Theres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.
The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
That's true, but I don't think of open world PVP as something that's just persistent. I think I just expect the PVP zone to be in the same "world" that you quest, gather, harvest, etc. in.
That way PVP sometimes "just happens" when you're doing other things. It's part of the whole open world experience and plays into and interacts with PVE as well. It's not something set aside.
Speaking personally, when a zone is set aside just for PVP, even if it's technically "part of the landmass" that doesn't feel like open world PVP to me. So even RVR lakes in WAR, while fun, don't really feel like open world PVP to me.
Theres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.
The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
come on now this is mmorpg.com you know when they say is there open world pvp it means can i go into a low level PVE area and gank newbies all day.... for the rest of us WvWvW is huge and offers plenty of chances to sneak up on lone or small groups of people.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
If a zone can have one copy and copy only at time... it's not instanced.
Dungeons are instanced.
Personal area in the city are instanced
Battlegrounds are instanced
WvWvW is not
yep.
this is the single defining factor of the word "instanced." it is the very foundation of the word's existence.
before there were instanced dungeons and pvp maps everywhere we just called different areas "zones." it wasn't until they starting doing maps that copied themselves everytime a new group walked in so you didn't interact with the other groups that were there that we started using the word "instance." <- by my memory
to remove that most important part of the meaning of the word is to strip all usefulness from the term and simply make it interchangeable with the word "zone" or "map." ... which is really a de-evolution of the language.
Theres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.
The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
That's true, but I don't think of open world PVP as something that's just persistent. I think I just expect the PVP zone to be in the same "world" that you quest, gather, harvest, etc. in.
That way PVP sometimes "just happens" when you're doing other things. It's part of the whole open world experience and plays into and interacts with PVE as well. It's not something set aside.
Speaking personally, when a zone is set aside just for PVP, even if it's technically "part of the landmass" that doesn't feel like open world PVP to me. So even RVR lakes in WAR, while fun, don't really feel like open world PVP to me.
got to also remember WvWvW has a ton of NPCs to fight as well including a dungeon so people will be fighting NPCs not just PCs.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Originally posted by Creslin321 Originally posted by sammandarOriginally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?
Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?
Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.
If a zone can have one copy and copy only at time... it's not instanced.
Dungeons are instanced.
Personal area in the city are instanced
Battlegrounds are instanced
WvWvW is not
It's unintentionally misleading to call WvW instanced. Not because of pontless debates about seamless or whatever.
But because of the point above. WvW is a separated set of zones. But there is one absolute status to it and it fundamentally CANNOT be allowed to be cloned. This is because of the way scoring is being done.
You can't have two versions of Eternal battleground and one of blue borderlands going. It would make the scoring go completely pear shaped.
WvW may not be seamless (i.e. you can't swim from red bordlerlands to EB even if it looks like you can there is an invis wall). You may be forced to zone into it. Which is fine since that is actually the lore. WvW is in the mists the mists are only accessible through special magic portals.
But its not instanced in the way a WoW battleground or GW2 sPvP is and the two should emphatically not be connoted together. WvW has an absolute semi-persistent state and there must always be EXACTLY 1 version of each of the 4 zones.
WvW zones are not dynamically allocated. There is a set population limit and when its reached that's it, no new zone. You wait until people leave the always existing single zone.
Generally an instanced scheme dyanically allocates a new zone under certain conditions. Unfortunately people have confused the term to mean well basically anythign that is not seamless, which unfortauntely is complete and useless drivel.
Originally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?
Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?
Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.
Where DO you draw the line?
Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
Originally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?
Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?
Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.
Where DO you draw the line?
I draw the line at copies. Raids persist for a week for my group.. but in the same server there's also your group, that has a different copy of the raid (another instance) that also persists for a week.... and that other guy has yet another different copy of that raid and so on, so there could be hundreds of copies of the same raid for different groups at any given time.
