I didn't mean to give the impression that I think Lucas Arts didn't wish for SWG to close. IMHO SWG remainiong open was not in the best interest of either company. The negative press alone outweights any tiny bit of revenue that the game might have been making, even for SOE. I really do think they mutually wanted the game to close down.
As for Smeds comments, there are a few former soe developers who have stated how easy it was to work with Lucas Arts and how they could get almost anything they wanted approved. Just look at all the nonsense that has gone into the game in recent years. Two huge massive core altering changes. Pink ewok cherubs, vampires, zombies. etc. I don't think Lucas Arts was very difficult to work with as Smed says, but they couldn't have been as bad as he suggests seeing that he signed up to make a second game with them in the last couple of years.
Perhaps he was talking about wizards of the coast (magic the gathering tactics); perhaps he was talking about Tom Clancy (facebook game); perhaps he was talking about their efforst to publish games with other developers like Sigil-Vanguard, Perpetum-GodsAndHeroes, Flying Labs-POTBS. Maybe he was talking about the king fu hustle game they were working on, the comic book game based on the Indian mythos or any number of the over seas joint ventures they have tried. Maybe he was even talking about working with his own company and the difficulties they have had with the PS3.
I know there are a lot of choices in there and that SWG was the biggest explosion of the bunch, but it could be anything... including the one common denominator of the bunch in there, soe.
Having said that I pretty much agree with most of what you say save one last thing.
Despite the common assumption, I was not burned by the NGE as I wasn't playing SWG in 2005. I wasn't burned by the combat upgrade either. Again I had already quit SWG long before the details were being given. I am as much a friend with you as I am anyone else on the forums I discuss games. Outside of exchanging posts talking about gaming I know nothing about anyone here or elsewhere.
On top of that, I don't give Lucas Arts a free pass on anything with SWG and I also know of the former SWG devs went to SWTOR, but that isn't an issue for me. I'm not really interested in playing wow with lightsaber. No offense meant to those who are looking forward to SWTOR. I hope you enjoy it.
If you want to discuss issues cool, love to chat, but please don't force assumptions, groups or labels on me. Much like you I am just another poster here with their own set of opinions.
I don't think you should have to sub for it either, this is just SOE's way of milking the player base for more money.
No one is forcing you to play it.
Also, explain what SoE could use in game in a Free to Play model.
All, and i mean ALL cosmetics are made in game already. Heck most everything is made in game, if you take those away then you remove the trader professions. If you do not have those items to sell in a cash shop what would you substitute? Other things to substitute would bring on player rage at a Pay to Win structure (see EvE for this failed idea).
SWG would still have a huge player base if not for the unending misteps made by the SWG dev teams. In fact i would argue that if the NGE had never been implemented and the large pop of veterens had been retained this entire conversation would not even be discussed.
No i don't hate on SoE but i do think they have the absolute worst customer relations in the industry.
I will miss SWG but there are plenty of other sandbox games that are decent, no not on the same level as Raph Kosters vision for SWG but decent enough to be very enjoyable.
Perpetuum, Ryzom, Xsyon, Darkfall, EvE. Try one, most have trials.
lets be fair for just one momment. there isnt many games that get live until they are 8 years old now is there!!! swg has had and seen its days. despite the apauling patches and updates from soe.. the game has miraculously lasted for 8 long years, now i dont know about all you other mmo players out there but thats a success to me.. 8 years!!!!! hardly ant game lasts 8 years i can only think of a few... eve , guildwars(which is free), swg, wow will make it to 8 years too.
also look at the games that wont last 8 years.
warhammer online . already after 2-3 years closed down all but 6 of its servers thats 3 us servers and i think its like 3 eu servers. this game had tons of servers and they are all gone. its just a matter of time till the game is gone. i would be surprised if it lasts nother 2 years. i doubt it will.
sto.. this game flopped on launch. so many bad reviews. it wont be long till this is entirely free to play and it will be the free to play that saves this game. if they keep asking for subs it will die a swift death. this game hasnt even reached 2 yet.
developers know that asking for subs for a shit game = their game dies a quick death if its been rushed or its just crap with little effort put in. they solve this death crisis by makeing them free to play. people play them for free and are tempted by the ingame store. these items you can buy make you powerfuller (thats right i made a word up!! who cares!) .
why do you think!! all games are exploreing the free to play option. f2p means they dont have to worry about keeping players happy as their product is free. and those that want to get ahead will spend a fortune on the cash store.
its also important that i say!! you will spend far far far more money on f2p games than you will ever spend on subscription based games. and just about every one useing a free 2 play gamee will spend money in the store to help them ahead in game. every body does!! and the developers know this..
the morale to this story is, we are the victims of our greed and need. our desire to be competetive and better than our peers and friends drives us to lengths to ensure our glory. and the developers of games today know this.. and thats why you have many many free to play games.
people have more money than sense, its really tthat simple.
all games released today are a pile of crap compaired to the games released some 8-10 years ago. swg and eve where the last great games released. eve has remained relativly unchanged from its orriginal form where as swg has adopted the wow look style and feel thinking it to be the best move.
what about the recent attempts to bring back the old school game image.. mortal online darkfall.. very noble attempts but the gamers today do not have the minds or heads for this kind of complexity. and this is what happens when you invite console players into the pc games genre. you get a blending of the races and the result is a watered down crap heap of players who know only a few things..
the few things!! -
charecters must be rolled as a specific class. i.e. tank healer,dps
you must grind to max level 1-50 or 1-90
items are all level restricted and or class restricted
all games must focuss primarily on the pvp side of end game. (because we dont know any better)
the best geer can only come from instances.
and crafting must be easy and simple but not as good as geer we grind raids and instance for.
and the above are the exact problems why mmos today are so terribly crap and worthless, yes almost all of them.
swtor is going to use and incorporate all of the above and probably more that i simply couldnt be bothered to list as i was getting depressed just writing those down.
