Now having over 10 million customers is the key. Most mmos don't seem to keep players over one year's time and struggle to hit 300k so this is still a pretty remarkable thing.
Now losing the argumentum ad numerum power of Big Numbers of Subs in Other Countries is going to put a hurt in the standard forum arguments, though. It'll actually be refreshing after the last eight years.
Actually, that's part of the argument. Non-serious people look at a one day or week stock price and go "See? It's happening!" lol. That isn't how the market works at all, nor is it how games go.
Even if Blizzard announced tomorrow "We lost 5 million subs", people would still be shouting their doom, even though the games they play still can't get one-tenth of that new "fail" number.
So yeah, Pandas opening in China (and the US/EU soon) will make a difference, if not to anything else, you'll probably see some WoW fanboi post "WoW releases MoP; stock prices soar!" and then you'll be stealing my argument now.
F2P and the game becoming old I think is the main reason. I will never go back to WOW mainly because of all the F2P games out there. I for one will never sub for a game again.
Honestly, I believe its simply that Ghostcrawler needs to go. Yes the game is stale, yes the game is old. However the only real thing that changed is who's leading the dev team. The game could be fun despite its age. Unfortunately, they put a self righteous jerk in charge who seeming cant pull his head out. What I find most interesting is that they genuinely seem surprised that he's (they) lost over a mil subs. I would have thought that Activizzard would have canned his sorry a** when the first 500k left. The guy makes piss poor decisions and has done ZERO to revitialize the game, infact seemingly he's pushing for its demise. Either that or he just doesnt know what hes doing and is too proud to admit it.
3.To much HP if that makes sense. 100-200k hp sure it sounds cool but imo is just fking stupid.
4.Talent tree re-worked
5. Empty world no exploration left.
I could go on but whats the point. WoW is hitting its experation date. I think theyd been better off stetching BC and WOTLK out and just pumped out more content one thing that i think might have helped would be bigger continents they didnt have enugh room to work but thats just me.
A lot of WoW's troubles puzzle me as I'm sure they puzzle Blizzard. Essentially, WoW is no different than Everquest at this point in its life cycle, yet EQ's fanbase is largely happy with the game. It would appear that WoW's more casual fanbase doesn't take as well to the endless gear grinding and raiding.
3.To much HP if that makes sense. 100-200k hp sure it sounds cool but imo is just fking stupid.
4.Talent tree re-worked
5. Empty world no exploration left.
I could go on but whats the point. WoW is hitting its experation date. I think theyd been better off stetching BC and WOTLK out and just pumped out more content one thing that i think might have helped would be bigger continents they didnt have enugh room to work but thats just me.
Agree on all but 1, loved old world ... but love even more cataclismic event that changed it. Impressive job they did. I would add insane constant druid nerfings. They messed terribly wrong with end game as goes for 5 man, I'm not even minimally interested in raiding. To hard, to easy, .... Wotlk was to easy at the end, all fully geared ... but as stands for me would be much better for Cata if they would not listen to vocal minority that wanted "harder".
This way, all you haters can just get it out all in one big orgasmic post. No one cares why you left the game. We're just happy you did. Actually, right after you left, DPS was getting instaque to Dungeons and and the Horde and Alliance got together for a picnic.
Point is... it doesn't matter what anyone here thinks and the impending WoW doom that I have been hearing about since 2005. I will keep playing until I personally am no longer having fun. However, unlike most of you, when I do decide to quit, I'm not going to think it sucks, just that I have outgrown my fun times with it. I don't need to hate a game to not play it......Whydo people feel the need to come here and badmouth a game cause they are finished with it? Moreover, why do they feel like they need to convince others their decision was justified? Your post aren't going to keep people from trying it..make them quit it, or anything else. So just move on.
After observing how long the numbers hovered around the 11.5 million mark, I figured the king was going to begin it's inevitable descent in the not so distant future.
Where's Zorndorf when you need him dammit. He could use a nice hot cup of "told ya so" right about now.
Ah well, WoW has had a fucking hell of a run, and it should be interesting to see how slowly or quickly the population deflates. Considering some of the ancient relics of the genre that are still alive and kicking, my bet would be on the former.
