Protecting newbie areas is common. In Rift as a Guardian / Defiant, you can not enter the other introductory area because that area is in a different time. The story makes areas that you can not explore as part of the other faction. Aion is the same as well.
In WoW, they use level 90 guards to send you to the GY almost instantly around newbie zones. Getting the achievements for Gnomeagon is hard for high level horde because of this. I prefer the Rift / Aion method over the gy runs affecting gameplay.
That answer from Georg Zoeller goes into much detail, nothing really new but I haven't seen a dev to say it that directly especially about PvP and UO ...
I agree. I'll add another that has seemed to pop up in this thread: The freedom to go anywhere you want to without any regard to the story or IP. A jedi knight should not be able to travel to Korriban and visit the tombs. That is a Sith controlled world and is crawling with sith. It would be like re-creating a game set in World War 2 and having the Nazis visiting the United States on a whim. It's immersion breaking and has no place. Same goes for a sith player visiting a republic controlled world.The game is about a war between two factions who hate each other and want to kill each other. Having players able to visit enemy territory and walk around as if a war isn't happening is just plain stupid. There are 17 worlds and if you can't visit THREE of them it is in NO way a negative against this game.
I'm guessing that's a joke? That's precisely what you do in Kotor 1. In fact, you can't proceed through the game unless you do. So, yes, a Jedi visiting Koriban and going through the tombs isn't jist viable gameplay - it's actual Kotor lore as written by Bioware's own writers.
I'm guessing you can't see the difference in a single player game where you are the only player in the game and a MMORPG where there will be hundreds of other players walking around knowing that you are a player of the other faction? In TOR your faction alignment is already set in stone, unlike with KOTOR where you didn't make your allegiance known until the end of the game. Here you make your faction choice at the very beginning of the game. So either deal with it or find something else to play.
I'm guessing that's a joke? That's precisely what you do in Kotor 1. In fact, you can't proceed through the game unless you do. So, yes, a Jedi visiting Koriban and going through the tombs isn't jist viable gameplay - it's actual Kotor lore as written by Bioware's own writers.
I'm guessing you can't see the difference in a single player game where you are the only player in the game and a MMORPG where there will be hundreds of other players walking around knowing that you are a player of the other faction? In TOR your faction alignment is already set in stone, unlike with KOTOR where you didn't make your allegiance known until the end of the game. Here you make your faction choice at the very beginning of the game. So either deal with it or find something else to play.
No. It's bad lore. It's lazy design. It's reduced gameplay. You may or may not admit it but you know it's true.
If your objections can be easily overcome - and made to work - by Blizzard in WoW then designers as advanced as Bioware could and should have done it.
The way I see it, you just have over inflated sense of right and wrong here. They are making a perfectly simple and intelligent design decision and because YOU don't like it, then it must be wrong. Take a step back and you MIGHT see that the MMO vs SPG has a LOT of merit. I personally would like to see a story line or two that has you infiltrating the enemies lair (so to speak) but the game will not suffer for it if I can't.
Let's be honest though, with 4 Force Classes that can feel the presence of members of the "other side" it would make ABSOLUTELY no sense if they could infiltrate the other sides capital worlds. So that leaves 4 classes that might be able to pull it off and it they were allowed then we would have everyone whining that the force users could not do it too.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
No. It's bad lore. It's lazy design. It's reduced gameplay. You may or may not admit it but you know it's true.
If your objections can be easily overcome - and made to work - by Blizzard in WoW then designers as advanced as Bioware could and should have done it.
Does this also mean all MMO's from here forth should have 100% VO, if Bioware's formula pays off?
Bad lore really makes no sense in this respect as it's a different time period, as well as Biowares time period, they have complete authority in the end. Going to Koriban for instance could be fun but how the story is being told is significant in what sense it would make in going there. Would an American head into Nazi Germany to just stroll around in 1941?
A better example would be what was said about an American travelling to Russia at the height of the cold war?
In KOTOR your character is in charge of his alignment in a much different manner, as the whole purpose of the game is to dictate where you end up. That's not the case with TOR.
To me it seems the whole build up in story is going to be an escalation to all out war, to explain end game PVP and the scenarios that take place in "operations". Pure speculation on my part but the story starting off at a period of serious tension and half-hearted treaties seems to be the makings of such a tale.
You also have to consider future updates if the plan is to continue the story from where it intially ends.There may be battles (PVE or PVP) that take place on Koriban or other core worlds. You relly never know, there could even be a future option of PVP all over once the game becomes top heavy with little new customers.