My opinion? I'm happy it's shutting down, overjoyed really, yet I will miss my toon. But even with free play time I rarely logged in, the game wasn't fun for me and a lot of other people. It's existence constantly served as a reminder of what was, what could have been. Time to put it to rest.
Bloodfin is empty, along with lots of other servers. I mean at peak times I saw maybe 5 people, all afk...and not just on Bloodfin. The game has hit rock bottom, it's worse than Matrix Online when it comes to population.
It's also Karma that those same people who told us to shut up about the NGE and leave are now experiencing the loss we did. I remember the community being divided into those he loved it, and those who hated it. And the ones who loved it felt like they won some fight, and needed to salt the wound with insults, and SOE let them by deleting any and every complaint. I remember them saying there would never be another SW MMO, now look. I remember them saying SWG will never shut down, now look. It's because of the new SW MMO it's shutting down. My char was born on Bloodfin, and will now die on Bloodfin. For a game, It's like closure for me and now I will really only be left with my memories. As long as SWG is alive it will continue to mar the reputation of ever Star Wars Game that hits the market because the comparison will always be made. Good riddance. I'm not attempting to troll do don't be offended, this is just how I feel.
Yep, this is a good thing. I actually think that anyone who still paid to play this game after NGE did a great injustice to everyone who played BEFORE the NGE. Had everyone boycotted this game altogether they would have been forced to shut down THEN or roll back, either was a better alternative.
The players that liked the changes and stuck up for SOE really spat in the faces of those who had invested a lot of time into their game.
SWG needs to die and all the NGE players get what they deserve. Every time you paid to log on to this monstrosity you justified SOE and in a symbolic way the industries treatment of players in a negative and unconcerning manner.
I'm glad it's gone and I hope it hurts. I just wish SOE would have taken the servers offline for good one day without warning, that would have been the only better outcome from this.
Yep, this is a good thing. I actually think that anyone who still paid to play this game after NGE did a great injustice to everyone who played BEFORE the NGE. Had everyone boycotted this game altogether they would have been forced to shut down THEN or roll back, either was a better alternative.
The players that liked the changes and stuck up for SOE really spat in the faces of those who had invested a lot of time into their game.
SWG needs to die and all the NGE players get what they deserve. Every time you paid to log on to this monstrosity you justified SOE and in a symbolic way the industries treatment of players in a negative and unconcerning manner.
I'm glad it's gone and I hope it hurts. I just wish SOE would have taken the servers offline for good one day without warning, that would have been the only better outcome from this.
Yep, this is a good thing. I actually think that anyone who still paid to play this game after NGE did a great injustice to everyone who played BEFORE the NGE. Had everyone boycotted this game altogether they would have been forced to shut down THEN or roll back, either was a better alternative.
The players that liked the changes and stuck up for SOE really spat in the faces of those who had invested a lot of time into their game.
SWG needs to die and all the NGE players get what they deserve. Every time you paid to log on to this monstrosity you justified SOE and in a symbolic way the industries treatment of players in a negative and unconcerning manner.
I'm glad it's gone and I hope it hurts. I just wish SOE would have taken the servers offline for good one day without warning, that would have been the only better outcome from this.
Yep, this is a good thing. I actually think that anyone who still paid to play this game after NGE did a great injustice to everyone who played BEFORE the NGE. Had everyone boycotted this game altogether they would have been forced to shut down THEN or roll back, either was a better alternative.
The players that liked the changes and stuck up for SOE really spat in the faces of those who had invested a lot of time into their game.
SWG needs to die and all the NGE players get what they deserve. Every time you paid to log on to this monstrosity you justified SOE and in a symbolic way the industries treatment of players in a negative and unconcerning manner.
I'm glad it's gone and I hope it hurts. I just wish SOE would have taken the servers offline for good one day without warning, that would have been the only better outcome from this.
I mostly quit after the NGE, and hardly played for a year, but when it was blatantly obvious it was not going to change back, I sucked it up, and moved on and enjoyed what it was. No one liked the changes but knew it was the only SW MMO around.
The game today is nowhere as bad as it was in Nov 2005, and is still better than a lot of MMOs out there for features. If more people returned to SWG, they may have had more money to invest in a complete overhaul, and made the game more pollished and less laggy, added more questlines for professions instead of legacy for all and whatnot. They may have even reimplented the 250 point skill system, or something similar maybe better, as they have taken peoples comments (written in a calm cool manner and not written in hate and anger) on board and done it. If you are not subbed you can not post anything. People who have quit and stayed quit are to blame now for the loss of the greatest MMO ever created.
If they were going to do a rollback it would have happened within the first week, but tthey thought people were going to get over it and come back, but when that did not happen, and by the time they realised that fact, it was too late for a rollback, because changing the game back from the NGE to pre-NGE would have impacted players as much as the NGE did and would have lost as much too, and you people are not the only ones to be considered.
There will be plenty of cookiee cutter WOW clone MMOs come and go, but there will never be anything like SWG again, with its player cities and crafting system. Even SWTOR looks like the NGE but more dumbed down.
