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Charrs are beasts that eat the children of Ascalon.
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lol Are you familiar with the Middle East?
this is where i think you are wrong..Charr know the humans took their homeland..and that was thousands of years ago...if the flame legion is still around im sure their bad qulities will not be forgivn.. IM sure the cubs are taught what happened..and im sure they keep that in the back of your mind...
What is to stop the humans from expanding on the peace with an expansion out of the Ebonhawke?
Charr are not forgetfull...250 years the Flame legion has been beaten but they are still a thorn in the Side of the other legions...Once the dragons are Defeated what then?
The humans may not keep that peace
Are you roleplaying or something? Im not pushing any agenda, how the hell can you come up with that? You act as if what you talk about in this thread, will affect the relation between humans and Charr. While its been determined by Arenanet already.
Just check the pages on the Guild Wars 2 website already. Listen to the voices on the race pages. Its bloody obvious that many humans hate the Charr and they dont understand the alliance. And that many Charr look down upon humans. There are even political forces within the humans that dont agree with this treaty. And of course its whispered because of what I underlined.
Wtf agenda, this is what Anet wrote down. There is no agenda to be pushed by me, because I dont give a shit about your roleplaying drama.
Im also NOT interested in assumptions about what might happen over time , I was just pointing out whats on their website.
@madeux
"lol Are you familiar with the Middle East?"
Are you familiar with racism? Look at what you just said and think about how horrible that is for a moment, honestly, just because there are some parts of the Middle East that some parts of the world might be at war with, suddenly all of the Middle East is counted as a faceless monster?
Thank you for proving my point.
@needalife
First of all, you don't know if that will be the case. If you read the lore, the lore does point out that Ebonhawke want the treaty, which means that they're tired of fighting. I'm sorry that I can't be as pessimistic as you, but considering that Smodur wants the treaty, and Ebonhawke wants it, I think that they're both going to be eager to teach their children to uphold their treaty, and to teach them that what happened in the past were atrocities, not things to be proud of.
@someforumguy
First of all, I'll apologise, I think I've just been too exposed to other communities where the charr hate is insane. Did you know that there's a forum out there where someone has actually claimed that it's bad that the charr have women now, because charr women have diluted their evilness, turning them into the coke light of evil, and feminising teh charr? I don't know about you but I think that's really horrible and it implies all sorts of misogyny and old world values. I guess I'm just seeing enemies where there are none.
Looking back at things, I think you just might be honestly mistaken, so I apologise for that, okay?
The only thing that bothers me though is that you are incorrect, and you're parading around that incorrectness which then allows other people to utilise that to spread hate. Which is not cool, because we don't need this in Guild Wars 2, so I have to correct you where you're wrong. First of all, the voices, I have listened to them, and I think that you should listen to them to instead of just saying that. Listen to where one charr airs concerns about the treaty, and is quickly shut down by their centurion. That's not hate, that's doubt, and as I've said many times, duty will keep doubt in line.
"I was just pointing out whats on their website."
That's just the problem, you're not. You're pointing out a very slanted, subjective version of it that doesn't take into account all the variables.
(But yeah, rereading my post, it's clear that when I'm dealing with stuff like this, I often find myself dealing with real racism which those who have hate problems in regards to the charr also have - see the first reply. And other old world values such as gender inequality come up, too, which have to be countered. This charr hate seems to come from the most hate-filled sorts of people, and that's what I intend to drag out into the open. We don't need that in a game. Seriously, we do not need that in a game.)
It is clear that Six Tix misunderstood every single word that I wrote.
I sincerely share her opinion that nobody should insult anybody for any reason in game.
GW and GW2 are made for all players' fun. One who cannot follow this rule should not play.
Gardavil2 expressed this very clearly.
Contrary to him, though, I do not hate charrs, I rp hating charrs in GW because that is playing hero
according to GW's design. If charrs will be green dots on the radar in GW2, no players should have
any reason to hate them and it would be crazy to insult those that play charr.
***
At this point a thought made me wonder whether Six Tit nourishes the idea that I hate her because her avatar is a charr
and I would be 'filled with burning hatred' against charrs.
***
One who calls GW player's characters 'racist', 'liar', 'worse than charr' is gratuitouly offending GW players.
GW was designed on the perpective of ascalonians being heroes and charrs being monsters.
GW was designed by humans, GW2 by charrs. LOL
***
Just a random aside that I find amusing.
