I dont understand why all the GW2 hc-fans runs into defense screaming "no no no!" when all the OP is asking is an option. When he says "Why is there not a single server for people who wants this" all the GW2 fans hear "I want to force open world PvP on you fool!" seriously.
The easiest way to cater to most audience WITHOUT BREAKING THE GAME FOR ANYONE is to offer more server types. There is absolutely no downsides to this since people get to choose their servers.
If there were one or more open world gank fest servers, which I would never join, I dont understand how that breaks the game for all those people who dont want to be in servers like those. Only thing honestly that makes sense for this kind of behaviour is that people feel somehow inferior if they join PvE servers when there's also PvP servers at present, so not allowing PvP servers to exist they dont have to struggle with their egos.
I've witnessed many times in other games people who are not up to the PvP servers rules but they join them because they are not "carebears" and they are kool and all that and then they cry and whine endlessly when getting ganked, do they absolutely have to join a PvP server without an option? No! That's why there are different server types!
There cannot be any other reason because it would be optional. You have the option not to join these servers yet they are a huge problem when they could be just ignored if you dont want to be a part of them. Well, actually, there's one other reason, the devs just simply dont want to listen to those people I mentioned who join the PvP server but who are actually not up for it. I kind of understand them, but then again, they should just ignore such fools.
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not? They dont need a single mechanic to change, hell they dont even need extra moderation, all they need is to add an RP tag to one or two servers so likeminded people can go to those servers instead of being scattered and asking across the GW2 boards "What's the unofficial RP server?" ...
I dont understand why all the GW2 hc-fans runs into defense screaming "no no no!" when all the OP is asking is an option. When he says "Why is there not a single server for people who wants this" all the GW2 fans hear "I want to force open world PvP on you fool!" seriously.
The easiest way to cater to most audience WITHOUT BREAKING THE GAME FOR ANYONE is to offer more server types. There is absolutely no downsides to this since people get to choose their servers.
If there were one or more open world gank fest servers, which I would never join, I dont understand how that breaks the game for all those people who dont want to be in servers like those. Only thing honestly that makes sense for this kind of behaviour is that people feel somehow inferior if they join PvE servers when there's also PvP servers at present, so not allowing PvP servers to exist they dont have to struggle with their egos.
I've witnessed many times in other games people who are not up to the PvP servers rules but they join them because they are not "carebears" and they are kool and all that and then they cry and whine endlessly when getting ganked, do they absolutely have to join a PvP server without an option? No! That's why there are different server types!
There cannot be any other reason because it would be optional. You have the option not to join these servers yet they are a huge problem when they could be just ignored if you dont want to be a part of them. Well, actually, there's one other reason, the devs just simply dont want to listen to those people I mentioned who join the PvP server but who are actually not up for it. I kind of understand them, but then again, they should just ignore such fools.
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not? They dont need a single mechanic to change, hell they dont even need extra moderation, all they need is to add an RP tag to one or two servers so likeminded people can go to those servers instead of being scattered and asking across the GW2 boards "What's the unofficial RP server?" ...
To reiterate my previous post, lots of responses I've read (granted, didn't read all posts) weren't attacking the FFA PvP way of playing an MMO (granted, several were talking about FFA PvP as a whole, not just in GW2), but the fact that creating FFA PvP in GW2 would mean a restructure and rewrite of lots of the core features of the game as it is to make them viable in a PvP setting (dynamic events, open world boss fights, for example), that would include a big downside for everyone even if they never touch one of those servers: extended development times.
I dont understand why all the GW2 hc-fans runs into defense screaming "no no no!" when all the OP is asking is an option. When he says "Why is there not a single server for people who wants this" all the GW2 fans hear "I want to force open world PvP on you fool!" seriously.
The easiest way to cater to most audience WITHOUT BREAKING THE GAME FOR ANYONE is to offer more server types. There is absolutely no downsides to this since people get to choose their servers.
If there were one or more open world gank fest servers, which I would never join, I dont understand how that breaks the game for all those people who dont want to be in servers like those. Only thing honestly that makes sense for this kind of behaviour is that people feel somehow inferior if they join PvE servers when there's also PvP servers at present, so not allowing PvP servers to exist they dont have to struggle with their egos.
I've witnessed many times in other games people who are not up to the PvP servers rules but they join them because they are not "carebears" and they are kool and all that and then they cry and whine endlessly when getting ganked, do they absolutely have to join a PvP server without an option? No! That's why there are different server types!