LoL @ Zorndorf . They probably gave him a ban , goo goo ga joob . :P . All those quotes and links to X-fire and obscure sites . I often wonder what happens to someone like him when a game hes so invested in starts to fail . I can't imagine its a good . Poor lad . I somehow think though even he saw the light with MOP and will be in TOR along with everyone else on the planet .
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
That was just them shedding a few gold farmers and spambots.
I wouldn't start raising an eyebrow or worrying until they start getting into the single digits.
LOL, just like when rats flee a sinking ship, gold farmers leaving a game is a good sign that its time to leave.
And when you think about it, if there were 800,000 gold sellers, then I can't even imagine how inflated WoW's numbers are because there are bound to be more.
The gold sellers are still in Warhammer, they will still be in WoW until they are the only ones in chat.
WoW hasn't been WoW since Activision became their big dog, neither does Diablo 3 seem like something Blizzard would have done before the merger.
It comes as no surprise, but it's evident what kind of failing direction Blizzard is following similar to how Infinity Ward is ending up right now.
Core top guys get fired/leave Infinity Ward under the direction of Activision, and you can't help but wonder if those guys were still there, would Infinity Ward have released MW3 as a recycled MW2 with the exact same 4.0 IW Engine, albeit little tweaks in details.
Several changes in how Blizzard is implementing new things, such as premium mounts, ingame RMT system for Diablo 3 seem to indicate declining "old" Blizzard mentality.
For one, I specifically remember Mike Morhaim stating he is completely against RMT, but seems to me he's making an exception for it with Diablo 3. I don't know if Mike Morhaim has changed, or it's Activision putting pressure on Blizzard, but the direction Blizzard is taking in recent years, certaintly don't reflect the type of mentality they had in the 90s and early 2000s.
At this point, Diablo 3 doesn't seem like it will live up to the hype from how successful Diablo 2 was, WoW will slowly decline, maybe even decline faster than expected if Blizzard continues to neglect playerbase, and Titan, I doubt will be as big, or even come close to WoW in terms of subscriptions.
GRIND sucks? You wanna be max level in a month? Since when did society award easy-goers and lazy-fools? MAKES ME PHOBIC OF STUPIDITY!
lol i wonder if wow would recovr from all the hate of the pandas they will implement....i was thinking it was a april fools joke...but was on oct. lols someone kill wow already (yeah i know 10kk is stills allot and wow will need some years to really "die" )
"Casual players like the variety of activites to play around with, keep raiding focused on mostly hard core players and devote more resources to giving casuals other fun activities to entertain themselves."
Agree. They've been trying to target a generic player when there isn't a generic player. In particular there's not just casuals and hardcores there's a third group who have the hardcore mentality but don't have the TIME. I think Blizzard (and other game companies in the past) see complaints from this group about speeding up levelling and making raiding more accessible and they think this is what casuals want but it's not. It's what the third group want because they want to be hardcore but don't have the TIME. Trivializing the levelling and the raiding to suit the timepoor hardcores messes up the game for botht he casuals and the hardcores.
Blizzard need to find a way to give the timepoor hardcores a way to level faster than casuals** and then tuck in behind the hardcore raiders. They won't like not being able to be the best on the server but if they have better getter than all the casuals that will keep them 3/4 happy.
**or at least give endgamers in general, whether pvp or raider, the option of creating new max level chars after the first one so they stop moaning about levelling.
Blizzard need to find a way to give the timepoor hardcores a way to level faster than casuals** and then tuck in behind the hardcore raiders. They won't like not being able to be the best on the server but if they have better getter than all the casuals that will keep them 3/4 happy.
**or at least give endgamers in general, whether pvp or raider, the option of creating new max level chars after the first one so they stop moaning about levelling.
And eliminate DELICIOUS SUBSCRIPTION MONIES??? Oh hell no. The reason you have to level every character, as well as wait a week for raids to reopen, is so you keep your account open longer, paying out of your pocket month after month hoping for that purple drop. Blizzard doesn't care that much about moaning to remove their fundamental income-producing scam. They're as bad as bankers.
Blizzard need to find a way to give the timepoor hardcores a way to level faster than casuals** and then tuck in behind the hardcore raiders. They won't like not being able to be the best on the server but if they have better getter than all the casuals that will keep them 3/4 happy.
**or at least give endgamers in general, whether pvp or raider, the option of creating new max level chars after the first one so they stop moaning about levelling.
