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Except for Vanguard, mobs are way to easy to kill, WHY?
eddieg50
Member UncommonPosts: 1,809
And I am a solo player for the most part and I am complaining, it just makes the game boring if you can easily kill mobs. Yes you have your PvP action if you like that, but than you have to put up with ganking and unbalanced characters, and the games that have good PvP usually have poor PvE. I am talking about games like LOTRO and WOW and Aion and EQ2 and Fallout online and DCUO , etc, etc, It actually takes away the desire to group , because if solo is easy how easy is group. I guess I could play something like EVE but to me that is an empty game (my opinion) It is a shame that these games have made it so easy to get bored
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Conan has some very challanging PVE both solo and group especially in the newer areas. NOT easy mode by far.
The newer gamers don't want a challenge, they want progression.
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They want to keep the carrot just a few inches from the horses nose, if its more than one foot the horse will lose interest.
I agree and until late,,FFXI was the ONLY game where combat was challenging and needed a group.The trend is one of easy mode,everyone wants instant reward for doing little,and yes we have heard every excuse under the sun ,why they deserve it.This trend in game design is totally ruining it for me,i had my fall back in FFXI,where i could meet people and have fun grouping in a challenging combat structure,but now there is not one game offering this anymore.
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I played FFXI from beta up. I loved that game for its community feel. I remember when Dragoons got he shaft and you had that sub community inside the larger. Dragoons going around helping each other and hitting the /salute command. Awesome community. Then added a difficult setting. No game has ever produced a difficult PVE setting as difficult as FFXI. Anyone who says otherwise never got to fight Absolute Virtue back at 75 cap.
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Actually it is that they split monsters into group monsters and solo monsters -- and set the quests so that fighting monsters above your level do not yield anything special.
A lot of the problem is that dichotomy and is why you have a better time in vanguard...
I am assuming these solo challenges are fighting 3 star monsters.
There is no such thing in most other games -- they have something like 1 1/2 star monsters and 5 star monsters and nothing inbetween.
Yeah , mmorpg's are SO easy in open world it is insluting , not to mention very very very boring. Really fighting all those fights when you know that you will win is so boring. I used to read newspaper and fight mobs in open world and still win no problems , just spamming one-two skills
Mobs are still too easy to kill, it takes about 5 mobs of the same level to take down a single player.
Good question, OP. I think it is some kind of ego thing, if 1 Vs 1 would be challenging you wouldn't feel like a demi good or something. I wish MMOs added a little more realism here, it is not more boring to fight 1 opponents then 5 as long as the challenge level is right.
But I blame movies, they always teach us that a hero easily can beat then bad guys.
More challenging mobs would mean you would have to play more tactical and that is a good thing in my book.
Players don't want to die. They don't want to have weaknesses. They want to be gods, killing dozens of enemies at once or without a break.
To advance in MMORPG PvE (at least in the solo part), you are not required to be a good player or have great reactions or cunning strategies. You just have to invest time. That's it. If people would die, people would be annoyed and switch to another game.
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
There are currently two options:
1. Easy mobs. These include mobs with low health, low damage, and zero challenge.
2. Hard mobs. These include mobs with high health, high damage and are a challenge because it is a race between your health and their health.
What we need is a third option:
3. Hard mobs. These would include mobs with medium health, medium damage, and would be a challenge because they have depth and can actually react to your abilities using their own. Each mob would be a different fight, requiring actual thought.
Until we have option 3, I vote for option 1. Anything else is just creating a time sink that doesn't need to be created. It isn't a challenge, it just takes longer.
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It's because killing mobs is MMO 101, bread and butter, whatever you want to call it - every mouth breather out there HAS to be able to do it successfully to at least gain that most basic feeling of satisfaction of accomplishing something.
Are you bored because you are progressing without an witness or because you prefer killing kobolds next to the guy wearing epic plate with the Sword of a Thousand Truths?
No matter... I can agree with you some and offer the following as another viewpoint:
Long ago, killing the male lion surrounded by ten female lions seemed very realistic and worth the time to do. The females were of normal power and rating, while the male was a bit harder to kill... sometimes, depending on you training and gear, you were not able to kill the male lion alone. Therefore, you grouped to get the task done.
Later, devs added mob tags such as, 'Epic', 'Alpha', or 'Elite' for example. They even went so far as spawning rare mobs on occassion. These 'tagged mobs' are mainstay and very common in every emerging MMO that I know of... thus it is an effort to engage players with players.
PVP is the same type idea. You can't PVP yourself.
A rusty sword or crooked stave is all we ever needed to feel competent in the mob world. Having your BFF there is optional and doesn't necessarily mean that your BFF shouldn't be there. There are very few games, if any, where you hit a mob brick wall right out of training. These high-end mobs are not stalking you. They are simply scratching a hole in the ground ebneath them awaiting your arrival, where if it seems you are well-prepared, they will meet their demise much easier. Some, by the nature of thier existence, will welcome you to a solo fight where in the end you will die so bad that your account will subsequently delete itself automatically.