For each 3 servers paired in WvW it's not instanced, I go, it'll be the same maps you can go, and the same map that other guy can go, and anyone else that goes in within those three servers. So personally that, and not reset duration, is why I don't consider WvW instanced, it's not about how long they last, but whether new copies are generated dinamically to accomodate more people. Heck, for the first couple of weeks WvW matches will last for a day to prevent servers being matched for 2 weeks against much stronger servers at first, and I still won't consider it instanced.
Originally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?
Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?
Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.
Where DO you draw the line?
Not sure if serious but... the difference is there is only ever ONE WvW for a server at the same time, while there are multiple raids at the same time for the same server. ie. if YOU zone into WvW, you'll always be in the same zone as your friend, while the same is not for raids.
got to also remember WvWvW has a ton of NPCs to fight as well including a dungeon so people will be fighting NPCs not just PCs.
That's true, and quite nice. It's also that way in WOW's Alterac Valley and Wintergrasp on a small scale (PCs) and also Aion's Abyss, IIRC, on a larger scale (dungeons).
My point was just that this type of PVP is cut off from that whole other sphere of gameplay. It makes PVP feel like this separate thing which is quite different than your standard open world PVP experience.
I guess the main thing is that I like the surprise element in open world PVP. You don't have to look for PVP, it finds you, and I like that - maybe because I'd be bored going out and looking for it in the first place. Hunting & stalking is just boring to me and I honestly can't stomach attacking someone going on his PVE business. Thankfully many players don't feel that way! So I get attacked routinely, thus the PVE world gains this "dynamic" quality you really can't simulate with rampant mobs of PCs set on cycles.
got to also remember WvWvW has a ton of NPCs to fight as well including a dungeon so people will be fighting NPCs not just PCs.
That's true, and quite nice. It's also that way in WOW's Alterac Valley and Wintergrasp on a small scale (PCs) and also Aion's Abyss, IIIRC, on a larger scale (dungeons).
My point was just that this type of PVP is cut off from that whole other sphere of gameplay. It makes PVP feel like this separate thing which is quite different than your standard open world PVP experience.
I guess the main thing is that I like the surprise element in open world PVP. You don't have to look for PVP, it finds you, and I like that - maybe because I'd be bored going out and looking for it in the first place. Hunting & stalking is just boring to me and I honestly can't stomach attacking someone going on his PVE business. Thankfully many players don't feel that way! So I get attacked routinely, thus the PVE world gains this "dynamic" quality you really can't simulate with rampant mobs of PCs set on cycles.
i know what you mean but honestly in every game I played that allowed PVP in PVE areas with no restrictions it just ended up being way to much camping and grieving.. guess some people are into that and the whole "being on edge" type of gameplay but I honestly never understood it. Also with how the DE's are setup and PVE in general in this game I don't think that type of PVP would work well... not to mention the lack of factions
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
What is strange to me is that because of level scaling, OWPvP might work far better in GW2 than in most other MMORPGs. Ganking isn't as easy when you get scaled to the people playing in the zone.
got to also remember WvWvW has a ton of NPCs to fight as well including a dungeon so people will be fighting NPCs not just PCs.
That's true, and quite nice. It's also that way in WOW's Alterac Valley and Wintergrasp on a small scale (PCs) and also Aion's Abyss, IIIRC, on a larger scale (dungeons).
My point was just that this type of PVP is cut off from that whole other sphere of gameplay. It makes PVP feel like this separate thing which is quite different than your standard open world PVP experience.
I guess the main thing is that I like the surprise element in open world PVP. You don't have to look for PVP, it finds you, and I like that - maybe because I'd be bored going out and looking for it in the first place. Hunting & stalking is just boring to me and I honestly can't stomach attacking someone going on his PVE business. Thankfully many players don't feel that way! So I get attacked routinely, thus the PVE world gains this "dynamic" quality you really can't simulate with rampant mobs of PCs set on cycles.
i know what you mean but honestly in every game I played that allowed PVP in PVE areas with no restrictions it just ended up being way to much camping and grieving.. guess some people are into that and the whole "being on edge" type of gameplay but I honestly never understood it. Also with how the DE's are setup and PVE in general in this game I don't think that type of PVP would work well... not to mention the lack of factions
I'll agree that sort of open world PVP would not really fit this game's design.
