Kudos to Syndicate for getting where they are today and staying together so long but seriously why do we need to know they embrace FTP or make april fools jokes? It's a none news story. I'm joining the masses here and would much prefer articles about different guilds, there are plenty of solid guilds out there, ok they may not have the PR machine the Syndicate obviously have but they are worthy of hunting down and being interviewed.
Too much ego involved on The Syndicate site for my liking, by all means state your successes but reading their blurb on there and here you would think we all need to be bowing down to them for their involvement in the industry, kudos for contributing but sorry there are hundreds and thousands of individuals and many, many guilds that contribute every day through so many betas and feedback on official forums and forums like these.
If The Syndicate are taken that seriously by the gaming industry just says to me there's something wrong with the industry - I don't want one guilds feelings about a game taken more seriously than anyone elses.
I'd like The Syndicate more and respect them a little more if they toned down their self promotion, it's more like a corporate machine than a warm welcoming guild, I'm sure they have great members and do a lot for each other but their public persona isn't very likable unless you dig the whole corporate thing.
I do hope we don't have wasted space on this site dedicated to just this guild every week, is mmorpg.com that stuck for content or is it purely (as I suspect) nepotism ?
Good luck to The Syndicate in every thing they do, I wish them well but please don't bore us with this irrelevance any more.
lol love the 'jealousy' comments when on every MMO i have played I have never ran into them or even heard whispers of them doing well. As for their testing hardware and software, their basically a volunteer amateur QA team. Again, no one cares. Gaurantee I've done more QA work in early game development than any one of their members. Not a common occurance but it's also uninteresting to observers.
Like I said the syndicate is famous for being famous. their the MMO equivilent of Paris Hilton or Kim Kardashian. Famous but ultimately contributing very little if anything.
Aref - To help educate everyone a little bit on Trademarks ... not only is "The Syndicate" able to be trademarked but it was done so over 5 years ago. That means that it is now unchallengeable as to its legitimacy or for anyone else to claim earlier first use.
Ok, I am going to stop you there; just because it hasn't successfully been challenged (has anyone even bothered to try?), does not mean that it cannot be successfully challenged in court. It is much the same as when Microsoft sued Lindows because of it's similarity to Windows, and Lindows countersued Microsoft because Microsoft didn't create the word Windows. Microsoft wisely settled out of court on that one, and paid Lindows to change their name. The simple fact of the matter is that ANYTHING can be challenged in court (and generally is these days); NOTHING is unchallengeable.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Aref - To help educate everyone a little bit on Trademarks ... not only is "The Syndicate" able to be trademarked but it was done so over 5 years ago. That means that it is now unchallengeable as to its legitimacy or for anyone else to claim earlier first use.
Ok, I am going to stop you there; just because it hasn't successfully been challenged (has anyone even bothered to try?), does not mean that it cannot be successfully challenged in court. It is much the same as when Microsoft sued Lindows because of it's similarity to Windows, and Lindows countersued Microsoft because Microsoft didn't create the word Windows. Microsoft wisely settled out of court on that one, and paid Lindows to change their name. The simple fact of the matter is that ANYTHING can be challenged in court (and generally is these days); NOTHING is unchallengeable.
roflmao.. are they going to sue Eve online.. because an area of space is called Syndicate.. and regardless of their claims.. they don't have any right to stop other people or guilds, corporations etc.. from using the name.. but.. as i've yet to see any game their actually active in.. its kind of pointless.. what games do they even appear in? they certainly can't be the mainstream ones. but.. its easy to be a 'king of the hill' if you choose an extremely small hill.. right..
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
ive heard of them. i think. But they never amounted to anything and always did horrible. least any Syndicate guild/clan/tribe/corp i ever seen has. and the writer of this articles needs to go find a new job. If your gonna post about sum dumb guild. then Post about the ones WHO ARE ACHEIVING STUFF! who have been in games since beta and still runing strong in those games today. Those are the ones wed like to hear about as they can tell a story about a game from start till today. and really give info on these games. Not have people claim...oh developers listen to them..they are so smart their above guild status...pfft please. No developers gives a rats ass on wat any1 says. n the ones that do listen to the community end up failing cuz they did listen. Lets face it folks too many styles we all want in games. we killem faster then their coming in. So mmorpg.com get a new writer. And who ever keeps giving me warnings. Do your job. the last person i said somthing 2 was banned from fourms and soon the game and just likes giving a decent game bad PR. You know sorta like we all will do over you article :-P
Aref - To help educate everyone a little bit on Trademarks ... not only is "The Syndicate" able to be trademarked but it was done so over 5 years ago. That means that it is now unchallengeable as to its legitimacy or for anyone else to claim earlier first use.
