SWTOR, much like Tera is sorely lacking in MMORPG aspects.
Tera has the size of an MMORPG but is lacking in almost everything else in terms of depth and quality...SWTOR has size and story.
SWTOR plays like a single player RPG forced online with a few multi-player aspects...and the community acts like it, if you want to call it a community. im playing right now, been logged in for just over an hour and have seen one single person say something in chat and thats only because he cant solo the quest he wants to do.
Joy. Once im done with this 3rd characters story ark im out and even though I am having fun with the story I hate the fact that I have paid to play it, wont happen again. I will be playing GW2 until the new D&D game comes out, no more pay to play mediocre MMOs that dont bring anything to the genre for me.
I am 100% done with P2P MMOs and its 100% the fault of companies making piss poor quality games for "the masses".
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
If it wants to survive it better go f2p before the GW2 freight train launches officially. There is also Tera and TSW that will gobble up some TOR players as well.
I said I was not going to purchase it as I was waiting on D3 & GW2 but when those games got set back I thought why not give it a try. Against my better judgment I purchased it. I didnt last a month. For such a highly anticipated game it was a big let down. I would have rather gone back to WOW where I had unsubbed 1.5 years ago.
Yes it should be B2P or F2P but I dont think that will happen at this moment as long as they have the subs that cover their expenses and turn a profit. Until they start losing money in the "sub's" catagory it will still be a subscription game....but they will need to plan for that day as there are a lot of other games approaching that will draw people away.
Should they make it F2P? Well yes if subs are declining. F2P will bring in more cash, it's not like they would need to do much changes.
Every fun features is already shoehorsed into premium / collector / exclusiv x *****. And they way Legacy currently works one rather get's a feeling it took them that long to rewrite it from real money to in game currency.
Would F2P make me come back? NO. It's never been about the 15$ a month. I don't care about it. The question is, whenever the game is enough to be worth my time.
The bad designed classes, the poor story implementation and the lack of deep and freedom of character creation. (Armor restrictions, weapon restrictions, faction restrictions), dead empty areas, lackluster Graphics with an douchebag attitude about it, aside from heavy balancing issues - won't make me come back.
This game is as good as any nameless clone korean grinder f2p game to me. 5 Minutes of Fun with Vette and SWTOR slapped over those....armor...aborminations won't change that.
In this week's Star Wars: The Old Republic column we discuss whether or not SWTOR should make the switch to the free-to-play business model.
I’ve been knee-deep in the MMORPG.com community since I came on in June of 2009, but it feels like only yesterday when our community was up in arms over the notion of some Western game going free-to-play. While some of this sentiment still remains, it doesn’t take more than a cursory glance to notice that there’s been an overall attitude shift here, and this is likely due in part to the gradual trend towards free-to-play that has been going on since DDO made the extremely successful switch back in September of ’09. This apparent shift, at least to me, speaks volumes to where things are headed and it’s got me asking myself one question in particular as of late:
Should Star Wars: The Old Republic go Free-to-Play?
As if there weren't enough threads for whiners and trolls we have community managers creating them now? NICE!
Tera is gonna have people bitching in a month.
GW2 wil have people bitching a month after release.
TSW will have people bitching after release...
You see the trend? It's all happened before... see the last 10 years on this forum...
You are right. It only shows that moderators are nothing better then rest of us. He is just throwing apples to hungry crowd. I think it is my last post on this site, it is just stupid to watch same spiting all the time. I go now to play because mmo players play games and boring old ladies write on forums all the time. Facebook generations all over the place
F2P only promotes low end players(10-20 yr old immature gamers), instant gratification gaming, more grinding for points to spend on crappy cosmetic/leveling gear and an overall underwelming gaming world.
If anything, I believe F2P games cause players to leave earlier for other games because the lack of time invested in the game makes it too easy to just quit from boredom/lack of content.
Pay the devs up front and you'll find the games to be done both professionally, creatively and worth their weight in gold(literally).
I wouldn't be playing TOR right now if it was free and neither would my wife. I guess we're just old school players.
For this discussion to make any sense whatsoever you would first have to establish that ToR isn't doing well with it's current model. For better or ill what hard evidence there is suggests it's doing very well indeed -- and frankly I'll take official EA numbers over the ravings of the armchair expert brigade any day of the week.
