However Diablo 3 is vastly superior to both game. I mean it basically wipes floor with their bloody corpses.
Its that good.
nope its not that good Tbh i like d3, i actually llove it but... i stil like PoE better doesnt mean D3 is a bad game, or that PoE is a better game overall, thats purely subjective opinion. But i really like both games and feel they are so similar yet so different, that it makes me play, and enjoy both games almost equally.
and boy in the era of wow clones, PoE and D3 really stand out. And most important thing to me being - they re pure fun, even if you are only able to play a 20 mins session, you can still login and have some fun and even find some useful thing, compared to most other mmos where your 20 mins would probably be spent trying to find/organize a group to get some 'serious' gaming started
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, are there still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre or I just misunderstood that line?
i'm glad i didn't waste 60 euro on a game that lasts 12 hours and calls replaying the game on higher level difficulty a source of content..what a scam.
have you ever played a diablo game before?
yes i have played diablo 1 and 2 both have well over 50 hours of game play
Pardon me but i believe that you don't rememer well. It took me 2 days to finish D2 with a paladin. Now, i don't recall exactly the game sessions but they where definitely less than 8 hours per day. Granted, i didn't explore at all and went straight for the quest objectives.
So far i have 7 hours in D 3 and i am still in Act 1 (on the quest chain where you must find some sword fragments) but now i'm taking my sweet time. I explore very thoroughly i read / hear all lore related stuff and i'm leveling the blacksmith companion.
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, there are still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre?
Dungeonhacks existed already on the C-64, no one called them RPGs back then. In fact few called the 2 first games RPGs, they were still called dungeonhacks or just actiongames.
Diablo was maybe the first PC dungeonhack that got really big though.
If you want a name of an earlier Dungeonhack, there was "Gauntlet" on arcade and C-64. It BTW also had random dungeons.
For what it's worth: I'm taking my time, I've played about 6 hours total on my Monk, and I'm not even done with Act I.
A friend took the day off and played the game for 7 hours or so and finished Act I. He could have been finished with Act II but he explored the maps, opened all the chests, etc. So...yeah you could probably get to the end in 12 hours, but what's the point in that?
they were probably looking for the end game raid...(sarcasm light is on).
The nice thing about all of these people, who in my opinion don't really understand what the Diablo franchise is really about, is that they will be gone by the time my CE shows up next week.
That leaves the servers more stable for me to enjoy my single-player game on someone else's server.........
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
i'm glad i didn't waste 60 euro on a game that lasts 12 hours and calls replaying the game on higher level difficulty a source of content..what a scam.
have you ever played a diablo game before?
Judging by some of the replyes in the other threads, some people simply played another diablo 2, completely different from the battle.net diablo 2 (which for example I havent played), the diablo 2 which took hundreds of hours for normal and you would never ever reach hell...
Flame on!
Diablo 2 did not take 100s of hours to finish. I beat it on hell mode with at least 3-4 characters. Used to do Hell runs on Diablo himself for loot runs nightly.
Anyone who says beating D2 even on normal mode was 100s of hours is mistaken or really really took their time. If I remember correctly i beat D2 normal mode with my paladin within 30-40 hours max, and that was taking my time.
So much misinformation on this site nowdays. Just like the guy yesterday insisting D2 wasnt a total hackfest a year after release. Those guys are the ones you can thank for this online drm crap.
I hope I am wrong but TL2 is gonna be a hackfest as well with their release. Good thing is it will only cost $20 bucks.
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, there are still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre?
Dungeonhacks existed already on the C-64, no one called them RPGs back then. In fact few called the 2 first games RPGs, they were still called dungeonhacks or just actiongames.
Diablo was maybe the first PC dungeonhack that got really big though.
If you want a name of an earlier Dungeonhack, there was "Gauntlet" on arcade and C-64. It BTW also had random dungeons.
You are preaching to the preacher mate.
Originaly you had Rogue , it was not only first random generated "dungeon hack" but one of first computer games at all.
Diablo 1 was born from attempt to convert Angband(roguelike) to graphic+mouse friendly interface , but in the making Blizzard (the company that blizzard bought actually) had strange idea to make it action based instead of turn based.
