I chose Tera because I don't expect GW2's pve to amuse me (or really anyone) for very long. The PvP is alright but also not sure how long that will amuse me. Tera's pvp is not perfect either but in my opinion it has way more potential.
Obviously if you enjoy Tera more then that's what you should play. I'm just a bit surprised at the comment about because I found the PvE content in Tera to be, by far, the weakest point. One leveling path. Repeating the same fetch and kill quests 3 times (like the trees in the starter area). In fact, people advised me to just go off the path and do only my character storyline quests and farm BAMs to level. I compare this to my experience in GW2 where no matter where you go, there is appropriate and mostly interesting content for you to do, and level approrpriate items drop, and the events seemed to impact the world. But to each their own.
"Loading screens" are not "instances". Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
Thank you! Might I use your GW2 targeting analogy on other posts I find from Tera fans? Every other post is about tab-targeting! I wish both sides would read about the games before posting rumors or clueless comments.
Sure.
I don't understand what is the thing about Tera vs GW2, especially concerning combat.
I wold love an mmo that would combine the aiming crosshair of Tera+ GW2 movement freedom.
Both combat systems require skill and are fun to play.
I'm not going to be playing Tera for 2 reasons - subscription (no point paying when there are games just as good or better without them) and out of combat stuff like questing (for my tastes GW2 world is apparently superior)
But we (at least I do) definetly are needing mmorpgs that have action combat and I don't think the combat will be the main factor deciding between GW2 and Tera for most people - both games will give a more lively, albeit different, combat.
I'm sorry that you don't understand why you need the 'animation-lock' for this kind of combat. Honestly, it's one of my favorite features in the game. If you attack, you leave yourself vulnerable. The way it usually works is the stronger attacks have a bigger drawback. Even boxers and MMA fighters, with all their quickness, are vulnerable when they throw haymakers. I don't know why it's so hard for some video gamers to understand the trade-off.
I know that constant movement can be fun because it provides more of an 'arcade' feel to it, but the way TERA does it just adds another level of strategy.
I didn't said anything about understanding or not the animation lock so there is nothing to be sorry about.
Imobility is simply one of the ways of representing vulnerability and providing opportunities.
The downside of the Tera system is that it becomes easier to avoid the hits if every time one attack it has to stop.
GW2 offer those opportunities with their CC, skills that can have movement modifiers, boons and conditions.
Then add cooldowns and dodge.
You just used your big attack with a big cooldown and I just dodged taking no damage (remember you don't have that many skills availablr, so each one is precious), now you are vulnerable. On the other hand, I'm vulnerable as well since spent 1 of my dodges and have to regain endurance.
Its different ways of approaching combat that in my opinion are superior to other more traditional systems.
One may prefer one or the other, they will require different skill and routines, but both are active combat systems.
The red leads someone to believe that you don't understand why there's an animation lock. I didn't just make it up
Meh this is me signing out on the GW2 fanboy discussions. There's no point.
I argue "It's tab-targetting", and they respond back "No it's not tab-targetting because if there's a tree inbetween us then the spell hits the tree"... Oh really? What the hell does projectile collision detection have to do with tab-targetting? Absolutely NOTHING. "You don't HAVE to use tab". Yah, but you're clearly at a disadvantage to anyone else who is.
My favorite is how managing skills and cooldowns is somehow harder and more complex with the removal of a resource system.
Again, this whole everyone is self-sufficient, being able to cast while running, no real resource management thing just seems too 'arcade' for me.. I prefer the strategy of having to aim my attacks and knowing that if I miss my attack there will be more to consider than just a cooldown (like cooldown consideration is somehow new). It's no surprise people choose the easier option, hell WoW made a killer living off of it. With the action combat thing you either love it or you hate it.
Have fun trollin - Cya in-game.
First the red means that I don't see why people are bashing GW2 or Tera combat system on the grounds that they aren't innovative or at least different - both are clearly different from something you have in a game like EQ, WOW or Rift. I didn't say having to stop while using a skill is a big problem to me, but I prefer not having it, but probably the way Tera is designed absolute movement freedom would imbalance the game while in GW2 mobs have tools to crowd control the players (this is less seen in earlier levels but as you go on you start to see more knocks, conditions, charges, etc).
Second why is a disadvantage no tabbing? You can just shoot in their direction by pressing one key instead of two - you just don't see a crosshair but you are actually playing as if you had one.
Third, opposed to other games where tab guarantess you hit the enemy even if the enemy is behind a horde of other enemy targets, in GW2 it doesn't. It also doesn't guarantee an hit if the target strafes or dodge due to the physics model being used in game.
Fourth, the resource system cannot be seen in isolation to the number of skills available and type of skills available. And there is a reason why these systems with multiple resource systems end up in 1 or 2 rotations that are more efficient.
GW2 takes a different look at it (I said different, nothing about easier or harder) - there is one solid attack, the number "1" skill and all the others can be more effective if used in the proper circumstance or can be worse if used in the wrong circumstances - In a rotation sometimes you have to use subpar skills just because it is slightly better than doing nothing. Aditionally many skills concern positioning, blocking attacks, or granting boons (buffs) and debuffs (conditions).
In the end, even in games with a ton of skills available at all times, it boil down to just use 5 or 6 most of the time since all the resources just prevent you to use all those skills (and lets face it many of the skills are only useful in a few special circumstances). So in fact GW2, despite only having the cooldown resource might force a player to actually use more skills during a combat with their weapon swapping and profession mechanics because all these skills do something usefull, most if not all the time, and are required for you to survive and kill the targets (early levels this isn't true of cource).
Everyone isn't self sufficient - they are self sufficient for shorts periods of time. Big difference.
One needs to manage their health, deal damage, control the enemies, dodge and be able to hold the aggro for a few seconds. So basically one is doing all the roles that in other games are split in tank, healing and dps.
Exactly how having to perform all the roles is easier than perform a single role?
For example playing as a warrior in one of those events about killing the drake broodmother, I started by going and bashing her, then she start attacking me and my focus shifted to stay alive mode while other people pounded on her. Then someone else caught the broodmother atention, so I was able to regain my health while ressurecting a downed player and go again deal damage and then drew the broodmother attention from the other player that was starting to take a beating.
In that simple early level event, I "tanked", I dealt damage, I dodge some of the broodmother attacks and got out of the way of her breath attack, I ressurected someone, I crippled the broodmother allowing an injured player to escape and I managed my health bar. I still had to assure I was facing the broodmother and was in range to hit her.
I guess this is easy peasy mindless game.
I have no problem with you prefering a style over the other, but bashing a style without giving it a shot to actually understand what is going on, that I think isn't fair.
I don't understand why some GW2 fans bash Tera combat either - sure there is a trinity, there is rotations, but the aiming is indeed different and refreshing.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
I chose Tera because I don't expect GW2's pve to amuse me (or really anyone) for very long. The PvP is alright but also not sure how long that will amuse me. Tera's pvp is not perfect either but in my opinion it has way more potential.
Obviously if you enjoy Tera more then that's what you should play. I'm just a bit surprised at the comment about because I found the PvE content in Tera to be, by far, the weakest point. One leveling path. Repeating the same fetch and kill quests 3 times (like the trees in the starter area). In fact, people advised me to just go off the path and do only my character storyline quests and farm BAMs to level. I compare this to my experience in GW2 where no matter where you go, there is appropriate and mostly interesting content for you to do, and level approrpriate items drop, and the events seemed to impact the world. But to each their own.
I should have worded that better. I dont expect GW2 PvE to amuse me or really anyone for very long because I dont expect there to be alot of high end pve content or updates to add new pve experiences. I expect there to be the occasional expansion but thats about it. I could be mistaken but id be surprised if I was.
I expect there to be more to do in Tera PvE wise over all though I do not expect it to have more to do than say WoW PvE wise. I dont expect non PvPers to stay in either game for long.
I chose Tera because I don't expect GW2's pve to amuse me (or really anyone) for very long. The PvP is alright but also not sure how long that will amuse me. Tera's pvp is not perfect either but in my opinion it has way more potential.
Obviously if you enjoy Tera more then that's what you should play. I'm just a bit surprised at the comment about because I found the PvE content in Tera to be, by far, the weakest point. One leveling path. Repeating the same fetch and kill quests 3 times (like the trees in the starter area). In fact, people advised me to just go off the path and do only my character storyline quests and farm BAMs to level. I compare this to my experience in GW2 where no matter where you go, there is appropriate and mostly interesting content for you to do, and level approrpriate items drop, and the events seemed to impact the world. But to each their own.
I should have worded that better. I dont expect GW2 PvE to amuse me or really anyone for very long because I dont expect there to be alot of high end pve content or updates to add new pve experiences. I expect there to be the occasional expansion but thats about it. I could be mistaken but id be surprised if I was.
I expect there to be more to do in Tera PvE wise over all though I do not expect it to have more to do than say WoW PvE wise. I dont expect non PvPers to stay in either game for long.
