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Has Kickstarter stopped the Mmorpg's Stagnation ?
darker70
Member UncommonPosts: 804
With the advent of Kickstarter there is a complete circle regarding innovation in Mo's,many potential subscribers and a seemingly older and wiser player base seems to have gone past theme park fluff and want something more solid and with some lasting foundation,or as in GW2 a basic formula but throw something different into the mix to make it it's own entity.
SWTOR is an example if released 5 years ago this would be huge,but as Bioware copy pasted the gendre,[mod edit] the novelty wears off and the people want something different how else can you explain the mega IP that is Star Wars being such a mega flop ?
So we have The Repopulation,Pathfinder,Embers of Cerus,Origins of Malu,and even the themepark kings the Koreans are going sandbox with Archeage,i challenge anybody to come up with that amount of innovation in the last five years as we have had Themepark Clone after clone and more clones with the F2P factor,but the people have spoken with cash and a desire for the market to change which it seems to be doing after a very long stagnation.
So will this herald a new golden age as many projects are now on their way with funds from the people and some are possibly on the the drawing board after potential devs see that their dreams and visions can become a reality ,and a future business for themselves as many had hoped they could steer their project themselves and not have someone pulling at the wheel and veering them on another path which as seen lately is not always the right one to take.
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Comments
So which kickerstarter mmorpgs have been released and a big hit right now?
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
We have yet to see Kickstarter produce actual results yet... So...
Not many projects up on it were in active development before joining in on it to garner some bumper funding. All it's done is replace typical hypemongering with wishful thinking.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Remember Old School Ultima Online
That is not the point Kickstarter is quite new and takes ages to create a MO,but many devs would have had no way to fund future projects,it may take years but if we see real virtual worlds then the wait has to be worth it.
For instance The Repopulation have self funded but Kickstarter is another avenue as they want to speed up development and if really successful the Nov 2013 launch could be cut much shorter.
But Embers devs are a major team with a vision how much they have compared to Repop i'm not sure as Repop is in a very advanced state near Alpha,and i believe Pathfinder is mainly a tech demo but don't quote me on that.
It shows that people are tired of the same old thing? Isn't there anywhere else that might suggest that to be the case?
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Kickstarter has had, and will have, about zero impact on the industry.
Like, everything on the internet regarding gaming in general...
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Fair enough as i said MO's are a long term goal,but Wasteland2,Shadowrun2,dead linger,Skyjacker these are short term so we will see tangible results after all Rome was not built in a day.
BINGO!
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
How the heck can u say that look at all the projects funded,are u seriously suggesting that no games will be made at all and who is to say the next big thing is not around the corner,look at CCP they were a tiny company what if they had not created Eve and now pitched it on Kickstarter now as there only way to fund the game it's an example but i think they would have an effect on the industry even as a fictional example.
I expect to see a few inie developed, underfunded sandbox MMO's to come out of kickstarter that are pretty much of the same quality as a Mortal Online or Darkfall.
I have a hard time being optimistic that kickstarter is going to be good for those of us waiting for a quality avatar based sandbox. I can't help but feel that these games are just going to continue to perpetrate the myth that there is no sandbox crowd.
The hard truth is, any well funded studio is going to make more money producing a themepark game no matter how much alike it is to every other themepark, then an underfunded game that didn't get proper development time, is riddled with bugs, and half working features.
The industry probably wouldn't be where it is today if one company hadn't made a very well polished and fun themepark MMO. The same thing needs to happen with a sandbox MMO before the industry really starts taking them seriously.
Kickstarter isn't the answer.
Do you understand the meaning of putting the cart before the horse?
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
In a word, no. The financial requirements for making a "good" MMO are way more than single player games.
While Kickstarter can and has raised $2mil for Wasteland 2, that is NOTHING compared to the $15-$30mil needed to make a "quality" MMO title (and that is still on the low end). And if you are not even going to try to make a quality title, why bother?
While Kickstarter may certainly have its place, I doubt it can do much in the MMO space.
And the first time some company pulls a scam with Kickstarter (and it will happen, if it hasn't already), that is only going to make it even harder the next time.
CCP is an exception and no the norm, and they benefit from having been able to survive to the point of becoming the best sandbox mmo on the market. Where are the sandbox people supposed to go when your options are either an internet spaceship game, or a bad sandbox game?
