This release is a simple example of when you have bad code at the bottom of all of this, you can't build good code on top and expect it to work at all.
Compare it to a house with a leaky foundation. You can build a great kitchen extension, a patio, etc... and then find out your house is sinking on one side and everything else breaks because of it. This is the state of Mortal Online.
It's not about fixing "one bug", it's about saying well, we need this game to be usable and playable, and we need to fix the core issues. The problem is of course, that the developers have no ability to fix these issues because they simply don't have the experience or knowledge to do so. Sebastian is an Unreal modder who is the "lead programmer" and has never programmed *anything* in his life.
I am just waiting on the blame to be placed on Epic Games, yet again.
So, they are a small company with talent that is less than average. We all know this. Its been stated by everyone countless times and proven be SV time after time.
Yet I and others still sub. Is it because Im stupid? Is it because I wouldnt know a good MMO if it bit me? Or perhaps it is because I know what else is out there at the current time. And alot of those games have talented programmers and alot of capital. Thats what I am surprised about. The headline is that all these companies with funds are making crap.
I will take a mortal online with crappy code and low-skilled employess over a face-roller themepark with " dyn*amic* c*ont*ent" any day of the week.
This is a discussion of unforeseen issues. In other words if a developer releases content that is bugged. It is always going to be UNFORESEEN.
So allow me to do this for you. Im here to educate the entire MMORPG community that whatever SV releases in the future will have bugs, including Dawn and everything they release in the future. So when they release future content it will be with unforseen issues. Even though SV cant forsee them. You and I can 'forsee' them. Dawn having unforseen issues is not news anylonger due to it being expected. Even with crappy coding I still will give them my sub money because I also know that the system they put in place in Dawn will actually eventually be hammered out.
In addition Im questioning what there is to discuss? We already knew/know about the bugs in the expansion that they are trying to fix. In addition let me educate you furthur... They will probably take a LONG time to fix said bugs. Oh no Shocker!!!
Can you guess what the next patch/expansion will be like in terms of unforeseen issues? I think you can.
This release is a simple example of when you have bad code at the bottom of all of this, you can't build good code on top and expect it to work at all.
Compare it to a house with a leaky foundation. You can build a great kitchen extension, a patio, etc... and then find out your house is sinking on one side and everything else breaks because of it. This is the state of Mortal Online.
It's not about fixing "one bug", it's about saying well, we need this game to be usable and playable, and we need to fix the core issues. The problem is of course, that the developers have no ability to fix these issues because they simply don't have the experience or knowledge to do so. Sebastian is an Unreal modder who is the "lead programmer" and has never programmed *anything* in his life.
I am just waiting on the blame to be placed on Epic Games, yet again.
So, they are a small company with talent that is less than average. We all know this. Its been stated by everyone countless times and proven be SV time after time.
Yet I and others still sub. Is it because Im stupid? Is it because I wouldnt know a good MMO if it bit me? Or perhaps it is because I know what else is out there at the current time. And alot of those games have talented programmers and alot of capital. Thats what I am surprised about. The headline is that all these companies with funds are making crap.
I will take a mortal online with crappy code and low-skilled employess over a face-roller themepark with " dyn*amic* c*ont*ent" any day of the week.
This is a discussion of unforeseen issues. In other words if a developer releases content that is bugged. It is always going to be UNFORESEEN.
So allow me to do this for you. Im here to educate the entire MMORPG community that whatever SV releases in the future will have bugs, including Dawn and everything they release in the future. So when they release future content it will be with unforseen issues. Even though SV cant forsee them. You and I can 'forsee' them. Dawn having unforseen issues is not news anylonger due to it being expected. Even with crappy coding I still will give them my sub money because I also know that the system they put in place in Dawn will actually eventually be hammered out.
In addition Im questioning what there is to discuss? We already knew/know about the bugs in the expansion that they are trying to fix. In addition let me educate you furthur... They will probably take a LONG time to fix said bugs. Oh no Shocker!!!
Can you guess what the next patch/expansion will be like in terms of unforeseen issues? I think you can.
But your statemets above imply ignorance..
As you just stated, you know it's is going to happen, so it is OK for SV to release broken patch to thepublic, because they need us to Beta test it..?
Then why do they charge for a premium MMO, when they could be charging $8.99..? If it was $5.99 I don't think people would be complaining all that much, would they..?
You give SV your money, because you think giving them your money will keep the game afloat... it will not. Ironically, it doesn't matter if MO stays afloat when the game & gameplay is this horrible. The game is this horrible because of Henrik ignorant decision making. The game is horrible (not because of another failed patch), but because there is no balance within the game.
Ironically, If you and everyone else would stop subb'ing, then Henrik would be removed and the game would get the proper balancing it needs. Thus, making the game a working model & healthier, thus better reviews and more subscriptions. So as long as you keep subing and Henrik is still lead developer, then nothing will change... money talk & you're just blabbering.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
This release is a simple example of when you have bad code at the bottom of all of this, you can't build good code on top and expect it to work at all.
Compare it to a house with a leaky foundation. You can build a great kitchen extension, a patio, etc... and then find out your house is sinking on one side and everything else breaks because of it. This is the state of Mortal Online.
