When I played EQ it was the same. I don't get why people think its something new, or something WoW brought. I distinctly remember level 60s(max at the time I played), coming into a zone owning without regard and camping the rare spawns.
I remember the zone Oasis, and its retarded high school like chatter.
Nothing we do online has a lasting effect on our real lives. This will cause a lot of people to act in their true nature. Just look at these forums, and see how most of these people talk to each other. Disrepectful and unrestrained. Same as in online games.
edit: My point is this: people are jerks everywhere in life. It their momma's fault not WoW.
It's what you make of it. Almost every zone has elite quests that require groups to complete. I don't think I've ever just automatically been put in a group. I had to click the "join public group" button. It just makes grouping easier. If I'm questing in an area and see others I invite them and ask them what they need as well. Cross server matching is only for the esport Battlegrounds.
Vanguard has a very tiny population. Some people complain they can't find groups. Someone on here made a great post about how to solve that problem. Same applies to every game. Use the search function (if the game has one) for players your own level. Ask if you can group with them to help them quest, do dungeons, whatever. Keep doing this and before you know it you have new friends. Add them to your friends list. That is how you find and form good communities in game. Not by spamming global chat for groups or reading the banter that goes on in those channels. Be personable, chat up individual people. There are some great people out there.
Edit: To piggyback on the last poster I just saw.
Yep, in EQ my first experience wasn't so great. It was my first mmorpg. Within a couple days I already experienced several rude players. I didn't know all the rules of the game at that point, and no one cared to share. Some guy was camping a skeleton spawn. I went to kill one and got yelled at by him. I had no clue about camping spawns. I saw a guy running away from a snake. My first thought was "oh, let me help him out that bad snake is going to kill him." What happened? I got cussed out and the guy reported me to a GM for trying to KS. Thankfully the GM was nice and offered to help explain some rules.
I too have joined others in canceling my subscription. I appreciate the game's polish, and enjoyed the remarkeable attention to detail concerning every aspect of the game. However, the community in this game is ridiculously awful. I have made some friends fairly easily, but throughout the cross server warfronts it's constant bickering, insults, and other anti-social behavior. I joined a role play server thinking i'd see less names like "JustinBeiber" and "Homersimpson" and of course the always present, "Azzhurtz," but a lot of players don't even seem to respect those who role play. I have no way of knowing if it's an influx of kids joining the game, or simply how people behave in todays mmorpg.
However, I have played Vanguard, LOTRO, and Everquest 2 and can attest to how communities can strive to be; Vanguard of course being the role model for excellence in community with the latter games coming in second.
Even in the levels 40-50 chat channel I encountered an unsually unfriendly atmosphere. Snarky comments and bad information in response to honest, and simple answers doesn't make for an enjoyable experience, especially one you pay monthly for. I've heard people complain about WOW before with similar concerns, so maybe I'm just the type of person who'd enjoy a smaller player base. Could be the worsening community in Rift is a direct indication of a growing population?
I can agree. I really didn't care for the community in Rift and as a 30 y/o player, I must tell you, I'm having more fun then ever in Eq2. Sure there are some youngters in the (1_9) chat, but overall, the comminutiy has been outstanding. Very helpful and mature for the most part. I also joined an older Guild, which has mostly 25+ players. Come on back to Eq2...lol
I'd venture a guess and say a bulk of Rift's player base are former WOW players and the game's design is very similar (in terms of not supporting social game mechanics) so it's not surprising that you're experiencing the same sort of bad community that it has.
/this
Rift lacks social game mechanics? Being able to join public groups, an LFD system that matches players together. An event constantly going on somewhere in the world normally more than one that encourages players to come together to defeat it. Battlegrounds that pull people together to work together for a common goal. How in the world are those not social game mechanics?
These are way more tools than previous games.
Having said that there is another reason why people don't care what others think about them. Its not a lack of social game mechanics.
