Role playing, in the truest sense of the term, is impossible in the context of an MMO. There are two main reasons for this. The linear progression of leveling and quests. (Which get more linear and streamlined every year) and the limitations...or lack there of...of the interface.
In table top role-playing the players can actually have an effect on the world as a whole. Something they do in game can change the world for everyone else (especially new characters that come into the campaign.)
Players can have sub-plots, interfere with the plots and sub-plots of other players and NPCs. In short they have no limitations other than what the gamemaster/dungeonmaster enforces. And any good GM/DM lets the players develop the campaign as much as he/she does.
But there are other role-playing limitations set by the online games. In D&D if you need to navigate rough terrain, track down where the monsters lair is you had to ask the ranger. In WoW, the map and markers take care of all of this, no ranger (hunter) neded. In WoW you don't NEED that healer when questing, just take a 2 minute or so break and you're good to go. In D&D if you offended the clerics god in some way the clerics healing spells MAY NOT EVEN work on yo..that's if the cleric was willing to heal you even after you offended his god.
While it is possible in WoW (and other MMOs) to role-play your story withing the confines of the game even then it is but a shadow of what honest to goodness "true" roleplaying is all about. That's why most people don't even bother.
Ultimately tho, as a player in an MMO you lack any true power to shape the world around you which is one of the most important fundamentals of a role-playing game.
"That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange aeons even death may die."
The poster you responded to was however probably more true than not.
Very little evolution of the genre has occurred in the past 10 years, mainly due to the gravitation away from actual skill based paradigms, World artifact and dynamics development, instead routed into the stagnant pool of simple gerbil-wheel grind mechanisms with frosting slapped on. PvP maps with little, or in some cases no, objectives based dyanmics, instead reduced to fast boxing ring sessions.
"Role Playing" isn't the exclusive domain of people who insist on using "thee" and "thou" in sentences, playing pretend. It includes actual game play of a character class in whatever setting that class finds itself.
Unfortunately, with gap closers, heals, and all sorts of other mechanics slathered all over classes . . . to promote running at each other and mashing buttons . . . I'd have to generally agree with that poster.
The RPG has been ripped from the industry by "Fat Cat" industry leaders who want a quick buck for a low quality product, ala: WoW, SWTOR, RIFT, Aion, etc etc. You simply CANNOT roleplay in these games, and if you try hard enough you'll only strain yourself !
This an example of why some people feel less enthused about Role Players; its the overly gratuitous self rightous indignant attitude some have towrds anything that does not fit the bill of what they percieve as a "true MMORPG gaming experiance". The fact is all those games(for the exception of SW:TOR do to its newness) have well developed and mature Role Playing communities. This idea that all game developers are greedy "fat cats" is preposterous and only demonstrates ones inability to look at things rationally.
The RPG has been ripped from the industry by "Fat Cat" industry leaders who want a quick buck for a low quality product, ala: WoW, SWTOR, RIFT, Aion, etc etc. You simply CANNOT roleplay in these games, and if you try hard enough you'll only strain yourself !
This an example of why some people feel less enthused about Role Players; its the overly gratuitous self rightous indignant attitude some have towrds anything that does not fit the bill of what they percieve as a "true MMORPG gaming experiance". The fact is all those games(for the exception of SW:TOR do to its newness) have well developed and mature Role Playing communities. This idea that all game developers are greedy "fat cats" is preposterous and only demonstrates ones inability to look at things rationally.
What are you kidding me? The yellow text dude has it right on. In the begining you had books, you had to read somewhat decent and have some basic math skills and alot of imagination to make it worthwhile. And it was worthwhile. Things you put EFFORT into tend to be that way.
Fast forward now you have big corps making games that are run forward (can only go that way) to the highlighted guy (the only one) click on him to recieve your prize (skinner box) and then proceed to the next highlighted guy (only one way to move and go to) and repeat process..... by the 3rd guy there is your mandatory advertisement to stop by the RMT house to purchase a way to skip all these "lame" guys and go to the better guys for $5.99 ..............you know , games for the stupid masses that sell well and make alot of money for selling an addiction.
Skinner box is mental conditioning. Look it up. Big Business Money. Ask Acticrap. Bobby K gets it and is making alot of money with it. Sure it might be fun playing some pos game like that, but it's not the same fun we had as kids using our brains. Not even close.
The RPG has been ripped from the industry by "Fat Cat" industry leaders who want a quick buck for a low quality product, ala: WoW, SWTOR, RIFT, Aion, etc etc. You simply CANNOT roleplay in these games, and if you try hard enough you'll only strain yourself !
This an example of why some people feel less enthused about Role Players; its the overly gratuitous self rightous indignant attitude some have towrds anything that does not fit the bill of what they percieve as a "true MMORPG gaming experiance". The fact is all those games(for the exception of SW:TOR do to its newness) have well developed and mature Role Playing communities. This idea that all game developers are greedy "fat cats" is preposterous and only demonstrates ones inability to look at things rationally.
