Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Clans CYBERDESTRUCTION, 1st Canyon, and ETSU leave FE!
hookiedupu2
Member Posts: 19
The official reasoning was given here: http://cyberdestruction.net/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=19&id=846&Itemid=169#846
tl;dr: Fallen Earth staff don't ban exploiters, botters, or hackers. They also don't follow their code of conduct. To protest this illegal and unfair game management model, clans CD and ETSU have boycotted and left FE, sending mass letters to the BBB with regards to the bad business practices being employed by the Fallen Earth staff. 1st Canyon left due to the massive mistreatment they were getting by players in clans Saints and Exile (ironically the two clans proven guilty of cheating by screenshots and videos).
For those of you who don't know, Cyberdestruction, 1st Canyon, and ETSU are three of the largest clans left in FE. With their departure and boycott the only PvP clans left are Saints and Exile, leaving the wasteland population decimated and the state of PvP barren.
Clear evidence of misconduct and cheating can be found here: http://cyberdestruction.net/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=19&id=521&Itemid=169
Comments
You reported wrong guys. Exile/Saints/ex WoW are the clans for whom the game is being developed. They complain and devs even change the code for them. Obviously nothing will happen to them. Too bad 3 major clans are leaving because of this though.
Uh... ok. I'm going to be honest here. I'm in Exile, and I'm kind of confused by all this "exploit" business, no-one has been 'sploiting around me and I've been in the clan for a year. I'm thoroughly sick of being branded a cheater just because of the clan tag I have. I don't even PvP 99% of the time for heaven's sake, and I, personally, have zero tolerance for cheating. If I truly believed anyone in my clan was hacking/exploiting, I'd have been gone a long time ago.
I doubt anyone here is going to take my word for it, but I still feel it needs to be said.
Exile, as it stands now, is a small, mostly PvE clan. That's based on the players left behind when KAOS went out on their own.
I haven't been in-game for a week (been away from home) so I don't know if there's some huge drama I've missed, but I gotta say attacking Icarus through the BBB, and withdrawing sub fees, and posting on any forum you can think of about it seems very harsh.
For people who claim to care about the game, attacking it on all available fronts sends a contradictory message.
What are you looking for? Should Icarus ban all players that ever had a Saints/Exile tag just because you say they're all a bunch of cheaters?
I saw what aimbotting did to APB, I play games to have fun not to grow myself an epeen (don't want one, I'm a girl, having an epeen would be strange
), I don't understand why anyone would be so obsessed with winning in PvP to the extent that they'd either cheat to win or claim the other guys are cheating when they lose.
Coming out with a stunt like this is winning in the vein of Charlie Sheen (i.e. losing), you're not playing the game you love and you're not supporting the company that makes it either... instead you're adopting a "Do as we say or we shall rain our wrath down upon you" policy, which no-one, dev or player is likely to take kindly to.
Oh dear what a childish behaviour.
REALITY CHECK
The "largest clans" are nothing more than a bunch of randomly invited people, mostly inactives and trial players and I wouldn't be so sure they are gonna be so easily manipulated by someone who they don't know at all. Majority of the clanners probably never spoke with their officiers. Clan will disband, a few officiers will leave, but the majority remains. The community washes away the infants.
The cheaters I personally never encountered (and I have three capped chars now), but if you believe they're there just quit the game without the melodrama "massive mistreatment" oh my god, ... "Press Release" are you f.... serious? That's not mature, that's something that wants to look mature.
REALITY CHECK
The problem is, if you follow the second link, you find screenies of your clan members doing the exploit. Basically, what I understand is if you are flagged for pvp the mushrooms spawned by that boss doesnt make damage to you, you are immune, so you can kill it all the times you want without risk.
I understand you are probably telling the truth here, you never cheat and you dont like it but your clan members were caugh in the act exploiting that bug.
A bug that wasn't noticed and someone else noticed you mean. A GM was called and then all action on said boss with a pvp flag was stopped, and the announcement was made by a gm. How it went was 1 was killed, 1 was despawned by a GM. People didn't know about said bug when they were doing it, they just tend to pvp flag when they pve because most are pvp flagged as it is so its easier for the 2/3 other to flag up than it is to wait 15 mins for a flag to go down, before said incident it wasn't known that a pvp flag could interfere with pve in that kind of a manner.
Later on in the day a member of Saints showed a GM that even without that, said boss was soloable. Even after patching he was able to be duoed.
@OP
1st Canyon Army - They actually crumbled due to internal issues involving the officers and their leader, they were a clan that mass recruited. What was the number they had again? 1300+ members? All spam recruited without being messaged in s1/s2. Talked to someone last night whom was an officer there and their officers left to go to a different clan, didn't poach any members etc. Plus this kind of ruins what you were showing:
http://forums.fallenearth.com/fallenearth/showthread.php?t=65979
ETSU - Wasn't overly loud about why they left.