Saying things are bad in regard to lore or lazy design is a bit pre-mature at this point. What's on the table could more than make up for any seeming limitations once we see all that is on offer.
I can think of 100 bad scenarios this game could pan out to fulfill, yet I could at the same time see 100 positive scenario's as well.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I'm guessing that's a joke? That's precisely what you do in Kotor 1. In fact, you can't proceed through the game unless you do. So, yes, a Jedi visiting Koriban and going through the tombs isn't jist viable gameplay - it's actual Kotor lore as written by Bioware's own writers.
I'm guessing you can't see the difference in a single player game where you are the only player in the game and a MMORPG where there will be hundreds of other players walking around knowing that you are a player of the other faction? In TOR your faction alignment is already set in stone, unlike with KOTOR where you didn't make your allegiance known until the end of the game. Here you make your faction choice at the very beginning of the game. So either deal with it or find something else to play.
No. It's bad lore. It's lazy design. It's reduced gameplay. You may or may not admit it but you know it's true.
I love when anonymous posters tell me what I know and what I don't. It's almost as entertaining as the ones pulling their hair out in the awards thread. The only thing "true" (since you brought it up) that I know is :
that I'll be playing this game the week it comes out and enjoying myself.
I KNOW what this game offers because I've actually been following it and making up my own mind.
I know that this won't be an open ended crapfest where I'm slaughtering animals for hours on end just to level up.
I know that this game has more worlds on it to explore than any other game has. If I can't hit three of them because of faction restriction then so be it. I can always role another character from the other faction to see the other starter planets.
I know that there will a fun story to play with choices that actually matter.
I know that I didn't waste money and years on crap MMOs so I'm not coming into this game with the same jaded attitude as others suffering from burnout. I don't see WOW around every corner and can enjoy the game for what it is, not for what it wasn't.
I know that I will be much happier with "reduced" gameplay if it means that jedi in hot pants won't be running around where they shouldn't be. I couldn't STAND that in SWG.
I could go on but what would be the point? I'm still going to play this game no matter how much you try to smear TOR and you're still going to hate it no matter what I say here. So have a good day and I hope that maybe ONE day(if that ever comes) a game comes along that matches your high and mighty standards.
Dragon Age with lightsabers. Once maybe two go arounds and they'll be looking for something else to buy to keep them busy. Lets hope the journey is well worth the price of admission.
Worlds are just zones like any other mmo. If they are for level ranges and some are restricted by faction you will lose content. In a game like this though, there's little point in visiting the opposing factions areas as there are no quests for you there. All it means to me is dont expect to be able to go everywhere as one toon, just like other games of this type.
The way I see it, you just have over inflated sense of right and wrong here. They are making a perfectly simple and intelligent design decision and because YOU don't like it, then it must be wrong. Take a step back and you MIGHT see that the MMO vs SPG has a LOT of merit. I personally would like to see a story line or two that has you infiltrating the enemies lair (so to speak) but the game will not suffer for it if I can't.
Let's be honest though, with 4 Force Classes that can feel the presence of members of the "other side" it would make ABSOLUTELY no sense if they could infiltrate the other sides capital worlds. So that leaves 4 classes that might be able to pull it off and it they were allowed then we would have everyone whining that the force users could not do it too.
Well, I took your advice. I took a step back. I had a good long think about it. Here's my conclusion:
It's bad lore. It's lazy design. It's reduced gameplay.
Sorry, I admire you trying to argue your way round this but, come on, blocking off 17.5% of playable areas because the designers can't work out a guard/patrol system the way that Blizzard can is self-evidently ridiculous. Search your feelings. You know this to be true.
Did you really look at the argument or did you just dismiss it out of hand? Somthing tells me you just dismissed it.
No, I did precisely as you said. First, I stopped and meditated for a while. Then I prayed to my god for guidance. Then I printed out his argument and read it over carefully. I read it over again and took notes. Then I rang some friends and discussed with with them, each one an expert in some aspect of lore, gameplay, MMO construction, the industry. Finally, I went out onto a hillside and waited for the universe to speak to me. Then I came back with my conclusion:
It's bad lore. It's lazy design. It's reduced gameplay.
I dont really see what the huge deal is. In pretty much every MMO ever made where you have more than 1 side / faction there is a ton of content that is only available to 1 side or the other, such as quests, storylines, and yes even locations just like these planets.
The only difference here is that its called a planet, instead of a zone. You could easily swap the 2 and it would be just like any other MMO where only the good side has access to certain zones or cities, and the the same goes for the bad side.
