Err, they removed the character slots from the cash shop....
Noticed that as well, but keep in mind it is still a work in progress. We will know for sure on 8/28/2012. Until then (and after of course) it is subject to change. I just hope we see the ability to purchase amounts below $10.
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
Yep, Cow finisher is clearly a p2w item. I mean, how do you expect to win without a Cow finisher? It's ridiculous!
There can be 5000 completely innocent cosmetic items on the cash shop, but it still doesn't change the fact that you can buy gold with $ . That's the only real issue I have with the CS.
And what are you going to buy with that gold that gives you an advantage over someone else?
And before you say WvW stuff, that only works around the keep the guild owns and if you have enough people to own a keep then influence is not going to be a very big shortage either.
A: a whole lot of awesome with those aviators! Own peeps in style! That cop like stare has been known to make weaker peeps buckle under pressure!
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
The VAT system for online sales is absolute bull..
If i buy things online with a US company, that company only pays its VAT in the US (if any) they dont have to calculate VAT for europeans. I really dont think for every Euro i spend online (not box sales in dutch shops) they are going to pay those 20 cents to the dutch government.
So the pricedifference is a pure tefth. Just give us europeans those prices in Dollars and my Credit card company will calculate how many euros i need to pay.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
The VAT system for online sales is absolute bull..
If i buy things online with a US company, that company only pays its VAT in the US (if any) they dont have to calculate VAT for europeans. I really dont think for every Euro i spend online (not box sales in dutch shops) they are going to pay those 20 cents to the dutch government
Except that you aren't buying from a US company. You are buying from NCSoft Europe, which is a UK based company.
Hence you are correct that the VAT isn't going to the dutch government, as it is actually going to the UK government.
This reflects tax-exclusive v. tax-inclusive pricing.
In America, you pay the price you see plus sales tax.
In Europe, you pay the price you see. The vendor pays VAT out of that price.
VAT rates in EU range from roughly 15%-25%. We pay based on the location of our EU office, in UK, so we pay a flat 20% for all of EU.
€1 = €0.833 base + €0.167 VAT
€0.83 base = $1.02 (at today's exchange rate)
~ MO
See, it's roughly the same price. Maybe Europeans are paying $.02 more than American's, but it's not that much more. Yes, VAT is expensive nad you've just got to deal with it. Tough luck. Us in America have to deal with taxes all the time, and states with Income Tax have it far worse percent rate than sales tax.
And that still doesn't change the fact that the way the game is built, gold isn't important enough to offset the balance of pvp or pve gameplay by itself. Supply still limits the usefulness of gold in WvW.
Depends how it ends up at launch. Last BWE there were a few upgrades that didn't require any supply.
It still wouldn't be P2W. Though someone could pay for an advantage in certain situations.
See, it's roughly the same price. Maybe Europeans are paying $.02 more than American's, but it's not that much more. Yes, VAT is expensive nad you've just got to deal with it. Tough luck. Us in America have to deal with taxes all the time, and states with Income Tax have it far worse percent rate than sales tax.
a consumption tax because it is borne ultimately by the final consumer. It is not a charge on businesses.
If you consider that demand is effected by price, with a higher price leading to less demend, then you should realize that this tax, as with all sales taxes, increase price, reduce demand, and decrease the tatal revenue of the business. Burden of a sales tax is ultimately borne by both the consumer and the business.
Sorry, I got side tracked. Personally, I don't really care if prices in the gem story are high. This is about what I expected. In fact, I told a friend of mine yesterday that it would be 800gem = 1$. The ONLY thing I am somewhat worried about is the supply of gems in the market. Hopefully the market gold price for gems does not get unreasonable before enough people decide just to buy gems from the cash shop (thouhg, if they are doing that, then the gems are probably just going strait to the cash shop, and not to other players). I mean, supply of gems is just as important as the supply of gold.
I used to TL;DR, but then I took a bullet point to the footnote.
a consumption tax because it is borne ultimately by the final consumer. It is not a charge on businesses.
If you consider that demand is effected by price, with a higher price leading to less demend, then you should realize that this tax, as with all sales taxes, increase price, reduce demand, and decrease the tatal revenue of the business. Burden of a sales tax is ultimately borne by both the consumer and the business.
What most people don't get is the difference between business practices in europe vs. north america. In North America, you see the "price of the item" and then when you get to the cash they add tax and you wind up paying significantly more than the price that was listed. Among other things, this makes people more likely to buy it as the price seems more reasonable, and by the time they see the tax they are at the cash and they are unlikely to change their mind, it also makes the store look better and the government look bad to most people.
In EU, all prices have the tax included, so the price you see on the shelf is the same one you pay at the counter. So US prices are plus tax, and EU prices are including tax... and as per Mike Obrien this is exactly what they are doing, which means that US players will be paying tax on their purchase.
I'm fine with the cash shop since I can play without it.