There cannot be any other reason because it would be optional. You have the option not to join these servers yet they are a huge problem when they could be just ignored if you dont want to be a part of them. Well, actually, there's one other reason, the devs just simply dont want to listen to those people I mentioned who join the PvP server but who are actually not up for it. I kind of understand them, but then again, they should just ignore such fools.
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not? They dont need a single mechanic to change, hell they dont even need extra moderation, all they need is to add an RP tag to one or two servers so likeminded people can go to those servers instead of being scattered and asking across the GW2 boards "What's the unofficial RP server?" ...
I can understand why some one would want to play FFA PvP. The issue is that it just doesn't work with the way GW2's DE and skills work. Every one would be killing eachother during a DE even if they didn't mean to.
I dont understand why all the GW2 hc-fans runs into defense screaming "no no no!" when all the OP is asking is an option. When he says "Why is there not a single server for people who wants this" all the GW2 fans hear "I want to force open world PvP on you fool!" seriously.
The easiest way to cater to most audience WITHOUT BREAKING THE GAME FOR ANYONE is to offer more server types. There is absolutely no downsides to this since people get to choose their servers.
If there were one or more open world gank fest servers, which I would never join, I dont understand how that breaks the game for all those people who dont want to be in servers like those. Only thing honestly that makes sense for this kind of behaviour is that people feel somehow inferior if they join PvE servers when there's also PvP servers at present, so not allowing PvP servers to exist they dont have to struggle with their egos.
I've witnessed many times in other games people who are not up to the PvP servers rules but they join them because they are not "carebears" and they are kool and all that and then they cry and whine endlessly when getting ganked, do they absolutely have to join a PvP server without an option? No! That's why there are different server types!
There cannot be any other reason because it would be optional. You have the option not to join these servers yet they are a huge problem when they could be just ignored if you dont want to be a part of them. Well, actually, there's one other reason, the devs just simply dont want to listen to those people I mentioned who join the PvP server but who are actually not up for it. I kind of understand them, but then again, they should just ignore such fools.
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not? They dont need a single mechanic to change, hell they dont even need extra moderation, all they need is to add an RP tag to one or two servers so likeminded people can go to those servers instead of being scattered and asking across the GW2 boards "What's the unofficial RP server?" ...
How do you implement this into a world that is designed around cooperative PvE and DEs that scale based on people allegedly working together toward a common goal?
"Loading screens" are not "instances". Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
This sort of choice has nothing to do with programming and everything to do with design. They could easily make it FFA PvP, but they have built gameplay around PvE. Features that would make PvP server unenjoyable:
- Instant traveling (you would probably do it anytime you see another player whom might kill you)
- Dynamic events (you would have to avoid them in case a PK showed up)
- Large Cities (you would need to avoid them because thats where the PKs are)
- WvW (your server would be ranked low because you are too busy killing each other to do proper WvW)
- Huge alliances between guilds
- Probable lag in PvE areas or more resource intensive to run high latency across all areas
- Cash shop would have larger impact in world where it is difficult to get started due to high level PKs preying on lowbies
I would be interested in a PvP server as well, but they would need to have some restrictions, like making it so players have to max a character out on a regular server first. That way new players would not join the PvP server and be dissatisfied by the experience... Because GW2 gameplay was not made for open world pvp.
1 - Having different server rulesets costs money and resources. Especially when you already have a structure laid out that does not allow for FFA. I don't want Anet spending resources away from the main game to cater for a very, VERY minor and vocal population. Much better spending those workhours into the core gameplay and issues.
2 - FFA PVP is the nichest of the niche rulesets. FFA rulesets are ALWAYS the first ones to wither away in games. Always. AoC, Vanguard, DAoC, etc, etc, etc. Do the research. They are fun for a few gonzo moments (and usually lowbie PvP is actually quite fun), but they are usually the first servers to close down or to be merged. FFA is simply too difficult to structure, too easy to abuse, and they have the lowest retention rates of any other ruleset. Only a few games manage to have FFA ruleset, and they are usually fake-FFA, such as EVE (A great game, which handles the FFA problem by having a very structured setting for PvP.)
FFA in GW2 would probably mar the server as a whole, and it would make very difficult to pit this server against the others.
In the end of the day, why spend valuable time and money into something that only the smallest minority seems to enjoy? Makes no sense, no matter how you look at it.
Originally posted by Kuinn I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not?
Re. FFA it's easy to answer why not: extra coding. Not some humongous amount of it like some people here think but even a moderate amount of work need to be justified. You say you won't roll on a FFA server. Well, who will? This thread would be more interesting with a poll in the OP. And even then, voting in a poll doesn't force people to act accordingly.
