Great article. Pretty much the same way that I feel. It's really very difficult to find a guild that really fits (or that I'm a good fit for).
You may also add other guild types:
Romper Room
- full of kids, some of which need babysitters.
- guild members can often be found spouting the most ignorant things they can think of in order to provide 'shock value-humor'. They have no filters... and don't care what anyone else thinks and they actually hope they offend others.
- guild chat largely consists of 'u mad bro', "anal-spam", discussions of 'period-blood', and stories about how drunk/high someone is while playing.
- unlimited amounts of 'bro-speak' can also be expected
What/When/Why/How/Who--help?
- players that have been playing for 6 months-1 year that still don't know much about the game
- these players can't be bothered to read any online information about the game, their class, quest guides, etc.,..
- if you join one of these guilds and they find out that you know anything about the game at all, you will be elected as 'keep of knowledge'. You will be expected to answer ALL questions about the game... in deep levels of detail and likely have to 'show' someone what you mean.
Dating Service
- full of singles that chat up every new guildmember in hopes that they are members of the opposite sex that may be available for ERP, in-game romance, and even out of game romance.
- any single (confirmed) member of the opposite sex may be 'jumped'.
- guild member photos should never be looked at on the guild sites
*yes, I know that many people have met their significant others in games. I'm aware of this. But these guilds take it to the extreme.
The Clique
- most of the guild has been around since 'BETA' and are just looking for a few new members to 'round the guild out'
- enjoy feeling like the odd-man-out
- when it's not raid time, you really aren't necessary
- you try to fit in, but since you don't know guild-member x personally, you aren't likely going to be able to do so... ever
Anytime a Guild is way too anal about something I just tell them later and some other things that probably arent appropriate and leave the guild. I generally don't let myself join "raiding" or "hardcore" guilds, though.
Only time I do is piss them off, lol. I typically only join "casual" or "social" guilds and own it up.
Whether you personally consider it 'twisted' or 'weird' or whatever, that isnt the point. It's sad you judge others who are just enjoying themselves at no cost to others so harshly, but whatever.
If you joined a hard RP guild and found that you didnt like it because of the hard RP then you obviously didnt ask anything at all about them before joining. No one forced you in to it I would imagine.
One of the beauties of this genre is that they can be played a few different ways, and the guild system allows people to create enclosed spaces for that. If you don't like what they do, stay the f**k out of it. Join the kind of guild you like and leave others to play how they want. It's that simple.
A guild isnt 'wrong' or even a bad guild, because they like to RP, or hardcore raid, or goof around in a rules free channel with others of the same mind, like the OP says it is. it obviously works for the people in it, so if thats what someone is looking for why would they 'avoid it'?
I think you are misunderstanding me. I have nothing against well thought out and organized RP, that has no bigger emotions involved.
Anything 'hardcore' tends to mean no-one enjoys it that much, it's just person's desire to push things past the limits, beyond their own enjoyment and the enjoyment of others as well.
Nah, I think it'sy ou thats missing the point being made... I am talking to you about your use of the words 'weird' and 'twisted' towards other people, just because they don't play in a way that you like. Who are you to define whats 'normal'?
People have the right to play how they want within their own space,and I repeat the fact that others do not like it themselves dosent make them 'bad' guilds 'to be avoided' (IF you want what they offer).
Look at your second paragraph here... really? I guess there are a lot of people out there that need you to tell them they arnt having fun and that they need to play your way in order to start doing so.
I have been a member of each of those guilds at one time or anothe and at the times I was in them they were right for me otherwise I wouldn't have joined in the first place. But life happens and things change, including priorities and preferences, so your choice of guild will change too.
----- The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Oh how I have stories about my experiences with pretty much every type of guild you list.
There's another type I'dl ike to add to that list:
It's the guild where the overall mentality from "on high" is basically: "You're all here to help the guild leader and his main officers (read: his closest personal friends) get their characters fully geared up. We'll help the rest of the guild (read: anyone who isn't the leader or his closest personal friends) get what you need once we're done with our characters... if we have the time in-between everything we intend to do then (read: expect to find outside help with anything you need; we'll be too busy. No, we don't care that you helped us for all those months. Too bad").
