The Star Wars universe in general is not theme park hold me by the hand universe.
Do you make a habit out of posting vague one-liners or would you like to explain further?
Now I haven't seen the Star Wars movies in some time, but I do seem to recall them being pretty themeparkish. Every step of the way each character always had a main goal in mind and would occasionly get sidetracked by side quests. There was never much in the way of exploration like say in Star Trek as the galaxy for the most part had been already explored and mapped out even in the Old Republic era.
I would even be willing to say SWG was even more far away from what Star Wars is then SWTOR looks to be if we are to go by the movies as I have limited knowledge of the EU.
Those who know my posts know that I am a very big critic of SWTOR. AND I am a huge SWG fan. Or ex-fan of how it was, rather. And still I say: give TOR a chance! Let us try it out with open mind and see how it is.
A boycott for said reasons of the OP is in a way emotionally understandable. But I don't see it leads anywhere. Yes, TOR isn't SWG, and for many reasons that's a pity. But maybe it is still fun. I say give it a chance and see how it all plays out. No one is forcing you. I say, I respect anyone who says, what LucasArts did with SWG was so shameful I boycott SWTOR. Really, I can understand you can come to that point. But I don't.
Keep in mind, a MMO is first and foremost a GAME, a sort of relaxation and escapism. It's NOT a political party or a religion. So in the end of the day, it is either fun or it isn't. End of story.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Just a question OP, is it your blog and you are looking for some hits?
I dont see a whole lot of information, so I'm not sure I'd call it informative. What I do see is a lot of tin foil hat ranting, and its all pretty much opinion, I'm not sure facts would support all of it.
Hey, to each his own, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, if I want a decent blog, I'll read this:
I get more factual info, plus when he does a creative piece like "Why Sith Are More Interesting than the Republic." It doesnt come off as a rant.
Like I said, it's just a matter of opinion and taste.
I agree, to each his own. I read some of the entries in your link and he' clearly a SWTOR lover
One thing I disagree and agree with him is on this:
"The Old Republic isn’t presenting itself as something it isn’t. It isn’t revolutionizing the genre, it isn’t going to be an MMOFPS, it isn’t going to break ground with a new combat system (like AoC set out to do), but it is taking the absolute best it could find from the current generation, adding its own twist, and making the end result its very own."
I disagree that they are not presenting it as something it isn't, cause they are preseting as more than it is. I don't mind it so much because they run a big company marketing machine so this is expected...I do agree on the rest, it's like Rift but with a bigger budget and of course a different "twist". I hate the fact that many SWTOR fans(specially in this forums) can't just love it for what it is and instead label it as a "genre changer" or "revolutionary"
Well Kuppa. I do think I will love it for what it is AND it does appear to be a genre changer as well. A fully Voiced MMO is a game changer as is the shear size of this game at launch. Those might not be "Huge!", but they will affect what other companies do in the future if this game is very successful. If it is not a huge success though, it will have very little affect on the MMO scene and that is fine by me as well. Diversity breeds competition, competition breeds improvement (normally), and improvements mean a better gaming environment for all of us.
Personally though, I think BOTH bloggers should be taken as nothing more than what they are. People with way to much time on their hands (like many of us on these forums . . . yes, me too) and should be taken with a grain of salt. As usual I try to look at a wide variety of "reviews" from people who have played the game and try to get a general impression based on that. So far, all things point to positive in the overall.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Those who know my posts know that I am a very big critic of SWTOR. AND I am a huge SWG fan. Or ex-fan of how it was, rather. And still I say: give TOR a chance! Let us try it out with open mind and see how it is.
A boycott for said reasons of the OP is in a way emotionally understandable. But I don't see it leads anywhere. Yes, TOR isn't SWG, and for many reasons that's a pity. But maybe it is still fun. I say give it a chance and see how it all plays out. No one is forcing you. I say, I respect anyone who says, what LucasArts did with SWG was so shameful I boycott SWTOR. Really, I can understand you can come to that point. But I don't.
Keep in mind, a MMO is first and foremost a GAME, a sort of relaxation and escapism. It's NOT a political party or a religion. So in the end of the day, it is either fun or it isn't. End of story.
Well said Elikal. Something tells me that guy won't listen, but still well said.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Let us try it out with open mind and see how it is.
