I think the title says it all. I'm just wondering will people come across DE's and ME's that are so profound in the story that it'll take a whole server to collectively work together to make it progress the positive side of the DE.
Wouldn't that be nice. I'm sure a lot of us are hoping so.
In this new video that Yogscast released, the event boss looked way too easy. I'm hoping A-Net continues to tweak them so it's harder. I don't believe it was a meta-event, and i know it was in the level 1-14 area, but it still looked too easy.
I'm not an expert on GW2 but I'm pretty sure the point of PVE in GW2 is to be doable by PUG casuals, and all DE content scales to your group. Other than explorer mode dungeons which supposedly is where the non-casual PVE'ers will have to focus if they like a PVE challenge. Most of the PVE is just for story's sake it seems.
Me personally I don't care that much about PVE so casual PVE is fine for me. PVP better be fun and difficult though as we have enough easy-mode MMO's out there already...
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind" 1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN 2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
No, because organising a server would be unrealistic.
In the real world, it would be ridiculous.
So, here's a thing - do you know why we haven't emulated the brain yet? It's because every cell in your brain is its own unique life form, which is, at any time, ready to flee or feed depending on what it needs to do. Every cell is a reactive life form. And people are much more complicated than that. You can't expect all of the people on a server to drop what they're doing to your beck and call. So realistically, an event should be completable with a maximum of 10-15 people, and it should never, ever be more than that.
There should be no events which wipe out groups of 50 because that would be so ludiicrous that it would alienate most of the people playing the game. It just wouldn't allow them any sense of achievement, because they'd realise that it would be numbers dictating whether they win or lose, not them. And that's WoW. I'm sorry, but it is. Numbers should never dictate a win or lose situation, becuase if they do then we're back to WoW. It should be a matter of player skill, strategy, and tactics.
Nothing should define the outcome of a battle other than that.
GW2 isn't EvE.
GW2 isn't WoW.
GW2 is GW2.
I, like may, am here because GW2 is GW2.
Can we please just have GW2?
If you don't want or like the potential of large scale events, I suggest you check out SWTOR. Just because an event could be large, doesn't make it WoW. Other multi-player online rpgs have had larger scale events before WoW came along. Many of us would like to experience the challenge of or would like to again experience the challenge of a realm wide event. So can we please stop asking for limitations of what can be?
Or not. I of the casual crowd who wishes to partake in events for story sakes and not to experience uber hardmare mode content to give rise to my epeen. If you want super dooper hardcore nightmare mode then partake in the 5 man dungeons. Challenging content that is beatable is much more enjoyable then banging my head on a raid boss for hours on end while continuing to wipe ad-naseum.
Well excuse me for wanting a bit of dynamic challenging content. It has nothing to do with 'epeen' little snowflake, it's to do with providing a decent level of challenge to keep a person interested.
Who do you think you are to think that the game should be made just to your requirements? Some of us like a bit of challenge, and I would hope that we can find some in the open world as well as in dungeons. Zerg fests are not challenging. I would like some thought to be able to be applied for some events to successfully complete (and no I don't mean challenging riddles).
In short, if you don't want to do a challenging dynamic event then don't. Just ignore it and go off and save some bunny's, let someone who wants a harder event do it instead.
This is probably my biggest concern about the game, with all the recent press videos doing nothing but enforce it.
I am yet to see evidence of the much mentioned need for skill and how this will trump all. As it stands everyone has the same tools - heal, tank , dps etc. Is this not the very foundation of a zerg? As of the "greater need for communication and strategy" - is that really going to be the case if everyone can effectively "tank" for short times and roll out the way? The end result of this could be people all wailing away on mobs doing their own thing with no concern for who it beats on because it ultimately dosent matter anyway.
It sounds like this could be just a further dissolution of the genre and further pandering to the entitlement crowd. Where nobody can be debarred from any activity on grounds of personal skill as that would just be unfair.
The truely awful gameplay displayed by the majority of the press event people is just a further indication of how this may well turn out to be - those clickers, one skillers and non aoe dodgiers got on just fine it seemed. Granted it was low level but i cant help but worry.
I like difficulty in games and without a degree of it there is little sense of achievement to be had, as in reall life, few things that are easy are actually worthwhile.
My recomendation to you is to watch the yogcast videos on dungeons and look at how a normal WoW player gets owned by simply doing their own thing and everyone just trying to zerg it. Then look at Mike B aka fony dungeon run and see how the part where the yogcast dies repeatdly is done by he and his group in a minute or so, by using actual strategy and having skill. There is difficulty in the game and a need for people to coordinate and strategise. This has been proven by the press beta videos that you have said to watch.
