I agree but some research go's along way. the best they can do is avoid spilling beans about crafting right up until release. thats why BW does not give you to much information becuase now peeps know about character creation. they let some screens slip. and it's has about 6 more customizing options then Wow and no slides, and peeps were hoping for sliders to make the toons look like they wanted.
of course they always say it's not finished but in truth it's done and that the way it is. crafting from the leaks is an expensive costly thing to do and know ones ever got to the last tier to test the gear.
Are you guys being serious? Actually discussing a crafting system where your pet *cough* companion can go collect the resources and do all the work for you? Don't be expecting some amazingly thought out crafting system or economy to come from it.
Better do some research before you make false claims.
In demo gameplay related interviews there was mention of crafted gear that was 2nd best in slot. I could be wrong, but in my book 'second best in slot' that there's only 1 item or itemset ingame that's better.
If you have a whole plethora of level cap gear, then that still sounds pretty powerful to me, if crafting can provide the 2nd best gear ingame for various slots.
Or am I missing something here?
Yes, which is all fine and dandy for me, accept that you will need to raid to get those recipes and components as well. So whether you want to get great gear through drops / rewards or through crafting -> raiding it shall be.
Crafters should have their own end game, something thats not a raid but requires a lot of skill and or hard work to obtain, note hardwork should not equate to endless hours of boring grind like fishing or killing the same mob for hours to get a 0.0001% drop.
A few suggestions would be like the 1 and only Hunter Epic quest in wow, wow missed the ball by not taking this concept further, I think crafters need something like this.
Like to get scale of uberness, you have to go out find, track down, and then knock out some uber beast, then chip off part of its scale before it wakes up and noms you.
I am so with you one the first part but crafting endgame should not be based on combat since crafting is usually the only none combat game there is.
Make on option so that the crafter can design something of his own instead, like the masters test many real crafters had to do. You can have an instance where people can go in and look on the crafted stuff and give a score to each item (that should not have the name of the creator on it). The crafters making the best looking stuff gets their master title and the ability to craft the endgame stuff.
I promise you that many crafters would spend a long time working on their masters piece and if you only give away one of these every day (or whatever, limited number) it would be a very interesting endgame that could take at least as long time as the PvE part since only the best gets rewarded.
Crafting should have it's own endgame, that much is clear.
Are you guys being serious? Actually discussing a crafting system where your pet *cough* companion can go collect the resources and do all the work for you? Don't be expecting some amazingly thought out crafting system or economy to come from it.
Better do some research before you make false claims.
'You’ll be able to assign tasks to your companions to gather resources, to craft items at the ship’s workstation,'
Are you guys being serious? Actually discussing a crafting system where your pet *cough* companion can go collect the resources and do all the work for you? Don't be expecting some amazingly thought out crafting system or economy to come from it.
Better do some research before you make false claims.
'You’ll be able to assign tasks to your companions to gather resources, to craft items at the ship’s workstation,'
He means the yellow part which is complete nonsense and uninformed. See my former reply in this thread.
On the side, clicking on a button and watching your character make crafted items or components for an hour while you watch the tv, as done in many MMO's, has nothing to do with the complexity of a crafting system in MMO's. To say that it does is madness: watching your own avatar do the work, or watch your Companions do the work or leave and do something else why you've assigned their tasks is the same, and the latter is even more preferrable. It's the other stuff and mechanics that make up complexity, not whether you avatar or companions do the crafting.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Are you guys being serious? Actually discussing a crafting system where your pet *cough* companion can go collect the resources and do all the work for you? Don't be expecting some amazingly thought out crafting system or economy to come from it.
Companions are just an extension of your own skills. And everything they collect you can also collect , the difference is that they just provide a top up to the stockpile. As far as PvE gear goes everyone should be able to get hold of it or craft it as PvE is just that .........
Different gear for PvP only scenarios is fine but other wise this discussion is a little lame.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Are you guys being serious? Actually discussing a crafting system where your pet *cough* companion can go collect the resources and do all the work for you? Don't be expecting some amazingly thought out crafting system or economy to come from it.
Better do some research before you make false claims.