RP servers are a sensible request though.
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not?
Re. FFA it's easy to answer why not: extra coding. Not some humongous amount of it like some people here think but even a moderate amount of work need to be justified. You say you won't roll on a FFA server. Well, who will? This thread would be more interesting with a poll in the OP. And even then, voting in a poll doesn't force people to act accordingly.
RP servers are a sensible request though.
RP servers are different. It's mostly just a label you put on a server so that everyone that is interested in RP know where to go to to find other RPers, no extra coding needed.
Granted, some things can be nice bonuses on one, like the ability to use /say, sit on chairs (not sure if GW2 allows it) and maybe even some moderators at hand to prevent non RP names on it, but those are mostly optional.
I'm going to miss the random encounters while out in the open World and for me personally this is what is holding me back from buying GW2 the lack of World pvp encounters, I understand that we will be given WvWvW zones and I love the idea of that but I still want my random encounters.
My question is where, how and who do I express my concerns to about them just adding 1 server with this type of rule set?
For the last 10 years I have been looking for a AAA MMO that would at least give me a feel of danger in the World like Asherons' Call 1 did almost a decade ago, I am just sick of waiting and wishing and to tell you the truth I am about at my wits end and just might stop playing MMO's or videos games for that matter all together.
What is so god dam hard about getting it right, Its like they give cool things but then take away other things, why can't a MMO have it all for all types of player, is it that hard to just set up a server with a FFA rule set now days? One server IMO can only do a MMO good not bad so I fail to see the reason.
I understand that in GW2 we all all trying to kill some dragons but that still lacks reason why someone can't attack a alli or enemy, it;s like all MMO's today are created by a bunch of pansies that hate, fear the thrill of a online Worldy danger unless it is scripted, I mean really WTF is going on with this industry?
You know, hard-core PvPers and hard-core Raiders are not the only people who play MMOs. And MMOs would be better, over all, if the devs took both groups, put you in a sack, and hit you with sticks until you promised to shut up.
And, yes, I do PvP. And, yes, I do Raid. But I don't act like those are (depending if I'm a PvPer or a Raider) the only things that make an MMO good. I've, personally, found both to be boring. You do the same stupid raids over and over. PvP ends up being the same dumb thing over-and-over.
There's a lot more to MMOs, or there used to be, before this idiotic fixation on PvP and raiding.
I can understand why some one would want to play FFA PvP. The issue is that it just doesn't work with the way GW2's DE and skills work. Every one would be killing eachother during a DE even if they didn't mean to.
I dont know about skills, but in FFA/PVP server it's not supposed to be all nice and friends around DE's. Just make a system where you dont hurt your team mates. Other harm than that, is what the these people actually want, they dont want to be safe or friends at DE's.
Anet is all about making PvP competetive, with that they don't really do the random gank setup you find in games like TERA and DFO.
Why do you think they boost you up to max level in PvP, or why do you think they let you make a max level PvP char in GW1.
Anet doesn't typically do that kind of thing, expecting it or asking for it doesn't make a great deal of sense.
GW2 and GW1 are about actual PvP, competetive. It's more about who's better, who has the better team/guild/w/e. If you want levels and such to matter then your looking for a different kind of PvP game, one that is offered by several other developers.
How do you implement this into a world that is designed around cooperative PvE and DEs that scale based on people allegedly working together toward a common goal?
These people dont want to cooperate with everyone. Just make a system where you dont hurt your team mates. It will affect the standard servers in no way where you and me will play.
Allthough I agree world PvP can be nice, it goes against all core mechanics of the PvE part of the game, it just wouldn't work at all unless they redesign almost the entire game just for that 1 FFA server. It's not just a matter of a different ruleset.
All parts of the game PVE, WvW and sPvP are (going to be) superb imho and I actually don't miss the standard open world pvp at all that I prefer to have in other games because there the PvE experience is so bloody boring. GW2 actually surprises and challenges you in PvE allready as much as a PvP server would do in the basic kill10rats/fetch quest mmo's. PvE is just too good in this game, with the naturally (encouraged by core game mechanics) occuring cooperation with / helpfulness towards other players for PvP to destroy all that. Even if only on 1 server. WvW is scratching that open world'ish PvP itch well enough to avoid destroying that PvE experience, even if the PvP focused people only can enjoy it on those rare occasions that they feel all warm and fuzzy instead of ganky.