What are you kidding me? The yellow text dude has it right on. In the begining you had books, you had to read somewhat decent and have some basic math skills and alot of imagination to make it worthwhile. And it was worthwhile. Things you put EFFORT into tend to be that way.
Fast forward now you have big corps making games that are run forward (can only go that way) to the highlighted guy (the only one) click on him to recieve your prize (skinner box) and then proceed to the next highlighted guy (only one way to move and go to) and repeat process..... by the 3rd guy there is your mandatory advertisement to stop by the RMT house to purchase a way to skip all these "lame" guys and go to the better guys for $5.99 ..............you know , games for the stupid masses that sell well and make alot of money for selling an addiction.
Skinner box is mental conditioning. Look it up. Big Business Money. Ask Acticrap. Bobby K gets it and is making alot of money with it. Sure it might be fun playing some pos game like that, but it's not the same fun we had as kids using our brains. Not even close.
Agreed. Double check the above post sequences. I basically responded the yellow text fellow had it right.
Comments
Role playing, in the truest sense of the term, is impossible in the context of an MMO. There are two main reasons for this. The linear progression of leveling and quests. (Which get more linear and streamlined every year) and the limitations...or lack there of...of the interface.
In table top role-playing the players can actually have an effect on the world as a whole. Something they do in game can change the world for everyone else (especially new characters that come into the campaign.)
Players can have sub-plots, interfere with the plots and sub-plots of other players and NPCs. In short they have no limitations other than what the gamemaster/dungeonmaster enforces. And any good GM/DM lets the players develop the campaign as much as he/she does.
But there are other role-playing limitations set by the online games. In D&D if you need to navigate rough terrain, track down where the monsters lair is you had to ask the ranger. In WoW, the map and markers take care of all of this, no ranger (hunter) neded. In WoW you don't NEED that healer when questing, just take a 2 minute or so break and you're good to go. In D&D if you offended the clerics god in some way the clerics healing spells MAY NOT EVEN work on yo..that's if the cleric was willing to heal you even after you offended his god.
While it is possible in WoW (and other MMOs) to role-play your story withing the confines of the game even then it is but a shadow of what honest to goodness "true" roleplaying is all about. That's why most people don't even bother.
Ultimately tho, as a player in an MMO you lack any true power to shape the world around you which is one of the most important fundamentals of a role-playing game.
"That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange aeons even death may die."
The poster you responded to was however probably more true than not.
Very little evolution of the genre has occurred in the past 10 years, mainly due to the gravitation away from actual skill based paradigms, World artifact and dynamics development, instead routed into the stagnant pool of simple gerbil-wheel grind mechanisms with frosting slapped on. PvP maps with little, or in some cases no, objectives based dyanmics, instead reduced to fast boxing ring sessions.
"Role Playing" isn't the exclusive domain of people who insist on using "thee" and "thou" in sentences, playing pretend. It includes actual game play of a character class in whatever setting that class finds itself.
Unfortunately, with gap closers, heals, and all sorts of other mechanics slathered all over classes . . . to promote running at each other and mashing buttons . . . I'd have to generally agree with that poster.
Wherever you go, there you are.
Heh-heh. My above post was a response to:
Originally posted by Fadedbomb
The RPG has been ripped from the industry by "Fat Cat" industry leaders who want a quick buck for a low quality product, ala: WoW, SWTOR, RIFT, Aion, etc etc. You simply CANNOT roleplay in these games, and if you try hard enough you'll only strain yourself
!
This an example of why some people feel less enthused about Role Players; its the overly gratuitous self rightous indignant attitude some have towrds anything that does not fit the bill of what they percieve as a "true MMORPG gaming experiance". The fact is all those games(for the exception of SW:TOR do to its newness) have well developed and mature Role Playing communities. This idea that all game developers are greedy "fat cats" is preposterous and only demonstrates ones inability to look at things rationally.
Wherever you go, there you are.
What are you kidding me? The yellow text dude has it right on. In the begining you had books, you had to read somewhat decent and have some basic math skills and alot of imagination to make it worthwhile. And it was worthwhile. Things you put EFFORT into tend to be that way.
Fast forward now you have big corps making games that are run forward (can only go that way) to the highlighted guy (the only one) click on him to recieve your prize (skinner box) and then proceed to the next highlighted guy (only one way to move and go to) and repeat process..... by the 3rd guy there is your mandatory advertisement to stop by the RMT house to purchase a way to skip all these "lame" guys and go to the better guys for $5.99 ..............you know , games for the stupid masses that sell well and make alot of money for selling an addiction.
Skinner box is mental conditioning. Look it up. Big Business Money. Ask Acticrap. Bobby K gets it and is making alot of money with it. Sure it might be fun playing some pos game like that, but it's not the same fun we had as kids using our brains. Not even close.
Agreed. Double check the above post sequences. I basically responded the yellow text fellow had it right.
As you do.
Wherever you go, there you are.