'You’ll be able to assign tasks to your companions to gather resources, to craft items at the ship’s workstation,'
It's the same dang thing that's in just about any mmo, even SWG's crafting was handled by a device. There's zero difference between pressing an option on a crafting tool, or pressing an option on your companion.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
that treadmill with chasing the carrot on the stick for gear is there and is the main end-game for SW:ToR
hope you enjoy it... I cancel my preorder because I won't play or support another mmo that does this treadmill crap anymore
Agreed. I cancelled on both RIFT and DCUO as soon as I reached endgame because there was nothing else to do besides raiding. First of all its boring and completely meaningless and second I can't commit as much time as I could have 10 years ago.
With 2 kids I can't guarantee I won't have to go AFK at some point of raiding.
Having companions to go out and farm materials and craft for you is just the same as giving everyone an alt bot. Everyone will have masses of resources and the market will flood with items no matter how much they take to make because it involves ZERO effort on the crafters side to do so.
Everyone will be resource rich. Thanks to companion bot.
Everyone will be great crafters. Thanks to companion bot.
to me, it all depends on how difficult the crafting is. if crafting involves taking two components and clicking "make", then it should make items that are the equivalent to whatever drops of a one-shottable solo mob (you click "shoot" and you get item).
if crafting takes 20 crafters 2 hours of skilled co-operative play in order to <maybe> create a couple of items if they play well, then those items should be equivalent to what 20 skilled adventurers get out of 2 hours of raiding.
The reward should match the difficulty, skill and effort involved.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
Having companions to go out and farm materials and craft for you is just the same as giving everyone an alt bot. Everyone will have masses of resources and the market will flood with items no matter how much they take to make because it involves ZERO effort on the crafters side to do so.
Everyone will be resource rich. Thanks to companion bot.
Everyone will be great crafters. Thanks to companion bot.
The market will suffer. Thanks to companion bot.
This game just shat all over crafters. GG.
Wait so there's a difference between plopping down a harvestor to farm resources, and sending a companion out to gather?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Having companions to go out and farm materials and craft for you is just the same as giving everyone an alt bot. Everyone will have masses of resources and the market will flood with items no matter how much they take to make because it involves ZERO effort on the crafters side to do so.
Everyone will be resource rich. Thanks to companion bot.
Everyone will be great crafters. Thanks to companion bot.
The market will suffer. Thanks to companion bot.
This game just shat all over crafters. GG.
Wait so there's a difference between plopping down a harvestor to farm resources, and sending a companion out to gather?
It's been ages since i played SWG, but if i remember correctly, the difference is:
1. you have to invest in a harvester.
2. you have to search (possibly for hours) for a good location to harvest (it was a big part of crafting)
3. you have to defend (or hire people to defend) said harvester
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
Pretty sure we'll see database addons like the resource ones in WoW which will tell your bot where to go.
The difference is having to do it manually with your character creates and effort gap which is why not everyone crafts in most games. If it's all done for you (SWTOR) everyone will be a crafter and everyone will be pumping out stock into the market with a never ending supply of resources that magically appear.
Having companions to go out and farm materials and craft for you is just the same as giving everyone an alt bot. Everyone will have masses of resources and the market will flood with items no matter how much they take to make because it involves ZERO effort on the crafters side to do so.
Everyone will be resource rich. Thanks to companion bot.
Everyone will be great crafters. Thanks to companion bot.
The market will suffer. Thanks to companion bot.
This game just shat all over crafters. GG.
Wait so there's a difference between plopping down a harvestor to farm resources, and sending a companion out to gather?
It's been ages since i played SWG, but if i remember correctly, the difference is:
1. you have to invest in a harvester. Harvesters of all types were pretty much dirt cheap.
2. you have to search (possibly for hours) for a good location to harvest (it was a big part of crafting) There was a web page that had every resource listed that spawned with which planet to go to for the best materials. Finding where to drop your machines was about a 2-3 minute task.
3. you have to defend (or hire people to defend) said harvester You never had to hire anyone to defend your machines. The mobs just ignored them.
Pretty sure we'll see database addons like the resource ones in WoW which will tell your bot where to go.
The difference is having to do it manually with your character creates and effort gap which is why not everyone crafts in most games. If it's all done for you (SWTOR) everyone will be a crafter and everyone will be pumping out stock into the market with a never ending supply of resources that magically appear.
This is far from the truth I have no intention what so ever of crafting anything, harvetsing or any of that. I'm much more interested in the diplomacy/missions skills of companions
Diplomacy – the art of conducting and managing negotiations
Investigation – the skill of examining evidence and following clues to discover valuable secrets
Treasure Hunting – the ability to track down and recover valuable items by investigating a series of clues
Underworld Trading – expertise in the trading of illegal goods and services
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Pretty sure we'll see database addons like the resource ones in WoW which will tell your bot where to go.