It's not about fixing "one bug", it's about saying well, we need this game to be usable and playable, and we need to fix the core issues. The problem is of course, that the developers have no ability to fix these issues because they simply don't have the experience or knowledge to do so. Sebastian is an Unreal modder who is the "lead programmer" and has never programmed *anything* in his life.
I am just waiting on the blame to be placed on Epic Games, yet again.
So, they are a small company with talent that is less than average. We all know this. Its been stated by everyone countless times and proven be SV time after time.
Yet I and others still sub. Is it because Im stupid? Is it because I wouldnt know a good MMO if it bit me? Or perhaps it is because I know what else is out there at the current time. And alot of those games have talented programmers and alot of capital. Thats what I am surprised about. The headline is that all these companies with funds are making crap.
I will take a mortal online with crappy code and low-skilled employess over a face-roller themepark with " dyn*amic* c*ont*ent" any day of the week.
Wow, you compared something that's crap to something that's even crappier to make it look good. Original.
It's quite the same for persons or companies, if you set your goal low, your result will be low. If your goal is to make a better game than the crappiest themepark mmo on the market, okay. Does that make your product good? No.
I just love the "x is still better than y" arguement.
Just wondering what is considered "good" in your mind?
This is a discussion of unforeseen issues. In other words if a developer releases content that is bugged. It is always going to be UNFORESEEN.
So allow me to do this for you. Im here to educate the entire MMORPG community that whatever SV releases in the future will have bugs, including Dawn and everything they release in the future. So when they release future content it will be with unforseen issues. Even though SV cant forsee them. You and I can 'forsee' them. Dawn having unforseen issues is not news anylonger due to it being expected. Even with crappy coding I still will give them my sub money because I also know that the system they put in place in Dawn will actually eventually be hammered out.
In addition Im questioning what there is to discuss? We already knew/know about the bugs in the expansion that they are trying to fix. In addition let me educate you furthur... They will probably take a LONG time to fix said bugs. Oh no Shocker!!!
Can you guess what the next patch/expansion will be like in terms of unforeseen issues? I think you can.
But your statemets above imply ignorance..
As you just stated, you know it's is going to happen, so it is OK for SV to release broken patch to thepublic, because they need us to Beta test it..?
Then why do they charge for a premium MMO, when they could be charging $8.99..? If it was $5.99 I don't think people would be complaining all that much, would they..?
You give SV your money, because you think giving them your money will keep the game afloat... it will not. Ironically, it doesn't matter if MO stays afloat when the game & gameplay is this horrible. The game is this horrible because of Henrik ignorant decision making. The game is horrible (not because of another failed patch), but because there is no balance within the game.
Ironically, If you and everyone else would stop subb'ing, then Henrik would be removed and the game would get the proper balancing it needs. Thus, making the game a working model & healthier, thus better reviews and more subscriptions. So as long as you keep subing and Henrik is still lead developer, then nothing will change... money talk & you're just blabbering.
Indeed.
I am also confused as the main objection raised in the post seems to be to the word "unforseen" and then explaining why this disaster should have been forseen. I would just like to point out that "Unforseen Issues" is a direct quote from the developers as clearly shown in the OP... so any anger and/or frustration with the use of those words should be redirected to their source.. which is StarVault.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Its not whether its ok or not ok for SV to release a bugged patch. It's how many people are willing to pay for it. And I include myself in those willing to pay for it. The real question becomes why are you or why arent you willing to pay what they charge for it? Of course I would rather have a perfect MMO, with instantaneous bugless patches for my tastes.
What fantasy MMO out there is polished, challenging, and structured towards a more sophisticated gamer?
I realize its the lesser of 2 evils question. But the market nowadays has brought that about.
Its not whether its ok or not ok for SV to release a bugged patch. It's how many people are willing to pay for it. And I include myself in those willing to pay for it. The real question becomes why are you or why arent you willing to pay what they charge for it? Of course I would rather have a perfect MMO, with instantaneous bugless patches for my tastes.
What fantasy MMO out there is polished, challenging, and structured towards a more sophisticated gamer?
I realize its the lesser of 2 evils question. But the market nowadays has brought that about.
So tell me, if a car company said "We are going to introduce a car that gets 100MPG, never needs servicing, has lots of features, and it's super comfortable and holds 8 people while handling like a BMW", wouldn't you get excited?
Would you buy that car? Sure you would -- so would a lot of people.
However if they said all this, and then delivered a car that gets 2MPG, breaks down every few miles, has a lot of features but none of them work, and handles like a tractor, would you continue to try to "support" the company because nobody promised anything like this?
It was said earlier but bears repeating.... if you are willing to pay for total garbage, there is always somebody who is going to be willing to sell it to you. In SV's case, we know that they have no talent, no training, no future, but one or two features that works (on occasion) that are different than competitors. So you sink your money in them to enjoy those two features, rather than say "Hey, I demand quality for my money, especially if I'm paying a premium price!" (which you are). The simple fact is that most people are *not* willing to pay for it, but you are showing that there's a market for gamers who "hope" too much on the empty promises of a known liar (Henrik) and as such, you will be rewarded with more empty promises from him and lots of others along the way. You are paving the way for more "indy" companies to promise the world to get some easy cash, instead of actually looking at what they deliver and expecting more for your money.