Thus new genre was born called "Hack&Slash" wich is used to refer to Diablo clones (or simply Diablo clone)
So although you have games like Gauntlet and many other dungeon running RPGs
Hack and Slash is used in corelation with Diablo like gameplay
i'm glad i didn't waste 60 euro on a game that lasts 12 hours and calls replaying the game on higher level difficulty a source of content..what a scam.
This. Also it is not a scam. Most people buy Diablo games to complete them 100 times.
FYI I just finished Act 2 with 13h and 49m played (6h 40m Act 1, 7h 9m Act 2) . So yeah 12 hours.. pfft they missed so much. Cool ass boss fight at the end of Act 2.
For years, Blizz has been advancing the idea that the same content set to a higher level of difficulty is the equivalent of new content. They have been using this in WoW for years, releasing 7 or 8 raid bosses every 6-8 months and getting the community to buy in to the idea that they really haven't finished the content unless they've done it on hard mode.
Some people find this acceptable and get enjoyment out of the grind, I do not.
"Loading screens" are not "instances". Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
Originaly you had Rogue , it was not only first random generated "dungeon hack" but one of first computer games at all.
Diablo 1 was born from attempt to convert Angband(roguelike) to graphic+mouse friendly interface , but in the making Blizzard (the company that blizzard bought actually) had strange idea to make it action based instead of turn based.
Thus new genre was born called "Hack&Slash" wich is used to refer to Diablo clones (or simply Diablo clone)
So although you have games like Gauntlet and many other dungeon running RPGs
Hack and Slash is used in corelation with Diablo like gameplay
I thought I was agreeing with you, not preaching. Reason I mentioned Gauntlet is that I played it alot in 1985, not because it was first. And of course because it was action based.
Dungeonhacks existed already on the C-64, no one called them RPGs back then. In fact few called the 2 first games RPGs, they were still called dungeonhacks or just actiongames.
Diablo was maybe the first PC dungeonhack that got really big though.
If you want a name of an earlier Dungeonhack, there was "Gauntlet" on arcade and C-64. It BTW also had random dungeons.
You are preaching to the preacher mate.
Originaly you had Rogue , it was not only first random generated "dungeon hack" but one of first computer games at all.
Diablo 1 was born from attempt to convert Angband(roguelike) to graphic+mouse friendly interface , but in the making Blizzard (the company that blizzard bought actually) had strange idea to make it action based instead of turn based.
Thus new genre was born called "Hack&Slash" wich is used to refer to Diablo clones (or simply Diablo clone)
So although you have games like Gauntlet and many other dungeon running RPGs
Hack and Slash is used in corelation with Diablo like gameplay
Actually, Loke's right about this one Lobo. You may want to check your friendly neighborhood wiki. While Diablo is referenced in the hack & slash genre, it's far from the only game, and it's certainly not the first. It was released at the end of 1996, far after that genre had been established.
For years, Blizz has been advancing the idea that the same content set to a higher level of difficulty is the equivalent of new content. They have been using this in WoW for years, releasing 7 or 8 raid bosses every 6-8 months and getting the community to buy in to the idea that they really haven't finished the content unless they've done it on hard mode.
Some people find this acceptable and get enjoyment out of the grind, I do not.
Take it as a example that a thing can work in one genre and fail in an other
There are cryes on all forums for years that mmorpgs are not skill based like fps games, now we hear cryes that action rpgs are not as long and unique as mmorpgs, what is next, fps players crying that the ingame weapons have not enough strength accuracy and endurance on them?
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, are there still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre or I just misunderstood that line?
I read is the same way as well. I'd bet they didn't know that Diablo is a roguelike. They likely don't even know what a roguelike is or played one back when they first came into being.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Than my friend you are clearly not interested in Hack&Slash games at all. And you are obviously in wrong forum.
Actually, it's Diablo 3 that's in the wrong forum, this is MMORPG.com baby!
I'm sure the average player will play D3 much more than 12 hours, one can never satisfy the rushers and power gamers in any new title.