I've been in and out of that type alone more times than I care to remember.
One I was in - back in the day in L2 - was led by a guy who demanded that all members donate 75% of all materials they'd harvested so he could "craft items for the clan". He frowned on people crafting or obtaining their own gear because "it doesn't help the clan if you're using all the mats for yourself". In reality, he wanted members to be dependent on him for everything, as a means of control. Best part was, even though the members did all the grinding for the mats (he never grinded anything), himself and his girlfriend were always given top priority in items being crafted. Everyone else had to wait 'til he got around to it. If you didn't do what he wanted you to do, he'd dangle an item he was supposed to craft for you over your head, basically "do what I want, or you don't get this".
Oh, and anything crafted for you by him belonged to the guild. If you quit the guild, you had to return anything he crafted. If you were kicked, you had to return anything crafted. If he decided he wanted someone else (such as his girlfriend) to have a weapon originally crafted for you, you had to give it to that person and he'd give you a "replacement weapon" (typically inferior). If you refused to give back what he demanded, when he demanded, you were immediately labeled a thief and deemed KoS (kill on sight).
Not surprisingly, many members - most of them as far as I can tell - kept most of their own mats and only reported a small portion of what they actually got. For myself, I didn't stay in that clan for very long. It was beyond absurd.
As one other example, back in Matrix Online, I was in a rather RP heavy guild (or whatever they called them then... Crews?). I don't mind a bit of RP from time to time. The setting of the Matrix is a great backdrop, and back then the GMs would "jack in" as some of the key characters from the movies (Morpheus, Nayobe, etc) and interact with players, relating to the current storyline being played out. It was really quite brilliant.. too bad it didn't last. Anyway!
So the leader of the guild/crew/whatever I was in was a bit on the militant side, especially with roleplaying. He would expect members to stand on a rooftop while he had meetings in a room a floor or two below us, to "look out for spies". Wouldn't have been a problem, except that he tended to needlessly draw things out at length. A discussion that was essentially wrapped up in 10 minutes would be dragged out to 30 minutes or more, as he was all into RP'ing it and wanted it to last longer. He was surprised and disappointed when others stopped showing up to the meetings, or simply getting up and leaving in the middle of them because they were bored to tears.
I remember an argument breaking out at one point, because someone at the meetings interrupted, saying, "Can you get to the f'ing point and stop jerking yourself off so we can get back to doing other stuff?" That was a breaking point for many and, after that I don't recall many meetings happening anymore. The guy just went way overboard and people stopped taking him seriously. We were all basically his "captive audience" and folks got fed up with it.
The reason I left was because I needed to take a break from the game due to real life things that had come up. I got a long and not at all pleasant verbal lashing from the guy because I was "abandoning my post in the crew and letting everyone down". I said "I'm not RP'ing here. I have stuff going on in RL that needs to be dealt with". He stated that I had a committment to the crew and breaking that committment would mean expulsion from it, with no option to come back. I told him I had real committments to real people in real life, and he could shove his crew up his ass...
And that was that.
When I came back, that crew had pretty much all but disbanded, with only a few of the 'core' members keeping it going. Everyone else had gotten sick of the leader and his antics and split off to form their own... which I ended up joining upon returning. Unfortunately, not long after that is when everything started going noticeably downhill with MxO and so the whole thing was short-lived.
Anyway... yeah... so many people out there running guilds who really have no right to be.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
been in all of those guilds at one point or another. You left out the "I built this guild for the sole purpose of getting myself and my significant other geared to the max and screw the rest of you" guild tho.
Ha yeah I was in one like that for about a year. The rest of the players were great people but the GM and he's spose were just nuts if they couldn't get their own way.
I wonder what that says about me putting up with it for so long? :P
Maybe you were morbidly curious?