And eliminate DELICIOUS SUBSCRIPTION MONIES??? Oh hell no. The reason you have to level every character, as well as wait a week for raids to reopen, is so you keep your account open longer, paying out of your pocket month after month hoping for that purple drop. Blizzard doesn't care that much about moaning to remove their fundamental income-producing scam. They're as bad as bankers.
LOL. Really? Maybe they should just give you the game free of charge? Incredible.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
I played WoW for years. The game isn't any good anymore IMO. Look, don't tell me what I'm thinking if you're trying to prove you're not trolling. At least stick to the topic at hand - they make you pay a sub to play the game, then they draw out your time and get you addicted so you wait that extra week, then the next week, and so on, just so you can pick up that fabled loot, meanwhile money magically drains from your account. I was saying there is no way in hell they would allow anyone to create a max level character because it would be a bigger drain on their cash cow than even their piss poor game design abillities over the last two expansions, to say nothing of the upcoming one.
I played WoW for years. The game isn't any good anymore IMO. Look, don't tell me what I'm thinking if you're trying to prove you're not trolling. At least stick to the topic at hand - they make you pay a sub to play the game, then they draw out your time and get you addicted so you wait that extra week, then the next week, and so on, just so you can pick up that fabled loot, meanwhile money magically drains from your account. I was saying there is no way in hell they would allow anyone to create a max level character because it would be a bigger drain on their cash cow than even their piss poor game design abillities over the last two expansions, to say nothing of the upcoming one.
Welcome to world of themeaprk MMOS. if that is your outlook better quit playing themepark MMOS now and stick to open ended sandbox games. WOW is not the only MMO which implements this formula to keep player paying a sub.
I played WoW for years. The game isn't any good anymore IMO. Look, don't tell me what I'm thinking if you're trying to prove you're not trolling. At least stick to the topic at hand - they make you pay a sub to play the game, then they draw out your time and get you addicted so you wait that extra week, then the next week, and so on, just so you can pick up that fabled loot, meanwhile money magically drains from your account. I was saying there is no way in hell they would allow anyone to create a max level character because it would be a bigger drain on their cash cow than even their piss poor game design abillities over the last two expansions, to say nothing of the upcoming one.
Welcome to world of themeaprk MMOS. if that is your outlook better quit playing themepark MMOS now and stick to open ended sandbox games. WOW is not the only MMO which implements this formula to keep player paying a sub.
I only quit themepark MMOs who do this sort of thing, but not themepark MMOs altogether. I fully expect to be satisfied by the box price of GW2 for a long, long time without ever feeling like I'm being milked.
i would have to agree.. i played wow since vanilla and nwo the game has gone so far downhill i dont even have it installed on my computer...thank god that Skyrim came out(currently playing) why cant they make a good mmo like Skyrim...this dont include MO(epicFail) srry to say kiddies but WoW is falling into Oblivion...and SW and GW2 will be the final blow to Blizzard makign them realize that dummed down gameplay and all these extra tools there adding to the game to make it "better" are only killing it. I.E: dungeon finder.(totally ruins the exploration and mmo feel) Guild Perks(makes every other guild taht isnt 25 seem usless) And the BIG one for me is Flying(lost the sense of exploration and impact of the land) example of this is u walk up to a wall that u cnt walk arround OH WAIT I CAN FLY!
WoW died for me when BC came out then was reborn in LK then died again and was permenentlly put down with Cata.
Is te world ready for a Panda MMO? just ask the millions of kids that play Perfect World...wow fits in with that game now. a child filled pre-teens wet dream.
Comments
Its my favorite games not the only ones I play, but i sure your rigth they won't join those (Well maybe DF 2.0 I hope not hehe)
Zoos the Slacker
Even if Blizzard announced tomorrow "We lost 5 million subs", people would still be shouting their doom, even though the games they play still can't get one-tenth of that new "fail" number.
So yeah, Pandas opening in China (and the US/EU soon) will make a difference, if not to anything else, you'll probably see some WoW fanboi post "WoW releases MoP; stock prices soar!" and then you'll be stealing my argument now.
"TO MICHAEL!"
F2P and the game becoming old I think is the main reason. I will never go back to WOW mainly because of all the F2P games out there. I for one will never sub for a game again.
