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If Cryptic had made this game,,,
Vesavius
Member RarePosts: 7,908
... and they could have with their engine, easily, wouuld you all be loving it or hating it?
How much does the Bioware brand carry for you guys in terms of your perception for it?
This game could have been, lets be honest, made as a Champions mod anmd probably have saved BW £100 mill or so in dev costs... The question is would it have attracted the 'passionate' support and following if it had been, and would folks have been so accepting of it's model?
My view btw is Champions meets Mass effect, they fall in love and have a baby.
Comments
Generally? No, and it's not because of cryptic.
It's because I happen to love the way Bioware does their stories and their choice system.
Now If the game had (has? dunno yet) the character customization of cryptics games, with everything else being Biowar made that would be a match made in heaven for me. However just to have Bioware step out all together would mean me stepping out all together. Cryptic makes games i like. Bioware makes games I love.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Hm.... i dont think LucasArt would of ever given the franchise of StarWars to Cryptic...
I didnt try Champion Online myself (waiting on bandwith Renewal) , to download it
but Star Trek online, wasnt that much of a Big hit... Specially for an IP as big as Star Trek...
Also Bioware already as quite a few Great RPG who sold tons of copies with the StarWars IP...
Im more Confident in Bioware Ways of making a game, than Cryptic.
Only Release and a year into game will tell us.
I personally am Interested in The Story Lines of SWTOR by BioWare, specially since i can play them "co-op" with my friends.
Let's be honest, you sound like someone who doesn't know what the heck he's talking about when it comes to SWTOR if you say that it's like a CO mod, just another themepark hater cq hardcore sandbox fan, imo of course
If I have to make a comparison, then it's like KOTOR meets WoW or LotrO: SW a la KOTOR with the branching questing structure that goes with it, paired to huge wide open worlds and amounts of content that equal and surpass all other themepark MMO's.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
If it was made by CRAPTIC I wouldn`t touch it with a 10 foot barge pole.
We would have half the game we see shaping up today and more stuff in the item shop than in the game.
I`m sure that the story wouldn`t be there either.
NO WAY NO THANKS!
Played WOW (5 years), AOC, AO, EQ2,AC2, Horizons, Saga of Ryzom, SWG, CO, STO(Beta),ROM, Allods, and many other F2P titles. Asl been in beta for many of the main titles and played countless SP games. I have been gaming for 15+ years!
If cryptic made this, using their engine and everything. It would be a instanced pile of crap steaming from the depths of the bargain box. star trek online came out like what, last year? it's already 10 bucks. Champions is Free to play now. This game would be even more of a 'I'll pass' if cryptic made it.
I have nothing against Cryptic myself, but I also do not have a lot of faith in there ability to make an MMO that I can like. So far they are at a zero percentage for me.
I do have to say though, you come accross as rather ill informed on this game if you think BioWare could have save 100 million on this game by using a Cryptic Engine. Especially since the last figures on the cost for this game I saw was 80 - 120 million (USD).
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
It would be similiar to star trek online I believe, only on a grander scale. It probably would have been released by now, earlier in the year perhaps, way too early, with too many bugs and unfinished and missing content.
And just like STO, there would be people (such as those who buy lifetime subs just because of the name, in this case "star wars") who defend the game and take it too personally even though the problems are right there, if anything, they hinder the development and progress of a game by ignoring problems or attacking those that try to address those issues. In short, I believe the game would have been a huge failure.
You have no idea what I know or don't know about this game, so leave your assumtptions at the door.
There is nothing in this game that the Cryptic engine couldnt have been used for, and nothing it does better then the Cryptic engine. Thats the point of the OP.
Look, I have told you a million times, which you constantly ignore, that I do NOT hate themeparks. FFS. Try and absorb some info as well as spouting it out now and again. What I have posted here has nothing to do with themepark vs sandbox. The way that you constantly project your own meanings on to what others say is irritating, to say the least. Please do not do it.
The stories and chocie system isnt a engine thing though right?
It was the stories ect that were the ME part of the marriage, the gameplay beyond that is extremely Cryptic (CoH/ CO).