I think its kind of funny though that youre complaining about "17.5%" of content being blocked, when in reality 50% of the content is blocked to the opposing side in pretty much every MMO. 1 side has quest chains suited to their side, and so doe sthe other. Whya rent you complaining that there are opposing sides and not everyone can access every quest and do every single thing at once with 1 character and its unfair you can only play 50% of the game.
Originally posted by gaou Originally posted by Foomerang
Originally posted by Temujin2011
Originally posted by MMO.Maverick
Originally posted by Temujin2011
It's true that this game or that game may or may not have a main feature that other MMOs do have - you use LotrO not having PVP as an example - but Turbine never said that LotrO was going to be anything but a PVE game right from the start while Bioware has made a big deal about SWTOR offering open world PVP and exploration.
And it does have it: open world PvP as well as exploration, with planets that are each as large as the whole world in Rift, that sounds like quite some exploration options to me. Even more, based upon information that the devs provided you now know where the limitations are regarding exploration a considerable time before the game launches, so you can include that in your decisionmaking whether the game is something you want to play or not. If you still decide to play, you already know what to expect when it comes to what is available of the whole of SWTOR when you play 1 faction.
Yes, it has open world PVP and exploration on the worlds THE DEVELOPERS LET YOU VISIT. And that's only just over eighty per cent of the planets. I mean, really? A bounty hunter can't visit Coruscant? I'm not talking about opening fire on the Chief Jedi, I'm talking abouit visiting the city for a damn drink. Nope. it can't be done. Oh,k and an Imperial Agent, the master of deception, infiltration and subterfuge? No, they can't do it either. In lore terms, that's ridiculous - in gameplay terms, its unjustifiable. It just is. It's not a deal breaker for me but I was hoping that something this obvious was a given.
Sith empire faction cant visit Coruscant? I'll believe that when I see a dev quote.
from stephen reid after a community q&a update revealed some faction restricted planets: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5209952#post5209952 Morsong's correct in this instance. Empire players cannot visit Coruscant. It is crawling with Republic forces, of course - who have their guards up after the assault on the planet.
There are other planets, though....
from what we have been told capital planets(coruscant, dormund kaas) and origin worlds(tython, ord mantell, korriban, and hutta) are faction resctricted
oh man, that is just straight up stupid. I can understand maybe some newbie starter zones and maybe a couple of cities.... but entire planets? i really hope that changes.
... wait, does this mean that there's no 'skip cutscene' button?
Because I abuse the hell out of that button in every RPG that lets me.
you can hit spacebar to skip lines of dialogue(but need to hit it every time someone speaks) but there is no skip everything because choices need to be made
... wait, does this mean that there's no 'skip cutscene' button?
Because I abuse the hell out of that button in every RPG that lets me.
you can hit spacebar to skip lines of dialogue(but need to hit it every time someone speaks) but there is no skip everything because choices need to be made
They need a 'shift+spacebar' to skip you to the next choice you need to make.
Then you can just 'Shift+spacebar', click the first choice that pops up, repeat until done.
Congratulations, your story has been near-completely avoided.
I'd actually be annoyed at a game where you can't actually skip every single cutscene possible.
... wait, does this mean that there's no 'skip cutscene' button?
Because I abuse the hell out of that button in every RPG that lets me.
you can hit spacebar to skip lines of dialogue(but need to hit it every time someone speaks) but there is no skip everything because choices need to be made
They need a 'shift+spacebar' to skip you to the next choice you need to make.
Then you can just 'Shift+spacebar', click the first choice that pops up, repeat until done.
Congratulations, your story has been near-completely avoided.
I'd actually be annoyed at a game where you can't actually skip every single cutscene possible.
If you wanted to, you could simply do the following
Click the NPC to start up the quest
Mash the space bar over and over again until you get to the point where the dialog wheel pops up
Select 1 on the keyboard command or whatever it is to select a option.
mash the space bar until the next wheel pops up
Rinse repeat until complete.
I don't recommend this method but you could do it that way if you so choose.
Provided of course your not in a group, in which case each dialog skip needs to be confirmed by each group member. Which is unlikely except if as a group you decided before hand you would skip all the dialog as each line would take about 10 to 20 seconds to say and it would take about that long for each person to get around to hitting the space bar.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Isn't it kinda silly to think you could bypass the story element since it is one of the highly tauted features?
If I didn't care to give this whole VO/story thing in an mmo a go, I probably wouldn't be interested in this title. Considering how much effort and emphasis BW has put into that aspect of their game, it would seem like such a waste to just skip it all.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
I don't recommend this method but you could do it that way if you so choose.
