Since, apparently, I need to spell out EXACTLY what I meant, here goes:
I'm aware of the use of NDAs throughout the gaming industry. I'm aware that Bioware isn't doing anything other companies haven't done.
What I think is idiotic is the fact that they lifted only the press NDA. And only a portion of it. And only for a portion of the game. While leaving the NDA for "common" testers in-tact.
Let's be realistic here. Most online gaming sites w/ press people playing the SWTOR beta aren't going to be very hard on the game if they see things they don't like. They might mention them in passing, or critique them off-handedly, but they likely won't lay it all on the line. They, and the sites they represent, stand to lose too much ad revenue and/or promotional goodies if they do that.
We're 2 months from release. Tell me why they can't lift the frikkin' NDA for everyone. Tell me why they won't even lift the entire NDA for the press (not that lifting the entire NDA will have huge negative effects, for the reasons listed above).
I'd tell you why, but then I'd have to kill everyone who read it .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The SUCK part of this media NDA lift is all the BS and outright lies about the game I am reading and as a beta tester can not challenge with the truth because we are still under NDA.
Almost every " review " I am reading is like some kind of press release canned by bioware. Really annoying how corrupted gamesites, and game " reviewers " have become.
I am willing to bet some of these so called " reviewers " have not even been in the game from some of the crap they are writing.
You can plant a rose bush in a pile of manure, but it doesnt make it a rose garden.
Nice rant, but you do realize that there are a lot of leaks from actual beta testers regarding this game, and that a very large amount of them are even more positive than the media previews? How do you account for that? Does EA/Bioware pay their beta testers to break NDA and leak positive info about the game as well?
And it's ironic that you claim some of these "Reviewers" probably didn't even play the game, when it's been pretty obvious that some of the hate spread about the game on these very forums come from people "claiming" they took part in beta just to strengthen their arguments against the game, when it's obvious from some of the things they say that they didn't.
Actually though, I hope the NDA never gets lifted. I enjoy watching the hates nerdrage over the fact that TOR is getting some positive feedback. Witnessing them justify it with cries of "Bribery! Conspiracy! Extortion!" makes me laugh every time.
Anyway, back on topic: I don't agree with the OP. This game is definitely a casual game, and Bioware never made any claim otherwise. I haven't actually seen any previews claiming that it wasn't for the casual player, so I'm not sure which ones he read.
Some people always think any game is too easy or hard, that is just how we work.
But too "casual" or "hardcore"is not good terms. Many so called "hardcore" thinks that it is about skills and difficulties, but it really isn't.
I met many casual players in games like Guildwars that do the hardest content in the game (and it is rather hard compared to most games there), the difference is that they only can put in a few hours each week, not that they suck at playing. Many casual players today are in fact old MMO vets that can't play that much nowadays since they got family and work, and those guys are good enough to laugh at most "hardcore" games today.
So what do you mean with casual OP? Difficulty, timesinks or something else?
I myself havn't tried TOR yet so I have no opinion either on the difficulty or the amount of timesinks in TOR.
Im with loke666 on this (differance being ive played the game for almost 2 months now) What i see as hardcore may differ quite a bit form the OP....And Im a long time Vet of mmo's with roots that go back to the mid 70's for RPG's. While I still cant say what Id like to about ToR I can say that the game is not easy mode. If like me you only have so much time to put into a mmo and still want to feel like your "in" the game and compet with someone who plays 8-10 hours a day, Id say you will be ok with how things work in ToR. again just my opnion with a littel inside knowledge.
Can you supply links to those write-ups, or at least quote the parts that say the game isn't too casual?
I've played the beta at length, but can't share my opinion with you because of Bioware's retarded effing NDA. Idiots.
I can't believe Bioware created this NDA thing for its beta testers. It's crazy that they are doing something no other gaming company in the history of gaming has ever done. Idiots!!!
Yes and I can't believe you didn't donate a couple of million dollars to help with the development costs. Good on Bioware they have done a fantastic job....