If Cryptic had made this game I most likely would not be intrested in SW:Tor.
I love Bioware games that have made and released, SW:ToR remains to be seen if my love for them carry's one.
Cryptic never gave me the gaming experiance I wanted from a MMORPG. While I have tried them to atleast have the experiance to know their games aint for me, which is a shame since I both love Superhero's and Star Trek.
But I don't think you could compare SW:ToR as being or could be a Champions mod, that would mean that you havn't read or watch anything about SW:Tor. But if you feel that way then please explain in what way you meant it.....
In the red... No it wouldnt. It just means I see what you refuse to because you like BW and don't like Cryptic, and don't want to negative connetations (according the popular way of thinking) of the similarities to be recognised.
I repeat, there is nothing in SWToR that the Cryptic engine couldnt have handled.
Once you get past the SW skin, and the story telling aspect (both of which can be modded in), SWToR obviously plays very much like a Cryptic game.
Hey, you were the one saying that SWTOR resembles CO, if that's your take then you're either biased or seriously misinformed. You could as well say, 'if Cryptic had made ArcheAge or GW2 using the Cryptic engine...' etc.
Just answer a simple question, do you intend to play SWTOR, or do you not and do you in fact dislike SWTOR for what it is?
As for the Cryptic engine, I don't know what its limitations are. I did see what's possible with the Hero Engine though in the demo videos. If the Cryptic engine can handle contiguous areas minimally as large as Rift's world with no loading screens between instances and open world, then sure, it might have been an option as well as engine, I guess.
Wouldn't matter a lot for the 80-120 million dollar though: I'd guess that a lot of that went into producing the questing/leveling content and 17 planets that together are larger than any other themepark MMO.
For the rest the OP read as just another 'I don't like SWTOR and that's why I compare with a crappy other MMO company that I dislike' thread. Which gets annoying, a lot. So please try to show less of your bias against SWTOR next times, at least less than former post(s).
CO uses no classes, you can pick your skills however you like. CO uses blocking where if you don't you'd get seriously hurt. CO uses all kinds of flying means that your character can do. Those are just a few very significant things that CO has that other MMO's don't. Which makes SWTOR's gameplay come closer to a LotrO or WoW than a CO.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Are you serious? it would be an instanced mess half finished at lauch with a online store that sells weapons and other stuff so full it could be half a game.
the 2 games are so far apart its unreall and i guess you would have to be a really big cryptic fanboy to not see that lol.
Okay so i'm confused then, I was thinking you were saying that if Crytpic took a shot at making the game using their engine. In which case like i stated i prefer the way Bioware does their story telling. Crptic is well known for their character customization. Not their story telling (this goes along with character development, presentation and basically everything that goes into telling a story, not just the words). They said so themselves btw so this isn't just my perception.
They went along the lines of. This company is known for this, that company is known for that, we are known for our character customization.
Now if you were talking about Bioware using cryptics engine, that would depend on what engine you could use. I don't know what engine Crytpic uses but what i do know is what engine Bioware is using.
Which is the Hero engine
The hero engine allows for character morphing (they need this for their dark/light allignement system changes), drop in content without needing to disconnect the server (which means they can patch content in while the player is playing) and a bunch others.
I'm not sure the cryptic engine (whatever it is) can do things like that. Is the cryptic engine specifically designed for MMOs? cause the hero engine is specifically designed for that.
It would depend on who is making the content for me really, not so much the engine, I'm going to be honest, it doesn't bother me what engine it uses, the only requirement it's gotta fill is to be able to work smoothly while i'm playing the game. It's the conents of the game that i'm more interested in. Can the developer with the tools available make a fun immersive game, and frankly i feel Bioware has a better shot at that then cryptic.
I suppose for this game you "could" use the engine but i'm not sure, because i don't know what crytpics engine is able to do. Maybe that engine can't handle the content Bioware wants to put in. I'll take a look later and see what cryptics engine for Co can do. However i have a strange feeling it's better suited to comic style artwork then stylized realism. LIke i said i'd need to know what the engine capabilities are for the ones crytpic is using and whether they'd work for the content intended.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Only one response to this really..