About "on the edge" thing... Well, what to say, those occasions just feel more memorable to me, I guess. Thankfully I tend to not get too annoyed with the mindless camping and zerg-PKing.
Originally posted by colddog04 What is strange to me is that because of level scaling, OWPvP might work far better in GW2 than in most other MMORPGs. Ganking isn't as easy when you get scaled to the people playing in the zone.
this is a good point i had not thought of.
i agree with others that the game design overall doesn't lend itself to the sort of pvp where players can gank one another.
but i do hope to someday see level scaling in a game that does support this type of pvp. i'm a fan of the level scaling in general for PVE purposes and how as my character advances they have more options on where to go rather than the same or fewer.
that it helps balance PVP to some extent is an incredible bonus to which i cannot see a downside. seems like a MUCH better solution than WAR's chickens.
The main reason why there is no open world pvp is because there are no factions, shame
Nope. The reason there is no open world PvP is because the game emchanics in PvE world are built around the ideal of co-op gameplay. You don't need to group up to help each other, to gain contribution from events or xp and loot from kills. Having open world PvP in game like it would mean that any AoE you use when doing DE would have to hurt all other players, which would be pretty counter intuitive.
im hoping they do bi-monthly or monthly events like the end of BWE2 where you fight a swarm of creatures and turn into one if they get you then turn into a creature and go out and kill other players that way.. was a lot of fun:)
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
The main reason why there is no open world pvp is because there are no factions, shame
Nope. The reason there is no open world PvP is because the game emchanics in PvE world are built around the ideal of co-op gameplay. You don't need to group up to help each other, to gain contribution from events or xp and loot from kills. Having open world PvP in game like it would mean that any AoE you use when doing DE would have to hurt all other players, which would be pretty counter intuitive.
exactly there is just no way it would work with how this games PVE is designed
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Originally posted by colddog04 Originally posted by XiaokiOriginally posted by Creslin321Originally posted by sammandarOriginally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree WvW is like....kind of instanced.I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.Where DO you draw the line?Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
But there is multiple copies.
The Mists only connects 3 servers.
GW2 will launch with 18 NA servers which means there will be 6 copies.
Originally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.Where DO you draw the line?
Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
But there is multiple copies.
The Mists only connects 3 servers.
GW2 will launch with 18 NA servers which means there will be 6 copies.
so basically in ANY MMO with multiple servers everything in the game is instanced? i really don't think you get the point people are making
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
GW2 will launch with 18 NA servers which means there will be 6 copies.
this only pertains to the server you are playing on. you have to draw the line somewhere.
i could say every game is instanced by your logic if we want to extend the line further and further.
Pac Man, or pong, could be considered instanced by that train of logic because multiple machines host multiple copies, or "servers."
no, it only applies to the server, or shard, you are on.
delving too deeply into a definition to serve an argumentative purpose often leads to these sorts of problems where your "proof" of argument creates a situation where you've suddenly devolved a word into complete uselessness. best not to do such things.
Originally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.Where DO you draw the line?
Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
But there is multiple copies.
The Mists only connects 3 servers.
GW2 will launch with 18 NA servers which means there will be 6 copies.
Umm...
You are now saying that any game with mutiple servers is fully instanced. Given that, yes, GW2 is instanced the same way every open world MMORPG is instanced (like UO for example).
Originally posted by ValuaTheres no open world pvp because there are no factions. GW2 has no Open World PvP. All GW2 PvP is instanced.The closest you'll get to Open World PvP is WvW, which is instanced, but very, very large.
I agree
WvW is like....kind of instanced.I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.Where DO you draw the line?
Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
But there is multiple copies.
The Mists only connects 3 servers.
GW2 will launch with 18 NA servers which means there will be 6 copies.
so basically in ANY MMO with multiple servers everything in the game is instanced?
Yeah this... I can see what you are saying Xia using a strict interpretation of the 'multiple copies' comment, and maybe the issue is that the scope of 'per server' wasnt defined with that. As Aerowyn was implying, servers inherently are multiple copies of the game world, but that does not make everything on the server instances.