[ Portal 2 spoilers follow, so if you've not finished Portal 2 yet, don't read this. ]
In Portal 2, you're forced to ally with GLaDOS, the primary antagonist from Portal 1. In the original however I always felt she wasn't fleshed out much, and couldn't really bring myself to 'hate' her for that reason (I felt the same about the charr, they were meant to be bad guys in that story, which isn't a good reason to hate them). Anyway, in Portal 2 you actually find out that she has a character, a personality, and she's not nowhere near as bad as all that, and in the end GLaDOS even seems to think of the player character as a friend. There's still friction there, but GLaDOS has gained a certain sense of admiration and respect for Chell, and because of that, she can no longer kill Chell. And the storyline of GLaDOS also made her seem like more of a sympathetic character overall.
Okay, I'm done. Just something that I felt was relevant.
Just on a personal note, I'm planning on doing at least a character of each race.
The only one I specifically planned on making racist is the asura. Because instead of for silly reasons like the charr or humans, asura have the BEST reason for being racist.
Because they're superior. All the tall people can quibble over unimportant details like whose grandfather killed whose.
Some say that Smodur demands the return of the legendary weapon so that he can use it to bolster his authority and claim rulership of the charr. Other rumors imply that the unconventional imperator wishes to melt down the Claw and destroy the legacy of the Khan-Ur, in hopes that his people will continue moving forward and never look back.
http://www.arena.net/blog/the-legions-of-the-charr
You aren't wrong. But you aren't right either.
@AKASlaphappy
Very nice post indeed, thank you.
A few questions more to understand how to play a charr hero.
1. No henchies, right? Charr heroes should find a few others to form a stable warband,
excluding all other characters, even charrs?
2. Charr heroes should obey orders by superior NPCs that have ancient roman titles?
3.Or superiors will be charr heroes too? Will be like a guild for charrs?
More important for me:
4. Charr heroes that hear, say, a young Six Tit crying 'Help me! Those monsters near the river are trying to eat me!'
should a) ignore, b) kill the monsters, c) give her a dagger and c1) let she fight alone or c2) fight by her side?
Independent. Self-reliant. Bold. Those are some of the positive traits I would use to define the norn.
In regards to the treaty, Smodur clearly just needed an excuse to make it go forward, he needed something to show his people to get the other Imperators behind it. I've pointed out a few times that he was already allowing all races (including humans) into the Black Ccitadel providing they could show their worth to the charr. This doesn't sound like a man who has only hate and contempt for humanity to me, this sounds like someone who sees the war as unproductive, and a by-product of old hatreds that needed to be set aside.
If Smodur only started to be interested after the Claw, then i'm certain I'd be wrong, but as I said, that he was allowing other races into the Black Citadel long before the claw came into the picture is telling. And I wouldn't put it past him to melt it down by the end of hte game, making a public thing of it, too. He obviously wants to lead the charr in a brave, new direction and this is a good way to do that, he realises that without doing this his race is going to stagnate and that's the very last thing he wants.
@Unlight
Those are really good, thank you! So there you go, the norn's admirable qualities, I should've seen individuality myself, really.
(Oh and for those curious, I've not got anything against the norn, I've just not been following their lore as closely, so I'm not in tune with what I should've listed as their virtues without stealing from the other pools. Unlight got it, though.)
Your welcome!
1. I am not sure what you mean by henchies, there are no hero or henchmen in GW2. Well as for whom Charr should group with that would depend how you want to play your character. For me when I play a Charr I will fight beside anyone that is willing to pick up a blade and fight the elder dragons, in that fight everyone is my warband. If you want to Role-play a Charr with some friends you could make it so that you are only friendly to people of the same order as your Charr. There are 3 orders fighting the elder dragons in GW2 the vigil, the order of whispers, and the Durmand Priory. So if your Charr joins the Vigil you would make a warband with all of the members of the vigil, and kind of talk bad about the other orders like calling them priory trash. So it really just depends on how you want your Charr to view the struggle against the elder dragons.
2. Well for me it will be more about obeying the orders of the group I decide to follow and bringing honor to the Clan I am part of (Blood, Ash, or Iron). If I join the Vigil my duty will be to obey the commands of the leader of the vigil and see their orders carried out, or die in the attempt.
3. I am kind of weird this way, even in guilds I really do not consider other player characters superior to me. So I will not take orders from other players, unless it is instructions on how to beat a boss or something along those lines. So for me all player characters are going to be my equals, it will just be NPC characters that I will make oaths of loyalty too. NPCs are not short sighted and irrational like humans playing characters in a game can be. If you want to make a military structure for your guild with Charr in it, go for it, I tend to leave that out when I deal with other people in games.
