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yeah or just go play Wurm:
100x content
great community
several servers/islands to choose from
thousands of things to do/craft
only 7$/month with no purchase necessary and a free to play until skill lvl 20
I review lots of indie games and MMORPGs
But that's how it has always been. Themepark and sandbox folks both go into their own forums and complain. There is hardly anyone in this forum that enjoys mmo's anymore, everyone just likes to say "INNOVATION INNOVATION INNOVATION" and complain when it tries to innovate too much. Or complain when it doesn't innovate enough. Or complain when it's too much like any other MMO on the market, and say its a clone of this or a clone of this. The only reason i complained about this game earlier in the thread was because I was expecting something different, it was too difficult for me to play. But it could be pretty cool if it were refined.
A "true" sandbox isn't EvE or archage or fallen earth or whatever. You're "making" stuff thats already been made by developers. Sure you control it and move it around, but you don't actually make anything with your "sand". Second Life is a "true" sandbox but you have to actually design stuff and no one wants to do that because they want everything made for them.
So seriously, maybe you should start calling things custom themeparks or something. Unless the term sandbox is just gonna mean "a game where people think they're making something, but actually aren't"
Were asking for a QUALITY Sandbox game not some half assed game that is broken.. The problem is the companies that are trying something new are the companies that don't have the money to make a QUALITY game. But it looks like a QUALITY somewhat sandbox game is in the horizon Arche Age. So far I like what I see and Im more than happy to pay a 15 bones sub for that game.
Yeah maybe playing a half assed game could help it become a better one, but I don't think supporting games that launched half ass helps anything. IMO it would actually show dev's its ok to launch half ass games.
There, feel better now?
Look, just because some half-arsed "indi" dev cobbles up a barely functioning game, callts is a sandbox and charges full price for it all the time asking for patience while they get the "kinks" out doesn't mean we have to all pat them on the back and smile while we hand them our $. Like many have said on here, just because it is "indie" + sandbox = quality. Crap is crap no matter who makes it or what they call it.
If you want to support an unfinished product with you $ that's your business but don't come on here raging an expect me to give a crap...
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
It is a free forum so I will post what I want thank you very much. And people have a right to criticize if they want to (and some do so ad nauseum about swtor) but just don't expect people to go along with your line of thinking every time. Also, no where did I say that people couldn't like Xsyon (or their game of choice). The OP went on a rant about supporting indi devs because they are "trying". My reply was no, if they want to charge real $ for their product, they need to deliver a somewhat finished, working product.
{mod edit}
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
How about a free trial first to see if the game is worth dropping $40 on?
unless they have funding aka dominus at least till 2013 >.>
I get just a teensy little annoyed at all these posts made by people who played this game at launch for a month and think they are bloody experts at how well its doing. Maybe it has improved in 10 months or just maybe you played it the wrong way: like a mindless grinding muppet zombie.
The original post was biased and stupid but what followed was 3 pages of equally biased and stupid crap. Also, I dont bash corporations, I bash people who buy their 200 million dollar AAA titles which are completly devoid of any creativity or innovation. 200 million dollars worth of fucking voiceovers, objectively speaking, I would take Xsyon over that any day.
So would I and my post was never an endorsement for thempark games, you assumed it was.
Not to be rude but you know how lame that excuse sounds like? You are playing the game wrong??? Give me a break!
Sorry, but I played for a few months after release and was not impressed. I still check the forums and have a friend who plays (and likes the game) and constantly tries to get me to play again. No thanks, not impressed with the dev team behind Xsyon. Hey, at least I didn't ask for a refund from the box sale like some people did: I figured they needed the money more.
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
Sorry I hope I didnt hurt your feelings then but if your sole reason for not playing Xsyon is that you simply dont like the game or the developers, again, why are you posting here? Why do you care?
This, is a very excellent point actually. You see the game is chuck full of one man totems that belong to people who decided they were going to play the game like any other mmorpg... solo. Completly ignoring the fact that the game thrives on player interaction and teamwork. I see it all the time in global chat, people keep whining that they cant progress because they need some tool or some scheme for toolcrafting, everyone else keeps saying "go trade instead!" "sell your labor for schemes or tools!", but instead they sit and grind shit for 5 hours, with deminishing returns on skill ups and discoveries, for their first couple of days in game and then they quit and dismiss it as a grindy and tedious game. So you see, it is entirely possible to play this game the WRONG way, the evidence is overwhelming actually.