If im on one server, I cannot access any other WvWvW zone than the one 3 world cluster. There are no more copies to access within that server cluster.
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence. Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
Comments
It's quite simple.
If a zone can have one copy and copy only at time... it's not instanced.
Dungeons are instanced.
Personal area in the city are instanced
Battlegrounds are instanced
WvWvW is not
That's true, but I don't think of open world PVP as something that's just persistent. I think I just expect the PVP zone to be in the same "world" that you quest, gather, harvest, etc. in.
That way PVP sometimes "just happens" when you're doing other things. It's part of the whole open world experience and plays into and interacts with PVE as well. It's not something set aside.
Speaking personally, when a zone is set aside just for PVP, even if it's technically "part of the landmass" that doesn't feel like open world PVP to me. So even RVR lakes in WAR, while fun, don't really feel like open world PVP to me.
come on now this is mmorpg.com you know when they say is there open world pvp it means can i go into a low level PVE area and gank newbies all day.... for the rest of us WvWvW is huge and offers plenty of chances to sneak up on lone or small groups of people.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
yep.
this is the single defining factor of the word "instanced." it is the very foundation of the word's existence.
before there were instanced dungeons and pvp maps everywhere we just called different areas "zones." it wasn't until they starting doing maps that copied themselves everytime a new group walked in so you didn't interact with the other groups that were there that we started using the word "instance." <- by my memory
to remove that most important part of the meaning of the word is to strip all usefulness from the term and simply make it interchangeable with the word "zone" or "map." ... which is really a de-evolution of the language.
got to also remember WvWvW has a ton of NPCs to fight as well including a dungeon so people will be fighting NPCs not just PCs.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
WvW is like....kind of instanced.
I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then?
Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks?
Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW.
Where DO you draw the line?
It's unintentionally misleading to call WvW instanced. Not because of pontless debates about seamless or whatever.
But because of the point above. WvW is a separated set of zones. But there is one absolute status to it and it fundamentally CANNOT be allowed to be cloned. This is because of the way scoring is being done.
You can't have two versions of Eternal battleground and one of blue borderlands going. It would make the scoring go completely pear shaped.
WvW may not be seamless (i.e. you can't swim from red bordlerlands to EB even if it looks like you can there is an invis wall). You may be forced to zone into it. Which is fine since that is actually the lore. WvW is in the mists the mists are only accessible through special magic portals.
But its not instanced in the way a WoW battleground or GW2 sPvP is and the two should emphatically not be connoted together. WvW has an absolute semi-persistent state and there must always be EXACTLY 1 version of each of the 4 zones.
WvW zones are not dynamically allocated. There is a set population limit and when its reached that's it, no new zone. You wait until people leave the always existing single zone.
Generally an instanced scheme dyanically allocates a new zone under certain conditions. Unfortunately people have confused the term to mean well basically anythign that is not seamless, which unfortauntely is complete and useless drivel.
its kind of funny, what with overflow servers and all.
one could argue WvW is the only area in all of GW2 that is NOT instanced.
Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
I draw the line at copies. Raids persist for a week for my group.. but in the same server there's also your group, that has a different copy of the raid (another instance) that also persists for a week.... and that other guy has yet another different copy of that raid and so on, so there could be hundreds of copies of the same raid for different groups at any given time.
For each 3 servers paired in WvW it's not instanced, I go, it'll be the same maps you can go, and the same map that other guy can go, and anyone else that goes in within those three servers. So personally that, and not reset duration, is why I don't consider WvW instanced, it's not about how long they last, but whether new copies are generated dinamically to accomodate more people. Heck, for the first couple of weeks WvW matches will last for a day to prevent servers being matched for 2 weeks against much stronger servers at first, and I still won't consider it instanced.
What can men do against such reckless hate?
Not sure if serious but... the difference is there is only ever ONE WvW for a server at the same time, while there are multiple raids at the same time for the same server. ie. if YOU zone into WvW, you'll always be in the same zone as your friend, while the same is not for raids.