A boycott for said reasons of the OP is in a way emotionally understandable. But I don't see it leads anywhere. Yes, TOR isn't SWG, and for many reasons that's a pity. But maybe it is still fun. I say give it a chance and see how it all plays out. No one is forcing you. I say, I respect anyone who says, what LucasArts did with SWG was so shameful I boycott SWTOR. Really, I can understand you can come to that point. But I don't.
Keep in mind, a MMO is first and foremost a GAME, a sort of relaxation and escapism. It's NOT a political party or a religion. So in the end of the day, it is either fun or it isn't. End of story.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Well when you think about it Star Wars has never been about linear gameplay until Bioware got a hold of it. It was always about player choice and choosing your own destiny/fate. Alot of it had to do with you as a player shaping the world. I can see where he is coming from but that is not going to stop people from liking "hold me by the hand" mmos.
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Well when you think about it Star Wars has never been about linear gameplay until Bioware got a hold of it. It was always about player choice and choosing your own destiny/fate. Alot of it had to do with you as a player shaping the world. I can see where he is coming from but that is not going to stop people from liking "hold me by the hand" mmos.
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
Sometimes I wonder if I am the only VET who actually read the many complaints back at pre-cu.
So many topics about Jedi being to hard/harsh.
So many topics about lack of content/directions/handholding.
So many topics about to much reading, yet what most only seem to remember is quote's that Nancy McIntyre placed which was a direct result of what we all could read by forumposter who have said what she only quoted.
So many topics about to much choices/classes/skills.
So many topics about it not being Star Wars.
Yet all I see VETS saying that they where suprised by the change, did I wanted such a hugh change?, by far I didn't, I wanted fixes/polish, but I wasn't blind to see that even though I was part of the small minority that loved the pre-cu game, our voices wern't as loud as those who did wanted change.
The NGE was the last drop, but before that even before the CU we saw so many people leave the game and for new commers the game might have been to complex for them to stay and learn. Cause the common player doesn´t seem willing to truly learn a game, they want to jump right into the action and SWG didn´t provided that for the impatient type of player who couldn´t look at the game for what it had to offer but like with most MMORPGT that only have a limited view and feel if a singleplayer game can look and play that good they lack the understanding that a MMORPG is a complete different beast.
But overall the loudest in the gaming community have won time and time again, else we wouldn´t have seen much more limited type of MMO´s on the market, cause that´s what the majority of people now into this genre seem to want, and yes a tiny minority now chooses to be loud.
I loved SWG and still to today I havn't found a match with the depth of the game despite it's flaws and issue's, I am just more forgiven towards games that big and enjoyed every minute of it, no MMORPG has even come close to the experiance, the content, the freedom, the ingame community SWG gave me and others around me.
But to boycot a piece of entertainment where people-gamers have a choice in playing is rather silly and shows a lvl of immaturity that I wouldn´t expect from former SWG fans, but then again forums like this have shown me how limited some people think. Sorry.....
The Star Wars universe in general is not theme park hold me by the hand universe.
The "star wars universe in general" is a collection of linear stories that guide you from start to finish.
Edit- OP, what is informative about yet another SWG vet blaming the world for losing their game? It was the same SWG vets who bitched and moaned daily, threw hissy fits and constantly compalined about most aspects of the game in the general discussion long before there was an NGE.
I'm a SWG vet just look at my join day here, does it coincide with anything that happened to SWG? Do you think it's a coincidence I joined on that date?
It wasn't only SOE who wasn't just happy with what they had, I'm sick of that never being discussed.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
Some might like this or that game, but the general consensus (maybe not by you though, true) is that KOTOR is one of the best Star Wars games that have been produced, and to a lot of people it's in their Top 3 SW games if not the best SW game they have played.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Well when you think about it Star Wars has never been about linear gameplay until Bioware got a hold of it. It was always about player choice and choosing your own destiny/fate. Alot of it had to do with you as a player shaping the world. I can see where he is coming from but that is not going to stop people from liking "hold me by the hand" mmos.
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
Outcast and Jedi Academy developed by Raven Software are probably my favorite Star Wars games.
But I am inclined to believe that there are way more horrible Star Wars games compared to the ones that were actually good, though I guess we would just be arguing opinions on whats a good SW game and what the bad ones were.
