At the point where your character development depends largely on the point when you have no choice but to do the same thing over and over. In most cases it is for loot, because your at the level cap and loot is the only way to further develope your toon meaningfully.
This is largely 1 of the reason I have always prefered sandbox games, because it is much less common in those for your characters developlemt to just stop.
for me its currently every single themepark MMO in existence. Its like within 10 mins after logging in I see the same boring shnazz from level 1 to level cap. Pointless hand holding quests and at the end switch gears and run the same boring dungeon for gear to do the same boring raid. Its why I quit doing it, WoW burned me out of the whole themepark game and Rift just reinforced the notion that I want soemthing better from my game. Luckily I still have the goold old Asherons Call to fall back on, after 11 years I still dont get bored when I log in and play.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
For me its when leveling comes to a slow pace and you end up grinding both quests and mobs just to get to the next level and spending hours doing so. Though I have to say, those games that don't have enough content and quests to level are the worse grinds, spending hours just killing mobs ain't fun!
When the fun of doing whatever it takes to level up wears off, if i'm having fun it nevers feel like a grind. However, if I'm having absolutely no fun anymore then it feels like a huge grind.
Karasu Linkshell for Final fantasy 14 now accepting all members! Just head on over to karasuls.shivtr.com and apply now! Linkshell info is on the site.
Grinding as a term pre-2004 was fine for me because it was always optional to game play which offer greater freedom. For instance it's up to you whether to grind or not and which spot? crafting or PvEing? it's your choice.
But then a bastard child was born. Quest Solo Grinds. The problems with this type of grinding are disasterous for various reasons.
1. It forces you to Solo
2. It restricts your gaming session through pre-defined paths (you're set on rails)
3. It consist of running 50% of the time (do a questing session and observe the time you spent while running and not playing)... running 50% of the time is not fun.
4. It introduced a package of problems (it killed Exploration, it trivialized game lore, it killed immersion, it destroyed the idea of you being in a world to you being hand hold and spoon fed the content whether you like it or not)
5. You have no choice whether to grind them or not. Some quests are important to your character progression. So this type of Quest Grind is mandatory not optional.
I complained before about "Grinding" but I never thought it to be as game breaking as the last 7 years when I played Quest Grinding MMORPGs like WoW and Rift. THAT type of grinding is wrong for the reasons mentioned above.
When: Lack/limit of game interaction with the mmorpg world and players > gameplay options
Currently only play Pocket Legends atm, as it's quick feedback when you run a few dungeons and attempt a few things, chat with players and call it a day (15mins). The lag between enjoyment and "ok had enough now" is very short so the grind remains low when played in short doses (at least that's how I find mmorpgs structured to be).
When there is lot to do, but no challenge behind it.
Meaning if I get some super hard mob thats really hard to beat, that is no grind. It can get frustrating, too, though. I only say AKANDE !!!
But if the developers just add a TON of mobs to kill (with no danger whatsoever) and all you have to do is kill, kill, kill, yawn, kill, yawn, kill, yawn, yawn, yawn ... then you're going to feel bored in amounts previously unconceiveable.
When I am doing something I do not enjoy just to level up. The process of doing things I don't enjoy is the grind. For most MMOs the grind starts as soon as you start the game because they are just not very fun to begin with and if you don't enjoy the basic gameplay everything you do becomes a slog.
All men think they're fascinating. In my case, it's justified
Pretty much when I have to resort to some sort of other entertainment while playing the game, then it's a grind. Basically when I have to turn on the tv or pop in a movie while playing, it is a grind. Or when people start resorting to bot programs to carry on the functions, it's a grind.
When the game stops being mentally stimulating or fun so level 2 in Rift & Warhammer, 30 in AOC, 65 in WoW, never in L2 or EQ2 or LotRO or EvE or Atlantica etc...... a bad game is a bad game and grind kicks in earlier because its a bad game.
Cal.
This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.
Any mmorpg with any kind of levelling, accumulation of pixels or skilling-up can be considered a grind.
Depends on the person but even if your enjoying the game, that doesn't make it any less of a grind.
A game with no progression, no levels, no accumulation of "points" or items or a leaderboard of any kind can't be a grind, repetitve play gains you nothing so the theory is you only play to have fun...but then where is the fun in that?
Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy
Comments
At the point where your character development depends largely on the point when you have no choice but to do the same thing over and over. In most cases it is for loot, because your at the level cap and loot is the only way to further develope your toon meaningfully.