If Henrik was capable of designing a well balanced game, managing an experienced team, and showing the roadmap for MO, then he would not be in the trouble he's in now. His daddy set him up, he has nobody to answer to, and a few features keeps people clamoring for more, as if they'd get it in any format that isn't a bug ridden piece of garbage. People with talent actually can make it; they can show their idea to the world and get real investors behind them. How do you think Blizzard games started out? How about Runic (Torchlight)? How about a LOT of companies? They had talent, good ideas, good design, good implementation, and they got people to invest in that idea and made money off of it, and made their users really happy. What we have here is a guy that is horrible at anything related to a computer, a very poor liar, and subsidized by a person who is never going to hold him accountable. And you want to give him your money?
Feel free. But when the next "Awesome Sandbox game" comes out, and takes advantage of players, just remember it's people like you who allow that behavior to continue.
My belief in the type of gameplay I want is much stronger than teaching Henrick management skills through trial and error.
If a company does a Mortal Online better than SV then I will redirect my money to them. Its captialism at work. Although Im not
going to pay less for a crapier game.
What game are you currently playing Slapshot? Or are you just into 'not' playing MO?
If you did play an MMO, what would you play at the moment? Just curious.
Believe it or not, part of developing a business plan is to show the potential audience you are going to hit. I don't think what you want out of gameplay is that niche that nobody is going to do it, and while MO may do it the "best" for you, the sad fact is, and I think deep down, you know it too, is that this game is not going to stand the test of time.
I'm not in the business of charity, and I'm not going to sub to a game that is on the whole, unplayable. A few features work but you can't just PvP all day long, you need a metagame to make the overall game seem more appealing. That's why "quests" are even around. You know, in WOW, you don't have to *do* the quests, they are optional and add to the metagame experience. When you build out a 'sandbox' game per your definitions that has no quests, no levels, that's a businessplan made to fail. There has to be a way to keep a captive audience, and part of that could be a level treadmill, or quests, or whatever. It doesn't have to be the same thing, but it has to be something to keep you going. And that's the thing with MO... it has nothing to keep you going once you get past a few gankfests. So I'll wait for an MMO that has a solid business plan that encompasses things that I might like as well as a few that I don't, in order to get my fix. Till then, I'll be playing Starcraft just for my 'competitive' fix.
My belief in the type of gameplay I want is much stronger than teaching Henrick management skills through trial and error.
If a company does a Mortal Online better than SV then I will redirect my money to them. Its captialism at work. Although Im not
going to pay less for a crapier game.
What game are you currently playing Slapshot? Or are you just into 'not' playing MO?
If you did play an MMO, what would you play at the moment? Just curious.
Believe it or not, part of developing a business plan is to show the potential audience you are going to hit. I don't think what you want out of gameplay is that niche that nobody is going to do it, and while MO may do it the "best" for you, the sad fact is, and I think deep down, you know it too, is that this game is not going to stand the test of time.
I'm not in the business of charity, and I'm not going to sub to a game that is on the whole, unplayable. A few features work but you can't just PvP all day long, you need a metagame to make the overall game seem more appealing. That's why "quests" are even around. You know, in WOW, you don't have to *do* the quests, they are optional and add to the metagame experience. When you build out a 'sandbox' game per your definitions that has no quests, no levels, that's a businessplan made to fail. There has to be a way to keep a captive audience, and part of that could be a level treadmill, or quests, or whatever. It doesn't have to be the same thing, but it has to be something to keep you going. And that's the thing with MO... it has nothing to keep you going once you get past a few gankfests. So I'll wait for an MMO that has a solid business plan that encompasses things that I might like as well as a few that I don't, in order to get my fix. Till then, I'll be playing Starcraft just for my 'competitive' fix.
Ok. fair enough Hercules. I personally hate the heck out of themeparks. So I guess we can agree to disagree on that.
I have been "let down" by what developers promised and the amount of fun Ive had playing many games, excluding single-player games.
Is this the first time you, Hercules and Slapshot, have heard a developer promise alot and the game ended up sucking in your opinion? And do you guys exhibit the same fervour in resputing that company in the long future ahead?
Or is there some additional motivation also? Was there some bad in-game event in the beginning which even furthured your hatred for SV? What guild were you in in Beta?
Wow, you compared something that's crap to something that's even crappier to make it look good. Original.
It's quite the same for persons or companies, if you set your goal low, your result will be low. If your goal is to make a better game than the crappiest themepark mmo on the market, okay. Does that make your product good? No.
I just love the "x is still better than y" arguement.
Just wondering what is considered "good" in your mind?
If MO was working properly, if the corruption amongst the staff members was gone, if the features of the game had a social context, i.e. territorial control, a proper economy, entertaining combat with proper balance, then it would be quite good in my eyes. Those aren't even luxery features, those are basic game mechanics and core conditions that you can expect from a "good" game. Or even an "okay" game.
Mortal isn't okay. It may be the best of its kind out there atm (or not, I don't know!), but I have no clue how anyone can play it for longer than 4 weeks, there's nothing to do in there. They're all just running around staring at what could have been, a bit of more or less consensual combat.. it's just an arena with the possibility of mining rocks and cutting wood, or farming boks.