The difference is having to do it manually with your character creates and effort gap which is why not everyone crafts in most games. If it's all done for you (SWTOR) everyone will be a crafter and everyone will be pumping out stock into the market with a never ending supply of resources that magically appear.
You know that would be a bad situation, however the reality is noone will add anything to the market due to it's ease and will just craft for themselves making the whole crafting thing not just pointless but a waste of eveyones time as well.
But this is pretty much how it is for all mmo's of this type, they pick their audience and build thier game geared towards them, devs aiming for a wide audience use wow as a template and crafting isn't high on their agenda.
----- The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Pretty sure we'll see database addons like the resource ones in WoW which will tell your bot where to go.
The difference is having to do it manually with your character creates and effort gap which is why not everyone crafts in most games. If it's all done for you (SWTOR) everyone will be a crafter and everyone will be pumping out stock into the market with a never ending supply of resources that magically appear.
This is far from the truth I have no intention what so ever of crafting anything, harvetsing or any of that. I'm much more interested in the diplomacy/missions skills of companions
Diplomacy – the art of conducting and managing negotiations
Investigation – the skill of examining evidence and following clues to discover valuable secrets
Treasure Hunting – the ability to track down and recover valuable items by investigating a series of clues
Underworld Trading – expertise in the trading of illegal goods and services
Pretty sure you get multiple companions. If you really don't have atleast one being a resource bot then you're foolish tbh.
Pretty sure we'll see database addons like the resource ones in WoW which will tell your bot where to go.
The difference is having to do it manually with your character creates and effort gap which is why not everyone crafts in most games. If it's all done for you (SWTOR) everyone will be a crafter and everyone will be pumping out stock into the market with a never ending supply of resources that magically appear.
This is far from the truth I have no intention what so ever of crafting anything, harvetsing or any of that. I'm much more interested in the diplomacy/missions skills of companions
Diplomacy – the art of conducting and managing negotiations
Investigation – the skill of examining evidence and following clues to discover valuable secrets
Treasure Hunting – the ability to track down and recover valuable items by investigating a series of clues
Underworld Trading – expertise in the trading of illegal goods and services
Pretty sure you get multiple companions. If you really don't have atleast one being a resource bot then you're foolish tbh.
Why? I'm going to be a smuggler, the above things are far more in line with how i'd want my companions to help me.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Comments
I agree but some research go's along way. the best they can do is avoid spilling beans about crafting right up until release. thats why BW does not give you to much information becuase now peeps know about character creation. they let some screens slip. and it's has about 6 more customizing options then Wow and no slides, and peeps were hoping for sliders to make the toons look like they wanted.
of course they always say it's not finished but in truth it's done and that the way it is. crafting from the leaks is an expensive costly thing to do and know ones ever got to the last tier to test the gear.
Better do some research before you make false claims.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Yes, which is all fine and dandy for me, accept that you will need to raid to get those recipes and components as well. So whether you want to get great gear through drops / rewards or through crafting -> raiding it shall be.
That is the problem in my eyes.
My brand new bloggity blog.
that treadmill with chasing the carrot on the stick for gear is there and is the main end-game for SW:ToR
hope you enjoy it... I cancel my preorder because I won't play or support another mmo that does this treadmill crap anymore
Played: MCO - EQ/EQ2 - WoW - VG - WAR - AoC - LoTRO - DDO - GW/GW2 - Eve - Rift - FE - TSW - TSO - WS - ESO - AA - BD
Playing: Sims 3 & 4, Diablo3 and PoE
Waiting on: Lost Ark
Who's going to make a Cyberpunk MMO?
I am so with you one the first part but crafting endgame should not be based on combat since crafting is usually the only none combat game there is.
Make on option so that the crafter can design something of his own instead, like the masters test many real crafters had to do. You can have an instance where people can go in and look on the crafted stuff and give a score to each item (that should not have the name of the creator on it). The crafters making the best looking stuff gets their master title and the ability to craft the endgame stuff.
I promise you that many crafters would spend a long time working on their masters piece and if you only give away one of these every day (or whatever, limited number) it would be a very interesting endgame that could take at least as long time as the PvE part since only the best gets rewarded.
Crafting should have it's own endgame, that much is clear.
'You’ll be able to assign tasks to your companions to gather resources, to craft items at the ship’s workstation,'
http://www.swtor.com/info/systems/crew-skills
Sorry, what was that?