Because it is a forum: it's what you do....
And my point still stands. Do not blame the players for "playing the game wrong": blame the game for not having enough features to keep people interested and "nudging" players in the right direction. Come on, be honest. At release and for many months after, the game had a few glaring problems:
PvP was a joke: There was no point to it, the lag made it imposible and you could do more damage with fists than you could with a weapon.
No point to crafting: You could craft baskets full of weapons and armor; gather all the fish and food you could carry but what was the point? No item decay, you really couldn't use the items for anythin so it became a crafting for crafting sakes proposition.
Safe zones: First Jordi had a vision of a faction PvP with sieges and the like. But no, the carebears cried and so safe zones were not taken out (as they promised in beta) and territory PvP was to be consentual. So, everybody put ther totem in or near a scrap pile and voila. Gather materials in complete safety with nothing to worry about. In other words, a snooze fest that caused all the pvp folk to leave.
No PvE. Mobs were so bugged that they would all run to the green mist and so the world became devoid of mobs. So, no PvE, no PvP, so what do you have left? Yes folks, a Sim City style game you pay a sub for. No thanks.
And no worries. Hard to get offended on the net.
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
Sorry, but that's just a poor excuse for a sub-par product. People didn't quit Xsyon because they played it the "wrong" way. Hell, by launch whole guilds transfered from MO and DF because they wanted real empire building and territory control, so please don't try to blame the game's failures on solo players. There were plenty of co-operative players around, but they all quit.
They quit because the game was in an extremely poor state, and there was nothing to do besides building stuff and grinding mats to build more stuff. The world was empty, the PvP was broken, and the game had extreme technical issues.
That may have changed, but most MMOs will not recover from a terrible launch. I really hope Xsyon turns around and gets on its feet one day, but I sure as hell won't shell out AAA money for it. If the devs can't deliver a working product, too bad. It's not my job to fund their projects.
Again you are basing your critisism on "how the game was at launch" and everyone knows it was a huge mess. The game has improved a lot since then, its been 11 months and it has vastly improved. Which means you have a biased and outdated opinion about the game, how can anyone use that constructively? I wouldnt presume to give advice to people on whether they should play this game or not, but I atleast is playing it today. Its not a game that appeals to everyone and it requires a ton of patience, but it has its merits. My point was, that everyone who played this game at launch seems to be experts on how the game is doing now, you dont and you shouldnt presume to know. Each of those points are either planned to be changed during the next developement cycle or has allready been fixed, Decay was put in ages ago and mobs are numerous and belligerent, the amount of mobs was recently increased but even some time before then it was simple to find mobs, people just didnt understand that they seek away from populated areas so you wouldnt find anything close to your tribes. PVP is still lacking but the plan was to give incentive for people to leave the safezone, this still needs work but atleast with scavenging you wont get the good stuff if you dont travel a good distance away from your safe, add the fact that resource distribution means that you cant get some items in certain zone encouraging trade and travel. The plan was allways eventually to put in an alignement system where you could switch to warring tribes, and this is in the works. Xsyon right now is mostly for people that love to build stuff and that is advertised but once these things are improved it will be good for PVPers aswell.
And I will continue to blame some solo players for simply being bad at the game. I have one of the most constructed solo homesteads, so I know all the pitfalls, believe me, the game doesnt open up unless you interact and mmo players are actually bad at this.
@ Biskop, you didnt read what I said. I said solo players since launch has been quitting because they suck at the game, the amount of abandoned solo player totems is a good indicator of that, meanwhile player retention for the past couple of months has been considerably increased in the larger tribes. A lot of people quit some time after the launch because the launch sucked, big time. No reason to deny that, everyone knows it.
To sum up: Dont critisize Xsyon because of a botched launch, 11 months have passed and its starting to sound like a broken record. Get over it.
...or perhaps they quit because the game still sucks? Because there is nothing to do except build stuff that has no use? Because soloing is slow and boring, and joining a tribe means everything has already been built so you still have nothing to do? I don't know since I haven't played since launch but something tells me the devs, not the players, are at fault here.
