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Are You Hardcore Enough?
Cuathon
Member Posts: 2,211
Death penalties are for casuals. A really hardcore game can just be lost. Period.
In Ten Thousand Suns the game is the largest real time strategy game ever made. But you only control one unit. Yourself.
You can build tools and weapons and cast spells but you don't have armies that are perfectly obedient bending to you in every way. You have to organize and strategize with other real people to win. You can do things by yourself, mostly crafting and building and exploring and some low level fighting if the game has just started, but that's it.
There is no outsourcing drudgery to stupid companions. Do you want an item? Either gather the res and make it yourself or buy it from someone else. Too much work? Suck it up.
Have you ever made fun of casuals because they complained about a steep leveling curve to the cap. There is no cap here. Although the curve becomes much steeper as you level it never ends. If you earn 10billion exp you will be able to stomp someone with only 1 million. What? 10billion is too much? Lazy bastard.
Oh and if you and the other players fuck up too much, you just lose. I would have to reset the game and have it start over because you blew it.
Sure if you die you just get a small penalty and respawn at a bind point. But thats not the real punishment for bad play.
You will never ever run out of things to do, but you better make smart choices on how you invest your time.
Also as described previously, your character never leaves the game world. You can try to find a place to hide when you log out, or be in a zone where most things can't kill you. But your best bet is to only log off in player settlements or at the world gate. If you hide and get found, or a powerful monster comes by, you will die. And you will face the full penalty.
A lot of people on this site trash casuals about lame death penalties and short play sessions, but hardcore is relative.
Do you think you are hardcore? What's the most hardcore thing you've done in a game?
Comments
I love the Nerdspeak term "hardcore", pertaining as it does to something as trivial a computer game - it must make them feel all manly and uber.
Well, hardcore is just a time identifier imo. It doesn't apply only to video games either. Anything you put a lot of time in. Hardcore artist, hardcore musician, w/e. Sports too.
What is a "hardcore artist?" Do you mean professional?
Could just be a street artist who is out there all the time spraypainting or w/e.
Must we get so far offtopic in the first 3 posts?
Hardcore, in regards to gamers, doesn't have much to do with direct time investment. Time investment is more of a side effect of using any and all methods, in and out of the game, to improve themselves or group members. A hardcore player may use or create spreadsheets to optimize his characters build and find the most efficient rotation for his gear/stats.
Hardcore players tend to play more hours but that, in and of itself, is more a way for people to passively insult someone who puts more into the game.
"In Ten Thousand Suns the game is the largest real time strategy game ever made."
You accidentally used the word 'made' there.
BUT... to stay on topic....
@Quesa,
Well said.
"Do you think you are hardcore? What's the most hardcore thing you've done in a game?"
Hardcore is a degree of playstyle, not a playstyle. For a grinder, hardcore is a 12-hour grindfest. To someone that isn't a grinder, there's nothing hardcore about pressing 12344412444234445 for 12 hours. The same can be said about every other aspect of gameplay, so you'dprobably get far better responses if you avoided the term 'hardcore' and just spoke to the aspect of gameplay you're referring to.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
what the hell is going on? is this dude just babbling? Does this game exist or has it ever existed?
I am real curious, but what MMO do you play Loktofeit?
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Currently EVE Online, Puzzle Pirates, Free Realms and Vendetta Online.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
It doesn't exist yet, but give me time. I finally convinced PhysX to run on Code::Blocks. Yes I am cheap and use free software, bite me.
Are you a bad enough dude to invest more time than everyone else?
(Ironically timesink-centric games are pretty casual. Don't have skill? No problem! Just invest more time in the game than your opponents for easy wins!)
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
That doesn't even make sense. Casual means not investing a lot of time.
Casual hobbies are hobbies you don't pursue with serious effect. For instance I play chess casually. And I play LoL casually. Ie, not that much and at irregular intervals.
Every system is unfair to someone. Life is unfair for poor people. Its also unfair for sick people, disabled people, dumb people, lazy people and so forth.
Whatever system you pick as the system for success fucks over the majority.
So I would like to add to your list:
Are you a bad enough dude to be born to rich parents?
Are you a bad enough dude to be born to smart parents?
Are you a bad enough dude to be born to physically talented parents?
Your argument is stupid.