It's a bunch of functions shuffled together but a real game it is not. I hate themepark games as much as you do, if someone tries two of them I think he's insane. But in an "okay" game, players can usually give a short summary about the goal of the game. Even in sandboxes. For example in Eve, "what do you do in there?" - "Errr gain influence, make money, shoot people, scam". The dynamic social fundament itself is a perpetual engine of new game content. What content is there in Mortal and what's the goal in it?
Regardless of what I or anyone thinks is good, if you have to compare MO to something crap to make it look good, it probably isn't good if you really think about it. Are you in your first month? Then your defensive stance (har har) would be understandable. I liked the first one too.
My belief in the type of gameplay I want is much stronger than teaching Henrick management skills through trial and error.
If a company does a Mortal Online better than SV then I will redirect my money to them. Its captialism at work. Although Im not
going to pay less for a crapier game.
What game are you currently playing Slapshot? Or are you just into 'not' playing MO?
If you did play an MMO, what would you play at the moment? Just curious.
Believe it or not, part of developing a business plan is to show the potential audience you are going to hit. I don't think what you want out of gameplay is that niche that nobody is going to do it, and while MO may do it the "best" for you, the sad fact is, and I think deep down, you know it too, is that this game is not going to stand the test of time.
I'm not in the business of charity, and I'm not going to sub to a game that is on the whole, unplayable. A few features work but you can't just PvP all day long, you need a metagame to make the overall game seem more appealing. That's why "quests" are even around. You know, in WOW, you don't have to *do* the quests, they are optional and add to the metagame experience. When you build out a 'sandbox' game per your definitions that has no quests, no levels, that's a businessplan made to fail. There has to be a way to keep a captive audience, and part of that could be a level treadmill, or quests, or whatever. It doesn't have to be the same thing, but it has to be something to keep you going. And that's the thing with MO... it has nothing to keep you going once you get past a few gankfests. So I'll wait for an MMO that has a solid business plan that encompasses things that I might like as well as a few that I don't, in order to get my fix. Till then, I'll be playing Starcraft just for my 'competitive' fix.
Ok. fair enough Hercules. I personally hate the heck out of themeparks. So I guess we can agree to disagree on that.
I have been "let down" by what developers promised and the amount of fun Ive had playing many games, excluding single-player games.
Is this the first time you, Hercules and Slapshot, have heard a developer promise alot and the game ended up sucking in your opinion? And do you guys exhibit the same fervour in resputing that company in the long future ahead?
Or is there some additional motivation also? Was there some bad in-game event in the beginning which even furthured your hatred for SV? What guild were you in in Beta?
Just curious
I do not think it is the game itself or a bad ingame event that made people SV. There was an old thread about why people hate on MO so much. It is the way they do business and how henrik runs things. He promises the world and gives you a pea. He lies and over exagerates things way way too much. For instance. "Hundreds of new skills"???? There are not hundreds of new skills. I have been trying Dawn (between crashes and shit just not working) Been in IRC talked to a gm in game and No one can give me a list besides the ones we know about or the few real new skills that go with armor and cooking. Anyone remember "It will be MO2"?
Or the way he handles people in game he has his favorites and he has the people he does not like. The way the game is run is totally non professional.
I have been watching the game during beta.. subbed when it came out and played for 2 months. Left because of the desync/server issues. Came back once desync was fixed.
Ive been recently playing for the last 4 months and been enjoying it. Am having fun with my guild. Lots of good people in there.
I enjoy the politics, the crafting, the gathering, and the exploring.
Im pretty aware of the current goings-on over the last year and 1/2, the scandals, the guild dramas, the guild/GM dramas, etc.
But, given the fact that there is no better game out of the things I want in a game, I am playing MO.
Ya I'm not gona read all the crap above me, but I will say this... their is not many people playing this game, and the ones who are playing probably are doing so because they enjoy it, have friends and community in it, and have no alternatives.
I don't even play the game anymore, and it's really easy to understand that.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to play.
As for the expansion, my server in wow back when wrath and tbc came out was unplayable for at least 1-2 week-ish. It's been 2 days? SV is a pretty bad dev company, but this right here really isn't that big of a deal.
Ya I'm not gona read all the crap above me, but I will say this... their is not many people playing this game, and the ones who are playing probably are doing so because they enjoy it, have friends and community in it, and have no alternatives.
I don't even play the game anymore, and it's really easy to understand that.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to play.
Ya I'm not gona read all the crap above me, but I will say this... their is not many people playing this game, and the ones who are playing probably are doing so because they enjoy it, have friends and community in it, and have no alternatives.
I don't even play the game anymore, and it's really easy to understand that.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to play.
I have tried so many games that promise the world and they dont come through. I pulled my subscription if it had one. And stayed away from that studio in the future.
I didnt linger on game forums and still talk about how much they suck months/years later.
Ya I'm not gona read all the crap above me, but I will say this... their is not many people playing this game, and the ones who are playing probably are doing so because they enjoy it, have friends and community in it, and have no alternatives.
I don't even play the game anymore, and it's really easy to understand that.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to play.
Oh the irony.
explain the irony, go.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to post.
That's the irony.
(Or why you're defending a game that you aren't playing. But your valuable free time is up to you, of course. And you look pretty fit to educate us on what to do in our free time as well, but that wasn't your style, you said?..)