That said, I disagree, replaying content with a different class, that's entertainment, (Did so with D1) doing it again at a higher level difficultly, that's just retreading content.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, are there still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre or I just misunderstood that line?
I read is the same way as well. I'd bet they didn't know that Diablo is a roguelike. They likely don't even know what a roguelike is or played one back when they first came into being.
I don't know. I find it ineteresting that people would make the Diablo-to-Rogue comparison. It's kinda like the MUD-to-MMO comparison: it is a bit of a stretch.
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
i'm glad i didn't waste 60 euro on a game that lasts 12 hours and calls replaying the game on higher level difficulty a source of content..what a scam.
This. Also it is not a scam. Most people buy Diablo games to complete them 100 times.
I know, pretty weird when you think about it. I mean doing the exact same thing over and over, good thing MMORPG's aren't anything like that.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Sorry but I do not agree with you OP, If I play the game on normal and it takes me 12 hours to beat...then the game is done. Everthing else is additional progression. The main quest should be the meat and potatoes of any game, that main quest line should be the longest part of any game. As soon as the main quest is done for me, I am done with the game. If I want to grind out mobs I can do that on any MMO.
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, are there still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre or I just misunderstood that line?
I read is the same way as well. I'd bet they didn't know that Diablo is a roguelike. They likely don't even know what a roguelike is or played one back when they first came into being.
I don't know. I find it ineteresting that people would make the Diablo-to-Rogue comparison. It's kinda like the MUD-to-MMO comparison: it is a bit of a stretch.
Started playing last night with my girlfriend (she has never played any diablo before), and I think we probably put in 5 hours before the server went down. We are still in Act 1. I probably would have gone a bit faster without her since I am teaching her how to play (she loves it). Even if it was 12 hours, for a hack and slash game that is decent I think.
@OP I think everyone understands the philosophy of hack and slash games. Most I'm sure are aware of the random nature of content as well as dungeon layouts. The problem is this design is ancient at this point, not to say people should stop making them, but I think it's telling why many do not charge top rate premium prices for these games anymore. TL2 is 20 bucks as an example.
You say not to compare it to Skyrim or others, why not? It's the same price... It's not about the game offering a few different difficulties and random content, it's that one play-through should IMO at least take 60 hours to warrant the price of admission. By most accounts it won't offer anywhere close.
Keep in mind this isn't rage I'm expressing, just looking at what you get for the asking price and I don't feel you get enough.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Diablo is (creator) of Hack&Slash genre based on randomly generated content. Like in its predecesor "roguelike" , each time you start the game its completely different because everything is randomly generated.
Crazy, are there still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre or I just misunderstood that line?
I read is the same way as well. I'd bet they didn't know that Diablo is a roguelike. They likely don't even know what a roguelike is or played one back when they first came into being.
I don't know. I find it ineteresting that people would make the Diablo-to-Rogue comparison. It's kinda like the MUD-to-MMO comparison: it is a bit of a stretch.
MUD ... now you are tripping :P
Actually, I was playing hack/slash ARPGs since Ys and Gauntlet. I'll give you though that, Diablo is the first ARPG I remember on the computer, but I didn't get into computer gaming until my late teens so I could have missed some things.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
Originaly you had Rogue , it was not only first random generated "dungeon hack" but one of first computer games at all.
Diablo 1 was born from attempt to convert Angband(roguelike) to graphic+mouse friendly interface , but in the making Blizzard (the company that blizzard bought actually) had strange idea to make it action based instead of turn based.
Thus new genre was born called "Hack&Slash" wich is used to refer to Diablo clones (or simply Diablo clone)
So although you have games like Gauntlet and many other dungeon running RPGs
Hack and Slash is used in corelation with Diablo like gameplay
I thought I was agreeing with you, not preaching. Reason I mentioned Gauntlet is that I played it alot in 1985, not because it was first. And of course because it was action based.
Very well , if Wikipedia can be any point of reference - hack&slash is used for any action game set in sword and sorcery fantasy.
Diablo however did start its own subgenre wich (according to Wikipedia) is called "point and click action RPG" or "DIablo clones"
I will not list the games from the genre because there are lot of them , including latest POE and Torchlight.