Or not. I of the casual crowd who wishes to partake in events for story sakes and not to experience uber hardmare mode content to give rise to my epeen. If you want super dooper hardcore nightmare mode then partake in the 5 man dungeons. Challenging content that is beatable is much more enjoyable then banging my head on a raid boss for hours on end while continuing to wipe ad-naseum.
Well excuse me for wanting a bit of dynamic challenging content. It has nothing to do with 'epeen' little snowflake, it's to do with providing a decent level of challenge to keep a person interested.
Who do you think you are to think that the game should be made just to your requirements? Some of us like a bit of challenge, and I would hope that we can find some in the open world as well as in dungeons. Zerg fests are not challenging. I would like some thought to be able to be applied for some events to successfully complete (and no I don't mean challenging riddles).
In short, if you don't want to do a challenging dynamic event then don't. Just ignore it and go off and save some bunny's, let someone who wants a harder event do it instead.
This is probably my biggest concern about the game, with all the recent press videos doing nothing but enforce it.
I am yet to see evidence of the much mentioned need for skill and how this will trump all. As it stands everyone has the same tools - heal, tank , dps etc. Is this not the very foundation of a zerg? As of the "greater need for communication and strategy" - is that really going to be the case if everyone can effectively "tank" for short times and roll out the way? The end result of this could be people all wailing away on mobs doing their own thing with no concern for who it beats on because it ultimately dosent matter anyway.
It sounds like this could be just a further dissolution of the genre and further pandering to the entitlement crowd. Where nobody can be debarred from any activity on grounds of personal skill as that would just be unfair.
The truely awful gameplay displayed by the majority of the press event people is just a further indication of how this may well turn out to be - those clickers, one skillers and non aoe dodgiers got on just fine it seemed. Granted it was low level but i cant help but worry.
I like difficulty in games and without a degree of it there is little sense of achievement to be had, as in reall life, few things that are easy are actually worthwhile.
My recomendation to you is to watch the yogcast videos on dungeons and look at how a normal WoW player gets owned by simply doing their own thing and everyone just trying to zerg it. Then look at Mike B aka fony dungeon run and see how the part where the yogcast dies repeatdly is done by he and his group in a minute or so, by using actual strategy and having skill. There is difficulty in the game and a need for people to coordinate and strategise. This has been proven by the press beta videos that you have said to watch.
Ive seen plenty of videos so far of blobs of people doing what looks like just zerging content. Id appreciate seeing the links of these specific occassions if you could furnish us with them.
arenanet tend to be a very dynamic oriented !on other corp you could ignore this fact but on arenanet i wouldnt because they showed in gw1 they can turn insanelly quick around and if for some reason the fight arent hard enough they ll probably scalle up the difficulty of the mobs and all to 2 cause the idea is that you are supposed to have a battle on 3 front at any given time!
npc,and the other 2 faction!i dont sweat it it should be fun!
Or not. I of the casual crowd who wishes to partake in events for story sakes and not to experience uber hardmare mode content to give rise to my epeen. If you want super dooper hardcore nightmare mode then partake in the 5 man dungeons. Challenging content that is beatable is much more enjoyable then banging my head on a raid boss for hours on end while continuing to wipe ad-naseum.
Well excuse me for wanting a bit of dynamic challenging content. It has nothing to do with 'epeen' little snowflake, it's to do with providing a decent level of challenge to keep a person interested.
Who do you think you are to think that the game should be made just to your requirements? Some of us like a bit of challenge, and I would hope that we can find some in the open world as well as in dungeons. Zerg fests are not challenging. I would like some thought to be able to be applied for some events to successfully complete (and no I don't mean challenging riddles).
In short, if you don't want to do a challenging dynamic event then don't. Just ignore it and go off and save some bunny's, let someone who wants a harder event do it instead.
This is probably my biggest concern about the game, with all the recent press videos doing nothing but enforce it.
I am yet to see evidence of the much mentioned need for skill and how this will trump all. As it stands everyone has the same tools - heal, tank , dps etc. Is this not the very foundation of a zerg? As of the "greater need for communication and strategy" - is that really going to be the case if everyone can effectively "tank" for short times and roll out the way? The end result of this could be people all wailing away on mobs doing their own thing with no concern for who it beats on because it ultimately dosent matter anyway.
It sounds like this could be just a further dissolution of the genre and further pandering to the entitlement crowd. Where nobody can be debarred from any activity on grounds of personal skill as that would just be unfair.
The truely awful gameplay displayed by the majority of the press event people is just a further indication of how this may well turn out to be - those clickers, one skillers and non aoe dodgiers got on just fine it seemed. Granted it was low level but i cant help but worry.