My opinions are 1) there are a lot of jerks in life 2) nobody needs someone else when all we do is solo quest. How do jerks treat people they don't need or feel is under their station in life? Ask any cashier or waitress.
I'm still playing Rift, but do agree the community is awful for the most part. Luckily, my guild came in together and have added a few great folks since launch. But doing anything outside the guild is a crap-shoot because of the poor community. I came from Vanguard and have to say that is the best community I've ever seen in an MMO. Unfortunately, I'd have to rank Rift's community as the worst.
Rift lacks social game mechanics? Being able to join public groups, an LFD system that matches players together. An event constantly going on somewhere in the world normally more than one that encourages players to come together to defeat it. Battlegrounds that pull people together to work together for a common goal. How in the world are those not social game mechanics?
These are way more tools than previous games.
I can see how you might think these are social game mechanics, but I have to ask you, how many of these activites lead you to spend even 2 minutes talking to your group/raidmates? I'm willing to be in almost every case you grouped up,defeated the Rift, or won/lost the battleground and other than perhaps being cursed out by your team mates if you lost I'll be you never spoke to anyone in almost every situation.
The game mechanics I'm referencing included such things as forced downtime between fights (up to 2 or 3 minutes sometimes after a particularly tough pull), or long travel times, sometimes together or waiting together for 5-10 minutes with your realm mates to portal back out into the new frontier.
Speaking of battles, I find that battleground combat is so scripted there really is little need for intereaction, everyone pretty much knows where the fight is, how they are supposed to execute it, and is nothing like the massive realm and keep raids that we used to do in DAOC or Lineage 1/2.
Other MMO's like SWG actually had player cantinas and medical facilities where players had to go to get rid of some negative effect, and they had to stay for a set duration.
I think most players today find the above mechanics horrific, however they contributed greatly to the overall socialization between players in MMO's because they gave them time to socialize and they were encouraged to do so because it sometimes took some effort to coordinate complicated battles, particularly in the era before voice coms became the rage.
As we've discussed before, the solution isn't neccessarily to return to the mechanics of before, many players just won't tolerate them, but I do think Developers need to come up with some new ideas (and the ones you listed for Rift are actually good ones, they just don't go far enough IMO)
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Rift lacks social game mechanics? Being able to join public groups, an LFD system that matches players together. Battlegrounds that pull people together to work together for a common goal. How in the world are those not social game mechanics?
These are way more tools than previous games. Its not a lack of social game mechanics.
Auto group joining, cross server matching, and solo quest grinding are all anti social mechanisms.
No they aren't close to DAoC's sieges, sadly. And the dungeon runs are nothing compared to EQ's sit on one's bum in the same spot for hours, luckily.
I was just poining out that there are social mechanisms in place - more so than other games and that is something I can appreciate. Unfortunately, I think people see these as distractions to get back to their solo questing, so they can get to level 50, ASAP. Like a magical fountain of fun is waiting for them.
Rift lacks social game mechanics? Being able to join public groups, an LFD system that matches players together. Battlegrounds that pull people together to work together for a common goal. How in the world are those not social game mechanics?
These are way more tools than previous games. Its not a lack of social game mechanics.
Auto group joining, cross server matching, and solo quest grinding are all anti social mechanisms.
Rift has them all in abundence.
You have fallen for the spin, thats all.
I'm sorry, but you have fallen for the spin that getting people together is somehow anti-social.
Solo questing is anti-social and I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that I said it was socializing. In fact, I said its why people don't take advantage of the current tools in place that allow us to socialize easier than ever before. Everyone is too busy solo questing. Maybe because its the most efficient/easiest way to max level?
Rift lacks social game mechanics? Being able to join public groups, an LFD system that matches players together. Battlegrounds that pull people together to work together for a common goal. How in the world are those not social game mechanics?
These are way more tools than previous games. Its not a lack of social game mechanics.
