Maybe I misunderstood the question. From budget point of view you might be right, the success or fail of the game can change the market. But what I thought: it will not change the MMORPG genre. I have some frends in the beta, they told me that the game is absolutely a WoW copy from gameplay point of view. But they also told that it's very good, very polished and they love it very much. This game might fail as MMO in the long run, but as a game, I'm pretty confident that it will be a huge success.
Look at WoW.... the graphics are not really impressive yet it hosts the most subscriptions of any online game. What Bioware is going for is the ability for older systems to play this game without bogging down.
I think once people get used to the "different" style of these graphics they will grow on you. I am looking forward to the release of this game just to play something different then the classic fantasy MMO. I am also a huge Star Wars and Bioware fan so this should be a great combo.
I think the OP misunderstood the 'devil's advocate' article as representing the formal opinion of the whole mmorpg.com staff. Which it is not, reread it if you like.
So, that's 1 argument that was untrue in the OP. As for whether SWTOR is revolutionary, it depends what you categorize as revolutionary. WoW was far from revolutionary in its mechanics, but it was definitely revolutionary in its impact and influence it had on the MMO market and its 'themepark design' recognition it managed to insert in public awareness. So was WoW revolutionary? That all depends upon what you consider revolutionary, I guess.
Whether it'll be successful or a fail, a lot of people in the MMO gaming industry are watching SWTOR closely, if it'll be hugely successful then it'll prove the validity of the themepark design model to them and that blockbuster MMO's can work, if it isn't that successful then it'll start making people believe that WoW may have been a perfect storm.
I can see though why sandbox loving fans or themepark burn outs are vehemently against crediting any important value or success to SWTOR except a fervent wish for it to fail.
Personally, I think that SWTOR isn't revolutionary but there's no denying that its entrance into the MMO market will make waves and no small ones, whether for a good or bad end result remains to be seen.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Look at WoW.... the graphics are not really impressive yet it hosts the most subscriptions of any online game. What Bioware is going for is the ability for older systems to play this game without bogging down.
I think once people get used to the "different" style of these graphics they will grow on you. I am looking forward to the release of this game just to play something different then the classic fantasy MMO. I am also a huge Star Wars and Bioware fan so this should be a great combo.
I look forward to seeing you all in game!
Draegoth
Yeah, and then there are tons of games (MMOs or not) which are forgotten thanks to their shitty gfx
Jesus, stop creating out of WoWs formula a rule to succes - it's is one weird abomination/exception that breaks any logic
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
Yeah, and then there are tons of games (MMOs or not) which are forgotten thanks to their shitty gfx
Jesus stop doing WoW a formula a rule to succes - it's is one weird abomination/exception that breaks any logic
I think the logic is a very simple one, if a game is fun for a large and varied group of people over a long period of time, then more people will play it for a longer period of time.
Look at Minecraft, people play it despite its shitty graphics because they're having fun. Same for WoW, it may not have the graphics that other MMO's had or have but a larger group of people playing it enjoyed themselves more than they did with other MMO's, for various reasons.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Unfortunately, even if it is, I'm not sure the "industry impact" is something I will like from my own selfish point of view.
You know the old argument about gameplay over graphics? I think this argument will be something similar.
Ok, so when I played Mass Effect 1 I said to myself "this game is awesome! Feels like I'm in a movie where I direct the outcome!"
Sure, I liked it. But will I like it in an MMO? Hard to say I guess. I mean, I agree with people that say that everything in MMOs is becoming more simplistic, which I don't particularly care for. I like in depth game worlds that are immersive. So this gets down to the old Morrowind vs Oblivion argument as well. Sure, I see why people liked Oblivion, but I think Oblivion lovers should also acknowledge why many MW fans thought it was a terrible follow-up.
Besides, why do all MMOs have to follow a single model? Tell you what, lets have LOTS of MMOS! Some that make you feel like you are in a movie, and some that feel like massive, well-developed and immersive worlds.