SWG is being shut down prematurely and to make way for SWTOR. It is being given loads of notice for closure because it is all planned ahead with SWTOR and there are still plenty of people still playng.
I also find your post rather ironic and contradictive, as you seem to want NGE players to suffer, yet do not want players to be treated in a negative and unconecrening manner, which they are by the sudden closure - You make no sense. The only people who will suffer from the closure will be the SWG players,as SOE will just put their staff on other games, and they will carry on.
It is up to the players if they want to play and enjoy a game or not, and if that is SWG in its current form, then so be it. It is not the current players faults, as even if it dropped to 1 player last year, because they tried another attempt to get the game to rollback, they would not do a rollback, it would have just got shut down.
If you and countless others, who were boycotting the game, to try and force SOE/LA to do a rollback to pre-CU or pre-NGE, then you are the ones that have destroyed SWG, and although may not have done a rollback, it could have given them enough revenue to polish up SWG, to remove the lag and whatnot, making it as viable as SWTOR, if not more with its deep crafting system and player housing.
Seriously, looking at SWTOR, how is the NGE much worse? SWTOR has even less professions than the NGE! The only difference with SWTOR is that it will be a polished version of the NGE written from the ground up, and not had code upon code added to it.
From rumours, it seems that there was a clause in the contract which prevents SWTOR and SWG operating together, and is the reason it is being shut down. If SWG closes, then it makes it easier for companies to do the same with other games/MMOS and alll YOUR efforts will be wasted in the next MMO, as despite it thriving, a clause in the contract forces the game to shut down. This can not be allowed.
In the end, SWG shutting down, like this, is not a good thing. Also there is zero hope of SWG rolling back officially or given a server with pre-CU/NGE code on it, and I reckon after SWG closes, LA will shut down the fake version.
There is no is clause in the contract that prevents either game from existing.
Smedley admitted that soe could have negotiated for another contract extention, but chose not to. That means that SWG could have gone on if the two companies resigned.
Bioware might have a clause in their contract that no NEW star wars mmos can be licenesed for X number of years or something along those lines, but they can't contract in anything that nullifies what is already in effect between soe/la.
Honestly that rumor sounds like someones attempt to desperately find 1 and only 1 party to blame for the closure of the game, when there is plenty of blame to go around for how things are transpiring.
The game today is nowhere as bad as it was in Nov 2005, and is still better than a lot of MMOs out there for features. If more people returned to SWG, they may have had more money to invest in a complete overhaul, and made the game more pollished and less laggy, added more questlines for professions instead of legacy for all and whatnot. They may have even reimplented the 250 point skill system, or something similar maybe better, as they have taken peoples comments (written in a calm cool manner and not written in hate and anger) on board and done it. If you are not subbed you can not post anything. People who have quit and stayed quit are to blame now for the loss of the greatest MMO ever created.
If they were going to do a rollback it would have happened within the first week, but tthey thought people were going to get over it and come back, but when that did not happen, and by the time they realised that fact, it was too late for a rollback, because changing the game back from the NGE to pre-NGE would have impacted players as much as the NGE did and would have lost as much too, and you people are not the only ones to be considered.
...
If you and countless others, who were boycotting the game, to try and force SOE/LA to do a rollback to pre-CU or pre-NGE, then you are the ones that have destroyed SWG, and although may not have done a rollback, it could have given them enough revenue to polish up SWG, to remove the lag and whatnot, making it as viable as SWTOR, if not more with its deep crafting system and player housing.
...
Utter nonsense. You are indulging the same "blame the victims" that you decry in the post you replied to. No, the people that left and never returned are NOT responsible for SWG's ultimate demise. SOE/LA got many, many clear warnings of what would happen if they rammed NGE down their customers' throats, and chose to disregard them. Sub number dropped as they had after the CU, but far more precipitously. That alone should have told SOE/LA that there would be no population rebound this time. And many if not most former players returned on free trials (even re-subbing for a month) to see if things had improved: they hadn't.
Equally foolish is the notion that they had only a one week window to rollback, and that it would be as damaging to rollback after that as to keep the NGE. They screwed over a lot more players with rollbacks during their botched rollout of CU. There would have been permanent losses no matter what ("Fooled me once, fooled me twice..."), but not as bad as what they got. Any gesture that told the players that SOE/LA was listening to them would have gone a long way to salvage things (words with no accompanying action didn't work, Smed later found).
Quite simply: the people who destroyed the game are... the people whose changes destroyed the game.
The game today is nowhere as bad as it was in Nov 2005, and is still better than a lot of MMOs out there for features. If more people returned to SWG, they may have had more money to invest in a complete overhaul, and made the game more pollished and less laggy, added more questlines for professions instead of legacy for all and whatnot. They may have even reimplented the 250 point skill system, or something similar maybe better, as they have taken peoples comments (written in a calm cool manner and not written in hate and anger) on board and done it. If you are not subbed you can not post anything. People who have quit and stayed quit are to blame now for the loss of the greatest MMO ever created.
If they were going to do a rollback it would have happened within the first week, but tthey thought people were going to get over it and come back, but when that did not happen, and by the time they realised that fact, it was too late for a rollback, because changing the game back from the NGE to pre-NGE would have impacted players as much as the NGE did and would have lost as much too, and you people are not the only ones to be considered.
...
If you and countless others, who were boycotting the game, to try and force SOE/LA to do a rollback to pre-CU or pre-NGE, then you are the ones that have destroyed SWG, and although may not have done a rollback, it could have given them enough revenue to polish up SWG, to remove the lag and whatnot, making it as viable as SWTOR, if not more with its deep crafting system and player housing.