Ok, I am going to stop you there; just because it hasn't successfully been challenged (has anyone even bothered to try?), does not mean that it cannot be successfully challenged in court. It is much the same as when Microsoft sued Lindows because of it's similarity to Windows, and Lindows countersued Microsoft because Microsoft didn't create the word Windows. Microsoft wisely settled out of court on that one, and paid Lindows to change their name. The simple fact of the matter is that ANYTHING can be challenged in court (and generally is these days); NOTHING is unchallengeable.
roflmao.. are they going to sue Eve online.. because an area of space is called Syndicate.. and regardless of their claims.. they don't have any right to stop other people or guilds, corporations etc.. from using the name.. but.. as i've yet to see any game their actually active in.. its kind of pointless.. what games do they even appear in? they certainly can't be the mainstream ones. but.. its easy to be a 'king of the hill' if you choose an extremely small hill.. right..
Actually I would like to see CCP sue the syndicate. That area of space has been around a lot longer than the 5 year trademark. So to me CCP has a really strong case.
Aref - To help educate everyone a little bit on Trademarks ... not only is "The Syndicate" able to be trademarked but it was done so over 5 years ago. That means that it is now unchallengeable as to its legitimacy or for anyone else to claim earlier first use. In terms of those other examples you sited, trademarks are done only for a specific area of commerce. You can be "Hooters the Car Dealership" and not violate the Hooters restaurant chain's trademark. You can only protect your name within your area of commerce. In our case that is within the gaming space and supporting guild websites. In fact a major gaming company just bumped into our mark working on a similarly titled game and we ended up putting some legal documents in place so as to confirm we agreed there was no conflict. Hopefully that helps clarify a bit more on how marks work.
In terms of why our opinion gets asked about for some articles... it is perhaps due in part to the fact that the major news sites all have views behind the scenes of game development that most readers do not. Time and again they bump into us behind that same curtain. So there is a knowledge that there is a unique perspective on some aspects of gaming that can be shared that there are no other major guild entities able to offer with the same level of breadth, depth and duration. There are certainly groups involved in game X or Y.. or people involved in things (such as the SWTOR example person above) but in terms of having a single group that has seen and influenced and helped with most things over the past 15 years, there is no other source. Thus an article every 4-6 months on things going on has relevance. While it is also fun for the trolls, the exposure given by all of the trolling posts also creates new opportunities so its actually a good thing.
In terms of the kinds of things that are done that are different or special or simply not something you may have heard of or reaized was done, here are a few examples...
Imagine there is a FPS maker. They are early in their development. They have a title you haven't heard of yet but its playable and in need of some early testing. Perhaps that is server stress testing; perhaps that is early systems testing; perhaps some initial map run throughs. They do not want the game to leak to the public. They need several hundred people to achieve their results. They want those results over a very short window of time. They want a consolidated, professional report at the end rather than sifting through reams of bug and feedback reports. They don't have the time or desire to deal with all the NDAs, handing out keys, installation issues etc.. and need whomever they work with to provide a complete turn-key solution, with complete confidentiality, and that has a track record of success so they can count on getting the quality results they want in the timeframe they need it. And when all is said and done, they want the game as secret as they currently have it. - That kind of scenario is one The Syndicate gets involved in several times a year. We provide that turn key solution, with a track record of results and with 0 leaks.
Imagine there is a RPG creator. They are in pre-production. They have design documents and concepts. They have a vision for how the core systems of the game will work. The game remains shrouded in shadow. The information is business critical to them and they cannot afford for it to leak. By the same token, they need a cross-section of their target audience (age, location, socio-economic status, play styles, gaming habits etc..) to provide feedback on those core systems and directions to see if they are heading in a direction that offers them a chance at success. They turn to The Syndicate to provide that team, flown in from around the country (and sometimes around the world) to go on site and provide that review and comments. Multiple teams over multiple months with different charateristics are used to provide a full cross section. Those teams follow the game through development providing early feedback until the hand-off when a larger scale testing presence can be done. The Syndicate fills that gap.