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I've said it before but it's still true. More games allowing membership in multiple guilds would solve a lot of the issues. Yes it's hard to do anything "just for fun" in a hardcore guild but if you can switch over to the casual friendly guild that you're a member of, you can have fun with them.
You could be a member of multiple linkshells (guilds) in XI... and it was pretty much the same thing.
Some LS's - particularly the hardcore ones - demanded you be either in that LS at all times, or be aware of what was going on in that LS at all times. If you were online and they announced an event - on the spot - you were expected to be there. If you didn't go, you risked being kicked. Having another LS active at the time the event was set up would not be a good reason, as you were supposed to be in the hardcore one at all times.
In other cases, LS leaders became very "possessive" of their members and took it personally if they saw members with a different LS pearl on. I was interrogated many times, "Why are you in that LS? What's wrong with mine?" type stuff.
It would solve certain issues... but would also introduce others.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
been in all of those guilds at one point or another. You left out the "I built this guild for the sole purpose of getting myself and my significant other geared to the max and screw the rest of you" guild tho.
Ha yeah I was in one like that for about a year. The rest of the players were great people but the GM and he's spose were just nuts if they couldn't get their own way.
I wonder what that says about me putting up with it for so long? :P
it just say you were loyal to what was important to you in the guild, specifically the other "great players". what makes for a good guild is not necessarily who runs it but who you group with. what maybe you (or one of your guildies) could have done is form another guild & tell the selfish leaders to go stick it.
I agree. Especially with the last one, now adays it seems like guilds expect you to drop everything you are doing and be online and if you can't make it every time then they give you the boot.
Ugh. Nothing worse than the Non-Selective guild that just goes through the list of unguilded people and spams them with invites continuously. No tell asking if you're even interested in a guild, just "Soandso has invited you to the cult" every 10 minutes.
There was one in EQ2 like that. Had close to 3000 members. I'd log in, and within 5 to 10 minutes, I'd get an invite. Log out, and switch characters, and within a few minutes I'd get an invite on that character. Now, I just turn off guild invites, if the option is available.
Maybe someday, I'll find the smaller, casual-ish, yet organized, guild that does some raiding, some pvp, and still likes to putz around in old content, that I've been looking for.
I have been in some great guilds, and some bad ones too. My rule of thumb is no "of the" guilds: <Faggies of the Gayname> these usually tend to be the type that lets anyone in and never really has direction or interaction that contributes to my game enjoyment. Best guild I was ever in, <Brew Masters> (EQ/Rift/couple other games) for years we had annual Brewfest, weekend of drunkedness in different cities across the US. Getting to know the people you raid all week with in RL, and know you can drink most of them under the table adds a nice aspect to interguild relationships
I think everyone who says they are a gammer has been in each of those guilds. Sad thing is how long we stayed before we left the guilds simply cause there wasent anything different or better. Sad thing is the small casual guilds were the ones you had the most fun in but never progressed so to get gear and see higher end content you had to leave them.
Comments
Great article. Pretty much the same way that I feel. It's really very difficult to find a guild that really fits (or that I'm a good fit for).
You may also add other guild types:
Romper Room
- full of kids, some of which need babysitters.
- guild members can often be found spouting the most ignorant things they can think of in order to provide 'shock value-humor'. They have no filters... and don't care what anyone else thinks and they actually hope they offend others.
- guild chat largely consists of 'u mad bro', "anal-spam", discussions of 'period-blood', and stories about how drunk/high someone is while playing.
- unlimited amounts of 'bro-speak' can also be expected
What/When/Why/How/Who--help?
- players that have been playing for 6 months-1 year that still don't know much about the game
- these players can't be bothered to read any online information about the game, their class, quest guides, etc.,..
- if you join one of these guilds and they find out that you know anything about the game at all, you will be elected as 'keep of knowledge'. You will be expected to answer ALL questions about the game... in deep levels of detail and likely have to 'show' someone what you mean.
Dating Service
- full of singles that chat up every new guildmember in hopes that they are members of the opposite sex that may be available for ERP, in-game romance, and even out of game romance.