I was one of the random masses that CD just invited upon my return to the wasteland. I came back for pretty much solo play and crafting- little PvP. So when I say I care so little about alleged cheating and guild drama- I mean it. I was happy as a clam just riding around the wasteland , doing every quest out of order and generally experiencing all the game lore has to offer.
THEN came quit day. Everyone was quitting. I was meh. They removed me from the clan as part of the quit. Again...Meh.
Then the GM right before he quit, posted a link ( an apparent Tos Violation ) to the CD website and that got everyone talking. I posted a few times that cheating was bad but a GM ignoring cheating is worse. There were probably 100 back and forths between people on Global. I said something innocuous again like I think the GMs should address the issue and I got a PM from Tesseract saying that if I said one more thing in Global, I would face a temp ban. Tesseract then went into Global and basically repeated the threat to everyone in the game.
That was when I personally quit.
I mean who does that? Not even Blizzard, SOE, EA would do that. Shit, not even Age of Conan would do that!
In an age where games like EVE govern their games with input from their players to have a GM basically come into chat and threaten everyone like some sort of Darth Vader Dictator is crazy.
Who at IcarusFE approved such a imperial " YOU SHALL NOT TALK" directive ?
If a player is spamming Global, at BEST, all of the other MMOs would disable their ability to speak in Global or give them a few warnings or temp ban them, but not try and dictate to the entire player base what is kosher to talk about.
Shit, I can even understand it in the official forums because that is there to help players not to air out drama.
Sorry, I don't know if FE is based in America but it sure sounds like they are based in China with their anti free speech rules.
I quit for that one reason. Any game that threatens free speech can go kiss my ass.
Shadowlord Sage
CmdrAkbar
Napa Valley, UO, 1997.
Fallen Earth is the first and only game that I know that specificly has in it's CoC that people WILL get banned from the official forums and the game for posting stuff on EXTERNAL sites.
They delete EVERY critisising posts from their forums within minutes and if you are on the badboy-list for critisism you're as good as banned.
The only exception from this rule is made for only 3 dozen of players being in the Clans: Saints/Exile/KAOS who can do anything they want at all times and the are not banned.
The Lead Dev (Marie Croall aka Aro Sei aka GM Skathi) personally supports them. There is an evidence FRAPS of her witnessing a banable exploit by a Saints player that did it as long as it existed saying that she "will take care of it" on Youtube somewhere (unfortunately the forums containing the link is down atm...) however, that player and all his friends in Saints/Exile/KAOS stay untouched, while some other players from other clans using the same exploit ONCE got some temp-bans.
They can flame in the game and on the forums (see screenshot in my gallery! WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS!) like they want and nothing happens. Each of them has a couple of thousand forum posts like "you just suck" harrassing other players. Those posts do not get deleted and they don't get banned. Those 30 or so people are personally responsible for about 600 cancelled subscriptions so far, still nothing happens.
Only some time ago they banned that guy that was running a blog about all that stuff. Only after massive protests, and I guess him agreeing to delete his blog, he was allowed back in after suffering the 2nd longest ban of the game ever.
EDIT: The FRAPS-proof of the Fallen Earth Lead Dev:
What you can see: The prone player is frapsing the Saints player exploiting the banable exploit known as "Tannerfield Well" (meanwhile fixed after a year). The player asks GM Skathi (aka Aro Sei aka Marie Croall - Lead Dev of Fallen Earth) if it is still a banable exploit. The answer is yes. She teleports to the location and catches the Saints guy in the act. Then she tells the frapsing player that she "will take care of it". The Saints player and all his comrades have never been banned for this or any other banable exploit they have used.
I find it odd, that the site with all the truth posted on it has seemingly crashed. I was going to link a reply that was made there that put a lot of thing about what is going on into perspective. I hate to do this, but I will have to link it in this thread later when the Cyberdestruction.net comes back up.
It's up. Page 6, post #60
http://cyberdestruction.net/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=19&id=846&limit=10&limitstart=50&Itemid=169#925
Hmmm... I've just read that whole thread and I see a lot of covering of ears and going "lalalalalala" whenever someone makes a valid point contrary to Cyberdestroyer's ramblings. Or else insulting his own former clanmates when they ask questions.
To be honest I saw nothing in the logs pasted that was out of order, and saw the GM concerned making an effort to joke with the player after their tense previous interaction.
Should be noted at some point that both Tiggs and Carlin are female, not that it means anything other than the people claiming such familiarity with the game are not as up to speed as they would claim to be.
I'm also amused at being mentioned as a "low member" of Exile over there, cheers much guys. I'm an officer. And I stand by what I said above.
I don't have the patience Inanecorn has to engage in a debate over any of this, I figure it will turn out to be a tempest in a teacup provoked by someone taking umbrage where the was none to be had, and then going on a crusade to convert the interwebs to his p.o.v..