I couldn't figure out why they had the exp boosts in the cash shop... but now that they've announced that you can keep leveling past 80 for additional skill points I get it. I'm still fine with it and have no plans to purchase exp boosts because I have no need to rush to max level or accumulate skill points faster than average, but I can see them selling a great deal of these now. (Which is good for everyone since it helps to support the game.)
Originally posted by Creslin321 Originally posted by NaqajYep, Cow finisher is clearly a p2w item. I mean, how do you expect to win without a Cow finisher? It's ridiculous!
There can be 5000 completely innocent cosmetic items on the cash shop, but it still doesn't change the fact that you can buy gold with $ . That's the only real issue I have with the CS.
Comments
Noticed that as well, but keep in mind it is still a work in progress. We will know for sure on 8/28/2012. Until then (and after of course) it is subject to change. I just hope we see the ability to purchase amounts below $10.
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
A: a whole lot of awesome with those aviators! Own peeps in style! That cop like stare has been known to make weaker peeps buckle under pressure!
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
The VAT system for online sales is absolute bull..
If i buy things online with a US company, that company only pays its VAT in the US (if any) they dont have to calculate VAT for europeans. I really dont think for every Euro i spend online (not box sales in dutch shops) they are going to pay those 20 cents to the dutch government.
So the pricedifference is a pure tefth. Just give us europeans those prices in Dollars and my Credit card company will calculate how many euros i need to pay.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
For those complaining that EURO's are paying MORE than Americans, please read what Mike O'Brian has posted on reddit
http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/wp1oo/do_you_think_gems_are_too_expensive_for_eu_zone/c5fay5u
This reflects tax-exclusive v. tax-inclusive pricing.
In America, you pay the price you see plus sales tax.
In Europe, you pay the price you see. The vendor pays VAT out of that price.
VAT rates in EU range from roughly 15%-25%. We pay based on the location of our EU office, in UK, so we pay a flat 20% for all of EU.
€1 = €0.833 base + €0.167 VAT
€0.83 base = $1.02 (at today's exchange rate)
~ MO
See, it's roughly the same price. Maybe Europeans are paying $.02 more than American's, but it's not that much more. Yes, VAT is expensive nad you've just got to deal with it. Tough luck. Us in America have to deal with taxes all the time, and states with Income Tax have it far worse percent rate than sales tax.
I will not buy gems in the BWE but i will secure 2 toon slots and a bag space for 5 toons on the 25th of august..
I do not mind supporting a great company that has made a great game rather it be by sub or CS..
Playing GW2..
Depends how it ends up at launch. Last BWE there were a few upgrades that didn't require any supply.
It still wouldn't be P2W. Though someone could pay for an advantage in certain situations.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/incometaxandtheirs/a/nostatetax.htm
You get what you pay for, and if you are getting something, somebody is paying.
Interesting to note, http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/taxation/vat/how_vat_works/index_en.htm says that the VAT is:
a consumption tax because it is borne ultimately by the final consumer. It is not a charge on businesses.
If you consider that demand is effected by price, with a higher price leading to less demend, then you should realize that this tax, as with all sales taxes, increase price, reduce demand, and decrease the tatal revenue of the business. Burden of a sales tax is ultimately borne by both the consumer and the business.
Sorry, I got side tracked. Personally, I don't really care if prices in the gem story are high. This is about what I expected. In fact, I told a friend of mine yesterday that it would be 800gem = 1$. The ONLY thing I am somewhat worried about is the supply of gems in the market. Hopefully the market gold price for gems does not get unreasonable before enough people decide just to buy gems from the cash shop (thouhg, if they are doing that, then the gems are probably just going strait to the cash shop, and not to other players). I mean, supply of gems is just as important as the supply of gold.
I used to TL;DR, but then I took a bullet point to the footnote.
What most people don't get is the difference between business practices in europe vs. north america. In North America, you see the "price of the item" and then when you get to the cash they add tax and you wind up paying significantly more than the price that was listed. Among other things, this makes people more likely to buy it as the price seems more reasonable, and by the time they see the tax they are at the cash and they are unlikely to change their mind, it also makes the store look better and the government look bad to most people.
In EU, all prices have the tax included, so the price you see on the shelf is the same one you pay at the counter. So US prices are plus tax, and EU prices are including tax... and as per Mike Obrien this is exactly what they are doing, which means that US players will be paying tax on their purchase.
I'm fine with the cash shop since I can play without it.
I couldn't figure out why they had the exp boosts in the cash shop... but now that they've announced that you can keep leveling past 80 for additional skill points I get it. I'm still fine with it and have no plans to purchase exp boosts because I have no need to rush to max level or accumulate skill points faster than average, but I can see them selling a great deal of these now. (Which is good for everyone since it helps to support the game.)
I don't mind it at since I don't HAVE to use it. I really don't care though.
So it's like every other game out there that way?
Shadus
I don't really care because i won't be buying any cash shop items
There is one thing I think they should change.
They should add an intermediate gem amount that will sell for exactly the price of the usual MMORPG monthly subscription.
Respect, walk
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