I dont understand why all the GW2 hc-fans runs into defense screaming "no no no!" when all the OP is asking is an option. When he says "Why is there not a single server for people who wants this" all the GW2 fans hear "I want to force open world PvP on you fool!" seriously.
The easiest way to cater to most audience WITHOUT BREAKING THE GAME FOR ANYONE is to offer more server types. There is absolutely no downsides to this since people get to choose their servers.
If there were one or more open world gank fest servers, which I would never join, I dont understand how that breaks the game for all those people who dont want to be in servers like those. Only thing honestly that makes sense for this kind of behaviour is that people feel somehow inferior if they join PvE servers when there's also PvP servers at present, so not allowing PvP servers to exist they dont have to struggle with their egos.
I've witnessed many times in other games people who are not up to the PvP servers rules but they join them because they are not "carebears" and they are kool and all that and then they cry and whine endlessly when getting ganked, do they absolutely have to join a PvP server without an option? No! That's why there are different server types!
There cannot be any other reason because it would be optional. You have the option not to join these servers yet they are a huge problem when they could be just ignored if you dont want to be a part of them. Well, actually, there's one other reason, the devs just simply dont want to listen to those people I mentioned who join the PvP server but who are actually not up for it. I kind of understand them, but then again, they should just ignore such fools.
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not? They dont need a single mechanic to change, hell they dont even need extra moderation, all they need is to add an RP tag to one or two servers so likeminded people can go to those servers instead of being scattered and asking across the GW2 boards "What's the unofficial RP server?" ...
You don't understand? I will explain it to you.
I don't want what you are asking for but I don't want the things I want. I don't want any resources spent on what you are asking for and all of it on what I want. Why not? You are just asking for what you want and I am against your side. It's just that simple.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not?
Re. FFA it's easy to answer why not: extra coding. Not some humongous amount of it like some people here think but even a moderate amount of work need to be justified. You say you won't roll on a FFA server. Well, who will? This thread would be more interesting with a poll in the OP. And even then, voting in a poll doesn't force people to act accordingly.
RP servers are a sensible request though.
Well the original poster would join at least heh. You are right, extra coding would be needed (not for RP servers, but PvP) sure, I dont think anyone assumes these things just happens, but I'm pretty sure introducing different server types isnt the hardest thing around the business even if it's not simply a matter of a powerful wish :P
Also, there's a lot of talk often how people want PvP servers and others want FFA servers etc on boards of many games. There certainly would be an audience imo, though I dont know how big since I'm not part of such community or gankfest mentality, I just like to see variety in server types so people get to play around likeminded people and in desired environment.
If you like ganking and griefing, then find another game than GW2. Go play Aion or WoW or Lineage2 or whatever else with Open World PvP. The people playing GW2 will be PvPing in a world designed for PvP.
If you can't live with that, then tough really, no GW2 for you.
I don't want what you are asking for but I don't want the things I want. I don't want any resources spent on what you are asking for and all of it on what I want. Why not? You are just asking for what you want and I am against your side. It's just that simple.
Strangely enough, when MMO's were small, tiny things developers had no issue with creating alternate rules servers and I recall DAOC had at least 3 different rulesets. (Normal, FFA PVP, and Cooperative)
But now that Developers have an almost limitless budget at their disposal compared to the early titles, they seem unwilling/unable to provide any sort of variety.
I always was surprised that Blizzard never delivered a FFA ruleset server in WOW with the resources they had, guess it all just came down to not making enough profit for the effort.
Pity.
Yep. Back then MMORPG devs were mostly visionaries and people who loved creating games just for the sake of creating games. These days MMORPGs are big business so you have the suits and beancounters, calculating how to maximize profits. And yes that is a pity for us who loves games.
No. Those games were small. And it wasn't that enjoyable. Games had problems with this open-world PvP and having PvP flags, limited PvP opportunities and PvE-only was the response. Take the original Ulitma Online. In 1997 this game wasn't all that fun unless you were a ganker.
Rather, it was quite tedious. Well, of course, exept to the gang of jerk-off gankers that'd shut a town down because they had all the exits covered and you couldn't leave. Day after day. I could get NOTHING done. Ever. Log in, get ganked. Get ganked again. Get ganked again. Go out in a gang, they run away... Get seperated... Ganked again. Ganked some more. Oh, fun and joy, I just got ganked again.
Then came the ganking guilds. A big gang of gankers could gank the guards. Then gank everyone in town. Oh, more joy!
Even worse is when the gankers figured out how to exploit ranged and AoE spells and could gank you from outside the town. Oh boy, wasn't that ever fun.