Honestly, I believe its simply that Ghostcrawler needs to go. Yes the game is stale, yes the game is old. However the only real thing that changed is who's leading the dev team. The game could be fun despite its age. Unfortunately, they put a self righteous jerk in charge who seeming cant pull his head out. What I find most interesting is that they genuinely seem surprised that he's (they) lost over a mil subs. I would have thought that Activizzard would have canned his sorry a** when the first 500k left. The guy makes piss poor decisions and has done ZERO to revitialize the game, infact seemingly he's pushing for its demise. Either that or he just doesnt know what hes doing and is too proud to admit it.
Just my opinion.
Things that killed WoW for me.
1. World Re-worked (i loved the old world)
2. The stat changes
3.To much HP if that makes sense. 100-200k hp sure it sounds cool but imo is just fking stupid.
4.Talent tree re-worked
5. Empty world no exploration left.
I could go on but whats the point. WoW is hitting its experation date. I think theyd been better off stetching BC and WOTLK out and just pumped out more content one thing that i think might have helped would be bigger continents they didnt have enugh room to work but thats just me.
A lot of WoW's troubles puzzle me as I'm sure they puzzle Blizzard. Essentially, WoW is no different than Everquest at this point in its life cycle, yet EQ's fanbase is largely happy with the game. It would appear that WoW's more casual fanbase doesn't take as well to the endless gear grinding and raiding.
Oh calm down.
That was just them shedding a few gold farmers and spambots.
I wouldn't start raising an eyebrow or worrying until they start getting into the single digits.
Agree on all but 1, loved old world ... but love even more cataclismic event that changed it. Impressive job they did. I would add insane constant druid nerfings. They messed terribly wrong with end game as goes for 5 man, I'm not even minimally interested in raiding. To hard, to easy, .... Wotlk was to easy at the end, all fully geared ... but as stands for me would be much better for Cata if they would not listen to vocal minority that wanted "harder".
I really can't believe this post still has legs.
This way, all you haters can just get it out all in one big orgasmic post. No one cares why you left the game. We're just happy you did. Actually, right after you left, DPS was getting instaque to Dungeons and and the Horde and Alliance got together for a picnic.
Point is... it doesn't matter what anyone here thinks and the impending WoW doom that I have been hearing about since 2005. I will keep playing until I personally am no longer having fun. However, unlike most of you, when I do decide to quit, I'm not going to think it sucks, just that I have outgrown my fun times with it. I don't need to hate a game to not play it......Whydo people feel the need to come here and badmouth a game cause they are finished with it? Moreover, why do they feel like they need to convince others their decision was justified? Your post aren't going to keep people from trying it..make them quit it, or anything else. So just move on.
LoL @ Zorndorf . They probably gave him a ban , goo goo ga joob . :P . All those quotes and links to X-fire and obscure sites . I often wonder what happens to someone like him when a game hes so invested in starts to fail . I can't imagine its a good . Poor lad . I somehow think though even he saw the light with MOP and will be in TOR along with everyone else on the planet .
LOL, just like when rats flee a sinking ship, gold farmers leaving a game is a good sign that its time to leave.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
They will lose more subs because their expansions is all a WOW clone.
The Dev are getting too lazy cos all the expansions is mostly the same shit just different skin.
Maybe that is why the Senior Titan designer laid off by Blizzard.
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
Hemorraghing hardcore.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
And when you think about it, if there were 800,000 gold sellers, then I can't even imagine how inflated WoW's numbers are because there are bound to be more.
The gold sellers are still in Warhammer, they will still be in WoW until they are the only ones in chat.
WoW hasn't been WoW since Activision became their big dog, neither does Diablo 3 seem like something Blizzard would have done before the merger.
It comes as no surprise, but it's evident what kind of failing direction Blizzard is following similar to how Infinity Ward is ending up right now.
Core top guys get fired/leave Infinity Ward under the direction of Activision, and you can't help but wonder if those guys were still there, would Infinity Ward have released MW3 as a recycled MW2 with the exact same 4.0 IW Engine, albeit little tweaks in details.
Several changes in how Blizzard is implementing new things, such as premium mounts, ingame RMT system for Diablo 3 seem to indicate declining "old" Blizzard mentality.
For one, I specifically remember Mike Morhaim stating he is completely against RMT, but seems to me he's making an exception for it with Diablo 3. I don't know if Mike Morhaim has changed, or it's Activision putting pressure on Blizzard, but the direction Blizzard is taking in recent years, certaintly don't reflect the type of mentality they had in the 90s and early 2000s.