This is largely 1 of the reason I have always prefered sandbox games, because it is much less common in those for your characters developlemt to just stop.
for me its currently every single themepark MMO in existence. Its like within 10 mins after logging in I see the same boring shnazz from level 1 to level cap. Pointless hand holding quests and at the end switch gears and run the same boring dungeon for gear to do the same boring raid. Its why I quit doing it, WoW burned me out of the whole themepark game and Rift just reinforced the notion that I want soemthing better from my game. Luckily I still have the goold old Asherons Call to fall back on, after 11 years I still dont get bored when I log in and play.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
For me its when leveling comes to a slow pace and you end up grinding both quests and mobs just to get to the next level and spending hours doing so. Though I have to say, those games that don't have enough content and quests to level are the worse grinds, spending hours just killing mobs ain't fun!
When the fun of doing whatever it takes to level up wears off, if i'm having fun it nevers feel like a grind. However, if I'm having absolutely no fun anymore then it feels like a huge grind.
Karasu Linkshell for Final fantasy 14 now accepting all members! Just head on over to karasuls.shivtr.com and apply now! Linkshell info is on the site.
Grinding as a term pre-2004 was fine for me because it was always optional to game play which offer greater freedom. For instance it's up to you whether to grind or not and which spot? crafting or PvEing? it's your choice.
But then a bastard child was born. Quest Solo Grinds. The problems with this type of grinding are disasterous for various reasons.
1. It forces you to Solo
2. It restricts your gaming session through pre-defined paths (you're set on rails)
3. It consist of running 50% of the time (do a questing session and observe the time you spent while running and not playing)... running 50% of the time is not fun.
4. It introduced a package of problems (it killed Exploration, it trivialized game lore, it killed immersion, it destroyed the idea of you being in a world to you being hand hold and spoon fed the content whether you like it or not)
5. You have no choice whether to grind them or not. Some quests are important to your character progression. So this type of Quest Grind is mandatory not optional.
I complained before about "Grinding" but I never thought it to be as game breaking as the last 7 years when I played Quest Grinding MMORPGs like WoW and Rift. THAT type of grinding is wrong for the reasons mentioned above.
At point where there are no enough quests to continue.
When: Lack/limit of game interaction with the mmorpg world and players > gameplay options
Currently only play Pocket Legends atm, as it's quick feedback when you run a few dungeons and attempt a few things, chat with players and call it a day (15mins). The lag between enjoyment and "ok had enough now" is very short so the grind remains low when played in short doses (at least that's how I find mmorpgs structured to be).
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
When there is lot to do, but no challenge behind it.
Meaning if I get some super hard mob thats really hard to beat, that is no grind. It can get frustrating, too, though. I only say AKANDE !!!
But if the developers just add a TON of mobs to kill (with no danger whatsoever) and all you have to do is kill, kill, kill, yawn, kill, yawn, kill, yawn, yawn, yawn ... then you're going to feel bored in amounts previously unconceiveable.
When I am doing something I do not enjoy just to level up. The process of doing things I don't enjoy is the grind. For most MMOs the grind starts as soon as you start the game because they are just not very fun to begin with and if you don't enjoy the basic gameplay everything you do becomes a slog.
All men think they're fascinating. In my case, it's justified
In general at the point where i start loosing interest in the stories and environment and get totally focused on gear and stats...
Thats when the fun is gone and the grind starts.... and when i notice it happened again, its to late...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
MMO's becomes a grind at level 2.
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
Well.. since Everquest, at around level 4-5, over ten years ago. And i quit Everquest at lvl 6.
Pretty much when I have to resort to some sort of other entertainment while playing the game, then it's a grind. Basically when I have to turn on the tv or pop in a movie while playing, it is a grind. Or when people start resorting to bot programs to carry on the functions, it's a grind.
When the game stops being mentally stimulating or fun so level 2 in Rift & Warhammer, 30 in AOC, 65 in WoW, never in L2 or EQ2 or LotRO or EvE or Atlantica etc...... a bad game is a bad game and grind kicks in earlier because its a bad game.
Cal.
This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.
Any mmorpg with any kind of levelling, accumulation of pixels or skilling-up can be considered a grind.
Depends on the person but even if your enjoying the game, that doesn't make it any less of a grind.
A game with no progression, no levels, no accumulation of "points" or items or a leaderboard of any kind can't be a grind, repetitve play gains you nothing so the theory is you only play to have fun...but then where is the fun in that?
Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy
For me, it happens very quickly, it's when you get less a 1% of your level for killing some thing!
No reward for effort = no desire to play!