Provided of course your not in a group, in which case each dialog skip needs to be confirmed by each group member. Which is unlikely except if as a group you decided before hand you would skip all the dialog as each line would take about 10 to 20 seconds to say and it would take about that long for each person to get around to hitting the space bar.
What if you're on your 2nd or 3rd play through of the same thing though?
That could get kind of boring! (The main reason I'll skip something. I'll reread a book 4, 5 times, but usually not in the same WEEK.) I guess the main problem is that the most LIKELY reason you'd be replaying through the same thing is because you're doing it with somebody else who hasn't seen it before. Darn people playing content I've already done twice before!
I'm sure somewhere, there will be people demanding that everybody else in the group skip the dialogue as quickly as possible, and a 10-20 second time to hit the spacebar would be seen as grounds for removal from party.
I'll be disappointed in human nature if this isn't true!
I was thinking of it more from a single player RPG angle before, but I suppose it's true that having 4 players watching cutscenes totally changes the dynamic.
What if you're on your 2nd or 3rd play through of the same thing though?
That could get kind of boring! (The main reason I'll skip something. I'll reread a book 4, 5 times, but usually not in the same WEEK.) I guess the main problem is that the most LIKELY reason you'd be replaying through the same thing is because you're doing it with somebody else who hasn't seen it before. Darn people playing content I've already done twice before!
I'm sure somewhere, there will be people demanding that everybody else in the group skip the dialogue as quickly as possible, and a 10-20 second time to hit the spacebar would be seen as grounds for removal from party.
I'll be disappointed in human nature if this isn't true!
I was thinking of it more from a single player RPG angle before, but I suppose it's true that having 4 players watching cutscenes totally changes the dynamic.
Well, there are several aspects that SWTOR has that other MMO's don't have that can make leveling alts actually a more enjoyable experience than in other MMO's.
- you have 8 Classes with fully unique class story that isn't like that of other classes, making leveling an alt when you picked another class (which most ppl often do when picking a 2nd or 3rd character) be a fresher experience than in other MMO's
- your quest leveling experience actually changes depending on the choices you make. In contrast to other MMO's where you can only accept or abandon quests but you can't make decisions in them, in SWTOR it can happen that if you followed a roughly lightside path the 1st time and the 2nd time with that same class you pick a roughly darkside path, you can end up with a questing experience that's rigorously different for large parts of your leveling.
As for cutscenes, I played GW which had large cutscenes in the Missions you played, I haven't experienced once in the time that I played that I saw someone kicked out or people asking for someone to leave because of that they didn't skip the cutscene the second it was possible. But maybe I was lucky all that time
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
- you have 8 Classes with fully unique class story that isn't like that of other classes, making leveling an alt when you picked another class (which most ppl often do when picking a 2nd or 3rd character) be a fresher experience than in other MMO's
- your quest leveling experience actually changes depending on the choices you make. In contrast to other MMO's where you can only accept or abandon quests but you can't make decisions in them, in SWTOR it can happen that if you followed a roughly lightside path the 1st time and the 2nd time with that same class you pick a roughly darkside path, you can end up with a questing experience that's rigorously different for large parts of your leveling.
Actually, what often happens with me is I'll create a bunch of characters real fast, sort of sloppy play them to figure out what I like, then remake a character of the type I like.
So I'd be going through at least PART of the same story.
Though I probably wouldn't randomly press a number, it'd be more like (skip skip skip) Uhm... 2. (skip skip skip) Uhm.... 3. (skip skip skip skip) Uhhh... 1.
Given an FAQ, and people trying to speed/power level, you could remove all the 'uhms' and just be skipskipskip2skipskipskip3skipskipskipskip1. Why would people just blaze through choices without trying to find out what the optional choices are? Because there are things like the 'Darth' title that you can only get through certain paths. So maybe not the FIRST play through (For most people), but for people who want to be Darth-whatever with their alt, there might be some speedrunning.
So yeah, the fact that there's even people wondering if they can avoid the story suggests there will be people who will read FAQs and just blaze through that whole story.
I'd honestly prefer a choice where you can read text instead of hear voice most of the time anyway (I'm one of those weird people who would rather read a book than watch a movie, and in games I tend to prefer the text over the voice acting. I know! I'm a horrible person. Voice acting is wasted on a Philistine like me.), so I spend a lot of time in RPGs skipping the voice (And reading the text), then swearing and reloading a game when I skip TOO much and accidentally miss some bit of physical movement as opposed to just talking head stuff.