So, ganking in the country. Gangs of gankers ganking guards then you. And the ever-present getting ganked by a ranger or an AoE spell...
Yeah, I know they changed the game in 1998. But it was too late. The experience of being a noob getting constantly ganked ruined the game for me. So I left an dnever looked back. But while it was too late for me, it wasn't for the game as a whole. After the gankers left/were neutralize due to the changes the subs went from 100K to 250K as people stopped quitting in response to the constant ganking. So, clearly your ganker's paradise was not fun for the majority of gamers.
I can understand why some one would want to play FFA PvP. The issue is that it just doesn't work with the way GW2's DE and skills work. Every one would be killing eachother during a DE even if they didn't mean to.
I dont know about skills, but in FFA/PVP server it's not supposed to be all nice and friends around DE's. Just make a system where you dont hurt your team mates. Other harm than that, is what the these people actually want, they dont want to be safe or friends at DE's.
Yeah that's going to make it damn near impossible to beat a larger DE with a big boss. It just doesn't fit in with the design philosophy from the ground up.
What's the point? GW2 has two forms of PvP environments. Isn't that enough? And, as has been stated already, it makes absolutely no sense from a lore standpoint. The entire point of the game is a bunch of adversarial people banding together to fight a common enemy. So, if I were Charr, and a bunch of Norn ganked my friends, why would I want to join up with the Norn for any reason? And why would you want to kill a potential ally and take all of his/her stuff? How effective an ally would they be then?
I would suggest another game for you if you are so adamant about OWPvP. GW2 doesn't seem like a good fit for you.
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Strangely enough, when MMO's were small, tiny things developers had no issue with creating alternate rules servers and I recall DAOC had at least 3 different rulesets. (Normal, FFA PVP, and Cooperative)
But now that Developers have an almost limitless budget at their disposal compared to the early titles, they seem unwilling/unable to provide any sort of variety.
I always was surprised that Blizzard never delivered a FFA ruleset server in WOW with the resources they had, guess it all just came down to not making enough profit for the effort.
Pity.
Usually you have really good posts... this one not so much.
It has nothing to do with costs... I am sure Anet could make a FFA server ruleset in a couple of days at most... IT WOULD SUCK!
When a game is designed a certain way, to make a ruleset counter to that design does not create more options, it creates more headache. Do you think crappy FFA and everyone getting ganked repeatedly while trying to do DEs... not to mention almost every attack has splash making melee pretty much impossible will create more complaints or reduce them?
Once down that road it does not stop... just like raiding... Once the core raiders have their uber items they stomp their feet and general be a pain in the backside until more raids are released with even more game breaking gear.
GW2 did not EVER claim to have FFA PvP. So anyone complaining now needs to just walk away. The GW2 core does not need to be gutted just because people want that "feeling" they had in other X MMO THEY STOPPED PLAYING! Don't get me wrong I like FFA PvP and cut my teeth on darktide and SB. I just don't get the need to ruin a solid AAA title just to get a nitch desire that is counter to what the game is all about. Like buying a car to go on a lake... Sure would be nice to have a car that was part boat... but you end up with a crappy car boat. Rather have a boat and a car... then I could take which every I wanted when I got the itch.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
I say give the "hardcore" pvpers a pvp server and in about 30 days when they are all whining about getting ganked during a DE close the server and say "I told you so"
The game as it is now with open world pvp would have alll the "hardcore" Pkers pissing themselves in rage at getting ganked back more often then not. I mean really if another player enters a DE more mobs spawn and the would be PK would have to fight mobs as much as the inteneded target would.
Personally i think a full on pvp server would be really amusing.
As the game works now I seriously doubt any of the wanabe PKs would last long.
AMD Phenum II x4 3.6Ghz 975 black edition 8 gig Ram Nvidia GeForce GTX 760
What's the point? GW2 has two forms of PvP environments. Isn't that enough? And, as has been stated already, it makes absolutely no sense from a lore standpoint. The entire point of the game is a bunch of adversarial people banding together to fight a common enemy. So, if I were Charr, and a bunch of Norn ganked my friends, why would I want to join up with the Norn for any reason? And why would you want to kill a potential ally and take all of his/her stuff? How effective an ally would they be then?
I would suggest another game for you if you are so adamant about OWPvP. GW2 doesn't seem like a good fit for you.
That is what it boils down to... finding the right game for you.