Can the two co-exist? Possibly. But I tend to think not based in releases of the past few years. When all is said and done, even if you spend 100 million, that's still a finite number. You can't do everything.
What really scares me though is that it becomes the next standard for success. Which means the next standard for failure. Everyone's going want a piece of the success whatever that means. And if history is any indication, that simply means another ten years of uninspired idiot copycats who WILL fail.
Wait the game will have cash shops? Ok.. pre-order not happening.
Thats the biggest turn off in a game, having you pouring your money into something that should have an entertaining factor in it, not a money sink.
Scratch this one also... ( this cash shop game model is really anoying, it really takes the fun and entertainment factor out of any games, worst ideia ever! )
So you read 1 post by some random guy on the forum and your are not pre-ordering now because of it?
How about do some research people.
That poster was stating an opinion (that is dead wrong) about exclusive in game items given out to those people who ordered the CE or DDE. He sees it as a cash shop, in that case ever MMO that has ever released any type of CE should be considered to have a cash shop b/c they all come with some type of in game exclusive item.
It has never been stated anywhere that there will be a cash shop or any type of micro transactions. As a matter of fact the lead Dev Daniel Erickson has stated his dislike of Mt's and cash shops.
Am I saying it will never happen? No, anything is possible. But as of now it has not even been mentioned.
Also the people saying the in game store for the CE buyers is a cash shop are wrong as well. It has been stated at SDCC that it will be a vendor like any other in the game requiring only in game credits(money)
Please stop posting deliberately wrong information people. It only take minutes to find the truth.
Besides, why do all MMOs have to follow a single model? Tell you what, lets have LOTS of MMOS! Some that make you feel like you are in a movie, and some that feel like massive, well-developed and immersive worlds.
Can the two co-exist? Possibly. But I tend to think not based in releases of the past few years. When all is said and done, even if you spend 100 million, that's still a finite number. You can't do everything.
What really scares me though is that it becomes the next standard for success. Which means the next standard for failure. Everyone's going want a piece of the success whatever that means. And if history is any indication, that simply means another ten years of uninspired idiot copycats who WILL fail.
It's all so damn predictable.
I disagree here: you forget, there'll be several MMO's that will arrive, not only SWTOR.
Next to SWTOR we'll see GW2, The Secret World, ArcheAge, TERA, Firefall, Planetside 2, World of Darkness, Undead Labs' zombie MMO, Trion's Defiance, I think with such a wide and varied range that there's a very high chance that we'll see various different successful gameplay models next to eachother.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
My point is that games do not need outstanding graphics to do well. If its fun to play and immersive people will overlook graphics. WoW is just one example of that.
There are many other games that do well without having the "best" graphics.
i dont care if it will be revo or the next new wow or the most awesome things.
I know that im going to buy it and play cus i like starwars and sfci-fi mmo's.
End of story
No..it's not the 'End of Story'. You will soon be grinding for 200 hours through a story. Enjoy.
As opposed to grinding for 200 hours with no story, or real objective, or even a change of scenery, ala sandbox style. You know, SWTORs sounding pretty good to me.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
Wait the game will have cash shops? Ok.. pre-order not happening.
Thats the biggest turn off in a game, having you pouring your money into something that should have an entertaining factor in it, not a money sink.
Scratch this one also... ( this cash shop game model is really anoying, it really takes the fun and entertainment factor out of any games, worst ideia ever! )
So you read 1 post by some random guy on the forum and your are not pre-ordering now because of it?
How about do some research people.
That poster was stating an opinion (that is dead wrong) about exclusive in game items given out to those people who ordered the CE or DDE. He sees it as a cash shop, in that case ever MMO that has ever released any type of CE should be considered to have a cash shop b/c they all come with some type of in game exclusive item.
It has never been stated anywhere that there will be a cash shop or any type of micro transactions. As a matter of fact the lead Dev Daniel Erickson has stated his dislike of Mt's and cash shops.