...
Utter nonsense. You are indulging the same "blame the victims" that you decry in the post you replied to. No, the people that left and never returned are NOT responsible for SWG's ultimate demise. SOE/LA got many, many clear warnings of what would happen if they rammed NGE down their customers' throats, and chose to disregard them. Sub number dropped as they had after the CU, but far more precipitously. That alone should have told SOE/LA that there would be no population rebound this time. And many if not most former players returned on free trials (even re-subbing for a month) to see if things had improved: they hadn't.
Equally foolish is the notion that they had only a one week window to rollback, and that it would be as damaging to rollback after that as to keep the NGE. They screwed over a lot more players with rollbacks during their botched rollout of CU. There would have been permanent losses no matter what ("Fooled me once, fooled me twice..."), but not as bad as what they got. Any gesture that told the players that SOE/LA was listening to them would have gone a long way to salvage things (words with no accompanying action didn't work, Smed later found).
Quite simply: the people who destroyed the game are... the people whose changes destroyed the game.
Exactly. I just do not see why anybody would be so fond of the game shutting down. It only hurts fellow players and not those who brought the NGE
If you do not like the game, then fine, do not play it. But others do, and it shutting down will be a loss to them the players. SOE/LA or whoever in a business sense, will carry on on regardless in other ventuires. The closure only harms other fellow players, not the people who brought the NGE in the first place. Also. some people only know the NGE as started playing after the change
SWTOR is going to be tainted by SWGs closure, and it just carries on, and all these business decisions just ruin the games by making people hate on them. People hated SWG with the NGE, and now people are hating on SWTOR because of SWGs closure, and other people have stated they will annoy other people in SWTOR on purpose because they do not agree with SWGs closure (I won't as still want to play SWTOR and have no desires to get banned)
If SWG shut down next year, then it would have been better, as people would have gotten a taste for SWTOR, and moved there willingly instead of feeling forced, and fed up of all the lies or changes of plans, as LA stated that both MMOs could run alongside each other
SWG started off great as was all new, there was little expectations, and no negativity around it.
I've had a negative view towards SWG myself these past few years, and never really got stuck into SWG all these years since 2005, and basically just faffed around in it, but since the clousre announcement I have gotten stuck into it, and really enjoying it more now. The last 5-6 years have just been a wasted time, and I should have embraced it more. I was going to boycott SWTOr myself, but its got to stop somewhere, so will just embrace it all and enjoy SWTOR from day 1, as do not want to feel as though I missed out again in the future just because today I feel hurt by SWGs closure, because I missed out on great times, because I did not accept SWG NGE as it is, as wanted pre-NGE back. I am not doing that again, I am not going to ignore SWTOR, because I want SWG back. In the end you just hurt yourself with all this negativity, and the companies still do not care.
So people stuck around for years, they did SOE a favor trying to make what they could out of the game better. But after getting screwed over royally in the first place, do you guys even find this much of a surprise that they would screw the rest of you over by shutting the game down?
As far as Im concerned , this game should have been shut down a week after CU. Instead a small percentage of people stayed around paying to play a beta keeping it on life support. And Im glad they ARE finally shutting it down because it is a competing game to SWTOR and would take subs away however little they may have been. Perhaps some wont play it, but alot of you guys craving Star Wars will indeed play the new game helping make a solid player base.
So people stuck around for years, they did SOE a favor trying to make what they could out of the game better. But after getting screwed over royally in the first place, do you guys even find this much of a surprise that they would screw the rest of you over by shutting the game down?
As far as Im concerned , this game should have been shut down a week after CU. Instead a small percentage of people stayed around paying to play a beta keeping it on life support. And Im glad they ARE finally shutting it down because it is a competing game to SWTOR and would take subs away however little they may have been. Perhaps some wont play it, but alot of you guys craving Star Wars will indeed play the new game helping make a solid player base.
Why would they shut the game down a week after the CU? The point of doing the CU and even the NGE was so not to have to shut the game down! They were both done to help boost the game, not destroy it, but as we all know neither worked. WHen NGE did not work, they got stuck on SWTOR. The new tutorial section that came with the NGE featured voice over NPCs, and from what read, they planned on doing that across the rest of the game, and adding atmostpheric flight as used for the snowspeeders in the hoth instance, but due to the game engine it was not possible without a rewrite, so enter SWTOR.
SWTOR is basically just another devolution from the NGE. First there was SWG, then there was the CU, then the NGE, and now soon there is SWTOR. The difference now is you lose all your characters and items. At least with the NGE and CU all your characters and stuff remains.
There is no SWG and SWTOR, like there was no NGE and pre-CU/NGE (officially)
It will be a solid player base if people do not dance on SWGs grave. Anybody who enjoys SWGs clousre will immediately be on my ignore list
SWTOR is basically just another devolution from the NGE.
Well if you imply devolving you suggest TOR is a worse game than the NGE.
{mod edit}
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
SWTOR is basically just another devolution from the NGE.
Well if you imply devolving you suggest TOR is a worse game than the NGE.
Far from it. Right now, in a laggy overpopulated and known-bugs in beta it is ten times the game the nge ever could have been in the hands of the $OE chimp developers. Better than the nge in their wildest dreams.
Sorry to say, better than Pre-CU from a bug standpoint. ONLY from a bug standpoint.
You are borth wrong, but just because you compare SWG and TOR, that never works.
TOR and SWG have only one thing in common (NGE or pre-cu) and that is the ip. And just barely since TOR is set thousands of years before SWG.