Why?
Why would they use Cryptics engine when there is no need?
Why would they build on something that has failed?
Also.. Your asking if it would be better if Cryptic made the game.. Not a colabiration for Bioware/Cryptic.. So it would be a completely different game and I am afraid after the STO fiasko it would not have nearly as many people looking at it as it does now..
Remember there are three factors drawing people in here..
If cryptic made the game it would lose not only the Bioware fan base but the large group of MMO players who just cant cope with how they make games now..
Star Wars (Obvious huge fanbase).
Bioware (Have a huge fan base of NON MMO Players)
and then the smallest of those categories the MMO players themselves.. Notice I say that WE the MMO crowd is the smallest segment of that group.. Cause really if you think about it.. We are..
What are you talking about? You were talking about replacing the Hero engine for the Cryptic engine to use for development, not about building an engine from scratch: BW didn't build the Hero engine themselves, you know, they licensed it. Do you have ANY idea what costs go into development besides the engine?
Because it sounds to me that you're completely clueless about what goes into development of MMO's, if you think that most of SWTOR's budget was used for the engine.
edit: I reread the OP, and to answer questions I didn't reply on before. Cryptic doesn't have the track record nor the quality/storytelling level that I've come to expect from Bioware. So, of course BW's name and reputation makes a difference. BW made a very good SW game that captured the SW atmosphere, Cryptic hasn't and they botched another large IP, namely Star Trek. So no, even if I liked CO a lot as a little side MMO, I wouldn't trust them that easily with a SW franchise.
Turbine would already be better, but still it wouldn't be Bioware, and I would doubt whether they'd manage to get their VO/cinematic story questing right for their version of a SW MMO, which BW is very good at.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
If cryptic made the game it would have been released and dead now .
Bioware brand lost its meaning for me after EA bought Bioware
I hate cryptics game engine so I would not be liking it at all.
If Cryptic had made the game, it would launch with about 25% of the content that BW's put in, 1000% more bugs, and would probably contain mostly 'game-changing innovations' that turned out to be unworkable and stupid.
That's just going off Cryptic's previous record.
The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: Be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
-Elbert Hubbard
Cryptic is going to be one of those companies that EA will buy soon just to fade it out of existence, but if Cryptic did get to make ST:TOR it would be dead before it hit the store selves. cryptic just sucks
Evil will always triumph because good is dumb....
In my eye cryptic have manage to make one semi good mmo and that was city of heroes while i playd it on off for a while i realy got bored of it fast every time.
I dont know if its the cryptic engine or the cryptic dev that is the fault but one of the 2 for sure cant make fun games.
I would get more value of my money if i light em on fire then buying a cryptic game(harsh i know but stil true)
Cryptic is currently raping Neverwinter Nights. Cryptic even looking in the general direction of NN should be illegal.
If cryptic had made this game, then then it would experience the exact same fate as Champions Online and STO and soon NeverWinter.
underachieved, rushed and pinned with extreme scrutiny
lets start with underachieved:
its known that Cryptics development philosophy is to churn out mmo's two years or less, a proposal that atari seemed plausible for the suits to be happy about, fast dev time, fast profits. unfortunately, quality and the appreciation of the IP is sacrificed.
Rushed:
STO is prime example of that, beta filled with bugs, with launch being nothing more a 8 month span of extra beta testing for subscribers and lifers. in addition, the Term "Champions Online with StarWars Skin" would apply automatically due to the favored engine cryptic uses for their development formula.
Extreme Scrutiny:
This speaks for itself. A Giant IP with a plethora of roles,lore,playstyles of all kinds, condensed into a form of instanced rooms and a narrow,unremarkable path of progression. such elements are negatively magnified by the any IP's big reputation and zealot fans that follow them.
In closing, this is exactly what youd expect if Cryptic were to make SWTOR, and its end result that follows.
Closet example being the quietly forgotten Star Wars Clone Adventures mmo. simply made to be made; nothing more.