My understanding is that post-launch, developers will be working to regularly swap in and swap out DE content to all areas of the game so that the content does not become too stale and/or predictable. There was an article on this but damned if I can find it at the moment.
At any rate, I spent about 15 or so hours on one character in the BWE and had uncovered 4% of the explorable area and I know I did not stick around areas long enough to see the full DEs play out, which is my mistake. This leads me to believe that there are hundreds of hours of pure PvE content and that the higher in level the content, the higher the stakes. This doesnt even include the 8 official instances.
This will not be enough to hold the attention of people seeking a pure instanced raiding tiered progression format, but then again at this point Tera has no raids implemented or structured PvP. It will be interesting to see which delivers more PvE satisfaction over time.
"Loading screens" are not "instances". Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
I'm sorry that you don't understand why you need the 'animation-lock' for this kind of combat. Honestly, it's one of my favorite features in the game. If you attack, you leave yourself vulnerable. The way it usually works is the stronger attacks have a bigger drawback. Even boxers and MMA fighters, with all their quickness, are vulnerable when they throw haymakers. I don't know why it's so hard for some video gamers to understand the trade-off.
I know that constant movement can be fun because it provides more of an 'arcade' feel to it, but the way TERA does it just adds another level of strategy.
I didn't said anything about understanding or not the animation lock so there is nothing to be sorry about.
Imobility is simply one of the ways of representing vulnerability and providing opportunities.
The downside of the Tera system is that it becomes easier to avoid the hits if every time one attack it has to stop.
GW2 offer those opportunities with their CC, skills that can have movement modifiers, boons and conditions.
Then add cooldowns and dodge.
You just used your big attack with a big cooldown and I just dodged taking no damage (remember you don't have that many skills availablr, so each one is precious), now you are vulnerable. On the other hand, I'm vulnerable as well since spent 1 of my dodges and have to regain endurance.
Its different ways of approaching combat that in my opinion are superior to other more traditional systems.
One may prefer one or the other, they will require different skill and routines, but both are active combat systems.
The red leads someone to believe that you don't understand why there's an animation lock. I didn't just make it up
Meh this is me signing out on the GW2 fanboy discussions. There's no point.
I argue "It's tab-targetting", and they respond back "No it's not tab-targetting because if there's a tree inbetween us then the spell hits the tree"... Oh really? What the hell does projectile collision detection have to do with tab-targetting? Absolutely NOTHING. "You don't HAVE to use tab". Yah, but you're clearly at a disadvantage to anyone else who is.
My favorite is how managing skills and cooldowns is somehow harder and more complex with the removal of a resource system.
Again, this whole everyone is self-sufficient, being able to cast while running, no real resource management thing just seems too 'arcade' for me.. I prefer the strategy of having to aim my attacks and knowing that if I miss my attack there will be more to consider than just a cooldown (like cooldown consideration is somehow new). It's no surprise people choose the easier option, hell WoW made a killer living off of it. With the action combat thing you either love it or you hate it.
Have fun trollin - Cya in-game.
First the red means that I don't see why people are bashing GW2 or Tera combat system on the grounds that they aren't innovative or at least different - both are clearly different from something you have in a game like EQ, WOW or Rift. I didn't say having to stop while using a skill is a big problem to me, but I prefer not having it, but probably the way Tera is designed absolute movement freedom would imbalance the game while in GW2 mobs have tools to crowd control the players (this is less seen in earlier levels but as you go on you start to see more knocks, conditions, charges, etc).
Second why is a disadvantage no tabbing? You can just shoot in their direction by pressing one key instead of two - you just don't see a crosshair but you are actually playing as if you had one.
Third, opposed to other games where tab guarantess you hit the enemy even if the enemy is behind a horde of other enemy targets, in GW2 it doesn't. It also doesn't guarantee an hit if the target strafes or dodge due to the physics model being used in game.
Fourth, the resource system cannot be seen in isolation to the number of skills available and type of skills available. And there is a reason why these systems with multiple resource systems end up in 1 or 2 rotations that are more efficient.
GW2 takes a different look at it (I said different, nothing about easier or harder) - there is one solid attack, the number "1" skill and all the others can be more effective if used in the proper circumstance or can be worse if used in the wrong circumstances - In a rotation sometimes you have to use subpar skills just because it is slightly better than doing nothing. Aditionally many skills concern positioning, blocking attacks, or granting boons (buffs) and debuffs (conditions).
In the end, even in games with a ton of skills available at all times, it boil down to just use 5 or 6 most of the time since all the resources just prevent you to use all those skills (and lets face it many of the skills are only useful in a few special circumstances). So in fact GW2, despite only having the cooldown resource might force a player to actually use more skills during a combat with their weapon swapping and profession mechanics because all these skills do something usefull, most if not all the time, and are required for you to survive and kill the targets (early levels this isn't true of cource).
Everyone isn't self sufficient - they are self sufficient for shorts periods of time. Big difference.
One needs to manage their health, deal damage, control the enemies, dodge and be able to hold the aggro for a few seconds. So basically one is doing all the roles that in other games are split in tank, healing and dps.
Exactly how having to perform all the roles is easier than perform a single role?
For example playing as a warrior in one of those events about killing the drake broodmother, I started by going and bashing her, then she start attacking me and my focus shifted to stay alive mode while other people pounded on her. Then someone else caught the broodmother atention, so I was able to regain my health while ressurecting a downed player and go again deal damage and then drew the broodmother attention from the other player that was starting to take a beating.
In that simple early level event, I "tanked", I dealt damage, I dodge some of the broodmother attacks and got out of the way of her breath attack, I ressurected someone, I crippled the broodmother allowing an injured player to escape and I managed my health bar. I still had to assure I was facing the broodmother and was in range to hit her.
I guess this is easy peasy mindless game.
I have no problem with you prefering a style over the other, but bashing a style without giving it a shot to actually understand what is going on, that I think isn't fair.
I don't understand why some GW2 fans bash Tera combat either - sure there is a trinity, there is rotations, but the aiming is indeed different and refreshing.
I would buy you a beer if I could. Thank you for posting that.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
I'm sorry that you don't understand why you need the 'animation-lock' for this kind of combat. Honestly, it's one of my favorite features in the game. If you attack, you leave yourself vulnerable. The way it usually works is the stronger attacks have a bigger drawback. Even boxers and MMA fighters, with all their quickness, are vulnerable when they throw haymakers. I don't know why it's so hard for some video gamers to understand the trade-off.
I know that constant movement can be fun because it provides more of an 'arcade' feel to it, but the way TERA does it just adds another level of strategy.
I didn't said anything about understanding or not the animation lock so there is nothing to be sorry about.
Imobility is simply one of the ways of representing vulnerability and providing opportunities.
The downside of the Tera system is that it becomes easier to avoid the hits if every time one attack it has to stop.
GW2 offer those opportunities with their CC, skills that can have movement modifiers, boons and conditions.
Then add cooldowns and dodge.
You just used your big attack with a big cooldown and I just dodged taking no damage (remember you don't have that many skills availablr, so each one is precious), now you are vulnerable. On the other hand, I'm vulnerable as well since spent 1 of my dodges and have to regain endurance.
Its different ways of approaching combat that in my opinion are superior to other more traditional systems.
One may prefer one or the other, they will require different skill and routines, but both are active combat systems.
The red leads someone to believe that you don't understand why there's an animation lock. I didn't just make it up
Meh this is me signing out on the GW2 fanboy discussions. There's no point.
I argue "It's tab-targetting", and they respond back "No it's not tab-targetting because if there's a tree inbetween us then the spell hits the tree"... Oh really? What the hell does projectile collision detection have to do with tab-targetting? Absolutely NOTHING. "You don't HAVE to use tab". Yah, but you're clearly at a disadvantage to anyone else who is.
My favorite is how managing skills and cooldowns is somehow harder and more complex with the removal of a resource system.
Again, this whole everyone is self-sufficient, being able to cast while running, no real resource management thing just seems too 'arcade' for me.. I prefer the strategy of having to aim my attacks and knowing that if I miss my attack there will be more to consider than just a cooldown (like cooldown consideration is somehow new). It's no surprise people choose the easier option, hell WoW made a killer living off of it. With the action combat thing you either love it or you hate it.
Have fun trollin - Cya in-game.
First the red means that I don't see why people are bashing GW2 or Tera combat system on the grounds that they aren't innovative or at least different - both are clearly different from something you have in a game like EQ, WOW or Rift. I didn't say having to stop while using a skill is a big problem to me, but I prefer not having it, but probably the way Tera is designed absolute movement freedom would imbalance the game while in GW2 mobs have tools to crowd control the players (this is less seen in earlier levels but as you go on you start to see more knocks, conditions, charges, etc).
Second why is a disadvantage no tabbing? You can just shoot in their direction by pressing one key instead of two - you just don't see a crosshair but you are actually playing as if you had one.