I like difficulty in games and without a degree of it there is little sense of achievement to be had, as in reall life, few things that are easy are actually worthwhile.
My recomendation to you is to watch the yogcast videos on dungeons and look at how a normal WoW player gets owned by simply doing their own thing and everyone just trying to zerg it. Then look at Mike B aka fony dungeon run and see how the part where the yogcast dies repeatdly is done by he and his group in a minute or so, by using actual strategy and having skill. There is difficulty in the game and a need for people to coordinate and strategise. This has been proven by the press beta videos that you have said to watch.
Ive seen plenty of videos so far of blobs of people doing what looks like just zerging content. Id appreciate seeing the links of these specific occassions if you could furnish us with them.
Or not. I of the casual crowd who wishes to partake in events for story sakes and not to experience uber hardmare mode content to give rise to my epeen. If you want super dooper hardcore nightmare mode then partake in the 5 man dungeons. Challenging content that is beatable is much more enjoyable then banging my head on a raid boss for hours on end while continuing to wipe ad-naseum.
Well excuse me for wanting a bit of dynamic challenging content. It has nothing to do with 'epeen' little snowflake, it's to do with providing a decent level of challenge to keep a person interested.
Who do you think you are to think that the game should be made just to your requirements? Some of us like a bit of challenge, and I would hope that we can find some in the open world as well as in dungeons. Zerg fests are not challenging. I would like some thought to be able to be applied for some events to successfully complete (and no I don't mean challenging riddles).
In short, if you don't want to do a challenging dynamic event then don't. Just ignore it and go off and save some bunny's, let someone who wants a harder event do it instead.
This is probably my biggest concern about the game, with all the recent press videos doing nothing but enforce it.
I am yet to see evidence of the much mentioned need for skill and how this will trump all. As it stands everyone has the same tools - heal, tank , dps etc. Is this not the very foundation of a zerg? As of the "greater need for communication and strategy" - is that really going to be the case if everyone can effectively "tank" for short times and roll out the way? The end result of this could be people all wailing away on mobs doing their own thing with no concern for who it beats on because it ultimately dosent matter anyway.
It sounds like this could be just a further dissolution of the genre and further pandering to the entitlement crowd. Where nobody can be debarred from any activity on grounds of personal skill as that would just be unfair.
The truely awful gameplay displayed by the majority of the press event people is just a further indication of how this may well turn out to be - those clickers, one skillers and non aoe dodgiers got on just fine it seemed. Granted it was low level but i cant help but worry.
I like difficulty in games and without a degree of it there is little sense of achievement to be had, as in reall life, few things that are easy are actually worthwhile.
My recomendation to you is to watch the yogcast videos on dungeons and look at how a normal WoW player gets owned by simply doing their own thing and everyone just trying to zerg it. Then look at Mike B aka fony dungeon run and see how the part where the yogcast dies repeatdly is done by he and his group in a minute or so, by using actual strategy and having skill. There is difficulty in the game and a need for people to coordinate and strategise. This has been proven by the press beta videos that you have said to watch.
Ive seen plenty of videos so far of blobs of people doing what looks like just zerging content. Id appreciate seeing the links of these specific occassions if you could furnish us with them.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
No, because organising a server would be unrealistic.
In the real world, it would be ridiculous.
I take it you haven't played many old school MMOs.
Kerafyrm on the Rallos Zek server and AQ40 opening world bosses who had ridiculous HP and abilities to one shot you were defeated with server wide efforts.
While nobody is going to expect everyone to be perfectly organized like a hardcore raiding guild, you can at least organize people enough to do simple tasks.
I also expect some of the better servers to have organization on a server wide level in WvWvW.
GW2 wouldnt be GW2 if it didnt copy anything from the other mmo at first. Daoc had plenty of server wide raid, always some good leaders that come out and lead the realm for pve raid dragon raid.
Or not. I of the casual crowd who wishes to partake in events for story sakes and not to experience uber hardmare mode content to give rise to my epeen. If you want super dooper hardcore nightmare mode then partake in the 5 man dungeons. Challenging content that is beatable is much more enjoyable then banging my head on a raid boss for hours on end while continuing to wipe ad-naseum.
lol, that's not what i meant. i understand it's not fun to get pwnt all the time, but i hope world bosses are actually just that...world BOSSES. they should be something that people /y about. OMG IT'S <instert badass name>!!!!!???? if the enemy get's totally set up in the world they should have their own version of "hero" that can pwn players. i think good de's allow for an endless amount of replayability and should be used to challenge players, not make gameplay stressful, but engaging...not go collect 4 boar tusks and turn in for your daily reward. /sigh...idk...i'm just bored writing now. peace.