You might as well compare "Crusader kings" and "Doom".
I enjoyed playing the beta state game from release till the NGE, and even played like 5-6 months after that dreadful november 2005.
I actually enjoyed that wookie expansion, guild runs into the corvette/bunker/geo cave and world pvp/BH runs on jedi players + RP. Even then you saw the game was severely lacking content. I would have probably still played the game if they released that Hoth and dungeon content in pre-CU/CU style.....
It was the lack of fixing bugs, looooong downtimes, bad code that made servers crash if you had a 40vs40 pvp battle+ very bad implementing of the 'hey, let's code a game in 2 days' NGE....and the worst part: the deceiving of the community+arrogant behaviour of $OE that made me quit the game.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
You are borth wrong, but just because you compare SWG and TOR, that never works.
TOR and SWG have only one thing in common (NGE or pre-cu) and that is the ip. And just barely since TOR is set thousands of years before SWG.
You might as well compare "Crusader kings" and "Doom".
I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong. They have far more in common than that and you know it lol. Not much changes in the thousands of years.
Im going to enjoy watching the /meltdowns that are going to happen when TOR fails to deliver what people are expecting from is, SWG is closed and there isnt another SW MMO to play.
Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT Playing: Skyrim Following: The Repopulation I want a Virtual World, not just a Game. ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)
If your a true SW fanatic why are you into a new aged NGE2 style of Star Wars that is geared towards new SW people, you know the ones Lucas makes shitty Clone Wars cartoons for? Any true SW lover I know prefers EP4-6 but can make the same argument, matter of opinion. But in the end I think the die hard people who grew up before all the new wave SW bs came out would agree, ONLY 1 TRILOGY.
When did you start playing "old school" MMO's. World Of Warcraft?
I'm sure they could of done something besides pulling the plug.. amazes me how games like Dark age of camelot and ultima online are still running..im sure SWG has or had the same amount if not more subscriptions than those games, yet you dont see them pulling the plug on those games do you
So people stuck around for years, they did SOE a favor trying to make what they could out of the game better. But after getting screwed over royally in the first place, do you guys even find this much of a surprise that they would screw the rest of you over by shutting the game down?
As far as Im concerned , this game should have been shut down a week after CU. Instead a small percentage of people stayed around paying to play a beta keeping it on life support. And Im glad they ARE finally shutting it down because it is a competing game to SWTOR and would take subs away however little they may have been. Perhaps some wont play it, but alot of you guys craving Star Wars will indeed play the new game helping make a solid player base.
Why would they shut the game down a week after the CU? The point of doing the CU and even the NGE was so not to have to shut the game down! They were both done to help boost the game, not destroy it, but as we all know neither worked. WHen NGE did not work, they got stuck on SWTOR. The new tutorial section that came with the NGE featured voice over NPCs, and from what read, they planned on doing that across the rest of the game, and adding atmostpheric flight as used for the snowspeeders in the hoth instance, but due to the game engine it was not possible without a rewrite, so enter SWTOR.
SWTOR is basically just another devolution from the NGE. First there was SWG, then there was the CU, then the NGE, and now soon there is SWTOR. The difference now is you lose all your characters and items. At least with the NGE and CU all your characters and stuff remains.
There is no SWG and SWTOR, like there was no NGE and pre-CU/NGE (officially)
It will be a solid player base if people do not dance on SWGs grave. Anybody who enjoys SWGs clousre will immediately be on my ignore list
I should have been more clear, sorry. They (SOE) had no reason to close it down from a business standpoint, however from my standpoint it was a pay to play beta piece of garbage that needed to be shut down. Again , that is in my opinion of course. Also in my opinion, TOR is a much better game already in beta than SWG ever was. The game was mismanaged and poorly run. Save the game? No, the intent was to tap a mythical player base they thought existed and s hit all over it's current one.
Again though, I find it hard to believe people stuck around after all that and they are really surprised at what SOE/LA did. They didn't give a s h7t about anyone before, why would you expect it now. Hell, I'm really surprised they gave everyone as much warning as they did . I half expected them to put a message on the patcher the day before they took it offline.
I'm sure they could of done something besides pulling the plug.. amazes me how games like Dark age of camelot and ultima online are still running..im sure SWG has or had the same amount if not more subscriptions than those games, yet you dont see them pulling the plug on those games do you
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@JYCowboy
I didn't mean to give the impression that I think Lucas Arts didn't wish for SWG to close. IMHO SWG remainiong open was not in the best interest of either company. The negative press alone outweights any tiny bit of revenue that the game might have been making, even for SOE. I really do think they mutually wanted the game to close down.
As for Smeds comments, there are a few former soe developers who have stated how easy it was to work with Lucas Arts and how they could get almost anything they wanted approved. Just look at all the nonsense that has gone into the game in recent years. Two huge massive core altering changes. Pink ewok cherubs, vampires, zombies. etc. I don't think Lucas Arts was very difficult to work with as Smed says, but they couldn't have been as bad as he suggests seeing that he signed up to make a second game with them in the last couple of years.
Perhaps he was talking about wizards of the coast (magic the gathering tactics); perhaps he was talking about Tom Clancy (facebook game); perhaps he was talking about their efforst to publish games with other developers like Sigil-Vanguard, Perpetum-GodsAndHeroes, Flying Labs-POTBS. Maybe he was talking about the king fu hustle game they were working on, the comic book game based on the Indian mythos or any number of the over seas joint ventures they have tried. Maybe he was even talking about working with his own company and the difficulties they have had with the PS3.
