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To the people currently unhappy about the MMO market
sanshi44
Member UncommonPosts: 1,187
I figured ill make a constructive post after readin a few thread in this forums, This thread is for the people who are currently not happy about the current ways of the MMO market. I would like people to list what they would like to see in a game so game developers know what the community is looking for.
This is what i would like to see
- A world Rich in Lore
- Death penalty, i quite like the corpse runs from EQ 1
- A world that consists of more than 10 races each with there different starting city.
- A game where there are mroe than 8 unique classes
- A Large world with lots of unique areas
- Travel between islands made by a ship that takes around 10 minutes (Kinda like how Everquest 1 boat travel worked) this was a nice time to relax and watch the scenery go right by, you can also add little minigames like a little gambling onboard.
- A more group orintated game that still allows solo players to solo to max lvl, although it will be tougher
- A game where you dont hit lvl cap in 2 weeks of playing im thinking 6 months of casual playing to hit lvl cap, however there needs to be thing to do appart from lvling, include low lvl raids, and so on (allow mentoring down aswell to lower lvls aswell and stop high lvl player from running people through)
- No instances, i dont like the idea of being the only group in 1 area lets leave the whole instancing thing in the current MMO market
- PvE must be challenging.
- PvP server that consists of more than 2 teams (for example Everquest 1 had a PvP team server than consisted of 4 different teams consisting of 3 races each different colour names indicated the team they were on it was the short races vs Elves vs evil races vs good races it added to an intresting element in pvp)
- A player controled world for example a npc wants to build a house in a certain area, she ask player 2 collect certain materials when the npc has enough she makes a house and so on, in some cases you can collect more resources and the house become a village and then a town then a city, however to regulate this npc attack the cities and if it not defended it reverts back a phase in development.
- Dynamic events for example a mob seiging a NPC city could u imaging what it would be like making a new character and loging in for the first time to find out the the city is being attacking by waves of low lvl mobs.
-All npcs can be killed by anyone, city guards/leaders quests npcs however doing so will make you loose faction with that city and posible raise it somewhere else (Everquest 1 did this realy well)
- Guild housing or even guild cities
- Player houses
- Limited way of instant travel say 1 portal on each island in the world 2 if it a large continent that takes you to one location which can be used to port to the other portals.
- Remove ! mark for quest givers make players interact witht he NPC to see if they have a quest to offer.
Thats all i can think of for now that i would like to see, i appologise for any spelling mistakes its late here and my brain not working 100% : P, feel free to add any comments however plz make in constructive, I would also prefer that people try not to post anything that rresmebles a WoW clones since this is for the people who are currently unhappy with the market and we dont need another doublacite game.
Note - alot of these suggestion were in everquest 1 to me it was one of the best games ive played.
Comments
Yeah, at least in my opinion you hit the nail on the head of what would be my dream MMO. My MMO days started with EQ1 when Kunark released. I think the thing I miss the most is the sense of accomplishment you get even when leveling. I'm not talking about leveling being hard just for the sake of being hard. I miss running around that Commonlands tunnel in EQ1 just so I might get to see someone's max level toon.
*Sigh... those were the days.
"Life is 10% of what happens to you and 90% of how you react to it."
Aye every lvl you got was an accomplsihment even dinging to lvl 2 felt like an accomplishment because the mobs were alot harder than they are currently in games, atm its imposible to die to a lvl 1 mob and ur equal lvl because u out regen it.
Agreed.
I would add one more thing.
- NO CASH SHOP. any cash shop, vanity or no vanity. Nothing , null, nada. They really destroy experience and tend to expand
For the most part your thread sound like a description of what Guild Wars 2 will be.You just outlined a gam with a built in kiddie filter.........
My friend,
Developers do not speak in terms such as you. When making & designing a game, the very first thing you decide is whether or not the game is going to be a expensive game to build, using an Open World design ($40 million +)... or a very cheap game to make, using instancing and zones ($40k ~ $5m).
AFTER THAT DECISION^ is made... then you can conceptulize what game mechanics can/will work within your engine & game world.
All the stuff (& fluff) you speak about in the opening post, is a wish list based on nothing. You do not even understand how to present your thoughts in terms of game mechanics & building a MMO. Instead, all you know is thing you like inside a game.
But, if you don't understand the mechanics behind those things, then you can rarely offer a knowledgable suggestion.