Imagine you are a gaming hardware manufacturer. Perhaps you make complete computers. Perhaps you create accessories and peripherals and internal components. There is whole behind the scenes process that goes into the creation of that hardware that is not just about specs and speed. There are ergonomic studies of how users make use of the items within their gaming space. There are usability studies. There are asthetic studies. There are, of course, also real world game testing studies putting the hardware under load in real conditions and seeing how it holds up. In all cases the information is buisness critical and proprietary to the manufacturers who consider it a competitive advantage. They need to evaluate all of those things against the cross section of their target audience and they need to do so in secrecy without leaks and with a group that has a track record of results. The Syndicate fills those needs.
Those are three brief examples but the list could go on with MMO developers, software developers and so on. We've been doing this for many years and many of the games you enjoy have a component of our involvement. We do it discretely behind the scenes and we do our work well enough that we continually pick up new roles based on the success of the previous ones.
So, the humorous rantings of the trolls aside, there is definitely a unique perspective The Syndicate can bring to news articles that you will likely see more of, on this site, in the future.
The Syndicate might indeed have become part of the problem, the above statement would indicate that (if true) then they are influencing the Dev process of MMO's... and.. their a business, their not players, and they have a vested interest.. which to me would mean that any input they have.. would be tainted.. who they are no longer matters. I'd be very interested in what games they have been involved in.. it may even explain why certain games have failed. were they involved with APB ?
If mmorpg.com is gonna talk about Guilds, talk about real famous oldschool guilds like LotD or Fires of Heaven . Who the effff are these syndicate guys? myself i've seen over 15 different fail guilds called syndicate, exile,fate,etc...
right along with The Knightsof (insert some bullshit random name here) .
between the half assed reviews( I didnt get to end game but I know everything about it!) and these type of articles I think I'll seek my info elsewhere.
If the Syndicate is helping to develop all these awesome games, and is doing all these tests with developers during beta, why is it that on world of warcraft they are a second rate guild? Not once have I even seen Synidcate get close to a world first kill, so if you had so much time to beta and test bosses and the like, why is it that in the live no one has gotten any noteworth achievements in game from your guild?
It's entirely possible that it is rather boring completing a puzzle that you helped create. It's also very probable that part of their agreement is that they are prohibited in their contracts from geting world firsts lest the tinfoil hat crowd cries foul.
@Heartless - While there is a massive leap between what you do in an Alpha/Beta/FAF and The Syndicate's contracted producer-level interactions, you've been a member of the MMO community for quite a while, spending half that time blogging about it. I'm quite sure that if you submitted a particularly insightful, humorous or controversial article from your site to MMORPG.com they would post a news article about it. The same goes for Paragus, Teala Te'jir and quite a few others here with some really great insight into MMO and game development.
The problem is that when anyone starts to rise above this pack, this pack tears them down. The minute someone is getting their articles covered, the pack here pounces on them "MMORPG.com is a shill of game x so they are giving exposure to the shill who's shilling for game x!" "they must be a friend of the editor" "who they hell are they? I never heard of them so they must be nobody" However, on the flip side, the minute some unknown says he's making a revolutionary MMO and fires off the most ludicrous wishlist of a feature list he immediately has five dozen disciples worshipping at his feet... with complete disregard for history and logic.
It's insanity.
I'd really like to see more spotlight stuff on Heartless, Paragus, Teala, KeenandGraev and other knowledgeable players. I'd also like to see more people take advantage of these opportunities (ex: having the ear of Dragon of TS) to have the discussions on community and development that are obviously hot topics judging by the massive threadnaughts that appear around hrere regarding player interaction, innovation and 'immersion'.
Want to know how devs have worked toward building better community? TS can probably field that question for you.
Want to know what goes into making a raid dungeon difficult enough to prevent everyone from completing it on the first day? TS can probably answer that as well.