I know there are a lot of choices in there and that SWG was the biggest explosion of the bunch, but it could be anything... including the one common denominator of the bunch in there, soe.
Having said that I pretty much agree with most of what you say save one last thing.
Despite the common assumption, I was not burned by the NGE as I wasn't playing SWG in 2005. I wasn't burned by the combat upgrade either. Again I had already quit SWG long before the details were being given. I am as much a friend with you as I am anyone else on the forums I discuss games. Outside of exchanging posts talking about gaming I know nothing about anyone here or elsewhere.
On top of that, I don't give Lucas Arts a free pass on anything with SWG and I also know of the former SWG devs went to SWTOR, but that isn't an issue for me. I'm not really interested in playing wow with lightsaber. No offense meant to those who are looking forward to SWTOR. I hope you enjoy it.
If you want to discuss issues cool, love to chat, but please don't force assumptions, groups or labels on me. Much like you I am just another poster here with their own set of opinions.
lets be fair for just one momment. there isnt many games that get live until they are 8 years old now is there!!! swg has had and seen its days. despite the apauling patches and updates from soe.. the game has miraculously lasted for 8 long years, now i dont know about all you other mmo players out there but thats a success to me.. 8 years!!!!! hardly ant game lasts 8 years i can only think of a few... eve , guildwars(which is free), swg, wow will make it to 8 years too.
also look at the games that wont last 8 years.
warhammer online . already after 2-3 years closed down all but 6 of its servers thats 3 us servers and i think its like 3 eu servers. this game had tons of servers and they are all gone. its just a matter of time till the game is gone. i would be surprised if it lasts nother 2 years. i doubt it will.
sto.. this game flopped on launch. so many bad reviews. it wont be long till this is entirely free to play and it will be the free to play that saves this game. if they keep asking for subs it will die a swift death. this game hasnt even reached 2 yet.
developers know that asking for subs for a shit game = their game dies a quick death if its been rushed or its just crap with little effort put in. they solve this death crisis by makeing them free to play. people play them for free and are tempted by the ingame store. these items you can buy make you powerfuller (thats right i made a word up!! who cares!) .
why do you think!! all games are exploreing the free to play option. f2p means they dont have to worry about keeping players happy as their product is free. and those that want to get ahead will spend a fortune on the cash store.
its also important that i say!! you will spend far far far more money on f2p games than you will ever spend on subscription based games. and just about every one useing a free 2 play gamee will spend money in the store to help them ahead in game. every body does!! and the developers know this..
the morale to this story is, we are the victims of our greed and need. our desire to be competetive and better than our peers and friends drives us to lengths to ensure our glory. and the developers of games today know this.. and thats why you have many many free to play games.
people have more money than sense, its really tthat simple.
all games released today are a pile of crap compaired to the games released some 8-10 years ago. swg and eve where the last great games released. eve has remained relativly unchanged from its orriginal form where as swg has adopted the wow look style and feel thinking it to be the best move.
what about the recent attempts to bring back the old school game image.. mortal online darkfall.. very noble attempts but the gamers today do not have the minds or heads for this kind of complexity. and this is what happens when you invite console players into the pc games genre. you get a blending of the races and the result is a watered down crap heap of players who know only a few things..
the few things!! -
charecters must be rolled as a specific class. i.e. tank healer,dps
you must grind to max level 1-50 or 1-90
items are all level restricted and or class restricted
all games must focuss primarily on the pvp side of end game. (because we dont know any better)
the best geer can only come from instances.
and crafting must be easy and simple but not as good as geer we grind raids and instance for.
and the above are the exact problems why mmos today are so terribly crap and worthless, yes almost all of them.
swtor is going to use and incorporate all of the above and probably more that i simply couldnt be bothered to list as i was getting depressed just writing those down.
My opinion? I'm happy it's shutting down, overjoyed really, yet I will miss my toon. But even with free play time I rarely logged in, the game wasn't fun for me and a lot of other people. It's existence constantly served as a reminder of what was, what could have been. Time to put it to rest.
Bloodfin is empty, along with lots of other servers. I mean at peak times I saw maybe 5 people, all afk...and not just on Bloodfin. The game has hit rock bottom, it's worse than Matrix Online when it comes to population.
It's also Karma that those same people who told us to shut up about the NGE and leave are now experiencing the loss we did. I remember the community being divided into those he loved it, and those who hated it. And the ones who loved it felt like they won some fight, and needed to salt the wound with insults, and SOE let them by deleting any and every complaint. I remember them saying there would never be another SW MMO, now look. I remember them saying SWG will never shut down, now look. It's because of the new SW MMO it's shutting down. My char was born on Bloodfin, and will now die on Bloodfin. For a game, It's like closure for me and now I will really only be left with my memories. As long as SWG is alive it will continue to mar the reputation of ever Star Wars Game that hits the market because the comparison will always be made. Good riddance. I'm not attempting to troll do don't be offended, this is just how I feel.
Yep, this is a good thing. I actually think that anyone who still paid to play this game after NGE did a great injustice to everyone who played BEFORE the NGE. Had everyone boycotted this game altogether they would have been forced to shut down THEN or roll back, either was a better alternative.
The players that liked the changes and stuck up for SOE really spat in the faces of those who had invested a lot of time into their game.
SWG needs to die and all the NGE players get what they deserve. Every time you paid to log on to this monstrosity you justified SOE and in a symbolic way the industries treatment of players in a negative and unconcerning manner.