All you are saying, is that you want to play ArchAge(/GW2).. and that you like open worlds with free roaming environments.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Dark Age of Camelot with an entirely new graphics engine with crysis-like graphics...epic win!
Update the graphics/sounds and UI of Asheron's Call = Epic Win! If Turbine did that, they'd make a bajillion dollars/euros/other currency.
I'm still clinging to the hope that they'll someday realize this.
Asherons call2-darktide server with free for all pvp or follow up similar to AC2 maybe AC3 not like AC1 that would be grave mistake.
This game was good mix of party play and solo you could explore by foot or mount or travel through wormholes.
Game was one big open world with no instance and not with dumb quest HUBS like most mmo's have these days AC2 had limited npcs. Skill tree to put xp in and make what ever class you want or untrain it and make other class. With some damn unique RACES like TUMEROK and LUGIAN and some unique classes like TACT, clawbearer and hivekeeper to name but a few.
Every race 3 of them tumerok-lugians-humans later also emprians and drudge but never saw them i left before expansion, had there own classes.
This game was a true HIBRID Sandbox/themepark. And still have awesome graphics comepare to many mmo's these days.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
A lot of that stuff is very Vanguard like as an old fashioned open ended game,with multiple options and no real linear path to follow,this game is from the golden age when WOW was just getting it's claws into the countless sheep after nothing more than phat lewtz.!!
Still waiting for that game to take me away and immerse me again atm VG is doing a decent job.
There is a very good reason that most MMOs coming out now have are a lot more solo-friendly; because that's what most people want. Even many raiders are tired of the demanding schedule that some guilds force on them.
More players these days have limited time to play. So things like timesinks, long meaningless travel, having to click on NPCs needlessly, all have to go. Let's get the players playing. They needs lot of QoL stuff, minimal clicks for inventory or auction house selling, swapping gear around, etc.
That would be doing work and being subject to the harsh criticism they dish out. They can't stand that because all they do is perfect. Not that they actually do any work.
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Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Well maybe its time that changed and we actuly had some people actully doing their job and make a good game without the 99% of bugs with last few years games.
You are talking about a different thing here.
You don't like timesinks, because it prevents you from clicking on mobs. That's fine, if you define a MMO as a mass-click-on-mobs. If you define it in a social, community oriented way like sanshi, timesinks are much needed. Maybe you should just try one of the old school games, not because of the great gameplay, but because of the great people you will meet.
I agree that a cumbersome user interface is bad (FF14, cough), but I do not agree that something like medding 10 seconds after each fight must be avoided.
Basically most old school players want their old games back with new graphics and new content. There is nothing around for them at the moment, so they tend to be quite unhappy with those follow-the-exclamation-mark games.
Currently playing: EverQuest
Waiting for Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen
Better leave the IT stuff to the IT guys - they usually know it better ;-)
I don't think that any developer will read these wish lists that are posted on these forums anyway, but they are a nice timesink :-)
Currently playing: EverQuest
Waiting for Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen
Am I seeing the same list as the rest of you? The original post is full of absolutely awful ideas. I'm with SwampRob on this.
If you're going to create a list of good things to change in an MMOG, focus on stuff that actually matters. Longer boat trips? Making the current quest system (which is horrible) harder to use? Ugh.
Focus on improving combat systems, increasing customization of characters, diplomacy, and making things dynamic where technology allows rather than demanding the impossible. Remove levels entirely, don't add more and make them longer.
Focus on the root of the problem rather than bandaid solutions. For example, I understand you want fewer "instant travel" options because it allows players to skip too much content. The bandaid solution would be to force players to travel for hours to get to the same place, while the root of the problem is how worthless the content is. Why would people want to travel through a level 20 zone when they're level 1,000? Keep the portals, keep instant travel, but make those zones worth going to.
Go play a Korean MMOG if you want a huge grind with little content. Keep enormous time sinks out of my games.
Sarcasm is not a crime!
To the OP, I'd take that game in a heartbeat
That's the kind of stuff I love in my mmorpgs, along with things like realistic day/night cycles (with DARK nights), torches and braziers being lit at night time, boat trips are awesome and the longer the better for me, dynamic weather, etc...
The old MUDs, M59, UO, EQ1, AC1... for me, nothing has come close since, and I have tried almost everything. It's the reason I still play those games today.