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
It depends on what class and AC you pick, for some classes it will be really easy (BH and Trooper are reknown for being the easiest classes in the game.) While others are much more difficult (Smuggler and IA.)
If you played thru either ME, you know that to get all acheivements that you have to beat Insanity level. Me wasnt so bad, as you had all prior equipment/upgrades.
ME2 let you keep your levels/weapons....but the upgrades had to all be done over. It made that game rough to finish on Insanity lvl.
I would say BW knows how to make ya work for something.
Asking Devs to make AAA sandbox titles is like trying to get fine dining on a McDonalds dollar menu budget.
Do we really understand what casual is? My opinion of casual is time-based. Casual games require less time to get more content. Non-casual games are opposite.
A good portion of MMO players don't agree letting players who can't dedicate extensive hours into the base of their community.
I hate to say it, but more times then not, gamers hate change.
Remove an ability? /ragequit
Add an ability? /ragequit
Dungeon finder? /unsubscribe
Create an extra tab on the chat-bar? /superragequit.
Anyway, back on topic: I don't agree with the OP. This game is definitely a casual game, and Bioware never made any claim otherwise. I haven't actually seen any previews claiming that it wasn't for the casual player, so I'm not sure which ones he read.
There was an interview at gamescom where one of the designers from bioware stated that their goal was good accessibility and great depth at the same time:
Now, accessibility is this casual-solo-crap that we all know from Rift and WoW. I think, we need to accept that it has to be a part of modern games. Having depth on the other hand is the part of the game, when the tutorial has been done, i.e. when we are out for dungeons... erm... flashpoints. Many so-called WoW-clones miss that depth, maybe Bioware will teach them what a RPG is meant to be - we will see.
I am very happy about what I heard about swtor in the last days. Especially that there is no dungeon finder
Has nothing to do with how long your play sessions are either. It's all in how much the game appeals to you.
The game determines whether someone is casual or hardcore. Not the difficulty or artificial timesinks, although this makes the rewards more meaningful, which in turn can make gear grinds an incentive to some, but a deterent to others. But the gear grind is failing to be an incentive anymore. Gear grinds being the ONLY longterm goal.
The games arent casual, people just dont enjoy them enough to dedicate more time. They want stuff quicker when they arent enjoying themselves. Remember that always!!!
Basically, as gear (naturally over time) becomes less an incentive to play, the less people will play. The more they will want out of their short play time.
Look at the longterm goals a game offers. If those goals are in sync with the desires of gamers (or core audience) at that time. you will succeed. The masses will follow. They always follow. Remember that always!!
DERP!!
Anyway, Good luck to Bioware (and EA). Hope your Christmas bonus' are PHAT and you're too busy adding servers to mess up the fun!!
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
Comments
I'd tell you why, but then I'd have to kill everyone who read it
.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Nice rant, but you do realize that there are a lot of leaks from actual beta testers regarding this game, and that a very large amount of them are even more positive than the media previews? How do you account for that? Does EA/Bioware pay their beta testers to break NDA and leak positive info about the game as well?
And it's ironic that you claim some of these "Reviewers" probably didn't even play the game, when it's been pretty obvious that some of the hate spread about the game on these very forums come from people "claiming" they took part in beta just to strengthen their arguments against the game, when it's obvious from some of the things they say that they didn't.
Actually though, I hope the NDA never gets lifted. I enjoy watching the hates nerdrage over the fact that TOR is getting some positive feedback. Witnessing them justify it with cries of "Bribery! Conspiracy! Extortion!" makes me laugh every time.
Anyway, back on topic: I don't agree with the OP. This game is definitely a casual game, and Bioware never made any claim otherwise. I haven't actually seen any previews claiming that it wasn't for the casual player, so I'm not sure which ones he read.
Some people always think any game is too easy or hard, that is just how we work.
But too "casual" or "hardcore"is not good terms. Many so called "hardcore" thinks that it is about skills and difficulties, but it really isn't.