Am I saying it will never happen? No, anything is possible. But as of now it has not even been mentioned.
Also the people saying the in game store for the CE buyers is a cash shop are wrong as well. It has been stated at SDCC that it will be a vendor like any other in the game requiring only in game credits(money)
Please stop posting deliberately wrong information people. It only take minutes to find the truth.
There is an In-game Vendor you have access too if you pay X more then a standard edition.
Its been said at SDCC its been said during LS. Its a fact.
If someone draws comparisons between this and a cash shop, I can understand. Its not X items included with CE, its X vendor with its own cost/reward system unique to those who paid more.
It segregates the community more then i've seen in the past on a new release, and speaks to the philosophy behind their decisions.
If i was a forecaster i would use the data available to me to create a model that might predict a potential outcome. From all the data I have seen about current titles, pricing models, and the direction online social activities are taking, the decisions EA has made indicate a very pricey, segregated community, centered around using peoples passions against them in cash grab marketing schemes over and over and over again.
"I swear -- by my life and my love for it -- that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine." - John Galt
You need to think clearly all mmorpgs if they want to succeed do the following :-
1) See what else is outhere
2) See what works and what doesnt
3) Take what works and incoporate it into your model
4) See what you can do that "improves" an aspect of your game and seperates it from your rivals.
So what has SWTOr done they know the EQ model as used by WOW works and is popular. So that makes a good basis for their design. They also know by using a similar interface people will pickup the gameplay easier.
They decided that rather than go for cutting edge graphics they would focus on a particular art style and design it to be xompatable with the average system much like WOW and EQ did because this way again it maximises the number of people who can play.
Lastly their particular hook is an indepth story driven main questline and complete vocalisation of all NPCs. Judging by how much this would have cost this alone is a major step. Is it revoloutinary some will say yea others nay personally I feel its a significant step and when combined with choices that have actual consequences could well be labeled revoloutionary.
But and this is the big BUT, We won't know how well they have it implemented until we actually play the game. Screenshots video clips and blogs about this or that feature mean nought. The proof as they say is in the pudding on the day is it FUN. When you login do you feel a thrill do you feel motivated to continue if you do then guess what the game as far as your concerned works and is a success. If you enjoy sweeping epic storylines I suspect this is the game for you. If you prefer a more haphazard approach then perhaps it isnt.. Because the story is this games hook and if your not interested in the story then how can you be interested in the game.
The only thing I think is unimaginative in terms of Bioware's design process for SWTOR is the tank/heal/dps trifecta thing.
I think with the amount of money going into this the designers could have come up with clever abilities and situations where all classes could effectively counter a situation without necessarily needing tanks or a dedicated healer.
First, combat in almost every mmo I've ever seen, including Guild Wars 2 is going to be and utterly is REPETATIVE. It all looks boring from the outside. It's only when you start playing it yourself can you really judge how boring it truly is. There are few mmos or games in general with fluid and dynamic combat that isn't the same animation because there are only so many animations one can program. So on the point of it looking boring, WoW videos look dreadfuly boring when watched, but when played, totally different feel.
Second, I agree that the idea of "revolutionary" ONLY applies to the story telling aspect. Everything else is simply taking what their predacessors have done, and improving or simply duplicating it because it worked and worked well. Everything being fully voiced AND facial animations to match IS revolutionary in the industry of MMOs. None, to my knowledge, have even tried it on this scale. So from that perspective it is revolutionary. However, the rest of it is simply duplication or improvements on previous successes.
ie. the exact same thing Blizzard did when it put together world of warcraft. They took what was out there and made it better or strait up duplicated it.
If Star Wars simply does minor improvements on the things it copies, I'll be plenty satisfied as long as i have a blaster or lightsaber in my hand.
Wait the game will have cash shops? Ok.. pre-order not happening.
Thats the biggest turn off in a game, having you pouring your money into something that should have an entertaining factor in it, not a money sink.