Auto group joining, cross server matching, and solo quest grinding are all anti social mechanisms.
Rift has them all in abundence.
You have fallen for the spin, thats all.
I'm sorry, but you have fallen for the spin that getting people together is somehow anti-social.
I see what you didn there. Building what i said into your retort. Very clever.
But that aside...
You seem to be missing the point that any mechanic that removes communication and interaction is by definiton anti social. 'Getting people togther' physically (or in this case virtually) in the same space blasting away at a rift or whatever is not the same as building relationships and community.
With auto join you simply give the players one more reason to not interact. It is therefore an anti social mechanic.
Tbh though, I have a feeling your not gonna get it no matter what I say, so I will just leave what I said and depart the thread. If you have a think about it though I have a feeling you will see what I am saying.
1) kiddies don't read. . they just hit "next". . I remember some guy was saying how everyone was being so (insert insult here) for role playing. . I sent him a tell and told him it was an RP server. . after a bit of back and forth I found out that he had no idea and was po'd that he had wasted so much time on his character and had to play with all the f#$s etc. Only RPers care about the RP tag.. . or see point 2
2) PvPers who think RP servers will offer then 14 year old virgins with on co-ordination as opponents. They don't care about the RP tag and see it as a disability window tag on the server.
Also you said the battlefronts are cross server so. . that makes it even worse.
Comments
When I played EQ it was the same. I don't get why people think its something new, or something WoW brought. I distinctly remember level 60s(max at the time I played), coming into a zone owning without regard and camping the rare spawns.
I remember the zone Oasis, and its retarded high school like chatter.
Nothing we do online has a lasting effect on our real lives. This will cause a lot of people to act in their true nature. Just look at these forums, and see how most of these people talk to each other. Disrepectful and unrestrained. Same as in online games.
edit: My point is this: people are jerks everywhere in life. It their momma's fault not WoW.
It's what you make of it. Almost every zone has elite quests that require groups to complete. I don't think I've ever just automatically been put in a group. I had to click the "join public group" button. It just makes grouping easier. If I'm questing in an area and see others I invite them and ask them what they need as well. Cross server matching is only for the esport Battlegrounds.
Vanguard has a very tiny population. Some people complain they can't find groups. Someone on here made a great post about how to solve that problem. Same applies to every game. Use the search function (if the game has one) for players your own level. Ask if you can group with them to help them quest, do dungeons, whatever. Keep doing this and before you know it you have new friends. Add them to your friends list. That is how you find and form good communities in game. Not by spamming global chat for groups or reading the banter that goes on in those channels. Be personable, chat up individual people. There are some great people out there.
Edit: To piggyback on the last poster I just saw.
Yep, in EQ my first experience wasn't so great. It was my first mmorpg. Within a couple days I already experienced several rude players. I didn't know all the rules of the game at that point, and no one cared to share. Some guy was camping a skeleton spawn. I went to kill one and got yelled at by him. I had no clue about camping spawns. I saw a guy running away from a snake. My first thought was "oh, let me help him out that bad snake is going to kill him." What happened? I got cussed out and the guy reported me to a GM for trying to KS. Thankfully the GM was nice and offered to help explain some rules.
I can agree. I really didn't care for the community in Rift and as a 30 y/o player, I must tell you, I'm having more fun then ever in Eq2. Sure there are some youngters in the (1_9) chat, but overall, the comminutiy has been outstanding. Very helpful and mature for the most part. I also joined an older Guild, which has mostly 25+ players. Come on back to Eq2...lol
Rift lacks social game mechanics? Being able to join public groups, an LFD system that matches players together. An event constantly going on somewhere in the world normally more than one that encourages players to come together to defeat it. Battlegrounds that pull people together to work together for a common goal. How in the world are those not social game mechanics?
These are way more tools than previous games.
Having said that there is another reason why people don't care what others think about them. Its not a lack of social game mechanics.