For those who want true world pvp where ganking noobs is on the menu, GW2 is not for you. For those who enjoy wvw, structured/competitive pvp, and pve then GW2 is for you. I personally enjoyed killing horde as an alliance mage in wow. I would gank them and they would gank me. It was fun for a while but then it got old real fast. After playing the GW2 BWE I completely forgot about wow for an entire weekend and realized that wow was no longer for me.
There are as many different types of games as there are different types of players. Look for the game that you enjoy playing and stick to it. But do please leave the rest of us enjoy our game - GW2.
Its as if they don't have enough with ganking noobs in wow and in eve... they have to try to gank GW2 from us!
Comments
I dont understand why all the GW2 hc-fans runs into defense screaming "no no no!" when all the OP is asking is an option. When he says "Why is there not a single server for people who wants this" all the GW2 fans hear "I want to force open world PvP on you fool!" seriously.
The easiest way to cater to most audience WITHOUT BREAKING THE GAME FOR ANYONE is to offer more server types. There is absolutely no downsides to this since people get to choose their servers.
If there were one or more open world gank fest servers, which I would never join, I dont understand how that breaks the game for all those people who dont want to be in servers like those. Only thing honestly that makes sense for this kind of behaviour is that people feel somehow inferior if they join PvE servers when there's also PvP servers at present, so not allowing PvP servers to exist they dont have to struggle with their egos.
I've witnessed many times in other games people who are not up to the PvP servers rules but they join them because they are not "carebears" and they are kool and all that and then they cry and whine endlessly when getting ganked, do they absolutely have to join a PvP server without an option? No! That's why there are different server types!
There cannot be any other reason because it would be optional. You have the option not to join these servers yet they are a huge problem when they could be just ignored if you dont want to be a part of them. Well, actually, there's one other reason, the devs just simply dont want to listen to those people I mentioned who join the PvP server but who are actually not up for it. I kind of understand them, but then again, they should just ignore such fools.
I like the current system, and I would never join a FFA gankfest server, but it baffles me when companies refuse to introduce different kinds of servers when it's the easiest way to cater to different tastes of people when it comes to choosing your playing environment. Same goes to RP servers, why not? They dont need a single mechanic to change, hell they dont even need extra moderation, all they need is to add an RP tag to one or two servers so likeminded people can go to those servers instead of being scattered and asking across the GW2 boards "What's the unofficial RP server?" ...
To reiterate my previous post, lots of responses I've read (granted, didn't read all posts) weren't attacking the FFA PvP way of playing an MMO (granted, several were talking about FFA PvP as a whole, not just in GW2), but the fact that creating FFA PvP in GW2 would mean a restructure and rewrite of lots of the core features of the game as it is to make them viable in a PvP setting (dynamic events, open world boss fights, for example), that would include a big downside for everyone even if they never touch one of those servers: extended development times.
What can men do against such reckless hate?
companies want their games to be fun.
whe they are sure a certain rule set would not fit for their game, they do not implement it ^^
sounds simple to me.
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I can understand why some one would want to play FFA PvP. The issue is that it just doesn't work with the way GW2's DE and skills work. Every one would be killing eachother during a DE even if they didn't mean to.
My theme song.
How do you implement this into a world that is designed around cooperative PvE and DEs that scale based on people allegedly working together toward a common goal?
"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
This sort of choice has nothing to do with programming and everything to do with design. They could easily make it FFA PvP, but they have built gameplay around PvE. Features that would make PvP server unenjoyable:
- Instant traveling (you would probably do it anytime you see another player whom might kill you)
- Dynamic events (you would have to avoid them in case a PK showed up)
- Large Cities (you would need to avoid them because thats where the PKs are)
- WvW (your server would be ranked low because you are too busy killing each other to do proper WvW)
- Huge alliances between guilds
- Probable lag in PvE areas or more resource intensive to run high latency across all areas
- Cash shop would have larger impact in world where it is difficult to get started due to high level PKs preying on lowbies
I would be interested in a PvP server as well, but they would need to have some restrictions, like making it so players have to max a character out on a regular server first. That way new players would not join the PvP server and be dissatisfied by the experience... Because GW2 gameplay was not made for open world pvp.
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There are actually 2 good reasons not to do so:
1 - Having different server rulesets costs money and resources. Especially when you already have a structure laid out that does not allow for FFA. I don't want Anet spending resources away from the main game to cater for a very, VERY minor and vocal population. Much better spending those workhours into the core gameplay and issues.