Scratch this one also... ( this cash shop game model is really anoying, it really takes the fun and entertainment factor out of any games, worst ideia ever! )
So you read 1 post by some random guy on the forum and your are not pre-ordering now because of it?
How about do some research people.
That poster was stating an opinion (that is dead wrong) about exclusive in game items given out to those people who ordered the CE or DDE. He sees it as a cash shop, in that case ever MMO that has ever released any type of CE should be considered to have a cash shop b/c they all come with some type of in game exclusive item.
It has never been stated anywhere that there will be a cash shop or any type of micro transactions. As a matter of fact the lead Dev Daniel Erickson has stated his dislike of Mt's and cash shops.
Am I saying it will never happen? No, anything is possible. But as of now it has not even been mentioned.
Also the people saying the in game store for the CE buyers is a cash shop are wrong as well. It has been stated at SDCC that it will be a vendor like any other in the game requiring only in game credits(money)
Please stop posting deliberately wrong information people. It only take minutes to find the truth.
There is an In-game Vendor you have access too if you pay X more then a standard edition.
Its been said at SDCC its been said during LS. Its a fact.
If someone draws comparisons between this and a cash shop, I can understand. Its not X items included with CE, its X vendor with its own cost/reward system unique to those who paid more.
It segregates the community more then i've seen in the past on a new release, and speaks to the philosophy behind their decisions.
If i was a forecaster i would use the data available to me to create a model that might predict a potential outcome. From all the data I have seen about current titles, pricing models, and the direction online social activities are taking, the decisions EA has made indicate a very pricey, segregated community, centered around using peoples passions against them in cash grab marketing schemes over and over and over again.
Yes there is an in game vendor for people who purchased the CE. You buy things there with ingame credits not real money. This is what was said at SDCC so it is a fact that there is no cash shop.
It is an in game extra that came with purchasing the CE. No different than say the eyewear in SWG or the Panda, Zergling or Diablo in WOW.
In now way shape or form is that a cash shop to me.
What it is however is a way to identify the in-game character as being one of the first in the game and one who is a CE holder.
I will not disagree with you on the last paragraph... if I was a betting man, well somewhere down the road I can see it happening.
The only thing I think is unimaginative in terms of Bioware's design process for SWTOR is the tank/heal/dps trifecta thing.
I think with the amount of money going into this the designers could have come up with clever abilities and situations where all classes could effectively counter a situation without necessarily needing tanks or a dedicated healer.
You are absolutely right here. I mean it is obvious that even in real life we have millions of people that are expert Surgeons who can skillfully drive an armored combat vehicle and expertly weild a machine gun to full effect. Oh wait . . . maybe I am wrong there. The problem is each of those skills take a massive amount of time to master and become effective with, not even taking into account the continuous experience required to kept your expertise, which therefore often excludes mastering other skills.
The reason the "Holy Trinity" is so popluar is because it so effectively mimmicks real life (in my opinion). You can be an expert in one feild and seldom more than one, while often having only a little talent in others. Some games have tried to change this up and made more generalist classes, but that often means that you are only mediocre in all feilds and tend to get pawned often (unless you know how to play your toon much better than most others).
In the end it is only in the movies that people are expert computer hackers, expert pilots, and expert marksmen all in one. Thank you Mr. Bond!
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
This game is the product of the current industry. Therefore there is no way it can change anything.
Anyone I know simply hopes it is a good product of the time ... with improvements solid enough to be entertaining.
The next evolution of gaming will be a combination of gaming medium change (not yet controlled by mega-companies like EA and Activision) and an indi company making the right product at the right time.
Basically it will be like winning the lottery, so sit back and start holding your breath.
This game serves only to reinforce the limitations in design mechanics as well as the easy marketability of ThemePark games. At its very core, the publisher wants WoW success, this is done by emulating the greatest theme park of all time and using WoW as the "style sheet" for which the EA game is built upon.
These cannot and will not change the industry in any meaningful way. It will just be the "next popular theme park game" with a different franchise attached to it. In fact, it can do more to harm the future of MMORPGs than actually help.