Third, opposed to other games where tab guarantess you hit the enemy even if the enemy is behind a horde of other enemy targets, in GW2 it doesn't. It also doesn't guarantee an hit if the target strafes or dodge due to the physics model being used in game.
Fourth, the resource system cannot be seen in isolation to the number of skills available and type of skills available. And there is a reason why these systems with multiple resource systems end up in 1 or 2 rotations that are more efficient.
GW2 takes a different look at it (I said different, nothing about easier or harder) - there is one solid attack, the number "1" skill and all the others can be more effective if used in the proper circumstance or can be worse if used in the wrong circumstances - In a rotation sometimes you have to use subpar skills just because it is slightly better than doing nothing. Aditionally many skills concern positioning, blocking attacks, or granting boons (buffs) and debuffs (conditions).
In the end, even in games with a ton of skills available at all times, it boil down to just use 5 or 6 most of the time since all the resources just prevent you to use all those skills (and lets face it many of the skills are only useful in a few special circumstances). So in fact GW2, despite only having the cooldown resource might force a player to actually use more skills during a combat with their weapon swapping and profession mechanics because all these skills do something usefull, most if not all the time, and are required for you to survive and kill the targets (early levels this isn't true of cource).
Everyone isn't self sufficient - they are self sufficient for shorts periods of time. Big difference.
One needs to manage their health, deal damage, control the enemies, dodge and be able to hold the aggro for a few seconds. So basically one is doing all the roles that in other games are split in tank, healing and dps.
Exactly how having to perform all the roles is easier than perform a single role?
For example playing as a warrior in one of those events about killing the drake broodmother, I started by going and bashing her, then she start attacking me and my focus shifted to stay alive mode while other people pounded on her. Then someone else caught the broodmother atention, so I was able to regain my health while ressurecting a downed player and go again deal damage and then drew the broodmother attention from the other player that was starting to take a beating.
In that simple early level event, I "tanked", I dealt damage, I dodge some of the broodmother attacks and got out of the way of her breath attack, I ressurected someone, I crippled the broodmother allowing an injured player to escape and I managed my health bar. I still had to assure I was facing the broodmother and was in range to hit her.
I guess this is easy peasy mindless game.
I have no problem with you prefering a style over the other, but bashing a style without giving it a shot to actually understand what is going on, that I think isn't fair.
I don't understand why some GW2 fans bash Tera combat either - sure there is a trinity, there is rotations, but the aiming is indeed different and refreshing.
.
U sir for sure proved ur point well done ! very well writing post with facts not troll... GJ !
Thank you! Might I use your GW2 targeting analogy on other posts I find from Tera fans? Every other post is about tab-targeting! I wish both sides would read about the games before posting rumors or clueless comments.
Sure.
I don't understand what is the thing about Tera vs GW2, especially concerning combat.
I wold love an mmo that would combine the aiming crosshair of Tera+ GW2 movement freedom.
Both combat systems require skill and are fun to play.
I'm not going to be playing Tera for 2 reasons - subscription (no point paying when there are games just as good or better without them) and out of combat stuff like questing (for my tastes GW2 world is apparently superior)
But we (at least I do) definetly are needing mmorpgs that have action combat and I don't think the combat will be the main factor deciding between GW2 and Tera for most people - both games will give a more lively, albeit different, combat.
I'm sorry that you don't understand why you need the 'animation-lock' for this kind of combat. Honestly, it's one of my favorite features in the game. If you attack, you leave yourself vulnerable. The way it usually works is the stronger attacks have a bigger drawback. Even boxers and MMA fighters, with all their quickness, are vulnerable when they throw haymakers. I don't know why it's so hard for some video gamers to understand the trade-off.
I know that constant movement can be fun because it provides more of an 'arcade' feel to it, but the way TERA does it just adds another level of strategy.
I didn't said anything about understanding or not the animation lock so there is nothing to be sorry about.
Imobility is simply one of the ways of representing vulnerability and providing opportunities.
The downside of the Tera system is that it becomes easier to avoid the hits if every time one attack it has to stop.
GW2 offer those opportunities with their CC, skills that can have movement modifiers, boons and conditions.
Then add cooldowns and dodge.
You just used your big attack with a big cooldown and I just dodged taking no damage (remember you don't have that many skills availablr, so each one is precious), now you are vulnerable. On the other hand, I'm vulnerable as well since spent 1 of my dodges and have to regain endurance.
Its different ways of approaching combat that in my opinion are superior to other more traditional systems.
One may prefer one or the other, they will require different skill and routines, but both are active combat systems.
The red leads someone to believe that you don't understand why there's an animation lock. I didn't just make it up
Meh this is me signing out on the GW2 fanboy discussions. There's no point.
I argue "It's tab-targetting", and they respond back "No it's not tab-targetting because if there's a tree inbetween us then the spell hits the tree"... Oh really? What the hell does projectile collision detection have to do with tab-targetting? Absolutely NOTHING. "You don't HAVE to use tab". Yah, but you're clearly at a disadvantage to anyone else who is.
My favorite is how managing skills and cooldowns is somehow harder and more complex with the removal of a resource system.
Again, this whole everyone is self-sufficient, being able to cast while running, no real resource management thing just seems too 'arcade' for me.. I prefer the strategy of having to aim my attacks and knowing that if I miss my attack there will be more to consider than just a cooldown (like cooldown consideration is somehow new). It's no surprise people choose the easier option, hell WoW made a killer living off of it. With the action combat thing you either love it or you hate it.
Have fun trollin - Cya in-game.
Ugh I thought I was done so I'll make this quick. You just butter up everything GW2 and put a little mint chocolate on top.
First the red means that I don't see why people are bashing GW2 or Tera combat system on the grounds that they aren't innovative or at least different - both are clearly different from something you have in a game like EQ, WOW or Rift. I didn't say having to stop while using a skill is a big problem to me, but I prefer not having it, but probably the way Tera is designed absolute movement freedom would imbalance the game while in GW2 mobs have tools to crowd control the players (this is less seen in earlier levels but as you go on you start to see more knocks, conditions, charges, etc).
Yes they are both different.
Second why is a disadvantage no tabbing? You can just shoot in their direction by pressing one key instead of two - you just don't see a crosshair but you are actually playing as if you had one.
You can make your own start-up and make billions without ever setting foot in an educational institution, does that mean you should? There really is just no getting through to you GW2 fans. Just because you CAN doesn't mean you WILL. I understand that you DON'T HAVE TO. However, looking at the warrior video someone post, each of his gap-closers were tab-target based. They went to the target he had tab-targetted regardless of where he was facing or 'aiming'.
Third, opposed to other games where tab guarantess you hit the enemy even if the enemy is behind a horde of other enemy targets, in GW2 it doesn't. It also doesn't guarantee an hit if the target strafes or dodge due to the physics model being used in game.
lol you just had to recite it one last time didn't you. I acknowledged the feature of projectile collision detection. It is tab-targetting with projectile collision detection. As for the last part, I've seen lots of streams and videos where animations and projectiles curve to meet their target - Again, the warrior video posted earlier, the charge curves to meet the enemy's new location.
Fourth, the resource system cannot be seen in isolation to the number of skills available and type of skills available. And there is a reason why these systems with multiple resource systems end up in 1 or 2 rotations that are more efficient.
Ok, so you've convinced yourself that having NO resource management leads to no rotations, while having resources as a limitation leads to rotations.
Because when you're at the end of your resource-pool you can keep doing the same rotation than say if all you had to do was wait for cooldowns? lol, there's just no getting through to you.
Yup, my berzerker that's been deprived of mana (rage) can keep executing the same rotation because I have a resource system. I'm sorry, but your logic hear is so horribly incorrect.
GW2 takes a different look at it (I said different, nothing about easier or harder) - there is one solid attack, the number "1" skill and all the others can be more effective if used in the proper circumstance or can be worse if used in the wrong circumstances - In a rotation sometimes you have to use subpar skills just because it is slightly better than doing nothing. Aditionally many skills concern positioning, blocking attacks, or granting boons (buffs) and debuffs (conditions).
lol no need to use subpar skills here because they give you 1 button that you're supposed to mindlessly spam inbetween any other skill because it's better than doing nothing. Not like spamming that 1 key has any drawbacks or trade-offs. This isn't a different look - WAR has casting while running and a spammable "auto-attack". It's not really that different here.
I love how you butter up things that have been in games for AGES. "lol it's about correct positioning, buffs, debuffs, some circumstances it's better etc..." You described every single MMO on the market.
In the end, even in games with a ton of skills available at all times, it boil down to just use 5 or 6 most of the time since all the resources just prevent you to use all those skills (and lets face it many of the skills are only useful in a few special circumstances). So in fact GW2, despite only having the cooldown resource might force a player to actually use more skills during a combat with their weapon swapping and profession mechanics because all these skills do something usefull, most if not all the time, and are required for you to survive and kill the targets (early levels this isn't true of cource).
I played GuildWars 1 at release. I don't have a problem with the limited skill choice - I actually like the need to select a load-out.