My belief in the type of gameplay I want is much stronger than teaching Henrick management skills through trial and error.
If a company does a Mortal Online better than SV then I will redirect my money to them. Its captialism at work. Although Im not
going to pay less for a crapier game.
What game are you currently playing Slapshot? Or are you just into 'not' playing MO?
If you did play an MMO, what would you play at the moment? Just curious.
Believe it or not, part of developing a business plan is to show the potential audience you are going to hit. I don't think what you want out of gameplay is that niche that nobody is going to do it, and while MO may do it the "best" for you, the sad fact is, and I think deep down, you know it too, is that this game is not going to stand the test of time.
I'm not in the business of charity, and I'm not going to sub to a game that is on the whole, unplayable. A few features work but you can't just PvP all day long, you need a metagame to make the overall game seem more appealing. That's why "quests" are even around. You know, in WOW, you don't have to *do* the quests, they are optional and add to the metagame experience. When you build out a 'sandbox' game per your definitions that has no quests, no levels, that's a businessplan made to fail. There has to be a way to keep a captive audience, and part of that could be a level treadmill, or quests, or whatever. It doesn't have to be the same thing, but it has to be something to keep you going. And that's the thing with MO... it has nothing to keep you going once you get past a few gankfests. So I'll wait for an MMO that has a solid business plan that encompasses things that I might like as well as a few that I don't, in order to get my fix. Till then, I'll be playing Starcraft just for my 'competitive' fix.
Ok. fair enough Hercules. I personally hate the heck out of themeparks. So I guess we can agree to disagree on that.
I have been "let down" by what developers promised and the amount of fun Ive had playing many games, excluding single-player games.
Is this the first time you, Hercules and Slapshot, have heard a developer promise alot and the game ended up sucking in your opinion? And do you guys exhibit the same fervour in resputing that company in the long future ahead?
Or is there some additional motivation also? Was there some bad in-game event in the beginning which even furthured your hatred for SV? What guild were you in in Beta?
Just curious
My irritation for SV lies heavily in their unethical business practices. I had friends who were billed without their consent for months, because they were deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan. It's unconscionable, the way they operate.
As for promises well... let's just say that this game is staying afloat longer because the CEO has a rich father. Nothing else. Other games have come and gone and blown up fast, because the "investors" knew they were duped and pulled all support. Look up Mourning for that example, or Dark and Light. In this case the "investor" is the CEO's dad, and apparently doesn't care if his moron of a son spends all this cash with nothing to show for it.
I liken Henrik to Hulk Hogan's son, who liked racing so much that he got his dad to buy him a race car and sponsor him. He wound up sucking so badly that he never made a dime in his racing "career" and not to mention his stupidity, got a friend basically put into a vegitative state for the rest of his life. Spoiled rich kids that feel entitled to do something amazing with no prior training, effort, or real work experience irritate me, so if you wonder why I dislike SV... there's a lot of reasons.
Oh, and believe it or not, I was recruited into Aegis Imperium prior to beta, but left because I thought it was aiming to be a zerg guild. I wound up being right, though the definition of zerg in MO is really like 4 people, because there's nobody online any more.
Ya I'm not gona read all the crap above me, but I will say this... their is not many people playing this game, and the ones who are playing probably are doing so because they enjoy it, have friends and community in it, and have no alternatives.
I don't even play the game anymore, and it's really easy to understand that.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to play.
Oh the irony.
explain the irony, go.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to post.
Or why you're defending a game that you aren't playing although your free time is up to you, of course.
That's the irony. Now see how valuable your posting really is, according to your own logic?
This is what, my first post on that topic. You call that passion and "so much time"...1 post? I'm talking about the people who have been doing this for a good year+ with sarcastic threads, obivous threads, the whole spectrum. I'm not talking about saying your opinion here and there, I'm talking about the devotion of a select few mo haters on here, its kind of ridiculous, persistance for a good year now...
Also, i'm not defending the game, i'm defending this particular incident, because this is obviously not a big deal. unless saying a dev company is bad is defending the game...
We have been working pretty much nonstop with the Dawn release.
As you all know we are still a very small team, and so is our testing team. We have had a very long test phase on Dawn, we ironed out all bugs we could find during that period. But we wont be able to cover it as good as when the server get filled with players. Our bug tracker is nowhere full with bugs, compared to previous bugs which we are happy to see.
We have located one of the client crashes many players experience and is building the patch for that at the moment. We also solved the server crash we had since yesterday.
There is also discussion regarding attribute points and size.
This system work as intended now, which it didn't before. The costs for size is working now, hence its taking point from your pool, or simply lowers the size to prevent you going over stat cap. What Dawn brings you is the ability to change size up and down using food. Now you will be able to go up to 2.20 as long as your race allows it to.
Please continue to add bugs in bug tracker, as that's the only place we will look when it comes to bug, NOT on the forums. Player items have gone invisible in player house chests, we will try to patch a fix for this tomorrow, also a guild fix.
Mounts works as following: it can handle a certain amount of actions and then queues them before going through them. Low int mounts will do this slowly, this means if you spam that mount with commands it will end up doing it for a long time, that may seem like its not responding, even it does. We need to further balance this, while that is done we have made all mounts a bit smarter, that allows them to handle commands faster and simultaneous. Whenever you get to learn how this works it will become more clear how you control them. We have also fixed strange size on mounts that comes in this patch we are building now.