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
Some might like this or that game, but the general consensus (maybe not by you though, true) is that KOTOR is one of the best Star Wars games that have been produced, and to a lot of people it's in their Top 3 SW games if not the best SW game they have played.
I think you missed the point. He basically said that there was some sort of turning point in the quality of Star Wars games once Bioware made theirs. It was also worded in a way that makes it seem like he's saying that Bioware has made a few Star Wars games.
1) Bioware so far has only made one Star Wars game (TOR is still in development so that doesn't count).
2) There are plenty of great Star Wars games that were out before Kotor and crap Star Wars games are stilled made even after Kotor (general consensus seems to be that Force Unleashed 2 was crap). It doesn't matter how great Kotor was, it doesn't mean that all of a sudden the state of quality of Star Wars games being made went up. Kotor was just a drop in the lake that is Star Wars games.
Well when you think about it Star Wars has never been about linear gameplay until Bioware got a hold of it. It was always about player choice and choosing your own destiny/fate. Alot of it had to do with you as a player shaping the world. I can see where he is coming from but that is not going to stop people from liking "hold me by the hand" mmos.
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
While there are a few SW games I like, I think what the guy said was accurate, it is rare for the IP to be given justice in a VG setting.
The SNES series was okay back when I was a kid, The X-wing Tie fighter series, and the Jedi KNight series was okay. Was never into BF or Republic Commandos. I also like Empire at War. None of these games IMO captured the feeling of the IP better than KOTOR did though.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
I think you missed the point.
I didn't miss his point, I just interpreted it differently.
He says good SW games were rare before KOTOR, which is true (depending on what you classify as good, admittedly).
He implies that KOTOR jumped out enough to be considered a good game, better than most preceding SW games, which to most of the gamer public is also true.
He also seems to imply that after BW's KOTOR more good SW games followed, which is his opinion, and one that I personally disagree with, but to each his own taste. Sure, KOTOR 1 and 2 were good games and SWG as well in its own way, but there have also been bad SW games afterwards.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
Some might like this or that game, but the general consensus (maybe not by you though, true) is that KOTOR is one of the best Star Wars games that have been produced, and to a lot of people it's in their Top 3 SW games if not the best SW game they have played.
I think you missed the point. He basically said that there was some sort of turning point in the quality of Star Wars games once Bioware made theirs. It was also worded in a way that makes it seem like he's saying that Bioware has made a few Star Wars games.
1) Bioware so far has only made one Star Wars game (TOR is still in development so that doesn't count).
2) There are plenty of great Star Wars games that were out before Kotor and crap Star Wars games are stilled made even after Kotor (general consensus seems to be that Force Unleashed 2 was crap). It doesn't matter how great Kotor was, it doesn't mean that all of a sudden the state of quality of Star Wars games being made went up. Kotor was just a drop in the lake that is Star Wars games.
Nope, I said it was rarely capable of producing a good game prior to Bioware. Of the dozens and dozens of StarWars games, there is only a handful that where good prior to Bioware...and they were space fighter games. Bioware's first shot turned out to be probably the best SW games ever (by consensus anyway).
It's success also opened the door to KOTOR 2 Battlefront 2, the Lego games, and the Unleashed games. All where pretty decent games, although the Unleashed series is disappointing considering its potential.
On top of that. W/out Bioware's success in KOTOR, we wouldn't even be on this forum now talking about SWTOR.
Haha wow, I remember that title from somewhere....ooohhh yea... I remember now *nudges Whilan* Remind you of anything?
This is hilarious.
haha yeah i do remember this, however mine was a preview this is a guy ranting about it not being SWG 2 and somehow that means you should boycott ToR.
The one i found was also someone who was giving impressions, this one is just giving their opinion.
Third mine didn't have any conspiricy theories this one does.
Plus most of the one i posted did indeed surround itself in facts or opinions and was only incorrect on one or maybe two areas. Whereas this one seems more like he just doesn't like the game.