MMORPG.com writers have given in to the mob of idiots that haunt their forums...
These people are out of touch with reality... casking for server merges in games they don't even play when those servers show standard population on most nights.
I would be shocked if either of you still has a sub to SWTOR as you are clearly out of touch with the population issues this game has. I unfortunately still have a sub (my wife still wants to log in once a week so I said I would play with her) and the population decline is shocking and a very big issue at this point.
I don't think this game should go F2P before they have the funds to create some alternate lvling paths...lol. With one leveling path there isn't much to do for more than two months and thus I can't imagine that F2P would really help the game. Not to mention it is nice to have at least one MMO left that doesn't have a cash shop.
F2P only promotes low end players(10-20 yr old immature gamers), instant gratification gaming, more grinding for points to spend on crappy cosmetic/leveling gear and an overall underwelming gaming world.
If anything, I believe F2P games cause players to leave earlier for other games because the lack of time invested in the game makes it too easy to just quit from boredom/lack of content.
Pay the devs up front and you'll find the games to be done both professionally, creatively and worth their weight in gold(literally).
I wouldn't be playing TOR right now if it was free and neither would my wife. I guess we're just old school players.
It can't go ftp. It cost a ton to make and they have to pay Lucus. The might do some sort of play free until lvl 10 or other crappy gimmick to get people interested in the game again, but its going to be awhile if ever before they can go ftp.
Agreed. I think I see them going the WoW route in that regard at some point, especially after this report from Gamespot a while back. It's kind of hard to estimate how many people are genuinely subscribed with the 30 free days (I have two accounts currently activated due to the 30 day giveaway for having a 50 on each one), and until the smoke clears from that deal, we won't have a very lucid picture of what's actually happening.
I do know that if the game was F2P, a few of my friends who left would at least come back to play the game with me on occasion. As it stands now, there are just a handful of people I know who still play. I'm looking forward to the upcoming free transfers so I can possibly move to a server with a higher population. It's very hard for me to find groups while leveling right now.
Originally posted by Cypt1 It's kind of hard to estimate how many people are genuinely subscribed with the 30 free days (I have two accounts currently activated due to the 30 day giveaway for having a 50 on each one), and until the smoke clears from that deal, we won't have a very lucid picture of what's actually happening.
I forsee the reactivations happening every time they have to show investors sub numbers.
Emperors new clothes situation for sure.
Grouping in Old school mmo's: meeting someone at the bar and chatting, getting to know them before jumping into bed. Current mmo's grouping: tinder. swipe, hookup, hope you don't get herpes, never see them again.
In this week's Star Wars: The Old Republic column we discuss whether or not SWTOR should make the switch to the free-to-play business model.
I’ve been knee-deep in the MMORPG.com community since I came on in June of 2009, but it feels like only yesterday when our community was up in arms over the notion of some Western game going free-to-play. While some of this sentiment still remains, it doesn’t take more than a cursory glance to notice that there’s been an overall attitude shift here, and this is likely due in part to the gradual trend towards free-to-play that has been going on since DDO made the extremely successful switch back in September of ’09. This apparent shift, at least to me, speaks volumes to where things are headed and it’s got me asking myself one question in particular as of late:
Should Star Wars: The Old Republic go Free-to-Play?
As if there weren't enough threads for whiners and trolls we have community managers creating them now? NICE!
Tera is gonna have people bitching in a month.
GW2 wil have people bitching a month after release.
TSW will have people bitching after release...
You see the trend? It's all happened before... see the last 10 years on this forum...
THis is why I dont think f2p is a bad thing....The trend is that people bitch after they pay money for these games....If you're playing for free and don't like the game, you just leave and move on to the next game......If you pay 60 bukcs for the box, then another 15 a month for a few months, then you feel cheated.....Also if gamers weren't so dumb they would simply wait a few months and play these games for a fraction of hte price that they do on launch day.....At some point SWTOR will most likely be f2p, and at that point Iwill check it out.
The game should have been b2p not f2p. With updates that actually add content being purchaseable dlc.
I think the bigger question is considering the market and the lack of hype should The Secret World consider going b2p?
