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So... I just started Ultima Online ("Old vs. New" MMOs)
twstdstrange
Member Posts: 474
My oh my.
If I could only take back all those wasted years of WoW, all those wasted days of Final Fantasy XI, all those wasted hours of Warhammer, and all those wasted minutes of City of Heroes.
I won't lie to you, jumping into UO without knowing anything of what to do was far from easy. But now that I know a bit about the game, I've never experienced anything so... engaging.
All I had was my sword, a bit of gold, and a boat load of opportunities.
For once I wasn't pushed to level up or do endless chains of quests or hunt for useless epeen garbage.
I wasn't pushed to do anything except what I wanted to do, and so I did. And I'm having a blast.
I'm now keeping two characters, the first being my stalwart Warrior, the grand adventurer and explorer.
The second, a hermit-like Necromancer who keeps to himself and scares away passerby in his forest home. I'm even using his Book as a tome of mad, incoherent babbling which I will one day carelessly misplace near a town for some fledling adventurer to stumble upon.
I wish I played this sooner.
Do devs really think this sort of thing won't sell nowadays?
Edited again to expand/clarify on the topic:
I don't know about the rest of you, but I rarely hear any epic, engaging stories from people who are playing newer MMO's. It's always those who play and talk about games like EQ, DAoC, UO, SWG etc. etc.
Of course, they would be looking through rose colored glasses when speaking of such tales, but even then, does anybody talk about WAR, WoW, CoH (sorry to repeat the same MMOs but you get the idea) in the same way, despite the age difference?
I would much rather hear about an epic, improptu adventure in UO than a story about a few angry players in a raid and how one of them got kicked for no reason (which seems to be a popular story among the newer games).
Comments
lmao.
the system would work, but who in their right mind would actually spend time playing a 2D mmo now days......oh, right...you did
what i dont understand is why they never made a UO2 with updated graphics?......that would sell.
I'm glad you're liking the game. It's just a shame you couldn't have played it back in it's prime around The Second Age expansion release.
I've been asking myself the same thing for years. I don't understand how development companies can continue to put out quest-grinding linear games when there's already been a better game model developed in UO.
Good luck to you.
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
Too many people is looking for the flashy things now days. UO is just too hard of a game for people to comprehend. They cant do anything unless they are "showed" the way. So yea Devs thinks that its not going to cater to the crowd anymore. Glad you're enjoying it. I was thinking about resubbing too, but not yet it seems.
I haven't played for a long time but I do miss logging in and figuring out what I wanted to do with that session. In my recent MMO experiences I have been mostly focused on just leveling. It was nice having runes marked to all my favorite places. I even enjoyed doing the treasure map hunts when those were implemented.
I'm rather frustrated my Pub thread was moved here. Sure, it's a UO centric thread, but I wanted the topic of conversation to be primarily about the last sentence. A bit difficult to get sufficient feedback here, and it makes me think mods (or whoever moves threads) are quick to move something without reading/thinking about it.
UO would be far too complicated on many levels for most gamers today. Eventually, most MMOs will probably end up looking like Hello Kitty as we continue our societal slide into mediocrity.
"Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever." - Noam Chomsky
You need to cleverly word your threads and thread titles in order to manipulate the system, all the while keeping your UO thread in the general forums. Perhaps a title, "Why aren't there other MMOs like this?" and then while casually bringing up UO, explain what should be in current MMOs that are currently in UO.
I agree though, having your thread moved here keeps it to a very select audience when your thread was meant for a discussion with the general population.
-Computer specs no one cares about: check.
-MMOs played no one cares about: check.
-Xfire stats no one cares about: check.
-Signature no one cares about: check.
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-Narcissism: check.
What is the relevance of a game being 2D or not?
Sadly, I was thinking of this as I wrote it, but I didn't think it would be moved within 5 minutes of being created.
Ho hum. I'm getting more replies than I thought I would anyway.
Edit: I didn't even get a PM telling me they moved it, I just knew it was going to be here.
Just because of this thread I grabbed the trial.
I feel like I accomplished something today.