Everyone isn't self sufficient - they are self sufficient for shorts periods of time. Big difference.
Seriously? Wow man...
One needs to manage their health, deal damage, control the enemies, dodge and be able to hold the aggro for a few seconds. So basically one is doing all the roles that in other games are split in tank, healing and dps.
So everyone takes turns zerging the boss using their cooldowns, then waiting for them to come back to take their turn. Not waiting idly of course since you can switch to a ranged weapon. Again, self reliant. Jack of all trades deal is cool if you're into that. Personally, I prefer specialized roles. Neither is better but I can't help but feel like encounters can be easier to make for the latter. I'm interested to see how they keep things interesting.
Exactly how having to perform all the roles is easier than perform a single role?
Because it relies on teamwork instead of everyone having the tools to do it themselves.
For example playing as a warrior in one of those events about killing the drake broodmother, I started by going and bashing her, then she start attacking me and my focus shifted to stay alive mode while other people pounded on her. Then someone else caught the broodmother atention, so I was able to regain my health while ressurecting a downed player and go again deal damage and then drew the broodmother attention from the other player that was starting to take a beating.
I'm glad you had fun.
In that simple early level event, I "tanked", I dealt damage, I dodge some of the broodmother attacks and got out of the way of her breath attack, I ressurected someone, I crippled the broodmother allowing an injured player to escape and I managed my health bar. I still had to assure I was facing the broodmother and was in range to hit her.
NO WAY!! You had to stay in range AND face her? Sorry, but I couldn't resist. I just wanted to point out how deep you're pulling in your fanboy bag to try to paint the game in a positive image. It's a great game, it really doesn't need stuff like this.
Tanking, dealing damage, dodging attacks - Congratulations, you just described solo play to a T. You can do this very same "testimonial" story with anything else. "I did more than DPS, I kept mobs off the healer, I helped our healer out by avoiding big damaging attacks, I helped out our tank by providing crucial CC.. blah blah". Again, highly unbecoming.
I guess this is easy peasy mindless game.
Never said it was easy peasy. Watching streams and videos it actually seems fairly difficult PvE wise (as far as the way mobs are balanced to players etc). I think it's awesome that content scales to the amount of people. I'm curious to see how they prevent that from being a zerg-fest. What I DID say is that GW2 has tab-targetting, even if not 100%, it has it. I also mentioned having tab-targetting is easier than aiming. Easier, not easy.
I have no problem with you prefering a style over the other, but bashing a style without giving it a shot to actually understand what is going on, that I think isn't fair.
Because you're not doing the same insisting over and over and over again that there are rotations in TERA? I worry more about timing than any real rotation. Why? Because if I do an attack while the boss is doing an attack, I'm going to take a lot of damage and stress out our healer. I can't just mindlessly block in the middle of an attack like some arcade game.
I don't understand why some GW2 fans bash Tera combat either - sure there is a trinity, there is rotations, but the aiming is indeed different and refreshing.
Well that wasn't very short. Grrr. This is why you shouldn't play with leveling buddies. Damn slacker... I wanna blow stuff up.
GW2 is warhammer 2.0...while warhammer had immense potential that GW2 could do better at...its still a very familair game even without heals and all the frills they will add to it. (not a fan of the b2p+item mall cash shop ether)
Tera is ....well it looks like a better aion...has all the lame characters you hate in korean games. It has a pedo race, a furry race and a overly metro race, on top of some acceptable ones. It has "grind" Its rough around the edges. It has some issues that i wouldnt call game breaking but can be turnoffs.
The only thing tera has over GW2 is its combat system, wich is incredibly fun and diffrent. Some stunning scenery as well...everything ive seen in GW2 looks dreary and standard issue ( going the realism rout over fantasy world perhaps)
All tera has over GW2 is the combat and the bright and beautiful scenery. GW2 has everything you expect from a new wow-park with a pvp focus.
I wouldnt consider one to compete with the other in any way tbh. Im playing tera now for the combat, will play Gw2 when i get in the mood for pvp ( i actually loved warhammer so i know ill like it) Just not in the mood for gw2 type game, and ill let the community go through its 3 month emotional rollercoaster ride first. You know when all the crazy fanbois slowly turn into illogical anti-game ragers.
I have played neither game but I signed up for an account just to tell you how unintelligent your responses appear in comparison to the posters whom you're trying to reason with.
Most people take intelligent responses seriously. Give it a try. I believe in you.
We did thte same style of poll for our mutli-genre gaming group (we have been gaming for 13 years together) but the poll was simpler option 1 or option 2. We were trying to decide were we would focus for the next while. 213 votes 209 were for tera and 4 for GW2 combat. We like to focus on PvP and we keep the irrational fanboy/girl stuff out. Just combat nothing else and highlighted was 4 videos two of tera and two of GW2 PvP as performed by 2 of our top facemelters.
For PvE I would understand - people have different preferences. But for PvP? GW2's combat + combat system is designed with PvP in mind to a very large degree. So far I have not seen anything close to advanced in the way abilities are designed in Tera that makes PvP interesting.
Edit: And just stop the tab targetting stuff. It is wrong. Ranged attacks are not homing in GW2. At least base the discussion on facts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YxOeRyboxA 3:01 in that video and the next 10 seconds clearly shows it. The elementalist and the arrows comming from behind him are both locked and homing. Hrmmmmm facts is facts
OH ffs. That isn't tracking, it's straight line. In GW2 your attacks are intelligent enough to lead your target, going to where the target will be if he maintains speed and heading. If you change direction, they miss.
lololol
I wouldn't get too :smug: about the numbers on the poll. TERA fans might be, oh I don't know, playing the game? GW2 fans have nothing better to do than troll other games and white-knight their own.
I played beta weekend. I can confirm that you do change dirrections automatically. Also just want to make things clear,,, GW2 is not aim based like a FPS/TPS. it's tab target.
This is why the dodge mechanics don't actually have you dodging attacks, but simply make you immune to the attack..
Also GW2 does have animation locks. Especially on Melee. For example, Guardian Greatsword build. Using skills 2-5 on Greatsword will be interrupted while moving. While moving from point A to point B, and using those skills I between, you will stop and be rooted in place from Melee animation. Melee attacks with cast times don't seem to allow movement while casting, like advertised.
Just making this clear, since the GW2 forum community here seem to be against people speaking the truth over the misleading hype from the fans.
Thank you! Might I use your GW2 targeting analogy on other posts I find from Tera fans? Every other post is about tab-targeting! I wish both sides would read about the games before posting rumors or clueless comments.
Sure.
I don't understand what is the thing about Tera vs GW2, especially concerning combat.
I wold love an mmo that would combine the aiming crosshair of Tera+ GW2 movement freedom.
Both combat systems require skill and are fun to play.
I'm not going to be playing Tera for 2 reasons - subscription (no point paying when there are games just as good or better without them) and out of combat stuff like questing (for my tastes GW2 world is apparently superior)
But we (at least I do) definetly are needing mmorpgs that have action combat and I don't think the combat will be the main factor deciding between GW2 and Tera for most people - both games will give a more lively, albeit different, combat.
I'm sorry that you don't understand why you need the 'animation-lock' for this kind of combat. Honestly, it's one of my favorite features in the game. If you attack, you leave yourself vulnerable. The way it usually works is the stronger attacks have a bigger drawback. Even boxers and MMA fighters, with all their quickness, are vulnerable when they throw haymakers. I don't know why it's so hard for some video gamers to understand the trade-off.
I know that constant movement can be fun because it provides more of an 'arcade' feel to it, but the way TERA does it just adds another level of strategy.
I didn't said anything about understanding or not the animation lock so there is nothing to be sorry about.
Imobility is simply one of the ways of representing vulnerability and providing opportunities.
The downside of the Tera system is that it becomes easier to avoid the hits if every time one attack it has to stop.
GW2 offer those opportunities with their CC, skills that can have movement modifiers, boons and conditions.
Then add cooldowns and dodge.
You just used your big attack with a big cooldown and I just dodged taking no damage (remember you don't have that many skills availablr, so each one is precious), now you are vulnerable. On the other hand, I'm vulnerable as well since spent 1 of my dodges and have to regain endurance.
Its different ways of approaching combat that in my opinion are superior to other more traditional systems.
One may prefer one or the other, they will require different skill and routines, but both are active combat systems.
The red leads someone to believe that you don't understand why there's an animation lock. I didn't just make it up
Meh this is me signing out on the GW2 fanboy discussions. There's no point.
I argue "It's tab-targetting", and they respond back "No it's not tab-targetting because if there's a tree inbetween us then the spell hits the tree"... Oh really? What the hell does projectile collision detection have to do with tab-targetting? Absolutely NOTHING. "You don't HAVE to use tab". Yah, but you're clearly at a disadvantage to anyone else who is.
My favorite is how managing skills and cooldowns is somehow harder and more complex with the removal of a resource system.