Just LOL.. not going to happen, its p2p + cash shop for clothes and stuff
Yeah I know...of course they won't. Doesn't mean they shouldn't consider it.
As proven all to often by these companies there are a lot of things they should consider and not write off so quickly. Many of them would have been better off if they had.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I think all sci-fi MMORPG are up against strong opposition with Eve Online on the market - CCP evolve their game.
Neither SWTOR or Eve Online were that great in the first few months, but SWTOR isn't even trying to adapt.
No offense against EVE or its playerbase but it is not even a contender for the sub numbers TOR wants & needs. EVE has its niche player base and overall has done pretty well. But TOR will probably be shut down if it drops enough subs to be at EVE subsciption numbers.
And the TOR fans are pretty much opposite in every way possible from EVE fans. Other than they are humans & are breathing.
And the TOR fans are pretty much opposite in every way possible from EVE fans. Other than they are humans & are breathing.
or dead accounts reactivated to show "sub numbers" to ppl without a clue
Grouping in Old school mmo's: meeting someone at the bar and chatting, getting to know them before jumping into bed. Current mmo's grouping: tinder. swipe, hookup, hope you don't get herpes, never see them again.
I agree that F2P is the way TOR will go soon enough.
We paid $150.00 for the CE version and got what for our money.... Not much.
I think the hype that Star Wars has in general was super High for this game and BW and the people that play it gave it far more hype then it was due.
The graphics are good for the game, FPS is bad...
I have un-subbed and will play something else. GW2 looks far to much like WoW and D3, is well... a let down.
They promise of the "Patch" is seen as a never ending story. Server transfers will be out some time this summer...?
That would be far to late, as they may not have many folks to transfer by that time......
Bio made many mistakes that should not have been. It is not like they were the First MMO.
They have had plenty others to look at and build from, yet they did not. Heck, they had SWG to model some parts after, yet they chose to, not include, a great many things that would have help make the game far better then it is.
Sad, because I an a huge fan of all things SW, and have played every game made. This is Not the first let down, nor will it be the last.
Any problem can be solved, with the Proper Amount of High Explosives..... Dont take life serious, youll never get out alive ..
First and foremost, TOR should have never been made at all. If Bioware wanted to jump into the mmo genre, they should have used their own ME IP and left SW alone. I say don't do what SOE did with SWG after the killing blow of the NGE. Let TOR die quickly and let it be done.
my personal thoughts on SWToR, and I stress personal, take it or leave it, I really don't care, is....
BW were looking at the mmo market and drooling over the possible revenue. They decided to go for a sure thing for box sales and preorders and signed on with Lucas to make a SW mmo. Sound logic. Work on coding, figure out the how and when's of mmorpg's. Guaranteed huge sales for their first mmo title by partnering with Lucas. Their thoughts on the back burner were "and when we're done we'll have a name in the mmo scene and huge profits from presales, even after paying for the dev time, voice actores, etc and giving Lucas their cut....Then we can put out the Mass Effect MMO we're wanting to make and it will be sweet sweet profit".
I fully expect BW to pull pretty much all support to SWToR one year after release and then go full throttle on the ME MMO they've spoken about a few times.
Stale worlds, stale gameplay, the whole thing is on rails (I'd probably still play if there were even one optional area to hunt per level bracket to advance rather than starter world>DK>Balmorra>tatooine>NS>Taris>ETC-ETC-ETC over and over per character rails shooting...or pvp from 15 to 50). Combining that, declining player base (my guild of 150 dropped to 48 char's [pretty much 6 of us and alts] before I pulled the plug on my account), and a general Been There Done That after my first character, and my thoughts on how the support for the game will go decided for me.
Grouping in Old school mmo's: meeting someone at the bar and chatting, getting to know them before jumping into bed. Current mmo's grouping: tinder. swipe, hookup, hope you don't get herpes, never see them again.
As if there weren't enough threads for whiners and trolls we have community managers creating them now? NICE!
Tera is gonna have people bitching in a month.
GW2 wil have people bitching a month after release.
TSW will have people bitching after release...
You see the trend? It's all happened before... see the last 10 years on this forum...