Perhaps if you rewrote the topic (example below) and then petitioned a mod to move it:
Title: Older Game Models Superior?
I am curious as to why developers don't create more games that are similuar to very popular but older game models.
My recent experience with one such game has really opened my eyes to what these games could be.
If I could only take back all those wasted years of WoW, all those wasted days of Final Fantasy XI, all those wasted hours of Warhammer, and all those wasted minutes of City of Heroes.
I won't lie to you, jumping into UO without knowing anything of what to do was far from easy. But now that I know a bit about the game, I've never experienced anything so... engaging.
All I had was my sword, a bit of gold, and a boat load of opportunities.
For once I wasn't pushed to level up or do endless chains of quests or hunt for useless epeen garbage.
I wasn't pushed to do anything except what I wanted to do, and so I did. And I'm having a blast.
I'm now keeping two characters, the first being my stalwart Warrior, the grand adventurer and explorer.
The second, a hermit-like Necromancer who keeps to himself and scares away passerby in his forest home. I'm even using his Book as a tome of mad, incoherent babbling which I will one day carelessly misplace near a town for some fledling adventurer to stumble upon.
I wish I played this sooner. The chance to really explore different types of characters with different game play possibilities, all the while not being pressured to experience a linear track for my progression is very refreshing.
Do devs really think this sort of thing won't sell nowadays? Are there other games that share this type of game play and why don't we see it more in contemporary games?
Well that's just a tweak to what you wrote but you get the gist.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
You're welcome, I suppose.
On a side note: the follwing was the first thing I saw written on the updater:
"Gypsy camps should no longer be spawning till we can figure out if they are causing items to disappear."
Isn't that kinda racist? THE CODE IS RACIST?!
Gypsies are shifty.
@Sovrath, Yes, but I'm satisfied with the turnout the thread has gotten now, so I suppose I'll try a repost another time and take your advice then, maybe I will get some broader responses.
Or perhaps some kind soul will move my thread back anyway.
Thank you, powers that be.
I think it comes down to redefining "successful MMO". We need more indie developers who are willing to settle for a few thousand players, and they'd have to design and budget the game accordingly. No way are you going to see a UO-style game pulling huge numbers of players away from the big name MMOs.
I understand that SOE is probably happy with how the new Progression server is doing, but it cost them almost nothing to do it. They had several thousand people jump in at launch and a few thousand are still subscribed. Those aren't numbers that would support a brand new game unless it was developed by a very small studio on a tight budget.
Mhhh...............I am reading very naive answers to the OP.
Like the guy who points out that no one will play a 2D nowadays or another one that says that EQ progression server only attracted few thousands subscribers.
I don't know if you noticed it, but we are talking about 10 years old games.....................of course they will never attract huge masses in that condition.
What the OP meant when he asked if developers really think that games like UO won't sell nowadays was to suggest the the design of those games should be implemented in a 3D game with 2011 technology.
Those 2 games launched the MMORPG genre, but after WoW I would say that MMORPGs died (hence people always criticising all new MMOs).
So why not resurrect the 2 daddies of all MMORPGs and make them relevant for the 2011 crowd with spanky new graphics and a modern interface and combat system?
My bet is on Bethesda reinventing the MMORPGs, the Elder Scroll Series is perfect for a sandbox or old school MMORPG (If you played Daggerfall and Morrowind you will know what I mean)
I agree. MMOs these days are all basically following the SWTOR route: spend tons to make tons. If they just aimed for a target audience instead of trying to pull from the WoW subscriber base, the games would be a lot cheaper, better (that one is only a possibility. I'm basing the statement on the fact that instead of trying to do a huge number of things to pull in a wide variety of people, these theoretical games would be focusing in on one item of niche appeal. I could be entirely wrong), though they would only get a few hundred / thousand players. But unfortunately the only people who want to venture into the area are the big companies with AAA titles, or little indie types that barely make a splash. There are exceptions of course, but it's a hard area to get into.