Blaming the players for a game's shortcomings is actually really lame, but it's usually a fanboy's last resort. I've seen it before, in MO for example, where anyone who brings up the game's numerous issues automatically gets labeled a carebear, a WoW-lover, not "hardcore" enough, etc, by the few fans still defending the game.
If 90% of the people trying a game quits because they play it the "wrong" way, something is wrong with the game's design.
Stand by for exasperated sigh. Siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiighhh....
Ok first of all you are putting a lot of words into my mouth that I never said and making alot of stupid assumptions. Im actually fairly certain of my point here, and Im going by all the abandoned one man totems and the chatter in global chat, what are you going on? Have you even been in game since launch? Like I said, you simply cannot reach the full potential of the game in a one man tribe unless you interact with other tribes and Im fairly sure the majority didnt, most of these totems dont even have archietecture around them, just a random cluttering of baskets and maybe a little terraforming. I find its more than likely that a lot of these people simply didnt interact and got stuck on grinding toolcrafting or some other dumb grind. You also have no idea how many many of these totems there are, the gameworld is absolutely strewn with them. Its a real problem because there are now so many awesome spots that are taken by people that have been gone for months, that new tribes find it hard to find good spots, luckily totem decay is going active late february or march. So yeah, you can believe whatever the hell you want, but if you cant deliver a recent and unbiased opinion about the game, you should keep it to yourself tbh.
And you mean to say that you're unbiased? You sure seem very pro-Xsyon in your posts.
But anyway, you're missing the point here. No one doubts that the world is full of unused totems. The question is whether all those players quit because
1) They are all stupid and played the game the wrong way, or
2) The game is not providing a sufficiently good experience for them to hang around.
You claim 1) to be the truth, and I think you're wrong, partly due to your apparently biased view on things.
I see no reason to take this discussion any further, you obviously think its completly black and white. I never said everyone who ever quit Xsyon, quit because they were simply idiots, I said that a lot of solo players might have played it the wrong way, based on what Ihve heard in global chat and the massive amount of abandoned totems. Its my theory atleast, based on observation and thats more than you can say. So yeah, if all you want to do is twist words, I am really done argueing with you.
Sorry, but I agree with Biskop and all you are doing now is backpedaling on your earlier statements. I may not play the game anymore but I still follow it and, as previously mentioned,my mate still plays. What I find funny is that you claim the game has gotten so much better but when visiting the Xsyon forums, I see (barring some slight improvements) the same gripes since launch are still there. But I agree, no point in arguing the topic any further. Enjoy your game.
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
Im saying the same thing Ihve been saying all threadlong, there wasnt any fucking backpeddling. There has been vast improvements to the game since launch, but its still just a builder, noone is denying that, the devs have stated thats basicly what the prelude is all about, if you accept that premise Xsyon is in fact a pretty awesome game. Its not for anyone who wants PVP and its not for anyone who has no patience and its not for people who dont want to interact, but it has its merits. We can argue semantics all day long about why soloplayers quit Xsyon, but at the end, its your word against mine and mine is based in observation while yours is based in prejudice. So go suck a mutant bear.
I mostly love this game but the "there is nothing to do but build stuff" argument is still true. They are just NOW testing totem decay from the entire land grab fiasco. Once totem decay is working that will clear out some trash . I tried to play again and recreated a character because starting out is the best part. I couldn't find a decent spot due to all the inactive totems around.
The game was a great start. Once totems are decaying I will give iet a shot again. . altough when I read the updates on the forum not much has changed. . they added carts to carry stuff. . but where are you going to take it? It is still just a building game. A pretty cool one at first - it just needs some progression past that.
I am mostly afraid that at the rate the game has progressed that by the time they add something really cool to move the game along it will be too late. I wish them the best and will check stuff out next month.
Actually if the test server is still open to anyone I will check it out now.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
I had the oposite experience then the one he describes. I was having a blast playing solo with my little homestead. I got to the point he mentioned where I could not progress so I joined a tribe nearby. They had everything we needed. . .and that was the problem. There was nowhere to go from there. WIthin a week that tribe was empty and it was just me so I packed up and moved to a solo homestead again (by Book and a few other guys who were very cool). I realized though that I was just building up for nothing. That is what led me to quit.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!