You are right. It only shows that moderators are nothing better then rest of us. He is just throwing apples to hungry crowd. I think it is my last post on this site, it is just stupid to watch same spiting all the time. I go now to play because mmo players play games and boring old ladies write on forums all the time. Facebook generations all over the place
Lol...of all the people for you to make these types of accusations against. Hahahaha
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Comments
SWTOR, much like Tera is sorely lacking in MMORPG aspects.
Tera has the size of an MMORPG but is lacking in almost everything else in terms of depth and quality...SWTOR has size and story.
SWTOR plays like a single player RPG forced online with a few multi-player aspects...and the community acts like it, if you want to call it a community. im playing right now, been logged in for just over an hour and have seen one single person say something in chat and thats only because he cant solo the quest he wants to do.
Joy. Once im done with this 3rd characters story ark im out and even though I am having fun with the story I hate the fact that I have paid to play it, wont happen again. I will be playing GW2 until the new D&D game comes out, no more pay to play mediocre MMOs that dont bring anything to the genre for me.
I am 100% done with P2P MMOs and its 100% the fault of companies making piss poor quality games for "the masses".
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
Just LOL.. not going to happen, its p2p + cash shop for clothes and stuff
Like most said they should have been b2p from he beginning.
F2P conversion takes time and I am not sure how people would react ot it, as from hyped to f2pis a long fall.
For the MMO Genre I hope they keep it p2p and let it die when the time has come
Grim Dawn, the next great action rpg!
http://www.grimdawn.com/
I said I was not going to purchase it as I was waiting on D3 & GW2 but when those games got set back I thought why not give it a try. Against my better judgment I purchased it. I didnt last a month. For such a highly anticipated game it was a big let down. I would have rather gone back to WOW where I had unsubbed 1.5 years ago.
Yes it should be B2P or F2P but I dont think that will happen at this moment as long as they have the subs that cover their expenses and turn a profit. Until they start losing money in the "sub's" catagory it will still be a subscription game....but they will need to plan for that day as there are a lot of other games approaching that will draw people away.
Should they make it F2P? Well yes if subs are declining. F2P will bring in more cash, it's not like they would need to do much changes.
Every fun features is already shoehorsed into premium / collector / exclusiv x *****.
And they way Legacy currently works one rather get's a feeling it took them that long to rewrite it from real money to in game currency.
Would F2P make me come back? NO.
It's never been about the 15$ a month. I don't care about it. The question is, whenever the game is enough to be worth my time.
The bad designed classes, the poor story implementation and the lack of deep and freedom of character creation. (Armor restrictions, weapon restrictions, faction restrictions), dead empty areas, lackluster Graphics with an douchebag attitude about it, aside from heavy balancing issues -
won't make me come back.
This game is as good as any nameless clone korean grinder f2p game to me. 5 Minutes of Fun with Vette and SWTOR slapped over those....armor...aborminations won't change that.
You are right. It only shows that moderators are nothing better then rest of us. He is just throwing apples to hungry crowd. I think it is my last post on this site, it is just stupid to watch same spiting all the time. I go now to play because mmo players play games and boring old ladies write on forums all the time. Facebook generations all over the place
No way!
F2P only promotes low end players(10-20 yr old immature gamers), instant gratification gaming, more grinding for points to spend on crappy cosmetic/leveling gear and an overall underwelming gaming world.
If anything, I believe F2P games cause players to leave earlier for other games because the lack of time invested in the game makes it too easy to just quit from boredom/lack of content.
Pay the devs up front and you'll find the games to be done both professionally, creatively and worth their weight in gold(literally).
I wouldn't be playing TOR right now if it was free and neither would my wife. I guess we're just old school players.
Subscription models FTW!
I don't play ToR or care either way but aren't there enough threads like this without a staff writer making one. What's next, "Is GW2 worth a sub?"
I would be shocked if either of you still has a sub to SWTOR as you are clearly out of touch with the population issues this game has. I unfortunately still have a sub (my wife still wants to log in once a week so I said I would play with her) and the population decline is shocking and a very big issue at this point.
I don't think this game should go F2P before they have the funds to create some alternate lvling paths...lol. With one leveling path there isn't much to do for more than two months and thus I can't imagine that F2P would really help the game. Not to mention it is nice to have at least one MMO left that doesn't have a cash shop.