Want to know what kind of hurdles devs face when creating guild-focused content and features? Sounds like something TS could probably answer, also.
My one challenge to every poster here is this: If you are about to post something negative - STOP - think about what questions you have about guilds and game design that TS might be able to answer, and post that instead. It's probably a question that a lot of other people here would be interested in hearing the answer to so, if nothing else, you'd be doing something cool for your fellow MMORPG.com members.
"TS" is a clear and shining example of everything that's wrong with MMO's nowadays.
People don't like them not because of that self induced "they've risen above the crop due to their success" spiel.
People don't like them because of their "corporate politicaly correct approach" and their outright lies and self back patting. Their ego's can't fit through doors. "World's oldest guild" anyone? Everyone remember those lies that they told? They fooled Guiness and took advantage of loopholes. Doing so doesn't make you the worlds oldest guild. It does make you unethical and lacking integrity.
I love my guild, I really do. I love it more than anything. We've got our own accomplishments, things that we're all very proud of. But you don't see us running around spouting them off everywhere. You don't see us bragging about them. We keep to ourselves and concentrate on playing games and just out and out having a good time together. That's what guilds are supposed to do.
While we're on the subject of "oldest guilds" the first "official guild" in any MMO was a guild called Guild of Chaos which was formed in Neverwinter Nights on AOL, the first MMO. I could look it up but if memory serves me right I think they were formed in 1992 and then other guilds followed suit around the time that PvP was introduced into the game. That's long before "TS" was even a thought. Many of the guilds from NWN are still running around today. Bregan D'Arth, KAAOS, MECH, and that's just a few.
No one likes anyone who boasts or brags. That's part of the problem with ANY guild that does it and why "TS" as you put it, gets so much ire. It has nothing to do with "fame" or "rising above" as you say.
A little humility goes a long way. However, in this case it is lost.
You mention these other bloggers such as Teala, etc. I don't think people would be so much to jump on them and let them have it as you say. I've read their blogs and for the most part I've found them an enjoyable read. Their well thought out, well written, cohesive, and they do so without inflating their own ego's. TS can't seem to do that. They seem more interested in perpetuating an "ego machine" for lack of a better term.
Whenever I hear a guild or a developer mention "raiding" as a manner of point through which they use as a means of proliferating their viability and success, they instantly lose all credibility with me. I remember reading a dev post one time from a dev for Champions Online saying how he was in an uber guild so that instantly gave him credibility and knowledge how certain things should be done. I instantly groaned, and well, the areas he worked on were just as lackluster as I had expected them to be.
Guilds in the early MMO's had no guild chat and some didn't even have guild tags. This meant that guild leaders actually had to lead. There were no real phat loots and there were no world firsts to be done. The games were more about adventure, role playing, and PvP in some. Because of this it meant that guild leaders had to actually work at leading. They didn't have the crutch of a guild tag and the lure of the carrot (phat loots) to draw in people to their guilds. Most guilds had a story that explained their name. Most guilds had some depth, and their guild members shared a tight knit bond with one another. They helped create a sense of community and guilds and guild leaders acted responsibly and held themselves accountable for their actions by and large. Hell in NWN for example, you had to exist as a guild for six months before you could even recieve "sanctioning" by the staff. Those games forced you to lead. It's also why most of those guilds are still around roughly 20 years later. Guilds and most developers nowadays just don't get it sadly. Their are guilds out there that do, but "TS" is clearly not one of them. Their actions and attitude certainly dictate that.
Banegrivm Leader of the 1st Fist of Light www.1stfistoflight.com
Egotistical nerds have always drawn ire, because they are obnoxious. 500 nerds filled with over inflated egos is just excessively ick, and trying to validate their delusions of grandeur by giving them face time at mmorpg.com calls into question the motivations.
I think somehow mmorpg.com is affilliated with this guild. Perhaps someone on the staff here is a member.
Every time I here about these guys I get an 'oooh gross' feeling. It's like some obnoxious nerd telling you his IQ and how he is a bonafide genius. Just yuck. Get over yourselves.
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If anyone has suggestions for editorial (such as the member highlight suggested above) please email us or use the Site Suggestions forum. Those are more direct ways of letting us know what you'd like to see more or less of.
because your last article from this week? about the guild didn't leave enough comments that we don't care about them?