I met many casual players in games like Guildwars that do the hardest content in the game (and it is rather hard compared to most games there), the difference is that they only can put in a few hours each week, not that they suck at playing. Many casual players today are in fact old MMO vets that can't play that much nowadays since they got family and work, and those guys are good enough to laugh at most "hardcore" games today.
So what do you mean with casual OP? Difficulty, timesinks or something else?
I myself havn't tried TOR yet so I have no opinion either on the difficulty or the amount of timesinks in TOR.
Im with loke666 on this (differance being ive played the game for almost 2 months now) What i see as hardcore may differ quite a bit form the OP....And Im a long time Vet of mmo's with roots that go back to the mid 70's for RPG's. While I still cant say what Id like to about ToR I can say that the game is not easy mode. If like me you only have so much time to put into a mmo and still want to feel like your "in" the game and compet with someone who plays 8-10 hours a day, Id say you will be ok with how things work in ToR. again just my opnion with a littel inside knowledge.
Yes and I can't believe you didn't donate a couple of million dollars to help with the development costs. Good on Bioware they have done a fantastic job....
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
It depends on what class and AC you pick, for some classes it will be really easy (BH and Trooper are reknown for being the easiest classes in the game.) While others are much more difficult (Smuggler and IA.)
If you played thru either ME, you know that to get all acheivements that you have to beat Insanity level. Me wasnt so bad, as you had all prior equipment/upgrades.
ME2 let you keep your levels/weapons....but the upgrades had to all be done over. It made that game rough to finish on Insanity lvl.
I would say BW knows how to make ya work for something.
Asking Devs to make AAA sandbox titles is like trying to get fine dining on a McDonalds dollar menu budget.
Do we really understand what casual is? My opinion of casual is time-based. Casual games require less time to get more content. Non-casual games are opposite.
A good portion of MMO players don't agree letting players who can't dedicate extensive hours into the base of their community.
I hate to say it, but more times then not, gamers hate change.
Remove an ability? /ragequit
Add an ability? /ragequit
Dungeon finder? /unsubscribe
Create an extra tab on the chat-bar? /superragequit.
Played - M59, EQOA, EQ, EQ2, PS, SWG[Favorite], DAoC, UO, RS, MXO, CoH/CoV, TR, FFXI, FoM, WoW, Eve, Rift, SWTOR, TSW.
Playing - PS2, AoW, GW2
There was an interview at gamescom where one of the designers from bioware stated that their goal was good accessibility and great depth at the same time:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqEzeOPP2-s
Now, accessibility is this casual-solo-crap that we all know from Rift and WoW. I think, we need to accept that it has to be a part of modern games. Having depth on the other hand is the part of the game, when the tutorial has been done, i.e. when we are out for dungeons... erm... flashpoints. Many so-called WoW-clones miss that depth, maybe Bioware will teach them what a RPG is meant to be - we will see.
I am very happy about what I heard about swtor in the last days. Especially that there is no dungeon finder
Currently playing: EverQuest
Waiting for Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen
Casual = someone who enjoys the game.
Hardcore = someone who loves the game.
Has nothing to do with how long your play sessions are either. It's all in how much the game appeals to you.
The game determines whether someone is casual or hardcore. Not the difficulty or artificial timesinks, although this makes the rewards more meaningful, which in turn can make gear grinds an incentive to some, but a deterent to others. But the gear grind is failing to be an incentive anymore. Gear grinds being the ONLY longterm goal.
The games arent casual, people just dont enjoy them enough to dedicate more time. They want stuff quicker when they arent enjoying themselves. Remember that always!!!
Basically, as gear (naturally over time) becomes less an incentive to play, the less people will play. The more they will want out of their short play time.
Look at the longterm goals a game offers. If those goals are in sync with the desires of gamers (or core audience) at that time. you will succeed. The masses will follow. They always follow. Remember that always!!
DERP!!
Anyway, Good luck to Bioware (and EA). Hope your Christmas bonus' are PHAT and you're too busy adding servers to mess up the fun!!
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.