- any single (confirmed) member of the opposite sex may be 'jumped'.
- guild member photos should never be looked at on the guild sites
*yes, I know that many people have met their significant others in games. I'm aware of this. But these guilds take it to the extreme.
The Clique
- most of the guild has been around since 'BETA' and are just looking for a few new members to 'round the guild out'
- enjoy feeling like the odd-man-out
- when it's not raid time, you really aren't necessary
- you try to fit in, but since you don't know guild-member x personally, you aren't likely going to be able to do so... ever
Anytime a Guild is way too anal about something I just tell them later and some other things that probably arent appropriate and leave the guild. I generally don't let myself join "raiding" or "hardcore" guilds, though.
Only time I do is piss them off, lol. I typically only join "casual" or "social" guilds and own it up.
Nah, I think it'sy ou thats missing the point being made... I am talking to you about your use of the words 'weird' and 'twisted' towards other people, just because they don't play in a way that you like. Who are you to define whats 'normal'?
People have the right to play how they want within their own space,and I repeat the fact that others do not like it themselves dosent make them 'bad' guilds 'to be avoided' (IF you want what they offer).
Look at your second paragraph here... really? I guess there are a lot of people out there that need you to tell them they arnt having fun and that they need to play your way in order to start doing so.
I have been a member of each of those guilds at one time or anothe and at the times I was in them they were right for me otherwise I wouldn't have joined in the first place. But life happens and things change, including priorities and preferences, so your choice of guild will change too.
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Oh how I have stories about my experiences with pretty much every type of guild you list.
There's another type I'dl ike to add to that list:
It's the guild where the overall mentality from "on high" is basically: "You're all here to help the guild leader and his main officers (read: his closest personal friends) get their characters fully geared up. We'll help the rest of the guild (read: anyone who isn't the leader or his closest personal friends) get what you need once we're done with our characters... if we have the time in-between everything we intend to do then (read: expect to find outside help with anything you need; we'll be too busy. No, we don't care that you helped us for all those months. Too bad").
I've been in and out of that type alone more times than I care to remember.
One I was in - back in the day in L2 - was led by a guy who demanded that all members donate 75% of all materials they'd harvested so he could "craft items for the clan". He frowned on people crafting or obtaining their own gear because "it doesn't help the clan if you're using all the mats for yourself". In reality, he wanted members to be dependent on him for everything, as a means of control. Best part was, even though the members did all the grinding for the mats (he never grinded anything), himself and his girlfriend were always given top priority in items being crafted. Everyone else had to wait 'til he got around to it. If you didn't do what he wanted you to do, he'd dangle an item he was supposed to craft for you over your head, basically "do what I want, or you don't get this".
Oh, and anything crafted for you by him belonged to the guild. If you quit the guild, you had to return anything he crafted. If you were kicked, you had to return anything crafted. If he decided he wanted someone else (such as his girlfriend) to have a weapon originally crafted for you, you had to give it to that person and he'd give you a "replacement weapon" (typically inferior). If you refused to give back what he demanded, when he demanded, you were immediately labeled a thief and deemed KoS (kill on sight).
Not surprisingly, many members - most of them as far as I can tell - kept most of their own mats and only reported a small portion of what they actually got. For myself, I didn't stay in that clan for very long. It was beyond absurd.
As one other example, back in Matrix Online, I was in a rather RP heavy guild (or whatever they called them then... Crews?). I don't mind a bit of RP from time to time. The setting of the Matrix is a great backdrop, and back then the GMs would "jack in" as some of the key characters from the movies (Morpheus, Nayobe, etc) and interact with players, relating to the current storyline being played out. It was really quite brilliant.. too bad it didn't last. Anyway!