Still yeah i can see the imititation with the title. You know what they say about that. Imitation is the greatest form of flattery, guess i'm a trend setter here ;P
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Interesting or pathetic? Because all I'm hearing is the atypical disenfranchsed SWG vet reject with a "hate every game since Wow" complex, and with a little tinfoil hatted conspiracy theorist thrown in. It is amazing how long some people can carry such a deep and vicious grudge over what was at best a half assed and broken SW rip off game to begin with.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
While the blogger gets the "NGE 2.0" part correct concerning TOR, his rose colored glasses of SWG PreCU are clearly affecting his vision. PreCU had a ton of problems. The shoddy combat system drove plenty of people away, there were bugs all over the game, and even the people who stuck around complained of all the issues that the game had. If SOE had left the game as was, SWG would have shut down long before Dec. 15, 2011. Had SOE and LA given the CU more of a chance, they would likely have been better off, but they instead decided to push a major change to the game, that was nowhere near complete, and that no one in the player community wanted.
The mistake that SOE and LA made was that they incorrectly assumed that players wanted the full WoW experience: the combat system, the role system, gear grinds, etc., etc. The fact is, the SWG community just wanted the bugs fixed and the kind of structured, storied content that was there in abundance with WoW and other games, but missing from SWG. The problem with SWG's sandbox approach was that there were incredible, vast, open worlds to see, but very little incentive to explore them. There was no established reason to attack the sandpeople at Fort Tusken, yet if you were going into the DWB with a group, you knew it was to craft a Mandalorian armor piece. There was a story and an established objective to doing it. This type of content was lacking in SWG from day one, and will still be one of the reasons listed as to why it failed when the game closes. There just wasn't enough Star Wars story and content to keep people interested in SWG. In the last couple of years, great inroads were made in fixing this problem, but it was clearly too little, too late.
With TOR, the same logic has been used. The major difference between the NGE and SW:TOR, is that BioWare is implementing this system from the beginning, not trying to force it into the game, half-assed, two years after launch. Now, if you enjoy the WoW experience, then clearly you will enjoy TOR. If you don't enjoy this game style, or are already playing WoW and see no reason to start all over again playing essentially the same game, then you most likely won't find TOR appealing. I personally think that the approach to content in WoW is fine, but the rest of the game is complete trash, and there is no reason for me to play TOR when I already know that I detest what the game offers.
There is no way in hell that TOR will only have 150k subs by the end of the first year. That's pathetically wishful thinking on the part of the blogger. Financially, TOR will ultimately turn a profit for EA, it just won't be the next king of the MMO realm. A one-gamer "boycott" of TOR isn't going to change that, but both EA and LucasArts will notice how fast or slow they are seeing the return on their immense investment pour in. If the game fails to generate an impressive following despite the amount of hype and financial backing it has, it'll be very interesting to see how long it takes EA to shift into damage control mode.
While the blogger gets the "NGE 2.0" part correct concerning TOR, his rose colored glasses of SWG PreCU are clearly affecting his vision. PreCU had a ton of problems. The shoddy combat system drove plenty of people away, there were bugs all over the game, and even the people who stuck around complained of all the issues that the game had. If SOE had left the game as was, SWG would have shut down long before Dec. 15, 2011. Had SOE and LA given the CU more of a chance, they would likely have been better off, but they instead decided to push a major change to the game, that was nowhere near complete, and that no one in the player community wanted.
The mistake that SOE and LA made was that they incorrectly assumed that players wanted the full WoW experience: the combat system, the role system, gear grinds, etc., etc. The fact is, the SWG community just wanted the bugs fixed and the kind of structured, storied content that was there in abundance with WoW and other games, but missing from SWG. The problem with SWG's sandbox approach was that there were incredible, vast, open worlds to see, but very little incentive to explore them. There was no established reason to attack the sandpeople at Fort Tusken, yet if you were going into the DWB with a group, you knew it was to craft a Mandalorian armor piece. There was a story and an established objective to doing it. This type of content was lacking in SWG from day one, and will still be one of the reasons listed as to why it failed when the game closes. There just wasn't enough Star Wars story and content to keep people interested in SWG. In the last couple of years, great inroads were made in fixing this problem, but it was clearly too little, too late.
With TOR, the same logic has been used. The major difference between the NGE and SW:TOR, is that BioWare is implementing this system from the beginning, not trying to force it into the game, half-assed, two years after launch. Now, if you enjoy the WoW experience, then clearly you will enjoy TOR. If you don't enjoy this game style, or are already playing WoW and see no reason to start all over again playing essentially the same game, then you most likely won't find TOR appealing. I personally think that the approach to content in WoW is fine, but the rest of the game is complete trash, and there is no reason for me to play TOR when I already know that I detest what the game offers.