Know what rule no. 1 of Exile is? No drama.
It's a damn good rule.
Read Inane's post above.
See? No drama.
Obviously keeping it as "inside matter" doesn't help much. Exile was exploiting already back when the game was a lot younger. I remember that crafters experience was nerfed around the time, when level cap was increased(a year ago) for the reason, that "crafters" would advance too fast. Then Exile was exploiting a buggy mission and got to level 50 overnight. Nothing happened, only their leader, it was Prometheus at the time I think, told the same as you here preach, "No drama". Which basically means/meant, that suck it up, we do what we want.
That has been going through the history of FE, that the same people exploit the crap out of everything possible and nothing happens to them. Yet, when they start a QQ campaign on FE forums, devs go through thick and thin, just to please the exploiters. No-one has ever told, that every Saints/Exile member should be banned, but those who are responsible of shady actions, SHOULD be punished.
Actually bans were handed out so get your facts straight. I actually got pms from 1 of the bigger instigators over there(ragtime roastbeefy as he is known on the forums) asking why I wasn't banned, accusing me of using said instance because i was quote on quote 'in the area' previously, after bans were handed out(only time I had been there in the past couple months was to see if i could get the ap missions on my 30ish toon before resetting faction and to buy around 2100 average cotton when haietta would get flipped as its merchants were bugged and hadn't been upgraded to the shorter upgrade time). There have been numerous bans handed out through FE's existence but as they have a privacy policy they don't release the info. And considering they have logs and that kinda deal, I highly doubt those poor innocent souls 'did it once' and if they felt so wronged there is an appeals system.
In the future get your facts straight before you scream about nonsense, and both sides have been able to troll and flame at times. A lot gets nuked, bans and warnings do go out they just aren't publicized.
As for a cpl thousand posts telling other people they suck? Are you feeling ok as the closest that's happened to that on a regular basis was 'uncheck the suck button', which is just a joke implying going from bad to good is fast and easy...which it isn't but people expect it to be.
Ahh so you are caiylin the person whom was trolling region before that with the same kinda language, even going on about having sex with them(in an e-rp kinda way), or were you just copying what was convenient for you? lol
@highway
And when evidence was asked for the claims he was yelling about he instead jumped to personal attacks as has been noted further in the thread and he even got the information about the supposed exploiting wrong when it was stickied and just a thread under that one. Ohh sorry I missed this: "Last Edit: 15 Apr 2011 12:25 by cybrdestroyr.", guess he had to correct himself and even then he got it wrong, guess he just felt like he needed to exagerate and lie.
Gotta say his style of tar and feathering anyone whom opposes his viewpoint is pretty low, especially as he tries to act as if it is based off of facts.
@Rixk
What 'qq campaign' was that, that the dev's went through "thick and thin to please the 'exploiters'"? And actually if that was the case people would refer to single people...not singular clans. I'm curious though as I've heard this statement before and wondering what thing you are referring to.
My facts are straight. The privacy policy that they claim to have and that contradicts their own Code of Conduct, might stand for the fact that they never said "x received a ban" and it's perfect for you to claim "there have been bans" since there is no black on white written statement. But you are just - like the devs themselfs - calling people idiots by it. People that are online every day, can clearly see the Saints, Exile and KAOS chars in question being online without interruption, therefor clearly no bans are handed out.
About the "you suck posts"... current examples:
http://forums.fallenearth.com/fallenearth/showpost.php?p=634307&postcount=21
http://forums.fallenearth.com/fallenearth/showpost.php?p=634330&postcount=32
But the BEST example of how Saints/Exile/KAOS think are their own videos with the nice "text". Especially the videos of Saints Leader "Hollywood Undead" who's favourite line is "suck on my dick while I fuck that ass". That is the attitude of you people and the Icarus Studios / Fallen Earth LLC support that by holding the hand over you! (Those videos are all linked in a sticky thread on the official Fallen Earth Forums even tho it clearly violates the CoC. The company has been told that they are in violation of the CoC but neither have the links been removed, nor have the people suffered any consequences.)
The only LOGIC explaination that I can see why some 30ish people are safe from everything even tho they personally caused like 600 people to quit so far, is that it's GM/Devs private accounts... but that would be more than lame, wouldn't it?
The only difference between Exile/KAOS and Saints is, that the Saints do flame and harrass more (except for Nufan, he flames as much as Saints). Other than that, they could be the same people playing...
Oh and finally, no, I'm not that guy. Region can be read by every player in the region - like the name suggests. Every player that comes to Central Kaibab at any time, knows what type of people Saints/Exile/KAOS are, just from the region chat...
I would suspect, judging by the date x-perienced joined and the content of his posts, that its actually cybrdestroyr. I also believe that the "mass exodus" was mostly limited to the leadership of a couple clans. I have seen many of the rank and file from those 3 guilds still in game. I would say 50-60 vice 600.