Again, this whole everyone is self-sufficient, being able to cast while running, no real resource management thing just seems too 'arcade' for me.. I prefer the strategy of having to aim my attacks and knowing that if I miss my attack there will be more to consider than just a cooldown (like cooldown consideration is somehow new). It's no surprise people choose the easier option, hell WoW made a killer living off of it. With the action combat thing you either love it or you hate it.
Have fun trollin - Cya in-game.
Ugh I thought I was done so I'll make this quick. You just butter up everything GW2 and put a little mint chocolate on top.
First the red means that I don't see why people are bashing GW2 or Tera combat system on the grounds that they aren't innovative or at least different - both are clearly different from something you have in a game like EQ, WOW or Rift. I didn't say having to stop while using a skill is a big problem to me, but I prefer not having it, but probably the way Tera is designed absolute movement freedom would imbalance the game while in GW2 mobs have tools to crowd control the players (this is less seen in earlier levels but as you go on you start to see more knocks, conditions, charges, etc).
Yes they are both different.
Second why is a disadvantage no tabbing? You can just shoot in their direction by pressing one key instead of two - you just don't see a crosshair but you are actually playing as if you had one.
You can make your own start-up and make billions without ever setting foot in an educational institution, does that mean you should? There really is just no getting through to you GW2 fans. Just because you CAN doesn't mean you WILL. I understand that you DON'T HAVE TO. However, looking at the warrior video someone post, each of his gap-closers were tab-target based. They went to the target he had tab-targetted regardless of where he was facing or 'aiming'.
Third, opposed to other games where tab guarantess you hit the enemy even if the enemy is behind a horde of other enemy targets, in GW2 it doesn't. It also doesn't guarantee an hit if the target strafes or dodge due to the physics model being used in game.
lol you just had to recite it one last time didn't you. I acknowledged the feature of projectile collision detection. It is tab-targetting with projectile collision detection. As for the last part, I've seen lots of streams and videos where animations and projectiles curve to meet their target - Again, the warrior video posted earlier, the charge curves to meet the enemy's new location.
Fourth, the resource system cannot be seen in isolation to the number of skills available and type of skills available. And there is a reason why these systems with multiple resource systems end up in 1 or 2 rotations that are more efficient.
Ok, so you've convinced yourself that having NO resource management leads to no rotations, while having resources as a limitation leads to rotations.
Because when you're at the end of your resource-pool you can keep doing the same rotation than say if all you had to do was wait for cooldowns? lol, there's just no getting through to you.
Yup, my berzerker that's been deprived of mana (rage) can keep executing the same rotation because I have a resource system. I'm sorry, but your logic hear is so horribly incorrect.
GW2 takes a different look at it (I said different, nothing about easier or harder) - there is one solid attack, the number "1" skill and all the others can be more effective if used in the proper circumstance or can be worse if used in the wrong circumstances - In a rotation sometimes you have to use subpar skills just because it is slightly better than doing nothing. Aditionally many skills concern positioning, blocking attacks, or granting boons (buffs) and debuffs (conditions).
lol no need to use subpar skills here because they give you 1 button that you're supposed to mindlessly spam inbetween any other skill because it's better than doing nothing. Not like spamming that 1 key has any drawbacks or trade-offs. This isn't a different look - WAR has casting while running and a spammable "auto-attack". It's not really that different here.
I love how you butter up things that have been in games for AGES. "lol it's about correct positioning, buffs, debuffs, some circumstances it's better etc..." You described every single MMO on the market.
In the end, even in games with a ton of skills available at all times, it boil down to just use 5 or 6 most of the time since all the resources just prevent you to use all those skills (and lets face it many of the skills are only useful in a few special circumstances). So in fact GW2, despite only having the cooldown resource might force a player to actually use more skills during a combat with their weapon swapping and profession mechanics because all these skills do something usefull, most if not all the time, and are required for you to survive and kill the targets (early levels this isn't true of cource).
I played GuildWars 1 at release. I don't have a problem with the limited skill choice - I actually like the need to select a load-out.
Everyone isn't self sufficient - they are self sufficient for shorts periods of time. Big difference.
Seriously? Wow man...
One needs to manage their health, deal damage, control the enemies, dodge and be able to hold the aggro for a few seconds. So basically one is doing all the roles that in other games are split in tank, healing and dps.
So everyone takes turns zerging the boss using their cooldowns, then waiting for them to come back to take their turn. Not waiting idly of course since you can switch to a ranged weapon. Again, self reliant. Jack of all trades deal is cool if you're into that. Personally, I prefer specialized roles. Neither is better but I can't help but feel like encounters can be easier to make for the latter. I'm interested to see how they keep things interesting.
Exactly how having to perform all the roles is easier than perform a single role?
Because it relies on teamwork instead of everyone having the tools to do it themselves.
For example playing as a warrior in one of those events about killing the drake broodmother, I started by going and bashing her, then she start attacking me and my focus shifted to stay alive mode while other people pounded on her. Then someone else caught the broodmother atention, so I was able to regain my health while ressurecting a downed player and go again deal damage and then drew the broodmother attention from the other player that was starting to take a beating.
I'm glad you had fun.
In that simple early level event, I "tanked", I dealt damage, I dodge some of the broodmother attacks and got out of the way of her breath attack, I ressurected someone, I crippled the broodmother allowing an injured player to escape and I managed my health bar. I still had to assure I was facing the broodmother and was in range to hit her.
NO WAY!! You had to stay in range AND face her? Sorry, but I couldn't resist. I just wanted to point out how deep you're pulling in your fanboy bag to try to paint the game in a positive image. It's a great game, it really doesn't need stuff like this.
Tanking, dealing damage, dodging attacks - Congratulations, you just described solo play to a T. You can do this very same "testimonial" story with anything else. "I did more than DPS, I kept mobs off the healer, I helped our healer out by avoiding big damaging attacks, I helped out our tank by providing crucial CC.. blah blah". Again, highly unbecoming.
I guess this is easy peasy mindless game.
Never said it was easy peasy. Watching streams and videos it actually seems fairly difficult PvE wise (as far as the way mobs are balanced to players etc). I think it's awesome that content scales to the amount of people. I'm curious to see how they prevent that from being a zerg-fest. What I DID say is that GW2 has tab-targetting, even if not 100%, it has it. I also mentioned having tab-targetting is easier than aiming. Easier, not easy.
I have no problem with you prefering a style over the other, but bashing a style without giving it a shot to actually understand what is going on, that I think isn't fair.
Because you're not doing the same insisting over and over and over again that there are rotations in TERA? I worry more about timing than any real rotation. Why? Because if I do an attack while the boss is doing an attack, I'm going to take a lot of damage and stress out our healer. I can't just mindlessly block in the middle of an attack like some arcade game.
I don't understand why some GW2 fans bash Tera combat either - sure there is a trinity, there is rotations, but the aiming is indeed different and refreshing.
Well that wasn't very short. Grrr. This is why you shouldn't play with leveling buddies. Damn slacker... I wanna blow stuff up.
Ok. Lets go back to basics.
Traditional MMORPG aiming -WoW style.
You lock on targets by pressing Tab.
You can only use your skills if you are in range and have a target.
The animation of the skill doesn't actually mean anything.
Skills are homing so can't be actively strafed (any dodges/misses/bloks are die rolls).
Aiming MMORPGs - Tera (but also games like Vindictus)
You need to aim the skills or they will miss.
The animation matters - anything hit by the animation takes damage.
You can get out of the way of charge (as in skills that advance quickly instead of skills that you hold to charge, both exist in Tera and GW2 by the way) skills like the Tera's Lancer.
Some skills home on the target after being aimed, like the Archer multi shot or some of the caster spells.
Hybrid systems - GW2
For melee tab targetting only works if you have a lock on target skill like Eviscerate. These skills can still be actively blocked or dodge by the enemy.
For ranged the tab targetting system makes the character face the enemy if they aren't already and auto-aim things like the rifle shots.
You don't require a target to use your skills with the exception of target area skills and lock on target skills.
Some skills like whirlwind attack need to be aimed and once they are fired they follow the animation path just like the Tera's Lancer charge.
The projectiles like arrows and bullets and projectile spells can be actively dodged ans strafed - most of them aren't homing.
Anything that your arrows, spells, bullets, melee weapon animation hit takes damage and they hit all the enemies on their path (projectiles generally can't go through their target).
As one can see GW2 isn't simply using a tab system carbon copy of WOW nor using a full aim system as Tera.
GW2 action combat doesn't only come from the aiming but from the fast pace and ability to use skills on the move plus the hybrid aiming/tab system.
So Tera aim but also homing projectiles, GW2 can be auto aim but the projectile isn't homing.
Finally, it seems some people are very interested in trying to say GW2 is clone or an evolution of some other games. To do so they choose an element of it and say "WvW is just like DAoC RvR" or "Dynamic events are like Warhammer PQs or Rift's rifts" or "combat is just like any other tab system".