There is no way in hell that TOR will only have 150k subs by the end of the first year. That's pathetically wishful thinking on the part of the blogger. Financially, TOR will ultimately turn a profit for EA, it just won't be the next king of the MMO realm. A one-gamer "boycott" of TOR isn't going to change that, but both EA and LucasArts will notice how fast or slow they are seeing the return on their immense investment pour in. If the game fails to generate an impressive following despite the amount of hype and financial backing it has, it'll be very interesting to see how long it takes EA to shift into damage control mode.
Common sense ftw!
This post is full of reasonable, well thought-out arguments. I like it!
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
It's astounding how people will take any chance they can to jump in on a TOR hatewagon. Half of the people here didn't even bother reading the blog that was linked.
Here's a little excerpt.:
"Couple that with the fact that Blizzard used subliminal audio tracks and hypnotic use of colours to brain wash players into a zombified state, thats how you retain 10 million subscribers.. Theres no other reason for it.. WoW as a game sucked pretty bad, and if you follow the corporate food chain up to the top of who's running blizzard you find someone deeply rooted in Illuminati beliefs and practice. Think I'm joking? Go do your home work.."
Now consider that some of you are using this as a legitimate arguement thread.
Comments
Do you make a habit out of posting vague one-liners or would you like to explain further?
Now I haven't seen the Star Wars movies in some time, but I do seem to recall them being pretty themeparkish. Every step of the way each character always had a main goal in mind and would occasionly get sidetracked by side quests. There was never much in the way of exploration like say in Star Trek as the galaxy for the most part had been already explored and mapped out even in the Old Republic era.
I would even be willing to say SWG was even more far away from what Star Wars is then SWTOR looks to be if we are to go by the movies as I have limited knowledge of the EU.
Those who know my posts know that I am a very big critic of SWTOR. AND I am a huge SWG fan. Or ex-fan of how it was, rather. And still I say: give TOR a chance! Let us try it out with open mind and see how it is.
A boycott for said reasons of the OP is in a way emotionally understandable. But I don't see it leads anywhere. Yes, TOR isn't SWG, and for many reasons that's a pity. But maybe it is still fun. I say give it a chance and see how it all plays out. No one is forcing you. I say, I respect anyone who says, what LucasArts did with SWG was so shameful I boycott SWTOR. Really, I can understand you can come to that point. But I don't.
Keep in mind, a MMO is first and foremost a GAME, a sort of relaxation and escapism. It's NOT a political party or a religion. So in the end of the day, it is either fun or it isn't. End of story.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Well Kuppa. I do think I will love it for what it is AND it does appear to be a genre changer as well. A fully Voiced MMO is a game changer as is the shear size of this game at launch. Those might not be "Huge!", but they will affect what other companies do in the future if this game is very successful. If it is not a huge success though, it will have very little affect on the MMO scene and that is fine by me as well. Diversity breeds competition, competition breeds improvement (normally), and improvements mean a better gaming environment for all of us.
Personally though, I think BOTH bloggers should be taken as nothing more than what they are. People with way to much time on their hands (like many of us on these forums . . . yes, me too) and should be taken with a grain of salt. As usual I try to look at a wide variety of "reviews" from people who have played the game and try to get a general impression based on that. So far, all things point to positive in the overall.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Well said Elikal. Something tells me that guy won't listen, but still well said.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Seconded.
+1
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Haha wow, I remember that title from somewhere....ooohhh yea... I remember now *nudges Whilan* Remind you of anything?
This is hilarious.
This is not a game.
It was also rarely capable of producing a good game before Bioware got a hold of it.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this only Bioware's second Star Wars game?
I personally found Battlefront 2 to be pretty good and I also liked Rogue Squadron on the N64. I'm pretty sure if you asked around you would find plenty of other games that people liked.
Sometimes I wonder if I am the only VET who actually read the many complaints back at pre-cu.
So many topics about Jedi being to hard/harsh.
So many topics about lack of content/directions/handholding.
So many topics about to much reading, yet what most only seem to remember is quote's that Nancy McIntyre placed which was a direct result of what we all could read by forumposter who have said what she only quoted.
So many topics about to much choices/classes/skills.
So many topics about it not being Star Wars.
