seek there. Not to mention supporting those servers, it tells SOE and rest of the genre that there's still interest in these types of games. Someone is right, money speak louder than words. If you want these types of games, then support these types of games.
Hop in, the water's fine.
EQ1-AC1-DAOC-FFXI-L2-EQ2-WoW-DDO-GW-LoTR-VG-WAR-GW2-ESO
The flip side to this is that games with long travel times tend to be just as bad in helping the player get 'lost' in the game. The game becomes all about the boring travel and immersion goes right out the window.
I think the games that have problems immersing the player that have longer travel don't have problems because of the travel. In any case, games that do have the longer travel times at least have the opportunity for immersion, whereas games with queue systems simply end up feeling like lobby FPS games with RPG elements.
The one game on the horizon that has a decent budget that i think genuinely has the opportunity to change the immersion factor is SW:TOR. While it may not have everything perfect, I think it's making steps towards putting the RPG back into MMORPG. One of the commentators put it best when he said that if you had a console RPG that was lacking a story, you'd feel like they sold you an incomplete game. In a way, I do feel like MMORPG producers have been selling me incomplete games. Roleplaying games without the roleplaying element is a bit like having a story without a plot or setting. You just end up with a bunch of characters standing around and fighting for no discernable reason, and without the ability to shape their own stories.
Even older and more shallow games did a better job of making me feel like I was in that world. Diablo for example, though it was extremely simple, and the plot very cliche and straightforward, being in a dungeon by yourself or with a small party and surrounded by hordes of demons lurking in the dark just waiting to take you out... you really felt that suspense and sense of "oh crap, I'm actually in Hell right now."
I'm just trying to motivate like-minded individuals to really push the gaming industry to give us that feel back. Make us feel like we're part of the world again, and not just some random person hacking apart mobs because they give us exp and loot.