That is simplistic because not only GW2 advance those systems, what other games combine them all, don't have a gear treadmill, have instant travel, have open world dungeons, have jumping puzzles, have faillure state quests, have limited skill bar selection, doesn't have a quest log since it handles questing in a different way,everyone participating in an event or a kill is rewarded doesn't diminish xp gained if multiple players kill a creature, allows everyone to gather from a node, allows partying without party, has individual loot tables, scales down players so areas keep challenging, allows max gear to be crafted, etc, etc?
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
We did thte same style of poll for our mutli-genre gaming group (we have been gaming for 13 years together) but the poll was simpler option 1 or option 2. We were trying to decide were we would focus for the next while. 213 votes 209 were for tera and 4 for GW2 combat. We like to focus on PvP and we keep the irrational fanboy/girl stuff out. Just combat nothing else and highlighted was 4 videos two of tera and two of GW2 PvP as performed by 2 of our top facemelters.
For PvE I would understand - people have different preferences. But for PvP? GW2's combat + combat system is designed with PvP in mind to a very large degree. So far I have not seen anything close to advanced in the way abilities are designed in Tera that makes PvP interesting.
Edit: And just stop the tab targetting stuff. It is wrong. Ranged attacks are not homing in GW2. At least base the discussion on facts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YxOeRyboxA 3:01 in that video and the next 10 seconds clearly shows it. The elementalist and the arrows comming from behind him are both locked and homing. Hrmmmmm facts is facts
OH ffs. That isn't tracking, it's straight line. In GW2 your attacks are intelligent enough to lead your target, going to where the target will be if he maintains speed and heading. If you change direction, they miss.
lololol
I wouldn't get too :smug: about the numbers on the poll. TERA fans might be, oh I don't know, playing the game? GW2 fans have nothing better to do than troll other games and white-knight their own.
I played beta weekend. I can confirm that you do change dirrections automatically. Also just want to make things clear,,, GW2 is not aim based like a FPS/TPS. it's tab target.
This is why the dodge mechanics don't actually have you dodging attacks, but simply make you immune to the attack..
Also GW2 does have animation locks. Especially on Melee. For example, Guardian Greatsword build. Using skills 2-5 on Greatsword will be interrupted while moving. While moving from point A to point B, and using those skills I between, you will stop and be rooted in place from Melee animation. Melee attacks with cast times don't seem to allow movement while casting, like advertised.
Just making this clear, since the GW2 forum community here seem to be against people speaking the truth over the misleading hype from the fans.
What?
Sure the Guardian greatsword skill number 3 and number 5 are skills that say "Spin in place". Of course the Guardian greatsword also has a few skills that actually immobilize foes.
Of course if you actually hit with those skills bad things happens to the enemy and teamwork is involved to make these siuations happen.
But most melee skills allow you to move and swing.
Likewise some of the casters channeled skills require you to stop.
Yes, skill mechanics are varied.
And yet again, if someone shoots a bullet at me in GW2 I can strafe the bullet or I can strafe that warrior that is moving my way using whirliwing attack, I can again strafe.
I can't strafe an eviscerate though, but do Tera mobs strafe and dodge, and does someone strafe a Tera Archer multi shot?
Actually, PvE wise do Tera regular mobs actually dodge anything?
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
And yet again, if someone shoots a bullet at me in GW2 I can strafe the bullet or I can strafe that warrior that is moving my way using whirliwing attack, I can again strafe.
I can't strafe an eviscerate though, but do Tera mobs strafe and dodge, and does someone strafe a Tera Archer multi shot?
Actually, PvE wise do Tera regular mobs actually dodge anything?
Just a quick clarification... you really can't strafe the bullets, the projectiles are too fast for that to be reliable. Arrows, on the other hand, are much easier.
Ranged attacks in GW2, if you have a target selected, will go to where that target would be if it continued the current heading and speed. If you're running in a certain direction and someone fires an arrow at you the arrow will be on an intercept course, but if you change direction or move out of range the arrow will miss. These claims that the arrows track you are blatantly false, and the links they post to back up this alleged claim actually show them to be false.
Of course, attacks made without a target fire off in the direction you're facing.
I like the weight and feel of impact that TERA's combat has.
I like the freedom of movement and fluidity that this provides in GW2.
All in all, i never felt like i was going to die in TERA while i think i set a new world record for deaths in GW2 during both betas.
My deciding factor in preferring GW2 is the philosophy behind the game and the exploration it encourages. I'm also not a fan of delayed release for content patches. They're both solid games and i had way more fun in both than i ever did in TOR.
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter Actually, PvE wise do Tera regular mobs actually dodge anything?
Yes, and it depends the type of mob you are fighting.
Mobs with shields will block. Some mobs have a defensive roll and will dodge your attacks. Caster mobs will run away and cast spells at you. Wolf mobs will leap around.
Good to know. I'm still tempted to pick up Tera while waiting for GW2 but subscription and GF not really being interested in it is preventing me from doing so, so I'll most likely ending picking up D3 instead. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- One interesting way of looking about of GW2 and Tera combat is looking at a video like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXyorxy1Kcs . While what you do in each individual game is somewhat different the visual result is very similar.
Then go look at games like WoW. It is very easy to see how one feels both GW2 and Tera to be action oriented.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
People used tab targeting in GW2? You know you could activate attacks without selecting a target right? Move in and out of attack range while your attacks are winding up/down? I didn't use the tab key at all during the GW2 BWE.
I will call you a liar. Didn't use targeting in the beta. Yeah right.
We did thte same style of poll for our mutli-genre gaming group (we have been gaming for 13 years together) but the poll was simpler option 1 or option 2. We were trying to decide were we would focus for the next while. 213 votes 209 were for tera and 4 for GW2 combat. We like to focus on PvP and we keep the irrational fanboy/girl stuff out. Just combat nothing else and highlighted was 4 videos two of tera and two of GW2 PvP as performed by 2 of our top facemelters.
For PvE I would understand - people have different preferences. But for PvP? GW2's combat + combat system is designed with PvP in mind to a very large degree. So far I have not seen anything close to advanced in the way abilities are designed in Tera that makes PvP interesting.
Edit: And just stop the tab targetting stuff. It is wrong. Ranged attacks are not homing in GW2. At least base the discussion on facts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YxOeRyboxA 3:01 in that video and the next 10 seconds clearly shows it. The elementalist and the arrows comming from behind him are both locked and homing. Hrmmmmm facts is facts
OH ffs. That isn't tracking, it's straight line. In GW2 your attacks are intelligent enough to lead your target, going to where the target will be if he maintains speed and heading. If you change direction, they miss.
lololol
I wouldn't get too :smug: about the numbers on the poll. TERA fans might be, oh I don't know, playing the game? GW2 fans have nothing better to do than troll other games and white-knight their own.
I played beta weekend. I can confirm that you do change dirrections automatically. Also just want to make things clear,,, GW2 is not aim based like a FPS/TPS. it's tab target.
This is why the dodge mechanics don't actually have you dodging attacks, but simply make you immune to the attack..
Also GW2 does have animation locks. Especially on Melee. For example, Guardian Greatsword build. Using skills 2-5 on Greatsword will be interrupted while moving. While moving from point A to point B, and using those skills I between, you will stop and be rooted in place from Melee animation. Melee attacks with cast times don't seem to allow movement while casting, like advertised.
Just making this clear, since the GW2 forum community here seem to be against people speaking the truth over the misleading hype from the fans.
Well I'm usually pretty biased on folks negative posts. I'm going to have to say no matter what you post you hold no credibility with me, and I beleive many, many others here. After about 2 seconds of carfeful deliberation I have decided you will be my first block. I'm tired of your "polls" and disruptive comments. Grow up sir.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
We did thte same style of poll for our mutli-genre gaming group (we have been gaming for 13 years together) but the poll was simpler option 1 or option 2. We were trying to decide were we would focus for the next while. 213 votes 209 were for tera and 4 for GW2 combat. We like to focus on PvP and we keep the irrational fanboy/girl stuff out. Just combat nothing else and highlighted was 4 videos two of tera and two of GW2 PvP as performed by 2 of our top facemelters.
For PvE I would understand - people have different preferences. But for PvP? GW2's combat + combat system is designed with PvP in mind to a very large degree. So far I have not seen anything close to advanced in the way abilities are designed in Tera that makes PvP interesting.
Edit: And just stop the tab targetting stuff. It is wrong. Ranged attacks are not homing in GW2. At least base the discussion on facts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YxOeRyboxA 3:01 in that video and the next 10 seconds clearly shows it. The elementalist and the arrows comming from behind him are both locked and homing. Hrmmmmm facts is facts
OH ffs. That isn't tracking, it's straight line. In GW2 your attacks are intelligent enough to lead your target, going to where the target will be if he maintains speed and heading. If you change direction, they miss.
lololol
I wouldn't get too :smug: about the numbers on the poll. TERA fans might be, oh I don't know, playing the game? GW2 fans have nothing better to do than troll other games and white-knight their own.
I played beta weekend. I can confirm that you do change dirrections automatically. Also just want to make things clear,,, GW2 is not aim based like a FPS/TPS. it's tab target.