Never said i wanted a world with no load bars i am fine with having 1 area then a zone line to the next like the old games, i would rather not have instancing which is loading into an area where only your group can go. to do an dounguen.
I am aware stright off the bat it would of been expensive but i just wanted to voice my option of what i would like to see in a game.
If i could i would.
Can someone develop [insert dream game here + free coffee for all subscribers + free massage through your screen + everything you think of even though you know it costs 8 zillions dollars to develop and that there is not enough money on earth to develop the MMO you dream of] ????
You say: "If I could I would"
EA/Arenanet/Bioware/Ubisoft/Trion/Funcom/... reply: "If I could I would"
All your ideas aren't even that fun as already pointed out. Not sure if they would attract a big enough player base to make their investment on such a game profitable, unless you (and the other 100 playing the game) are ready to pay a $300,000 subscription/month.
Sorry, this is a bit of a "destructive post" as opposed to your initial "constructive post", you have some nice ideas but really it seems more like a dream than anything else...
Seems to me your stuck in the present style of WoW gaming and dont want to try somthing new your personlity is just like the CEOs of the major game companies atm. Also you dont look at the bigger picture from what i can see you just look at what infront of your and dont expand on that.
I am afraid that the game OP would like will make TOR look like a low budget game, at least if we are talking nice graphics and bugg free.
There is only a few companies that both afford and have the competence for that, and I am not sure any of them would dare to gamble the sum we are talking about.
I am happy with just a few games that aren't reskinned older games myself. A few devs that try to think outside the box and make their own mechanics instead of just doing exactly the same as everyone else.
It is at least slightly more likely to actually happen.
10 different races in 10 different start cities, unless a "city" is 4 houses and a small quest hub that would be a massive project that I don't think anyone ever made before, at least not when the game launches. I am very impressed that ANET actually have half that many starting cities at launch, that is really rare.
While I don't mind death penalty corpse runs are stupid waste of time in my opinion. Never liked them in the old games and frankly are they both illogical lore wise and just a rather boring waste of player time. Lineage death penalty on the other hand was great. Besides some XP you sometimes dropped an item randomly when you died. If the party wiped any wandering monster would pick it up and add it to it's loot list. That is scary enough to make people think twice before taking stupid risks, makes PvP interesting but unlike full looting still makes getting gear fun.
Besides that all OPs points are fine, even though killing questgivers should give really bad faction points. I think I prefer GW2s dynamic quest system instead in this case, since you can have a griefer that kills all questgivers all the time otherwise.
You know, I am not so sure about that. Sure, there are some people that hate grouping and only solo but most people solo level up because it is faster today that by grouping.
I think it is mainly the games itself that makes so many people solo by rewarding that and punishing grouping before the endgame. Reward people for doing stuff together instead of punishing it and you'll see a lot more grouping fast.
As for long travel being boring, that really depends on how you do it. Sitting on a boat for 20 minutes never were fun in the old games, that is true. But frankly you could make that fun as well. For one thing you could add gambling to the boat, some dicing and cardgames were we can have a little fun instead of stupidly staring at the sea would help. Occasional pirate attacks also would liven up things (everything gets better with pirates).
Land travel could also be made fun with a little effort. Dynamic events that are interesting along the roads would help a lot. Amd of course a teleport service for the right kind of money between wizards tower would make it possible to get fast somewhere if you are willing to pay for it.
I think travel can be made fun both for casual and hardcore gamers if you make it the right way. Just locking your mount to run straight ain't fun or interesting and are therefor just a waste of players time but it doesn't have to be that way.
I really agree with you on unneccesarily clicking though. If it ain't fun it should be removed from the game, we all play to have fun and boring time sinks is just stealing time that I could use better for other stuff.
I have to agree with san seems to me like you dont liek change and want to be trapped forever in the poinless gameplay of WoW and almost ALL of todays current MMO's...
What's really needed (and it would solve all sorts of issues brought up constantly here) is a commercially available MMO game engine that could be modded by anyone who bought it. An engine that cost a reasonable amount, and could be fitted out to the buyer's ideal...by that individual or group. When you look at what the modding communities for various games have done, they've produced amazing assets for those games, at times far surpassing the original designers.
While it might not end up being as pretty as the high priced spreads, the gameplay available could be tailored to fit different niches. The very high cost of setting up MMOs almost inevitably leads to a certain amount of homogenization; or outright failure.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.