I'm glad it's gone and I hope it hurts. I just wish SOE would have taken the servers offline for good one day without warning, that would have been the only better outcome from this.
Tecmo Bowl.
Possibly a bit harsh, but quite true.
QFE
I mostly quit after the NGE, and hardly played for a year, but when it was blatantly obvious it was not going to change back, I sucked it up, and moved on and enjoyed what it was. No one liked the changes but knew it was the only SW MMO around.
The game today is nowhere as bad as it was in Nov 2005, and is still better than a lot of MMOs out there for features. If more people returned to SWG, they may have had more money to invest in a complete overhaul, and made the game more pollished and less laggy, added more questlines for professions instead of legacy for all and whatnot. They may have even reimplented the 250 point skill system, or something similar maybe better, as they have taken peoples comments (written in a calm cool manner and not written in hate and anger) on board and done it. If you are not subbed you can not post anything. People who have quit and stayed quit are to blame now for the loss of the greatest MMO ever created.
If they were going to do a rollback it would have happened within the first week, but tthey thought people were going to get over it and come back, but when that did not happen, and by the time they realised that fact, it was too late for a rollback, because changing the game back from the NGE to pre-NGE would have impacted players as much as the NGE did and would have lost as much too, and you people are not the only ones to be considered.
There will be plenty of cookiee cutter WOW clone MMOs come and go, but there will never be anything like SWG again, with its player cities and crafting system. Even SWTOR looks like the NGE but more dumbed down.
SWG is being shut down prematurely and to make way for SWTOR. It is being given loads of notice for closure because it is all planned ahead with SWTOR and there are still plenty of people still playng.
I also find your post rather ironic and contradictive, as you seem to want NGE players to suffer, yet do not want players to be treated in a negative and unconecrening manner, which they are by the sudden closure - You make no sense. The only people who will suffer from the closure will be the SWG players,as SOE will just put their staff on other games, and they will carry on.
It is up to the players if they want to play and enjoy a game or not, and if that is SWG in its current form, then so be it. It is not the current players faults, as even if it dropped to 1 player last year, because they tried another attempt to get the game to rollback, they would not do a rollback, it would have just got shut down.
If you and countless others, who were boycotting the game, to try and force SOE/LA to do a rollback to pre-CU or pre-NGE, then you are the ones that have destroyed SWG, and although may not have done a rollback, it could have given them enough revenue to polish up SWG, to remove the lag and whatnot, making it as viable as SWTOR, if not more with its deep crafting system and player housing.
Seriously, looking at SWTOR, how is the NGE much worse? SWTOR has even less professions than the NGE! The only difference with SWTOR is that it will be a polished version of the NGE written from the ground up, and not had code upon code added to it.
From rumours, it seems that there was a clause in the contract which prevents SWTOR and SWG operating together, and is the reason it is being shut down. If SWG closes, then it makes it easier for companies to do the same with other games/MMOS and alll YOUR efforts will be wasted in the next MMO, as despite it thriving, a clause in the contract forces the game to shut down. This can not be allowed.
In the end, SWG shutting down, like this, is not a good thing. Also there is zero hope of SWG rolling back officially or given a server with pre-CU/NGE code on it, and I reckon after SWG closes, LA will shut down the fake version.
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
There is no is clause in the contract that prevents either game from existing.
Smedley admitted that soe could have negotiated for another contract extention, but chose not to. That means that SWG could have gone on if the two companies resigned.
Bioware might have a clause in their contract that no NEW star wars mmos can be licenesed for X number of years or something along those lines, but they can't contract in anything that nullifies what is already in effect between soe/la.
Honestly that rumor sounds like someones attempt to desperately find 1 and only 1 party to blame for the closure of the game, when there is plenty of blame to go around for how things are transpiring.
Utter nonsense. You are indulging the same "blame the victims" that you decry in the post you replied to. No, the people that left and never returned are NOT responsible for SWG's ultimate demise. SOE/LA got many, many clear warnings of what would happen if they rammed NGE down their customers' throats, and chose to disregard them. Sub number dropped as they had after the CU, but far more precipitously. That alone should have told SOE/LA that there would be no population rebound this time. And many if not most former players returned on free trials (even re-subbing for a month) to see if things had improved: they hadn't.
Equally foolish is the notion that they had only a one week window to rollback, and that it would be as damaging to rollback after that as to keep the NGE. They screwed over a lot more players with rollbacks during their botched rollout of CU. There would have been permanent losses no matter what ("Fooled me once, fooled me twice..."), but not as bad as what they got. Any gesture that told the players that SOE/LA was listening to them would have gone a long way to salvage things (words with no accompanying action didn't work, Smed later found).
Quite simply: the people who destroyed the game are... the people whose changes destroyed the game.
Exactly. I just do not see why anybody would be so fond of the game shutting down. It only hurts fellow players and not those who brought the NGE
If you do not like the game, then fine, do not play it. But others do, and it shutting down will be a loss to them the players. SOE/LA or whoever in a business sense, will carry on on regardless in other ventuires. The closure only harms other fellow players, not the people who brought the NGE in the first place. Also. some people only know the NGE as started playing after the change
SWTOR is going to be tainted by SWGs closure, and it just carries on, and all these business decisions just ruin the games by making people hate on them. People hated SWG with the NGE, and now people are hating on SWTOR because of SWGs closure, and other people have stated they will annoy other people in SWTOR on purpose because they do not agree with SWGs closure (I won't as still want to play SWTOR and have no desires to get banned)
If SWG shut down next year, then it would have been better, as people would have gotten a taste for SWTOR, and moved there willingly instead of feeling forced, and fed up of all the lies or changes of plans, as LA stated that both MMOs could run alongside each other
SWG started off great as was all new, there was little expectations, and no negativity around it.