This is why the dodge mechanics don't actually have you dodging attacks, but simply make you immune to the attack..
Also GW2 does have animation locks. Especially on Melee. For example, Guardian Greatsword build. Using skills 2-5 on Greatsword will be interrupted while moving. While moving from point A to point B, and using those skills I between, you will stop and be rooted in place from Melee animation. Melee attacks with cast times don't seem to allow movement while casting, like advertised.
Just making this clear, since the GW2 forum community here seem to be against people speaking the truth over the misleading hype from the fans.
You never played BETA, why do you keep giving people the impression that you have.
We did thte same style of poll for our mutli-genre gaming group (we have been gaming for 13 years together) but the poll was simpler option 1 or option 2. We were trying to decide were we would focus for the next while. 213 votes 209 were for tera and 4 for GW2 combat. We like to focus on PvP and we keep the irrational fanboy/girl stuff out. Just combat nothing else and highlighted was 4 videos two of tera and two of GW2 PvP as performed by 2 of our top facemelters.
For PvE I would understand - people have different preferences. But for PvP? GW2's combat + combat system is designed with PvP in mind to a very large degree. So far I have not seen anything close to advanced in the way abilities are designed in Tera that makes PvP interesting.
Edit: And just stop the tab targetting stuff. It is wrong. Ranged attacks are not homing in GW2. At least base the discussion on facts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YxOeRyboxA 3:01 in that video and the next 10 seconds clearly shows it. The elementalist and the arrows comming from behind him are both locked and homing. Hrmmmmm facts is facts
OH ffs. That isn't tracking, it's straight line. In GW2 your attacks are intelligent enough to lead your target, going to where the target will be if he maintains speed and heading. If you change direction, they miss.
lololol
I wouldn't get too :smug: about the numbers on the poll. TERA fans might be, oh I don't know, playing the game? GW2 fans have nothing better to do than troll other games and white-knight their own.
I played beta weekend. I can confirm that you do change dirrections automatically. Also just want to make things clear,,, GW2 is not aim based like a FPS/TPS. it's tab target.
This is why the dodge mechanics don't actually have you dodging attacks, but simply make you immune to the attack..
Also GW2 does have animation locks. Especially on Melee. For example, Guardian Greatsword build. Using skills 2-5 on Greatsword will be interrupted while moving. While moving from point A to point B, and using those skills I between, you will stop and be rooted in place from Melee animation. Melee attacks with cast times don't seem to allow movement while casting, like advertised.
Just making this clear, since the GW2 forum community here seem to be against people speaking the truth over the misleading hype from the fans.
You never played BETA, why do you keep giving people the impression that you have.
Yeah cause I have forum access but didn't play. [Mod Edit]
People used tab targeting in GW2? You know you could activate attacks without selecting a target right? Move in and out of attack range while your attacks are winding up/down? I didn't use the tab key at all during the GW2 BWE.
I will call you a liar. Didn't use targeting in the beta. Yeah right.
when you press a skill it will automatically select the closest target in range if you do not have anyone targeted... and close to a quarter of the skills are aoe based requiring careful placement which very little amount of mmos do.. liar
People used tab targeting in GW2? You know you could activate attacks without selecting a target right? Move in and out of attack range while your attacks are winding up/down? I didn't use the tab key at all during the GW2 BWE.
I will call you a liar. Didn't use targeting in the beta. Yeah right.
when you press a skill it will automatically select the closest target in range if you do not have anyone targeted... and close to a quarter of the skills are aoe based requiring careful placement which very little amount of mmos do.. liar
That's the same thing as smart targeting in a tab target game....
everyone who was in GW2 BWE and had already played TERA weekends could see the difference of dynamic system but static/slow movement battle and tab targeting but fluid movement battles ...
in TERA i was feeling i play with a truck driver, in GW2 i had the sense of ninja !!! exception might be the root based skills for twohanded melee weapons ...
also dont forget the lag in the GW2 first BWE, usually the common message for projectiles was "obscured" ...
Comments
Obviously if you enjoy Tera more then that's what you should play. I'm just a bit surprised at the comment about because I found the PvE content in Tera to be, by far, the weakest point. One leveling path. Repeating the same fetch and kill quests 3 times (like the trees in the starter area). In fact, people advised me to just go off the path and do only my character storyline quests and farm BAMs to level. I compare this to my experience in GW2 where no matter where you go, there is appropriate and mostly interesting content for you to do, and level approrpriate items drop, and the events seemed to impact the world. But to each their own.
"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
First the red means that I don't see why people are bashing GW2 or Tera combat system on the grounds that they aren't innovative or at least different - both are clearly different from something you have in a game like EQ, WOW or Rift. I didn't say having to stop while using a skill is a big problem to me, but I prefer not having it, but probably the way Tera is designed absolute movement freedom would imbalance the game while in GW2 mobs have tools to crowd control the players (this is less seen in earlier levels but as you go on you start to see more knocks, conditions, charges, etc).
Second why is a disadvantage no tabbing? You can just shoot in their direction by pressing one key instead of two - you just don't see a crosshair but you are actually playing as if you had one.
Third, opposed to other games where tab guarantess you hit the enemy even if the enemy is behind a horde of other enemy targets, in GW2 it doesn't. It also doesn't guarantee an hit if the target strafes or dodge due to the physics model being used in game.
Fourth, the resource system cannot be seen in isolation to the number of skills available and type of skills available. And there is a reason why these systems with multiple resource systems end up in 1 or 2 rotations that are more efficient.
GW2 takes a different look at it (I said different, nothing about easier or harder) - there is one solid attack, the number "1" skill and all the others can be more effective if used in the proper circumstance or can be worse if used in the wrong circumstances - In a rotation sometimes you have to use subpar skills just because it is slightly better than doing nothing. Aditionally many skills concern positioning, blocking attacks, or granting boons (buffs) and debuffs (conditions).
In the end, even in games with a ton of skills available at all times, it boil down to just use 5 or 6 most of the time since all the resources just prevent you to use all those skills (and lets face it many of the skills are only useful in a few special circumstances). So in fact GW2, despite only having the cooldown resource might force a player to actually use more skills during a combat with their weapon swapping and profession mechanics because all these skills do something usefull, most if not all the time, and are required for you to survive and kill the targets (early levels this isn't true of cource).
Everyone isn't self sufficient - they are self sufficient for shorts periods of time. Big difference.
One needs to manage their health, deal damage, control the enemies, dodge and be able to hold the aggro for a few seconds. So basically one is doing all the roles that in other games are split in tank, healing and dps.
Exactly how having to perform all the roles is easier than perform a single role?
For example playing as a warrior in one of those events about killing the drake broodmother, I started by going and bashing her, then she start attacking me and my focus shifted to stay alive mode while other people pounded on her. Then someone else caught the broodmother atention, so I was able to regain my health while ressurecting a downed player and go again deal damage and then drew the broodmother attention from the other player that was starting to take a beating.
In that simple early level event, I "tanked", I dealt damage, I dodge some of the broodmother attacks and got out of the way of her breath attack, I ressurected someone, I crippled the broodmother allowing an injured player to escape and I managed my health bar. I still had to assure I was facing the broodmother and was in range to hit her.
I guess this is easy peasy mindless game.
I have no problem with you prefering a style over the other, but bashing a style without giving it a shot to actually understand what is going on, that I think isn't fair.
I don't understand why some GW2 fans bash Tera combat either - sure there is a trinity, there is rotations, but the aiming is indeed different and refreshing.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
I should have worded that better. I dont expect GW2 PvE to amuse me or really anyone for very long because I dont expect there to be alot of high end pve content or updates to add new pve experiences. I expect there to be the occasional expansion but thats about it. I could be mistaken but id be surprised if I was.
I expect there to be more to do in Tera PvE wise over all though I do not expect it to have more to do than say WoW PvE wise. I dont expect non PvPers to stay in either game for long.
My understanding is that post-launch, developers will be working to regularly swap in and swap out DE content to all areas of the game so that the content does not become too stale and/or predictable. There was an article on this but damned if I can find it at the moment.
At any rate, I spent about 15 or so hours on one character in the BWE and had uncovered 4% of the explorable area and I know I did not stick around areas long enough to see the full DEs play out, which is my mistake. This leads me to believe that there are hundreds of hours of pure PvE content and that the higher in level the content, the higher the stakes. This doesnt even include the 8 official instances.
This will not be enough to hold the attention of people seeking a pure instanced raiding tiered progression format, but then again at this point Tera has no raids implemented or structured PvP. It will be interesting to see which delivers more PvE satisfaction over time.
"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
I would buy you a beer if I could. Thank you for posting that.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
U sir for sure proved ur point well done ! very well writing post with facts not troll... GJ !
Well that wasn't very short. Grrr. This is why you shouldn't play with leveling buddies. Damn slacker... I wanna blow stuff up.
Simply put...