- you have 8 Classes with fully unique class story that isn't like that of other classes, making leveling an alt when you picked another class (which most ppl often do when picking a 2nd or 3rd character) be a fresher experience than in other MMO's
- your quest leveling experience actually changes depending on the choices you make. In contrast to other MMO's where you can only accept or abandon quests but you can't make decisions in them, in SWTOR it can happen that if you followed a roughly lightside path the 1st time and the 2nd time with that same class you pick a roughly darkside path, you can end up with a questing experience that's rigorously different for large parts of your leveling.
Actually, what often happens with me is I'll create a bunch of characters real fast, sort of sloppy play them to figure out what I like, then remake a character of the type I like.
So I'd be going through at least PART of the same story.
Though I probably wouldn't randomly press a number, it'd be more like (skip skip skip) Uhm... 2. (skip skip skip) Uhm.... 3. (skip skip skip skip) Uhhh... 1.
Given an FAQ, and people trying to speed/power level, you could remove all the 'uhms' and just be skipskipskip2skipskipskip3skipskipskipskip1. Why would people just blaze through choices without trying to find out what the optional choices are? Because there are things like the 'Darth' title that you can only get through certain paths. So maybe not the FIRST play through (For most people), but for people who want to be Darth-whatever with their alt, there might be some speedrunning.
So yeah, the fact that there's even people wondering if they can avoid the story suggests there will be people who will read FAQs and just blaze through that whole story.
I'd honestly prefer a choice where you can read text instead of hear voice most of the time anyway (I'm one of those weird people who would rather read a book than watch a movie, and in games I tend to prefer the text over the voice acting. I know! I'm a horrible person. Voice acting is wasted on a Philistine like me.), so I spend a lot of time in RPGs skipping the voice (And reading the text), then swearing and reloading a game when I skip TOO much and accidentally miss some bit of physical movement as opposed to just talking head stuff.
Well if your the type that prefers text over VO then they have that option as well. You can turn the Vo to text if you so wish.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
- you have 8 Classes with fully unique class story that isn't like that of other classes, making leveling an alt when you picked another class (which most ppl often do when picking a 2nd or 3rd character) be a fresher experience than in other MMO's
- your quest leveling experience actually changes depending on the choices you make. In contrast to other MMO's where you can only accept or abandon quests but you can't make decisions in them, in SWTOR it can happen that if you followed a roughly lightside path the 1st time and the 2nd time with that same class you pick a roughly darkside path, you can end up with a questing experience that's rigorously different for large parts of your leveling.
Actually, what often happens with me is I'll create a bunch of characters real fast, sort of sloppy play them to figure out what I like, then remake a character of the type I like.
So I'd be going through at least PART of the same story.
Though I probably wouldn't randomly press a number, it'd be more like (skip skip skip) Uhm... 2. (skip skip skip) Uhm.... 3. (skip skip skip skip) Uhhh... 1.
Given an FAQ, and people trying to speed/power level, you could remove all the 'uhms' and just be skipskipskip2skipskipskip3skipskipskipskip1. Why would people just blaze through choices without trying to find out what the optional choices are? Because there are things like the 'Darth' title that you can only get through certain paths. So maybe not the FIRST play through (For most people), but for people who want to be Darth-whatever with their alt, there might be some speedrunning.
So yeah, the fact that there's even people wondering if they can avoid the story suggests there will be people who will read FAQs and just blaze through that whole story.
I'd honestly prefer a choice where you can read text instead of hear voice most of the time anyway (I'm one of those weird people who would rather read a book than watch a movie, and in games I tend to prefer the text over the voice acting. I know! I'm a horrible person. Voice acting is wasted on a Philistine like me.), so I spend a lot of time in RPGs skipping the voice (And reading the text), then swearing and reloading a game when I skip TOO much and accidentally miss some bit of physical movement as opposed to just talking head stuff.
Well if your the type that prefers text over VO then they have that option as well. You can turn the Vo to text if you so wish.
well think he just means a text box as opposed to reading subtitles since he wants to skip thru the scenes
- you have 8 Classes with fully unique class story that isn't like that of other classes, making leveling an alt when you picked another class (which most ppl often do when picking a 2nd or 3rd character) be a fresher experience than in other MMO's
- your quest leveling experience actually changes depending on the choices you make. In contrast to other MMO's where you can only accept or abandon quests but you can't make decisions in them, in SWTOR it can happen that if you followed a roughly lightside path the 1st time and the 2nd time with that same class you pick a roughly darkside path, you can end up with a questing experience that's rigorously different for large parts of your leveling.