Games like WoW cause clones, so in a joking sense this is a CLONE WAR of sorts. IF this game is popular and the next big themepark, it will just cause more clones and the cycle will NOT be broken.
At the very least it may cause publishers to push for more sci-fi themed online games instead of the high fantasy.
Am I the only one that thought the video was mildly entertaining? I am sick of people thinking every new game has to be entirely different and break the mold. MMORPGs play a certain way and have a certain feel to them. If you don't like that feel then you dont like them. Sorry you don't like the game, I'm happy some people are getting a game they are so excited for.
On a side note the "dynamic events are the future" part just seems silly. I personally think they have left most people wanting in games like WAR and RIFT thus far. If someone can do it right more power to them, but invoation in any form is nice. I like SWTORs little space battles and the way they do quest dialog is interesting. They aren't ground breaking, but they are fun little additions.
I would like to add that I agree that SWTOR will not change the industry in any huge way, but every new game adds something to it.
Rabenwolf brings another good point, pushing more sci-fi is great for the industry, and that would be a big change.
Am I the only one that thought the video was mildly entertaining? I am sick of people thinking every new game has to be entirely different and break the mold. MMORPGs play a certain way and have a certain feel to them. If you don't like that feel then you dont like them. Sorry you don't like the game, I'm happy some people are getting a game they are so excited for.
On a side note the "dynamic events are the future" part just seems silly. I personally think they have left most people wanting in games like WAR and RIFT thus far. If someone can do it right more power to them, but invoation in any form is nice. I like SWTORs little space battles and the way they do quest dialog is interesting. They aren't ground breaking, but they are fun little additions.
I would like to add that I agree that SWTOR will not change the industry in any huge way, but every new game adds something to it.
The point youre kind of missing is that people want something new because we have already played the exact same game for the past decade. like 95% of the market has the exact same combat systems, UIs, classes/roles, and things to do. If people are going to spend the money on a "new" product and invest time in it, they tend to want it to actually be new, not a duplicate of something they already have wrapped in a different package.
Also, WAR did not have anything Dynamic. PQs were static and took place in 3 different stages in most cases. But those stages were always exactly the same an din the exact same place. They were basically just normal quests which people could participate in without having to group up. From what I understand Rift was a bit more dynamic, but still not on the same level as Dynamic Events in GW2.
Comments
I agree with Doug.... Again...
The sheer amount of money spent on SW:TOR has already changed the game industry.
No matter what happens now, the cost of making a BIG budget MMO game has gone up.
Any game that follows that did not spend 100 million or more will be judged on that fact.
Have a sense of humor, no need to get ALL MODDY !
A Simpson's quote shouldn't be worth a warning. You are lucky anyone is bothering to read this rag.
Maybe I misunderstood the question. From budget point of view you might be right, the success or fail of the game can change the market. But what I thought: it will not change the MMORPG genre. I have some frends in the beta, they told me that the game is absolutely a WoW copy from gameplay point of view. But they also told that it's very good, very polished and they love it very much. This game might fail as MMO in the long run, but as a game, I'm pretty confident that it will be a huge success.
Look at WoW.... the graphics are not really impressive yet it hosts the most subscriptions of any online game. What Bioware is going for is the ability for older systems to play this game without bogging down.
I think once people get used to the "different" style of these graphics they will grow on you. I am looking forward to the release of this game just to play something different then the classic fantasy MMO. I am also a huge Star Wars and Bioware fan so this should be a great combo.
I look forward to seeing you all in game!
Draegoth
I think the OP misunderstood the 'devil's advocate' article as representing the formal opinion of the whole mmorpg.com staff. Which it is not, reread it if you like.
So, that's 1 argument that was untrue in the OP. As for whether SWTOR is revolutionary, it depends what you categorize as revolutionary. WoW was far from revolutionary in its mechanics, but it was definitely revolutionary in its impact and influence it had on the MMO market and its 'themepark design' recognition it managed to insert in public awareness. So was WoW revolutionary? That all depends upon what you consider revolutionary, I guess.