2 - FFA PVP is the nichest of the niche rulesets. FFA rulesets are ALWAYS the first ones to wither away in games. Always. AoC, Vanguard, DAoC, etc, etc, etc. Do the research. They are fun for a few gonzo moments (and usually lowbie PvP is actually quite fun), but they are usually the first servers to close down or to be merged. FFA is simply too difficult to structure, too easy to abuse, and they have the lowest retention rates of any other ruleset. Only a few games manage to have FFA ruleset, and they are usually fake-FFA, such as EVE (A great game, which handles the FFA problem by having a very structured setting for PvP.)
FFA in GW2 would probably mar the server as a whole, and it would make very difficult to pit this server against the others.
In the end of the day, why spend valuable time and money into something that only the smallest minority seems to enjoy? Makes no sense, no matter how you look at it.
RP servers are a sensible request though.
MMORPG genre is dead. Long live MMOCS (Massively Multiplayer Online Cash Shop).
RP servers are different. It's mostly just a label you put on a server so that everyone that is interested in RP know where to go to to find other RPers, no extra coding needed.
Granted, some things can be nice bonuses on one, like the ability to use /say, sit on chairs (not sure if GW2 allows it) and maybe even some moderators at hand to prevent non RP names on it, but those are mostly optional.
What can men do against such reckless hate?
You know, hard-core PvPers and hard-core Raiders are not the only people who play MMOs. And MMOs would be better, over all, if the devs took both groups, put you in a sack, and hit you with sticks until you promised to shut up.
And, yes, I do PvP. And, yes, I do Raid. But I don't act like those are (depending if I'm a PvPer or a Raider) the only things that make an MMO good. I've, personally, found both to be boring. You do the same stupid raids over and over. PvP ends up being the same dumb thing over-and-over.
There's a lot more to MMOs, or there used to be, before this idiotic fixation on PvP and raiding.
I dont know about skills, but in FFA/PVP server it's not supposed to be all nice and friends around DE's. Just make a system where you dont hurt your team mates. Other harm than that, is what the these people actually want, they dont want to be safe or friends at DE's.
Anet is all about making PvP competetive, with that they don't really do the random gank setup you find in games like TERA and DFO.
Why do you think they boost you up to max level in PvP, or why do you think they let you make a max level PvP char in GW1.
Anet doesn't typically do that kind of thing, expecting it or asking for it doesn't make a great deal of sense.
GW2 and GW1 are about actual PvP, competetive. It's more about who's better, who has the better team/guild/w/e. If you want levels and such to matter then your looking for a different kind of PvP game, one that is offered by several other developers.
PvP is in, ganking is out.
These people dont want to cooperate with everyone. Just make a system where you dont hurt your team mates. It will affect the standard servers in no way where you and me will play.
Allthough I agree world PvP can be nice, it goes against all core mechanics of the PvE part of the game, it just wouldn't work at all unless they redesign almost the entire game just for that 1 FFA server. It's not just a matter of a different ruleset.
All parts of the game PVE, WvW and sPvP are (going to be) superb imho and I actually don't miss the standard open world pvp at all that I prefer to have in other games because there the PvE experience is so bloody boring. GW2 actually surprises and challenges you in PvE allready as much as a PvP server would do in the basic kill10rats/fetch quest mmo's. PvE is just too good in this game, with the naturally (encouraged by core game mechanics) occuring cooperation with / helpfulness towards other players for PvP to destroy all that. Even if only on 1 server. WvW is scratching that open world'ish PvP itch well enough to avoid destroying that PvE experience, even if the PvP focused people only can enjoy it on those rare occasions that they feel all warm and fuzzy instead of ganky.
You don't understand? I will explain it to you.
I don't want what you are asking for but I don't want the things I want. I don't want any resources spent on what you are asking for and all of it on what I want. Why not? You are just asking for what you want and I am against your side. It's just that simple.
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Well the original poster would join at least heh. You are right, extra coding would be needed (not for RP servers, but PvP) sure, I dont think anyone assumes these things just happens, but I'm pretty sure introducing different server types isnt the hardest thing around the business even if it's not simply a matter of a powerful wish :P
Also, there's a lot of talk often how people want PvP servers and others want FFA servers etc on boards of many games. There certainly would be an audience imo, though I dont know how big since I'm not part of such community or gankfest mentality, I just like to see variety in server types so people get to play around likeminded people and in desired environment.
If you like ganking and griefing, then find another game than GW2. Go play Aion or WoW or Lineage2 or whatever else with Open World PvP. The people playing GW2 will be PvPing in a world designed for PvP.
If you can't live with that, then tough really, no GW2 for you.