So far, they've already significantly improved the stability of the game through the server-side. Hopefully, a client patch will increase stability even more, along with some tweaks some of the systems of the game.
It will not take half a month to fix the few bugs that Dawn is having. Henrik's new thread already explains that they are tackling the major bugs already.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It will not take half a month to fix the few bugs that Dawn is having. Henrik's new thread already explains that they are tackling the major bugs already.
It's not surprising how this might be confusing, especially if the only source of information a person is using are forums which are routinely filled with emotionally laden exaggeration.
Ugg well I got everything updated. Tried it out, and when it doesn't crash(which is 90% of the time now, which is odd because before Dawn it was only 10% of the time)....everything has been broken in-game. I mean bugs everywhereeee. Hopefully it's fixed soon.
Bugs everywhere? I disagree. Once I got past the crashing, the only bugs I saw were the moving asleep people, and the old ghost-horses bug, and sometimes those giant mounts.
Other than that, i experienced (surprisingly) "polished" systems that they introduced, and had a lot of fun these few hours I played.
Comments
It is all lip service, as this was not only forseen, but expected... given StarVaults record.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
This is a discussion of unforeseen issues. In other words if a developer releases content that is bugged. It is always going to be UNFORESEEN.
So allow me to do this for you. Im here to educate the entire MMORPG community that whatever SV releases in the future will have bugs, including Dawn and everything they release in the future. So when they release future content it will be with unforseen issues. Even though SV cant forsee them. You and I can 'forsee' them. Dawn having unforseen issues is not news anylonger due to it being expected. Even with crappy coding I still will give them my sub money because I also know that the system they put in place in Dawn will actually eventually be hammered out.
In addition Im questioning what there is to discuss? We already knew/know about the bugs in the expansion that they are trying to fix. In addition let me educate you furthur... They will probably take a LONG time to fix said bugs. Oh no Shocker!!!
Can you guess what the next patch/expansion will be like in terms of unforeseen issues? I think you can.
But your statemets above imply ignorance..
As you just stated, you know it's is going to happen, so it is OK for SV to release broken patch to thepublic, because they need us to Beta test it..?
Then why do they charge for a premium MMO, when they could be charging $8.99..? If it was $5.99 I don't think people would be complaining all that much, would they..?
You give SV your money, because you think giving them your money will keep the game afloat... it will not. Ironically, it doesn't matter if MO stays afloat when the game & gameplay is this horrible. The game is this horrible because of Henrik ignorant decision making. The game is horrible (not because of another failed patch), but because there is no balance within the game.
Ironically, If you and everyone else would stop subb'ing, then Henrik would be removed and the game would get the proper balancing it needs. Thus, making the game a working model & healthier, thus better reviews and more subscriptions. So as long as you keep subing and Henrik is still lead developer, then nothing will change... money talk & you're just blabbering.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Just wondering what is considered "good" in your mind?
Indeed.
I am also confused as the main objection raised in the post seems to be to the word "unforseen" and then explaining why this disaster should have been forseen. I would just like to point out that "Unforseen Issues" is a direct quote from the developers as clearly shown in the OP... so any anger and/or frustration with the use of those words should be redirected to their source.. which is StarVault.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Its not whether its ok or not ok for SV to release a bugged patch. It's how many people are willing to pay for it. And I include myself in those willing to pay for it. The real question becomes why are you or why arent you willing to pay what they charge for it? Of course I would rather have a perfect MMO, with instantaneous bugless patches for my tastes.
What fantasy MMO out there is polished, challenging, and structured towards a more sophisticated gamer?
I realize its the lesser of 2 evils question. But the market nowadays has brought that about.
So tell me, if a car company said "We are going to introduce a car that gets 100MPG, never needs servicing, has lots of features, and it's super comfortable and holds 8 people while handling like a BMW", wouldn't you get excited?
Would you buy that car? Sure you would -- so would a lot of people.
However if they said all this, and then delivered a car that gets 2MPG, breaks down every few miles, has a lot of features but none of them work, and handles like a tractor, would you continue to try to "support" the company because nobody promised anything like this?
It was said earlier but bears repeating.... if you are willing to pay for total garbage, there is always somebody who is going to be willing to sell it to you. In SV's case, we know that they have no talent, no training, no future, but one or two features that works (on occasion) that are different than competitors. So you sink your money in them to enjoy those two features, rather than say "Hey, I demand quality for my money, especially if I'm paying a premium price!" (which you are). The simple fact is that most people are *not* willing to pay for it, but you are showing that there's a market for gamers who "hope" too much on the empty promises of a known liar (Henrik) and as such, you will be rewarded with more empty promises from him and lots of others along the way. You are paving the way for more "indy" companies to promise the world to get some easy cash, instead of actually looking at what they deliver and expecting more for your money.