1st time (2nd after the 1st article) i ever hear about this guild or w/e.
WE DON'T CARE.
simple, and it also looks bad that mmorpg.com is promoting guilds (well tools guild that is).
i swear if there weren't for all this prizes event going on here ( the free rift copy, free computer case etc), i would have never step foot in this site again.
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not another article on this guild - please let this be the last!
what is mmorpg.com thinking of? come on there are thousands of guilds many who dont have elitist views, many who recruit in more than 2 games - surely all our comments on these "news" articles should show how much we dont want this kind of article?
no one cares about The Syndicate and I only feel obliged to post in these comments as these articles are the worst mmorpg.com has done in a long time!
If anyone has suggestions for editorial (such as the member highlight suggested above) please email us or use the Site Suggestions forum. Those are more direct ways of letting us know what you'd like to see more or less of.
OK I will do just that but you would have thought after last weeks negative pushback about this another article on the same guild would not be a grand idea.
Actually in all honesty they are less of a guild and more of a regular company these days,
Cheers to "the Syndicate" to bad your aprisl fools joke was abit meak.
To all the haters... Name me one other guild who has had the continuity and succes (real life that is... i care not for who rimmed Arthas first) and still is going strong. It is sure as heck not my old guild from UO... After all if they offer a, as they stated service then they need to protect their "brand".
In my mind i see a lot of lil kids in the sandbox being angry because one kid has a bucket made out of gold,
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
The Syndicate might indeed have become part of the problem, the above statement would indicate that (if true) then they are influencing the Dev process of MMO's... and.. their a business, their not players, and they have a vested interest.. which to me would mean that any input they have.. would be tainted.. who they are no longer matters. I'd be very interested in what games they have been involved in.. it may even explain why certain games have failed. were they involved with APB ?
I'd be interested in which post-DAoC MMOs didn't have input from established and influential guilds during development. As a dev, one is seeing things from the inside. The combination of already knowing how everything works, intrinsic familiarity with the best possible paths and attachment to the project often colors things in such a way that an outsider's view is necessary. It's why about 5-6 years into almost every MMO some abomination happens, as the team - in focus and in members - is so far removed from the original design that crap like Gates of Discord, Trials of Atlantis and Age of Shadows happen. I don't follow WOW... how's Cataclysm? Did they break the pattern?
As for your theory about player-involvement in development and game success/failure, you do know how WOW was created, right?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Actually in all honesty they are less of a guild and more of a regular company these days,
Cheers to "the Syndicate" to bad your aprisl fools joke was abit meak.
To all the haters... Name me one other guild who has had the continuity and succes (real life that is... i care not for who rimmed Arthas first) and still is going strong. It is sure as heck not my old guild from UO... After all if they offer a, as they stated service then they need to protect their "brand".
In my mind i see a lot of lil kids in the sandbox being angry because one kid has a bucket made out of gold,
If they are more of a business than a guild then why perpetuate an outright lie that they are the oldest guild when they are clearly not? Their are plenty of other guilds that are long term who have been around as I mentioned in another post previously.
Banegrivm Leader of the 1st Fist of Light www.1stfistoflight.com
A little humility goes a long way. However, in this case it is lost.
Fair enough.
You mention these other bloggers such as Teala, etc. I don't think people would be so much to jump on them and let them have it as you say. I've read their blogs and for the most part I've found them an enjoyable read. Their well thought out, well written, cohesive, and they do so without inflating their own ego's.
I'm curious then why they stopped spotlighting Paragus' Rants.
Guilds in the early MMO's had no guild chat and some didn't even have guild tags. This meant that guild leaders actually had to lead. There were no real phat loots and there were no world firsts to be done. The games were more about adventure, role playing, and PvP in some. Because of this it meant that guild leaders had to actually work at leading. They didn't have the crutch of a guild tag and the lure of the carrot (phat loots) to draw in people to their guilds. Most guilds had a story that explained their name. Most guilds had some depth, and their guild members shared a tight knit bond with one another. They helped create a sense of community and guilds and guild leaders acted responsibly and held themselves accountable for their actions by and large. Hell in NWN for example, you had to exist as a guild for six months before you could even recieve "sanctioning" by the staff. Those games forced you to lead. It's also why most of those guilds are still around roughly 20 years later.