Actually, what often happens with me is I'll create a bunch of characters real fast, sort of sloppy play them to figure out what I like, then remake a character of the type I like.
So I'd be going through at least PART of the same story.
Though I probably wouldn't randomly press a number, it'd be more like (skip skip skip) Uhm... 2. (skip skip skip) Uhm.... 3. (skip skip skip skip) Uhhh... 1.
Given an FAQ, and people trying to speed/power level, you could remove all the 'uhms' and just be skipskipskip2skipskipskip3skipskipskipskip1. Why would people just blaze through choices without trying to find out what the optional choices are? Because there are things like the 'Darth' title that you can only get through certain paths. So maybe not the FIRST play through (For most people), but for people who want to be Darth-whatever with their alt, there might be some speedrunning.
So yeah, the fact that there's even people wondering if they can avoid the story suggests there will be people who will read FAQs and just blaze through that whole story.
I'd honestly prefer a choice where you can read text instead of hear voice most of the time anyway (I'm one of those weird people who would rather read a book than watch a movie, and in games I tend to prefer the text over the voice acting. I know! I'm a horrible person. Voice acting is wasted on a Philistine like me.), so I spend a lot of time in RPGs skipping the voice (And reading the text), then swearing and reloading a game when I skip TOO much and accidentally miss some bit of physical movement as opposed to just talking head stuff.
You will be able to just read text if you want.
The option to activate subtitles is in the game. - Bioware
Don't know if that stops the VO, but I guess you can just turn down the voice in the options panel. I will play much different from you though. I want the VO and dialogue choices as intended in TOR. I don't plan on playing the same class twice though. Just once is fine. I will play alts for a new story though.
To each his/her own, but the story is my main reason to play TOR. The rest of the MMO features will be there for a very long time. No need to be the first to do everything then quit after 3 months. Just play the game as a game and do what comes naturally in a MMO. Running through an enjoyable leveling process for a change and grouping for the social aspect. Best of both worlds really, minus features for the sandbox crowd, but they know this by now.
Edit: To anwser the above. You can just skip through. The option to skip dialogue is in game by pressing the space bar- Darth Hater. But I don't know if the text will all be there to read with the subtitles on.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them? R.A.Salvatore
Comments
Protecting newbie areas is common. In Rift as a Guardian / Defiant, you can not enter the other introductory area because that area is in a different time. The story makes areas that you can not explore as part of the other faction. Aion is the same as well.
In WoW, they use level 90 guards to send you to the GY almost instantly around newbie zones. Getting the achievements for Gnomeagon is hard for high level horde because of this. I prefer the Rift / Aion method over the gy runs affecting gameplay.
I'm guessing you can't see the difference in a single player game where you are the only player in the game and a MMORPG where there will be hundreds of other players walking around knowing that you are a player of the other faction? In TOR your faction alignment is already set in stone, unlike with KOTOR where you didn't make your allegiance known until the end of the game. Here you make your faction choice at the very beginning of the game. So either deal with it or find something else to play.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
The way I see it, you just have over inflated sense of right and wrong here. They are making a perfectly simple and intelligent design decision and because YOU don't like it, then it must be wrong. Take a step back and you MIGHT see that the MMO vs SPG has a LOT of merit. I personally would like to see a story line or two that has you infiltrating the enemies lair (so to speak) but the game will not suffer for it if I can't.
Let's be honest though, with 4 Force Classes that can feel the presence of members of the "other side" it would make ABSOLUTELY no sense if they could infiltrate the other sides capital worlds. So that leaves 4 classes that might be able to pull it off and it they were allowed then we would have everyone whining that the force users could not do it too.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Does this also mean all MMO's from here forth should have 100% VO, if Bioware's formula pays off?
Bad lore really makes no sense in this respect as it's a different time period, as well as Biowares time period, they have complete authority in the end. Going to Koriban for instance could be fun but how the story is being told is significant in what sense it would make in going there. Would an American head into Nazi Germany to just stroll around in 1941?
A better example would be what was said about an American travelling to Russia at the height of the cold war?
In KOTOR your character is in charge of his alignment in a much different manner, as the whole purpose of the game is to dictate where you end up. That's not the case with TOR.
To me it seems the whole build up in story is going to be an escalation to all out war, to explain end game PVP and the scenarios that take place in "operations". Pure speculation on my part but the story starting off at a period of serious tension and half-hearted treaties seems to be the makings of such a tale.