+10 man, bye
Agreed. I think I see them going the WoW route in that regard at some point, especially after this report from Gamespot a while back. It's kind of hard to estimate how many people are genuinely subscribed with the 30 free days (I have two accounts currently activated due to the 30 day giveaway for having a 50 on each one), and until the smoke clears from that deal, we won't have a very lucid picture of what's actually happening.
I do know that if the game was F2P, a few of my friends who left would at least come back to play the game with me on occasion. As it stands now, there are just a handful of people I know who still play. I'm looking forward to the upcoming free transfers so I can possibly move to a server with a higher population. It's very hard for me to find groups while leveling right now.
I think all sci-fi MMORPG are up against strong opposition with Eve Online on the market - CCP evolve their game.
Neither SWTOR or Eve Online were that great in the first few months, but SWTOR isn't even trying to adapt.
I forsee the reactivations happening every time they have to show investors sub numbers.
Emperors new clothes situation for sure.
THis is why I dont think f2p is a bad thing....The trend is that people bitch after they pay money for these games....If you're playing for free and don't like the game, you just leave and move on to the next game......If you pay 60 bukcs for the box, then another 15 a month for a few months, then you feel cheated.....Also if gamers weren't so dumb they would simply wait a few months and play these games for a fraction of hte price that they do on launch day.....At some point SWTOR will most likely be f2p, and at that point Iwill check it out.
Yeah I know...of course they won't. Doesn't mean they shouldn't consider it.
As proven all to often by these companies there are a lot of things they should consider and not write off so quickly. Many of them would have been better off if they had.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
No offense against EVE or its playerbase but it is not even a contender for the sub numbers TOR wants & needs. EVE has its niche player base and overall has done pretty well. But TOR will probably be shut down if it drops enough subs to be at EVE subsciption numbers.
And the TOR fans are pretty much opposite in every way possible from EVE fans. Other than they are humans & are breathing.
or dead accounts reactivated to show "sub numbers" to ppl without a clue
I agree that F2P is the way TOR will go soon enough.
We paid $150.00 for the CE version and got what for our money.... Not much.
I think the hype that Star Wars has in general was super High for this game and BW and the people that play it gave it far more hype then it was due.
The graphics are good for the game, FPS is bad...
I have un-subbed and will play something else. GW2 looks far to much like WoW and D3, is well... a let down.
They promise of the "Patch" is seen as a never ending story. Server transfers will be out some time this summer...?
That would be far to late, as they may not have many folks to transfer by that time......
Bio made many mistakes that should not have been. It is not like they were the First MMO.
They have had plenty others to look at and build from, yet they did not. Heck, they had SWG to model some parts after, yet they chose to, not include, a great many things that would have help make the game far better then it is.
Sad, because I an a huge fan of all things SW, and have played every game made. This is Not the first let down, nor will it be the last.
Any problem can be solved, with the Proper Amount of High Explosives.....
Dont take life serious, youll never get out alive ..
my personal thoughts on SWToR, and I stress personal, take it or leave it, I really don't care, is....
BW were looking at the mmo market and drooling over the possible revenue. They decided to go for a sure thing for box sales and preorders and signed on with Lucas to make a SW mmo. Sound logic. Work on coding, figure out the how and when's of mmorpg's. Guaranteed huge sales for their first mmo title by partnering with Lucas. Their thoughts on the back burner were "and when we're done we'll have a name in the mmo scene and huge profits from presales, even after paying for the dev time, voice actores, etc and giving Lucas their cut....Then we can put out the Mass Effect MMO we're wanting to make and it will be sweet sweet profit".
I fully expect BW to pull pretty much all support to SWToR one year after release and then go full throttle on the ME MMO they've spoken about a few times.
Stale worlds, stale gameplay, the whole thing is on rails (I'd probably still play if there were even one optional area to hunt per level bracket to advance rather than starter world>DK>Balmorra>tatooine>NS>Taris>ETC-ETC-ETC over and over per character rails shooting...or pvp from 15 to 50). Combining that, declining player base (my guild of 150 dropped to 48 char's [pretty much 6 of us and alts] before I pulled the plug on my account), and a general Been There Done That after my first character, and my thoughts on how the support for the game will go decided for me.
Lol...of all the people for you to make these types of accusations against. Hahahaha
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.