That's true, and quite nice. It's also that way in WOW's Alterac Valley and Wintergrasp on a small scale (PCs) and also Aion's Abyss, IIRC, on a larger scale (dungeons).
My point was just that this type of PVP is cut off from that whole other sphere of gameplay. It makes PVP feel like this separate thing which is quite different than your standard open world PVP experience.
I guess the main thing is that I like the surprise element in open world PVP. You don't have to look for PVP, it finds you, and I like that - maybe because I'd be bored going out and looking for it in the first place. Hunting & stalking is just boring to me and I honestly can't stomach attacking someone going on his PVE business. Thankfully many players don't feel that way!
So I get attacked routinely, thus the PVE world gains this "dynamic" quality you really can't simulate with rampant mobs of PCs set on cycles.
i know what you mean but honestly in every game I played that allowed PVP in PVE areas with no restrictions it just ended up being way to much camping and grieving.. guess some people are into that and the whole "being on edge" type of gameplay but I honestly never understood it. Also with how the DE's are setup and PVE in general in this game I don't think that type of PVP would work well... not to mention the lack of factions
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
I'll agree that sort of open world PVP would not really fit this game's design.
About "on the edge" thing... Well, what to say, those occasions just feel more memorable to me, I guess. Thankfully I tend to not get too annoyed with the mindless camping and zerg-PKing.
this is a good point i had not thought of.
i agree with others that the game design overall doesn't lend itself to the sort of pvp where players can gank one another.
but i do hope to someday see level scaling in a game that does support this type of pvp. i'm a fan of the level scaling in general for PVE purposes and how as my character advances they have more options on where to go rather than the same or fewer.
that it helps balance PVP to some extent is an incredible bonus to which i cannot see a downside. seems like a MUCH better solution than WAR's chickens.
Nope. The reason there is no open world PvP is because the game emchanics in PvE world are built around the ideal of co-op gameplay. You don't need to group up to help each other, to gain contribution from events or xp and loot from kills. Having open world PvP in game like it would mean that any AoE you use when doing DE would have to hurt all other players, which would be pretty counter intuitive.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
exactly there is just no way it would work with how this games PVE is designed
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
WvW is like....kind of instanced. I mean, it's instanced, but that instance persists for 2 weeks long. So I mean...where do you draw the line between instanced and persistent?
Raids in WoW persist for 1 week. Are the raids in WoW no longer instances then? Whats the difference between 1 persisting for 1 week and 1 persisting for 2 weeks? Also, in WoW you can extend the lock out for a raid so they can technically persist forever. So I guess that means raids in WoW are more persistent and therefor less instanced than WvWvW. Where DO you draw the line?
Raids are instances because there are mutiple copies of the raid that different groups are doing.
WvW is not instanced, because there are not mutiple copies.
But there is multiple copies.
The Mists only connects 3 servers.
GW2 will launch with 18 NA servers which means there will be 6 copies.
so basically in ANY MMO with multiple servers everything in the game is instanced? i really don't think you get the point people are making
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
this only pertains to the server you are playing on. you have to draw the line somewhere.
i could say every game is instanced by your logic if we want to extend the line further and further.
Pac Man, or pong, could be considered instanced by that train of logic because multiple machines host multiple copies, or "servers."
no, it only applies to the server, or shard, you are on.
delving too deeply into a definition to serve an argumentative purpose often leads to these sorts of problems where your "proof" of argument creates a situation where you've suddenly devolved a word into complete uselessness. best not to do such things.
Umm...
You are now saying that any game with mutiple servers is fully instanced. Given that, yes, GW2 is instanced the same way every open world MMORPG is instanced (like UO for example).
Yeah this... I can see what you are saying Xia using a strict interpretation of the 'multiple copies' comment, and maybe the issue is that the scope of 'per server' wasnt defined with that. As Aerowyn was implying, servers inherently are multiple copies of the game world, but that does not make everything on the server instances.
If im on one server, I cannot access any other WvWvW zone than the one 3 world cluster. There are no more copies to access within that server cluster.
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence.
Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
"Is this far enough?"
"No, push it back farther."