4. For me the answer would be fight beside her as a fellow soldier in arms. Charr value strength and courage and I would give the young cub the chance to show the world what she is made of. Of course I would help and guide her, so she will have no reason to fear any monster by the river instead the monster will fear her.
Why do you even click on the GW2 threads when you only make derogatory comments about people that like the game? Didn’t your mother ever tell you if you cannot say something nice do not say anything at all?
Yes. Yes we are. Yumyumyum.
Not really. I will be playing a charr though.
I really do hope that Charr won't be able to simply waltz into Ebonhawke and likewise for humans and charr locations. It should take some show of great bravery (or faction points) in order to. If they are allowed to just walk all over Ebonhawke and similar locations that will really put a dent in the lore, at least to me.
I'm sorry, but the last post above indicates that Six Tit is misrepresenting GW2 lore with her wishful thinking and talking.
In the Ecology of the Charr it is written that
"The legions are fiercely independent, each sporting many warbands and their own city-state as a central fortification. They each prefer to follow separate paths, but no legion is so foolish as to ignore the single goal of the Charr–conquer and dominate all by force. The Gold Legion does that best through magic, the Iron through mechanical creations and siege towers, while the Blood Legion possesses the single best face-to-face warriors among Charr, and the Ash Legion is known for its stalkers and assassins."
***
According to the Ecology of the Charr, charr will be on the verge of extinction in a few decades.
Let me explain and try to understand, please.
The main reason why charr defeated human was because they outnumbered the ascalonian
as Rurick said to Adelbern in the ruins of Rin.
The charr outnumbered ascalonians because their females were protected by the shamans
(they did not allow females to go to war for other reasons) and then the population increased fast.
After Kalla Scorchrazor’s rebellion, the females returned to warbands and made of war
their business. As a consequence, the number of cubs decreased.
Females do not want to be pregnant during war because their become weaker.
Thus, the number of cubs drops fast.
They drop faster when females die faster.
Now charr will face their worst enemy ever.
Very soon dead charr will outnumber newborn cub.
Do the math.
Charr do not have alternative, females won't accept to quit the warbands, because of Kalla's rebellion.
Queen Jennah is going to do the treaty knowing that charr will be at the front line ahead of human
because of their military heroism.
Furthermore, Queen Jennah will reward people that marry and have children younger.
As woman love their children, they will prefer to be safe at home taking care of the kids,
as always. Furthermore, married men won't go to the war. Thus, the number of newborn
will increase.
That's why charr are extinct in RL, but not us. ;-)
@Goya
Implying women in weak roles is not cool. I covered this earlier but it needs to be covered again. Here's a word to understand: Misogyny
Leanr that word, know it, and understand why you shouldn't embody it. That was the only problem I had with your reply to Slaphapy really, because sometimes insults go too far, and if you make them too general then you step over into some really ugly realms. One such is misogyny, and as a race, RL now, we should be trying to do everything we can to put elements like misogyny behind us. They were fitting for the dark ages, but not the modern day world.
If we don't want gamers picking up a reputation as a society of sociopaths, we really don't, so we need to adopt progressive ideas ourselves, this has nothing to do with the game, now, but more with day to day life. Anyone can be weak, or strong, and it has absolutely nothing to do with gender.
@KillHurt
The treeaty included Ebonhawke, and the latest lore reveals have shown that people within Ebonhawke, important people, were working hard toward making the treaty a reality, so they wanted it too. After 250 years, you forget why you were fighting in the first place and you just want it to end, so it's understandable. So Ebonhawke will be a city for all races to co-habitate, like all of the cities in the game are, yes.
And part of the five-race alliance meant that the five main cities are now completely open to all races, so you will see humans in the Black Citadel, and I welcome them there, same as I welcome anyone. And it doesn't put a dent in the lore, it's very realistic when you consider the gigantic dragons that plan to eat the world unless the pull together and do something about it. >_>
You do know that the dragons are absolutely massive things, right? The dragon brand is wide, very wide, and that was created by one flight by one of the dragons. That entire expanse. One flight. One dragon. Just think about that for a little while and then you may realise why they've set their petty squabbles aside.
Sigh. What I'm going to take away from this is 'haters gotta hate,' but they're not going to hate because they truly hate the humans or the charr, or anything like that, they're going to hate because they're sociopathic and hating is the only thing they know how to do, be it misogyny, racism, or whatever else. I had suspected that from the start, to be honest, since some of the hate went way beyonod roleplay or anything else, but this thread has absolutely confirmed my worst fears beyond the shadow of a doubt.