I've had a negative view towards SWG myself these past few years, and never really got stuck into SWG all these years since 2005, and basically just faffed around in it, but since the clousre announcement I have gotten stuck into it, and really enjoying it more now. The last 5-6 years have just been a wasted time, and I should have embraced it more. I was going to boycott SWTOr myself, but its got to stop somewhere, so will just embrace it all and enjoy SWTOR from day 1, as do not want to feel as though I missed out again in the future just because today I feel hurt by SWGs closure, because I missed out on great times, because I did not accept SWG NGE as it is, as wanted pre-NGE back. I am not doing that again, I am not going to ignore SWTOR, because I want SWG back. In the end you just hurt yourself with all this negativity, and the companies still do not care.
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
So people stuck around for years, they did SOE a favor trying to make what they could out of the game better. But after getting screwed over royally in the first place, do you guys even find this much of a surprise that they would screw the rest of you over by shutting the game down?
As far as Im concerned , this game should have been shut down a week after CU. Instead a small percentage of people stayed around paying to play a beta keeping it on life support. And Im glad they ARE finally shutting it down because it is a competing game to SWTOR and would take subs away however little they may have been. Perhaps some wont play it, but alot of you guys craving Star Wars will indeed play the new game helping make a solid player base.
I am so glad this game will finally RIP its been far over due as its time for SW:ToR to make its entrance!!
Im not sure why you would feel that way. What about the people that played and enjoyed it?
Its kind of strange to me too, because I would have thought they'd at least wait awhile after Swtors release to shut it down at least.
Why would they shut the game down a week after the CU? The point of doing the CU and even the NGE was so not to have to shut the game down! They were both done to help boost the game, not destroy it, but as we all know neither worked. WHen NGE did not work, they got stuck on SWTOR. The new tutorial section that came with the NGE featured voice over NPCs, and from what read, they planned on doing that across the rest of the game, and adding atmostpheric flight as used for the snowspeeders in the hoth instance, but due to the game engine it was not possible without a rewrite, so enter SWTOR.
SWTOR is basically just another devolution from the NGE. First there was SWG, then there was the CU, then the NGE, and now soon there is SWTOR. The difference now is you lose all your characters and items. At least with the NGE and CU all your characters and stuff remains.
There is no SWG and SWTOR, like there was no NGE and pre-CU/NGE (officially)
It will be a solid player base if people do not dance on SWGs grave. Anybody who enjoys SWGs clousre will immediately be on my ignore list
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
Well if you imply devolving you suggest TOR is a worse game than the NGE.
{mod edit}
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
{mod edit} SOE has ALWAYS been the greatest problem with SWG. They simply have no quality standards - never have.
You are borth wrong, but just because you compare SWG and TOR, that never works.
TOR and SWG have only one thing in common (NGE or pre-cu) and that is the ip. And just barely since TOR is set thousands of years before SWG.
You might as well compare "Crusader kings" and "Doom".
I enjoyed playing the beta state game from release till the NGE, and even played like 5-6 months after that dreadful november 2005.
I actually enjoyed that wookie expansion, guild runs into the corvette/bunker/geo cave and world pvp/BH runs on jedi players + RP. Even then you saw the game was severely lacking content. I would have probably still played the game if they released that Hoth and dungeon content in pre-CU/CU style.....
It was the lack of fixing bugs, looooong downtimes, bad code that made servers crash if you had a 40vs40 pvp battle+ very bad implementing of the 'hey, let's code a game in 2 days' NGE....and the worst part: the deceiving of the community+arrogant behaviour of $OE that made me quit the game.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong. They have far more in common than that and you know it lol. Not much changes in the thousands of years.
Im going to enjoy watching the /meltdowns that are going to happen when TOR fails to deliver what people are expecting from is, SWG is closed and there isnt another SW MMO to play.
Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
Playing: Skyrim
Following: The Repopulation
I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)
{mod edit}
If your a true SW fanatic why are you into a new aged NGE2 style of Star Wars that is geared towards new SW people, you know the ones Lucas makes shitty Clone Wars cartoons for? Any true SW lover I know prefers EP4-6 but can make the same argument, matter of opinion. But in the end I think the die hard people who grew up before all the new wave SW bs came out would agree, ONLY 1 TRILOGY.
When did you start playing "old school" MMO's. World Of Warcraft?
I'm sure they could of done something besides pulling the plug.. amazes me how games like Dark age of camelot and ultima online are still running..im sure SWG has or had the same amount if not more subscriptions than those games, yet you dont see them pulling the plug on those games do you
I should have been more clear, sorry. They (SOE) had no reason to close it down from a business standpoint, however from my standpoint it was a pay to play beta piece of garbage that needed to be shut down. Again , that is in my opinion of course. Also in my opinion, TOR is a much better game already in beta than SWG ever was. The game was mismanaged and poorly run. Save the game? No, the intent was to tap a mythical player base they thought existed and s hit all over it's current one.
Again though, I find it hard to believe people stuck around after all that and they are really surprised at what SOE/LA did. They didn't give a s h7t about anyone before, why would you expect it now. Hell, I'm really surprised they gave everyone as much warning as they did . I half expected them to put a message on the patcher the day before they took it offline.
Neither one of those pay IP fees either.