Excellent observation. It's a topic that I can assure you developers discuss often. Two big issue is that there are both less people willing to lead (but plenty willing to take the title of guildmaster/captain/leader) and less people that seem to be able to effectively lead. Affecting both is just the nature of today's society with people doing multipel thngs at once even those who can lead often lack the time to.
You have a great point there about the early guilds and why many are around still today while most guilds created now will be a memory or a shodow of itself in a year.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Actually in all honesty they are less of a guild and more of a regular company these days,
Cheers to "the Syndicate" to bad your aprisl fools joke was abit meak.
To all the haters... Name me one other guild who has had the continuity and succes (real life that is... i care not for who rimmed Arthas first) and still is going strong. It is sure as heck not my old guild from UO... After all if they offer a, as they stated service then they need to protect their "brand".
In my mind i see a lot of lil kids in the sandbox being angry because one kid has a bucket made out of gold,
Success in a field with no competition isn't much of a success. Show me all the other 'guilds' also trying to be companies. There are little to none because its fucking stupid. If they were seen as just a company, or just a guild, they would be piss poor as either. But since their the only ones who try and couple the two they get attention. Just a bunch of PR (aka BS). Maybe I'll start a FPS clan that's also an investment group and watch retards piss themselves excited over the biggest 'clan and investment group' in gaming.
Comments
Kudos to Syndicate for getting where they are today and staying together so long but seriously why do we need to know they embrace FTP or make april fools jokes? It's a none news story. I'm joining the masses here and would much prefer articles about different guilds, there are plenty of solid guilds out there, ok they may not have the PR machine the Syndicate obviously have but they are worthy of hunting down and being interviewed.
Too much ego involved on The Syndicate site for my liking, by all means state your successes but reading their blurb on there and here you would think we all need to be bowing down to them for their involvement in the industry, kudos for contributing but sorry there are hundreds and thousands of individuals and many, many guilds that contribute every day through so many betas and feedback on official forums and forums like these.
If The Syndicate are taken that seriously by the gaming industry just says to me there's something wrong with the industry - I don't want one guilds feelings about a game taken more seriously than anyone elses.
I'd like The Syndicate more and respect them a little more if they toned down their self promotion, it's more like a corporate machine than a warm welcoming guild, I'm sure they have great members and do a lot for each other but their public persona isn't very likable unless you dig the whole corporate thing.
I do hope we don't have wasted space on this site dedicated to just this guild every week, is mmorpg.com that stuck for content or is it purely (as I suspect) nepotism ?
Good luck to The Syndicate in every thing they do, I wish them well but please don't bore us with this irrelevance any more.
lol love the 'jealousy' comments when on every MMO i have played I have never ran into them or even heard whispers of them doing well. As for their testing hardware and software, their basically a volunteer amateur QA team. Again, no one cares. Gaurantee I've done more QA work in early game development than any one of their members. Not a common occurance but it's also uninteresting to observers.
Like I said the syndicate is famous for being famous. their the MMO equivilent of Paris Hilton or Kim Kardashian. Famous but ultimately contributing very little if anything.
Ok, I am going to stop you there; just because it hasn't successfully been challenged (has anyone even bothered to try?), does not mean that it cannot be successfully challenged in court. It is much the same as when Microsoft sued Lindows because of it's similarity to Windows, and Lindows countersued Microsoft because Microsoft didn't create the word Windows. Microsoft wisely settled out of court on that one, and paid Lindows to change their name. The simple fact of the matter is that ANYTHING can be challenged in court (and generally is these days); NOTHING is unchallengeable.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
roflmao.. are they going to sue Eve online.. because an area of space is called Syndicate.. and regardless of their claims.. they don't have any right to stop other people or guilds, corporations etc.. from using the name.. but.. as i've yet to see any game their actually active in.. its kind of pointless.. what games do they even appear in? they certainly can't be the mainstream ones. but.. its easy to be a 'king of the hill' if you choose an extremely small hill.. right..