I now know that if I ever encounter a race hater in game, to shove them straight on ignore, because they're also going to have a bunch of RL philosophies that I'm never going to be able to agree with in a million years. I just hope that no one's going to bother to hold a pretense at the moment that the virtual-race hate is anything but. I mean, people with a sensible head on their shoulders might do it for fun, for lulz, and I can spot that. I've seen some doing that here and it genuinely is funny, but some are just absolutely consumed by their own, boiling hatred.
Again, this is why we gamers get a bad reputation, we invite these hatreds and then allow people to project them into games. What I'm not looking forward to in GW2 is having to listen to someone tell me why Sinera is not equal to the men around her, even for a second, because that's going to tweak me, since I'll know the underlying reason for it. But I'm trusting most people to be better than that, and leaving this nonsense to an obviously sociopathic minority. I'm relying on you people, remember that.
roleplaying...fun isnt it
I will match your one piece of lore and raise you one.
"Due to their long history of conflicts, the charr are the most militarily and technologically advanced race in Tyria. Their rifles and pistols are among the most finely made, and their forging technology is superior to that of even the ancient and legendary dwarves. Individual artisans may produce better weapons, but on a mass production scale, no other group holds a candle to the mighty charr arsenals. However, not all of their advancements involve weapons--they also make some of the finest clockwork and spring-driven devices in Tyria.
With the rigid foundation of their warbands and the ruthless efficiency of their leadership, the charr face their opponents as they have always faced them: united in purpose. They have triumphed over internal dissension and external threat, have retaken their ancestral lands, and now face the world as one of the strongest and most energized races in Tyria."
"The Khan-Ur’s throne remains empty, but the charr in Ascalon stand largely united under the Iron Legion’s rule, functioning as a mighty machine of conquest.
All three legions coexist in the Black Citadel, along with a handful of norn, sylvari, asura, and even a few humans. By Smodur’s command, the Iron Legion allows just about anyone to visit and even settle there, so long as the visitors don’t cause trouble, but the leadership never lets anyone forget whose city it is, or the fact that everyone else is just a guest in their house.
After a series of diplomatic overtures, Smodur and Jennah established a tentative cease-fire between their respective peoples and are working out the details of a fully fledged peace treaty. Certain factions within both societies cannot accept the concept of peace with their ancestral enemies and are determined to do everything they can to derail the treaty talks. Their actions fuel the distrust and hatred that still lingers between the two races, but human desperation and charr discipline continue to move the process forward."
From the lore of GW2 which can be found here:
http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/races/charr/
http://www.arena.net/blog/scott-mcgough-on-writing-the-charr
I think this is a very invalid comparison, not all races have to show their affection for their children the same way as humans do. If that is a requirement for writers then that makes for a very boring universe since they cannot create anything new. *If you have not read Ghosts of Ascalon stop here* In fact I would say that if you read Ghosts of Ascalon ,and pay attention to everything that happens, you can see that Almorra Soulkeeper cares for her granddaughter Ember Doomforge!
And there's no saying that there's no familial relations between the charr, after all, because as you've pointed out Slap, there are. One important element to consider is that this may be an extremely selfless act on part of the charr. If sending your kid off to a private school would give them the best chance at life, due to being extraordinarily bright, then doing so so that they might begin absorbing knowledge from a young age would be a selfless act. It would be a selfish act to hang onto your kid and push them through a public school just so they could spend time with you if their intellect meant that they had more potential than such.
So what if that's the attitude of the charr? What if not a single parent actually wants to give their children away, but simply that they realise that it's the best chance the charr have at a good life? If you take away the cub from the fahrar, you take away their warband, and would anyone even try to claim that there's no love in a warband? Warband members love each other like family, they live and/or die for each other on a daily basis, so there's that side of things too. So there is love there, it's just abstracted from what's common to us as humans. The charr are different, but different does not actually mean inferior.
And that's where I see racism and it bugs me, because the first thing a racist will tell you is that the people that they're racist against are inferior, and if you look at groups like supremacists, on the most extreme end of racism, then this becomes fairly obvious. Different means different, it doesn't mean superior, it doesn't mean inferior, it just means different. Charr parents feel they need to give their children to a fahrar because that would be a better life for their cubs, and there is definitely love within the warband. If you listen to what Ember has to say about her warband in Ghosts of Ascalon, this is apparent. She loves them.
So to say it again: Just because something is different, it doesn't mean that it's inferior/superior. Just different.
@needalife
I can spot roleplaying, there's none going on in this thread, none at all. Just people using a game to express their life philosophies.