You should read posts that you reply to.
No. Those games were small. And it wasn't that enjoyable. Games had problems with this open-world PvP and having PvP flags, limited PvP opportunities and PvE-only was the response. Take the original Ulitma Online. In 1997 this game wasn't all that fun unless you were a ganker.
Rather, it was quite tedious. Well, of course, exept to the gang of jerk-off gankers that'd shut a town down because they had all the exits covered and you couldn't leave. Day after day. I could get NOTHING done. Ever. Log in, get ganked. Get ganked again. Get ganked again. Go out in a gang, they run away... Get seperated... Ganked again. Ganked some more. Oh, fun and joy, I just got ganked again.
Then came the ganking guilds. A big gang of gankers could gank the guards. Then gank everyone in town. Oh, more joy!
Even worse is when the gankers figured out how to exploit ranged and AoE spells and could gank you from outside the town. Oh boy, wasn't that ever fun.
So, ganking in the country. Gangs of gankers ganking guards then you. And the ever-present getting ganked by a ranger or an AoE spell...
Yeah, I know they changed the game in 1998. But it was too late. The experience of being a noob getting constantly ganked ruined the game for me. So I left an dnever looked back. But while it was too late for me, it wasn't for the game as a whole. After the gankers left/were neutralize due to the changes the subs went from 100K to 250K as people stopped quitting in response to the constant ganking. So, clearly your ganker's paradise was not fun for the majority of gamers.
Yeah that's going to make it damn near impossible to beat a larger DE with a big boss. It just doesn't fit in with the design philosophy from the ground up.
My theme song.
What's the point? GW2 has two forms of PvP environments. Isn't that enough? And, as has been stated already, it makes absolutely no sense from a lore standpoint. The entire point of the game is a bunch of adversarial people banding together to fight a common enemy. So, if I were Charr, and a bunch of Norn ganked my friends, why would I want to join up with the Norn for any reason? And why would you want to kill a potential ally and take all of his/her stuff? How effective an ally would they be then?
I would suggest another game for you if you are so adamant about OWPvP. GW2 doesn't seem like a good fit for you.
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!
Usually you have really good posts... this one not so much.
It has nothing to do with costs... I am sure Anet could make a FFA server ruleset in a couple of days at most... IT WOULD SUCK!
When a game is designed a certain way, to make a ruleset counter to that design does not create more options, it creates more headache. Do you think crappy FFA and everyone getting ganked repeatedly while trying to do DEs... not to mention almost every attack has splash making melee pretty much impossible will create more complaints or reduce them?
Once down that road it does not stop... just like raiding... Once the core raiders have their uber items they stomp their feet and general be a pain in the backside until more raids are released with even more game breaking gear.
GW2 did not EVER claim to have FFA PvP. So anyone complaining now needs to just walk away. The GW2 core does not need to be gutted just because people want that "feeling" they had in other X MMO THEY STOPPED PLAYING! Don't get me wrong I like FFA PvP and cut my teeth on darktide and SB. I just don't get the need to ruin a solid AAA title just to get a nitch desire that is counter to what the game is all about. Like buying a car to go on a lake... Sure would be nice to have a car that was part boat... but you end up with a crappy car boat. Rather have a boat and a car... then I could take which every I wanted when I got the itch.
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Play Darkfail...I mean Darkfall
I say give the "hardcore" pvpers a pvp server and in about 30 days when they are all whining about getting ganked during a DE close the server and say "I told you so"
The game as it is now with open world pvp would have alll the "hardcore" Pkers pissing themselves in rage at getting ganked back more often then not. I mean really if another player enters a DE more mobs spawn and the would be PK would have to fight mobs as much as the inteneded target would.
Personally i think a full on pvp server would be really amusing.
As the game works now I seriously doubt any of the wanabe PKs would last long.
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That is what it boils down to... finding the right game for you.
For those who want true world pvp where ganking noobs is on the menu, GW2 is not for you. For those who enjoy wvw, structured/competitive pvp, and pve then GW2 is for you. I personally enjoyed killing horde as an alliance mage in wow. I would gank them and they would gank me. It was fun for a while but then it got old real fast. After playing the GW2 BWE I completely forgot about wow for an entire weekend and realized that wow was no longer for me.
There are as many different types of games as there are different types of players. Look for the game that you enjoy playing and stick to it. But do please leave the rest of us enjoy our game - GW2.
Its as if they don't have enough with ganking noobs in wow and in eve... they have to try to gank GW2 from us!
LMAO... true, so true