Whether it'll be successful or a fail, a lot of people in the MMO gaming industry are watching SWTOR closely, if it'll be hugely successful then it'll prove the validity of the themepark design model to them and that blockbuster MMO's can work, if it isn't that successful then it'll start making people believe that WoW may have been a perfect storm.
I can see though why sandbox loving fans or themepark burn outs are vehemently against crediting any important value or success to SWTOR except a fervent wish for it to fail.
Personally, I think that SWTOR isn't revolutionary but there's no denying that its entrance into the MMO market will make waves and no small ones, whether for a good or bad end result remains to be seen.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Yeah, and then there are tons of games (MMOs or not) which are forgotten thanks to their shitty gfx
Jesus, stop creating out of WoWs formula a rule to succes - it's is one weird abomination/exception that breaks any logic
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
double post, sorry, my bad
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
I think the logic is a very simple one, if a game is fun for a large and varied group of people over a long period of time, then more people will play it for a longer period of time.
Look at Minecraft, people play it despite its shitty graphics because they're having fun. Same for WoW, it may not have the graphics that other MMO's had or have but a larger group of people playing it enjoyed themselves more than they did with other MMO's, for various reasons.
Key word is fun here.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I think the game will be a great success!
Unfortunately, even if it is, I'm not sure the "industry impact" is something I will like from my own selfish point of view.
You know the old argument about gameplay over graphics? I think this argument will be something similar.
Ok, so when I played Mass Effect 1 I said to myself "this game is awesome! Feels like I'm in a movie where I direct the outcome!"
Sure, I liked it. But will I like it in an MMO? Hard to say I guess. I mean, I agree with people that say that everything in MMOs is becoming more simplistic, which I don't particularly care for. I like in depth game worlds that are immersive. So this gets down to the old Morrowind vs Oblivion argument as well. Sure, I see why people liked Oblivion, but I think Oblivion lovers should also acknowledge why many MW fans thought it was a terrible follow-up.
Besides, why do all MMOs have to follow a single model? Tell you what, lets have LOTS of MMOS! Some that make you feel like you are in a movie, and some that feel like massive, well-developed and immersive worlds.
Can the two co-exist? Possibly. But I tend to think not based in releases of the past few years. When all is said and done, even if you spend 100 million, that's still a finite number. You can't do everything.
What really scares me though is that it becomes the next standard for success. Which means the next standard for failure. Everyone's going want a piece of the success whatever that means. And if history is any indication, that simply means another ten years of uninspired idiot copycats who WILL fail.
It's all so damn predictable.
So you read 1 post by some random guy on the forum and your are not pre-ordering now because of it?
How about do some research people.
That poster was stating an opinion (that is dead wrong) about exclusive in game items given out to those people who ordered the CE or DDE. He sees it as a cash shop, in that case ever MMO that has ever released any type of CE should be considered to have a cash shop b/c they all come with some type of in game exclusive item.
It has never been stated anywhere that there will be a cash shop or any type of micro transactions. As a matter of fact the lead Dev Daniel Erickson has stated his dislike of Mt's and cash shops.
Am I saying it will never happen? No, anything is possible. But as of now it has not even been mentioned.
Also the people saying the in game store for the CE buyers is a cash shop are wrong as well. It has been stated at SDCC that it will be a vendor like any other in the game requiring only in game credits(money)
Please stop posting deliberately wrong information people. It only take minutes to find the truth.
I disagree here: you forget, there'll be several MMO's that will arrive, not only SWTOR.
Next to SWTOR we'll see GW2, The Secret World, ArcheAge, TERA, Firefall, Planetside 2, World of Darkness, Undead Labs' zombie MMO, Trion's Defiance, I think with such a wide and varied range that there's a very high chance that we'll see various different successful gameplay models next to eachother.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
My point is that games do not need outstanding graphics to do well. If its fun to play and immersive people will overlook graphics. WoW is just one example of that.