Diablo it self resulted as attempt to make acessible "roguelike" game for PC ...
This is why "diablo clones" are often mentioned together with roguelikes
@OP I think everyone understands the philosophy of hack and slash games. Most I'm sure are aware of the random nature of content as well as dungeon layouts. The problem is this design is ancient at this point, not to say people should stop making them, but I think it's telling why many do not charge top rate premium prices for these games anymore. TL2 is 20 bucks as an example.
You say not to compare it to Skyrim or others, why not? It's the same price... It's not about the game offering a few different difficulties and random content, it's that one play-through should IMO at least take 60 hours to warrant the price of admission. By most accounts it won't offer anywhere close.
Keep in mind this isn't rage I'm expressing, just looking at what you get for the asking price and I don't feel you get enough.
Skyrim is amazing game well worth its asking price. But what makes you think Diablo is any less ?
Comments
nope its not that good
Tbh i like d3, i actually llove it but... i stil like PoE better 
doesnt mean D3 is a bad game, or that PoE is a better game overall, thats purely subjective opinion. But i really like both games and feel they are so similar yet so different, that it makes me play, and enjoy both games almost equally.
and boy in the era of wow clones, PoE and D3 really stand out. And most important thing to me being - they re pure fun, even if you are only able to play a 20 mins session, you can still login and have some fun and even find some useful thing, compared to most other mmos where your 20 mins would probably be spent trying to find/organize a group to get some 'serious' gaming started
Crazy, are there still people who believe that Diablo was the creator of hack'n slash RPG genre or I just misunderstood that line?
REALITY CHECK
Pardon me but i believe that you don't rememer well. It took me 2 days to finish D2 with a paladin. Now, i don't recall exactly the game sessions but they where definitely less than 8 hours per day. Granted, i didn't explore at all and went straight for the quest objectives.
So far i have 7 hours in D 3 and i am still in Act 1 (on the quest chain where you must find some sword fragments) but now i'm taking my sweet time. I explore very thoroughly i read / hear all lore related stuff and i'm leveling the blacksmith companion.
Dungeonhacks existed already on the C-64, no one called them RPGs back then. In fact few called the 2 first games RPGs, they were still called dungeonhacks or just actiongames.
Diablo was maybe the first PC dungeonhack that got really big though.
If you want a name of an earlier Dungeonhack, there was "Gauntlet" on arcade and C-64. It BTW also had random dungeons.
they were probably looking for the end game raid...(sarcasm light is on).
Currently bored with MMO's.
The nice thing about all of these people, who in my opinion don't really understand what the Diablo franchise is really about, is that they will be gone by the time my CE shows up next week.
That leaves the servers more stable for me to enjoy my single-player game on someone else's server.........
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
Diablo 2 did not take 100s of hours to finish. I beat it on hell mode with at least 3-4 characters. Used to do Hell runs on Diablo himself for loot runs nightly.
Anyone who says beating D2 even on normal mode was 100s of hours is mistaken or really really took their time. If I remember correctly i beat D2 normal mode with my paladin within 30-40 hours max, and that was taking my time.
So much misinformation on this site nowdays. Just like the guy yesterday insisting D2 wasnt a total hackfest a year after release. Those guys are the ones you can thank for this online drm crap.
I hope I am wrong but TL2 is gonna be a hackfest as well with their release. Good thing is it will only cost $20 bucks.
You are preaching to the preacher mate.
Originaly you had Rogue , it was not only first random generated "dungeon hack" but one of first computer games at all.
Diablo 1 was born from attempt to convert Angband(roguelike) to graphic+mouse friendly interface , but in the making Blizzard (the company that blizzard bought actually) had strange idea to make it action based instead of turn based.
Thus new genre was born called "Hack&Slash" wich is used to refer to Diablo clones (or simply Diablo clone)
So although you have games like Gauntlet and many other dungeon running RPGs
Hack and Slash is used in corelation with Diablo like gameplay
This. Also it is not a scam. Most people buy Diablo games to complete them 100 times.