You also have to consider future updates if the plan is to continue the story from where it intially ends.There may be battles (PVE or PVP) that take place on Koriban or other core worlds. You relly never know, there could even be a future option of PVP all over once the game becomes top heavy with little new customers.
Saying things are bad in regard to lore or lazy design is a bit pre-mature at this point. What's on the table could more than make up for any seeming limitations once we see all that is on offer.
I can think of 100 bad scenarios this game could pan out to fulfill, yet I could at the same time see 100 positive scenario's as well.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Dragon Age with lightsabers. Once maybe two go arounds and they'll be looking for something else to buy to keep them busy. Lets hope the journey is well worth the price of admission.
Worlds are just zones like any other mmo. If they are for level ranges and some are restricted by faction you will lose content. In a game like this though, there's little point in visiting the opposing factions areas as there are no quests for you there. All it means to me is dont expect to be able to go everywhere as one toon, just like other games of this type.
I dont really see what the huge deal is. In pretty much every MMO ever made where you have more than 1 side / faction there is a ton of content that is only available to 1 side or the other, such as quests, storylines, and yes even locations just like these planets.
The only difference here is that its called a planet, instead of a zone. You could easily swap the 2 and it would be just like any other MMO where only the good side has access to certain zones or cities, and the the same goes for the bad side.
I think its kind of funny though that youre complaining about "17.5%" of content being blocked, when in reality 50% of the content is blocked to the opposing side in pretty much every MMO. 1 side has quest chains suited to their side, and so doe sthe other. Whya rent you complaining that there are opposing sides and not everyone can access every quest and do every single thing at once with 1 character and its unfair you can only play 50% of the game.
@ Victor IMO it may be, it's hard to know for certain though.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
... wait, does this mean that there's no 'skip cutscene' button?
Because I abuse the hell out of that button in every RPG that lets me.
And it does have it: open world PvP as well as exploration, with planets that are each as large as the whole world in Rift, that sounds like quite some exploration options to me.
Even more, based upon information that the devs provided you now know where the limitations are regarding exploration a considerable time before the game launches, so you can include that in your decisionmaking whether the game is something you want to play or not. If you still decide to play, you already know what to expect when it comes to what is available of the whole of SWTOR when you play 1 faction.
Yes, it has open world PVP and exploration on the worlds THE DEVELOPERS LET YOU VISIT. And that's only just over eighty per cent of the planets. I mean, really? A bounty hunter can't visit Coruscant? I'm not talking about opening fire on the Chief Jedi, I'm talking abouit visiting the city for a damn drink. Nope. it can't be done. Oh,k and an Imperial Agent, the master of deception, infiltration and subterfuge? No, they can't do it either.
In lore terms, that's ridiculous - in gameplay terms, its unjustifiable. It just is. It's not a deal breaker for me but I was hoping that something this obvious was a given.
Sith empire faction cant visit Coruscant? I'll believe that when I see a dev quote.
from stephen reid after a community q&a update revealed some faction restricted planets:
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5209952#post5209952
Morsong's correct in this instance. Empire players cannot visit Coruscant. It is crawling with Republic forces, of course - who have their guards up after the assault on the planet.
There are other planets, though....
from what we have been told capital planets(coruscant, dormund kaas) and origin worlds(tython, ord mantell, korriban, and hutta) are faction resctricted
oh man, that is just straight up stupid. I can understand maybe some newbie starter zones and maybe a couple of cities.... but entire planets? i really hope that changes.
I'm pretty sure I've seen it stated a few times you can skip cutscenes.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
you can hit spacebar to skip lines of dialogue(but need to hit it every time someone speaks) but there is no skip everything because choices need to be made
Isn't it kinda silly to think you could bypass the story element since it is one of the highly tauted features?
In Bioware we trust!
They need a 'shift+spacebar' to skip you to the next choice you need to make.
Then you can just 'Shift+spacebar', click the first choice that pops up, repeat until done.
Congratulations, your story has been near-completely avoided.
I'd actually be annoyed at a game where you can't actually skip every single cutscene possible.
If you're really that concerned about being able to skip the story, then this simply isn't the right game for you.
PvP is another highly tauted feature in many games and you can usually bypass it.
If you wanted to, you could simply do the following
Click the NPC to start up the quest
Mash the space bar over and over again until you get to the point where the dialog wheel pops up
Select 1 on the keyboard command or whatever it is to select a option.
mash the space bar until the next wheel pops up
Rinse repeat until complete.