At this point, Diablo 3 doesn't seem like it will live up to the hype from how successful Diablo 2 was, WoW will slowly decline, maybe even decline faster than expected if Blizzard continues to neglect playerbase, and Titan, I doubt will be as big, or even come close to WoW in terms of subscriptions.
GRIND sucks? You wanna be max level in a month?
Since when did society award easy-goers and lazy-fools?
MAKES ME PHOBIC OF STUPIDITY!
lol i wonder if wow would recovr from all the hate of the pandas they will implement....i was thinking it was a april fools joke...but was on oct. lols someone kill wow already (yeah i know 10kk is stills allot and wow will need some years to really "die" )
"Casual players like the variety of activites to play around with, keep raiding focused on mostly hard core players and devote more resources to giving casuals other fun activities to entertain themselves."
Agree. They've been trying to target a generic player when there isn't a generic player. In particular there's not just casuals and hardcores there's a third group who have the hardcore mentality but don't have the TIME. I think Blizzard (and other game companies in the past) see complaints from this group about speeding up levelling and making raiding more accessible and they think this is what casuals want but it's not. It's what the third group want because they want to be hardcore but don't have the TIME. Trivializing the levelling and the raiding to suit the timepoor hardcores messes up the game for botht he casuals and the hardcores.
Blizzard need to find a way to give the timepoor hardcores a way to level faster than casuals** and then tuck in behind the hardcore raiders. They won't like not being able to be the best on the server but if they have better getter than all the casuals that will keep them 3/4 happy.
**or at least give endgamers in general, whether pvp or raider, the option of creating new max level chars after the first one so they stop moaning about levelling.
And eliminate DELICIOUS SUBSCRIPTION MONIES??? Oh hell no. The reason you have to level every character, as well as wait a week for raids to reopen, is so you keep your account open longer, paying out of your pocket month after month hoping for that purple drop. Blizzard doesn't care that much about moaning to remove their fundamental income-producing scam. They're as bad as bankers.
LOL. Really? Maybe they should just give you the game free of charge? Incredible.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
Lack of subscription =/= getting the game free of charge. Refer to: GW and GW2. Thank you, troll again.
Oh now its ME that is trolling. You would love to play WOW but your convictions wont allow you to pay a sub. Gotcha.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
I played WoW for years. The game isn't any good anymore IMO. Look, don't tell me what I'm thinking if you're trying to prove you're not trolling. At least stick to the topic at hand - they make you pay a sub to play the game, then they draw out your time and get you addicted so you wait that extra week, then the next week, and so on, just so you can pick up that fabled loot, meanwhile money magically drains from your account. I was saying there is no way in hell they would allow anyone to create a max level character because it would be a bigger drain on their cash cow than even their piss poor game design abillities over the last two expansions, to say nothing of the upcoming one.
Welcome to world of themeaprk MMOS. if that is your outlook better quit playing themepark MMOS now and stick to open ended sandbox games. WOW is not the only MMO which implements this formula to keep player paying a sub.
I only quit themepark MMOs who do this sort of thing, but not themepark MMOs altogether. I fully expect to be satisfied by the box price of GW2 for a long, long time without ever feeling like I'm being milked.
i would have to agree.. i played wow since vanilla and nwo the game has gone so far downhill i dont even have it installed on my computer...thank god that Skyrim came out(currently playing) why cant they make a good mmo like Skyrim...this dont include MO(epicFail) srry to say kiddies but WoW is falling into Oblivion...and SW and GW2 will be the final blow to Blizzard makign them realize that dummed down gameplay and all these extra tools there adding to the game to make it "better" are only killing it. I.E: dungeon finder.(totally ruins the exploration and mmo feel) Guild Perks(makes every other guild taht isnt 25 seem usless) And the BIG one for me is Flying(lost the sense of exploration and impact of the land) example of this is u walk up to a wall that u cnt walk arround OH WAIT I CAN FLY!
WoW died for me when BC came out then was reborn in LK then died again and was permenentlly put down with Cata.
Is te world ready for a Panda MMO? just ask the millions of kids that play Perfect World...wow fits in with that game now. a child filled pre-teens wet dream.