And along the way they pioneered technology. I really have my doubts that one of these kickstarter guys is going to end up developing server technology that is going to benefit the entire industry like CCP did.
How do I put this? Funcom made a game engine, and everyone gushes over it's graphics, but it's really all about DX features and doesn't do anything special. CCP, they made carbon, carbon makes funcoms engine look like it's 20 years old. The procedural generation and dynamic interaction that the carbon engine is designed for isn't found in any other MMO engine. Even today they're redoing all the textures in the game to take advantage of a 2d texturing technology that creates 3d effects without adding a single extra polygon to any of the models. I'm not familliar with any other MMO using this.
I do not think CCP could get to where they are today, if they had to do it through kickstarter, and I can't imagine a company coming out of kickstarter that will be able to do what CCP has done.
Yes I am a fanboy of CCP, and no I'm not ashamed to admit it.
I am waiting for the first scam to see what kind of blowup it will have.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Yeah, EvE was very much the exception, and there are even arguements that if EvE came out now, the way it did back then, would it make it?
For EvE being about the only indie success story, you have Earthrise, APB, MO and several other games that are failed or on their way coming out of the indie space. Even the well funded studios have been doing lousy the last few years.
So I would hugely surprised if anything good ever came out of a Kickstarter MMO.
Not to mention the companies that have what it takes to succeed as small start up developers will have the resourcefulness to get funds without a kickstarter.
Yup.
It is not like scams don't happen in the comp gaming industry, D+L, Stargate Worlds, and on and on.
And even non-scam "failures". What would happen if people pledge say $5 mil to make some bugdet MMO, but the company goes under after taking and using the money?
It will happen sooner or later and will be interesting to see the outcome.
Do you understand the concept of big tree's grow small acorns?
Eve came out in 2003 and grew from there. We have no idea how well it would do if it was released today.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Tell me about it...
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
You are trying discus kickstarter stopping the stagnation of the entire mmorpg market. Get real and stop trying to be full of yourself. It has not produced a single mmorpg. PERIOD. It hasn't gotten rid of the stagnation at all.
To hell with the potential of it all. Results matter not potential.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Right, but it came out in somewhat rough shape, and it had some problems for the first year+. Games that don't start well out of the gate are tending to not do so well these days.
Also, there were many fewer games available to play back then, so a lot of people, or some at least, that stuck with EvE, might not have, had there been a lot of chocies... like there are now.
So, it could be that EvE was a success of its time and its timing for the kind of game it was, and thus even less likely to be repeated.
CCP is an exception and no the norm, and they benefit from having been able to survive to the point of becoming the best sandbox mmo on the market. Where are the sandbox people supposed to go when your options are either an internet spaceship game, or a bad sandbox game? And along the way they pioneered technology. I really have my doubts that one of these kickstarter guys is going to end up developing server technology that is going to benefit the entire industry like CCP did. How do I put this? Funcom made a game engine, and everyone gushes over it's graphics, but it's really all about DX features and doen't do anything special. CCP, they made carbon, carbon makes funcoms engine look like it's 20 years old. The procedural generation and dynamic interaction that the carbon engine is designed for isn't found in any other MMO engine. Even today they're redoing all the textures in the game to take advantage of a 2d texturing technology that creates 3d effects without adding a single extra polygon to any of the models. I'm not familliar with any other MMO using this. I do not think CCP could get to where they are today, if they had to do it through kickstarter, and I can't imagine a company coming out of kickstarter that will be able to do what CCP has done. Yes I am a fanboy of CCP, and no I'm not ashamed to admit it.
Yeah, EvE was very much the exception, and there are even arguements that if EvE came out now, the way it did back then, would it make it? For EvE being about the only indie success story, you have Earthrise, APB, MO and several other games that are failed or on their way coming out of the indie space. Even the well funded studios have been doing lousy the last few years. So I would hugely surprised if anything good ever came out of a Kickstarter MMO.
Eve came out in 2003 and grew from there. We have no idea how well it would do if it was released today.
I was there in 2004'ish i had to buy the CD and it was the Blue Client,and if u were there u will know it was a bit of a mess and touch and go if it survived,but after they broke the world record 10k barrier,it all changed as the client finally stablised to the point that it did not crash every sunday night and finally played on ATI cards.
I dont even know what kickstarter is......Thats how much it has impacted me.....