If an event only happened once every week or so, you can bet your ass everyone is going to show up to it.
Thos would be the main events..
`but how long are they going to last, if the players cant defeat it. As said events will scale by the numbers of players, imagine 300 average players cant kill the event as it scaled to 300.... but then after a week, in the middle of the night, an elite guild of 50 high skilled players can beat the event as its scaled to 50 and all the players are of high or above skill.
So imagine, the shatterer lands, how long will he be around? untill killed or untill he survived for longer then an hour?
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Or not. I of the casual crowd who wishes to partake in events for story sakes and not to experience uber hardmare mode content to give rise to my epeen. If you want super dooper hardcore nightmare mode then partake in the 5 man dungeons. Challenging content that is beatable is much more enjoyable then banging my head on a raid boss for hours on end while continuing to wipe ad-naseum.
There needs to be a mix of hard and easy Dynamic events if there all to easy it will be boring and unchallanging, and there should be realy hard events that you may only be successful now and then to make people feel they realy accomplished something. Some people play games to be challenged (People who played the older games) other people do not (WoW players) The game will suffer if the events didnt cater for both the people wanting a easy walk through the game and people who want to play for challenges for me i prefer a challenge when im playing a game, i dont find a game that is easy entertaining, clicking one button to win is not very fun at all.
I think dunguens may also be easier than the videos are making them out to be simply because the people playing them has not gotten use to player the character they were playing because they only played for 2 days max.
I seem to remember seeing a vid from a DE (Tequatle the Sunless) where I heard a ANet representative say there weren't enough people present to defeat the boss. At that time you would have needed about 80 players working together to defeat the boss. These numbers may still change upon release, but I wouldn't count on 50 being enough to be able to defeat every DE.
I seem to remember seeing a vid from a DE (Tequatle the Sunless) where I heard a ANet representative say there weren't enough people present to defeat the boss. At that time you would have needed about 80 players working together to defeat the boss. These numbers may still change upon release, but I wouldn't count on 50 being enough to be able to defeat every DE.
Elite events scale like ever other event but the minimum amount of players they scale to is 10.
I seem to remember seeing a vid from a DE (Tequatle the Sunless) where I heard a ANet representative say there weren't enough people present to defeat the boss. At that time you would have needed about 80 players working together to defeat the boss. These numbers may still change upon release, but I wouldn't count on 50 being enough to be able to defeat every DE.
Yes, think the Elite DEs or bosses need to be one area of a "choke point on progress" for the game. Rule being if you have a boss, always make the boss epic visual and epic gameplay, at least I think that is necessary otherwise it's "Ah another one of those things..."
I seem to remember seeing a vid from a DE (Tequatle the Sunless) where I heard a ANet representative say there weren't enough people present to defeat the boss. At that time you would have needed about 80 players working together to defeat the boss. These numbers may still change upon release, but I wouldn't count on 50 being enough to be able to defeat every DE.
And then did you see the THREE people present succeed at defending one group of turrets, raise fallen NPCs in the area, and take Tequatle down to about 30% health before the demo timer ran out?
DE difficulty is a legitimate concert at this point. The number 50 was just an example used by the OP. DEs are meant to scale to to the number of players present, meaning no matter how many people are present, the difficulty should feel about exactly the same. Some DEs have minimum scaling, but I haven't heard of an event where that minimum number is ever above 10 players.
[Insert speculation about how the encounter was probably toned down for the demo.]
Comments
Wouldn't that be nice.
I'm sure a lot of us are hoping so.
I'm not an expert on GW2 but I'm pretty sure the point of PVE in GW2 is to be doable by PUG casuals, and all DE content scales to your group. Other than explorer mode dungeons which supposedly is where the non-casual PVE'ers will have to focus if they like a PVE challenge. Most of the PVE is just for story's sake it seems.
Me personally I don't care that much about PVE so casual PVE is fine for me. PVP better be fun and difficult though as we have enough easy-mode MMO's out there already...
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
If you don't want or like the potential of large scale events, I suggest you check out SWTOR. Just because an event could be large, doesn't make it WoW. Other multi-player online rpgs have had larger scale events before WoW came along. Many of us would like to experience the challenge of or would like to again experience the challenge of a realm wide event. So can we please stop asking for limitations of what can be?
My recomendation to you is to watch the yogcast videos on dungeons and look at how a normal WoW player gets owned by simply doing their own thing and everyone just trying to zerg it. Then look at Mike B aka fony dungeon run and see how the part where the yogcast dies repeatdly is done by he and his group in a minute or so, by using actual strategy and having skill. There is difficulty in the game and a need for people to coordinate and strategise. This has been proven by the press beta videos that you have said to watch.
Ive seen plenty of videos so far of blobs of people doing what looks like just zerging content. Id appreciate seeing the links of these specific occassions if you could furnish us with them.
r.i.p. c!
arenanet tend to be a very dynamic oriented !on other corp you could ignore this fact but on arenanet i wouldnt because they showed in gw1 they can turn insanelly quick around and if for some reason the fight arent hard enough they ll probably scalle up the difficulty of the mobs and all to 2 cause the idea is that you are supposed to have a battle on 3 front at any given time!
npc,and the other 2 faction!i dont sweat it it should be fun!
Sure
Here is for the yogcast
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pG3tEl9FF9s&feature=plcp&context=C404bb58VDvjVQa1PpcFMc28lyYkGpjXOb8YGg0v37NRhkDH0VaSE%3D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGNSuIqvezI&feature=plcp&context=C4f90ee9VDvjVQa1PpcFMc28lyYkGpjVv9TM1-Fz-KxXwX1m3imZs%3D
And here are the ones from mike b
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5bbBUFqZ9A&feature=plcp&context=C4646fc9VDvjVQa1PpcFPh9gPjMS0BBzqoAYnni0zkr2f_1w4Y3W4%3D
Can't wait to zerg the Shatterer
Oh wait...
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
I take it you haven't played many old school MMOs.
Kerafyrm on the Rallos Zek server and AQ40 opening world bosses who had ridiculous HP and abilities to one shot you were defeated with server wide efforts.
While nobody is going to expect everyone to be perfectly organized like a hardcore raiding guild, you can at least organize people enough to do simple tasks.
I also expect some of the better servers to have organization on a server wide level in WvWvW.
GW2 wouldnt be GW2 if it didnt copy anything from the other mmo at first. Daoc had plenty of server wide raid, always some good leaders that come out and lead the realm for pve raid dragon raid.
lol, that's not what i meant. i understand it's not fun to get pwnt all the time, but i hope world bosses are actually just that...world BOSSES. they should be something that people /y about. OMG IT'S <instert badass name>!!!!!???? if the enemy get's totally set up in the world they should have their own version of "hero" that can pwn players. i think good de's allow for an endless amount of replayability and should be used to challenge players, not make gameplay stressful, but engaging...not go collect 4 boar tusks and turn in for your daily reward. /sigh...idk...i'm just bored writing now. peace.
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss
Thos would be the main events..
`but how long are they going to last, if the players cant defeat it. As said events will scale by the numbers of players, imagine 300 average players cant kill the event as it scaled to 300.... but then after a week, in the middle of the night, an elite guild of 50 high skilled players can beat the event as its scaled to 50 and all the players are of high or above skill.
So imagine, the shatterer lands, how long will he be around? untill killed or untill he survived for longer then an hour?
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
There needs to be a mix of hard and easy Dynamic events if there all to easy it will be boring and unchallanging, and there should be realy hard events that you may only be successful now and then to make people feel they realy accomplished something. Some people play games to be challenged (People who played the older games) other people do not (WoW players) The game will suffer if the events didnt cater for both the people wanting a easy walk through the game and people who want to play for challenges for me i prefer a challenge when im playing a game, i dont find a game that is easy entertaining, clicking one button to win is not very fun at all.
I think dunguens may also be easier than the videos are making them out to be simply because the people playing them has not gotten use to player the character they were playing because they only played for 2 days max.
I seem to remember seeing a vid from a DE (Tequatle the Sunless) where I heard a ANet representative say there weren't enough people present to defeat the boss. At that time you would have needed about 80 players working together to defeat the boss. These numbers may still change upon release, but I wouldn't count on 50 being enough to be able to defeat every DE.
Elite events scale like ever other event but the minimum amount of players they scale to is 10.
Yes, think the Elite DEs or bosses need to be one area of a "choke point on progress" for the game. Rule being if you have a boss, always make the boss epic visual and epic gameplay, at least I think that is necessary otherwise it's "Ah another one of those things..."
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
And then did you see the THREE people present succeed at defending one group of turrets, raise fallen NPCs in the area, and take Tequatle down to about 30% health before the demo timer ran out?
DE difficulty is a legitimate concert at this point. The number 50 was just an example used by the OP. DEs are meant to scale to to the number of players present, meaning no matter how many people are present, the difficulty should feel about exactly the same. Some DEs have minimum scaling, but I haven't heard of an event where that minimum number is ever above 10 players.
[Insert speculation about how the encounter was probably toned down for the demo.]