Yet all I see VETS saying that they where suprised by the change, did I wanted such a hugh change?, by far I didn't, I wanted fixes/polish, but I wasn't blind to see that even though I was part of the small minority that loved the pre-cu game, our voices wern't as loud as those who did wanted change.
The NGE was the last drop, but before that even before the CU we saw so many people leave the game and for new commers the game might have been to complex for them to stay and learn. Cause the common player doesn´t seem willing to truly learn a game, they want to jump right into the action and SWG didn´t provided that for the impatient type of player who couldn´t look at the game for what it had to offer but like with most MMORPGT that only have a limited view and feel if a singleplayer game can look and play that good they lack the understanding that a MMORPG is a complete different beast.
But overall the loudest in the gaming community have won time and time again, else we wouldn´t have seen much more limited type of MMO´s on the market, cause that´s what the majority of people now into this genre seem to want, and yes a tiny minority now chooses to be loud.
I loved SWG and still to today I havn't found a match with the depth of the game despite it's flaws and issue's, I am just more forgiven towards games that big and enjoyed every minute of it, no MMORPG has even come close to the experiance, the content, the freedom, the ingame community SWG gave me and others around me.
But to boycot a piece of entertainment where people-gamers have a choice in playing is rather silly and shows a lvl of immaturity that I wouldn´t expect from former SWG fans, but then again forums like this have shown me how limited some people think. Sorry.....
The "star wars universe in general" is a collection of linear stories that guide you from start to finish.
Edit- OP, what is informative about yet another SWG vet blaming the world for losing their game? It was the same SWG vets who bitched and moaned daily, threw hissy fits and constantly compalined about most aspects of the game in the general discussion long before there was an NGE.
I'm a SWG vet just look at my join day here, does it coincide with anything that happened to SWG? Do you think it's a coincidence I joined on that date?
It wasn't only SOE who wasn't just happy with what they had, I'm sick of that never being discussed.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Some might like this or that game, but the general consensus (maybe not by you though, true) is that KOTOR is one of the best Star Wars games that have been produced, and to a lot of people it's in their Top 3 SW games if not the best SW game they have played.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Outcast and Jedi Academy developed by Raven Software are probably my favorite Star Wars games.
But I am inclined to believe that there are way more horrible Star Wars games compared to the ones that were actually good, though I guess we would just be arguing opinions on whats a good SW game and what the bad ones were.
I think you missed the point. He basically said that there was some sort of turning point in the quality of Star Wars games once Bioware made theirs. It was also worded in a way that makes it seem like he's saying that Bioware has made a few Star Wars games.
1) Bioware so far has only made one Star Wars game (TOR is still in development so that doesn't count).
2) There are plenty of great Star Wars games that were out before Kotor and crap Star Wars games are stilled made even after Kotor (general consensus seems to be that Force Unleashed 2 was crap). It doesn't matter how great Kotor was, it doesn't mean that all of a sudden the state of quality of Star Wars games being made went up. Kotor was just a drop in the lake that is Star Wars games.
While there are a few SW games I like, I think what the guy said was accurate, it is rare for the IP to be given justice in a VG setting.
The SNES series was okay back when I was a kid, The X-wing Tie fighter series, and the Jedi KNight series was okay. Was never into BF or Republic Commandos. I also like Empire at War. None of these games IMO captured the feeling of the IP better than KOTOR did though.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I didn't miss his point, I just interpreted it differently.
He says good SW games were rare before KOTOR, which is true (depending on what you classify as good, admittedly).
He implies that KOTOR jumped out enough to be considered a good game, better than most preceding SW games, which to most of the gamer public is also true.
He also seems to imply that after BW's KOTOR more good SW games followed, which is his opinion, and one that I personally disagree with, but to each his own taste. Sure, KOTOR 1 and 2 were good games and SWG as well in its own way, but there have also been bad SW games afterwards.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Nope, I said it was rarely capable of producing a good game prior to Bioware. Of the dozens and dozens of StarWars games, there is only a handful that where good prior to Bioware...and they were space fighter games. Bioware's first shot turned out to be probably the best SW games ever (by consensus anyway).
It's success also opened the door to KOTOR 2 Battlefront 2, the Lego games, and the Unleashed games. All where pretty decent games, although the Unleashed series is disappointing considering its potential.