If Henrik was capable of designing a well balanced game, managing an experienced team, and showing the roadmap for MO, then he would not be in the trouble he's in now. His daddy set him up, he has nobody to answer to, and a few features keeps people clamoring for more, as if they'd get it in any format that isn't a bug ridden piece of garbage. People with talent actually can make it; they can show their idea to the world and get real investors behind them. How do you think Blizzard games started out? How about Runic (Torchlight)? How about a LOT of companies? They had talent, good ideas, good design, good implementation, and they got people to invest in that idea and made money off of it, and made their users really happy. What we have here is a guy that is horrible at anything related to a computer, a very poor liar, and subsidized by a person who is never going to hold him accountable. And you want to give him your money?
Feel free. But when the next "Awesome Sandbox game" comes out, and takes advantage of players, just remember it's people like you who allow that behavior to continue.
My belief in the type of gameplay I want is much stronger than teaching Henrick management skills through trial and error.
If a company does a Mortal Online better than SV then I will redirect my money to them. Its captialism at work. Although Im not
going to pay less for a crapier game.
What game are you currently playing Slapshot? Or are you just into 'not' playing MO?
If you did play an MMO, what would you play at the moment? Just curious.
Believe it or not, part of developing a business plan is to show the potential audience you are going to hit. I don't think what you want out of gameplay is that niche that nobody is going to do it, and while MO may do it the "best" for you, the sad fact is, and I think deep down, you know it too, is that this game is not going to stand the test of time.
I'm not in the business of charity, and I'm not going to sub to a game that is on the whole, unplayable. A few features work but you can't just PvP all day long, you need a metagame to make the overall game seem more appealing. That's why "quests" are even around. You know, in WOW, you don't have to *do* the quests, they are optional and add to the metagame experience. When you build out a 'sandbox' game per your definitions that has no quests, no levels, that's a businessplan made to fail. There has to be a way to keep a captive audience, and part of that could be a level treadmill, or quests, or whatever. It doesn't have to be the same thing, but it has to be something to keep you going. And that's the thing with MO... it has nothing to keep you going once you get past a few gankfests. So I'll wait for an MMO that has a solid business plan that encompasses things that I might like as well as a few that I don't, in order to get my fix. Till then, I'll be playing Starcraft just for my 'competitive' fix.
Ok. fair enough Hercules. I personally hate the heck out of themeparks. So I guess we can agree to disagree on that.
I have been "let down" by what developers promised and the amount of fun Ive had playing many games, excluding single-player games.
Is this the first time you, Hercules and Slapshot, have heard a developer promise alot and the game ended up sucking in your opinion? And do you guys exhibit the same fervour in resputing that company in the long future ahead?
Or is there some additional motivation also? Was there some bad in-game event in the beginning which even furthured your hatred for SV? What guild were you in in Beta?
Just curious
If MO was working properly, if the corruption amongst the staff members was gone, if the features of the game had a social context, i.e. territorial control, a proper economy, entertaining combat with proper balance, then it would be quite good in my eyes. Those aren't even luxery features, those are basic game mechanics and core conditions that you can expect from a "good" game. Or even an "okay" game.
Mortal isn't okay. It may be the best of its kind out there atm (or not, I don't know!), but I have no clue how anyone can play it for longer than 4 weeks, there's nothing to do in there. They're all just running around staring at what could have been, a bit of more or less consensual combat.. it's just an arena with the possibility of mining rocks and cutting wood, or farming boks.
It's a bunch of functions shuffled together but a real game it is not.
I hate themepark games as much as you do, if someone tries two of them I think he's insane. But in an "okay" game, players can usually give a short summary about the goal of the game. Even in sandboxes. For example in Eve, "what do you do in there?" - "Errr gain influence, make money, shoot people, scam". The dynamic social fundament itself is a perpetual engine of new game content. What content is there in Mortal and what's the goal in it?
Regardless of what I or anyone thinks is good, if you have to compare MO to something crap to make it look good, it probably isn't good if you really think about it. Are you in your first month? Then your defensive stance (har har) would be understandable. I liked the first one too.
I do not think it is the game itself or a bad ingame event that made people SV. There was an old thread about why people hate on MO so much. It is the way they do business and how henrik runs things. He promises the world and gives you a pea. He lies and over exagerates things way way too much. For instance. "Hundreds of new skills"???? There are not hundreds of new skills. I have been trying Dawn (between crashes and shit just not working) Been in IRC talked to a gm in game and No one can give me a list besides the ones we know about or the few real new skills that go with armor and cooking. Anyone remember "It will be MO2"?
Or the way he handles people in game he has his favorites and he has the people he does not like. The way the game is run is totally non professional.
I have been watching the game during beta.. subbed when it came out and played for 2 months. Left because of the desync/server issues. Came back once desync was fixed.
Ive been recently playing for the last 4 months and been enjoying it. Am having fun with my guild. Lots of good people in there.
I enjoy the politics, the crafting, the gathering, and the exploring.
Im pretty aware of the current goings-on over the last year and 1/2, the scandals, the guild dramas, the guild/GM dramas, etc.
But, given the fact that there is no better game out of the things I want in a game, I am playing MO.
Ya I'm not gona read all the crap above me, but I will say this... their is not many people playing this game, and the ones who are playing probably are doing so because they enjoy it, have friends and community in it, and have no alternatives.
I don't even play the game anymore, and it's really easy to understand that.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to play.