Actually, your numbers are quite a bit off. Looking at the population densities of Darkfall and Crimecraft with regards to ETSU and CD I'd say maybe a 10th of both clans stayed in FE while the rest moved on, which is their choice and perfectly alright. CD and ETSU are not lead by Fallen Earth devs in that they don't tell you where to piss, what to wear, and what to say. If people want to keep playing FE that's fine, but the leadership of both clans have officially boycotted FE and many of the members have supported that decision (mostly because many of the members suggested it in the first place).
The people reading this thread are going to see a lot of flaming, harassment, and one sided arguments from all clans involved (as they've already seen the trolling from Exile and the accusations from CD). I'd like to point out that this is EXACTLY the toxicity level of the game of FE. The community is only comparible to kids on a playground at school: you're either friends with Jimmy or Ashley but not both and the fighting will go on long past it's prime. Don't believe me? Go read FE's forums for a while, specifically the suggestions and general discussion forums.
I stand with CD and ETSU's decisions to leave FE. Their arguments of GMs breaking the code of conduct are absolutely valid and proven through their actions upon CD leaving FE. I'd also like to state that a few CD members have even received threatening emails from the lead GM, Tiggs, telling them to take down their posts on the CD forums otherwise the Fallen Earth team will press legal charges. I'll copy and repost one of those emails a bit later today.
Their arguments that cheaters don't get punished is also valid, and as a member of the accused cheater clans I can corroborate their evidence with what I've seen in clan chat, ventrilo, and through private messages (and by participating, though I'm not too proud of that).
How is the second post you linked a 'you suck post'? He was merely stating a guideline for kaos and giving an example of how slack it may be, no one was insulted or told they suck or am I magically missing something? Interesting because you even said it yourself they cracked down on the tannerfield instance exploit a bit after it was fixed, all the while trying to downplay the fact they do have logs and tried to make ur own people whom got caught out as the 'victims'.
Well considering its a line from a comedy movie...I dunno maybe its a joke? ohh yeah:
The only place they are safe is your imagination really, or hey maybe you like to completely ignore things that go on so as your points seem valid? Your 'they are the devs/gms' theory was debunked a while ago but yet you want to pretend to ignore it. Bans have gone out as you very well know but you don't want to admit it. Though it's comical that you have conspiracy theories made up and everything lol.
As for 1st Canyon...they are still more than alive and kicking:
http://forums.fallenearth.com/fallenearth/showthread.php?t=66786
http://forums.fallenearth.com/fallenearth/showthread.php?t=66642
Are a couple examples of them still being alive.
@Hayes
Actually if anything it is probably Baz Ino as he posted the same kinda things on the blog he used to run purely against saints. The second video has a few quotes from his site before he removed everything. Actually if you look in the Google Cache all the stuff from his site is saved
@hookied
so which member are you supposedly or are you the exmember Ragtime Roastbeefy, a person whom got kicked from saints and had been kicked from most of the big clans from that whom from that point on held a grudge?
All I'm seeing here are Fallen Earth clans flaming each other. Over and over again. Who the fuck wants to play a game like that? If they're fighting here like children, imagine how bad it is in game and on their forums.
Hmmm, I played FE for a few months at the end of 2010 and I don't recall any of them.
Think if it more like a hand being pulled from a pail of water.
No real difference.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Not those 3 clans obviously!
Two points:
One: I post here and on the FE boards (and everywhere else I post) as an individual not as a representative of my clan. My opinions are purely my own and not representative of Exile. I don't claim to speak for anyone but myself, ever. Exile are not "targetting" this thread (lol at the very idea). I posted because I regularly post here (see post count) and I love FE and don't like to see unfounded accusations being lobbed around about either the game or the company behind it.
Two: Where was I trolling? I have no respect for trolls, and I even started a thread here before suggesting people chill out and remember that these are games we're talking about, pixellated entertainment, that's all they are. What I posted above is in line with my general thinking. To iterate: I don't understand people who cheat to gain an advantage and I equally don't understand those who swear people are cheating because they defeat them in PvP (or whatever). I couldn't care less about interclan politics and who has the bigger epeen. All that drama just puts me off. It has put me off logging into FE since I got back home from my holiday because I want my gaming drama-free and all this nonsense is a drama magnet. I'm playing Dragon Age 2 instead.
Still think I'm trolling? Check my post history, check my FE forums history (I'm wykydone over there) and show me where my opinions have wavered. Check my blog and see how fond I am of drama. I think you'll find I'm consistent in my distaste for it.
Started to go long winded, ha and I know the whole story. Could care less bout what some other clan is doing. How about killing your own clan members when they are trying to get some faction by taking a tower here and there?
Cry me a fucking river.