I thought it was funny.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
ive heard of them. i think. But they never amounted to anything and always did horrible. least any Syndicate guild/clan/tribe/corp i ever seen has. and the writer of this articles needs to go find a new job. If your gonna post about sum dumb guild. then Post about the ones WHO ARE ACHEIVING STUFF! who have been in games since beta and still runing strong in those games today. Those are the ones wed like to hear about as they can tell a story about a game from start till today. and really give info on these games. Not have people claim...oh developers listen to them..they are so smart their above guild status...pfft please. No developers gives a rats ass on wat any1 says. n the ones that do listen to the community end up failing cuz they did listen. Lets face it folks too many styles we all want in games. we killem faster then their coming in. So mmorpg.com get a new writer. And who ever keeps giving me warnings. Do your job. the last person i said somthing 2 was banned from fourms and soon the game and just likes giving a decent game bad PR. You know sorta like we all will do over you article :-P
Actually I would like to see CCP sue the syndicate. That area of space has been around a lot longer than the 5 year trademark. So to me CCP has a really strong case.
The Syndicate might indeed have become part of the problem, the above statement would indicate that (if true) then they are influencing the Dev process of MMO's... and.. their a business, their not players, and they have a vested interest.. which to me would mean that any input they have.. would be tainted.. who they are no longer matters. I'd be very interested in what games they have been involved in.. it may even explain why certain games have failed. were they involved with APB ?
Onyl syndicate I care about is the Bullfrog Game Syndicate and how cool it would be if they remade it today
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/ab/Norsefire-logo.png
And who are these guys again? {mod edit}
If mmorpg.com is gonna talk about Guilds, talk about real famous oldschool guilds like LotD or Fires of Heaven . Who the effff are these syndicate guys? myself i've seen over 15 different fail guilds called syndicate, exile,fate,etc...
right along with The Knightsof (insert some bullshit random name here) .
between the half assed reviews( I didnt get to end game but I know everything about it!) and these type of articles I think I'll seek my info elsewhere.
"TS" is a clear and shining example of everything that's wrong with MMO's nowadays.
People don't like them not because of that self induced "they've risen above the crop due to their success" spiel.
People don't like them because of their "corporate politicaly correct approach" and their outright lies and self back patting. Their ego's can't fit through doors. "World's oldest guild" anyone? Everyone remember those lies that they told? They fooled Guiness and took advantage of loopholes. Doing so doesn't make you the worlds oldest guild. It does make you unethical and lacking integrity.
I love my guild, I really do. I love it more than anything. We've got our own accomplishments, things that we're all very proud of. But you don't see us running around spouting them off everywhere. You don't see us bragging about them. We keep to ourselves and concentrate on playing games and just out and out having a good time together. That's what guilds are supposed to do.
While we're on the subject of "oldest guilds" the first "official guild" in any MMO was a guild called Guild of Chaos which was formed in Neverwinter Nights on AOL, the first MMO. I could look it up but if memory serves me right I think they were formed in 1992 and then other guilds followed suit around the time that PvP was introduced into the game. That's long before "TS" was even a thought. Many of the guilds from NWN are still running around today. Bregan D'Arth, KAAOS, MECH, and that's just a few.
No one likes anyone who boasts or brags. That's part of the problem with ANY guild that does it and why "TS" as you put it, gets so much ire. It has nothing to do with "fame" or "rising above" as you say.
A little humility goes a long way. However, in this case it is lost.
You mention these other bloggers such as Teala, etc. I don't think people would be so much to jump on them and let them have it as you say. I've read their blogs and for the most part I've found them an enjoyable read. Their well thought out, well written, cohesive, and they do so without inflating their own ego's. TS can't seem to do that. They seem more interested in perpetuating an "ego machine" for lack of a better term.
Whenever I hear a guild or a developer mention "raiding" as a manner of point through which they use as a means of proliferating their viability and success, they instantly lose all credibility with me. I remember reading a dev post one time from a dev for Champions Online saying how he was in an uber guild so that instantly gave him credibility and knowledge how certain things should be done. I instantly groaned, and well, the areas he worked on were just as lackluster as I had expected them to be.