There are many other games that do well without having the "best" graphics.
Just walk back down the yellow brick road to World of Warcraft, it smells like that is where you came from.
No..it's not the 'End of Story'. You will soon be grinding for 200 hours through a story. Enjoy.
It won't be a "grind" if you enjoy it. Sounds like a pretty good "end of story" to me.
As opposed to grinding for 200 hours with no story, or real objective, or even a change of scenery, ala sandbox style. You know, SWTORs sounding pretty good to me.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
There is an In-game Vendor you have access too if you pay X more then a standard edition.
Its been said at SDCC its been said during LS. Its a fact.
If someone draws comparisons between this and a cash shop, I can understand. Its not X items included with CE, its X vendor with its own cost/reward system unique to those who paid more.
It segregates the community more then i've seen in the past on a new release, and speaks to the philosophy behind their decisions.
If i was a forecaster i would use the data available to me to create a model that might predict a potential outcome. From all the data I have seen about current titles, pricing models, and the direction online social activities are taking, the decisions EA has made indicate a very pricey, segregated community, centered around using peoples passions against them in cash grab marketing schemes over and over and over again.
"I swear -- by my life and my love for it -- that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine."
- John Galt
You need to think clearly all mmorpgs if they want to succeed do the following :-
1) See what else is outhere
2) See what works and what doesnt
3) Take what works and incoporate it into your model
4) See what you can do that "improves" an aspect of your game and seperates it from your rivals.
So what has SWTOr done they know the EQ model as used by WOW works and is popular. So that makes a good basis for their design. They also know by using a similar interface people will pickup the gameplay easier.
They decided that rather than go for cutting edge graphics they would focus on a particular art style and design it to be xompatable with the average system much like WOW and EQ did because this way again it maximises the number of people who can play.
Lastly their particular hook is an indepth story driven main questline and complete vocalisation of all NPCs. Judging by how much this would have cost this alone is a major step. Is it revoloutinary some will say yea others nay personally I feel its a significant step and when combined with choices that have actual consequences could well be labeled revoloutionary.
But and this is the big BUT, We won't know how well they have it implemented until we actually play the game. Screenshots video clips and blogs about this or that feature mean nought. The proof as they say is in the pudding on the day is it FUN. When you login do you feel a thrill do you feel motivated to continue if you do then guess what the game as far as your concerned works and is a success. If you enjoy sweeping epic storylines I suspect this is the game for you. If you prefer a more haphazard approach then perhaps it isnt.. Because the story is this games hook and if your not interested in the story then how can you be interested in the game.
The only thing I think is unimaginative in terms of Bioware's design process for SWTOR is the tank/heal/dps trifecta thing.
I think with the amount of money going into this the designers could have come up with clever abilities and situations where all classes could effectively counter a situation without necessarily needing tanks or a dedicated healer.
I just wanted to respond to two things:
First, combat in almost every mmo I've ever seen, including Guild Wars 2 is going to be and utterly is REPETATIVE. It all looks boring from the outside. It's only when you start playing it yourself can you really judge how boring it truly is. There are few mmos or games in general with fluid and dynamic combat that isn't the same animation because there are only so many animations one can program. So on the point of it looking boring, WoW videos look dreadfuly boring when watched, but when played, totally different feel.
Second, I agree that the idea of "revolutionary" ONLY applies to the story telling aspect. Everything else is simply taking what their predacessors have done, and improving or simply duplicating it because it worked and worked well. Everything being fully voiced AND facial animations to match IS revolutionary in the industry of MMOs. None, to my knowledge, have even tried it on this scale. So from that perspective it is revolutionary. However, the rest of it is simply duplication or improvements on previous successes.
ie. the exact same thing Blizzard did when it put together world of warcraft. They took what was out there and made it better or strait up duplicated it.