As for the expansion, my server in wow back when wrath and tbc came out was unplayable for at least 1-2 week-ish. It's been 2 days? SV is a pretty bad dev company, but this right here really isn't that big of a deal.
Oh the irony.
explain the irony, go.
I have tried so many games that promise the world and they dont come through. I pulled my subscription if it had one. And stayed away from that studio in the future.
I didnt linger on game forums and still talk about how much they suck months/years later.
Thank you guys for your debate. Been a pleasure.
A bigger mystery is why someone would devote so much time trying to down talk the people who down talk the people who play it, and the game... like with a committed passion. Because what you do in your free time is up to you? Ya, same with the people willing to post.
That's the irony.
(Or why you're defending a game that you aren't playing. But your valuable free time is up to you, of course. And you look pretty fit to educate us on what to do in our free time as well, but that wasn't your style, you said?..)
My irritation for SV lies heavily in their unethical business practices. I had friends who were billed without their consent for months, because they were deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan. It's unconscionable, the way they operate.
As for promises well... let's just say that this game is staying afloat longer because the CEO has a rich father. Nothing else. Other games have come and gone and blown up fast, because the "investors" knew they were duped and pulled all support. Look up Mourning for that example, or Dark and Light. In this case the "investor" is the CEO's dad, and apparently doesn't care if his moron of a son spends all this cash with nothing to show for it.
I liken Henrik to Hulk Hogan's son, who liked racing so much that he got his dad to buy him a race car and sponsor him. He wound up sucking so badly that he never made a dime in his racing "career" and not to mention his stupidity, got a friend basically put into a vegitative state for the rest of his life. Spoiled rich kids that feel entitled to do something amazing with no prior training, effort, or real work experience irritate me, so if you wonder why I dislike SV... there's a lot of reasons.
Oh, and believe it or not, I was recruited into Aegis Imperium prior to beta, but left because I thought it was aiming to be a zerg guild. I wound up being right, though the definition of zerg in MO is really like 4 people, because there's nobody online any more.
This is what, my first post on that topic. You call that passion and "so much time"...1 post? I'm talking about the people who have been doing this for a good year+ with sarcastic threads, obivous threads, the whole spectrum. I'm not talking about saying your opinion here and there, I'm talking about the devotion of a select few mo haters on here, its kind of ridiculous, persistance for a good year now...
Also, i'm not defending the game, i'm defending this particular incident, because this is obviously not a big deal. unless saying a dev company is bad is defending the game...
ya k.
The SV CEO has given an update on the progress with Dawn:
#1 (permalink)
Henrik Nystrom
CEO
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 710
Rep Power: 15
Dear community,
We have been working pretty much nonstop with the Dawn release.
As you all know we are still a very small team, and so is our testing team. We have had a very long test phase on Dawn, we ironed out all bugs we could find during that period. But we wont be able to cover it as good as when the server get filled with players. Our bug tracker is nowhere full with bugs, compared to previous bugs which we are happy to see.
We have located one of the client crashes many players experience and is building the patch for that at the moment. We also solved the server crash we had since yesterday.
There is also discussion regarding attribute points and size.
This system work as intended now, which it didn't before. The costs for size is working now, hence its taking point from your pool, or simply lowers the size to prevent you going over stat cap. What Dawn brings you is the ability to change size up and down using food. Now you will be able to go up to 2.20 as long as your race allows it to.
Please continue to add bugs in bug tracker, as that's the only place we will look when it comes to bug, NOT on the forums. Player items have gone invisible in player house chests, we will try to patch a fix for this tomorrow, also a guild fix.
Mounts works as following: it can handle a certain amount of actions and then queues them before going through them. Low int mounts will do this slowly, this means if you spam that mount with commands it will end up doing it for a long time, that may seem like its not responding, even it does. We need to further balance this, while that is done we have made all mounts a bit smarter, that allows them to handle commands faster and simultaneous. Whenever you get to learn how this works it will become more clear how you control them. We have also fixed strange size on mounts that comes in this patch we are building now.
Thank you for your patience and support.
/The Devs
__________________
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/62831-update-dawn-13-6-a.html#post1159378
So far, they've already significantly improved the stability of the game through the server-side. Hopefully, a client patch will increase stability even more, along with some tweaks some of the systems of the game.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
Lets stay on topic, thanks!
Update from StarVault... but I'm not sure what game he was referring to with "few bugs"...
#17 (permalink)
Talwin
Lead Community Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Your Profile
Rep Power: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunshiner
w8 atleast half a month more if you ask me
It will not take half a month to fix the few bugs that Dawn is having. Henrik's new thread already explains that they are tackling the major bugs already.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It's not surprising how this might be confusing, especially if the only source of information a person is using are forums which are routinely filled with emotionally laden exaggeration.
I think this post explains it the best:
#29 (permalink)
GaraP
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1,258
Rep Power: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by killing karma
Ugg well I got everything updated. Tried it out, and when it doesn't crash(which is 90% of the time now, which is odd because before Dawn it was only 10% of the time)....everything has been broken in-game.
Bugs everywhere? I disagree. Once I got past the crashing, the only bugs I saw were the moving asleep people, and the old ghost-horses bug, and sometimes those giant mounts.
Other than that, i experienced (surprisingly) "polished" systems that they introduced, and had a lot of fun these few hours I played.
__________________
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.