So the leader of the guild/crew/whatever I was in was a bit on the militant side, especially with roleplaying. He would expect members to stand on a rooftop while he had meetings in a room a floor or two below us, to "look out for spies". Wouldn't have been a problem, except that he tended to needlessly draw things out at length. A discussion that was essentially wrapped up in 10 minutes would be dragged out to 30 minutes or more, as he was all into RP'ing it and wanted it to last longer. He was surprised and disappointed when others stopped showing up to the meetings, or simply getting up and leaving in the middle of them because they were bored to tears.
I remember an argument breaking out at one point, because someone at the meetings interrupted, saying, "Can you get to the f'ing point and stop jerking yourself off so we can get back to doing other stuff?" That was a breaking point for many and, after that I don't recall many meetings happening anymore. The guy just went way overboard and people stopped taking him seriously. We were all basically his "captive audience" and folks got fed up with it.
The reason I left was because I needed to take a break from the game due to real life things that had come up. I got a long and not at all pleasant verbal lashing from the guy because I was "abandoning my post in the crew and letting everyone down". I said "I'm not RP'ing here. I have stuff going on in RL that needs to be dealt with". He stated that I had a committment to the crew and breaking that committment would mean expulsion from it, with no option to come back. I told him I had real committments to real people in real life, and he could shove his crew up his ass...
And that was that.
When I came back, that crew had pretty much all but disbanded, with only a few of the 'core' members keeping it going. Everyone else had gotten sick of the leader and his antics and split off to form their own... which I ended up joining upon returning. Unfortunately, not long after that is when everything started going noticeably downhill with MxO and so the whole thing was short-lived.
Anyway... yeah... so many people out there running guilds who really have no right to be.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
You could be a member of multiple linkshells (guilds) in XI... and it was pretty much the same thing.
Some LS's - particularly the hardcore ones - demanded you be either in that LS at all times, or be aware of what was going on in that LS at all times. If you were online and they announced an event - on the spot - you were expected to be there. If you didn't go, you risked being kicked. Having another LS active at the time the event was set up would not be a good reason, as you were supposed to be in the hardcore one at all times.
In other cases, LS leaders became very "possessive" of their members and took it personally if they saw members with a different LS pearl on. I was interrogated many times, "Why are you in that LS? What's wrong with mine?" type stuff.
It would solve certain issues... but would also introduce others.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Sage advise. You never should take a game so serious as it were a 2nd work.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Lol, excellent post mate. I totally agree!
it just say you were loyal to what was important to you in the guild, specifically the other "great players". what makes for a good guild is not necessarily who runs it but who you group with. what maybe you (or one of your guildies) could have done is form another guild & tell the selfish leaders to go stick it.
I agree. Especially with the last one, now adays it seems like guilds expect you to drop everything you are doing and be online and if you can't make it every time then they give you the boot.
Real life is more important than E-Life.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Ugh. Nothing worse than the Non-Selective guild that just goes through the list of unguilded people and spams them with invites continuously. No tell asking if you're even interested in a guild, just "Soandso has invited you to the cult" every 10 minutes.
There was one in EQ2 like that. Had close to 3000 members. I'd log in, and within 5 to 10 minutes, I'd get an invite. Log out, and switch characters, and within a few minutes I'd get an invite on that character. Now, I just turn off guild invites, if the option is available.
Maybe someday, I'll find the smaller, casual-ish, yet organized, guild that does some raiding, some pvp, and still likes to putz around in old content, that I've been looking for.
I have been in some great guilds, and some bad ones too. My rule of thumb is no "of the" guilds: <Faggies of the Gayname> these usually tend to be the type that lets anyone in and never really has direction or interaction that contributes to my game enjoyment. Best guild I was ever in, <Brew Masters> (EQ/Rift/couple other games) for years we had annual Brewfest, weekend of drunkedness in different cities across the US. Getting to know the people you raid all week with in RL, and know you can drink most of them under the table adds a nice aspect to interguild relationships
I think everyone who says they are a gammer has been in each of those guilds. Sad thing is how long we stayed before we left the guilds simply cause there wasent anything different or better. Sad thing is the small casual guilds were the ones you had the most fun in but never progressed so to get gear and see higher end content you had to leave them.