He means the yellow part which is complete nonsense and uninformed. See my former reply in this thread.
On the side, clicking on a button and watching your character make crafted items or components for an hour while you watch the tv, as done in many MMO's, has nothing to do with the complexity of a crafting system in MMO's. To say that it does is madness: watching your own avatar do the work, or watch your Companions do the work or leave and do something else why you've assigned their tasks is the same, and the latter is even more preferrable. It's the other stuff and mechanics that make up complexity, not whether you avatar or companions do the crafting.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Companions are just an extension of your own skills. And everything they collect you can also collect , the difference is that they just provide a top up to the stockpile. As far as PvE gear goes everyone should be able to get hold of it or craft it as PvE is just that .........
Different gear for PvP only scenarios is fine but other wise this discussion is a little lame.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
It's the same dang thing that's in just about any mmo, even SWG's crafting was handled by a device. There's zero difference between pressing an option on a crafting tool, or pressing an option on your companion.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
That sort of thing is always in these types of games, you don't have to take part, there is a whole game before you even get to that point.
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Agreed. I cancelled on both RIFT and DCUO as soon as I reached endgame because there was nothing else to do besides raiding. First of all its boring and completely meaningless and second I can't commit as much time as I could have 10 years ago.
With 2 kids I can't guarantee I won't have to go AFK at some point of raiding.
Not a game for me.
Having companions to go out and farm materials and craft for you is just the same as giving everyone an alt bot. Everyone will have masses of resources and the market will flood with items no matter how much they take to make because it involves ZERO effort on the crafters side to do so.
Everyone will be resource rich. Thanks to companion bot.
Everyone will be great crafters. Thanks to companion bot.
The market will suffer. Thanks to companion bot.
This game just shat all over crafters. GG.
to me, it all depends on how difficult the crafting is. if crafting involves taking two components and clicking "make", then it should make items that are the equivalent to whatever drops of a one-shottable solo mob (you click "shoot" and you get item).
if crafting takes 20 crafters 2 hours of skilled co-operative play in order to <maybe> create a couple of items if they play well, then those items should be equivalent to what 20 skilled adventurers get out of 2 hours of raiding.
The reward should match the difficulty, skill and effort involved.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
Wait so there's a difference between plopping down a harvestor to farm resources, and sending a companion out to gather?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
independent, top tier
Forced raiding is just not my thing.
and no I don't want 2nd best gear
Make crafting much less cakewalk instead - even a second job
let me earn my goods.
Give me alternatives.
SexuaLobster's Grease Portal
It's been ages since i played SWG, but if i remember correctly, the difference is:
1. you have to invest in a harvester.
2. you have to search (possibly for hours) for a good location to harvest (it was a big part of crafting)
3. you have to defend (or hire people to defend) said harvester
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
1. you have to invest time in building your companion for that purpose.
2. That is correct.
3. That is incorrect.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Pretty sure we'll see database addons like the resource ones in WoW which will tell your bot where to go.
The difference is having to do it manually with your character creates and effort gap which is why not everyone crafts in most games. If it's all done for you (SWTOR) everyone will be a crafter and everyone will be pumping out stock into the market with a never ending supply of resources that magically appear.
Your out of luck, crafting in this game is a simple click and let your bot companion do it all for you. Even more cakewalk compared to WoW.
This is far from the truth I have no intention what so ever of crafting anything, harvetsing or any of that. I'm much more interested in the diplomacy/missions skills of companions
Diplomacy – the art of conducting and managing negotiations
Investigation – the skill of examining evidence and following clues to discover valuable secrets
Treasure Hunting – the ability to track down and recover valuable items by investigating a series of clues
Underworld Trading – expertise in the trading of illegal goods and services
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
You know that would be a bad situation, however the reality is noone will add anything to the market due to it's ease and will just craft for themselves making the whole crafting thing not just pointless but a waste of eveyones time as well.
But this is pretty much how it is for all mmo's of this type, they pick their audience and build thier game geared towards them, devs aiming for a wide audience use wow as a template and crafting isn't high on their agenda.
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Pretty sure you get multiple companions. If you really don't have atleast one being a resource bot then you're foolish tbh.
Why? I'm going to be a smuggler, the above things are far more in line with how i'd want my companions to help me.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I SOOOOOO agree with that. In our dreams, I suppose. I really wish that some game would do that.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club