GW2 is warhammer 2.0...while warhammer had immense potential that GW2 could do better at...its still a very familair game even without heals and all the frills they will add to it. (not a fan of the b2p+item mall cash shop ether)
Tera is ....well it looks like a better aion...has all the lame characters you hate in korean games. It has a pedo race, a furry race and a overly metro race, on top of some acceptable ones. It has "grind" Its rough around the edges. It has some issues that i wouldnt call game breaking but can be turnoffs.
The only thing tera has over GW2 is its combat system, wich is incredibly fun and diffrent. Some stunning scenery as well...everything ive seen in GW2 looks dreary and standard issue ( going the realism rout over fantasy world perhaps)
All tera has over GW2 is the combat and the bright and beautiful scenery. GW2 has everything you expect from a new wow-park with a pvp focus.
I wouldnt consider one to compete with the other in any way tbh. Im playing tera now for the combat, will play Gw2 when i get in the mood for pvp ( i actually loved warhammer so i know ill like it) Just not in the mood for gw2 type game, and ill let the community go through its 3 month emotional rollercoaster ride first. You know when all the crazy fanbois slowly turn into illogical anti-game ragers.
"helthros":
I have played neither game but I signed up for an account just to tell you how unintelligent your responses appear in comparison to the posters whom you're trying to reason with.
Most people take intelligent responses seriously. Give it a try. I believe in you.
For PvE I would understand - people have different preferences. But for PvP? GW2's combat + combat system is designed with PvP in mind to a very large degree. So far I have not seen anything close to advanced in the way abilities are designed in Tera that makes PvP interesting.
Edit: And just stop the tab targetting stuff. It is wrong. Ranged attacks are not homing in GW2. At least base the discussion on facts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YxOeRyboxA 3:01 in that video and the next 10 seconds clearly shows it. The elementalist and the arrows comming from behind him are both locked and homing. Hrmmmmm facts is facts
OH ffs. That isn't tracking, it's straight line. In GW2 your attacks are intelligent enough to lead your target, going to where the target will be if he maintains speed and heading. If you change direction, they miss.
lololol
I wouldn't get too :smug: about the numbers on the poll. TERA fans might be, oh I don't know, playing the game? GW2 fans have nothing better to do than troll other games and white-knight their own.
I played beta weekend. I can confirm that you do change dirrections automatically. Also just want to make things clear,,, GW2 is not aim based like a FPS/TPS. it's tab target.This is why the dodge mechanics don't actually have you dodging attacks, but simply make you immune to the attack..
Also GW2 does have animation locks. Especially on Melee. For example, Guardian Greatsword build. Using skills 2-5 on Greatsword will be interrupted while moving. While moving from point A to point B, and using those skills I between, you will stop and be rooted in place from Melee animation. Melee attacks with cast times don't seem to allow movement while casting, like advertised.
Just making this clear, since the GW2 forum community here seem to be against people speaking the truth over the misleading hype from the fans.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Ok. Lets go back to basics.
Traditional MMORPG aiming -WoW style.
You lock on targets by pressing Tab.
You can only use your skills if you are in range and have a target.
The animation of the skill doesn't actually mean anything.
Skills are homing so can't be actively strafed (any dodges/misses/bloks are die rolls).
Aiming MMORPGs - Tera (but also games like Vindictus)
You need to aim the skills or they will miss.
The animation matters - anything hit by the animation takes damage.
You can get out of the way of charge (as in skills that advance quickly instead of skills that you hold to charge, both exist in Tera and GW2 by the way) skills like the Tera's Lancer.
Some skills home on the target after being aimed, like the Archer multi shot or some of the caster spells.
Hybrid systems - GW2
For melee tab targetting only works if you have a lock on target skill like Eviscerate. These skills can still be actively blocked or dodge by the enemy.
For ranged the tab targetting system makes the character face the enemy if they aren't already and auto-aim things like the rifle shots.
You don't require a target to use your skills with the exception of target area skills and lock on target skills.
Some skills like whirlwind attack need to be aimed and once they are fired they follow the animation path just like the Tera's Lancer charge.
The projectiles like arrows and bullets and projectile spells can be actively dodged ans strafed - most of them aren't homing.
Anything that your arrows, spells, bullets, melee weapon animation hit takes damage and they hit all the enemies on their path (projectiles generally can't go through their target).
As one can see GW2 isn't simply using a tab system carbon copy of WOW nor using a full aim system as Tera.
GW2 action combat doesn't only come from the aiming but from the fast pace and ability to use skills on the move plus the hybrid aiming/tab system.
So Tera aim but also homing projectiles, GW2 can be auto aim but the projectile isn't homing.
Finally, it seems some people are very interested in trying to say GW2 is clone or an evolution of some other games. To do so they choose an element of it and say "WvW is just like DAoC RvR" or "Dynamic events are like Warhammer PQs or Rift's rifts" or "combat is just like any other tab system".
That is simplistic because not only GW2 advance those systems, what other games combine them all, don't have a gear treadmill, have instant travel, have open world dungeons, have jumping puzzles, have faillure state quests, have limited skill bar selection, doesn't have a quest log since it handles questing in a different way,everyone participating in an event or a kill is rewarded doesn't diminish xp gained if multiple players kill a creature, allows everyone to gather from a node, allows partying without party, has individual loot tables, scales down players so areas keep challenging, allows max gear to be crafted, etc, etc?
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
What?
Sure the Guardian greatsword skill number 3 and number 5 are skills that say "Spin in place". Of course the Guardian greatsword also has a few skills that actually immobilize foes.
Of course if you actually hit with those skills bad things happens to the enemy and teamwork is involved to make these siuations happen.
But most melee skills allow you to move and swing.
Likewise some of the casters channeled skills require you to stop.
Yes, skill mechanics are varied.
And yet again, if someone shoots a bullet at me in GW2 I can strafe the bullet or I can strafe that warrior that is moving my way using whirliwing attack, I can again strafe.
I can't strafe an eviscerate though, but do Tera mobs strafe and dodge, and does someone strafe a Tera Archer multi shot?
Actually, PvE wise do Tera regular mobs actually dodge anything?
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Just a quick clarification... you really can't strafe the bullets, the projectiles are too fast for that to be reliable. Arrows, on the other hand, are much easier.
Ranged attacks in GW2, if you have a target selected, will go to where that target would be if it continued the current heading and speed. If you're running in a certain direction and someone fires an arrow at you the arrow will be on an intercept course, but if you change direction or move out of range the arrow will miss. These claims that the arrows track you are blatantly false, and the links they post to back up this alleged claim actually show them to be false.
Of course, attacks made without a target fire off in the direction you're facing.
Oderint, dum metuant.
I like the weight and feel of impact that TERA's combat has.
I like the freedom of movement and fluidity that this provides in GW2.
All in all, i never felt like i was going to die in TERA while i think i set a new world record for deaths in GW2 during both betas.
My deciding factor in preferring GW2 is the philosophy behind the game and the exploration it encourages. I'm also not a fan of delayed release for content patches. They're both solid games and i had way more fun in both than i ever did in TOR.
Mobs with shields will block.
Some mobs have a defensive roll and will dodge your attacks.
Caster mobs will run away and cast spells at you.
Wolf mobs will leap around.
Good to know.
I'm still tempted to pick up Tera while waiting for GW2 but subscription and GF not really being interested in it is preventing me from doing so, so I'll most likely ending picking up D3 instead.
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One interesting way of looking about of GW2 and Tera combat is looking at a video like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXyorxy1Kcs . While what you do in each individual game is somewhat different the visual result is very similar.
Then go look at games like WoW.
It is very easy to see how one feels both GW2 and Tera to be action oriented.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
I will call you a liar. Didn't use targeting in the beta. Yeah right.Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Well I'm usually pretty biased on folks negative posts. I'm going to have to say no matter what you post you hold no credibility with me, and I beleive many, many others here. After about 2 seconds of carfeful deliberation I have decided you will be my first block. I'm tired of your "polls" and disruptive comments. Grow up sir.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
You never played BETA, why do you keep giving people the impression that you have.
Yeah cause I have forum access but didn't play. [Mod Edit]
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
when you press a skill it will automatically select the closest target in range if you do not have anyone targeted... and close to a quarter of the skills are aoe based requiring careful placement which very little amount of mmos do.. liar
I will call you a liar. Didn't use targeting in the beta. Yeah right.when you press a skill it will automatically select the closest target in range if you do not have anyone targeted... and close to a quarter of the skills are aoe based requiring careful placement which very little amount of mmos do.. liar
That's the same thing as smart targeting in a tab target game....Philosophy of MMO Game Design
everyone who was in GW2 BWE and had already played TERA weekends could see the difference of dynamic system but static/slow movement battle and tab targeting but fluid movement battles ...
in TERA i was feeling i play with a truck driver, in GW2 i had the sense of ninja !!! exception might be the root based skills for twohanded melee weapons ...
also dont forget the lag in the GW2 first BWE, usually the common message for projectiles was "obscured" ...