My opinions are 1) there are a lot of jerks in life 2) nobody needs someone else when all we do is solo quest. How do jerks treat people they don't need or feel is under their station in life? Ask any cashier or waitress.
I'm still playing Rift, but do agree the community is awful for the most part. Luckily, my guild came in together and have added a few great folks since launch. But doing anything outside the guild is a crap-shoot because of the poor community. I came from Vanguard and have to say that is the best community I've ever seen in an MMO. Unfortunately, I'd have to rank Rift's community as the worst.
I can see how you might think these are social game mechanics, but I have to ask you, how many of these activites lead you to spend even 2 minutes talking to your group/raidmates? I'm willing to be in almost every case you grouped up,defeated the Rift, or won/lost the battleground and other than perhaps being cursed out by your team mates if you lost I'll be you never spoke to anyone in almost every situation.
The game mechanics I'm referencing included such things as forced downtime between fights (up to 2 or 3 minutes sometimes after a particularly tough pull), or long travel times, sometimes together or waiting together for 5-10 minutes with your realm mates to portal back out into the new frontier.
Speaking of battles, I find that battleground combat is so scripted there really is little need for intereaction, everyone pretty much knows where the fight is, how they are supposed to execute it, and is nothing like the massive realm and keep raids that we used to do in DAOC or Lineage 1/2.
Other MMO's like SWG actually had player cantinas and medical facilities where players had to go to get rid of some negative effect, and they had to stay for a set duration.
I think most players today find the above mechanics horrific, however they contributed greatly to the overall socialization between players in MMO's because they gave them time to socialize and they were encouraged to do so because it sometimes took some effort to coordinate complicated battles, particularly in the era before voice coms became the rage.
As we've discussed before, the solution isn't neccessarily to return to the mechanics of before, many players just won't tolerate them, but I do think Developers need to come up with some new ideas (and the ones you listed for Rift are actually good ones, they just don't go far enough IMO)
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Auto group joining, cross server matching, and solo quest grinding are all anti social mechanisms.
Rift has them all in abundence.
You have fallen for the spin, thats all.
No they aren't close to DAoC's sieges, sadly. And the dungeon runs are nothing compared to EQ's sit on one's bum in the same spot for hours, luckily.
I was just poining out that there are social mechanisms in place - more so than other games and that is something I can appreciate. Unfortunately, I think people see these as distractions to get back to their solo questing, so they can get to level 50, ASAP. Like a magical fountain of fun is waiting for them.
I'm sorry, but you have fallen for the spin that getting people together is somehow anti-social.
Solo questing is anti-social and I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that I said it was socializing. In fact, I said its why people don't take advantage of the current tools in place that allow us to socialize easier than ever before. Everyone is too busy solo questing. Maybe because its the most efficient/easiest way to max level?
I see what you didn there. Building what i said into your retort. Very clever.
But that aside...
You seem to be missing the point that any mechanic that removes communication and interaction is by definiton anti social. 'Getting people togther' physically (or in this case virtually) in the same space blasting away at a rift or whatever is not the same as building relationships and community.
With auto join you simply give the players one more reason to not interact. It is therefore an anti social mechanic.
Tbh though, I have a feeling your not gonna get it no matter what I say, so I will just leave what I said and depart the thread. If you have a think about it though I have a feeling you will see what I am saying.
Two problems with Rp servers.
1) kiddies don't read. . they just hit "next". . I remember some guy was saying how everyone was being so (insert insult here) for role playing. . I sent him a tell and told him it was an RP server. . after a bit of back and forth I found out that he had no idea and was po'd that he had wasted so much time on his character and had to play with all the f#$s etc. Only RPers care about the RP tag.. . or see point 2
2) PvPers who think RP servers will offer then 14 year old virgins with on co-ordination as opponents. They don't care about the RP tag and see it as a disability window tag on the server.
Also you said the battlefronts are cross server so. . that makes it even worse.
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