I don't recommend this method but you could do it that way if you so choose.
Provided of course your not in a group, in which case each dialog skip needs to be confirmed by each group member. Which is unlikely except if as a group you decided before hand you would skip all the dialog as each line would take about 10 to 20 seconds to say and it would take about that long for each person to get around to hitting the space bar.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
If I didn't care to give this whole VO/story thing in an mmo a go, I probably wouldn't be interested in this title. Considering how much effort and emphasis BW has put into that aspect of their game, it would seem like such a waste to just skip it all.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
What if you're on your 2nd or 3rd play through of the same thing though?
That could get kind of boring! (The main reason I'll skip something. I'll reread a book 4, 5 times, but usually not in the same WEEK.) I guess the main problem is that the most LIKELY reason you'd be replaying through the same thing is because you're doing it with somebody else who hasn't seen it before.
Darn people playing content I've already done twice before!
I'm sure somewhere, there will be people demanding that everybody else in the group skip the dialogue as quickly as possible, and a 10-20 second time to hit the spacebar would be seen as grounds for removal from party.
I'll be disappointed in human nature if this isn't true!
I was thinking of it more from a single player RPG angle before, but I suppose it's true that having 4 players watching cutscenes totally changes the dynamic.
Well, there are several aspects that SWTOR has that other MMO's don't have that can make leveling alts actually a more enjoyable experience than in other MMO's.
- you have 8 Classes with fully unique class story that isn't like that of other classes, making leveling an alt when you picked another class (which most ppl often do when picking a 2nd or 3rd character) be a fresher experience than in other MMO's
- your quest leveling experience actually changes depending on the choices you make. In contrast to other MMO's where you can only accept or abandon quests but you can't make decisions in them, in SWTOR it can happen that if you followed a roughly lightside path the 1st time and the 2nd time with that same class you pick a roughly darkside path, you can end up with a questing experience that's rigorously different for large parts of your leveling.
As for cutscenes, I played GW which had large cutscenes in the Missions you played, I haven't experienced once in the time that I played that I saw someone kicked out or people asking for someone to leave because of that they didn't skip the cutscene the second it was possible. But maybe I was lucky all that time
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Actually, what often happens with me is I'll create a bunch of characters real fast, sort of sloppy play them to figure out what I like, then remake a character of the type I like.
So I'd be going through at least PART of the same story.
Though I probably wouldn't randomly press a number, it'd be more like (skip skip skip) Uhm... 2. (skip skip skip) Uhm.... 3. (skip skip skip skip) Uhhh... 1.
Given an FAQ, and people trying to speed/power level, you could remove all the 'uhms' and just be skipskipskip2skipskipskip3skipskipskipskip1.
Why would people just blaze through choices without trying to find out what the optional choices are? Because there are things like the 'Darth' title that you can only get through certain paths. So maybe not the FIRST play through (For most people), but for people who want to be Darth-whatever with their alt, there might be some speedrunning.
So yeah, the fact that there's even people wondering if they can avoid the story suggests there will be people who will read FAQs and just blaze through that whole story.
I'd honestly prefer a choice where you can read text instead of hear voice most of the time anyway (I'm one of those weird people who would rather read a book than watch a movie, and in games I tend to prefer the text over the voice acting. I know! I'm a horrible person. Voice acting is wasted on a Philistine like me.), so I spend a lot of time in RPGs skipping the voice (And reading the text), then swearing and reloading a game when I skip TOO much and accidentally miss some bit of physical movement as opposed to just talking head stuff.
Well if your the type that prefers text over VO then they have that option as well. You can turn the Vo to text if you so wish.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
well think he just means a text box as opposed to reading subtitles since he wants to skip thru the scenes
You will be able to just read text if you want.
The option to activate subtitles is in the game. - Bioware
Don't know if that stops the VO, but I guess you can just turn down the voice in the options panel. I will play much different from you though. I want the VO and dialogue choices as intended in TOR. I don't plan on playing the same class twice though. Just once is fine. I will play alts for a new story though.
To each his/her own, but the story is my main reason to play TOR. The rest of the MMO features will be there for a very long time. No need to be the first to do everything then quit after 3 months. Just play the game as a game and do what comes naturally in a MMO. Running through an enjoyable leveling process for a change and grouping for the social aspect. Best of both worlds really, minus features for the sandbox crowd, but they know this by now.
Edit: To anwser the above. You can just skip through. The option to skip dialogue is in game by pressing the space bar- Darth Hater. But I don't know if the text will all be there to read with the subtitles on.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore