Everquest TURNED INTO a themepark MMO... it wasn't like that until it's 3rd expansion and "instancing" and portals everywhere. Until then, the game (even though zoned) played like an open world.
Secondly, EQnext & ArcheAge are both Open World MMOs. Thus inherently a sandbox.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
im pretty sure EQnext is gonna be like WOW rather than EQ. grindy is not financially viable. need to make casual to make money, themepark or sandbox doesnt matter but doesnt have to be dumbed down.
look at minecraft: casual friendly sandbox that gets heaps complex if you delve into redstone/pistons. caters to PVPers and PVEers.
I think because both are viewed a little hybrid-ish. EQ1 had no quests(in the beginning), there was no recipe book for crafting(you had to expiriment), you werent told where to go.
Many people I think are hoping for or forseeing hybrid mmo's in the future.
I've seen people mention these two together, or mention EQ when talking about sandbox games...
Why?
When I look back, I see EQ as the grandfather of all themeparks, who gave birth to WoW and spewed its genetic material across the AAA market.
When I think of community heavy games, I see them as evolutions from UO, which brought about all the succeses and foibles of today's sandbox games (deep, interdependant crafting, societies and interactions, awkward gameplay mechanics, aimless "just do stuff" gameplay).
Is there something about EQ Next that I don't understand? Is there something about EQ that I was missing?
I think it's fine for players to enjoy two completely different types of games, but I'm not sure that's what's happening here. I really think people see both as the games heading in the same direction (usually to dem good ol days).
" Is there something about EQ that I was missing?"
EQ when I first started playing back in '99 felt like a living,breathing world. Players werent confined to instanced dungeons, battlegrounds or funneled into quest hubs. People like you who think of EQ as a themepark are actually quite clueless. There were so many options, so many places to go to explore and things to do at any particular level that you never felt like you were at a themepark as you mistakenly reference it. I fondly remember never quite knowing the best places to go to level and hunt and explore at any particular level unless I stumbled upon it on my own by exploring or getting some friendly advice from other players. EQ is unique in the sense it cant really be labelled "sandbox" or "themepark." They crafted a pretty cool game world and basically told players to go have fun exploring it. Just because you couldnt build a fort or a castle doesnt mean it was a "themepark."
Im sorry, but the original Everquest is credited as the brainchild of Brad McQuaid, one of the reasons he was given free reins with Sigil and the development of Vanguard. Smedley might have been involved running RedEye (later Verant) as the gaming deparment of SoE at the time of Everquests development and release, however not in a creative capacity on the level of McQuaid or Steve Clover.
Im curious about EQnext, especially if it returns to the roots of EQ1, but I know practically nothing about Archeage other than its about 2 years away.
Everquest TURNED INTO a themepark MMO... it wasn't like that until it's 3rd expansion and "instancing" and portals everywhere. Until then, the game (even though zoned) played like an open world.
Secondly, EQnext & ArcheAge are both Open World MMOs. Thus inherently a sandbox.
Open World != Sandbox. Nor was Everquest at anytime a sandbox or even something similar to it.
Originally posted by TyvolusNext
Originally posted by Sythion
I've seen people mention these two together, or mention EQ when talking about sandbox games...
Why?
When I look back, I see EQ as the grandfather of all themeparks, who gave birth to WoW and spewed its genetic material across the AAA market.
When I think of community heavy games, I see them as evolutions from UO, which brought about all the succeses and foibles of today's sandbox games (deep, interdependant crafting, societies and interactions, awkward gameplay mechanics, aimless "just do stuff" gameplay).
Is there something about EQ Next that I don't understand? Is there something about EQ that I was missing?
I think it's fine for players to enjoy two completely different types of games, but I'm not sure that's what's happening here. I really think people see both as the games heading in the same direction (usually to dem good ol days).
" Is there something about EQ that I was missing?"
EQ when I first started playing back in '99 felt like a living,breathing world. Players werent confined to instanced dungeons, battlegrounds or funneled into quest hubs. People like you who think of EQ as a themepark are actually quite clueless. There were so many options, so many places to go to explore and things to do at any particular level that you never felt like you were at a themepark as you mistakenly reference it. I fondly remember never quite knowing the best places to go to level and hunt and explore at any particular level unless I stumbled upon it on my own by exploring or getting some friendly advice from other players. EQ is unique in the sense it cant really be labelled "sandbox" or "themepark." They crafted a pretty cool game world and basically told players to go have fun exploring it. Just because you couldnt build a fort or a castle doesnt mean it was a "themepark."
Please keep in mind, I refer to EQ at launch '99.
EQ was a themepark. All mob spawns were static. Like one theme beside the other. As much as the progression, very straight forward alongside the themepark. You couldnt change the game world, no consisting alteration. You kill a mob, empty a dungeon and after a few days everything is the same. The theme starts from the beginning.
Just because it was a "hardcore" themepark in comparsion to WoW, with a long leveling curve, with long respawn timers, with harsh death penalities, with long and time consuming traveling ways, doesnt change that it was a themepark nevertheless. WoW and the themeparks of today are just casual friendly, but beside that.. it is the same.
Ok, you didnt got a tour guide(Quests) for the theme park, but usually you travelled from one mob spawn point to the next. And every mob spawn point was a theme by itself, and strictly arranged according to levels.
Both Archeage and EqNext could potentially be that first modern game that arent shallow, so they land in the same category in that matter. Also I wouldnt call eq a themepark, there is way too much freedom - but it was a mother of themeparks, but those ended up stripping more and more freedom while packing convenience on top.
Maybe I am wrong but I beleive Brad was the driving force of eq. When Smedley says stuff like eqnext having freedom and all the things players such as myself want to hear, he is still Smedley and those intentions "they feel strongly about" could have been applied to eq instead of slowly ruining it, so my confidence in his words is pretty low (as I expect others feel).. I am always ready to be positively surpriced so lets see how it turns out.
Everquest TURNED INTO a themepark MMO... it wasn't like that until it's 3rd expansion and "instancing" and portals everywhere. Until then, the game (even though zoned) played like an open world.
Secondly, EQnext & ArcheAge are both Open World MMOs. Thus inherently a sandbox.
Open World != Sandbox. Nor was Everquest at anytime a sandbox or even something similar to it.
Originally posted by TyvolusNext
Originally posted by Sythion
I've seen people mention these two together, or mention EQ when talking about sandbox games...
Why?
When I look back, I see EQ as the grandfather of all themeparks, who gave birth to WoW and spewed its genetic material across the AAA market.
When I think of community heavy games, I see them as evolutions from UO, which brought about all the succeses and foibles of today's sandbox games (deep, interdependant crafting, societies and interactions, awkward gameplay mechanics, aimless "just do stuff" gameplay).
Is there something about EQ Next that I don't understand? Is there something about EQ that I was missing?
I think it's fine for players to enjoy two completely different types of games, but I'm not sure that's what's happening here. I really think people see both as the games heading in the same direction (usually to dem good ol days).
" Is there something about EQ that I was missing?"
EQ when I first started playing back in '99 felt like a living,breathing world. Players werent confined to instanced dungeons, battlegrounds or funneled into quest hubs. People like you who think of EQ as a themepark are actually quite clueless. There were so many options, so many places to go to explore and things to do at any particular level that you never felt like you were at a themepark as you mistakenly reference it. I fondly remember never quite knowing the best places to go to level and hunt and explore at any particular level unless I stumbled upon it on my own by exploring or getting some friendly advice from other players. EQ is unique in the sense it cant really be labelled "sandbox" or "themepark." They crafted a pretty cool game world and basically told players to go have fun exploring it. Just because you couldnt build a fort or a castle doesnt mean it was a "themepark."
Please keep in mind, I refer to EQ at launch '99.
EQ was a themepark. All mob spawns were static. Like one theme beside the other. As much as the progression, very straight forward alongside the themepark. You couldnt change the game world, no consisting alteration. You kill a mob, empty a dungeon and after a few days everything is the same. The theme starts from the beginning.
Just because it was a "hardcore" themepark in comparsion to WoW, with a long leveling curve, with long respawn timers, with harsh death penalities, with long and time consuming traveling ways, doesnt change that it was a themepark nevertheless. WoW and the themeparks of today are just casual friendly, but beside that.. it is the same.
Ok, you didnt got a tour guide(Quests) for the theme park, but usually you travelled from one mob spawn point to the next. And every mob spawn point was a theme by itself, and strictly arranged according to levels.
It was not a pure themepark due to no quests. Although everyone has different definitions of what sandbox is.
Comments
Everquest TURNED INTO a themepark MMO... it wasn't like that until it's 3rd expansion and "instancing" and portals everywhere. Until then, the game (even though zoned) played like an open world.
Secondly, EQnext & ArcheAge are both Open World MMOs. Thus inherently a sandbox.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Because players are allowed to like different types of games, perhaps? Why do I like both Guild Wars and Tecmo Super Bowl?
im pretty sure EQnext is gonna be like WOW rather than EQ. grindy is not financially viable. need to make casual to make money, themepark or sandbox doesnt matter but doesnt have to be dumbed down.
look at minecraft: casual friendly sandbox that gets heaps complex if you delve into redstone/pistons. caters to PVPers and PVEers.
I think because both are viewed a little hybrid-ish. EQ1 had no quests(in the beginning), there was no recipe book for crafting(you had to expiriment), you werent told where to go.
Many people I think are hoping for or forseeing hybrid mmo's in the future.
" Is there something about EQ that I was missing?"
EQ when I first started playing back in '99 felt like a living,breathing world. Players werent confined to instanced dungeons, battlegrounds or funneled into quest hubs. People like you who think of EQ as a themepark are actually quite clueless. There were so many options, so many places to go to explore and things to do at any particular level that you never felt like you were at a themepark as you mistakenly reference it. I fondly remember never quite knowing the best places to go to level and hunt and explore at any particular level unless I stumbled upon it on my own by exploring or getting some friendly advice from other players. EQ is unique in the sense it cant really be labelled "sandbox" or "themepark." They crafted a pretty cool game world and basically told players to go have fun exploring it. Just because you couldnt build a fort or a castle doesnt mean it was a "themepark."
Please keep in mind, I refer to EQ at launch '99.
Im sorry, but the original Everquest is credited as the brainchild of Brad McQuaid, one of the reasons he was given free reins with Sigil and the development of Vanguard. Smedley might have been involved running RedEye (later Verant) as the gaming deparment of SoE at the time of Everquests development and release, however not in a creative capacity on the level of McQuaid or Steve Clover.
Im curious about EQnext, especially if it returns to the roots of EQ1, but I know practically nothing about Archeage other than its about 2 years away.
Open World != Sandbox. Nor was Everquest at anytime a sandbox or even something similar to it.
EQ was a themepark. All mob spawns were static. Like one theme beside the other. As much as the progression, very straight forward alongside the themepark. You couldnt change the game world, no consisting alteration. You kill a mob, empty a dungeon and after a few days everything is the same. The theme starts from the beginning.
Just because it was a "hardcore" themepark in comparsion to WoW, with a long leveling curve, with long respawn timers, with harsh death penalities, with long and time consuming traveling ways, doesnt change that it was a themepark nevertheless. WoW and the themeparks of today are just casual friendly, but beside that.. it is the same.
Ok, you didnt got a tour guide(Quests) for the theme park, but usually you travelled from one mob spawn point to the next. And every mob spawn point was a theme by itself, and strictly arranged according to levels.
Both Archeage and EqNext could potentially be that first modern game that arent shallow, so they land in the same category in that matter. Also I wouldnt call eq a themepark, there is way too much freedom - but it was a mother of themeparks, but those ended up stripping more and more freedom while packing convenience on top.
Maybe I am wrong but I beleive Brad was the driving force of eq. When Smedley says stuff like eqnext having freedom and all the things players such as myself want to hear, he is still Smedley and those intentions "they feel strongly about" could have been applied to eq instead of slowly ruining it, so my confidence in his words is pretty low (as I expect others feel).. I am always ready to be positively surpriced so lets see how it turns out.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
Open World != Sandbox. Nor was Everquest at anytime a sandbox or even something similar to it.
EQ was a themepark. All mob spawns were static. Like one theme beside the other. As much as the progression, very straight forward alongside the themepark. You couldnt change the game world, no consisting alteration. You kill a mob, empty a dungeon and after a few days everything is the same. The theme starts from the beginning.
Just because it was a "hardcore" themepark in comparsion to WoW, with a long leveling curve, with long respawn timers, with harsh death penalities, with long and time consuming traveling ways, doesnt change that it was a themepark nevertheless. WoW and the themeparks of today are just casual friendly, but beside that.. it is the same.
Ok, you didnt got a tour guide(Quests) for the theme park, but usually you travelled from one mob spawn point to the next. And every mob spawn point was a theme by itself, and strictly arranged according to levels.
It was not a pure themepark due to no quests. Although everyone has different definitions of what sandbox is.