Guilds in the early MMO's had no guild chat and some didn't even have guild tags. This meant that guild leaders actually had to lead. There were no real phat loots and there were no world firsts to be done. The games were more about adventure, role playing, and PvP in some. Because of this it meant that guild leaders had to actually work at leading. They didn't have the crutch of a guild tag and the lure of the carrot (phat loots) to draw in people to their guilds. Most guilds had a story that explained their name. Most guilds had some depth, and their guild members shared a tight knit bond with one another. They helped create a sense of community and guilds and guild leaders acted responsibly and held themselves accountable for their actions by and large. Hell in NWN for example, you had to exist as a guild for six months before you could even recieve "sanctioning" by the staff. Those games forced you to lead. It's also why most of those guilds are still around roughly 20 years later. Guilds and most developers nowadays just don't get it sadly. Their are guilds out there that do, but "TS" is clearly not one of them. Their actions and attitude certainly dictate that.
Banegrivm
Leader of the 1st Fist of Light
www.1stfistoflight.com
Egotistical nerds have always drawn ire, because they are obnoxious. 500 nerds filled with over inflated egos is just excessively ick, and trying to validate their delusions of grandeur by giving them face time at mmorpg.com calls into question the motivations.
I think somehow mmorpg.com is affilliated with this guild. Perhaps someone on the staff here is a member.
Every time I here about these guys I get an 'oooh gross' feeling. It's like some obnoxious nerd telling you his IQ and how he is a bonafide genius. Just yuck. Get over yourselves.
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because your last article from this week? about the guild didn't leave enough comments that we don't care about them?
1st time (2nd after the 1st article) i ever hear about this guild or w/e.
WE DON'T CARE.
simple, and it also looks bad that mmorpg.com is promoting guilds (well tools guild that is).
i swear if there weren't for all this prizes event going on here ( the free rift copy, free computer case etc), i would have never step foot in this site again.
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not another article on this guild - please let this be the last!
what is mmorpg.com thinking of? come on there are thousands of guilds many who dont have elitist views, many who recruit in more than 2 games - surely all our comments on these "news" articles should show how much we dont want this kind of article?
no one cares about The Syndicate and I only feel obliged to post in these comments as these articles are the worst mmorpg.com has done in a long time!
So it's a guild that beta tests mmos, er cool story bro...yet again.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
OK I will do just that but you would have thought after last weeks negative pushback about this another article on the same guild would not be a grand idea.
The rage is strong in this thread.
Actually in all honesty they are less of a guild and more of a regular company these days,
Cheers to "the Syndicate" to bad your aprisl fools joke was abit meak.
To all the haters... Name me one other guild who has had the continuity and succes (real life that is... i care not for who rimmed Arthas first) and still is going strong. It is sure as heck not my old guild from UO... After all if they offer a, as they stated service then they need to protect their "brand".
In my mind i see a lot of lil kids in the sandbox being angry because one kid has a bucket made out of gold,
This have been a good conversation
Excellent post, Tawess
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I'd be interested in which post-DAoC MMOs didn't have input from established and influential guilds during development. As a dev, one is seeing things from the inside. The combination of already knowing how everything works, intrinsic familiarity with the best possible paths and attachment to the project often colors things in such a way that an outsider's view is necessary. It's why about 5-6 years into almost every MMO some abomination happens, as the team - in focus and in members - is so far removed from the original design that crap like Gates of Discord, Trials of Atlantis and Age of Shadows happen. I don't follow WOW... how's Cataclysm? Did they break the pattern?
As for your theory about player-involvement in development and game success/failure, you do know how WOW was created, right?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
alot of similarities to Goonsquad.
although they actually make you pay for bullsh*t like this and syndicate used it as an April Fools joke! ^^
If they are more of a business than a guild then why perpetuate an outright lie that they are the oldest guild when they are clearly not? Their are plenty of other guilds that are long term who have been around as I mentioned in another post previously.
Banegrivm
Leader of the 1st Fist of Light
www.1stfistoflight.com
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Success in a field with no competition isn't much of a success. Show me all the other 'guilds' also trying to be companies. There are little to none because its fucking stupid. If they were seen as just a company, or just a guild, they would be piss poor as either. But since their the only ones who try and couple the two they get attention. Just a bunch of PR (aka BS). Maybe I'll start a FPS clan that's also an investment group and watch retards piss themselves excited over the biggest 'clan and investment group' in gaming.