If Star Wars simply does minor improvements on the things it copies, I'll be plenty satisfied as long as i have a blaster or lightsaber in my hand.
Yes there is an in game vendor for people who purchased the CE. You buy things there with ingame credits not real money. This is what was said at SDCC so it is a fact that there is no cash shop.
It is an in game extra that came with purchasing the CE. No different than say the eyewear in SWG or the Panda, Zergling or Diablo in WOW.
In now way shape or form is that a cash shop to me.
What it is however is a way to identify the in-game character as being one of the first in the game and one who is a CE holder.
I will not disagree with you on the last paragraph... if I was a betting man, well somewhere down the road I can see it happening.
You are absolutely right here. I mean it is obvious that even in real life we have millions of people that are expert Surgeons who can skillfully drive an armored combat vehicle and expertly weild a machine gun to full effect. Oh wait . . . maybe I am wrong there. The problem is each of those skills take a massive amount of time to master and become effective with, not even taking into account the continuous experience required to kept your expertise, which therefore often excludes mastering other skills.
The reason the "Holy Trinity" is so popluar is because it so effectively mimmicks real life (in my opinion). You can be an expert in one feild and seldom more than one, while often having only a little talent in others. Some games have tried to change this up and made more generalist classes, but that often means that you are only mediocre in all feilds and tend to get pawned often (unless you know how to play your toon much better than most others).
In the end it is only in the movies that people are expert computer hackers, expert pilots, and expert marksmen all in one. Thank you Mr. Bond!
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
This game is the product of the current industry. Therefore there is no way it can change anything.
Anyone I know simply hopes it is a good product of the time ... with improvements solid enough to be entertaining.
The next evolution of gaming will be a combination of gaming medium change (not yet controlled by mega-companies like EA and Activision) and an indi company making the right product at the right time.
Basically it will be like winning the lottery, so sit back and start holding your breath.
You stay sassy!
This game serves only to reinforce the limitations in design mechanics as well as the easy marketability of ThemePark games. At its very core, the publisher wants WoW success, this is done by emulating the greatest theme park of all time and using WoW as the "style sheet" for which the EA game is built upon.
These cannot and will not change the industry in any meaningful way. It will just be the "next popular theme park game" with a different franchise attached to it. In fact, it can do more to harm the future of MMORPGs than actually help.
Games like WoW cause clones, so in a joking sense this is a CLONE WAR of sorts. IF this game is popular and the next big themepark, it will just cause more clones and the cycle will NOT be broken.
At the very least it may cause publishers to push for more sci-fi themed online games instead of the high fantasy.
Am I the only one that thought the video was mildly entertaining? I am sick of people thinking every new game has to be entirely different and break the mold. MMORPGs play a certain way and have a certain feel to them. If you don't like that feel then you dont like them. Sorry you don't like the game, I'm happy some people are getting a game they are so excited for.
On a side note the "dynamic events are the future" part just seems silly. I personally think they have left most people wanting in games like WAR and RIFT thus far. If someone can do it right more power to them, but invoation in any form is nice. I like SWTORs little space battles and the way they do quest dialog is interesting. They aren't ground breaking, but they are fun little additions.
I would like to add that I agree that SWTOR will not change the industry in any huge way, but every new game adds something to it.
Rabenwolf brings another good point, pushing more sci-fi is great for the industry, and that would be a big change.
"cinnamon buns"
- Pickles
The point youre kind of missing is that people want something new because we have already played the exact same game for the past decade. like 95% of the market has the exact same combat systems, UIs, classes/roles, and things to do. If people are going to spend the money on a "new" product and invest time in it, they tend to want it to actually be new, not a duplicate of something they already have wrapped in a different package.
Also, WAR did not have anything Dynamic. PQs were static and took place in 3 different stages in most cases. But those stages were always exactly the same an din the exact same place. They were basically just normal quests which people could participate in without having to group up. From what I understand Rift was a bit more dynamic, but still not on the same level as Dynamic Events in GW2.