FYI I just finished Act 2 with 13h and 49m played (6h 40m Act 1, 7h 9m Act 2) . So yeah 12 hours.. pfft they missed so much. Cool ass boss fight at the end of Act 2.
For years, Blizz has been advancing the idea that the same content set to a higher level of difficulty is the equivalent of new content. They have been using this in WoW for years, releasing 7 or 8 raid bosses every 6-8 months and getting the community to buy in to the idea that they really haven't finished the content unless they've done it on hard mode.
Some people find this acceptable and get enjoyment out of the grind, I do not.
"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
I thought I was agreeing with you, not preaching. Reason I mentioned Gauntlet is that I played it alot in 1985, not because it was first. And of course because it was action based.
Actually, Loke's right about this one Lobo. You may want to check your friendly neighborhood wiki. While Diablo is referenced in the hack & slash genre, it's far from the only game, and it's certainly not the first. It was released at the end of 1996, far after that genre had been established.
Take it as a example that a thing can work in one genre and fail in an other
There are cryes on all forums for years that mmorpgs are not skill based like fps games, now we hear cryes that action rpgs are not as long and unique as mmorpgs, what is next, fps players crying that the ingame weapons have not enough strength accuracy and endurance on them?
Flame on!
I read is the same way as well. I'd bet they didn't know that Diablo is a roguelike. They likely don't even know what a roguelike is or played one back when they first came into being.
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Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Actually, it's Diablo 3 that's in the wrong forum, this is MMORPG.com baby!
I'm sure the average player will play D3 much more than 12 hours, one can never satisfy the rushers and power gamers in any new title.
That said, I disagree, replaying content with a different class, that's entertainment, (Did so with D1) doing it again at a higher level difficultly, that's just retreading content.
Fun if you enjoy it, but not my cup of tea.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I don't know. I find it ineteresting that people would make the Diablo-to-Rogue comparison. It's kinda like the MUD-to-MMO comparison: it is a bit of a stretch.
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
I know, pretty weird when you think about it. I mean doing the exact same thing over and over, good thing MMORPG's aren't anything like that.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Sorry but I do not agree with you OP, If I play the game on normal and it takes me 12 hours to beat...then the game is done. Everthing else is additional progression. The main quest should be the meat and potatoes of any game, that main quest line should be the longest part of any game. As soon as the main quest is done for me, I am done with the game. If I want to grind out mobs I can do that on any MMO.
MUD ... now you are tripping :P
Started playing last night with my girlfriend (she has never played any diablo before), and I think we probably put in 5 hours before the server went down. We are still in Act 1. I probably would have gone a bit faster without her since I am teaching her how to play (she loves it). Even if it was 12 hours, for a hack and slash game that is decent I think.
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@OP I think everyone understands the philosophy of hack and slash games. Most I'm sure are aware of the random nature of content as well as dungeon layouts. The problem is this design is ancient at this point, not to say people should stop making them, but I think it's telling why many do not charge top rate premium prices for these games anymore. TL2 is 20 bucks as an example.
You say not to compare it to Skyrim or others, why not? It's the same price... It's not about the game offering a few different difficulties and random content, it's that one play-through should IMO at least take 60 hours to warrant the price of admission. By most accounts it won't offer anywhere close.
Keep in mind this isn't rage I'm expressing, just looking at what you get for the asking price and I don't feel you get enough.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Actually, I was playing hack/slash ARPGs since Ys and Gauntlet. I'll give you though that, Diablo is the first ARPG I remember on the computer, but I didn't get into computer gaming until my late teens so I could have missed some things.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
Very well , if Wikipedia can be any point of reference - hack&slash is used for any action game set in sword and sorcery fantasy.
Diablo however did start its own subgenre wich (according to Wikipedia) is called "point and click action RPG" or "DIablo clones"
I will not list the games from the genre because there are lot of them , including latest POE and Torchlight.
Diablo it self resulted as attempt to make acessible "roguelike" game for PC ...
This is why "diablo clones" are often mentioned together with roguelikes
Skyrim is amazing game well worth its asking price. But what makes you think Diablo is any less ?