No, I'm not hardcore enough. I'm not sure what the most hardcore thing I've done in a videogame, thats a difficult question. I ate 1500 fruitcakes and drank over 2000 blue sugary drinks within a couple minutes in guildwars. I swam up a waterfall in AoC. I finished Super Mario Bros without dying. I punched a dragon.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
I beat Resident Evil 2 without a Memory card.
"I am not in a server with Gankers...THEY ARE IN A SERVER WITH ME!!!"
Amusingly I intended this to be more of a would you be willing to play a game where you can totally lose thread. ah well.
Trolololol.
You guys need to stop equating time spent to any one stereotypical playstyle. Casuals may play less but it's more likely due to the fact that they may play when their friends are on or don't find that playing the same game repeatedly for hours on end to be fun - maybe that's because they don't feel like putting as much into the game as Hardcores.
Time is just an easy way for one group to insult or belittle the other group. Hardcores use the "you didn't invest the time so you shouldn't get it" when speaking to casuals and casuals use "I don't have all day to play a game like you" when speaking to Hardcores.
Yes, they probably both play the game for different amounts of time but I've known plenty of people who are Hardcore who play far less than some casuals who play all day but lounge around in a main city for a couple of hours chatting in a general channel.
You should probably figure out what "trolling" is if you think this thread is one.
Cuathos in SQO you can totally lose. There is a death penealty that is based on the number of deaths you have. You evenntually die and your skills are reduced lower than a brand new player. THat is of course if you aren't taken prisoner and put on a cryo planet or turned into a vegetable with drugs.
"I am not in a server with Gankers...THEY ARE IN A SERVER WITH ME!!!"
It means that to you because your personal gauge is based on time invested. Casual simply means it's done with less than serious intent or even a level of indifference. That's why it would be better to avoid using hardcore/casual altogether, as it is completely subjective.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
"time spent" IS what grants any 'hardcore' moniker.
I don't care how much shouting or mountain dew gets thrown at a monitor, it doesn't make him a "hardcore MW player". Doing it all day, every day, does.
Then again, Lok makes a good point about "intent".
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I never said this thread was a troll thread dude. I was just annoyed at how it went offtopic after the first post.
I mean the merriam webster definition of casual is more or less based on your intent. But most players know what you mean if you say casual.
Instead of asking:
Are you someone who only plays a little bit to kill time and has much more important prioriries?
You ask:
Are you a casual?
People who aren't being nitpicky about definitions understand what you mean in the context of video games.
Sure any system for determining the victor screws over someone. But only one system (player skill) makes a game strongly a game. The entire point of games is interaction. Decisions.
When decision quality and execution (skill) are the primary things being rewarded, a game is highly interactive. When Time Spent Playing or Zerging are the things being rewarded, the importance of skill gets pushed aside in favor of this casual skilll-lite gameplay where any mouthbreather can do well as long as they have more time than someone else.
Most people wouldn't consider "Who can watch TV the longest?" to be a particularly interesting game (if they consider it a game at all.) Certainly many would question just how "hardcore" such a game would be, since it requires no skill at all -- just time.
Games which strongly reward excessive time investment are only a few steps away from that. They're not particularly interactive, because Time Spent Playing has such a significant effect, and so they're not particularly good games.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
OMG, Free Realms? You are hardcore. /wink
The idea of roleplaying games being "game" centric has always been incorrect. Its about your role, not the game mechanics.
MMOs have always been terrible games. In fact raids, the part that is most largely a game because its set up for a certain number of players with certain spells and specific gear is the minority of content in MMOs.
The leveling system has always been a shit game.
And in any case many many people get obessed with virtual worlds. And many many people watch hours and hours of TV and shows and books have "hardcore" fans who think it, breathe it and dream it.
And the game I am talking about does require skills. Not every fucking second of the time, but RTS skills over the game and math skills to make decisions on what to do, and art skills to make cool gear and engineering skills and construction skills to build things. I never said it was a largest common denominator game. I prefer that it isn't.
Also, being good at chess requires just as much time commitment as succeeding at an mmo and people who don't memorize all the openings and spend time watching opponents play lose.
Period. Yet chess is an interesting game. Oh wait, its not. The largest common denominator loves football and doesn't give a fuck about chess. Chess can still be a hardcore game, and you can still be a hardcore chess player.