On top of that. W/out Bioware's success in KOTOR, we wouldn't even be on this forum now talking about SWTOR.
haha yeah i do remember this, however mine was a preview this is a guy ranting about it not being SWG 2 and somehow that means you should boycott ToR.
The one i found was also someone who was giving impressions, this one is just giving their opinion.
Third mine didn't have any conspiricy theories this one does.
Plus most of the one i posted did indeed surround itself in facts or opinions and was only incorrect on one or maybe two areas. Whereas this one seems more like he just doesn't like the game.
Still yeah i can see the imititation with the title. You know what they say about that. Imitation is the greatest form of flattery, guess i'm a trend setter here ;P
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Interesting or pathetic? Because all I'm hearing is the atypical disenfranchsed SWG vet reject with a "hate every game since Wow" complex, and with a little tinfoil hatted conspiracy theorist thrown in. It is amazing how long some people can carry such a deep and vicious grudge over what was at best a half assed and broken SW rip off game to begin with.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
While the blogger gets the "NGE 2.0" part correct concerning TOR, his rose colored glasses of SWG PreCU are clearly affecting his vision. PreCU had a ton of problems. The shoddy combat system drove plenty of people away, there were bugs all over the game, and even the people who stuck around complained of all the issues that the game had. If SOE had left the game as was, SWG would have shut down long before Dec. 15, 2011. Had SOE and LA given the CU more of a chance, they would likely have been better off, but they instead decided to push a major change to the game, that was nowhere near complete, and that no one in the player community wanted.
The mistake that SOE and LA made was that they incorrectly assumed that players wanted the full WoW experience: the combat system, the role system, gear grinds, etc., etc. The fact is, the SWG community just wanted the bugs fixed and the kind of structured, storied content that was there in abundance with WoW and other games, but missing from SWG. The problem with SWG's sandbox approach was that there were incredible, vast, open worlds to see, but very little incentive to explore them. There was no established reason to attack the sandpeople at Fort Tusken, yet if you were going into the DWB with a group, you knew it was to craft a Mandalorian armor piece. There was a story and an established objective to doing it. This type of content was lacking in SWG from day one, and will still be one of the reasons listed as to why it failed when the game closes. There just wasn't enough Star Wars story and content to keep people interested in SWG. In the last couple of years, great inroads were made in fixing this problem, but it was clearly too little, too late.
With TOR, the same logic has been used. The major difference between the NGE and SW:TOR, is that BioWare is implementing this system from the beginning, not trying to force it into the game, half-assed, two years after launch. Now, if you enjoy the WoW experience, then clearly you will enjoy TOR. If you don't enjoy this game style, or are already playing WoW and see no reason to start all over again playing essentially the same game, then you most likely won't find TOR appealing. I personally think that the approach to content in WoW is fine, but the rest of the game is complete trash, and there is no reason for me to play TOR when I already know that I detest what the game offers.
There is no way in hell that TOR will only have 150k subs by the end of the first year. That's pathetically wishful thinking on the part of the blogger. Financially, TOR will ultimately turn a profit for EA, it just won't be the next king of the MMO realm. A one-gamer "boycott" of TOR isn't going to change that, but both EA and LucasArts will notice how fast or slow they are seeing the return on their immense investment pour in. If the game fails to generate an impressive following despite the amount of hype and financial backing it has, it'll be very interesting to see how long it takes EA to shift into damage control mode.
Common sense ftw!
This post is full of reasonable, well thought-out arguments. I like it!
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
SWTOR is here to stay; SWG is dead long live SWTOR.
The king of MMOs is coming the rollercoaster is on the way or should i say on RAILs....
Quote "To live in the past is to die", swg vets should heed these wise words....
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
It's astounding how people will take any chance they can to jump in on a TOR hatewagon. Half of the people here didn't even bother reading the blog that was linked.
Here's a little excerpt.:
"Couple that with the fact that Blizzard used subliminal audio tracks and hypnotic use of colours to brain wash players into a zombified state, thats how you retain 10 million subscribers.. Theres no other reason for it.. WoW as a game sucked pretty bad, and if you follow the corporate food chain up to the top of who's running blizzard you find someone deeply rooted in Illuminati beliefs and practice. Think I'm joking? Go do your home work.."
Now consider that some of you are using this as a legitimate arguement thread.