I would love a game like this. But then casuals who have to suffer with the learning curve will get sick. Also, that is the target of MMO devs nowadays. Casuals. Thats why they guide you everywhere and control how you play etc etc so the casuals always get their action filled stuffs. o.O
Sandboxes can be casual friendly and hardcore friendly at the same time but nooooo...They try to focus too much on casuals -.-
Oh wells....Next UO will be some kind of facebook game according to Garrior so get those facebook accounts ready~~
>.<
I srsly think though is that the devs are too focused on controlling the playstyles too much. When they say "we have quests to guide you n stuff" they mean "We made quests that you have to follow through or you will have a very very hard time enjoying! If you dont like it, bear with it because of the rewards!"
When they say "We have raids" they mean "Go do the raids because its the only thing you can do!" Or if they have pvp "Raid or pvp!"
I think they discussed this in some conference...How they should give players only a maximum of 3-4 choices at any given part where the player has to make a decision... -.- But hey~ Theyre a business and they want their products to make as much money as possible in the safest way possible~
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**This bunny was cloned from bunnies belonging to Gobla and is part of the Quizzical Fanclub and the The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club**
I loved that game and thinking about starting it up again. I loved setting up booby traped chest in my inventory and somebody stealing it and then hearing an explosion and then seeing a dead theif as a result. Didn't like getting pk'd lots when I first started and although I don't like pk'ing it isn't the same without it. A risk vs reward thing etc. Kind of ruined it when they made a whole copy of the world which was pve. Still though, i'd highly reccomend anyone take a look at the game either old or new players as it probly is the best game out there. It's more about playing the game than leveling which is what most games should be about.
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
It's the little things that make me love UO over the newer titles, and it's UO's flaws that seemingly add to its charm rather than detract from my playing experience.
This. I have tons of great stories from the older, more sand-boxy MMOs. Getting lost in the mountains trying to find my Patron's house in Asheron's Call, or the crazy battles over towns on Darktide. The epic build up to and execution of a massive invasion in Planetside. The epic, week long battles over cities in Shadowbane.
The stories from WoW seem to be things like "We wiped on the raid, but then we reformed and beat it"
Top MMOs: Asheron's Call, Shadowbane, EVE Online, Planetside
Played: Pretty much everything at one point or another
Blame it on the mainstreaming of the video gaming hobby... It's not that it won't sell, it's that it won't sell 12,000,000 copies. I do not think that I look back on my fond times playing UO, E&B or AO back in the 1997-2004 era with rose tinted glasses at all. Games in my opinion were better back then. I obviously don't mean graphically or technically... you know what I mean. The problem came when people realized that large profits could be made from games. So started the pandering to the lowest common denominator in that persuit of Blizzard-like profitability. It destroyed Ultima Online, which led to me ultimately quitting UO after 9 years, and led to EA shutting down E&B. There just wasn't room for any niches or smaller communities in gaming anymore. It became about nothing but selling boxes... and that's why we're where we're at today. Think about this, that UO that has you so engrossed today was 110% better back in 1997 before EA ruined it.
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"Searchers after horror haunt strange, far places..." ~ H.P.Lovecraft, "From Beyond"
Member Since March 2004
Archage Online is our only hope IMO. I have waited for too many Indie "the next UO" games and they all suck. No offense to independent developers, more power to them but we need sandbox made by competent developers w/ years of experience and a big budget. Archage looks like it will be that game...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvyQE4kfKDI
Remember Old School Ultima Online
I don't get your logic, OP. You ask "do devs not think this will sell?". Yet, that question has already been answered. There is a UO. There is an EQ out there. There is a Darkfall and MO. They are what they are; very slow sellers.
I played EQ, UO, DAOC, AoC, AC, and every other game that has come along. Its my opinion that while those games were great when there was little to no competition they don't cut the mustard, anymore. Kinda like how Super Mario Bros. on the NES was totally awesome 25 years ago, but today the memories are far better than actually playing it.
Sure, there are some great things about those old titles, and there are a lot of disadvantages.
Personally, I choose to play nothing, atm. I guess I want something that is modern, but not so pointless like the newer MMOs have been.