True. Some mobs are just plain easy to kill. Some mobs are hard to kill. Some mobs are almost impossible to kill. The adtage, "Don't bring a knife to a Gun Fight" prevails...
If you think the mob in front of you is a huggable-bunny-ride than so be it. I just hope nobody see's me dying from the fluffy wonderment of a level 444 rabbit.
But you know what? Gaming is really something we do inbetween the friendships that we build. Nobody wants to die alone or live forever.
Good topic.
Take Lord of the Rings online for example. I played since Beta right up to F2P. Used to be alot of grouping thoughout the levels because you HAD to group to finish the book quests. Now you get a buff that you can finish the books solo. My problem with the way Lotro went was you can solo all the way up to Moria instances and not have to group at all til then. Once you need a group to get your Moria gear, noone in the party even knows what or how to use a Conjunction, Tanks are lost because they never had to protect a group, Healers cant keep the Tank alive because they dont know how a Tank operates, Pets aggro everything in an instance because Casters forget to put them on passive. I am not stuck on Lotro with this story, I also Played Rift which I had two lvl 50 toons within a month and my Ranger/Bard had all his T1 gear. Easy. How easy? I work from 6:30am to 4pm and I played a few hours a night usually from 7pm until 10pm.
I agree that MMO's now days are "Hit the easy button" which is why I have recently switched my attention to Vanguard, and I am in heaven. I die ALOT, but with the community and gameplay content I dont even care. I am stuck with Vanguard until "they" ruin that one as well.
Most people play games for a little fun and to escape the challenges of their every day life. If you need challenge, you should seek the real world as there is more than you can handle there.
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Often it fits into lore that mobs should be easy, most games put you as some kid of hero, demi-god, awesome fighter or superior mage. A skeleton or wolf shouldn't be a problem.
Also I think the combat animations sort of limit the difficulty a mob can be. I would like harder mobs too, more of a challenge, but I dont want it in the form of more HP and more damage. It really isnt that fun just standing still taking and giving out blows. To make it somewhat interesting to fight mobs they have to be fairly easy in order to make the players not poke their eyes out from boredom of lousy animations and AI.
Because mobs are essentially powerups. They are a measured way to move you steadily toward advancement.
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I hate how mmorpgs are so easy these days, i recently just tried vanguard and loved it, i actually died at lvl 7! this is so rare for me and i loved it, an actual challenge! but then i was introduced into the diplomacy system and that turned me off the game completely.. *sigh*
I think they make mobs easy to kill in mmorpgs because most people dont like dieing and then they get frustrated and have a risk of leaving the game, so they make mobs easy to kill so players feel all uber, but sorry Devs theres still alot of us out there who enjoy having a challenge and taking the risk of dieing!
Sorry if i went off topic
The only way to have a challenging pve is if the games get rid of their f**king autoattack and skills that do this and that and start implementing action combat like attack/block/dodge RPG games have, where u actually have to watch what ur enemy does and when hes most vulnerable. But ofc mmos will never have that, because autoattack and a half screen skillbar is the way to go.
If they made, ill take WoW as an example cuz its the most universally understood mmo today, mobs hit 30% harder, would that really make for a challenging pve or just plain stupid with the combat mechanic it has? How can it feel challenging to u if u can't actually feel the combat by hitting a few right buttons or can't do anything about the damage ur taking? Sure grouping would the the solution but then again, u already have content intended for group play. And we're back at the begining of my post.
Just my five cents.
Very true. And too bad that progression by these newer 9and mostly younger generation) players is measured by levels & number of kills. Not by depth of character & exploration
EQ2 has it all....
there are 7 type of difficulty mobs for every level.... some come in groups some solo..
Try soloing equall levl ^^ an ^^^ mobs in EQ2 and there will be a challenge for sure....
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This is my single biggest issue with the current MMO's.
I feel that simple diablo style soloing is ruining MMOs. I'm suprised this is not a major concern of most MMO players. I quit WoW due to the solo game having no challenge or strategy.
At least games like EQ have tactics and a bit of strategy to kill a mob. You don't just jump in to a group of mobs and aoe them down. These newer games need to make solo combat use some strategy (and no I don't mean FPS lameness).
Because if they were too hard you would complain that they are too hard.
I've noticed some of the posters have not played some of the older MMO's. You didn't tank every mob...and thus it is not a race between your health and the mobs. Snares and roots made this possible.
I think overall we agree that solo combat needs some more strategy.
The primary problem is balancing for PvP ends up killing any powerful PvE skills (snares and root) that would make soloing more risky/interesting. I just wish these games would make different rules for PvE and PvP.